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Story-Conscious Leadership: Creating Safer Teams Where People Thrive

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High Velocity Radio
High Velocity Radio
Story-Conscious Leadership: Creating Safer Teams Where People Thrive
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In this episode of High Velocity Radio, Lee Kantor interviews Nathan Gaydosik, a trauma-informed leadership coach with Gaydosik Collective, about the power of becoming a story-conscious leader. Nathan explains how past experiences can influence workplace relationships, communication, trust, and performance, and how leaders can create safer environments where people can thrive. He also shares practical strategies for building psychological safety, asking better questions, embracing transparency, and leading employees according to their individual needs rather than treating everyone exactly the same.

Nathan Gaydosik is a trauma-informed coach and facilitator that empowers organizations and individuals to initiate deep and systemic change.

He holds a Master’s Degree in Clinical Mental Health, an International Coaching Federation ACC designation, and 1000s of hours facilitating experiential work.

He values wisdom, growth, and adventure, and is often found moving outdoors or enjoying music in many forms.

Connect with Nathan on LinkedIn.

What You’ll Learn In This Episode

  • Understanding trauma and how past experiences can influence workplace behavior
  • The principles behind story-conscious and trauma-informed leadership
  • Creating psychological, emotional, and physical safety in the workplace
  • Recognizing signs of low trust, employee disengagement, and relational waste
  • Using open-ended questions to give employees greater voice and choice
  • Supporting employees without needing to know the details of their personal experiences
  • Leading people according to their individual needs and backgrounds
  • Using transparency and clear communication during organizational change
  • Building healthier relationships, stronger teams, and more thriving workplace cultures

Transcript-iconThis transcript is machine transcribed by Sonix.

 

TRANSCRIPT

Intro: Broadcasting live from the Business RadioX Studios in Atlanta, Georgia. It’s time for High Velocity Radio.

Lee Kantor: Lee Kantor here another episode of High Velocity Radio and this is gonna be a good one. But before we get started, it’s important to recognize our sponsor, Business RadioX. If you’re a business coach who’s tired of being a best kept secret, set up a call with Stone Payton at bookstonephone.com to unlock your perpetual prospect pipeline. Today on the show, we have a trauma informed leadership coach, part of Gaydosik Collective. Nathan Gaydosik. Welcome.

Nathan Gaydosik: Thanks for having me. Honored to be here.

Lee Kantor: Well, I’m excited to learn what you’re up to. Tell us about Gaydosik Collective. How are you serving folks?

Nathan Gaydosik: Yeah, I coach leaders to become Story conscious to behave in ways that are sensitive to and aware of the past stories that might be affecting present relationships.

Lee Kantor: So how’d you get into this line of work? What’s your backstory?

Nathan Gaydosik: So I’ve been a student of leadership and personal growth since before I could drive a car. Really, my career started in experiential learning and leadership retreats where I was teaching the chick fil A leadership content, and it evolved into professional leadership coaching. And in coaching conversations, I was hearing and seeing signs of trauma and the stories that my clients were telling about their work, about their relationships. And that led me down the path to study clinical mental health therapy so that I could professionally see the whole picture. I decided to stay in the coaching space because I see caring for your mind at work as perfectly relevant to everyone and in every workspace. And so building story conscious leaders is what I would call a trauma informed leadership endeavor. I want people to become leaders that behave in trauma informed ways, so that they can become safe places for people to grow and thrive.

Lee Kantor: Now the word trauma has some weight. Can you explain what it is and what it isn’t?

Nathan Gaydosik: Yeah. So I would start actually at the beginning, which is I’d love to define leadership. Leadership as I define it, is the stewardship of our influence and authority. And so leaders automatically and everybody can be a leader. You can have influence, you have some level of authority in your job and it’s your responsibility to steward it. So that’s an important definition, an important piece. Trauma I would define as any negative event or relationship that causes a change in behavior. So trauma really has taken on a heavy meaning. But the root of the word trauma is just the word wound and wounding. Experiencing pain and trauma is really just part of the human experience. And so part of my vision for some of this work is actually to pathologize the word trauma. And for us to acknowledge that we have wounds that that we experience at work and in relationship with other people. And that’s not necessarily a problem. It’s when we have really bad, really dysfunctional responses to that wound and to that experience. That’s where the problems lie. Um, and so I’d like to take some of the weight out of the word trauma if possible in my work.

Lee Kantor: So is there a reason why that word carries so much emotional kind of baggage nowadays? Maybe compared to the way the word was formed initially.

Nathan Gaydosik: That’s a good question, I think. I was having a conversation with a leader in a firm local to Atlanta, and she was explaining, you know, you’re really going to have two camps of people. Um, you’re going to have one camp of people that will say, you know, everything is trauma. And, um, trauma is being overused as a word and everybody is maybe overusing it. And then there’s going to be another group that’s going to say, um, well, no, everything is trauma and they’re going to be the people that are really comfortable using that word. Um, I think that the, one of the reasons it’s become such a heavy term is because it’s tied to some of the most extreme things, which is true. But I think we’ve discounted the small hurts and the small instances of, of stories where people are experiencing wounding in the workplace. I mean, you take things that happen every day, like somebody getting a pretty negative performance review or someone being laid off from their job or having a difficult interaction with a customer or a client. Those might be in somebody’s mind and in their story. A traumatic event that changes their behavior and how they respond in future events and in future stories. And so, um, because the word captures so many things, I think people tend to focus on the most extreme, even though the really small things can actually make a big difference in people’s behavior.

Lee Kantor: And you’ve made it a point to cast a wide net in the definition, not be narrow very intentionally.

Nathan Gaydosik: Yes. Yeah. Because it is part of everyone’s story and in my experience in the mental health space, but even in the coaching space, people aren’t even acknowledging the big heavy trauma things. They’re not label them, labeling them correctly, much less the small, seemingly small traumatic events and especially in the workplace. Um, people aren’t acknowledging how work can hurt. We spend a lot of time at work. We spend a lot of energy and, and there can be things that really affect us, um, not just at work, but in our life as a whole, um, at work. And so I really would love leaders to be equipped with some of the therapists superpowers for causing behavior change, for innovating thinking, for building better futures. And that’s a little bit of what story conscious leadership trauma informed leadership is about for me, is helping people to behave in ways that make relationships safer, that make, uh, stronger relationships, that help people get access to their best thinking. And that’s by practicing the trauma informed principles in the workplace.

Lee Kantor: Now, how much of this, um. Uh, how much of the trauma from. Let’s assume the leader is not kind of being mean. They’re just being a leader that is uninformed about certain things. Um, so they’re not bullying or they’re not purposely, uh, trying to, uh, create trauma, but they’re doing the best they can with what knowledge they have to this point. How do you kind of help educate them about how to maybe communicate, um, and lead people differently? Because maybe that leader had grown up in a, maybe in, say, in the military where it was very directive and they were told what to do. And it was, you know, they were telling me to jump and they’re telling me how high and I shouldn’t think and I should just do what I’m told. And now they’re have a, a group of people they’re leading that maybe learn differently or need to be communicated differently. So how do you help that individual, um, lead, uh, more effectively?

Nathan Gaydosik: Yeah, it’s a great question. Uh, so I would say the main goal is a story conscious leader is going to behave in light of their awareness and sensitivity to how past stories might be interfering in the present. And so that has many layers that could be, um, just raising awareness of, um, what somebody might be coming into the workplace, you know, with a different background. They’re coming as a leader. They have a military background. Um, maybe this other person has never been in any situation like that before. And so to be met with a really strong, uh, Commanding leadership style that might be a a really triggering experience for them. That might be an experience that is really difficult, um, for them based on their past story. Um, and it also could be, um, that the leader maybe should look at their own experience and, and their own story and how, um, they’re maybe modeling things that didn’t really work as well for them as maybe they think it did. Um, or it just doesn’t work for the people that they’re with. I think that’s a lot of what leaders maybe fail to see is, um, the importance of treating everybody the same by treating them differently and according to their needs and, and how they need to be led.

Nathan Gaydosik: Um, so it really starts, my work starts probably at the awareness level of just helping people to see at the very basic psychological level. What happens when someone experiences a negative experience really at any level? How that changes how they think, how that impacts their ability to have access to their best thinking. Um, and that’s not a flaw. That’s actually just a basic biological system in our brain. Um, and so that would be a place that I would start is by exposing just the general system at play in human, in the human mind. Um, and then people tend to start to think differently and see their interactions differently when they realize, when I sit down to have a performance review conversation with someone, that person is not just seeing me, but they’re seeing every boss that they’ve had before. They’re seeing every person they’ve ever gotten feedback from. Um, their brain is looking for the patterns and is bringing all of those patterns to this interaction. No matter how I behave, the past stories are present in the conversation that we’re having, and that’s going to hopefully change how they show up to those conversations.

