Business RadioX ®

Angad Sahgal With Let Me Do It

by

Atlanta Business Radio
Atlanta Business Radio
Angad Sahgal With Let Me Do It
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Angad Sahgal is an Atlanta-based entrepreneur and the founder of two businesses. He is the founder of Let Me Do It Application that enables persons with disabilities to make informed decisions and live independently.

He is Georgia’s state ambassador for Supported Decision Making and is a student of the GSU IDEAL program. Let Me Do It was recently accepted into the Georgia State University Main Street Entrepreneur Seed Fund.

He is also the founder of Chai Ho Tea- organic and sustainably grown teas. His love for food, drink and travel led him to founding Chai Ho Teas which provides ethically sourced, organic, gourmet teas from his home country of India. Angad has Down syndrome, is a black belt in karate, an avid soccer fan and loves a good challenge.

Connect with Angad on LinkedIn.

What You’ll Learn In This Episode

  • What is supported Decision making and why is it important for persons with disabilities
  • Empowering Persons with disabilities
  • Leveraging technology and support networks to create a world where Persons with disabilities belong and thrive
  • Entrepreneurship and Persons with disabilities

This transcript is machine transcribed by Sonix

TRANSCRIPT

Intro: [00:00:04] Broadcasting live from the Business RadioX Studios in Atlanta, Georgia. It’s time for Atlanta Business Radio. Brought to you by on pay. Atlanta’s New standard in payroll. Now, here’s your host.

Lee Kantor: [00:00:25] Lee Kantor here another episode of Atlanta Business Radio, and this is one of my favorite series that we do. It’s the GSU radio show where we spotlight the great goings on at GSU and especially the Main Street Entrepreneurship Seed Fund participants. And today we have folks from that initiative. We have Angad and Amit Sahgal with Let Me Do It. Welcome.

Angad Sahgal: [00:00:52] Thank you.

Lee Kantor: [00:00:53] So excited to learn what you’re doing over there and let me do it. So if you don’t mind, share a little bit about the mission purpose of Let me do it.

Angad Sahgal: [00:01:01] So I’m going to let Angad start with the purpose and then get into the business side of it.

Lee Kantor: [00:01:05] Okay.

Angad Sahgal: [00:01:06] My purpose is to empower people with disability. Informed decision had to own voice. So essentially helping people with disabilities to own their decision rights. Often times what happens is the decision rights of persons with disabilities are taken away through power of attorney. Et cetera. And Angad, being one of the Georgia youth ambassadors for supported decision making, thought that would be best served. That if we create a enabling platform which will allow for persons with disabilities to own their decision rights with the support of a network of their caregivers, support family to decide what’s what they want to do, what’s good for them, and what makes sense for them.

Lee Kantor: [00:01:53] Now, before we get too far into things, do you mind kind of defining some of these terms? Like what does supported decision making mean for the layperson?

Amit Sahgal: [00:02:02] So essentially it’s to simplify it. It’s like if you were to take a decision, if or if Angad is going to take a decision about something or my wife or his support network, help him with that decision process. That is what supported decision making is. So Angad’s decision rights are with him. He decides I’m going to do this, but leverages his support network to get to that decision. Does that make sense?

Lee Kantor: [00:02:29] Yeah. So ultimately, the decision is with Angad.

Angad Sahgal: [00:02:33] Yes. Or we can help with him as he decides something. Okay. When God decided, you know, he wanted to join a post-secondary education program, so my wife and I worked with Unga to decide what’s good for him, what he would like, what he wanted in a program, and then figure out which is the best program which will work. And Unga took the final decision that he wanted to attend the ideal program.

Lee Kantor: [00:03:01] So now how is it set up right now without Let me do It around to help facilitate this, How are people kind of handling this situation? Are the support team just kind of making decisions for the people they’re caring for right now, or is that individual in charge of their decisions? Like what are the what are the rules of the game right now?

Angad Sahgal: [00:03:23] It’s very open ended. It would depend from a person and their network. There is no process which allows you to do it or in a structured format. So, you know, our family may be different than somebody else who’s going, you know, who needs help in the decision process. And there isn’t you know, we haven’t really leveraged the power of technology to do anything in this space. So what we’re trying to do is, you know, we have a fair understanding of the world of disabilities, having our lived experiences. And through my through mom and my wife’s work, she runs a organization called Synergies Work, which works with folks with disabilities to become entrepreneurs. So we have a fair understanding. So what we’ve tried to do is, through lived experiences, our experiences try to create a solution which would benefit, you know, persons with disabilities, the community which we’re trying to serve.

Lee Kantor: [00:04:29] So how is technology being leveraged to help? So.

Angad Sahgal: [00:04:35] If you really look at the the app, it’s essentially it’s a it’s a structured decision tree or a task management format, which, you know, when when a person downloads the app and they create the decisions in consultation with their support network, hey, I’m going to mornings when I get up, I need to go to work or I need to go to college. I’m going to live independently. And then those decisions have sub elements or tasks built in, and then you define those and you also create your network, you know, in case if he has to go somewhere, he needs to call an Uber. So the person to help him is Dad. If he wants to go to a doctor, the person to help him, his mom. So you create those networks. So and accordingly, then once you get to that decision point through notifications, the app keeps telling you where you are in the decision process and what you have to do next. So it sort of brings it in front of you. All of us, whether you have a disability or not, tend to forget things. This just simplifies it and brings it to you and notifies you. It’s similar concept. When you get something on your phone, you get a notification. So you’re getting a notification. You have to go to college. To go to college, you need to call an Uber. So he gets a notification. He reaches out to me, Dad, can you call me an Uber? And I call him an Uber. And that’s how this, you know, the cycle of events would work. And he will achieve his desired decision to get to college, leveraging people within his network.

Lee Kantor: [00:06:08] So so building that appropriate support team and network is a critical element for success.

Angad Sahgal: [00:06:16] It would be. And, you know, from what I know of the the disability community, everybody has a network. But today what you have is your network is basically 24/7, has to be with you. What we trying to do is you can reach your network on demand when you need them.

Lee Kantor: [00:06:37] And so when so an individual signs up for the app, they then, I guess, plug in their needs and the network that’s associated with each of those kind of components and subcomponents.

Angad Sahgal: [00:06:50] Yeah. So you download the app and in our case, so when we started rolling out the app, so I downloaded the app with so did his mom, his brother and two people from his support network. So all of us help with certain parts of the decision or his everyday life and decisions which manifest into everyday life or longer term, you know, longer term impact decisions. And accordingly, based on that, you know, we created the network of which person can help him with what part of those decisions. And so that’s the person to call for. And then you the app also color codes, the need is it something which is immediate and urgent, something which is done going to be done in a few hours. So sort of a red, yellow, red, yellow, red, amber, kind of a color code which defines the urgency of the task and the need for help.

Lee Kantor: [00:07:49] Now, does it kind of evolve along the lines to include like doctors or professors In this case, if it’s college and folks that are also interacting with the person with disabilities?

Angad Sahgal: [00:08:06] You’re exactly right. The step one, what we’re trying to do is include your, you know, your doctors because they are a part of your care giver network. We are going to include them. But obviously, we need to get some we need to be HIPAA compliant, etcetera. But that’s on the plan. And we are going to involve your if you’re in high school, if you’re in college, your professors so that they have, you know, you’re going to need help from them if you need help from them. There is an easy way to reach them. We’re also going to be working with we are approaching organizations such as Vocational Rehab to allow for folks with disabilities, because in the current environment, they get a job coach for a defined period of time. Now, all of us can tend to forget things. So what that will do is essentially one, increase the breadth of how far a job coach can go instead of just working with one person at a time. You could work with ten people at a time because you have the ability to do so using technology. And as a person with a disability, what that does is you have the job in the job details on your phone so you don’t have to technically be have the physical presence of a job coach. But if you need the job coach or anybody else in your support network, like the person, your boss, you can reach out to them and they can help you work through that.

Lee Kantor: [00:09:28] Now, speaking of coaching, does it offer kind of and maybe I is helpful in this area, some help if you need help, you know, sometimes you need help, sometimes you need a helper. Does the app provide for like encouragement or a tip or here, have you tried this? You know, some problem solving assistance rather than going immediately to a human being?

Angad Sahgal: [00:09:56] Uh, so it’s going to be it’s on the, on the roadmap right now, the way the app is, it it does not have it. But in the next 12 to 18 months, the plan is to include that kind of thing. And we’re also going to create a community pool so that everybody, all the folks who run the app, they can provide their input on whether it’s, you know, a doctor or a college or a class, which somebody should attend so that there is information sharing. And in today’s world of disabilities, there’s a lot of reinvention of the wheel that will eliminate that.

Lee Kantor: [00:10:31] Because like in the case of, like you were saying, people going to college, it might be one professor’s a better choice for this kind of a community rather than another one. And if the community was aware of that, it could save them some time and grief.

Angad Sahgal: [00:10:48] That is why the community resource pool comes into very handy. So if there are some so part of the the GSU Idol program, if the all the people who are there, if they start giving their feedback, you know, I had a great time with this professor in the in the pottery class or in the fine arts classes then that’s a resource somebody else can leverage today. It’s, you know, experience and find out rather than some information being there which says, yes, this is already tried, tested and proven. So try it now.

Lee Kantor: [00:11:19] So now where are you at in the development of this app? Is it is it kind of based on your family situation or are there other people in the wild kind of using it and being your beta testers?

Angad Sahgal: [00:11:32] Yeah. So we started with the inputs from 4 or 5 folks, and now we have 45 pilot users. And like you said, the purpose of the beta users is to tell us what’s good, what’s bad, what’s needed, what’s missing, what’s working.

Lee Kantor: [00:11:49] So when did you get a sense of, hey, this is something here, we have something here that’s needed and provides a lot of utility for the community. Was it right away, like for your like, I know you were solving your own problem, but when did you start getting kind of that market tell you that, hey, this is something that we really should lean into?

Angad Sahgal: [00:12:09] So the, the the idea for the app came is part of Angad’s role as a Georgia youth ambassador. And all the young adults had to pick a project. So Angad decided to build an app given his love for his phone and his iPad and all the games he’s been playing on the Ps5. So that was the idea, which sort of led us to create a document or a thought process or a position paper which Angad presented at the conference. It’s called it’s run by an organization called Tash U. The Association of the Severely Handicapped in November December in Phenix last year. And the traction and the response we got there from either the the parents who were there or the the disability advocacy and support organizations told us this is something which we need to, you know, really double down and build. And that’s what started that’s where we started building the platform and sourcing feedback, talking to educational institutions, research institutions and families of persons with disabilities. That’s what’s the trigger. And that’s that got us all started and we started building because just not us. We, we, we knew that there is a definitive market need for this sort of a product.

Lee Kantor: [00:13:29] So how did the Main Street Entrepreneurship Seed Fund get on your radar?

Angad Sahgal: [00:13:34] Well, Angad’s, a student at GSU, he’s a part of the ideal program. And when we saw the main Street fund, you know, looking for entrepreneurs for cohort four, we could not think of a better way to, you know, one showcase that entrepreneurs, you know, you can be entrepreneurs and it’s not governed by the label if you’re able or disabled. So that’s what got us started. And it also helped us get bring the awareness has been Main Street Fund’s been phenomenal in bringing the awareness or creating the awareness of not just the app but also disability entrepreneurship. So the reason we started was the student here. What better place than to reach out and start building the app then, you know, then with Main Street Fund.

Lee Kantor: [00:14:29] Now how how what has been the interaction with the folks at Main Street and on God and yourself? Has it been mostly you or is this something that Angad is actively involved with working with them and the mentors?

Angad Sahgal: [00:14:45] Angad is being a part of every meeting call conference workshop we’ve had thus far, whether it’s our mentor meetings, you know, three times a month or four times a month or workshops every week, angad’s a part of that plus angad’s a part of our conversation twice a month with the folks who are building the platform for us. So he’s involved in every part of it and more from not the nitty gritty of the business, but why and the how of what is going to be done and angad’s the principal user of the app. So, you know, as we are building the app, one of the things we try at home is trying to see how it works because there is no better experience than first us experiencing it. If we can’t do it, then why are we going to tell other people to use it?

Lee Kantor: [00:15:36] And it’s aligned philosophically with this supported decision making, right? Pardon me? And having him actively involved is aligned philosophically with the supported decision making?

Angad Sahgal: [00:15:48] Yes.

Lee Kantor: [00:15:51] So what do you need more of? How can we help you?

Angad Sahgal: [00:15:55] We need to. So the biggest thing we need is that it’s a two part thing. One, there are roughly 2 million people with a disability in the state of Georgia. Okay. We need to get the message out that there is something which can help you with your everyday to long term life, you know, decision making process. And you need there is something which will allow you to own your decision rights. Obviously there are some people who will not be may not believe in that. So that’s that’s one part of it. Getting the message out there is something which can help you. And secondly, the second part, which I think is more critical, is what we want to highlight and surface is to be an entrepreneur. You don’t you know, it doesn’t go by a label if you’re able or disabled. Entrepreneurship leverages your skill, talent and desire to make a change. And that’s those are the two things we want to really highlight.

Lee Kantor: [00:16:52] And that’s more of a mindset, right?

Angad Sahgal: [00:16:55] Mindset. You’re absolutely right.

Lee Kantor: [00:16:58] It’s believing you can make a change and taking action.

Angad Sahgal: [00:17:02] I think what we and what I’ve been saying and we’ve always said as a family, what you need to look for is what is the person, what is what a person has, rather than look at, oh, this person does not have this. So look at the positives rather than saying this is something which is lacking.

Lee Kantor: [00:17:20] Right, because people have more than sometimes they remember. Yes. So if somebody wants to connect with you on God or somebody on the team, what’s a website?

Angad Sahgal: [00:17:31] Let me do it.org.

Lee Kantor: [00:17:33] Let me do it.org and they can maybe sign up to be a beta tester. They can play around with it. They can see what it can be and get involved.

Angad Sahgal: [00:17:43] They can sign up to be a beta tester of what we are doing right now is instead of, you know, I’m meeting with each one of the folks who wants to come in as a beta tester. I want to make sure what is their expectation and the need so that we are properly addressing it. And so that’s the process I’ve adopted so far. The beta or version release, which is going to happen in November, that’s the time you open it to the general public. Right now we are, you know, we’re adding beta users, beta testers, which is at current, we’re adding about one a day. And you know, I want to get a large group of folks who can provide us the feedback to action.

Lee Kantor: [00:18:24] Now what about organizations that serve the disabled? Are you involving them as well?

Angad Sahgal: [00:18:29] So two of three of our design partners and sponsors, Georgia Advocacy Office, Sangha Unity Network Synergies Work. These are organizations which are disability support and advocacy. We are also talking to organizations in Iowa, Illinois and Massachusetts to disability support and advocacy organizations.

Lee Kantor: [00:18:54] Well Angad Amit, congratulations on all the success so far in the momentum. You’re doing important work and we appreciate you both.

Angad Sahgal: [00:19:02] Thank you so much.

Lee Kantor: [00:19:04] This is Lee Kantor. We will see you all next time on g-s-u E.n.i. Radio.

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Jennifer Jones-Mitchell With Human Driven AI

by

Atlanta Business Radio
Atlanta Business Radio
Jennifer Jones-Mitchell With Human Driven AI
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Jennifer Jones-Mitchell is an internationally recognized marketing leader and AI strategist. With nearly 30 years of experience leading marketing initiatives for top global brands, she is an expert on leveraging emerging technologies like AI and machine learning to drive marketing success. Jennifer realized that while many companies were excited about AI’s potential, few marketing teams understood how to practically apply it to their work.

She launched Human Driven AI to fill this gap and help agencies and brand teams future-proof themselves via AI adoption. Her data-driven methodology enables marketers to implement AI strategically across campaigns, content production, audience targeting, and optimization. She has held senior leadership positions within Ogilvy, Porter Novelli, Publicis and served as the president of The Brandware Group for many years.

A native of Georgia, she earned her Bachelor’s in Communications from Oglethorpe University and currently resides in Decatur with her husband, music composer, David Mitchell.

Connect with Jennifer on LinkedIn.

What You’ll Learn In This Episode

  • What is Human Driven AI
  • Will AI take jobs
  • What are the advantages of generative AI
  • What is AI transformation
  • Her favorite generative AI Tools
  • Future of AI Integration in Marketing, PR, Advertising and Business

This transcript is machine transcribed by Sonix

TRANSCRIPT

Intro: [00:00:04] Broadcasting live from the Business RadioX Studios in Atlanta, Georgia. It’s time for Atlanta Business Radio. Brought to you by on pay. Atlanta’s New standard in payroll. Now, here’s your host.

Lee Kantor: [00:00:24] Lee Kantor here another episode of Atlanta Business Radio, and this is going to be a good one. But before we get started, it’s important to recognize our sponsor, Onpay. Without them, we couldn’t be sharing these important stories. Today on Atlanta Business Radio, we have Jennifer Jones Mitchell with Human Driven. Ai, welcome.

Jennifer Jones Mitchell: [00:00:44] Thank you. Thank you so much for having me.

Lee Kantor: [00:00:47] I am so excited to be chatting with you today. Before we get too far into things, tell us about human driven AI, how you servant folks.

Jennifer Jones Mitchell: [00:00:54] Well, at its core, it’s a knowledge hub for marketers and companies who want to learn how to apply generative AI to their work, their articles, podcasts, master classes, workshops, things like that. And I also lead AI transformation strategies for agencies and brand marketing teams.

Lee Kantor: [00:01:13] So what’s your backstory? How’d you get involved with this?

Jennifer Jones Mitchell: [00:01:17] Well, I’ve been involved in marketing communications for 30 years now, and I’ve always been one to embrace emerging technologies. I was one of the early voices of social media back in 2007, 2008. And, you know, really for the past, I’d say eight, 8 or 9 months, I’ve been watching the emergence of generative AI tools and using them in my own marketing campaigns. And just, you know, I would talk to colleagues and clients and people who either are afraid of generative AI or they don’t understand how to use it. And it just sparked for me. I need to help people understand the value of these tools, the language and the mind of AI so that they can get the most out of it. Because like it or not, it’s here. So I just didn’t want my friends and colleagues to get left behind. And that was kind of the impetus.

Lee Kantor: [00:02:12] Now, AI has been around for a while now. In fact, a lot of folks, I mean, they have an Alexa in their house that they’ve been talking to, getting answers to questions for years. Can you maybe explain the difference between the AI that we’ve been talking to Alexa and Siri with and this generative, generative AI that you’re talking about now? Maybe define some terms and explain how these things are the same and different.

Jennifer Jones Mitchell: [00:02:41] Certainly, yeah. I mean, generative AI basically means AI that has been trained to generate something for you. So ChatGPT or Claude, these types of tools can generate articles or new ideas. Dall-e and Midjourney can generate images for you. So that’s what generative AI really means. But yeah, to your point, AI’s been a part of our lives, our daily lives for a very long time. Every time you use Google Maps or Waze to get somewhere, every time you use autocomplete in your searches or in your texts. It’s all AI. But yeah, the difference is really now we have all of these commercially available tools that can help us to operationalize efficiencies, particularly around marketing, which is my focus. I’m not an engineer, I’m not a software AI engineer. I just help people use these generative AI tools and develop the right tech stack to achieve their goals.