Lee Kantor: Now, is this something that is unique in America? Like, are there different cultures that approach trauma differently? And maybe they communicate in and around it and lead in and around it in a different manner?

Nathan Gaydosik: Yeah, that’s that’s a good question. I do come from the kind of American background, but I have a huge learner of the different cultures in the world. Um, there are tons of different approaches to this. I think America can be at times behind in how, um, we acknowledge and how we see, um, human centered workplaces, how we see, uh, how work affects people, how we value, um, health and flourishing and all those things. And so the system, the trauma informed principles are actually pretty universal across the globe. Like you can see countries all over the world, therapists, psychologists, medical professionals using these trauma informed principles. Um, and so it is actually pretty universal again, because it’s the human experience and it’s the human mind operating no matter what language, no matter what background, um, the system that is at play with having a negative experience and then having a response that is universal in the human experience, which is why I believe so strongly it belongs in the workplace. Being talked about is because we can’t escape it.

Lee Kantor: Now, are you typically being hired by the organization, um, to work with a team, or is this something that an individual who’s struggling at work hires you to help them manage their work situation from an employee lens.

Nathan Gaydosik: Yeah, that’s a great question. I love, I love working for organizations and doing entire trainings and workshops for large groups of leaders. And so I have one coming up in September where I’ll be meeting with about 20 managers and supervisors. And going through this work. I coach executive leaders one on one to build and initiate culture change in their organization. Often that is somewhat connected to deep, personal, transformational work that an executive leader is doing. Um, I do work occasionally with employees that are trying to, to grow and improve and change. Um, but my vision, this work is much more effective at the higher levels where behaviors can actually be changed, cultures can be changed, organizational policies can be changed. Um, and that’s really what I feel passionate about helping to see so that less and less employees are having to go get counseling because of their work situation, or find professional help, which usually is going to lead to them leaving their job, um, and going somewhere else. I’ve coached a lot of people out of their jobs because their leader is not a story conscious person. And there’s really nothing that is going to change from the employee’s perspective. And so they have to make a change. Um, so ultimately it’s, I want to be training organizations and that’s some of the best work I do is in the group space. And then executive leaders who are looking to make culture change happen at their organization.

Lee Kantor: Now, what is kind of what does it look like from the leader’s standpoint right before they hire you? What are some of the signs and signals that maybe that they should be calling Nathan and his team?

Nathan Gaydosik: Yeah. So a lot of, uh, if you have an organization that’s trauma uninformed. You have trauma uninformed leaders. They’re not going to know that. They’re not going to acknowledge that that’s what’s happening. But they will notice that, hey, we have a team that doesn’t really have any trust. Trust has has been eroded here. Um, our people are not performing at the high levels that we believe that they’re capable of what is happening there. Um, maybe there is, uh, high turnover or um, they’re getting poor scores on employee engagement surveys. Um, there’s something that I would call relational and emotional waste, which is really hard to measure, but is often easily felt within an organization. Um, there’s a lot of time spent trying to fix and work on things, um, that are totally relational and not actually the work that is supposed to be done that the group is there to do. And so they would see a lot of these signs and symptoms. Um, and they would be thinking, how do we make our people, how do we help our people thrive? How do we help our organization to thrive? And that’s usually where the conversation might start. They also might be seeing that they have, um, a lot of employees talking about mental health in the workplace and they don’t know how to interact with that. They don’t know what to do with that. They don’t know how to do that safely. And so, um, this would be a great work for them as well if they see that happening, um, a lot and aren’t sure how to engage, that might be a case where an executive leader comes to figure out how to navigate leading people who are sharing about that in the workplace.

Lee Kantor: Now, do you ever work with like private equity or venture capital where there’s some mergers, some acquisition that someone’s going to get bought out or somebody just got bought out and they want to integrate, you know, kind of two cultures into one.

Nathan Gaydosik: Yeah. Those major organizational changes are really interesting. I haven’t actually worked through any of those directly that I can think of, but a lot of times when major change is occurring, that is a great opportunity for some story conscious trauma informed behavior. Um, because there are ways, so many ways for it to go wrong. And there are a lot of pretty simple things that people can do and pretty simple things leaders can practice, um, in those times to kind of soften the, the blow to make the transition easier. One of them I would fight for and I fight for a lot is just clear transparency, um, as much transparency as possible, um, for people to know what to expect to understand what’s happening. Um, and, and being as clear as possible with people about if this happens, then this is what’s going to happen, giving them positive and negative consequences of their actions and their performance, those kinds of things. Um, even though they might be seem kind of hard line or actually can be really important and, and create a sense of clarity, um, and safety, um, even in unsafe and unsure times.

Lee Kantor: Now when you’re working with somebody, like that’s a great piece of advice. What would be, what are some of the other kind of low hanging fruit? A leader, um, who wants to be more trauma informed, wants to be a more trauma informed leader, could be doing, uh, to better communicate with their people. Is there some easy thing, some baby steps that anyone could take that’s listening right now?

Nathan Gaydosik: Absolutely. Um, so the number one kind of foundational element of creating a space where people can thrive is creating safety, psychological, emotional, physical safety, all of those things. Um, and so the first thing that a leader can do, the baby step is really to just start asking questions to identify where are some emotional, psychological safety risks in the organization. Um, I was actually in a coffee shop and heard one of the managers of the coffee shop having a one on one with a team member, and I just couldn’t help but overhear what was happening. And I was really appreciating the conversation that they were having. And she was asking questions like, hey, if you have a good idea, do you feel that you can bring that idea and be heard and considered if a problem arises, how comfortable are you bringing that up to a leader? Do you know what support you have? If you have a problem with your leader, those kinds of questions, you can start to ask questions about safety. Even just asking the team, hey, paint a picture of what a safe work environment looks like.

Nathan Gaydosik: And then you have now you have a checklist of things that you can start looking for and doing. It really is as simple as that. Something I want to emphasize is that being story conscious does not necessarily mean that, you know, the stories that people have experienced, that you know, the trauma that maybe somebody has. And actually, it’s more safe to not know. You can be a safe person and a safe work environment and a healing work environment without ever knowing the details or the background of the story. And if you are, find yourself digging to know more of what happened. Stop. Please stop. That’s not really necessary. And it’s actually can be more harmful to dig into. Ask. And so trauma informed leaders shouldn’t be encouraging emotional dumping of past stories, but they should be really focused on what do we need to do here and now and in the future to make this a place where you can flourish? And that’s really the main place to start and to be in the habit of doing over and over again.

Lee Kantor: And that’s a great example of how maybe a trauma informed leader would, uh, ask a question versus how someone who maybe isn’t trauma informed would ask the same question. Are there any other kind of questions that you can show us? Both sides? Like what? How a trauma informed leader would ask versus what a non trauma informed leader might ask?

Nathan Gaydosik: Yeah, I think it’s a trauma informed leader’s gonna ask and give opportunities for employees to have as much voice into issues and decisions and situations. They’re going to offer as many choices as possible. They’re going to encourage, um, you a sense of mutuality. So I’m invested in your success. You’re invested in our success. Um, there’s going to be that team environment. Um, and I think often it’s, it really is asking open questions, um, that allow them to really bring their response, um, their, their true thoughts. Um, often leaders default to closed questions, um, which can be unsafe because they’re, you’re looking for a very specific answer. And, and oftentimes, uh, there isn’t a specific answer. There isn’t a short answer to some of these deeper, heavier things. And so the more open questions a leader can ask, the more humble that leader can be in the asking and the listening to the response. Those are signs that someone’s tending towards being a more trauma informed leader. Um, and a trauma informed leader is going to, um, you mentioned earlier, despite their intentions, they’re going to perpetuate harms. They’re going to remind people of historical hurts, they’re going to miss these responses, these trauma and trauma responses that are at play. Um, they’re going to ignore emotional information and potentially cause harm for the employee simply through neglect, simply through lack of awareness. Um, and so it really is about asking a lot of questions, um, and being, being humble and being patient in the answers.

Lee Kantor: Now, is there a story you can share that maybe illustrates what it’s like to work with you? Don’t name the individual or the organization, but maybe share the challenge they came to you with and how you were able to help them get to a new level.

Nathan Gaydosik: Yeah. Um, I worked with a large group of executives recently and, um, they actually work in a space where they’re dealing with some heavy things. It’s a heavy industry, um, emotionally heavy. Um, and we were discussing becoming a trauma informed leader in that space for their team members. Specifically, how do we engage our team members? Um, and I think one of the biggest takeaways from the group, they mentioned it at the end of our workshop at the end of the day was, um, you don’t have to know. You really don’t have to know in order to create space for someone to thrive in order to ask them what they need to help, give them space to empower them to give them options, um, to manage your behavior in interacting with them. You don’t have to know the details of what’s going on, even if that’s something that’s completely outside of work, something that’s personal, something that’s very, uh, recent and relevant. Somebody’s going through something personally at home. They bring that to work. You don’t have to know the details. You may just have to know, hey, I’m having a really hard time right now. Totally heard. What do you need from me? That’s all that conversation needs to be. It doesn’t need to become an impromptu counseling session with your manager. Um, and I think that was really freeing for them is you don’t have to get into the details. And it’s actually better if you don’t get into the details, but you can get into what do you need from me? How can I support you? How can I create space for you? That’s the kind of conversation that needs to happen. And I think that’s really freeing. But I think it’s also a new challenge for people not to disengage, which often is the temptation. I don’t know what to do, so I disengage, but to engage with the right boundaries. And I think that is easier said than done. But I think that just having that new awareness was really impactful to this group of about 50 executive leaders and would love. I’d love for more people to know about it.