Lee Kantor: [00:03:47] Now, some of these tools right now, like ChatGPT, there’s free versions and some of them are kind of more they’re more like specialists and they, they do a certain thing for certain people and they are paid versions. Is this something that you help folks with is to say, okay, if you want to just kind of test it out, here’s some free ways you can do this, and here are some prompts that may help you achieve what you’re trying to do. But if you want to really make a bigger impact, you’re going to have to build kind of a tech stack around with certain tools to help you get to where you want to go.

Jennifer Jones Mitchell: [00:04:22] Yeah, absolutely. That’s really the difference between a workshop and an AI transformation strategy. A workshop is still customized, of course, to the people I’m talking to, but it is more about showing them the mind, the language of generative AI, how to use these tools in general, and then the AI transformation strategy. That’s about identifying those opportunities to automate tasks and augment skills gaps, build that tech stack that serves their specific needs, as well as developing company guidelines and policies around AI usage. It’s interesting. I like to think actually of generative AI more as an employee than a tool. I’ll give you an example. So many of my marketing colleagues used to say, Yeah, you know, I asked ChatGPT to write an article and it was fine, but I still had to proof it and edit it and to. Am. I always say, okay, if you ask an employee to write an article for a client, do you just blindly pass that off to the client or do you proof it? Do you edit it? Do you make sure that it is the best it can be? And that’s the way you have to look at these GUI tools. They are only as good as the inputs you give them. So that’s why in the workshop it’s about understanding the mind of AI. What do you need to tell it in order to get the right outputs that serve your goals?

Lee Kantor: [00:05:56] So now along those lines though, if we’re going to continue that metaphor about the AI being an employee at some point, can you stop checking their work or is it something that at this stage you’re going to have to check their work? They’re basically doing a good or a better and better first draft of something that you need, and it’s going to always take a human to kind of go over it to make sure that everything is just the way you’d like it.

Jennifer Jones Mitchell: [00:06:23] Well, I do.

Jennifer Jones Mitchell: [00:06:24] Think you should still check the work, but I have found that I need to give fewer and fewer edits to it the more you train it. One of the biggest mistakes that people make when using ChatGPT or Claude too, which I actually prefer to ChatGPT people will have one conversation with it and just keep adding to it. You want to start a new chat for different topics and that’s how you train it. So, you know, for example, I can train, you know, I write a lot of articles on behalf of clients because I still have PR consulting as well. And so I can train ChatGPT to write in the voice of a client. And all you do is you feed in an article written by that client. You ask it to the AI to analyze it and to recognize it as X client’s voice. And then I found if you do 2 or 3 of those and save that query, then it becomes easier and easier because I can just go to ChatGPT and say, Write this, turn these bullet points into an article in the style writing style of X client. So the more you work with it I guess is the shorter answer. The more you work with it, the better it is.

Lee Kantor: [00:07:43] Now when you’re working with a like a cloud or a ChatGPT in that form, is that is it going to remember that client over time, or is that something you need kind of a specific tool that you’re paying for that is is you’re building kind of that the the large language library of your own kind of unique needs rather than kind of a general purpose AI tool.

Jennifer Jones Mitchell: [00:08:11] Yeah, absolutely. That’s why you want to set up a different chat conversation for each task in that sense. And then within that chat conversation it will remember that writing style and it will improve with each new version of content that it creates. It’s like a lot of people will open up a chat, GPT chat, and this is someone else’s example, but it’s such a good one. They’ll be talking about quantum physics and then they’ll ask in that same chat for a recipe about Fettuccine Alfredo. Well, that AI chat is now trying to connect the dots between quantum physics and Fettuccine Alfredo So you really do want to have a separate chat for each task and you can save them and go back to them. And that’s how you train around specific tasks.

Lee Kantor: [00:09:04] Now, is it possible, like, for example, I’ve been doing podcasting for many, many years. I have a podcast that I do tips on. Me and my partner talk about tips and we have thousands of tips. Could I upload all of the the tips into a chat, into a chat and then it have and then we transcribe it. So there’s a machine transcription of all those words, could that be its own library? And then I could basically say, okay, now you come up with these ideas because you have pretty much everything I know in this chat.

Jennifer Jones Mitchell: [00:09:40] Yes. And that’s an excellent use of the tool. Absolutely. I also want to say, you know, a lot of people only think of these tools as content creation creators, and they are. But I’ve brainstormed solutions in these tools. I’ve brainstormed solutions to business problems, to marketing problems. It’ll come up with campaign ideas. I mean, there really is no limit to what you can ask these tools to do for you. You just do have to remember that generative AI tools were trained on the internet and everything on the Internet was created by humans. So there is an inherent bias. There is a chance that these tools will be wrong. So that’s why I do say you still need to. Look at it and proof it and make sure that it’s accurate. I like to ask for sources in an article. Please provide sources and examples, but I’ve found sometimes it’ll make up sources. So there’s still a lot of improvement in some of these tools. But again, it’s not just about content creation. There are generative AI tools that help with project management, that help you with pricing both B2C and B2B pricing. So there are just so many tools and that’s why it comes down to you want to understand what is your current state of AI and what is your future state and then what are the tools that that make the most sense for your specific needs.

Lee Kantor: [00:11:07] Now, a core element of all of these chats that I’ve seen so far is the ability to ask the right prompt or to ask the right question in the right way to get the result that you’re really looking for. How important is that skill to really be able to ask good questions and to really narrow down focus and give parameters when it comes to AI to really wring out the most value for this?

Jennifer Jones Mitchell: [00:11:37] It’s absolutely critical. I was giving a speech a couple of weeks ago and I told the audience, if everyone in this room asked ChatGPT to write an article about the top ten digital marketing trends for 2023, and that’s all we asked it to do. We would all end up with the same article and everyone would put it out there and we would just be lost in this sea of sameness. But if you ask that same question, right, an article, will you write an article about the top digital marketing trends of 2023 from a company perspective of this in the voice of this with the brand personality of that and give it a creative brief, let it know who, who is it writing for or who’s the audience. Give it everything it needs. That’s how you get something that is truly unique and and will truly serve your goals.

Lee Kantor: [00:12:33] So in a good prompt, how many parameters is there a rule of thumb like, okay, try to give it a minimum of three, but as many as ten parameters when coming up with a prompt so that you’re getting a better result.

Jennifer Jones Mitchell: [00:12:49] I mean, it really depends on what it is that you’re after. Do you remember Boolean logic back in the day? Yeah. You almost want to take that approach where you’re saying, I want something that is like this but not like this, like this and this. Similar to this, but not like that. You really want to have an in-depth string of prompts, but you can also, once you get the output, you can say, Oh gee, I forgot to tell it to do this. You can always improve upon it. I just recommend that you do that within that same conversation. Otherwise you’re going to be starting from scratch. So again, you want to teach it in each chat how to improve the output.

Lee Kantor: [00:13:31] So you mentioned that your work is primarily in marketing. If somebody is new to this at all, what are some of the kind of the basic things they should be doing to just test the waters and get a feel for some of the benefits of playing around in this space?

Jennifer Jones Mitchell: [00:13:50] Well, it’s exactly what you said. Play around with it. Start Start testing these tools, Play with certainly ChatGPT. I did mention I like Claude two better. I think the output is more human like. And Claude too, by the way, will actually give you prompts. I asked Claude to the other day to put an outline together for an upcoming podcast and it asked me What’s the audience? So again, to me that’s a way that it is far better than ChatGPT because it helps you. It actually prompts you to give it the information. But yeah, start playing around with these tools, see which ones really work for you. Read about, you know, visit human driven ai.com and read about some of the tools. But it really comes down to identifying the areas that can be automated or augmented with the right tools. You don’t want to just jump on every shiny new thing. You really do want to understand the value of each tool.

Lee Kantor: [00:14:54] Now, speaking of shiny new things, is this a shiny new thing that is going to be here, or is it a shiny new thing that may be, you know, I don’t want to, you know, like the metaverse was a shiny new thing. And and that was something everybody was like, oh, this is it. You know, this is going to be part of my everyday life. And it, you know, it’s still there and it’s doing interesting things, but it’s not kind of embedded in our life as maybe some people. Predicted when it first came out. Is this a shiny new thing that is going to be kind of just part of our day to day life? Especially if you’re in business nowadays?

Jennifer Jones Mitchell: [00:15:32] Yeah, absolutely. Make no mistake. Ai is changing everything. It will impact the way business is done at every single level. Again, I know it’s easy for people to think, Oh, it’s a content generator, it’s an image generator, but there are so many different AI tools. You know, I’m really impressed lately with Clickup, which is a project management tool powered by AI. We’ve all been there where you set up your whole timeline and your project and you’ve got all your teams and their tasks are all set up in a system, and then you’re suddenly told, Yeah, everything’s being delayed six weeks. Well, with one click of a button, your entire timeline can be adjusted in this tool. So again, it’s so much more than just generating content. But I do want to say something you said about the metaverse, because Zuckerberg may have been early with the metaverse, but he’s not wrong. We are absolutely headed toward XR, which is kind of a bucket for all different realities, augmented reality, virtual realities and the metaverse. We are going to see more and more in the XR realm very, very soon. We’re already seeing it with if you want to try on some clothes at Neiman’s, you can sit on your in your sofa and have your avatar. Not a cartoon, but an actual almost hologram of yourself with your dimensions trying on clothes. If you want to go to the Super Bowl, you can’t afford a ticket very, very soon you’ll pop on your headset and you can sit in the stands and watch the Super Bowl in the metaverse. Turn your head. There’s your buddy sitting next to you in the stands. He’s on his couch. You’re on his couch on your couch. But you’re all part of this reality that is coming very, very soon. And it’s the power and adoption of AI that’s going to lead to the metaverse.

Lee Kantor: [00:17:29] So when you’re working with your clients, you mentioned several different ways to engage with you. Can you go over those again and really explain the difference between them?

Jennifer Jones Mitchell: [00:17:39] Sure. Well, I can do in-person or virtual workshops, and this is custom to the client, you know, whether it’s an agency or a brand marketing team and it’s custom to the types of clients that they have because the needs of an agency that serves B2B clients versus B2C versus both, it’s all different. But I put together a workshop where I help you understand the mind and language of these GUI tools, how to talk to them, how to not just, Oh, here’s a list of good prompts to use, but rather how to craft the ask, how to craft the prompts, how to think through giving it what you need. Because I want you to be able to do more than just regurgitate a list of prompts that I give you. So that’s the workshops. And then the AI transformation strategy is far more in depth. It’s where I audit your teams. I identify those opportunities for automation. I look for those skills gaps that can be filled in by generative AI. You know, look for those operational efficiencies, look for data because so many companies and agencies have all this customer data that that’s being gathered through AI tools, but they don’t know how to use it. So I help them to operationalize that data for improved and personalized customer engagement. And then of course, those time saving and cost saving assistance through creative content generation. And then the last step of it is developing kind of company guidelines and policies to help really operationalize across the entire company. How you use generative AI tools, how we handle data privacy issues, how we handle, you know, all the risks that are associated with it as well, because you want to make sure you are not just strategic in your application, but you have an ethical application of GUI tools.

Lee Kantor: [00:19:42] Can you share a story of maybe one of the people or companies you work with that you don’t have to name their name, but maybe share the challenge that they were coming to you with and and how you helped them get to a new level.

Jennifer Jones Mitchell: [00:19:55] Well, just recently, like with an agency, one of the first things I like to do is look at their timesheets. Agencies, of course, have to track all their time. And I immediately found a number of areas where we could automate tasks that the agency was spending a lot of time doing. So, you know, identifying those those aha moments where you’re like, Yeah, you could have an AI tool. Achieve this for you. Also working with them on ways to recognize research and how to brainstorm in generative AI. That’s a big aha moment usually for the marketers that I work with because they just think of it as ask it to achieve and do this one task. But you can really have conversations with these tools that can kind of break you out of your normal approach to things. So just showing them how to use the tools in a new way. Always spark something in terms of application of it.

Lee Kantor: [00:21:05] Now, you mentioned a couple of the tools. Are there other. Can you list some of the kind of the tools that you your go to tools or the go to for marketers nowadays that you think should at least be experimented and played with?

Jennifer Jones Mitchell: [00:21:19] Well, absolutely. I’m a big fan as I mentioned of Claude two. I think it’s it’s far more human than ChatGPT. I mentioned Clickup anybody who’s trying to do project management. What I also like about Clickup is it has prompts, I think, over 100 different role based prompts. So as you’re building out your client campaign or some larger in-depth project, it, you can choose, let’s say engineering and it will have prompts not as I’m not an engineer, so I don’t inherently know what all the tasks I need to assign to an engineer for this specific campaign, but it will have prompts that will come up and say, write a technical spec or create a test plan. So it really helps you to map out your entire project management timeline. Price fix is one that I use a lot just in terms of developing my own B2B pricing for solutions. It basically reviews the market and competitive landscape and then helps you assist with your pricing. And then Wiser is another one that I’ve been playing with a lot on the B2C side. It captures real time retail data both online and in store, and it will help you develop your pricing strategies based on how your B2B B2C product is doing across the entire retail marketplace, which we know is, you know, beyond just the Tripoli.

Jennifer Jones Mitchell: [00:22:54] It looks at in-store, it looks at how resellers are pricing your products as well as competitors and gives you that real time data that helps you with your own pricing strategies. Beyond that, of course, I really love Mid-journey. I think it’s an incredible creator of images and I think that a lot of marketers also need to look at tools that they’re already using because a lot of existing tools are now adding generative AI features within them. For example, I already use Canva as a tool to help me create different graphics and images, particularly in social media. But with one click of a button, Canva will take your bullet points and turn that into a PowerPoint presentation. I can’t tell you how many hours marketers spend formatting decks to be able to have Canva, and there are a number of other tools that do it as well. But to have them create a beautiful PowerPoint deck for you in seconds, it’s just the time. Savings is is incredible.

Lee Kantor: [00:24:02] Now, when companies come to you, what is the typical point of entry? Like, are they coming to you to just get general information or are they coming to you to solve a problem?

Jennifer Jones Mitchell: [00:24:16] It’s both. Usually so far it starts with a workshop and then once their teams start using the generative AI tools, then they usually come back and say, okay, we understand the value, but we don’t understand how to get to this future state of AI. We need someone particularly to help us identify and test all of the tools because there are so many out there and some of them are really, really good and some of them are new companies that really haven’t tested to fruition yet. So a lot of times it comes down to we just don’t know which tools we should be using and we need help with that. And I always back that up and say, okay, let’s look at the strategy first. Let’s look at what we’re trying to achieve and not just give them a list of tools, but rather a true transformation strategy to get there.

Lee Kantor: [00:25:12] So if somebody wants to connect with you have a more in depth conversation. What is the coordinates?

Jennifer Jones Mitchell: [00:25:19] They can email me at Jennifer at Human Driven AOL.com or just visit the site human driven AI.

Lee Kantor: [00:25:25] Well, Jennifer, thank you so much for sharing your story. You’re doing important work and we appreciate you.

Jennifer Jones Mitchell: [00:25:30] Thank you so much for having me. I really appreciate it.

Lee Kantor: [00:25:33] All right. This is Lee Kantor. We’ll see you next time on Atlanta Business Radio.

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Nigel Stewart With Mission2Motivate

by

Atlanta Business Radio
Atlanta Business Radio
Nigel Stewart With Mission2Motivate
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Nigel Stewart, CEO of Mission2Motivate

M2M is a digital educational platform that aims to improve virtual learning for minority students. Young, energetic, and minority tutors can apply to tutor underrepresented students at struggling schools, mainly in the Atlanta area. All of the tutoring sessions are virtual and happen on the platform.

There are several other features that Mission2Motivate offers and he is excited to build and share.

Connect with Nigel on LinkedIn.

What You’ll Learn In This Episode

  • Transitioning to a web-app
  • Why this platform is needed
  • The process of “starting” a business
  • What my short term and future goals for the business are
  • Expanding the business

This transcript is machine transcribed by Sonix

TRANSCRIPT

Intro: [00:00:04] Broadcasting live from the Business RadioX Studios in Atlanta, Georgia. It’s time for Atlanta Business Radio. Brought to you by on pay. Atlanta’s New standard in payroll. Now, here’s your host.

Lee Kantor: [00:00:24] Lee Kantor here another episode of Atlanta Business Radio. And this is one of my favorite things we do. We have a series partnering with the folks at GSU where we spotlight some of the folks going through the Main Street Entrepreneurship Seed Fund. And I’m so excited to be talking to one of those people today. Nigel Stewart. He is with Mission to Motivate. Welcome, Nigel.

Nigel Stewart: [00:00:47] Hey, thanks for having me.

Lee Kantor: [00:00:48] Well, I’m excited to learn what you’re up to. Tell us about mission to motivate. How you serving folks?

Nigel Stewart: [00:00:53] It’s an online digital online educational platform designed to improve virtual learning for minority students. So the main aspect is that I connect virtual young minority tutors with young minority students, mainly between third and fifth grade at struggling schools who need the extra education.

Lee Kantor: [00:01:12] So what was the genesis of the idea? How did this get started?

Nigel Stewart: [00:01:16] It started in 2020 during Covid. I was a senior at Morehouse College. I have a sister. She’s 13 years younger than me. She’s in the third grade. At the time, her and all her friends were struggling with the new remote learning. I wasn’t struggling necessarily, but I didn’t enjoy remote learning at all. Most of my peers didn’t. So I knew there was a market for better virtual education, really for all ages. But I figured that grades third through fifth needed it the most, especially in the Atlanta area where I see a lot of education is lacking. So I just decided I used to tutor in undergrad and I just decided to first use my skills to see if I could make a difference. So I started tutoring online just to see what the market looked like and how things moved. And then once I got more comfortable, I started outsourcing and hiring some of my peers, some of my classmates who also wanted a tutor and just matched them with parents who wanted to sign up. So I started a website and allowed parents or students to just sign up online and then I would match them with the tutor that I had on my site. And this transitioned greatly since then, but that is definitely how it started.

Lee Kantor: [00:02:21] So is the curriculum the same nowadays, or do you study different things than you did when you started?

Nigel Stewart: [00:02:28] It’s the same. It’s always basic classes, math, English, science for all ages. So, you know, math could be regular edition and algebra and subtraction. It also be calculus. And, you know, science can be physics, chemistry, biology. And then also, I’ve had some tutors even be proficient in Spanish and French. So like I said, all ages. It really just depends on the student’s needs. Whatever a student needs help with, I can have a tutor help them.

Lee Kantor: [00:02:55] Now, is the tutoring one on one or is it a group session?

Nigel Stewart: [00:02:59] It’s a mainly a one on one session, especially for younger students. I feel like once it gets to a virtual session that’s bigger than three or to five, it just resembles a classroom setting, which is what I’m trying to avoid. I’m trying the goal is to always make sure that students are engaged, having a good time and just feel, you know, spirited about the session they’re in. I don’t want them to feel like it’s a drag or it’s it’s another class or, you know, an education setting that they don’t feel like doing. They should be excited about it. And I feel like that one on one opportunity just makes it a greater experience.

Lee Kantor: [00:03:34] Now, when you started doing this, when did you start seeing some traction saying, you know what, I think I’m on to something here. I think this is something that’s needed, number one. But also I can train other people to execute so I don’t have to do all the tutoring.

Nigel Stewart: [00:03:49] After the first couple of months because I started having a lot of parents signing up and my schedule didn’t allow me to tutor all their students. And that’s when it finally clicked, like, okay, I got to find some more people. And then I realized I don’t have to do it at all. And that’s kind of always the goal. You know, when you’re the CEO, of course you want to be hands on, but you don’t want to be doing the groundwork. So that’s when I realized that it’s time to start outsourcing and hiring more tutors. And then I started recruiting, which I hadn’t done before either. So sending out applications, interviewing people, hiring people, receiving resumes, all of that was was new to me, but it was a great learning experience and I’m glad I got to do it because that also helped with my managerial experience. So yeah, it wasn’t long, just a really maybe three, four months. I had a lot of parents start signing up.

Lee Kantor: [00:04:39] Now when you’re doing something like you’re doing with this double sided marketplace, is it harder to get students that need tutoring or is it harder to find tutors?

Nigel Stewart: [00:04:50] It’s harder to find students that need tutoring. Finding tutors was actually or still is one of the easiest parts of the business. Not to say it’s easy, it’s just easier compared to everything else. The tutors are eager. I have connections at my school at Morehouse College where I went, but also other several HBCUs, Howard University, Spelman College, Clark University. And I can go on. I’m trying to make connections at University of Virginia. The list goes on. It’s not never a shortage of people that want to to. Going get back to their community. Finding students that want to be tutored is definitely trickier because not every student that needs it necessarily wants to do it. And that’s at the age where a lot of students, frankly, just don’t really care or are highly invested in their education yet because they’re so young, you know, they’re focused on maybe playing a sport or having a good time being social, making friends. It’s a lot of other factors, especially if there’s stuff going on at home. But what I found early was definitely parents who were encouraging their kids to do that. So now I’m even partnering with schools or nonprofit school systems to just provide students so they’ll have a pool of students that need the help. And then I provide the tutors and match them with them, set up the organization. That way they don’t have to sign up individually. It’s already something that the school necessarily offers to them.

Lee Kantor: [00:06:13] So for parents that are listening right now, what are some kind of things they can be looking for with their kid to say, you know what, maybe my kid does need tutoring. I like it. It may not even occur to them that they would benefit from a service like this.

Nigel Stewart: [00:06:30] Just a lack of communication. I feel like a lot of students who are proud of what they do go home and just share with their parents. If students are hiding what they’re doing or aren’t being fully honest, it might be time just to check in. But also just, you know, if a student is lacking in something, maybe they are struggling and maybe they’re good in English and science, but not good at math. It doesn’t mean they’re a bad student. It just means they might need a little extra help, which is what my service is providing. There are our 30 minutes an hour long session, so they’re not very long. They can be once a week, twice a week, three times a week. It’s just something extra to help, you know, supplement what they’re not getting in school. And sometimes that’s what we need. I needed it when I was growing up. I’m sure at some point everybody’s kid has needed just a little help figuring things out. Maybe it’s help with organization, maybe it’s help with studying, maybe it’s helped with the subject, maybe it’s helped with reading. It could be a series of things that are all a part of a young child’s development, and you can never really get enough of that. So it might not even be. A student needs help with a certain subject it might need. They are extremely unorganized and can’t focus with all the work they have to do. So one of my tutors can help set up a schedule and facilitate things differently than what the teachers can at school or even what the parents can. It’s just an extra voice because really it takes a community to build up a child and my platform is adding to that community.

Lee Kantor: [00:07:55] Now. How do you see this platform evolving?

Nigel Stewart: [00:07:59] So I’m actually in the works of building out an app now, so it’ll be a web app platform very soon. It will be a one stop shop so students and schools will be allowed to apply based on, you know, certain criteria, but not much. They’ll be allowed to create a profile and then from there make a schedule with the tutors calendar as well. So tutors will also be able to sign up and apply. And then when I receive money from donations from nonprofits and organizations to pay out the tutors, donors will be able to make a profile and donate money on the site as well. And then all three entities or no, for school students, tutors and donors will all be able to communicate because everybody’s there for the same reason, which is improving minority education. And they’ll be able to interact, set up schedules, have one on ones, and make the tutoring aspect easy and all in one place. So it’s not a bunch of parties trying to figure out where everything is. Everything’s in one central area location and also schools and students and tutors will be able to keep up with students progress and just the work they have to do work completed organizing, planning, everything will be available on the platform. So that’s coming very soon.

Lee Kantor: [00:09:15] Now, have you been doing this long enough to see results of your efforts? Is there something that is documented that says, okay, we’ve had this many kids go through this and this is, you know, they were at this level when they started and now they’re at this new level several months in.

Nigel Stewart: [00:09:31] Yeah, I would say it’s a handful. So I don’t have extensive data, but I am confident in the work I’ve done, especially all the parent feedback. So every parent that I have had tutored has given great feedback and I can not I don’t just have their testimonials, but I also have their, you know, information to contact them whenever I need. Let’s see somebody or a recommendation or anything like that. So I have definitely proven the students that I have had come through. I have their their grades and their testimonials as well. I had one previous partnership with the I don’t want to name the school, but it was a school in Cobb County right outside of Atlanta, and they refused to give me the data once the semester was over. But, you know, that’s why that’s a learning process. So it I didn’t necessarily get. What I wanted out of it at the end, but I was able to say I did it and learn a lot of things doing that. But that’s just something that I’ll be working towards as I move forward. Especially building out the app is connecting with schools to make sure I get all the data necessary to move forward. But yeah, right now I have a handful of testimonials from students and parents who viewed my platform as highly helpful.

Lee Kantor: [00:10:47] Now, what inspired you to get involved with the Main Street Entrepreneurship Seed Fund?

Nigel Stewart: [00:10:53] It’s funny, so I just saw the application in my email and I was nervous to apply. When I first saw it. I was like, I don’t even I don’t need this. I think I’m okay. But then after a couple of days, I was like, You know, why not? It’s a great opportunity. I went in when I looked a second time, I went to the cohorts main page and looked at their first, second and third cohorts from the last couple of years and just figured that it might be something that would be advantageous for me in my business. I wasn’t aware of any other accelerator programs and I to be honest, I wasn’t even that wasn’t something I was looking for. I didn’t know they were really out there for that and I didn’t know Georgia State had one. I just am good with checking my email. I think that’s something underrated that a lot of people don’t do is check every email. You never know what’s going to pop up. But once I applied and went through the application and did some more research, I was extremely excited and then I wasn’t sure I was going to be accepted. It was a long interview process I had to pitch and I hadn’t pitched before. I had to build a starter deck, which I didn’t have. And yeah, the application led me to steps that I should have been doing with my business in the first place. So I’m forever grateful for what they’ve done. And now that I’ve been accepted, it’s been an amazing experience and where I might be halfway through. So yeah, they’ve given me much more than I could have ever, not just even like hope for, but just want it as well. I’m just extremely grateful. And every day I try to make sure I’m taking advantage of what they’re offering now.

Lee Kantor: [00:12:30] Are you able to incorporate any of the way that they’re mentoring you into your process?

Nigel Stewart: [00:12:37] Oh, every time they are well experienced, obviously, they’ve, you know, invested and created several businesses themselves from an individual standpoint. And also their network is extensive and they’ve been having people reach out to me when they can’t help me. So wherever I need help, they make sure that’s available. And it’s immediate. It doesn’t take them days or weeks. They find somebody that day and put me in an email chain and that person responds back to me very quickly. So it’s just all types of work. We have weekly workshops, so the workshops help their advice, help the one on one calls, help the mentor calls, help everything. And that’s really how I came to the conclusion that I wanted to even build a web app because I personally wasn’t thinking big enough when I started this app. And, you know, now that I’m here, it’s developing into something I never could have imagined. I told somebody the other day, I figured I’d be doing service in another country before I was building an app. So that’s what this Main Street program has done for me mainly is just open up my mind and taught me to, you know, expand what I believe this business can even be. And then just the knowledge and information I’ve gained in the last couple of months already is more than what some people get in their lifetime. So yeah, it’s it’s I could go on and on about the experience and the notes I’ve got and what they’ve done and how I’ve already pivoted 2 or 3 times since I even started the Main Street program.

Lee Kantor: [00:14:05] And it’s a great example and it really is similar to the work you’re doing when you put help at the right time in a person’s life, it can really take a person to a new level, help them dream bigger, help them accomplish more if it’s presented correctly, if it’s, you know, fairly easy to incorporate and it can really change lives.

Nigel Stewart: [00:14:29] Yeah. And just building on top of that, back to the tutoring. That’s why the tutors are so good at what they do is because they’re showing young minority and black students that it’s okay to be smart, it’s okay. You can come from where you come from and want to be an education, you know, And they’re showing that there’s other avenues besides the stereotypical and traditional ways there are for a young minority or black student to grow up and be successful. And that’s the main aspect of this whole business, is showing that education can be more than what’s offered from a 9:00 to 3:00 basis, especially when it comes to virtual education.

Lee Kantor: [00:15:10] So what do you need more of? How can we help you?

Nigel Stewart: [00:15:14] I just need, of course, getting the word out. Word of mouth is everything but starting to receive donations to pay off the tutors. The. I am not looking for donations for a mission to motivate. I’m looking for donations to pay out the tutors with and when I get those donations, they will sit in the fund until I’m ready to pay the tutors out. And then also, once the app and web app is being finished, donors will be able to sign up and see exactly where their money is going to, what schools and what students specifically by way of the platform. So just getting help, you know, starting those conversations and making sure that these nonprofits, organizations and donors know that this is being built and it’s all for the betterment of minority education, especially in the Atlanta area, so that they’re ready when the site is ready to go live again, because it’s obviously being built up that they’re ready to donate money and can help the tutors get paid.

Lee Kantor: [00:16:11] So if somebody wants to connect with you and learn more, what is the best way to do that? Is there a website or on LinkedIn? What’s the best way to connect?

Nigel Stewart: [00:16:19] Yeah, so there’s several platforms. First, my LinkedIn. Nigel Stewart It says it CEO of Mission to motivate, but also my personal and business email right now is Nigel Nigel Stewart street art to two at gmail.com. Nigel Stewart to two at gmail.com. But also contact at mission to motivate.com. That’s the business email the website. It’s funny it’s it’s almost like a dinosaur now because I pivoted so much in the last couple of months. It’s not up to date, but you can still sign up and send me a note on the website. It’s at the registration on the bottom. And then. Yeah, just if you know anybody that wants to get in contact, please share my email and I’ll be happy sharing my phone number off of this as well. So yeah, any LinkedIn email? Um, even my, my email is in Stewart 16@gsu.edu if anybody’s wondering and.

Lee Kantor: [00:17:18] The website is mission the number to motivate.com if they want to go and contact you through that.

Nigel Stewart: [00:17:23] Yeah I’m sorry it’s mission to motivate.com and it’s the number two so mission number two motivate.com.

Lee Kantor: [00:17:30] Well Nigel Nigel thank you so much for sharing your story you’re doing such important work and we appreciate you.

Nigel Stewart: [00:17:38] Thank you for having me. This is very exciting and very helpful.

Lee Kantor: [00:17:41] All right. This is Lee Kantor. We will see you all next time on GSU indie radio.

About Our Sponsor

OnPay’sOnPay-Dots payroll services and HR software give you more time to focus on what’s most important. Rated “Excellent” by PC Magazine, we make it easy to pay employees fast, we automate all payroll taxes, and we even keep all your HR and benefits organized and compliant.

Our award-winning customer service includes an accuracy guarantee, deep integrations with popular accounting software, and we’ll even enter all your employee information for you — whether you have five employees or 500. Take a closer look to see all the ways we can save you time and money in the back office.

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Maiya Newton With DuffleBox

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Atlanta Business Radio
Atlanta Business Radio
Maiya Newton With DuffleBox
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As a former student-athlete a part of Georgia State’s Track and Field and Cross Country teams, Maiya Newton felt like she needed more things to help supplement her workouts so DuffleBox was born.

Connect with Maiya on LinkedIn.

 

What You’ll Learn In This Episode

  • Balancing her 9-to-5 as an Entrepreneur
  • What being a former athlete has taught her about entrepreneurship
  • Challenges
  • What does the future of the business look like
  • Other things she is doing to stay in a healthy mental state

This transcript is machine transcribed by Sonix

TRANSCRIPT

Intro: [00:00:04] Broadcasting live from the Business RadioX Studios in Atlanta, Georgia. It’s time for Atlanta Business Radio. Brought to you by on pay. Atlanta’s New standard in payroll. Now, here’s your host.

Lee Kantor: [00:00:24] Lee Kantor here, another special edition of Atlanta Business Radio. This is the GSU radio show where we spotlight all the good work that’s happening at GSU and especially the folks that are involved with the Main Street Entrepreneurship Seed Fund. And we have another person right now that is going through that program. It’s Maiya Newton and she’s with Duffle Box. Welcome.

Maiya Newton: [00:00:50] Oh, thank you so much. I really appreciate.

Lee Kantor: [00:00:51] It. Well, I am so excited to learn what you’re up to. Tell us about Duffle Box.

Maiya Newton: [00:00:56] So duffle box is a subscription box for athletes. It has about five different items, 5 to 7 items ranging from nutrition to supplements to clothing. Everything that an athlete needs to really enhance their performance. So that’s a little bit about it. And I really I started it back in 2019. I had the idea because I actually ran track and cross country here at Georgia State. And one day after practice, I went up into my room and I realized that I needed a lot more things to help supplement my workouts. And so that’s how I came up with the idea.

Lee Kantor: [00:01:29] So was the idea like you maybe were familiar with other box subscriptions and you’re like, Hey, how come there isn’t one for athletes?

Maiya Newton: [00:01:38] Well, it was more like at the time subscription boxes were really popular. At the time, I didn’t really do much research on other subscription boxes for athletes, but I didn’t know about like Fab Fit Fun and, you know, the subscription model in general. So.

Lee Kantor: [00:01:55] So when you have the idea, then what do you do with that idea at that point?

Maiya Newton: [00:02:01] Well, so I started I formed the LLC, and then for a good little minute I had analysis paralysis where I was just kind of like working by myself and I didn’t know, like the next steps. So I really didn’t start until 2021 with like getting my sales and everything like that. But from 2019 to 2021, I kind of joined like other incubators. I did like a grant program where I was I was able to get some funding, a little bit of funding, and then that’s pretty much what happened. So yeah.

Lee Kantor: [00:02:30] So when you have the idea, did you like as the person that founded the company, you are kind of the curator of the box, right? You have you get to decide what goes in the box.

Maiya Newton: [00:02:42] Yes, correct.

Lee Kantor: [00:02:43] So how did you is that where did you begin with. Okay, let me curate a great box and then let me try to sell it. Or did you try to see if anybody would buy it first and then curate what goes in it?

Maiya Newton: [00:02:57] Um, that’s a great question. I think the first thing that I did was I put a group of people in like a group me and then it was supposed to be like a tester box, which was really ugly. When I first put it out, it was really small. And I just put this these basic items in there. But then once I sent it out to people, I called them back and I asked them like, what did they like about this? Or what? What would they change about it? But it was still going out to customers. And then the next box was my February box. And that was more of a a better trial run type of box.

Lee Kantor: [00:03:30] So yeah. Now at what point did you start getting some traction where people were like, you were thinking, Oh, people will pay for this if I put the right stuff in there.

Maiya Newton: [00:03:43] So I actually started selling on Amazon. And then I also did this partnership with Fit Bod, which is a personal fitness app, and we were able to give our subscribers like a year free with that membership. So that really started generating sales. It still wasn’t a lot of sales, but that’s really where I was like, okay, I can, you know, actually improve my sales and really be a business.

Lee Kantor: [00:04:05] And something like that’s a digital product. So like, were you putting a card in there with like a code that gives them a membership?

Maiya Newton: [00:04:13] Yeah. So I had a code and it said like maybe duffle box 20, 21, and then they were able to get their the Fitbit app for free. So yeah.

Lee Kantor: [00:04:22] And then, so then was it difficult to go and kind of curate other products like because you had to keep your costs low so you have some margin for the marketing and the production and the shipping of the the box. Right. Mhm. So was that was it difficult to find stuff to go in the box that was affordable and had high value?

Maiya Newton: [00:04:47] Yes, definitely. And that’s still something that I’m trying to work out now. So I’m glad that I’m in this program to kind of help me figure that out.

Lee Kantor: [00:04:55] So, like, how do you even go about deciding or finding the next thing that goes in next month’s box?

Maiya Newton: [00:05:03] So basically you’re supposed to kind of plan per month. Well, technically, we have like a monthly box and a quarterly box. Um, but I’m just still trying to figure that part out. Like how, how I want to go about planning certain boxes. And I think in the future, the boxes are supposed to be separated by sport. Um, so really trying not to kind of put the same products that was in the last box in this box. It’s been a challenge, so I’m still trying to figure that out. I haven’t had like a concrete plan just yet.

Lee Kantor: [00:05:38] Now, are you are you kind of communicating with your customers to see what they would like or they’re asking for? Or is it something that you are kind of trying to guide and lead your customers?

Maiya Newton: [00:05:52] Um, yeah. So we’re actually doing customer discovery right now in the program. So I’ve been like setting up tables at Unity Plaza and trying to go to gyms and just different events and try to talk to my customers and just kind of. Saying like, Hey, what do you think about this? But really not trying to give them too much about the the actual product since that’s the way they were leading us. So I’m just trying to figure out like what their current behaviors and patterns are and then we’ll go from there.

Lee Kantor: [00:06:19] Now, is your customer the collegiate athlete or like kind of a semi-serious or almost professional athlete, or is it a regular person that just aspires to be into fitness?

Maiya Newton: [00:06:31] So right now we have three different target segments, which I’m trying to, you know, get it down to about one. So the first customer segment is coaches and ads or coaches and trainers. And then we have athletes that are more professional between the well, sorry, college athletes and teams that are more professional athletes. And then we have your regular like gym goers or athletes between the ages of 18 and 34. So.

Lee Kantor: [00:07:00] So. So it’s geared towards serious athlete. It isn’t for you know, the person that just is that wannabe fitness person.

Maiya Newton: [00:07:09] Well we do have a lot of customers that are, um, they’re just a regular gym goer, um, regular everyday kind of athlete. And then we also do have teams that we’re trying to market to too, but we’re trying to get the, the target segment down. So it’s for.

Lee Kantor: [00:07:26] Both. Now has, has kind of being an athlete and having that discipline and the mental toughness helped you, you know, with your entrepreneurship is that some are those traits kind of transferable to entrepreneurship?

Maiya Newton: [00:07:40] Yes, definitely. So I feel like the main trait that being an athlete has taught me is resilience, just to kind of continue to keep going because entrepreneurship is really hard and it’s not fun, especially it’s kind of lonely at times. So, um, yeah, it’s definitely taught me how to continue to keep going and, you know, don’t quit when it gets hard.

Lee Kantor: [00:08:01] Now what was kind of the first hurdle that, that you overcame like that, You know, you were at a point where things were going and then all of a sudden something happened and then you’re like, oh, do I really want to be doing this? Yes.

Maiya Newton: [00:08:13] So I was living in Memphis. I actually moved from Atlanta to Memphis once I graduated college and I started working at Fedex. So kind of balancing a full time job with entrepreneurship is one thing. But I was in Memphis. I had my little office at the house and I started getting a little bit of traction. But then Covid happened and I wanted to move back from Memphis to Atlanta, and I didn’t know how to, like, keep a business going while you’re like moving. So that’s really another reason why I kind of stopped the business for a year. So that was something major that I’m still now trying to like implement. Like if I move, how, how our operations going to keep going.