Lee Kantor: Now, is there an industry you typically work in, like healthcare or nonprofits, or is this something that’s industry agnostic and you can work on any organization? You know, that is open minded to this type of leadership.

Nathan Gaydosik: It’s definitely industry agnostic. I tend to work with service based organizations. So organizations that are serving clients, customers, um, in an in person or in a personal way. Um, but any team, anybody that’s working with other humans. This work is for them. Um, and so that tends to be a lot of organizations, but typically I’m serving, uh, restaurants, service industries. I have, um, some nonprofits that I serve financial industries, banks, um, lots of people that are customer people facing, uh, this work is really helpful because not only does it help how you interact with your employees and your teammates, but it helps how you interact with your customers and the clients that are coming to you and the stories that they might be bringing to the meeting or to the interaction that you have. Um, and it can help how you interact with them as well.

Lee Kantor: Now what’s the way you deliver your service? You mentioned, um, workshops and working with teams and things like that. Do you do. Is it online in person? How do you deliver your coaching?

Nathan Gaydosik: Yeah. Online. Um, can do, uh, take, a one day full day workshop. That would happen in person. Um, I love the in-person work, but you can also take that split it up over six weeks, um, six one hour sessions, virtually online. Um, all of the work that I do is my background’s in experiential learning. I believe in it. All of it is very experiential and interactive. So it’s not just me lecturing, but it’s actually us having discussions, us, uh, putting into practice these things, wrestling with some of the concepts, diving into, uh, theoretical stories of what somebody might be experiencing and how do we then interact with it as a leader. Um, but yeah, virtual in person. Um, and then the one on one coaching is completely virtual wherever people are, I can connect to them.

Lee Kantor: So if somebody wants to learn more, have a more substantive conversation, what is the website? What’s the best way to connect?

Nathan Gaydosik: Yeah, they can go to storystoryconscious.co that’s co and they can meet me there. They can find me on LinkedIn. Uh, there’s not many of us out there, so, um, they can find me on LinkedIn. Um, and I’m sure you’ll attach in the show notes, um, other places that they can find me, but those are the main places. I have a Substack where I write as well. Same, same thing. Uh, Nathan on Substack. Um, and I write pretty short newsletters there that people can start to read about some of this work, some of, uh, my thoughts and my perspective on leadership in the workplace. And so that’s another place they can find me.

Lee Kantor: Well, Nathan, thank you so much for sharing your story today. You’re doing such important work and we appreciate you.

Nathan Gaydosik: Thank you.

Lee Kantor: All right. This is Lee Kantor. We’ll see you all next time on High Velocity Radio.

From Natural Healing to Purpose: Building a Healthier Life and a Bigger Mission

by

High Velocity Radio
High Velocity Radio
From Natural Healing to Purpose: Building a Healthier Life and a Bigger Mission
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In this episode of High Velocity Radio, Lee Kantor interviews Randi Shannon, a traditional naturopathic doctor and founder of The Body Can, about her journey into natural health, traditional face, tongue, and fingernail analysis, and her approach to helping clients make informed wellness choices. Randi also shares lessons on building an authentic personal brand, growing an engaged social media audience, and her mission to establish Meli Preserve, a sanctuary dedicated to protecting pollinators and rescued animals.

Randi Shannon, ND, is a Naturopathic Doctor, author, speaker, and media personality with nearly 30 years of experience in natural health and holistic wellness. She is the founder of TheBodyCAN.com and specializes in Face, Tongue, and Fingernail Analysis, using visible signs of the body to help identify areas that may need nutritional and lifestyle support.

She uses 5,000-year-old original medicine, bringing together ancient wisdom, traditional healing practices, nutrition, plant medicine, and modern science while recognizing that the body has an extraordinary ability to communicate what it needs.

Her media background includes eight years as a Fox-affiliate talk-show host, and she is a recurring guest on Coast to Coast AM with George Noory. She has also appeared on Sean Hannity Radio, The Power Hour, Mike Lindell TV, numerous podcasts and radio programs, and was featured in the Amazon Prime series Legacy Makers. She has had the privilege of speaking to audiences about natural health, nutrition, the body’s visible warning signs, and ancient knowledge that modern society has often forgotten.

She is the author of the Amazon bestselling children’s book Tongue Tales, and her newest book, The Language of Spices: The Complete Guide to Nature’s Most Powerful Medicines, is now available on Amazon. It explores 58 spices, bringing together their ancient history, traditional uses, biblical connections, culinary applications, and modern scientific research. The idea behind the book is one she strongly believes: There is a pharmacy in your kitchen.

Her newest work expands into another area she believes profoundly affects health—thoughts, words, attitudes, and emotional environment. The Physical Cost of Negative Thinking: How Your Thoughts, Words & Emotional Environment Affect Your Body, Health & Relationships explores the connection between chronic negativity and the physical body, while also looking at what happens when negativity becomes the emotional environment in which other people are forced to live.

She has also written Adapt and Overcome: The Physical Cost of Negativity—and Why a Man Cannot Afford to Live There, which speaks specifically to men about strength, resilience, discipline, responsibility, leadership, and the ability to face adversity without allowing it to define them. She believes men have always been called upon to protect, build, provide, endure, adapt, and overcome, and that this is a conversation worth having again.

She is currently working on her next book, Holy to the Lord: Bells of the Horses, inspired by the remarkable passage in Zechariah describing a day when even the bells of the horses will bear the words “HOLY TO THE LORD.” It continues her exploration of ancient Scripture, symbolism, forgotten knowledge, and the connections between the physical and spiritual worlds.

Another part of her life’s work is MeliPreserve.org, an effort devoted to preservation—protecting the knowledge, resources, and natural world that future generations deserve to inherit. For her, health isn’t only about what people do for themselves today. It is also about stewardship: what people protect, what they preserve, what they teach, and what they leave behind.

Although these subjects may appear very different—tongues and fingernails, spices, nutrition, thoughts and words, ancient Scripture, human resilience, and preservation—they all come back to the same questions that have driven her work for decades: What is the body trying to tell us? What did the ancient world understand that we have forgotten? And what are we going to preserve for the generations that come after us?

Connect with Randi on LinkedIn and follow The Body Can on Facebook and X.

What You’ll Learn In This Episode

  • The principles behind traditional face, tongue, and fingernail analysis
  • Randi’s journey from healthcare experience to naturopathic practice
  • Practical approaches to making more conscious nutrition and lifestyle choices
  • The importance of staying authentic and consistent when building a personal brand
  • Strategies for growing an engaged social media audience organically
  • Using short-form videos and live content to increase visibility
  • The mission behind Meli Preserve and the importance of protecting pollinators
  • Turning a personal passion into a purpose-driven business and community initiative

Transcript-iconThis transcript is machine transcribed by Sonix.

 

TRANSCRIPT

Intro: Broadcasting live from the Business RadioX Studios in Atlanta, Georgia. It’s time for High Velocity Radio.

Lee Kantor: Lee Kantor here. Another episode of High Velocity Radio and this is going to be a good one. But before we get started, it’s important to recognize our sponsor, Business RadioX. If you’re a business coach or a consultant who’s tired of being a best kept secret, set up a call with Stone Payton at bookstonephone.com to unlock your perpetual prospect pipeline. Today on the show, we have Randi Shannon with The Body Can & Meli Preserve. Welcome.

Randi Shannon: Hey, such an honor to be here. What a great platform you guys have. I when I, when I saw this, I was like, I did a little bit of a deep dive and saw that you guys are all over the country and just super impressed with it. It’s needed.

Lee Kantor: Well, I appreciate that and I am so excited to learn about your practice. Tell us about The Body Can.

Randi Shannon: Well, I’m a traditional naturopathic doctor and what that means is I don’t prescribe drugs. I’m not doing any kind of minor surgeries. And I actually look at faces, fingernails and tongues. That’s 5000 year old original medicine. And that’s how they would look at somebody to try and figure out what was going on with the body. Why do they feel bad? And they would have them stick out their tongue, look at their fingernails, look at the face. I do it a little bit deeper than that, but every line, crack, crevice, spot, etc. means something. We’re either perfect or we got something going on. And that’s what I do is I check out what is the going on.

Lee Kantor: So what’s your backstory? How’d you get involved in this line of work? What got you interested in a 5000 year old A medicine practice rather than, you know, leaning into the newer things that are happening right now.

Randi Shannon: Well, you know, I was kind of a young mom. I’m 58 now, but when I was 21, I had my first son. So I literally had just turned 21. And I knew that I needed to be as healthy as I possibly could. I had one doctor in all of my years growing up that when he took the little popsicle stick, you know, the depressor holding down the tongue. Normally they’d always be looking at your tonsils or your throat. This one doctor that I was in there for an infection for this one doctor held it on the very tip of my tongue. He actually looked at my tongue. And then the series of questions he asked my mom in that were all very health related. He had me remove things out of the diet. My mom cut me off on certain things, and after that, I never had that kind of an infection ever again for the rest of my life. And, you know, like I mentioned, being a young mom, I knew I wanted everything to be healthy. And so that kind of took me down that road. And I had worked as a CNA certified nursing assistant when I was somewhere around 18. And of course, you get exposed to a lot there. And I saw the pills being pushed room after room after room. It literally never ended. And that’s all I saw. The RN’s do was go from room to room.

Randi Shannon: How are you? Have the pills ready and the little, little, uh, cup handed to them and off they went. Like I spent more time than the, than the registered nurses did. And I just got to speak to them and hear their hearts and hear their complaints and hear their joys and, um, see the diets and just see how they went downhill. So in my 40s, I went back to school and became a traditional naturopathic doctor. There is the licensed ones that go to the big schools like Bashir, etc. they do the surgeries, they take a year of pharmaceuticals. But I knew I never wanted that for my clients. And so, uh, the eastern medicine appealed far more to me. And I really didn’t find anybody that was that great at it. Um, but we did touch on it when I was in school and I found out that that was the place that I absolutely loved. And I just latched on to that and took it further, went and worked for, uh, various doctors around the country, one that did specialize in looking at the tongues. And then that was it. I just took it from there and went beyond. And so it’s been my career now, and I absolutely love it. My clients are in all 50 states, and now we just hit our 22nd country.

Lee Kantor: Now, you mentioned that, uh, some of this practices, um, I guess the insights have been around for thousands of years. What makes the face, tongue and fingernails, um, so useful for somebody like you that has the knowledge to understand them.

Randi Shannon: Yeah. Somebody years ago, obviously a long, long time ago, uh, figured out that every crack and and I don’t know what the magic was that that they were able to figure that out. But every crack, every line, you know, lines that appear up here, lines that appear here, uh, even things in the neck, in the ears, the back of the neck, um, on the body, all of those things were correlated with an organ or a system, whether it was circulatory, lymphatic, digestive, uh, cardiovascular, they all coordinate. Somebody figured it out. And what I have found is that it has been spot on. And I can look at somebody I’ve never met before, and I’ve done this many, many times. I can look at somebody that I don’t know any history, any background, and I can call out the organs in the systems that I see that are having issues. I don’t say you have cancer or you have an autoimmune or you have a heart disease. But what I do say is that I can see the heart has a few issues here. You know, I get a little bit more in depth with my clients, but I don’t call it out. And I do suggest, um, you know, when I see the signs, let’s say of a cancer or a heart disease, that they go get some blood work, that they get some testing done. So I do use the medical system, uh, that’s in place today. I just then help them combat whatever the issue is from a natural standpoint. And I’m always willing to work with their medical doctors. I’ve talked to plenty over the years that are happy to work with me because we’re doing it from the natural, whereas they’re doing it from the synthetic because every prescription is a synthetic.

Lee Kantor: So now, um, in today’s world, especially in America, what percentage of maybe health issues or challenges that an individual has is kind of self-inflicted because of poor nutrition or poor lifestyle.

Randi Shannon: Uh, pretty close to 100%, pretty close to 100%. Now, I will say we do have outside factors that we can’t help. Uh, for those that are aware of chemtrails, the planes fly, they dump, uh, enormous amounts of aluminum. Uh, the samples from the water and the soil have been, uh, tested positive for radium, barium, uh, things that are in nuclear weapons are getting dumped because they’re testing it. I don’t make this up. This is their test. Rfk is very well aware of it. He works with a group, uh, DeSantis, uh, Governor Ron DeSantis, uh, was very well aware of it. He banned it in Florida. Uh, but yet it’s still persists. And I really don’t understand why when something is banned, that it really isn’t banned, why it still happens. But they have tested this. So there’s a sector of society that’ll say, oh, it’s just air crap things coming off of planes. That’s normal. But then why do we have governors of Tennessee and Florida banning it? And we have a legislature that’s been introduced nationwide. So the naysayers that are out there debunking it, I mean, they they need to take it up with the government because it’s real. But, uh, water also very dirty. If I tested your zip code, for example, I’m probably going to find ten, 15, 25, sometimes 40 and 50 contaminants. And the result of all of those is cancer, thyroid problems, heart issues. So it’s, we have tons of contaminants. So people do have to fight to be healthy, there’s no doubt.

Lee Kantor: So what are.

Lee Kantor: Some low hanging fruit an individual can do? A listener can do right now? What are what are some things that a person that wants to take action can. Obviously. I mean, if things are in air and water, there’s. There’s only so much you can do. But what are some of the things that you can do to be proactive?

Randi Shannon: Um, I’m very clean on my water. If people want to know, like my systems that are more than welcome to reach out. But, uh, I’m very clear and clean on water. And by the way, I am with my four sons and their families as well. Uh, just making sure that everybody is on track, you know, stop going out and just getting random jabs in your arm that you don’t know what’s inside of them. Uh, you have to research every ingredient and see that there are side effects. Uh, and some of them are pretty detrimental. Um, stop sabotaging the diet. It’s not hard to do. Uh, I’m completely gluten free. Uh, I don’t eat any oils. I haven’t any oils in my diet for well over 30 years. Maybe. Yeah, probably 30, 30 plus years. No. And, and people will say, well, what about extra extra Virgin just got it from da da da. It’s all in the processing and that’s what makes the oils bad. So, um, in a nutshell, no wheat, barley, rye oatmeal, no buckwheat, uh, no fried foods, no foods cooked in any oils, no processed meats like lunch meats and salamis. Unless it’s very clear, uh, that it’s from a clean farmer and they are not putting nitrates or nitrites into that meat. They’ve got to stop doing, uh, buying that. If everybody would stop buying these things, then they would stop selling this garbage to the people.

Randi Shannon: Um, they mass produce, I would say support the local farmers that are doing it right. In Florida, we have, um, uh, uh, uh, I can’t think of his first name right now, but, uh, James Fishback running for governor, and he stated he will stop the madness on being able to drink raw milk. People just have to stop and pull back and realize they drank raw milk since the dawn of time. There’s nothing wrong with raw milk. There was a German study done on milk. They put cats, uh, in one room. These were all lab cats. They’d been raised, uh, there. So they were perfect. Nothing wrong with them. They had on one side. They fed them raw milk, and the other side they fed them pasteurized milk. And on the pasteurized side, they developed arthritis, arthritis. They stopped being playful. They became afraid of their own shadows. Um, they became lethargic from pasteurized milk. So hello, we need to listen to the studies and stop doing that to our families. And arthritis is a multi multibillion dollar operation just in America. And it’s, you know, it’s it’s meant to treat it the arthritis but not prevent it or cure it. Okay. So switching to raw helps you tremendously. And of course, you know, the farmers got to be clean and sanitary and all of that. But I would rather have that all day long over the pasteurized anything.

Lee Kantor: Now, how do you help your clients, um, when they’re just bombarded with so much information and it seems like, I don’t know, every few months there’s some new thing popping up. Like I think peptides is a hot, hot button right now. And, um, how do you help your clients kind of know what’s what and understand kind of the risk and reward for any of these new things that all of a sudden seem ubiquitous. You see them everywhere and you know you hadn’t heard of them, and all of a sudden now they’re everywhere.

Randi Shannon: Okay, so childhood jabs, all kinds of autism. You look at the Amish, they didn’t get the autism. Then you look at let’s just fast forward the lockdown time jabs, tons of side effects, cardiovascular issues, growths in the body, blocking the blood from even flowing. Uh, lots of things that were hidden from the public, which was very criminal. Uh, I was a Fox affiliate talk show host at the time that they did the lockdowns. The very month they did that, they removed my voice. And I’d been on radio for eight straight years, and they took my voice away. So they stopped people like me from actually being able to speak out. We were censored. So losing that platform and then the social media censored us. I mean, there should be lawsuits flying everywhere for that. Um, uh, then the I feel like the next fad was the ozempic. There’s over $2 billion in lawsuits going on right now. People have died. People barely on it, even for a matter of months, registered their bone density and it just went to their bones become porous and brittle. And I’m talking young people. So I have always said no to that, that it’s very experimental, that the people are the human guinea pigs. Um, you know, a lot of people, even in my field, jumped on that bandwagon because it was a big money train. You have to find people that aren’t motivated by the money. And I’m going to put my self to the test on your show regarding that today. Um, I have something I want to give away at the end of the show. And then the new fad is exactly what you said the peptides.