Lee Kantor: [00:08:53] So yeah. So when you were struck with that kind of dilemma, how did you overcome some it was it did you have other people you talked to? Do you have any mentors? Did you have anybody that can give you advice or did you just kind of power through?

Maiya Newton: [00:09:09] At the time, I didn’t really have anyone to talk to. I just kind of stopped, stopped at all. And then I moved back home and then I just kind of tried to keep it going. But then I ran into Miss Erika Bracy here at Georgia State, and she was like, Oh, we’re going to have another, um, another program. So then I applied to the program and I got in. So they’ve definitely given me mentors now where I can say, okay, like what? What happens if this happens? Then how can I keep the business going? And now I have more people to like talk to and bounce ideas off from.

Lee Kantor: [00:09:44] Now having that kind of support, is that been kind of a game changer for you in terms of now you feel like, okay, now this is manageable? I have some structure now. I have kind of a team around me that can help me kind of make this as big as I want it to to be.

Maiya Newton: [00:10:00] Yes, definitely. Now I have three mentors, so there’s two that are they’ve either like worked in sports or like currently working in sports or they’ve won grant programs. So that’s super helpful because when you’re an entrepreneur, like I said, it can get really lonely and like you can be at home crying because you don’t know like what’s next or what to do. Um, so yeah, it’s definitely been a lot helpful.

Lee Kantor: [00:10:25] Now, do you have anybody else in the business with you or is it just, you.

Maiya Newton: [00:10:30] Know, it’s just me? So me at home making the boxes, trying to plan boxes, um, shipping them out. But it really helps because I can learn like every aspect of the business. I can learn like shipping and how much things are supposed to cost and, and marketing. So that really makes me well-rounded and I really like that.

Lee Kantor: [00:10:50] So your business is an online business. Do you have a technologist that helps with the website or the marketing, online marketing, digital marketing or that you also.

Maiya Newton: [00:11:01] So that’s me majority I did use I think it’s fiber.

Lee Kantor: [00:11:05] Fiber, fiber, yeah.

Maiya Newton: [00:11:07] Yeah. Fiber to um, to create like the logo and do the website and stuff like that. I’m actually in the process of rebranding as well, so I’m going to need that again. Um, and then I did do, I hired a marketer at one point where they like posted, you know, a couple of photos and were maybe able to increase my followers on Instagram. But that was like a one time thing and it wasn’t the most helpful. Um, so I’m majority doing that as well and trying to improve marketing as well.

Lee Kantor: [00:11:36] Now, being a former student athlete, were you, were you around during that the period of the nil, you know, licensing deals or.

Maiya Newton: [00:11:47] I wasn’t, unfortunately.

Lee Kantor: [00:11:49] So you missed out on that? Yeah. Is that is that an area you’re going to pursue for the current crop of athletes that are out there that. Where they can be partners with you or ambassadors?

Maiya Newton: [00:12:03] Yes. So that is one of the strategies that I’m going to do or focus on, especially when it comes to like TikTok and Instagram. Actually, one of my mentors told me about one of these websites. I forget the name of it, but we’re going to use that to really reach out to the athletes and they can, you know, do an Instagram post or TikTok post or possibly be like a partner. So, yeah.

Lee Kantor: [00:12:27] Yeah. So you’re so you weren’t able to take part in it, but you’re going to be able to leverage it for your company. Yes. So what how do you see this going? What’s your dream of dreams on how this story ends?

Maiya Newton: [00:12:43] So I’m still coming up with goals and everything like that. But one thing I do have in my mind is that I want to have, like, a warehouse. Um, I don’t know if you’ve ever heard of Saltbox, but I definitely want to get my business in there and just really generating revenue and just making it something that’s operational, something that I don’t have to necessarily touch and just really have a huge influence on athletes and then also giving back to the community. So that’s my my goal for now. And then, you know, as I progress, then I’ll be able to get more goals.

Lee Kantor: [00:13:14] Now is part of the dream for serving the athlete community? Is it to help them? Like, are they going to be able to kind of make money off this too? If they are an ambassador, they can earn or maybe an affiliate that they can make some extra money by promoting it so that it becomes a win win win all the way around.

Maiya Newton: [00:13:31] Yeah, definitely. That’s something I would want to have in the works, especially if you’re an affiliate. You definitely would get a portion of the profits or whatever like that. Um, so yeah, that’s definitely in the works.

Lee Kantor: [00:13:42] Now, in the Box, you mentioned that there was a digital app membership and there was, there’s stuff in the, in the like stuff an athlete could use obviously in the box as well. Is there anything in the box that maybe touches onto mental health or maybe other other needs of an athlete that isn’t maybe obvious?

Maiya Newton: [00:14:07] We actually don’t have anything in the box right now for mental health. But it’s interesting that you just said that because I was talking with one of my coaches and he was saying that mental, mental health, health is a huge thing that he wants to touch on. So I definitely want to figure out ways to kind of implement that in the box, whether that’s maybe like a free therapy, like how we did the fit Bod, maybe free therapy or like a journal or something like that.

Lee Kantor: [00:14:33] Yeah, because you want to touch the athlete, the whole athlete, right? Not just their physical skills.

Maiya Newton: [00:14:39] Yes, definitely.

Lee Kantor: [00:14:41] So what’s been your favorite part of going through the Main Street program?

Maiya Newton: [00:14:45] My favorite part. Um, the people are really helpful. So like my team members, the people in the cohort, they’ve been super helpful. We’ve like actually gone out outside of the program and like been able to help each other. So that’s really fun just to know that you’re not alone in, like, entrepreneurship. Um, we started doing customer discovery, so that’s really, it’s challenging. So it’s interesting to know, like to start talking to people on the street or customers potential customers. That’s really scary. So that’s not really fun, but it’s just fun to learn more things.

Lee Kantor: [00:15:24] Now when you’re having those conversations with potential customers, have you learned anything that you’re like, Oh wow, I hadn’t thought about that. That was surprising. Yes.

Maiya Newton: [00:15:34] I’m learning a lot and I’m trying to, you know, get all the data correct. But basically I’m trying to present to them a hypothesis. And our hypothesis is like. Athletes are not willing to change their current routines and purchase products that help improve their performance. And so a lot of people are having a lot of different things to say about it. Some people are saying it depends. Some people are saying yes, some people are saying no. So that’s one thing that’s really interesting is trying to figure out. If they agree with that or if they don’t. So and it’s also Well, yeah, one of the biggest things that I’ve learned is talking to the coaches and the ads is about like how they get their money and how they can spend their money. And if they would want a product like this or they’re telling me that the trainers really influenced their decision. So that’s a huge thing that I’ve learned, right?

Lee Kantor: [00:16:28] Because for athletes at that level, you know, just an incremental improvement of 1% is a big deal.

Maiya Newton: [00:16:37] Yes, very. Yeah. So they’re just saying that like if a trainer recommends like a supplement or this product, then they’re more likely to use it. Um, so yeah, yeah.

Lee Kantor: [00:16:49] I mean, it’s just really interesting when you’re dealing with athletes at that level, they just want an edge, you know? Yeah, every, every little bit matters because that all adds up. And that could be the difference between winning and losing.

Maiya Newton: [00:17:03] Yeah, definitely.

Lee Kantor: [00:17:05] So what do you need more of at this point? How can we help you?

Maiya Newton: [00:17:09] Um, this is definitely helpful. Just someone to talk to and get bounce ideas off of. That’s definitely helpful. Um, so, yeah.

Lee Kantor: [00:17:19] And if somebody wants to learn more about duffle box, is there a website or is their online presence?

Maiya Newton: [00:17:25] Yes. So you can go on to w-w-w dot boxscore right now if you log on to it, there might not be a screen. I don’t know why I’m trying to figure that out, but we’re actually rebranding right now, so everything should be up and running by November. Um, so yeah, that’s where you can reach us at. And also duffle box on Instagram, Twitter, all of the platforms.

Lee Kantor: [00:17:49] And then if somebody wants to subscribe, they can subscribe. Or are you taking subscribers at this point?

Maiya Newton: [00:17:55] Um, not at this point. They can actually. I’m going to create a landing page.

Lee Kantor: [00:17:59] It’s like a waitlist.

Maiya Newton: [00:18:01] Yes, a waitlist. So you can do that on our website. And then also we are going to be launching back on Amazon in November as well. So, yes, I’ll go ahead and create the landing page so you guys can go ahead and subscribe.

Lee Kantor: [00:18:14] Well, congratulations on all the momentum. What you’re doing is really hard and it takes a lot of resilience, as you’ve learned, and a lot of dedication and a lot of hard work. So congratulations on that. You’re doing important work and we appreciate you.

Maiya Newton: [00:18:29] Thank you so much. I really appreciate it.

Lee Kantor: [00:18:30] All right. This is Lee Kantor. We’ll see y’all next time on GSU indie radio.

About Our Sponsor

OnPay’sOnPay-Dots payroll services and HR software give you more time to focus on what’s most important. Rated “Excellent” by PC Magazine, we make it easy to pay employees fast, we automate all payroll taxes, and we even keep all your HR and benefits organized and compliant.

Our award-winning customer service includes an accuracy guarantee, deep integrations with popular accounting software, and we’ll even enter all your employee information for you — whether you have five employees or 500. Take a closer look to see all the ways we can save you time and money in the back office.

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Meagan Naraine and Tamir Mickens With Culturally Relevant Science

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CRSCI-logo
Atlanta Business Radio
Meagan Naraine and Tamir Mickens With Culturally Relevant Science
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Meagan Naraine, Co-Founder of Culturally Relevant Science, is an experienced Science Educator & rising Instructional Coach in Atlanta, GA. She earned a Biology, B.S. from Emory University & Broad Field Science, M.A.T. from Georgia State University. She has 5+ years of experience teaching in low-income schools with predominantly Black & Brown students.

Because of the rigorous, student-centered, culturally relevant curriculum she develops, she has a tremendous track record of increasing students’ standardized test scores 14-21+%. Additionally, she is a ‘18 Teach For America Alum & ‘25 Robert Noyce DSPETL Teacher Fellow.

Tamir Mickens, Co-Founder, is an experienced Science Educator & Instructional Coach in Atlanta, GA. He earned his Biology, B.S. from Morehouse College & Instructional Technology, M.S. from Kennesaw State University.

He has 10+ years of experience in Title-I, middle & high schools with predominantly Black & Brown student populations. From this experience, he noticed a severe underrepresentation of his students’ identities in district STEM curriculum. As a result, he taught himself digital content creation, in efforts to build a more engaging and inclusive STEM curriculum for Black & Brown identities.

Follow Culturally Relevant Science on LinkedIn, Facebook, and Twitter.

What You’ll Learn In This Episode

  • How did the idea for the venture come about
  • The progress of the venture right now
  • Major challenges they have faced
  • Other organizations that have lent a hand in their growth
  • How can people support or donate

This transcript is machine transcribed by Sonix

TRANSCRIPT

Intro: [00:00:04] Broadcasting live from the Business RadioX Studios in Atlanta, Georgia. It’s time for Atlanta Business Radio. Brought to you by on pay. Atlanta’s New standard in payroll. Now, here’s your host.

Lee Kantor: [00:00:25] Lee Kantor here so excited to be doing this special edition of Atlanta Business Radio. This is the GSU radio series that we’ve been doing for quite some time now where we celebrate the goings on over there at GSU. Any program, and especially the Main Street Entrepreneurship Seed Fund participants and finalists. And so excited to be talking to two of them. Today. We got Megan Noreen and Tamir Mickens with Culturally Relevant Science. Welcome.

Tamir Mickens: [00:00:56] Glad to be here and we thank you for having us.

Lee Kantor: [00:00:58] Well, I’m excited to learn what you’re up to. Tell us a little bit about culturally relevant science. How are you serving folks?

Tamir Mickens: [00:01:05] Absolutely. So culturally relevant Science is a 500 and 1C3 nonprofit founded by myself, Tamir Mickens and Megan Rain. And our goal is to increase representation in Stem amongst historically underrepresented communities. So whether those be black, brown, indigenous communities, the Lgbtqia community, communities of low socio income and we do this by creating and customizing digital resources and curriculum for teachers to use in those communities.

Lee Kantor: [00:01:34] So what was the genesis of the idea? How did this kind of get started?

Meagan Naraine: [00:01:41] Yeah, so essentially it originated during Covid when school was shut down and everything became virtual. We’ve been teaching for a combination of over ten years and it was a lot easier when we were in the classroom to engage our students and be those people of color and those representations inside the classroom. But when schools went virtual, it was harder. We obviously we weren’t in front of our students. We didn’t really know our students. And then we we were stuck to showing YouTube videos and we noticed that a lot of the YouTube videos didn’t look it didn’t have representations that looked like the students that were sitting behind in our classrooms, behind their screens. So we just started making videos during lockdown in our apartments, in our backyards, being the people in the videos, animating them just learning these different skills. And we realized they were big hits. And I called Tamir and I was like, We should turn this into something, make a bunch of resources and just change the game for when it comes to Stem videos and worksheets and lessons.

Lee Kantor: [00:02:39] Now, how important was it for you both growing up? You both decided to get into this field and to be educators and to touch on science and technology and the other Stem pillars. How how did you kind of make it? What was what helped you get to the level you’re at today where you can help other people and pull other people up? Was there a mentor or was there some resources that you were able to take advantage of in order to get to where you are?

Tamir Mickens: [00:03:08] Absolutely. Well, for myself, I come from a family of educators, so my mother was a science teacher in my community, DeKalb County. So growing up, I always just had that background and I was fortunate and privileged in certain ways to have to people in the home that valued education, particularly Stem education. I was able to go to Morehouse College at a very early age for different Stem camps, which led me to actually attend there. And so just being surrounded by all of those positive images in my community really instilled that love for science and community within me. But just because I had it, you know, it didn’t mean that all of my peers necessarily had it. It doesn’t mean that the other people in my community or the students I eventually taught had those same privileges, so just wanted to share it with them and spread it to those that don’t.

Lee Kantor: [00:04:04] Now, once you had the idea for the videos and and having yourself kind of star, I guess, star in them, when did you realize, hey, we might have something there? What was kind of the first evidence of some traction?

Meagan Naraine: [00:04:19] Yeah. So both Tamara and I are Teach for America alumni. So we teach for America. They. They train you and then they place you in underserved schools. And you you’re you work with them for two years, and then you choose if you want to stay and teach after that. And so someone saw us through Teach for America. Andy Appleton She was like, Hey, I see you guys started this nonprofit, this organization, this idea, you should come pitch, pitch in our Shark Tank event. So they have a mini shark tank every year in metro Atlanta. So we we never pitched before. We had no idea what a pitch was. But they coached us and we pitched and we won the grand prize there. And that was our first money, first grant, first revenue coming in and our first time feeling like we really, really had something special there. So Teach for America has poured a lot into us and our development and our coaching.

Lee Kantor: [00:05:12] Absolutely. Now, when did you start getting feeling that you were getting traction from the end users, the people that you really ultimately want to serve?

Tamir Mickens: [00:05:21] I’d say after our first year in starting to. Did our bit of funding together and we started to kind of invest in honing our skills. We made our videos a bit more, I guess. I don’t know if I want to say high end, but we invested more time into the animation and actually getting more dialog and funny things in our videos. And we Megan had the idea to do something very, very generic in science. So we made a video on lab safety and I pulled in a lot of things that I’d seen over the years and funny jokes and scenarios. And that was our first video that truly blew up to where it wasn’t just students watching it in our school, students around the country, teachers around the country, world, just commenting and liking and sharing that video. And that really helped our followers to increase on social media, YouTube, our views. That video is almost at 20 K views on YouTube right now. So that was our first, if you want to call it a big break or whatever.

Lee Kantor: [00:06:24] Now, was it to go from being a teacher, you know, where you have a job and that’s kind of pretty straightforward and structured to running a, you know, a new venture like you are, where it’s kind of a blank sheet of paper and no one gives you a manual on, Oh, here on Tuesday, I do this, you know, like you have you’re kind of making this stuff up as you go along. How do you kind of hone in on that kind of entrepreneurial, entrepreneurial kind of mindset of we got to make something happen every day. We got to grow certain metrics. Those are important to us. I mean, that’s a different type of thinking than, you know, being a teacher that has a curriculum that, you know, next week you’re doing a certain thing.

Meagan Naraine: [00:07:10] Yeah, absolutely. Um, that is just something. So we apply for a lot of fellowships and a lot of kind of like Main Street, of course, things like that that will teach us the business side of things, the entrepreneurship side of things, the nonprofit side of things that we didn’t get in our classroom education career. And we just we just keep pouring ourselves into that. We keep holding each other accountable. Um, we have two different, very different skill sets. Timéa is the digital guy. He makes all the videos, does all the web stuff, and I’m more so like the grant writer, the person that kind of applies for everything, organizes everything. And we just really, if we ever have deadlines and anything like that, we hold ourselves accountable. And then we join fellowships to hold ourselves accountable even more.

Lee Kantor: [00:07:55] So you’ve been able to get some of the kind of the entrepreneurship basics, kind of the foundational elements of running a business through some of the things that you’ve entered and won have been able to help you kind of get the knowledge you need to kind of grow the business.

Meagan Naraine: [00:08:14] Absolutely. So we did social innovation through TFA. That was our like ideation stage pitching stage. Then we did 4.0 schools as tiny fellowship. They were more of our customer discovery stage. And then now we’re doing Main Street. Who’s now We’re trying to get them to help us in our minimum viable product development and actually like run a pilot with the product that we plan to create. So everything is happening in different stages. We’re learning different things from all these different fellowships.

Lee Kantor: [00:08:44] But it sounds like conceptually, I mean, ultimately you want to create content for this end user person, but the way you get to that end user, your client might not be the end user, it might be the school or it might be something else.

Tamir Mickens: [00:08:57] Yeah.

Tamir Mickens: [00:08:59] Absolutely. So we’re currently trying to actually make sure we understand who our actual customer is going to be because there’s a wide variety when it comes to education as far as who is on the other end of the product. And so these fellowships that we’re in are really helping us to kind of streamline that and figure out who we need to be targeting.

Lee Kantor: [00:09:21] Right? Because whatever you pick, I’m sure there’s a it’s a different strategy if you’re trying to reach educators than it is if you’re trying to be. Mark Rober. Right. And go directly to the the consumer.

Tamir Mickens: [00:09:35] Yes. It proves to be difficult at times, as you stated, and myself, too, when it comes to education. So many people are involved and we know that ultimately we’re creating our project mean our product for teachers. But at the end, the teachers have to use it with the students. So what they enjoy and what they need, you know, that has to be in our minds as well. But teachers cannot just purchase curriculum or products for themselves. That tends to have to go through like a principal or any type of program coordinator for a county. So there are just so many different facets involved figuring out who we’re serving because sometimes it’s almost all three at once, right?

Lee Kantor: [00:10:20] Well, it’s one of those things where you think and this is an. Portant lesson for other entrepreneurs to be clear on who your ideal customer is like in your case, the purchaser. Where money changes hands is not going to be the person that is going to be learning from the videos. No. Right. You have to convince some bureaucrat or educator high up in an organization that they should invest in this type of an educational tool to help them achieve the goals that they want to do with test scores or whatever their metrics that matter are. So it’s an interesting choice that you’ll have to make as you grow the business.