Randi Shannon: So again, it’s a fad FAD. If you’re the first one on the fad, you’re probably not going to do well. And I will tell you 64 people didn’t they died. And so, um, what they found is that when people started to get those, they were dying like three weeks later of cardiovascular issues. Okay. That’s how it appeared. So it wasn’t being, um, like all eyes weren’t on the peptides and ultimately down the road, what they ended up doing was taking 12 of those peptides. Anybody can search this. 12 of those peptides were removed off of the market because they found them to be deadly. So why do you want to be the first one racing in? So my take on the peptides, and I’m one of, I only know one other doctor, maybe two that are on, you know, the same side as me is no, do not race into that. There are no long term studies. You don’t know what all is in there. They say it’s a, you know, a copper peptide or whatever. I love copper, but I drink copper. Okay. So I have no side effect of that. I’m getting it in a mineral mix. They are injecting that, um, for, you know, beauty and this and that. You can drink it, you because you don’t have a mix of whatever else is in that concoction going into your body and into your bloodstream and every single organ in your body. I am completely against them completely for anything. Nobody can talk me into it at all at this point from the research that I have found.

Lee Kantor: Now, can we talk a little bit about your career? You mentioned, uh, kind of your journey a little bit, but if you were trying to help another, um, maybe somebody in medicine like you are grow a brand, are there some do’s and don’ts you’ve learned when it comes to growing a brand that you can share?

Randi Shannon: Yeah. I mean, mainly stay on track. Stay because I’ve learned that the hard way. Everything I talk about or teach, I’ve definitely gone down a wrong road or got it right, right out of the gate. But I would definitely stay on brand. Um, don’t sway to this or that. One of the tricks of social media is getting your page up to, let’s say on Instagram, about 3000 genuine followers do not pay any of these companies that, uh, say we’ll get you however many followers in a short amount of time, maybe a few months, whatever. Don’t buy into that. It’s all fake. All of it that I have found was totally fake. Um, you’re getting people from other countries. They’re never going to buy what you have. And they, they’re known to be fake. And so if you have 30,000 genuine followers, which means you need to engage your audience, you need to be putting out true content. Um, they love to see you. That’s what moves the fastest. They want to see you. They want to hear you talk and be real. That gets your followers up. And that’s what makes your videos go viral. And when you’re at 30,000 followers, you’ll have sponsors come out from all over the place. And so if you’re in the health field, for example, companies will come to you and ask you to do a little blurb on whatever their product is. And if you like it, then do it. If you don’t, don’t do it. We need to get back to being genuine and real.

Lee Kantor: So how do you how do you help somebody that’s just starting out build up to 30,000. If you’re saying that you can’t buy the help, how do you how do you grow from, you know, get that escape velocity to go from 0 to 30, 30 K?

Randi Shannon: Yeah. If you’re an expert in your field, whatever it is, in my particular case, face, tongue, fingernail analysis, uh, create videos, create reels, those move fast. And if you can do it in 15 seconds or less, those seem to move the fastest. Uh, it’s not that you can’t put longer form content in there, because I do think people will listen if you’re actually talking and, um, you know, sharing good information, but those quickie ones, people love to share them. They’ll send them to their friends. If it’s chock full of information, you do that enough and you can get your, your, your followers will go up naturally. And then from that, the sponsors come.

Lee Kantor: Now when a person is starting out and they don’t have it. So they. How often should they be posting these short, uh, reels? Is it.

Randi Shannon: There’s nothing wrong with a couple a day.

Lee Kantor: Oh, really? You can do just different content kind of relentlessly.

Randi Shannon: Yeah. And lives are good too. If, if they can actually hold an audience, uh, with whatever it is they’re saying, or maybe they’re showing something. Um, I’m constantly asked, hey, you know, Doctor Shannon, I’m coming to Miami. What’s the best restaurant? So I’ve heard it so many times because I’ve had, you know, Miami is such a great destination place. Uh, that I said the other day, I said, you know, I’m, I’m a foodie. I love to go to restaurants. I would maybe love to start taking, doing some video content at local restaurants and showing their menus and, um, showing the life here in Miami because it’s actually pretty fun. It’s pretty amazing. And some people have a, you know, bad connotation about it. So it’s just something that was talked about because I’m not, I’m not a one trick pony. Like I actually do have a lot of passions in life. Uh, and food is one of them. So that was just something that we talked about. So that’s a possibility where I could have longer content. Let’s say if I go to South Beach and I film South Beach as I’m walking through it and go to the go on the actual sand and show that that’s a little bit longer. I could do a live with that. And I think that, uh, people would engage and stick around. You know, I remember years ago that there was a, um, a live cam on some eagles that were in, I believe it was in Iowa and people all over the world would log in to see those eagles. And at any given time, they had 16, 17,000 people live even in the middle of the night. So live cams are also, uh, those were eagles. They, it was a pair that, uh, she laid the eggs and then they showed back and forth. You could see them bringing in rabbits and fish and stuff to feed the birds. One didn’t make it, one crowded out the other. And that kept the world engaged. And that was at a conservation, uh, center.

Lee Kantor: Now, I, I’d also like to talk a little bit about, um, a project that’s important to you and close to your heart, the Mary Preserve. Can you share why it’s so important for us to care about, um, honey bees and other pollinators?

Randi Shannon: Yes. Um, well, here in Miami, again, chemtrails were banned, but they still persist. And we don’t see honeybees down here. The bird population is woefully been depleted. Um, I did not see not one, not one firefly this year. Uh, we’ve barely seen any dragonflies, no ladybugs, nothing like our, our bug ecosystem. We as a population cannot live without that. They have so many jobs in the soil, on the trees and all the plants and so many preserve was something that has been on my mind for over 20 years. Uh, we actually started a little portion of it. We started, um, I’m going to say back in 2009 or 10, something called the food for Life Planting Foundation, we’ve just kind of rolled it into melee preserve. Melee means, uh, the honey in the Greek language. I looked at the top 4050 languages and melee was just the most beautiful word. I just felt like it really fit Florida, and I wanted something that had to do with the honey bee without actually saying honey bee. So it’s called Melee preserve. We are going to be opening up. The first location should be in Florida. We’re in the fundraising process for it right now. The website is Meli MELI preserve.org. Uh, you can see the site. It’s incredibly beautiful.

Randi Shannon: We are going to put in programs to help to save the pollinators. Number one, we’re going to grow tons and tons acres of wildflowers so that they actually have a food source that’s clean, heirloom, organic. And we’re also going to be a law enforcement holdover. And what that means is we always hear these stories about how an animal gets out on the highway, the interstate, uh, law enforcement. Nobody will come to get it. They have nothing that they can do. Uh, we just recently had a bull that got out, um, on our main interstate, the I-95 in Florida. It was hit in cars. It became a danger. Cars were now hitting cars because it was getting backed up over an hour. They had to take the bull down because they couldn’t get anybody to come get it. So we want to be a law enforcement holdover. We want to have rescued animals, abused animals, etc. we want to give them a sanctuary and, you know, hopefully rehabilitate them. And then, uh, you know, they find a good home if that’s possible. Otherwise we just and we’re going to basically, at the end of the day, my initial plan was to open this up in Florida and maybe one in Tennessee. I spoke with. I sat down a couple of months ago with a congressional award winner, and at the end of the conversation, she said, can I open one in Arizona? And that just made me think, we can do this everywhere.

Randi Shannon: We don’t have to just hold to these first two. So it’s a lot of funds that need to be raised. And we’re sitting down now with people that, you know, have bigger dollars that can donate to really help us. We don’t even have the land yet. So we are at square one and we’re looking for those people. And I’m willing to fly anywhere in this country where someone wants to put together a good size fundraiser and we’ll go. And we launched just this past weekend. I found an original artist. No, I don’t like all the AI stuff. We’ve, um, I hired her, she did the cover, the spine and the front cover of our new book, which is called The Language of Spices. It can be found on Amazon, The Language of spices and that book. When people buy that, a portion of those proceeds are going towards Mary Preserved. Now, this is a huge book, over 300 pages that I wrote myself. I started it over five years ago, and it is on medicinal spices, scripturally based, and it’s taking in my naturopathic point of view.

Randi Shannon: And I touch on animals as well, because there’s certain things that would kill an animal. And so we touched on that to, to make sure that they’re not feeding that to the animals. So that book, The Language of Spices, brand new on Amazon, helps to support Mary preserve.org. And, um, you know, I teach what I do as a naturopathic doctor. I teach the face, tongue and fingernail analysis. We have a master class for that. And all of that can be found at randishannon.com, RANDI shannon.com. Um, and also for your audience, excuse me, I need to grab a water here for your audience. I have what I call a tongue analysis. And that comes with three months of appointments where every month I relook at your tongue and it’s normally $695 and I am going to give it free completely. I am not charging my fee for that at all. For the first 100 people that call in to my toll free line. So I hope to be busy from that because that’s my heart in trying to get your population, your audience healthy, and hopefully it spreads far and wide so that 100 people do come to get that for free and we can help them get on track.

Lee Kantor: Um, so you want to share that 800 number?

Randi Shannon: Oh, yes. Uh, (844) 275-1056. And that is a $695 value for free.

Lee Kantor: And the website is thebodycam.com. And yeah, for the honeybees, it’s melipreserve.org.

Randi Shannon: Yes. Yep. That’s it.

Lee Kantor: Well, Randi, thank you so much for sharing your story today. You’re doing such important work and we appreciate you.

Randi Shannon: Thank you. Appreciate you and your platform and everybody that’s involved with it. And, and thank you and God bless you and God bless your listeners.

Lee Kantor: All right. This is Lee Kantor. We’ll see you all next time on High Velocity Radio.

From Chaos to Clarity: Mastering the Stage 3 Growth Challenge

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High Velocity Radio
High Velocity Radio
From Chaos to Clarity: Mastering the Stage 3 Growth Challenge
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In this episode of High Velocity Radio, Lee Kantor interviews Rob Young, Founder and Principal of Stage 3 Group, about helping growing businesses navigate the challenges that emerge beyond the startup phase. Rob explains his Stage 3 framework, the importance of understanding business finances, creating effective systems, monitoring key metrics, and developing practical operating rhythms. He also shares how business owners can move from being overwhelmed by day-to-day chaos to becoming more strategic and effective leaders.

Rob Young spent two decades as a senior executive, working in leadership roles in companies ranging from a startup to a global corporation. After burning out on 80-hour workweeks, too much travel, and office politics, he left the corporate world.

An accomplished DIY-er, he had always loved historic architecture and working with his hands. After leaving corporate, he spent several years purchasing and renovating historic homes. When he hired contractors to work on his projects, it was with the agreement that they would let him work as part of the crew and teach him how to be a better craftsman. He was not just the investor; he was part of the construction team.

The contractors and tradespeople he worked with were smart, skilled, and deeply committed to their craft. But not one of them had been trained to run a business. As their businesses grew, their lack of training showed. Some got buried in decisions they did not know how to make.

Others made bad financial choices because they did not understand their numbers. Still others were simply overwhelmed by the day-to-day challenges of running a business. Several failed – not because they were bad at their craft or could not attract good customers, but because no one had given them the tools to manage a growing company.

Watching people he cared about lose their businesses turned into a mission for him. Through his writing, training, and advising, he makes corporate-level best practices accessible for small businesses. His goal is simple: to make sure that no owner loses the business they have built.

Rob is founder and principal at Stage 3 Group, where he helps business owners build the foundation and implement the playbook they were never trained to use. He’s the author of Stage 3 Success, a business trainer, and a frequent guest on podcasts.

Connect with Rob on LinkedIn.

What You’ll Learn In This Episode

  • Understanding the five stages of the business life cycle and the challenges of Stage 3 growth
  • Recognizing the warning signs that a growing business is becoming chaotic
  • Balancing product making, customer getting, and navigating within a business
  • Building financial literacy around profit, cash flow, balance sheets, and P&L statements
  • Using business plans and budgets as guides for decision-making
  • Creating systems, processes, meetings, and operational rhythms that support growth
  • Learning to delegate without abdicating responsibility
  • Identifying the best and highest use of an owner’s time, talent, and energy
  • Using assessments to identify business weaknesses and create a practical growth pathway
  • Keeping strategic plans updated as market conditions and technologies such as AI evolve
  • Moving from overwhelmed business owner to confident, strategic leader
  • Implementing plans instead of simply creating documents that sit on a shelf

Transcript-iconThis transcript is machine transcribed by Sonix.

 

TRANSCRIPT

Intro: Broadcasting live from the Business RadioX Studios in Atlanta, Georgia. It’s time for High Velocity Radio.

Lee Kantor: Lee Kantor here another episode of High Velocity Radio and this is gonna be a good one. But before we get started, it’s important to recognize our sponsor, Business RadioX. If you’re a business coach who’s tired of being a best kept secret, set up a call with Stone Payton at book Stone Payton dot com to unlock your perpetual prospect pipeline. Today on this show, we have the Founder Principal with Stage 3 Group, Rob Young. Welcome.

Rob Young: Thank you. Thanks for giving me the chance to be here.

Lee Kantor: Well, I am excited to learn what you’re up to. Tell us about Stage 3 Group. How are you serving folks?

Rob Young: So our focus is on companies that are either trying to enter or struggling to get through the third stage of the business life cycle. So typically they are beyond the startup phase. They’ve grown to the point that they’re experiencing the challenges of growth, and that’s our focus. And so we do that in a couple of ways. Some companies engage us for or kind of part time coo work. So fractional COO work. Others just have a couple of issues they need to wrestle through. And so we put together a framework and help them through that.

Lee Kantor: So what’s your back story? You know what, what did you do to get you where you are right now?

Rob Young: So I do not have the typical business pedigree. I did undergraduate degrees in theology and philosophy, anticipated getting a PhD and teaching philosophy at a small college somewhere. And the deeper I got into it, I thought, this is not something I want to do. The rest of my life had taken a couple of business and econ courses in college and just kind of stumbled into a business career. And so fortunately, I worked for companies that invested in my growth, eventually made it up to the senior executive level, and I liked it until I didn’t like it anymore. I got burned out on working 80 hours per week as a lifestyle. A lot of travel politics and all of that. And I wasn’t sure what I wanted to do, but I knew I couldn’t do that anymore. So I left that. And I’ve always loved construction. I’ve always loved working with my hands. And for a while, probably about eight years, I renovated historic houses in Cincinnati, which is where I was living at the time. And in the process, I worked side by side with a lot of great contractors and tradespeople and enjoyed those days. They were blast working with those people, but they had never been trained around a business. And so I watched a lot of them crash and burn, and I watched them lose their businesses because they had never been trained to run a business. So that was the catalyst for this. I thought I could leverage my business background to help people that I really admired, really enjoyed working with, could use my business background to help them stabilize their businesses. So that’s what I got started.

Lee Kantor: So now how did the the stage three framework come about? What was that something you created or is that something somebody taught you?

Rob Young: Uh, it’s something I created. And so it came about slowly. I started off initially, my company was called Contractor Success Hub and worked exclusively with Remodelers and people in the trades. Um, eventually I grew beyond that. My wife said, hey, what you’re doing is applicable outside of residential remodeling. Why don’t you consider expanding? And then concurrent with that, in a two week period, I had six business owners, a couple of clients, and then a few people who were just in my network all said this exact phrase to me. I don’t know how to run my business. And it was usually preceded with something like, I know how to remodel a house. I don’t know how to run my business. I know how to develop killer software. I don’t know how to run my business. And eventually I thought, well, I should ask them what they mean by that. And so I started asking people, when you tell me you don’t know how to run your business, what are you struggling with? And it was basic blocking and tackling stuff. I don’t know what information I need to be looking at.

Rob Young: Where do I find it? What’s it telling me? What do I do with it? People had financial questions. They didn’t understand what their financial statements were telling them. If they produced financial statements at all, they didn’t know how to tell if they had money. So I can log into my bank account and see where I am today. How do I know if that’s going to be able to meet my needs next week or next month, and so forth? People didn’t know how to spend their days and allocate their time. So a lot of basic blocking and tackling. And so I finally thought I should write a couple of blog posts about this or giving me good material. And I started to answer those questions one by one. Again, a degree in philosophy. What are philosophy majors do? We’re taught to think and write. And so at the end of the first day, I had 30 pages and I was surprised I had produced so much content, but I just kept going. It resulted in a book, and that is where the framework is laid out.

Lee Kantor: And then so can you go through the different stages? Are there just three stages for most businesses?

Rob Young: No, technically I think there are five. The fifth one is decline and death, so I’ll ignore that. Well, the first one is startup. And so at that point you’re simply trying to prove the viability of your business, trying to prove that you have a product or service that can work. Uh, stage two, I refer to that as early childhood. And so you’ve proven that there’s a need for your product. You’re trying to get your first few customers, or maybe you have your first few customers. You may have made your first several hires. And typically people are wearing multiple hats. Sometimes people are doing jobs that they have no business doing, but you don’t have the ability to bring in specialists. Eventually you get to stage four, which is mature, productive, adult. You have proven your product or service. Uh, you have a team in place with people who are qualified to do what they’re tasked with doing. And I refer to that as adulthood. So what I tell people is I help business owners, usually who’ve never been trained to run a business, grow their company from unruly teenager to mature, productive adult. And so really, the big issue with stage three is just trying to get everything done and dealing with the challenges of growth. Because what happens if your company is growing and you’re not equipped to handle it? It’s going to exploit every weakness and expose every weakness in the business. And so the way my, my framework for the business is, I think, intuitive.