Tamir Mickens: [00:11:00] Absolutely.

Lee Kantor: [00:11:02] Now, was that frustrating or is that something that you’re like, okay, well, this is just the task at hand, so this is what we have to do.

Tamir Mickens: [00:11:10] We’re learning as we go. It is a bit frustrating because, you know, you have so many different schools of thought on that and with the different fellowships that we enter. There are some that are more so on that business side and figuring out like you need to target the purchasing power. And then there are some that are more in the creative side like, well, how are the students interacting with this? And we have to find some sort of middle ground. So we find that with the students, we’re targeting their engagement with the actual content itself. Same for the teachers, but not really the higher end of our spectrum. They tend to be more focused on the outcomes. So like what is the data looking like with students, their test scores and retention, things of that nature? So we really have to hit.

Tamir Mickens: [00:11:59] But all.

Tamir Mickens: [00:11:59] Three sides. And yes, it can be frustrating, but it’s just it’s a part of it and it’s a learning experience.

Lee Kantor: [00:12:06] Right. The frustration to me, I don’t want to speak for you would be that I’m creative and I want to make videos that get kids excited and then that becomes a back burner thing because I got to convince some educator that’s, you know, high up that they should even do this before I can even begin the process of making the videos. And that was the kind of the catalyst of the whole idea was making videos.

Tamir Mickens: [00:12:33] So that’s what when Megan said, we have two different skill sets, that’s where it really helps us because I will be kind of like what you just said, focused more on the creative side. And Megan is there to make sure, like the metrics behind that match up so that we’re working hand in hand. And she will kind of guide me on like where those things need to go creatively so that we have the metrics to back it up. Um, and yeah, that’s.

Tamir Mickens: [00:13:04] Well, yeah, that’s.

Meagan Naraine: [00:13:04] That’s something that’s so funny that you bring it up because it’s literally something we are struggling with right now. Um, because like that joy of being creative, like, that’s all. Tamara But as we grow and as we develop and as people are expecting us to scale and actually get into schools like some of that creativity gets lost because we do have to, unfortunately, as you said, appeal to a bureaucrat and appeal to the higher ups and convince them that what we have and all of this creative fun stuff that we’re making actually does increase state test scores.

Lee Kantor: [00:13:34] Now, was there a point where you were considering, hey, there’s a space in the marketplace for a person of color like Mark Rober? I mean, I hate to keep talking about him, but to me he’s a really good example of a person using Stem in videos to really capture a young person and to really inspire them to, you know, at least consider a career in Stem. So I don’t want to belabor him, but he’s somebody top of mind that’s popular, that is targeting that similar type person that you are, but maybe not exactly.

Meagan Naraine: [00:14:06] Yeah. So as we as we grow and as we develop, I think we want to the reason why we’re approaching schools now is because we want to make the curriculum for teachers as opposed to just being a presence on YouTube and just making educational videos. We want to be able to write comprehensive curriculum from day one to the last day of school that is all culturally relevant, that has all of the slideshows, all of the worksheets, all of the discussions, all of the labs, experiments, anything that teacher would need to have cultural relevance being implemented in their classroom every day. So yes, we make the videos. Yes, they people love our animated videos, but we want that to be one aspect of the final product that we create. So every learning standard will have one of our animated videos for it, but it’ll also have all of the other stuff that teacher needs to just do a whole lesson.

Lee Kantor: [00:14:57] Right now. I’m not I’m not trying to poke holes in that strategy, but that’s a strategy and that there was a point, I’m sure that there was a fork in the road that says, hey, do we go directly to the individual or do we go through the schools? There had to be an inflection point where you made a choice and said, No, we’re not going to go to the individual, we’re going through this to the school. And then once you made that choice, then obviously there’s different strategies and different parts that are, you know, the dominoes that fall that are, you know, correspond to that choice. Was there a choice? Did you have that point of inflection where you were like, well, maybe we should go directly to the kids and we’ll just do these videos and we’ll build a YouTube audience. There’s lots of people who have done that. That’s not a new idea. It seems like a possible idea. I just want to understand how when if you did hit this point of inflection, you know what how you kind of weighed the tradeoffs of going one way or another.

Tamir Mickens: [00:16:01] Yeah.

Meagan Naraine: [00:16:01] So when we first launched, we wanted to make everything free and we wanted to have a free learning hub of YouTube videos, all of that. And I guess the point, the the point where we changed our mind was as we went through coaching and mentorship in the fellowships that we were in, they we really learned the value in what we were creating and we kind of shifted to, um, being able to like make a larger impact, but also make a lot of money off of what we create instead of just doing this, this free platform because we wanted teachers to have free access, because we know how teachers don’t have that money to buy stuff on their own for their classroom or how hard it is or how like they have to get fundraisers and donations. So essentially we were like, if we can approach the schools, then teachers still aren’t paying for it. The schools are.

Tamir Mickens: [00:16:49] And the other difficult aspect of that because yes, for sure, originally we did want to just go directly to the users. So it was kind of like, yes, just get videos that are popular enough to. Where kids will see them. The issue with that, the marketing and just that YouTube game all together is very difficult. So you’re almost just waiting for a viral moment because one, you have to understand that if it isn’t already popular, getting in that niche and just thinking that students will just be searching for educational videos even no matter how funny they are, just free will. That type of soul competition is difficult. So we had that fork in the road, as you suggested, and we found that it would probably be easier or quicker in order to get the videos in front of the students to go through the schools, because that is a place where they will have no like I don’t want to say no option to interact with it, but just hoping that it would get in front of them on their own. That’s just a very large just chance of free will and the YouTube algorithm and if they are looking for it or what’s in demand in the moment.

Lee Kantor: [00:17:57] Right? Well, no, I mean, it makes sense. Like you get more leverage and you get kind of more you get a multiplier effect. You know, one one sale to a school could be, you know, 500 kids where to get 500 individual kids would be extremely difficult and it would take a long time. So and that may not happen, like you said, because there are so many other things out there on on YouTube that they could be watching. That isn’t your thing. So I understand. I was just trying to understand that point because a lot of I’m trying to this is also for other entrepreneurs listening, there’s points of inflection where you have to pick a you have to make a choice. And and those choices, in hindsight, they seem like obvious, but at the moment they’re very difficult because, you know, the path you are going down now is completely different than the path would have been if you said, I’m going to go to the people individually, you would be doing totally different things. You would every day. You’d be working on something else that you’re not working on. But it’s interesting.

Tamir Mickens: [00:19:04] That goes back to.

Meagan Naraine: [00:19:05] The frustration part, because you have to make so many choices and different paths. Like it kind of feels like you’re starting over, over and over again and you kind of lose track of how much growth and progress you’ve made. And so like, you really do have to step back and just look at where you started from and where you are now. And don’t let those choices and those different paths deter you from feeling like you’ve made progress.

Lee Kantor: [00:19:25] Right? And you got to kind of leave those other choices behind and kind of almost like Men in Black, you know, you know, hit yourself with that little thing that erases your memory where you’ve just got to be like, Today’s the day we’re going boldly forward this way. And and this is what we got to do. And you can’t kind of look back in a lot of different places there Now. How as you’ve moved forward, have you gotten traction with schools? Have you been able to make any inroads in schools so that, you know, you can play out some of these scenarios and see the videos in the hands of these kids through the schools?

Tamir Mickens: [00:20:01] Absolutely.

Tamir Mickens: [00:20:02] So of course, we started with our actual school that we worked in, and from there we had neighboring districts. We were at one point, we had our hand in a lot of different things, so we would be doing exposure trips and curriculum packaging. So but by that you would end up having those schools end up invested in the videos as well. So we would end up moving towards our neighboring districts, DeKalb County of Rockdale.

Meagan Naraine: [00:20:35] Fulton, Clayton.

Tamir Mickens: [00:20:37] That and then we started moving into charter schools. We did some curriculum writing for charter schools in New Jersey and other partnerships with private schools in the area to where we were in the mix of getting the curriculum purchased by a school in Atlanta public schools. So that is how the traction picked up and started spreading. So we’re just hoping for more of that now.

Lee Kantor: [00:21:05] And and the sale is different now. This is kind of a business to business sale rather than a business to consumer sale because. Right. You now have to convince an organization, which is it’s a complex sale that you have have to probably explain a lot of stuff and have a lot of evidence and a lot of resources to show that you can deliver on the promise you’re making.

Meagan Naraine: [00:21:27] Yeah. And that’s so like the reason why we do all of these fellowships. And something valuable that I’ve learned from, especially Main Street, is your final product is going to be made in stages. So like we wanted to create this all full digital learning platform immediately, but someone was like, slow down. Like, do you even know that works yet? Like, how are you going to convince a school to even buy this long, drawn out platform and you’re probably going to waste some money on it. And so and so. So we’re taking it by steps in Main Street. We’re doing a pilot plan in a school in APS where we are working with four biology teachers that are not us. That’s the first time that none of the teaching is going to be done by us. They’re going to have curriculum from day one to the last day and this one school, and then that’ll be our pilot school of like, here’s this, here’s the data from this one school, that little microcosm that we worked in. And then hopefully the next stage of our minimum viable, viable product will be having some type of platform where we bring on more schools.

Lee Kantor: [00:22:22] Good stuff. Well, it’s exciting times. This is a this is I mean, this is probably not you probably didn’t imagine the stuff you’re doing today is what you would be doing when you had this idea initially.

Tamir Mickens: [00:22:36] Absolutely not. I mean, we started making videos. I know my first one was with my dog in my backyard. And it was just, you know, just to give the kids something else besides a guy behind a black screen doing math on a board. You know, it was it was all fun and games. But the why behind it is still there. You know, we want to see the kids involved. We want to see them engaged. We want them to know that the things that they’re experiencing at their homes, in their communities, it is all science. And that is what’s fueling all of our thirst for the business knowledge, for metrics, for figuring out our product and consumers. That is always going to be at the base of what it is that we’re doing.

Lee Kantor: [00:23:21] So right. Your true North hasn’t changed. It just, you know, the tactics and the how you get there might be shifting slightly and you’re learning as you go, but your true north is still there. Your big Y is still there.

Tamir Mickens: [00:23:36] Absolutely. And always will.

Tamir Mickens: [00:23:38] Be.

Lee Kantor: [00:23:38] So now, how has it been working with the Main Street folks? Has that been a good experience for you?

Meagan Naraine: [00:23:45] It’s been amazing. Um, the knowledge that like has and the, the pushing of, of him and like just because we’re in such a different stage right now, we need more of that business. The numbers the like value proposition, the unit cost of what we’re making all of that like we’re just so lost because we are just classroom teachers. And so is he creates individualized plans for everyone in the program, and those plans help that business grow exactly from where they’re at. So everyone is not necessarily doing the same thing. But there were still attending the same workshops and all of that. But the pilot plan that each of us are working on, it’s just it’s going to insanely grow every organization. That’s part of it.

Lee Kantor: [00:24:32] Yeah, it’s a lot to learn and it can be overwhelming. But have you noticed, do you see kind of the business world in your career maybe through a different lens now? When you see being an entrepreneur, it’s not as simple as, Oh, I have an idea here, I’ll just throw it out there. And now I’m successful. Like, like there’s a lot of moving parts and you have to kind of think a little differently than you would if you were just an employee at a at a job somewhere.

Tamir Mickens: [00:25:00] Absolutely.

Tamir Mickens: [00:25:00] Lee You know, there have been several wake up calls and just different perspectives. Just sometimes when you win a pitch competition or you get some views on YouTube, you you can kind of blind yourself and thinking that, you know, oh, everybody will want this, everybody will want this thing that we have and the different sessions we’ve gone through at Main Street. Wait a minute. Now, like, let’s talk about authentic demand. Let’s talk about not trying to build something for your customer, actually looking for what it is that they truly desire and not thinking that because you’re giving this survey or asking people what do they like this? Is it something that you need to truly move forward with that has been extremely insightful and game changing for us and we’re incredibly grateful and thankful for those opportunities.

Lee Kantor: [00:25:55] So what do you need more of? How can we help you?

Tamir Mickens: [00:26:00] Um, well, first, this is just a great opportunity itself. We always want opportunities to branch out for people who don’t know that we’re doing this type of work. So any exposure experiences that you all offer will be glad to tack on to. More interest in our social media platforms. We’re on all of the major platforms Facebook, Instagram, Twitter, YouTube. You all can follow us. It’s probably CR underscore Sky. We definitely appreciate it.

Meagan Naraine: [00:26:34] Yeah, definitely. Youtube subscriptions. We’re almost to the 1000 mark.

Tamir Mickens: [00:26:38] So that’s a that’s a big.

Lee Kantor: [00:26:40] Important milestone for every YouTuber.

Meagan Naraine: [00:26:43] An important milestone. Yes. And then, you know, just donate, just watch our stuff, keep up with us. Like we really just need more eyes on us.

Tamir Mickens: [00:26:50] Absolutely.

Lee Kantor: [00:26:51] And then the website for anybody who wants to kind of plug in.

Meagan Naraine: [00:26:54] Yes, the website is w-w-w dot c, r sky.org.

Lee Kantor: [00:27:02] Good stuff. Well, congratulations on all the momentum so far. You’re both doing such important work and we appreciate you.

Tamir Mickens: [00:27:09] We appreciate you.

Meagan Naraine: [00:27:10] Thank you so much.

Lee Kantor: [00:27:12] All right. This is Lee Kantor once again for the GSU. Radio show. It is so important to support the folks that are building a better tomorrow. This is Lee Kantor. We’ll see you all next time.

Tamir Mickens: [00:27:25] See you later. Thank you.

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Chris Appleton With Art Pharmacy

by

Atlanta Business Radio
Atlanta Business Radio
Chris Appleton With Art Pharmacy
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ChrisappletonChris Appleton is the Founder and CEO of Art Pharmacy, a solution for healthcare providers to prescribe and refer patients to arts & culture interventions benefiting mental health. Appleton’s vision for Art Pharmacy imagines the U.S. healthcare ecosystem adopting arts-based social prescribing as a critical part of a results-driven mental health field.

Prior to founding Art Pharmacy, Appleton co-founded two nonprofit organizations, where he became a national leader in the cross-sector arts movement. Chris and his work have been featured in the New York Times, CNN, ABC, CBS, NPR, Fast Company, and more.

Appleton’s strong commitment to servant leadership, family and civic engagement has led him to be bestowed numerous awards and honors, including the Americans for the Arts National Emerging Leader Award, Emory Center for Creativity and the Arts Community Impact Award, and New Leaders Council Alumni Award, 2019 Class of Leadership Atlanta, Atlanta Business Chronicle’s 40 Under 40, Georgia Trend’s 100 Notable Georgians, Outstanding Atlanta Class of 2014, and World Economic Forum’s Global Shapers. Appleton and his wife, Annie who works for Teach 4 America, live in Atlanta with their two children.

Connect with Chris on LinkedIn and follow Art Pharmacy on Facebook and Twitter.

What You’ll Learn In This Episode

  • Entrepreneurship
  • Mental Health Reform
  • Healthcare Reform
  • Social Prescribing
  • Healthcare Industry
  • Arts & Culture Engagements/intervention
  • Leadership

This transcript is machine transcribed by Sonix

TRANSCRIPT

Intro: [00:00:04] Broadcasting live from the Business RadioX Studios in Atlanta, Georgia. It’s time for Atlanta Business Radio. Brought to you by on pay. Atlanta’s New standard in payroll. Now, here’s your host.

Lee Kantor: [00:00:24] Lee Kantor here another episode of Atlanta Business Radio, and this is going to be a good one. But before we get started, it’s important to recognize our sponsor, Onpay. Without them, we couldn’t be sharing these important stories. Today on Atlanta Business Radio, we have Chris Appleton with Art Pharmacy. Welcome, Chris.

Chris Appleton: [00:00:43] Good afternoon.

Lee Kantor: [00:00:44] Well, I’m so excited to learn what you’re up to. Tell us about Art Pharmacy, how you serving folks?

Chris Appleton: [00:00:50] Sure thing. Art Pharmacy is a solution for health care payers and providers to increase the availability of behavioral health and mental health treatments for their patients and members. We connect patients to community based arts and culture resources with protective and therapeutic benefits to their mental health.

Lee Kantor: [00:01:07] What’s the backstory? How’d you get involved in this line of work?

Chris Appleton: [00:01:11] I spent my career working in the arts and culture field and coming out of the pandemic, we saw an enormous, enormous demand for mental health services and mental health crisis in America, especially amongst adolescents and older adults. The pandemic exacerbated social isolation and loneliness. You know, social media utilization, there’s just a real need for these two age groups to be more connected socially and and really thought that putting the arts to work, you know, artists have been healers since the beginning of time and putting artists to work to help address mental health seemed like a really great opportunity in need.

Lee Kantor: [00:01:49] Now, is there kind of research and data to support your hypothesis?

Chris Appleton: [00:01:54] There is the arts and health research field has been well established 40 plus years. There are Centers for Arts and Health, Arts and medicine research coming out of Johns Hopkins, Stanford University of Florida, UCLA. World Health Organization. Really the list goes on. And we’re taking that research that makes very clear that engagement with arts and culture can improve health outcomes and and, you know, have really developed a delivery mechanism for the health care industry to connect their patients to these life improving health, improving arts activities.

Lee Kantor: [00:02:29] So can you share your process and how it works for people that want to participate?

Chris Appleton: [00:02:34] Absolutely. So the name of the business is Art Pharmacy. In many ways, we work like a pharmacy. You go see your primary care provider or a your oncologist, your behavioral health provider, and they screen you for mental health concerns. They’re typically already doing this. If there is a diagnosis or risk factors for anxiety disorders, depression disorders, social isolation, they write a prescription for six months participation in arts and culture activities, and then call that prescription into us. The art pharmacy. On the on the other end of the equation, Art pharmacy has gone out and identified the thousands of instances of arts and culture activities that have these protective and therapeutic benefits and our software smart matches that patient profile to the highest efficacy arts engagement for the patient. So we like to say all art is good, but the right art at the right moment for the right patient is best. And and our care navigator works with the patient connects that then to that right. Arts and culture activity and then helps get them through that journey of attending and participating in these arts activities. And so, you know, maybe it’s helpful for me to kind of describe what these types of arts activities are. They’re they’re activities that your local theater museum or maybe going to a theater performance, a show on a on a Saturday evening with a friend or going to a painting class or a dance workshop. Both receptive and participatory experiences have benefits to mental health and well being. And, you know, really sort of depends on the specific patient health goals for what type of artistic discipline, what delivery mode or participation mode is, is right for them. So the patient participates in these arts activities. We help make sure there’s a strong adherence or compliance to the prescribed treatment and then we bill a third party payer to to make sure that it’s accessible for people that otherwise may not be able to access these types of resources.

Lee Kantor: [00:04:39] And then do you do an assessment prior and then post to make sure that it was beneficial?

Chris Appleton: [00:04:46] That’s exactly right. We’re we’re monitoring the patient well-being outside of the clinical settings. So everywhere from intake, when the patient first connects with with our care team to to after each instance attendance at at the arts and culture activities, we assess how the patient’s doing, screen them, monitor them, provide all that data back to the referring provider so that the primary provider, the referring physician, can monitor their patient outside of the clinical setting. And if there’s ever a need for a crisis intervention, an escalated medical issue or pharmacy gets involved and is really helping to to prevent emergency department utilization when when there are other ways of of getting people to resources that they need.