Rob Young: And I think that whether you are a one person startup, whether you are a fortune 500 company, all businesses have three essential functions. I call them product making. So producing the product or service that you sell. Customer getting, which is sales and everything upstream of sales. And then navigating is the third function. And that’s essentially running the business. And that is a very broad thing. It could be accounting and finance could be strategy, HR operations, all of those things. And if you think about the typical business owner, why do people start a business? Well, most of the time it’s really it’s related somehow to the craft. They want to practice the craft the way they want to practice the craft. Maybe they had lifestyle ambitions. They thought they could make more money as a business owner and so forth. So typically it’s related to the craft. They’re good at the product making component of the business. Most of the business owners I’ve worked with are pretty good at selling as well. So they have two of the three functions covered, but they’ve never been trained and trained in the navigating portion. They don’t know how to run a business, and that’s okay until the business starts to grow. But that’s where we come. Uh, people have grown their business to the point where the navigating becomes overwhelming and they can’t ignore it anymore.

Lee Kantor: So now it’s possible, I guess, uh, to grow a successful business just through stage two, just because you’re good at delivering whatever that, uh, solution to whatever problem that you decided to pursue.

Rob Young: Correct. And I’ve seen that a lot.

Lee Kantor: And then this is for folks who want to then take it to the next level, maybe, um, scale or franchise or, or grow beyond kind of, um, you know, the, I guess the plateau that eventually comes when you’re just at that stage two.

Rob Young: Correct. And they may not have huge ambitions for growing a big company, but at some point they’ve grown big enough that it becomes chaotic. So chaos is a big indicator that a company could use some help.

Lee Kantor: So what does chaos look like for that person that might have hit this plateau and is in between stage two and stage three? What are some of the signs and signals that say, hey, maybe I need some help right now?

Rob Young: Yeah, for the owner, it’s getting drawn into all kinds of different parts of the business and being the one through whom every decision has to go. So they’re involved in the product, they’re involved in sales, they’re trying to keep up with accounting and finance, trying to get their taxes filed on time, all of those things. So it’s really a point where nothing is working smoothly. Everything seems to be a problem. A big indicator for me is their meetings are the same week after week after week. They’re talking about the same problems over and over again, and they’re not really gaining any resolution on them. So those are big indicators that we see.

Lee Kantor: So that all sounds kind of operational. Is that at the heart of kind of in order to jump to stage three, you really have to get the operational side of your business, um, executing pretty smoothly.

Rob Young: Yeah. I think there are three things. And so in the book, I say that if you are a business owner or you’re leading a business, there are things you need to know. There are things you need to monitor and things you need to do. So there are a lot of books out there. One of the ways I think stage three success is different is that we start with the fundamentals again, Less than one third of people who own a business have ever been trained to run a business at all, or had any sort of business training. So I believe that there’s some foundational work. I think every company should have a business plan, every company should have a budget. And I think those things are important for two reasons. First of all, they’re going to tell you what to do, but probably more important, they’re going to tell you what not to do. And so companies are given good opportunities all the time. How do they know whether they can pursue that opportunity? Well, they should refer to their business plan and their budget. Those are kind of the true north of the business. I’ve also found business owners who are leading very successful, very profitable businesses. They don’t really understand their finances. And so we spend some time training on that. Uh, I want people to understand what they’re supposed to be seeing in their balance sheet and in their cash flow statement and in their profit and loss statement.

Rob Young: So those are the foundational things. Those are the things that I think every business owner or business leader needs to know. Then we jump more to the operational things. And so I refer to the financial statements as the report card of the business. I kind of nerdy in high school and college grades were very important to me, and I never waited until grades came out. The final grades came out to understand what I was doing. I checked scores all along quiz scores, test scores, you know, whatever scores we had that went into the final grade. I monitored those things all along, and if something wasn’t where I wanted it to be, then I could intervene. And so the second element then is monitoring. As a business owner leader, what do you need to monitor? So that’s where the operational side comes in. We put systems in place to help companies monitor the. Things will eventually lead to the grades they see in their financial statements. And then the final thing is what do you need to do? And so that’s where we draw out daily and weekly rhythms that the company needs to have. We have a list of suggested meetings and suggested content for those meetings. All very flexible. People can change them to meet their needs. We talk about managing time and energy, which I think go together. So it’s very practical, hands on basic things that we help companies implement now.

Lee Kantor: Do you find that, um, some founders, like for example, you mentioned the financial side of things in their mind. They have a CPA or bookkeeper combination. And in their mind, do they think, okay, that’s their job because I’m here solving the problem of my clients and they’re in charge of, you know, helping me make proper financial decisions because I’ve delegated that to them. Or I have an admin that’s kind of in charge of my operation. So I’ve, I’ve delegated that to them and that my job is to kind of keep the boat going forward. Um, and that you’re saying that they have to have a more hands on, holistic view of the entire operation in order to kind of navigate through the stage three.

Rob Young: It doesn’t necessarily have to be hands on. I think that in a lot of cases, it would be a waste to have the owner do the hands on work. What I have found is that for most emerging businesses, the owner’s talent in their craft tends to be the secret sauce for the business. They’re wired to do that. They’re gifted to do that. That’s what they like to do. But they can’t throw off the fact that they are business owners. And so the report card for a business is in financial statements. They need to have at least basic literacy in those things. So no, I think it would be a waste to have an owner in most cases, spending time doing debits and credits, but they need to be able to understand what their CPA is telling them. They need to understand the implications of it. I say that there are stories that are always hidden in the numbers in a business. They need to understand what those stories are and how to use them for the benefit of the business.

Lee Kantor: So they have to delegate. They just can’t abdicate.

Rob Young: Correct. Yeah. That’s well stated. Yeah. So I use a term called Bihu which stands for best and highest use. And so I say for the owner and really for everyone in every department throughout the organization, consider what is the best and highest use of their time, their talent, their wiring and so forth. And so typically, Bihu for an owner is not spending a lot of time in the actual accounting transactions.

Lee Kantor: So now if you were going to give advice to a business owner right now that’s struggling, is there any low hanging fruit, like what’s kind of their first moves they should be making if they want to kind of shore some of this up?

Rob Young: Yeah. And I don’t know that there’s a one size fits all. I think that if you look at any business, you can break it down into two things that need to happen. A business in order to be successful needs to be profitable and it needs to generate cash. So profitable, you have to be able to produce and sell your product for more money than it, than it costs you to deliver. You also have to generate cash. You could be incredibly profitable, but if you’re not bringing the actual money into the business and you’re not controlling your spending, you can still go under. So those are the things we look at. Um, we have an assessment that we offer and it breaks the business into ten distinct areas. It takes about five minutes to complete. And what we do when we start working with a client is we look for any crises. I’ve had business owners come to me and say, Rob, I have no idea how I’m going to make payroll next week. That’s pretty urgent issue. So we address those things, but then we work with the results of the assessment and we have a discussion like where do you want to be? Here’s where you are currently. And we create a pathway to do that. But yeah, bottom line of everything is if you’re producing a profit and you’re generating cash, you can be successful.

Lee Kantor: Now when you’re working with a client, is your work kind of at the coaching level or the consulting level. Are you rolling up your sleeves and doing work, or are you making recommendations to the leader to do certain things?

Rob Young: Yeah, it depends on the the company that we’re working with. And I don’t want to offend anyone, but almost every client I’ve worked with has previously had a coach, and they did not receive the value that they hoped to get out of that. And so how that plays out is if you’re struggling with your business and you’re overwhelmed, you can’t get everything done, what do you do? Well, you reach out to a coach. A lot of the clients I’ve worked with are coaching experience looked like this. They reached out to a coach. The coach probably had really good ideas and really good intentions, but they just handed it off to the business owner and said, here you go, do this, do that. Well, they had to keep the business running and they were already overwhelmed by that. So when those are the dynamics, coaching doesn’t work. So coaching is part of what we do. But really we jump in the trenches and we help get stuff done. And so for instance, if you need a business plan or a budget or to document SOPs. Or if you need an employee handbook, we will help create those things for the client. We don’t just hand them off. In some cases, we have clients who are a little bit larger, more mature. They have a lot of things in place, and they really just need someone to bounce ideas off with so we can do that. And that would be just a coaching agreement. But yeah, it really just depends on the nature of the business and what they’re struggling with.

Lee Kantor: So you work with businesses. They may not necessarily be at stage three. You work at them at at any stage they’re in.