Lee Kantor: [00:05:30] So the prescription that they’re filling and the deliverable that’s being given to them is it might be just watch a play or it could be participate in a play like it doesn’t. It could be anything related to the arts.

Chris Appleton: [00:05:45] That’s right. So so not. That’s exactly right. So so not all arts and culture engagements have all benefit for every health concern or every health need. It’s the it’s the specific type of art activity is useful to the specific patient profile and what they have. So our technology, our algorithm builds a profile on the patient that, you know, you think about primary diagnoses, comorbidities, access barriers, health goals, experiences and preferences around arts and culture. All of those are variables that are taken into consideration when we match the patient with the arts activity that’s best for them in mental health and behavioral health patient agency is incredibly important. And so you really want to make sure that you’re meeting patients where they are and that it’s that precision personalized medicine and so that patients are able to participate in the types of arts activity that’s that’s most useful for them, whether that’s going on a guided walking tour of an exhibit at a museum or being in a class or a workshop at that museum.

Lee Kantor: [00:06:52] And like if somebody. Depressed and they say watch, you know, binge watch the office is that.

Chris Appleton: [00:07:01] I will say binge watching the office is not a part of a treatment plan that that we have available right now. So, you know, we we vet all of the arts and culture partners there. There’s a standards of care to which they have to adhere to remain in our platform. If a patient scores an arts and culture experience below a certain rating, the availability of that offering is paused until we’re our team is able to go and do the due diligence to figure out what’s going on, to get them back online. And and so no binge watching. The office is not a treatment.

Lee Kantor: [00:07:41] But watching a comedic play might be a treatment.

Chris Appleton: [00:07:46] That’s right. Much of the benefit of participating in arts and culture activities is the social connection and sense of belonging that’s created as a result of having an emotional experience alongside other people. Now, that’s not to say that we don’t have any activities that are individual activities, because we certainly do. But largely when you’re trying to address mental health concerns, especially what we’re doing is really focused on social isolation and loneliness. And so, you know, binge watching the office at home is is probably not, you know, the most beneficial thing, though I have certainly been binge watched the the office at home. So we’re trying to get folks activated and connected to others and create a greater sense of belonging, which has a tremendous impact, positive impact on health.

Chris Appleton: [00:08:41] In fact.

Chris Appleton: [00:08:43] You know, as many of the listeners may have recently seen, US surgeon general just last month issued issued a notice around the social isolation and loneliness epidemic in the United States. Research showing that being socially isolated is as bad for our health as smoking 15 cigarets a day. And so this really is something that the health care system in the United States is trying to wrap its arms around.

Lee Kantor: [00:09:14] Now, can you share a story? Obviously don’t name the person, but maybe share their challenge and and how and explain kind of what art they were using and how they were able to kind of resolve maybe some of their issues.

Chris Appleton: [00:09:29] Absolutely. One of my one of my favorite stories. I won’t share the individual’s name, but we have a great partner here in metro Atlanta. The name of the company is Ginn Care, and they’re a primary care practice for older adults. They refer a good number of their of their patients to us. And there was an older, older woman who just lost her husband and she was understandably, she was struggling with depression and feeling isolated. And and we sent her to a playwriting workshop and she ended up connecting to a handful of other attendees at that class. And they’ve gone out and created their own playwriting workshop. That is not art Pharmacy facilitated, paid for. Et cetera. And so one of the one of the things that we want to make sure that we’re doing is sort of creating this off ramp, right? So that with enough new habit building and healthy behavior, that healthy activity that that patients are able to go and and engage in this type of activity on their own, which is which is largely what we’re focused on doing is building that strength and that resilience, strengthening those muscles for patients to be involved in these in these kinds of activities.

Chris Appleton: [00:10:57] The the kind of analogy that I like to give is to what we’re building is, is something that started about 30 years ago, a company that many listeners are probably familiar with, if you’re not familiar with and name certainly familiar with in concept. There’s a company called Silver Sneakers and Silver Sneakers started 30 years ago as a network of physical activity programs and and fitness programs for for seniors. And you know, a couple of generations ago, it wasn’t so broadly accepted that our physical activity level impacted our health in the way that we all understand it to today. And at that time, 30 years ago, when when silver sneakers emerged, they were getting older adults access to to fitness programs and getting them engaged in physical activity. Well, now everybody that’s on a Medicare plan in the United States has access to silver sneakers paid for by their health plan. And and I believe a generation from now we’ll all be sitting around saying, oh, you know, it’s kind of funny that that 20, 20 years ago we didn’t know that our mental health and emotional well-being was so closely linked to our engagement in arts and culture.

Lee Kantor: [00:12:17] Well, I, um, I was involved in fitness for a while at the beginning of my career, and I remember it made so sense, made so much sense to us to have, you know, your insurance pay for a gym membership or some sort of fitness and like you mentioned, you know. The speed of government is from understanding value and then to actually writing checks. It isn’t the quickest partner in these kind of initiatives.

Chris Appleton: [00:12:49] That’s right. It takes time and it takes it takes partnerships with the private sector, the public sector policymakers. You know, we we work with Medicaid, managed care organizations. We work with large health systems. We’re focused a lot on student health. We’re in 32 school based mental health clinics. So students are able to access our pharmacy as a as a mental health resource. So it takes a lot of different partners to build the evidence base and make the case So that policy ensures that people get access to the quality of care that they need.

Lee Kantor: [00:13:22] Now, I think I understand kind of that moment at the beginning where you’re like, Hey, this by giving people that are struggling access to the arts can really make a difference in their kind of mental health. I kind of get that. How did you kind of start getting traction and buy in from these health plans and health systems, bureaucracies that tend not to take fliers on this kind of stuff?

Chris Appleton: [00:13:52] You know, we’re really solving. So I think there’s there’s two reasons for that. The coexistence of these two things. The first is, is as I shared, the research is really clear, right? When we walk in and we talk to clinical directors, medical directors, at health plans or at health systems, we do not hear from them. We’re not sure if this is good for patients health. Everyone knows that engaging in arts and culture can be good for patients health. And so that’s been a pretty a pretty low barrier for us, largely because of the great research that that folks have been doing for decades now. Really, I think the other reason is the pain point that we’re solving. So what the for for health systems and for for payers. So what happened during the pandemic is you had an entire a huge number of behavioral health providers leave health systems. And and go into private practice where they only take self pay. From maybe individuals like you and me that pay the 200 bucks an hour to go to the 55 minute therapy session. But they’re not enrolled in network by choice. They’re not enrolled in network with these health plans. And so the health plans as a result and the large health systems then have a shortage of mental health services or behavioral health services that they can connect their patients and members to. And so by framing the problem that we’re solving for them, as as that what we’re doing is increasing the availability of mental health resources. We’ve been able to cut through some of the bureaucracy and, you know, just lengthy sales cycles that are required to sometimes get things off the ground in health care.

Lee Kantor: [00:15:54] Good stuff. Well, congratulations on all the success and the momentum. If somebody wants to learn more, where should they go?

Chris Appleton: [00:16:02] Go to Art.

Chris Appleton: [00:16:03] Pharmacy Coco to learn more about how you can partner with art pharmacy and get connected to the great work that our team is.

Chris Appleton: [00:16:12] Doing.

Lee Kantor: [00:16:13] And that’s both health systems and individuals.

Chris Appleton: [00:16:17] Health systems, individuals. Health care payers and public health programs.

Lee Kantor: [00:16:22] Good stuff. Well, Chris, thank you so much for sharing your story today. You’re doing important work and we appreciate you.

Chris Appleton: [00:16:28] Thanks a lot for having me.

Lee Kantor: [00:16:29] All right. This is Lee Kantor. We’ll see y’all next time on Atlanta Business Radio.

About Our Sponsor

OnPay’sOnPay-Dots payroll services and HR software give you more time to focus on what’s most important. Rated “Excellent” by PC Magazine, we make it easy to pay employees fast, we automate all payroll taxes, and we even keep all your HR and benefits organized and compliant.

Our award-winning customer service includes an accuracy guarantee, deep integrations with popular accounting software, and we’ll even enter all your employee information for you — whether you have five employees or 500. Take a closer look to see all the ways we can save you time and money in the back office.

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Zoe Hughes-Nelson and Hadyn O’Hara With Java Cats Cafe

by

Atlanta Business Radio
Atlanta Business Radio
Zoe Hughes-Nelson and Hadyn O'Hara With Java Cats Cafe
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Java Cats Cafe was Georgia’s first adoptable cat cafe located in Atlanta, Georgia.

Founded by Hadyn O’Hara and managed by Zoe Hughes-Nelson, Java Cats successfully helped over 2000 rescue cats find homes in a period of 5 years.

Unfortunately, due to Covid-19 and rising rent prices, Java Cats Cafe was forced to close in 2022. However, Java Cats now is operating a coffee counter inside a market, and is working to open a cat cafe again in the future.

Connect with Zoe on LinkedIn.

What You’ll Learn In This Episode

  • How did Java Cats start
  • What is a cat cafe
  • Why did Java Cats close
  • Will Java Cats reopen
  • What is your business model
  • What would they do differently in the future

This transcript is machine transcribed by Sonix

TRANSCRIPT

Intro: [00:00:04] Broadcasting live from the Business RadioX Studios in Atlanta, Georgia. It’s time for Atlanta Business Radio. Brought to you by on pay. Atlanta’s New standard in payroll. Now, here’s your host.

Lee Kantor: [00:00:25] Lee Kantor here another episode of Atlanta Business Radio, and this is a special edition. This is part of the GSU Ene series, the Georgia State University’s Entrepreneurship and Innovation Institute’s series, where we spotlight some of the great work that’s being done over there. And in this case, these are some of the folks that have gone through the Main Street Entrepreneurship Seed Fund or they’re involved with In this year’s cohort. We have Hadyn O’Hara and Zoe Hughes Nelson with Java Cat’s Cafe. Welcome.

Hadyn O’Hara: [00:00:58] Thank you. Thank you for having us.

Lee Kantor: [00:00:59] Wow, That was a workout. That was a lot there. But I’m glad we got that part done. And now we can focus on the most important things. What’s happening at Java Cat’s Cafe. How are you serving folks over there?

Hadyn O’Hara: [00:01:11] Yeah. So we currently run a coffee counter. We’re trying to get back to being a Georgia’s very first cat cafe. We originally opened in 2017 and we had a long five year run to locations and the pandemic unfortunately ended into that chapter. So we are working with the Georgia Georgia State Entrepreneurship Fund to get back and going and hopefully secure a building and continue our dream of being adoptable. Cat Cafe.

Lee Kantor: [00:01:36] So what was the genesis of the idea? How did this whole thing get started?

Hadyn O’Hara: [00:01:41] So I was a Georgia state student back in 2016. I kind of found the concept through a film class I was in and just derailed all my focus. I just never heard of a cat cafe before. And I’m a huge animal lover and advocate and I love cats. And just the concept of having a coffee shop where you can go and sit with cats. It just seemed amazing to me. And from there I decided I was going to take a leap of faith and open my very first business. So at 24, 25 years old, I opened Georgia’s very first Cat Cafe and found immediate success. It was very well loved in the community and well received, and we increased adoption rates for our partner shelters by 100%. We generated a ton of adoption revenue for them to support rescue efforts. And it was just it was just a dream. So it just turned out to be an ultimate dream for me. And that’s kind of how it started. The rest is history.

Lee Kantor: [00:02:36] Well, did you have any background of running a coffee shop in, you know, in that part of the business, or was it always about heart of helping cats?

Hadyn O’Hara: [00:02:45] Yeah, I’ve been in the service industry, hospitality industry for as long as I’ve been able to work. And no, I had no I have no business. Being in business is what I like to say. I am a true entrepreneur. I had no experience doing this and I’ve learned everything the hard way. But it was it’s definitely been a learning experience for me and I’ve grown a lot. But yeah, so I had no experience in this. I just knew I loved. I love being in the community, I love serving people and combining my passion for that. Learning the coffee skills and combining that with cats was just an ultimate dream dream business scenario for me.

Lee Kantor: [00:03:18] For someone who didn’t know or says they didn’t know anything about the business, what compelled you to open a second location during that time? Because it’s hard enough to run one location. What what was the thinking behind, you know what, let’s do this again in a different place and see what happens.

Hadyn O’Hara: [00:03:36] Yeah, you know, there was a lot of growing pains and I definitely think in hindsight I jumped the gun a little bit by opening as quickly as we did. I think we opened the second location in 9 or 10 months in after the first, and I think it was just the buzz around this new business. I mean, it was internationally recognized and it was one of the first cat cafes in the country. And I think just a lot of the attention and the buzz and just people wanted more locations to pop up everywhere. So the demand for another location was in downtown Marietta and close to the square. And it just kind of happened organically. There was a perfect building, perfect timing, perfect everything just lined up and it was much easier to open the second location. It took nine months from signing the lease to opening for Grant Park in Marietta only took three. So I learned a lot in that time, and opening a second location was a lot easier. It was very overwhelming being a young business owner still learning, but I think just trying to ride that wave of we’re doing something really good, cats are getting adopted and just incredible rates. Like we’re changing the lives of so many animals and people are loving it. So I think just trying to keep that momentum up and just, you know, I was like, you know what? I’m going to dream a little bit bigger and see what we can do with this.

Lee Kantor: [00:04:53] Now, when you’re like in business, at least in our business, we call it the metrics that matter. Like what are the the numbers that you should be paying attention to? It sounds like cats getting adopted was the super important metric for you in the growth of this? Did that tie it all to the numbers that it requires to pay rent, pay employees and pay for stuff?

Hadyn O’Hara: [00:05:16] Yeah. So the way the business model worked is there’s a half coffee shop, half cat adoption lounge and the lounge. We obviously have to make money. So the lounge, we charge admission. So you would go into the room with the cats for an hour and included a drip coffee or a tea so you can come into the coffee shop just to support us with coffee sales. But we are money making aspect of it was the admission. So every single person, every single hour was paying to be there. When I first let when the reservations went live for Grant Park, we were booked every single hour, every single day. We were open max capacity for the first three months. So it was just amazing to see the support coming through. And people just love this idea. And it was it was just very successful.

Lee Kantor: [00:06:02] So it was kind of a membership.

Zoe Hughes Nelson: [00:06:05] Um, it was more like people can go. We had a website and people would go online and make reservations. So not really a membership, but just kind of a thing that you reserve like the day before or even the day of when you wanted to come in.

Lee Kantor: [00:06:20] So you would just reserve it like at Tuesday at ten. And then and then I would just coincide that where were people like doing work and using it as a traditional coffee shop or were they just coming there just to chill out and just hang out with cats.

Zoe Hughes Nelson: [00:06:35] If they made a reservation, typically? Well, if you make a reservation, it’s for the cat lounge. So that’s typically where you would go and hang out with the cats for an hour. Um, but, you know, sometimes before or after, people would come early and hang out later and do like work on their laptop in the coffee shop. And the cool part about it being half coffee shop, half cat lounges, even people who didn’t like cats particularly, but still wanted to support the idea, You know what we were doing of animal rescue, They would just come and, you know, get coffee and do stuff on their laptop. And of course you don’t need a reservation to use it as a regular cafe.

Lee Kantor: [00:07:10] And then do. Are there any cats in that area or. That’s like a cat free zone?

Zoe Hughes Nelson: [00:07:15] That’s a cat free zone just because of like health code regulations and stuff like that. And also we, we strive to be, um. We strive to be accessible to everyone. So even people who are allergic to cats, we want them to be able to come in and hang out with us.

Lee Kantor: [00:07:33] Now, when a person’s hanging out was there, like were you learning like, Oh, if a hundred people come in here, five cats are going to get adopted? Was it like kind of predictable at some point there?

Hadyn O’Hara: [00:07:45] There was never pressure for anyone to adopt and we did. We never wanted it to be about the numbers. I mean, we of course we wanted cats get adopted, but for us it was more of like bringing cats out of the shelter that had been there for years, didn’t get much exposure, didn’t get much, you know, socialization with people. So it was more we did expedite adoptions just because the organic environment created for these cats, they would just thrive there. But I mean, it was it was there was never like a it’s never numbers based. I mean, some days we would have ten adoptions. Some weeks we would have, you know, 4 or 5. But the adoptions were they were always consistent. We would always having adoptions, but I think for us it was getting cats that just didn’t have that chance of that exposure and bringing them to a new environment where they were being seen by people every day.

Lee Kantor: [00:08:33] And there’s way more cats than anybody could handle. Right.

Zoe Hughes Nelson: [00:08:38] Exactly. So there are way too many.

Lee Kantor: [00:08:42] And so these these rescue organizations are happy to put some of them in your place because, you know, it’s helping them achieve their mission of saving these cats, right?

Zoe Hughes Nelson: [00:08:52] Yeah, exactly. If you think about it like we would like Hayden said, we would try to take in cats that were really scared and nervous and like, you know, needed some extra time socializing and getting adopted by us having them like, let’s say, a cat that’s super scared. It could be in the shelter for like a year. But if we take that cat, that frees up space for them. They could take on, you know, 5 or 10 friendly cats in one year and get them adopted. So it was really good. You know, just the socialization aspect is I think that’s really what made it flourish and made the adoption rates go up so high.

Lee Kantor: [00:09:30] So now so you closed both locations. Did you close both of them or just one of them?

Hadyn O’Hara: [00:09:36] Correct. Both locations did close. We closed Grant Park last year in Marietta, followed about 2 or 3 months later, unfortunately. And it was all Covid pandemic related.

Lee Kantor: [00:09:46] Right. So, I mean, a lot of small companies struggle during that period of time when people couldn’t go to places and things like that. So now at that point, are you just wrecked? Like, how were you emotionally handling this setback?

Hadyn O’Hara: [00:09:59] I was completely devastated. I mean, this is something I took a chance at such a young age, and I really wanted to build this to be my what I thought my lifelong career, what I hoped. And I so much of my identity was in this business. And I invested my heart, soul, blood, sweat and tears to get it open. It was very difficult to open a business of this kind. And yeah, I was devastated. I was completely wrecked. It took me about a year to really recover and just kind of, you know, see myself more than just my business and what I did. And but that took a lot of, like, self work. And I’m glad I went through that. I’m, you know, in hindsight, I’m not I’m sad the business is closed, but I’ve grown so much from that devastation and just knowing my worth and I’m more than a business and I can I did it before and I know, you know, I can certainly do it again and bigger and better. And that’s what me and Zoe are definitely setting out to do.

Lee Kantor: [00:10:54] So what was kind of the spark that reignited this? And, you know, you could have done anything at this point. Now you have a blank sheet of paper in front of you and you said, Hey, let’s let’s take another run at this Java Cats.

Hadyn O’Hara: [00:11:06] I think you know one thing, Zoe. Zoe put it perfectly. I mean, when we. So just a little backtrack with Zoe. When I when I laid off everyone, when I realized the pandemic was not going to be just a few month thing, it was going to be a long haul. Um, Zoe came back to work, and we both pretty much didn’t pay ourselves for two years just to keep the business open. And Zoe was the only employee that that came back and did that. And for two years we really worked hard. We knew the end was coming, we knew it, it was inevitable, but we wanted to work to see cats get adopted in the time that we had left on our lease. So we did. And then when we closed, we spent a few months just kind of like, what do we do now? And it’s just not the same. And she, she put it perfectly. She said, It’s like purgatory. We both felt like we were just in purgatory. Like, what’s next? What’s what’s what do we need to do now? Yeah. And was like.

Zoe Hughes Nelson: [00:11:59] Sorry, sorry to interrupt you. Um, it was like stuck in between Java Cats was my first job. I was only 15 when I started there and now I’m in my 20s and, you know, it just it just feels so weird to not have it in my life.

Lee Kantor: [00:12:17] Right. What you were doing something that not only was making money and employing people, but it was also making a difference. And when you have that bigger y, it’s a lot easier to get up in the morning to do your job, you know, You know you’re making an impact.

Zoe Hughes Nelson: [00:12:31] And then also when you have such a great boss and super great coworkers around, you know, then it then it makes the work environment very, very easy.

Hadyn O’Hara: [00:12:43] It was rare. It was a rare, magical place.

Lee Kantor: [00:12:47] Right. And so you said, okay, let’s take another swing at this. So you went from did you change anything from the original business model? Did anything really change? Or it was just like, let’s just reboot this thing and let’s see what we can do now without a pandemic.

Hadyn O’Hara: [00:13:02] So unfortunately, with the pandemic, we didn’t receive any funding. We applied both rounds. We did not. Money kept running out. So we it was just setback after setback. And I mean, I lost everything. I lost everything with the business financially. And I’m still recovering financially from those two years. So coming from a place of not having any money and wanting to get this back up and going, it was was difficult. But someone who adopted a cat from us, he reached out and offered us a space in a market he had just opened in Old Fourth Ward, so it was going to be a coffee operation, but he was like, Keep the name alive, make some money, and, you know, just just stay active in this. Like, keep keep working towards it. So we knew it was a setback, but it was a baby step forward at the same time. And we’ve we’ve been running that since late February. And that’s currently what we’re operating. It’s just a coffee counter to get back to being a cat cafe.

Lee Kantor: [00:13:56] So you’re so you’re keeping the brand because that’s a great name and it’s a great brand. And now you’re just trying to raise funds to expand into the vision that you’d like it to be. Where it’s half coffee shop, Half Cat Cafe.

Hadyn O’Hara: [00:14:11] Exactly. Yeah.

Zoe Hughes Nelson: [00:14:12] Um, yeah, we’ve been speaking to people around Atlanta and stuff like that of, of just like. Potentially making it making a comeback, and I definitely foresee it happening eventually. Um, for sure. Just a matter of time. And, you know, permitting stars have to align.

Hadyn O’Hara: [00:14:33] We’re waiting for the stars to align. But we are we’re very eager and we have the passion and determination to make it happen. We’re just waiting for the right time.

Lee Kantor: [00:14:41] And then what do you need more of at this point? Are you so you’re going through the main street process. So they’re working with you, mentoring you, doing things like that, right? Yes. So are they have they kind of poked at your business model or do they feel pretty good about it? It’s just a matter of, you know, kind of raising the funds.

Zoe Hughes Nelson: [00:15:03] Yeah, pretty much. I mean, we’ve I’ve definitely learned a lot from attending the Main Street Entrepreneurship Seed Fund. Lots of things that I really, you know, just kind of haven’t thought about before and like how to like customer discovery workshops and stuff and just kind of how to expand our brand. Um, but really what we need is like to talk to investors and stuff to make, to make it a reality again, to like be able to afford the build out and stuff like that. Because I know the build out for our original location was, was very expensive. So, you know, just kind of getting that ball rolling is the main thing. But we have learned so much from the seed fund and they have been able to kind of provide some little like constructive criticisms as well as some praise for just, you know, everything we’re doing. And it’s been very helpful.

Lee Kantor: [00:15:55] Well, one of the things at the beginning of any startup is to kind of prove the model. It seems like you’ve already kind of checked that box and you’ve proven that this model can be successful. So it’s just a matter of finding and attracting the investors or the money that you need to kind of roll it out is the ultimate vision to kind of franchise this, to have Java Cat’s Cafe all over the planet. Is it to be, you know, a big brand here in Atlanta? Like how do you see the story kind of evolving?

Hadyn O’Hara: [00:16:25] I think I you know, with opening a second location, the idea was like, well, we can do more. If we have more locations, we can adopt more cats and do more good. But I think, you know, what I’ve learned from that is I just really want to pour my focus into one location and I want to do bigger and better things with it. Maybe having a medical component where we can do like vaccine outreach or just just I’m just trying to think of more ways we can do good in one location. I have no desire to franchise. I have no desire to make Java Cats a known cat cafe all over. I just want to do good, as much good as we possibly can with our focus in one location. And that that’s my desire and it would be in Atlanta.

Lee Kantor: [00:17:05] And so you’re just looking for kind of a central location that you feel can best serve the community. Yes.

Zoe Hughes Nelson: [00:17:13] So going back to what you said about community, I think one of the reasons why we only want to do one location is because we really like that community aspect of like knowing the people who come in and like forming those relationships. That’s something that makes Java cats what it is.

Lee Kantor: [00:17:32] Absolutely. It’s a great idea and congratulations on the success and great job kind of getting back up there after a setback. A lot of people, you know, when they have a setback, they just call it and then they go a different direction. But to be resilient and tenacious enough to come back at it is kudos to you for that. That is not an easy thing to do.

Hadyn O’Hara: [00:17:54] It’s really not. And I feel really lucky. You know, Zoe and I’s relationship has really grown and we’ve learned to, like, lean into each other. And we went from, you know, I was a boss to she was my employee to like, Hey, we’re in this together and we’re crying together. We’re rejoicing together. We’re celebrating the little victories and we’re pushing through the setbacks. And I think having someone that’s been through the grit with me up to this point, it’s just it just makes this so much more so much more possible to just to really push through what’s what’s been difficult to get through. So I’m really grateful for this relationship and what’s come out of it. And I can’t wait to see how it continues to flourish in the future.

Lee Kantor: [00:18:33] So if somebody wants to learn more, what’s the website? What’s the best way to connect with you all?

Hadyn O’Hara: [00:18:38] We are very active on social media, Instagram, Facebook, just Java, Cats, ATL. That’s where you can find us.

Lee Kantor: [00:18:46] Good stuff. Well, again, congratulations on all the success and momentum. You’re doing important work and we appreciate you.

Zoe Hughes Nelson: [00:18:54] Thank you so much.

Lee Kantor: [00:18:55] All right. This is Lee Kantor. We will see you all next time on GSU indie radio.

About Our Sponsor

OnPay’sOnPay-Dots payroll services and HR software give you more time to focus on what’s most important. Rated “Excellent” by PC Magazine, we make it easy to pay employees fast, we automate all payroll taxes, and we even keep all your HR and benefits organized and compliant.

Our award-winning customer service includes an accuracy guarantee, deep integrations with popular accounting software, and we’ll even enter all your employee information for you — whether you have five employees or 500. Take a closer look to see all the ways we can save you time and money in the back office.

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Gina Diaz With Diaz Case Law

by

Chicago Business Radio
Chicago Business Radio
Gina Diaz With Diaz Case Law
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Firmspace-sponsor-bannerGina Diaz, one of the top immigration and real estate attorneys in Chicagoland, is also known as #TheRightAttorney on social media.

She opened Diaz Case Law to help immigrants find solutions to their difficulties and discovered a love for real estate investing. This added another dimension to her law practice as she assists investors with difficult closings and helps clients with real estate-related cases.

She is also a founding member of We Win, LLC, an organization dedicated to introducing women to the world of real estate, and We Win, NFP.

What You’ll Learn In This Episode

  • Some of the tips that she can give to those wanting to enter real estate investing
  • Importance of achieving a work-life balance

This transcript is machine transcribed by Sonix

TRANSCRIPT

Intro: [00:00:03] Broadcasting live from the Business RadioX studio in Chicago, Illinois. It’s time for Chicago Business Radio. Brought to you by Firm Space, your private sanctuary for productivity and growth. To learn more, go to firm spacecom. Now, here’s your host.

Max Kantor: [00:00:21] Hey, everybody. And welcome back to another episode of Chicago Business Radio. I’m your host, Max Kantor. And before we get started, as always, today’s show is sponsored by Firm Space, thanks to Firm Space because without them, we couldn’t be sharing these important stories. And we got a good one for you today. On today’s show, we have an immigration and real estate attorney located in the Chicagoland area known as Hashtag the right attorney on social media. She’s also a founding member of We Win LLC, an organization dedicated to introducing women to the world of real estate. So please welcome to the show, Gina Diaz. Welcome to the show, Gina.

Gina Diaz: [00:00:57] Thank you so much. Thank you for having me.

Max Kantor: [00:00:59] I’m excited to talk to you about everything that you’re doing. So let’s jump right in. How did you get involved with law and real estate investing?

Gina Diaz: [00:01:07] Yeah. So I’ve been working in the law field since I was 18. You know, I started off as like a secretary, then, you know, moved my way up to a paralegal and, you know, worked for a couple of big law firms and realized that I really, really liked doing this. I didn’t want to go right to law school right away because, you know, law school is not cheap. And so I wanted to make sure that it was something that I really liked and I really did. So then I went off to law school and I started actually doing criminal law and doing family law because that’s what I really thought I wanted to do. But it quickly transitioned into real estate and immigration because that’s kind of like what I kept getting asked for and kind of like what people around me were were needing. So, you know, I started doing that and then realized that I really, really love it. Like especially the real estate part. I think it’s amazing. I love everything that has to do with real estate. And I don’t know if you remember the I’m sure you remember the 2008, 2009, you know, how the market crashed and all that with the real estate.

Gina Diaz: [00:02:18] I started doing a lot of loan modifications for people and, you know, doing a lot of foreclosure defense. So that kind of drove me deeper into real estate and helped a lot of people with modifications and stay in their homes and, you know, defend their foreclosure and whatnot. So then I discovered like yet another aspect of real estate that I liked. And I’m really passionate about real estate because I think that there is so many things you can do with it. There’s just like real estate is gold to me. It’s definitely something I love and immigration is more of a personal thing to me because I am an immigrant. I came here when I was five years old, and so I understand the struggle. I understand, you know, the way things are done and the laws, immigration laws are just beyond ridiculous and it’s really hard to navigate through them. So I definitely want to help people do that if in whatever capacity I can. So that’s kind of what my practice has turned into over the past 12 years. And that’s kind of how I got involved with real estate for sure.

Max Kantor: [00:03:20] And so now you’re with Diaz Case Law. What inspired you to create your own firm and start working as an entrepreneur?

Gina Diaz: [00:03:28] Yeah, So, you know, it’s funny because I never when I started practicing law, I like having my own practice wasn’t something that I was like, Oh my God, I really want to do that. The reason why I started doing it is because the firm that I used to work for, the last one I worked for, I was doing what I loved criminal defense and family law. But a lot of people were asking me about immigration and real estate. And I, you know, had brought it up to my boss and I said, hey, I know how to do this stuff. And, you know, there’s a lot of people that want to do loan modifications right now, but, you know, they don’t want to go to like, you know, there was a lot of fraud being committed by organizations and charging people like exorbitant amount of money to do a loan modification. And, you know, I brought it up to my boss and I said, you know, can we open up like maybe a division of this? I’ll take care of it. You know, it’ll bring, you know, this much revenue. And he was like, No, I don’t want to do that. And I was like, okay, well, all right. So I kind of tabled it. But, you know, it just it just kept being brought up to me. So then I’m like, you know what? Then I’m going to have to go do it on my own. And that’s exactly what I did. I I’m also a licensed real estate broker. So I asked my real estate company at the time where I had my license, can I rent an office from here? And then I moved basically started case law from there. And within a month I opened up my own office space and like 1100 square feet office space across the street from where my real estate company was. And then it just kind of grew from there. And that’s where I’m at right now.

Max Kantor: [00:05:13] That’s very cool. You saw you had a vision for exactly what you wanted, and then you went out and you did it.

Gina Diaz: [00:05:18] Yeah, exactly. Because, you know, like I’m sure my ex-boss is kicking himself right now because he didn’t believe that, you know, it was a profitable business or like, didn’t care to even think about it. And, you know, I feel that sometimes when you really want to do something and you really believe in it and you’re really like, you know, I got to do this. Like, you got to take that step and just go out and do it. And so what if you fail? You just, you know, learn from it and you try again. And that’s kind of the mentality that I had. I was like, you know what? I’m going to do this. And if it doesn’t work, then, you know, I can always come back and work somewhere else. But I got to give it a try and it worked.

Max Kantor: [00:06:03] Now, speaking of going out and giving things a try. I feel like real estate investing or investing in properties is on such a rise now. So can you talk a little bit about some tips for those who are interested in getting involved in real estate investing or want to learn more?

Gina Diaz: [00:06:21] Yeah, for sure. So as I mentioned, I’ve been doing real estate as an attorney, you know, for over 12 years already. And I would do like the traditional, like, you know, for some home buyer, you know, maybe someone that’s buying a second home type of investing. And, you know, I did have a couple people that were investors that were doing like, you know, a lot of investing. But, you know, as even as a realtor, I never asked, how are you doing this? And I always wanted to do it because I’m like, you know, I don’t have like a 401. K to fall back on. I need I need to find a way to fall back on something. And I always knew real estate, you know, was, was definitely gold if done correctly. So I bought my building where my practice is in Berwyn now and then I’m like, Oh my God, I’m going to have to wait another ten years to, you know, get another 100,000 and buy something else. So, um, luckily enough, I stumbled upon a friend at a real estate event who I knew was also not like, you know, born into money and didn’t, you know, like have all this money to go invest. But she was doing it. So I ran into her at this real estate event and I said, Hey, you know, like, how are you doing this? Like, this is something me and my husband really want to do.

Gina Diaz: [00:07:42] But, you know, we just don’t have all the capital to do it. And she said, you don’t need any capital. And I said, What do you mean? And she goes, She gave me this flier to go to this three day event. And she said, Go to this event. I promise you’ll you’ll love it. And I said, You know, if I’m going to go to this event, and it was like Friday, Saturday, Sunday, and they’re going to come to me with like, give me $50,000, here’s a DVD and an 800 number. I’m going to bill you for it. You know, because this is you know, I’ve been to those type of events and that doesn’t work for me. She’s like, No, no, no, you’re going to love it. So I went to the Andrew Homes Building an Empire three day event. And after that first day of of hearing people that have been doing this the way they teach it, there were two people on stage. There was a it was like a 19 and 20 year old. They were personal fitness trainers and they already had four properties under their belt. And that kind of opened my eyes to like, what am I doing? Like, I got to do this, I just got to step in. So I joined the program three and a half years ago and fast forward to now, I have over a 50 property portfolio using zero of my own money just following the system that they’ve, you know, gave that they’ve developed.

Gina Diaz: [00:08:58] And I’ve been helping other people do the same because a lot of people, when we think of real estate investing, you know, and me, even as an attorney and as a realtor, I still thought like you, you got to have money that you can kind of play with. Right. To be able to do this. And it’s far from the truth if you do it the right way, if you, you know, go to the program and figure it out there, you don’t have to use your money. There’s people out there that are willing to lend you their money, either from a 401. K, an IRA, um, personal savings, whatnot. They’re not getting much interest on it right now, so they will lend you the money, obviously with a lot of paperwork and stuff that goes into it. But you that’s how you grow your portfolio. And then, you know, slowly you start using your own money. Whether you want to do a flip, whether you want to, you know, keep it and rent it, whether you want to Airbnb it, short term rentals, whatever you want to do, there’s the possibilities are endless. So I got obviously really excited about it and I started like, you know, telling my friends and telling people and, you know, then I kind of joined the group and, you know, helped them.

Gina Diaz: [00:10:08] Aside from being their attorney, I also helped them with all of their real estate closings, tons and tons of investors. We do, you know, all types of of real estate. There’s like creative financing. There’s like the regular, you know, conventional FHA loan. There’s, you know, commercial loans. There’s there’s just so much out there that anybody that really wants to do it can do it. And even if you just want to do it, like to get your feet wet and say, well, maybe I’ll just take a property and flip it like you can and there’s people out there that will help you and there’s ways to do it. So I just love the way and it worked for me. And I’m one of those people that will never recommend something that I haven’t already tried or that hasn’t, you know, worked that I know it works personally because it’s my name on the line, right? So just like when they tell me to recommend an attorney for something I don’t do, if I personally don’t know that person, I won’t recommend it because you know it’s your name on the line as well and your reputation. So, um, so that’s kind of. And then me and my best friend who’s also a part of this group, you know, we said, you know, this is this is really great for women.

Gina Diaz: [00:11:13] Like women need to start getting more involved in real estate investing because, you know, when when you go buy a house, usually you have a significant other or, you know, your mom or whoever it is that you always want their opinion. And most of the time the women are the ones that kind of make that decision because they’re like, well, this is the type of kitchen I want or this is the type of, you know, whatever I want. So why can’t they become investors? Why can’t they do it? And we create it. We win, which stands for Women, Entrepreneur, Women Investor Network. And the idea of that was to kind of like create an open space for women to come together and help each other with investing, whether it’s, you know, we have women that are general contractors, women that are electricians, plumbers, you know, things that you would normally think is, you know, it’s a man. We have women that also do this. And so we connect women with other women, and we kind of make it so that they can speak freely and, you know, just, you know, do all that they would traditionally now want to do in a open forum or get intimidated by a man. So we started doing a lot of that. We started we started right before Covid, which, you know, kind of threw us off a little because, um, you know, a lot of the in-person meetings were canceled and stuff like that.

Gina Diaz: [00:12:36] We were doing in-person meetings like once a month where we would have free seminars on real estate investing and how you can get started and how we can help you. And then we started obviously doing them virtually. And then because of the pandemic and everything that happened, we then created a non-for-profit called We Win Non-for-profit. And what we did is we basically hit up all of the investors and said, Listen, you are investing in this neighborhood, so you have an interest to make sure people in this neighborhood are good. You have an interest to make sure, you know, like houses don’t go in foreclosure. You have an interest to keep this neighborhood. Right. Because it’ll increase your property values, too. So we’re going to this neighborhood and we’re going to give out, you know, food or, you know, jackets or help them pay their first month rent, whatever it could be. We’re going to go out there and help people, but we need you guys to donate. So then, you know, investors were like, Yeah, sure. And we started collecting donations from investors and going into different neighborhoods to do food drives, toy drives, turkey drives. We would give grants for women that wanted to like start investing so they can put their their earnest money down. We would give grants to people that couldn’t pay their rent, you know, and to help them through or help them pay an electricity bill or whatnot.

Gina Diaz: [00:14:00] And this was all because we this was all sponsored by the investors, not like, you know, private money or we didn’t hit up like companies or anything. It was all investor based. And so we now we kind of keep it going. You know, we do 2 or 3 events like that on a year to keep it going, to help others to make sure that you’re not just an investor taking from the community. You also need to give to the community. Because a lot of times I think when people think of, you know, investors, they always think like, well, they’re just they just want to take advantage of an opportunity and make money on it, which is not necessarily the truth, but at least not not all of them. We also need to get back to it and to make sure that that community, that neighborhood is is beautified and you know that our property values stay and stuff like that and help out people. You know, we can’t it can’t always just be about you. So when I say real estate really opens up a lot of opportunities, you know, just out of one conversation, all this happened and taking action, you know, and realizing that, hey, if if someone that’s been doing it for a long time that has all this to prove it is trying to coach me, then I’m going to listen.

Gina Diaz: [00:15:15] But if someone who is trying to coach me virtually and, you know, has done it in a different state and wants all this money, maybe, maybe. Let me let me think about that, because nothing’s better than the people that are doing it in the neighborhood. You want to do it. And that’s kind of what we teach and what we help people do, especially women, so that they can get their foot in the door and get started. Because a lot of people don’t have, you know, a fall back plan or maybe living paycheck to paycheck. And then you realize that, hey, you could be doing this, too. And, you know, a lot of our real estate investors have a regular 9 to 5, and then they do this on the side on the weekends. It’s totally possible. Like real estate is your own schedule. You do what you want to do as much as you want to do. And make as much as you want to make. So that’s kind of like how we are doing it and how I’m doing it and why I love it so much and helping obviously my investor colleagues like closing their deals and making sure they get the right deal and helping them negotiate. It is another aspect that I do as the attorney.

Max Kantor: [00:16:28] Yeah, I mean, totally. It sounds like you guys are doing a lot of great work for the community and educating the community about the world of real estate and how they can become successful in it, similar to how you became successful in it. So if people want to learn more about case law, want to learn maybe more about you and we win. Do you have a website, social media where they can get in touch?

Gina Diaz: [00:16:52] Yeah, for sure. So my social media is just add ideas for Facebook and my website is com. Um, so they can always, you know, find my information there and either send me an email or call me. And I always put my cell phone number on everything because investing is a 24 over seven. Real estate is a 24 seven type of industry. So I don’t want someone to like lose a deal because they couldn’t get a hold of the attorney, you know, on a Sunday at 5:00. So I always give my cell phone number to my clients. And, you know, just I always tell them, be respectful. Don’t call me on a Sunday at 8:00 because you want to know, you know, what’s going on with your case. Let’s let’s wait till Monday. But if it’s something urgent like you’re about to get this deal, and unless you sign this contract right now, you know you’re not going to get it. Please call me and we’ll get it done together. So I’m very available for people. And obviously I’m not the only attorney in my office. We have other attorneys and a full staff and we help with all types of deals, whether it’s traditional closings, creative financing, wholesaling assignments, you name it, we can help you with it.

Max Kantor: [00:18:06] Definitely. Well, Gina, thank you so much for being on the show today. I mean, you guys are doing great work and you’re very passionate about what what you do. So I appreciate you being on the show today and talking about everything you’re doing for the community.

Gina Diaz: [00:18:18] Thank you so much for having me. I appreciate it.

Max Kantor: [00:18:21] And thanks to you for listening to another episode of Chicago Business Radio. I’m your host, Max Kanter, and we’ll see you next time.

Intro: [00:18:30] This episode of Chicago Business Radio has been brought to you by Firm space, your private sanctuary for productivity and growth. To learn more, go to firm Space.com.

Andrew Edstrom With Assessivate

by

Atlanta Business Radio
Atlanta Business Radio
Andrew Edstrom With Assessivate
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Andrew Edstrom, a United States Air Force veteran, has been in the information technology and security/compliance field since 1989. He has worked as a support technician, an engineer and system administrator to various leadership roles including a CIO and a CISO plus a vCIO and vCISO for 2 credit unions in the Southeast.

He understands customer needs and technical excellence requirements for the success of his customers. While having held various industry/vendor certifications during his career, it is his exposure to telecom, application development, security, compliance and infrastructure that makes him uniquely qualified to help any business achieve its objectives.

He is well versed in multiple compliance frameworks including but not limited to PCI, HIPAA, ISO27001, SOC2, CCPA, NIST 800-171, NIST CSF and GDPR to name a few. He started Assessivate in September 2018.

Connect with Andrew on LinkedIn.

What You’ll Learn In This Episode

  • Compliance vs Security – which should his business be more concerned with
  • How much should he spend on cybersecurity or privacy measures
  • Is AI really dangerous
  • What security measures should he have in place at home
  • Protecting his identity
  • Biggest threats going forward
  • How much support will he get from law enforcement if he have a breach
  • Should he ever pay a ransom for my data

This transcript is machine transcribed by Sonix

TRANSCRIPT

Intro: [00:00:04] Broadcasting live from the Business RadioX Studios in Atlanta, Georgia. It’s time for Atlanta Business Radio. Brought to you by on pay. Atlanta’s New standard in payroll. Now, here’s your host.

Lee Kantor: [00:00:24] Lee Kantor here another episode of Atlanta Business Radio, and this is going to be a good one. But before we get started, it’s important to recognize our sponsor, Onpay. Without them, we couldn’t be sharing these important stories. Today on Atlanta Business Radio, we have Andrew Edstrom with Assessivate. Welcome.

Andrew Edstrom: [00:00:43] Hey, Lee, how are you doing?

Lee Kantor: [00:00:45] I am doing well. I’m so excited to learn what you’re up to. Tell us about Assessivate, how you serving folks.

Andrew Edstrom: [00:00:51] So we’re a managed compliance services provider. So what we do is businesses that have a compliance requirement, say in health care or the payment card industry or many other areas. Now we help them achieve that compliance by making sure they’re doing the right things, whether it’s a control that manages governance or on a policy or a control that is around a technical cyber solution. And that’s where we really add value to businesses and help them achieve their goals.

Lee Kantor: [00:01:19] Now, are you working primarily with kind of startups that haven’t done this before and then you’re helping implement kind of the foundation, or is it something that you get called in after something bad has happened?

Andrew Edstrom: [00:01:31] Yeah, it’s a little bit of both, to be honest. We get we get a lot of customers, like you said, that are kind of in an entry point. They’re trying to figure out what they’re supposed to be doing to make sure they don’t create create a situation that causes them either a breach or a compliance issue. But then also we get even larger organizations that look to use us to augment what they’re already trying to do. You’ve probably heard of the staffing shortage around cybersecurity and things like that, and we kind of fit into that that picture as it stands today.

Lee Kantor: [00:02:01] So the industries you mentioned, fintech and health care, those are the obvious ones, or is that kind of the bulk of it? Or are there is this something that kind of every industry should be at least putting some energy towards?

Andrew Edstrom: [00:02:14] Yeah. I mean, really, everybody needs to do it. Compliance really is kind of the guiding point to meet really your security concerns or maybe some operational maturity things that help you to achieve business goals. But yeah, I mean, everybody everybody out there, whether you’re running a lawn care business or you’re a Fortune 100 company, you really need to be looking at what you’re doing to protect information, whether it’s intellectual property or personally identifiable information or other critical stuff that could impact your business in a negative way.

Lee Kantor: [00:02:46] Now, there’s kind of some rules of thumb of how much you should invest in different aspects of your business. Is it the same thing in your industry? Is there a certain rule of thumb that I should be investing in cybersecurity or privacy?

Andrew Edstrom: [00:02:59] That’s a really great question. Lee Yeah, a lot. A lot of times people ask us what a magic number is, and I think the magic number really kind of depends on what data you’re trying to protect and where you’re at. So, you know, if you’ve, if you’ve decided to set up your own data center, there’s obviously a lot more cost around that or servers that you’re going to buy and build. But if you if you go into a cloud environment, then the lift is a little bit less as far as cost goes because then you just pay for a subscription service. So if you need that subscription service, say with AWS, Azure or any cloud provider, you can pay for a fraction of the cost, you know, maybe $50 a virtual machine a month. And then you do some additional hardening around it. But I would just say kind of as a rule of thumb, when when people look at their business, they need to really look at endpoint protection, that that cost is usually fairly insignificant. Somewhere between, say, five and $35 a user a month, depending on the level of support it gets. But it’s it and that’s a little bit of where we come into play. Also, too, is to make sure people are spending right money in the right things. There’s a lot of shiny objects and gimmicks and stuff out there that really can, you know, cause businesses to spend money unnecessarily. And so what we try to do is we try to help them measure or understand what is the appropriate level of defense or infrastructure to protect that investment that they’ve made around their product or service.

Lee Kantor: [00:04:29] Now, how do you typically engage with a new client? What’s that typical point of entry?

Andrew Edstrom: [00:04:36] Yeah, so a lot of times people want an assessment. So we’ll do like typically like an assessment of their overall infrastructure against security and if they have a applicable framework around compliance like PCI or HIPAA, something like that, those are probably the two most common. Then we’ll really do a measurement, if you will, against that and then help them to understand where they’re at. And that’s kind of one of our our things is we try to act like GPS for for their journey. And so we tell them where they’re at and then we tell them how to get to where they’re trying to go.

Lee Kantor: [00:05:10] Well, assess is in your name. So I would imagine a good assessment is part of your your deliverable.

Andrew Edstrom: [00:05:16] It really is. It really is.

Lee Kantor: [00:05:19] So now with all this remote work, is that. Just opening up another can of worms that folks have to be dealing with nowadays. Having, you know, people that work with your company all over the globe, it’s always been around for, you know, for certain people. But now it seems like more and more people are now remote. Does is that add more complexity to the challenge that you have to help with?

Andrew Edstrom: [00:05:46] It can you know, every organization is a little bit different. So depending on company culture and then the investment that they’re willing to make in their technology. So a lot of times technology departments or cybersecurity is looked at as a cost center instead of something that can help project your business. Um, but yeah, the remote work definitely introduced some new concerns, you know, whether it’s somebody that lives in your home that can walk by your computer and see information they shouldn’t be seeing, or maybe they’re using a home computer and sharing a login. Those are the things that really started to show themselves. And then, you know, depending on what the investment was on the endpoint security, that was another part of it, because most businesses aren’t going to put their the identical infrastructure they put around their corporate office and every employees office that they’re working from home. So a lot of times what they do there is they add some identity access management tools and some really robust endpoint protection security tools that really can control that access and mitigate some of that risk.

Lee Kantor: [00:06:47] And it’s just it’s not their laptop only, right? It could be their phone as well.

Andrew Edstrom: [00:06:52] Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. So when when they have a remote office, they could actually have a phone device in their in their home. They could have a softphone on their computer. So yeah, there’s, there’s a lot of different aspects to it. It does limit some of the other risks though, because they may or may not have, you know, some additional things going on that they may have in the office. Like they may not be printing at home, they may not be allowed to print at home. And those would be some of the parameters that we would set out of the gate as we help secure them if they did remote work.

Lee Kantor: [00:07:24] Is there any kind of low hanging fruit for somebody who wants to protect their identity or just shore up their security if they are at home?

Andrew Edstrom: [00:07:33] Yeah, I think, you know, as far as identity stuff goes, the main thing I tell people a lot of times is, you know, you know, don’t make it easy on somebody that’s trying to get to your information. So specifically, when you come down to whether it’s employee identities or just your personal identity, a couple of things that we always tell people is to lock your credit if you’re not actively using it. And what that means is you go to any one of the big three and you can do it online. And actually I believe you can do it over the phone as well. But you basically set through some knowledge base to access some some questions and things that would challenge people. So if they tried to establish credit on your behalf, your credit is already locked. And basically it can’t go any further without them calling in and then be able to answer a bunch of questions that really only you should know.

Lee Kantor: [00:08:25] So it’s as simple as that. It’s just you have to contact all of the credit agencies or just one.

Andrew Edstrom: [00:08:30] You would reach out to each one of them and you would you would set it up. I believe there’s some some services that now that will actually do that kind of for you as as a top level. But right now, what we’ve just told people is just go directly to each one of the big three, do the enrollment and go ahead and freeze your credit so you can prevent identity theft from happening. It slows it down. And most of the time when it happens, they also have alerting. So, you know, when somebody attempted to do it and it definitely helps protect you.

Lee Kantor: [00:09:01] Now, what’s your backstory? How’d you get involved in this line of work?

Andrew Edstrom: [00:09:05] So I found out at a very young age that I was fascinated with computers and started taking classes back in high school. And I’m a I’m somebody who was born in the late 60s, so I’ve been around for a minute doing this from kind of the beginning when technology there was mainframes, there was bulletin boards and dialing up and doing different things and and my career and my experience really started, you know, like early on, I went into the military. They gave me access to computers there. And then I just continued to evolve it. And I just found out I had a real knack for understanding how to fix those problems for people and, you know, doing helpdesk roles and then becoming a manager and doing some engineering and then running things and then becoming a CIO and a CISO and then finally starting my own company because I just felt like I could do it better if I was the one pulling the levers. And I think we are doing it better now.

Lee Kantor: [00:09:57] It seems like at least lately, maybe this is the way it is all the time. It just seems like in the news there’s a lot of breaches and cybersecurity issues that are involving companies of all sizes. Is this something that’s just getting worse and worse or the bad guys are getting better at this faster than the good guys can prevent it?

Andrew Edstrom: [00:10:17] Yeah, I think I think the old cliche line is we have to get it right all the time and the hackers only have to get it right once to really steal from you and then I would also just say that, yeah, there’s there’s more technology today than there has ever been on this planet. So there’s more avenues or mechanisms or ways to get into stuff. And, and I think another part of that challenge or I would just absolutely say there’s another part of that challenge is, you know, anybody with a credit card can go to AWS or Azure or whatever and start up a server and find somebody develops an application. And a lot of us don’t necessarily know the background of how that application or service came to be about. So you may have people that are completely oblivious to cybersecurity, but maybe they make a great product and those things then start to collect data and information. And once that stuff gets out there, then the hackers, they’ll, they’ll poke around and there’s a lot of tools and websites that can do the research for them, if you will, and tell them where there’s open ports and and places are accessible.

Andrew Edstrom: [00:11:20] And then finally, I would just say that, you know, once somebody gets hacked once, then it’s almost like sales 101, you know, you start to farm the account. They try to, you know, get in there and steal more information or more data. And especially if somebody’s paid a ransom, that usually becomes a bigger target long term for other hackers, because I think what you would find is the Intel and the dark Web would definitely shine a light on, hey, you know, company X, Y, Z, we got 50,000 from them. There’s probably another opportunity here. Or they may have an advanced, persistent threat still in that network, still stealing that data. So it some of the complexity is there. But I would say more times than not, probably 90 to 95% of the time it’s misconfiguration, lack of visibility or monitoring of infrastructure that causes the breaches. Typical phishing, emails, training, those things are always important. But most of these cyber attacks are preventable and for whatever reason, they’re still happening. And it blows my mind.

Lee Kantor: [00:12:23] Now, something I’ve seen a little bit lately, or at least have gone to my attention are VPNs. Is that can you explain that and is that helpful?

Andrew Edstrom: [00:12:32] Yeah. So VPNs or virtual private network is just basically a way to make your device be an extension of your corporate network. What that means is that traffic becomes all encrypted over that VPN tunnel and there are some other technical configurations around that they can do something called split tunneling where everything doesn’t go through the tunnel. But VPN is definitely a value added technology, but the changes in technology are also allowing for some other technologies to come to light to to eliminate the VPN stuff. The VPN stuff can be a little bit clunky and cumbersome with installing additional clients and stuff there. There’s some products out there now that use something called zero Trust that also looks at like the health of your machine, making sure it has endpoint protection like an antivirus or an anti malware tool on it. It checks your identity. And then maybe it also considers your geo location of where you’re coming from. So you could set maybe somebody could access it from their home. But if they want to Starbucks or a hotel, you could lock out that access to prevent possible bleed over into other devices, getting access to that tunnel and connecting to it.

Lee Kantor: [00:13:44] Now, what about like kind of back in the day, you know, everybody said, oh, put that, you know, the software on and you don’t have to worry about it. Is that relevant today in today’s world? You know, those protective softwares that you can buy kind of at every.

Andrew Edstrom: [00:14:02] Yeah, there’s there’s a lot of different classifications of it. And it’s unfortunate that we seem to keep making it more complex and more difficult to figure out which solutions are right. But when you get into some of the advanced products, if you’re looking for an endpoint protection product, I would always highly recommend that people look for something that specifically calls out defending against ransomware. Maybe also has other detect features, tamper protection, advanced logging, advanced heuristics around how it scans and looks, how far down and deep it will scan. And then the reputation of that vendor as far as like defending against different cyber attacks. And really when we when we talk about that, really talking to industry professionals, word of mouth and finding out what really is working versus something’s a little bit vaporware and I don’t want to call out any specific brands, but but that’s kind of what we tell people. And then that’s also where, you know, if they’re if they’re using one set of products from one vendor for, say, firewalls and they have an endpoint protection product, there’s usually some value to adding that same product in that set so that we don’t silo information that can be used in an event if there’s a breach or an incident that can help minimize the amount of time that a hacker can be in your system or control it. A lot of them have now an isolation feature where if something goes bad, you can basically press a button and then that device can’t get to anything. So you can lock it down and prevent it from infecting other computers.

Lee Kantor: [00:15:40] So what’s that thing that’s happening right now in a prospective clients business where they should be contacting the folks at eight?

Andrew Edstrom: [00:15:51] Yeah, I think the main thing I would I would tell people is specifically if they have any kind of a compliance requirement like HIPAA, PCI, or they’re looking at getting into like maybe their technology or a software company and they’re looking at getting a SOC two attestation from the AICPA, which is kind of a validation of security availability, confidentiality, privacy and integrity, integrity, processing. Those things are things that are right in our our wheelhouse where we can just really jump into an organization and help them understand that. And that aligns with policy or procedure creation around acceptable use, information security policies, business continuity testing, tabletop exercises. There’s a whole realm of services that that help. And we usually start with some foundational ones and then continue to increase it as they increase their security posture.

Lee Kantor: [00:16:52] Good stuff. Well, this is stuff that you really have to stay on top of. Are some of these compliance requirements. Is that something that they have to do annually or is it something they do one time and check a box and then they’re good?

Andrew Edstrom: [00:17:07] Yeah, So so compliance is a tricky thing. It’s just like security. It’s really kind of a never ending thing. So once you jump into something, say if you go into a vertical like health care and you got to do HIPAA and you got to protect it, you really under that governance for the entirety of why your business is is touching patient records or EPI. But conversely, if you do like a soc2 attestation, that’s kind of a choice, right? That’s just a business choice to improve something you’re doing. But also we’re seeing a lot more vendor management requests where people are asking about the vendors they’re doing business with to see if they have a soc2 letter or they’re able to demonstrate through a questionnaire that they have the appropriate security things in place. The Soc2 is is an option. It’s not a mandated thing, but it does give people an understanding of people’s culture and position on cybersecurity and what they’re willing to do to make sure that they protect people’s information.

Lee Kantor: [00:18:06] Well, if somebody wants to learn more, have a more substantive conversation with you or somebody on your team, what’s the website? What’s that? What’s the website in case somebody wants to learn more? Oh yeah.

Andrew Edstrom: [00:18:17] It’s sorry about that. It’s assassinate.com a s s s s i v e.com. And please do call us and we’d be glad to help anybody.

Lee Kantor: [00:18:27] Well, Andrew, thank you so much for sharing your story. You’re doing important work and we appreciate you.

Andrew Edstrom: [00:18:32] Sounds good. Thank you so much, Lee, for having us. All right.

Lee Kantor: [00:18:35] This is Lee Kantor. We’ll see you all next time on Atlanta Business Radio.

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