Rob Young: Yeah. If we’re going to do consulting and coaching, we want those to be in the third stage of the life cycle or at least transitioning into that. Now we have tools. So again, not to keep harping on the book, but I created the book. And then there are software that we have created that’s available to anyone. And so if you have no idea how to create a business plan, we have software that will walk people right through that. At the end of that, they’ll have a business plan, likewise a budget and so forth. Um, so yeah, the tools will work with anyone. We will provide guidance. We’re not just going to hand those off, but we typically don’t do the day to day deep dive engagement with earlier stage companies.

Lee Kantor: And then so once they have a product, it’s proven they have. So they’ve sold some things to some people, then they’re kind of ready for you.

Rob Young: Correct. Yeah. If they’re starting to grow.

Lee Kantor: And then at that point, what so is your recommendation first read the book. So you kind of understand what the playbook is going to be moving forward. But then once they’ve done that, what is kind of there’s, I guess, a discovery period where you’re trying to analyze because you make them go through some sort of an assessment to at least understand, um, somewhat where they’re at.

Rob Young: Correct. Yeah. I’m happy to sell books, but that’s not a requirement. You know, if people find the book and they find value in it, great. But we will work with people otherwise. So the assessment is for both of us to get a common understanding of what the real issues are, and then we build a plan for that. And so one of the questions I ask clients is, if I had a magic wand and, you know, poof, I could make your business what you want it to be, what would it look like? And then we take that into focus. We also look at the realities of where they are, and we reverse engineer a plan to help them get there.

Lee Kantor: And then you help them actually implement the plan. It’s not like here’s a plan that you can put on a bookshelf that, you know, next to the other plan you did five years ago.

Rob Young: Correct. Correct. Yeah. And it’s funny because you may have experienced this as well, but a lot of people just have bad taste in their mouth over business plans. People have created them to qualify for a loan or they thought it was necessary. But the plan has really been a waste of time. It’s not guiding any sort of behavior or decision making process. We cut through all of that. When I first started doing this, I made the mistake of wanting my clients to build complex 40 page business plans. No one ever did. And initially, I was kind of ticked at my clients until I realized like, no, that’s my issue. A business plan doesn’t need to be that complex. Um, what I’m really looking for, in addition to some of the other fundamental things, you know, what are the financial projections, what are the operating projections, projections and so forth. Really, for me, a business plan is defining viability, which is identifying the problem your business seeks to solve. And then what is the need for that in the marketplace and how much, you know, how many people have that problem and are willing to pay for your solution. That’s the heart of it for us.

Lee Kantor: And then for the folks who have maybe some scar tissue with previous plans that, um, I mean, I guess a contrarian argument would be that, look, things change so much. I mean, if I had a plan three years ago that didn’t include AI, you know, this plan isn’t useful anymore.

Rob Young: Correct. Yeah. So that’s the beauty of the software. It includes a Swot analysis. And so Swot, I assume your listeners know what that is in case you’re not. It’s strengths weaknesses, opportunities and threats. And so strengths and weaknesses are internal to the company. And then opportunities and threats are things outside of the company. And so we require in the business plan for the user to do a Swot analysis, but not only to identify those things, but say, what does that mean to the business? And so your example of AI. Absolutely. Yeah. That is both an opportunity and a threat that’s outside of the business. Um, I’ve been affected by that in my business as well. So the plan is updatable. I am an advocate of looking at your strategic plan or your, your business plan at least once per year for exactly that reason. Things change that we never could have anticipated.

Lee Kantor: Well, like in the case of AI, I mean, it might be an opportunity and it might be a threat, but it also impacts your strengths and weaknesses. I mean, sure, so it’s something that’s going to permeate throughout the entire analysis of the of the business.

Rob Young: Right? Well, as an example of that, over the years, I’ve developed what we’re pretty sophisticated financial analysis tools all using Excel. And I would love to be able to market those and make those available to the market. But if you know, Excel, like I don’t care how well you password protect your your spreadsheets, there are ways around that. And there’s no way to protect my intellectual property with that. So I approached a software development company about converting this into actual software. And they said, we can do that, and it’s going to be $250,000. Well, there was no way I was going to pay that money. And so with AI, having grown up in software, um, professionally, I’ve been able to create that tool myself. So great opportunity. And it gave me a strength within the organization. Um, where the weakness or where the threat comes into play. I received notice last week that the software or the AI platform I’d been using to develop the software was not going to be available anymore. Like, I couldn’t have anticipated either of those things a year ago. So yeah, we’re constantly, we recommend reviewing those things on a, on a constant basis.

Lee Kantor: Now, is there an example you can share about what it’s like to work with you don’t name the organization or the individual, but maybe share the challenge they came to you with and how you were able to help them get to a new level.

Rob Young: Sure. And I’ve had it all over the map. So I’ve literally that story I shared earlier about someone comes to me and says, I have no idea how I’m going to make payroll in two weeks. That literally happened. And honestly, that’s pretty scary for me. Uh, but we’ve had that. We’ve had other people who’ve been around and are just overwhelmed. What I have found, um, is that in a lot of cases, you have people who are very competent in the craft of the business. That’s why they started it. They’re good at sales and the navigating is a challenge. What I have found is that a lot of people experience shame related to that, and if their business is struggling, they’re kind of embarrassed to admit it. And I think, no, no, no, no, you’ve never been trained to do this. I couldn’t build a house like you do. So we have to deal with some of that. We deal with the imposter syndrome. But again, we look at where they want to be, where they are, and we reverse engineer that. So we’ve we’ve had some clients who’ve done very well. And honestly, it’s a lot of fun. Um, and I think I mentioned earlier, we have a couple of ways that we can engage. If they just have a couple of issues they want to work through, we can do that. We’ll put together a proposal for that. Some people have said, hey, we’d really like to engage you as a fractional COO and we’ve done that. Um, so I don’t know if that answers your question or your, your.

Lee Kantor: Well, I was just trying to get to a specific, um, maybe story that was meaningful to you, like a, a, an organization, like you mentioned, they could have been struggling to meet payroll, but then now they’ve franchised or, you know, something that is a specific anecdote that shows what it’s like to work with you and your team so that, um, our listeners can understand what’s possible.

Rob Young: Sure. Yeah. So I work with a super high end custom builder in central Ohio. Fantastic, fantastic person. He has more passion for building and building science than anyone I’ve met. We started working together about a year and a half ago, and he thought he was going to close the doors. He had hired some family members, which I think is a big mistake. But he had they weren’t producing. Uh, he was struggling with clients because he was put in a position of weakness because he didn’t have the ability to find the numbers he needed to report to them, just all kinds of operational things. And he was very discouraged and thought about closing shop. So we helped him replace some people who needed to be replaced in the organization, put systems and processes in place, helped make visibility to project data more accessible to him, to the company, and probably more important to the clients. He’s regained his passion. He’s actually started an ancillary business to go with that. So those things are a lot of fun when we get to do that. And we’re fortunate to see some good results from our work.

Lee Kantor: Now, how has writing the book impacted your coaching and consulting? Did it, um, change any of your thinking about your business?

Rob Young: Um, it did so initially, like I said, I never intended to write it. It just came together. But it’s given me a solid framework that I can point to. And so we have a playbook. I believe it’s important for us. Uh, whereas before we might approach projects a little bit differently. We’re still flexible, but we make sure that we work within this defined framework that is outlined in the book. And the benefit of that is that if the customer chooses to get the book, they can work through it themselves and they know where we’re going.

Lee Kantor: Now, um, you mentioned kind of some of your work, um, with the construction industry and things like that. Is that kind of the area that you have the most depth of knowledge in or is at this stage you kind of industry agnostic in terms of a sweet spot in the types of businesses you can help. Like, can you help service based organizations or nonprofits? Does it matter anymore?

Rob Young: Um, it really doesn’t. So I have a lot of domain knowledge in construction just because I worked in that myself for a while. Um, but the whole purpose of the book is to provide general business knowledge. So I, I classify knowledge within a business in two things. There’s general business knowledge, understanding the foundations, understanding operations, financials, all of that. And then there’s domain knowledge, which is the technical knowledge within the business. How do you build a house? How do you develop software? How do you provide therapy? I’ve had architects, I’ve had therapists. I’ve had people in a wide range of industries. So yeah, our work is really industry agnostic.

Lee Kantor: So if somebody wants to learn more, have a more substantive conversation with you or somebody on the team or get a hold of your book, is there a website? What’s the best way to connect?

Rob Young: Yeah, the best way to connect would be to go to the website, which is stage3group.com. So it’s stage number three, group.com. I can find out all kinds of information. There’s a link to the book which is sold on Amazon. And then there’s the free assessment. So that assessment anyone can take it. There’s no pressure. We collect some data, but it’s not hard marketing. We do after that. But yeah, if people are just curious about how they might score in different areas of the business, they can do that on their own.

Lee Kantor: And then if you do the assessment, what’s what happens with that? Like, what do I get for doing the assessment? What am I going to learn?

Rob Young: So you’ll go through 50 questions and then it produces a graph and it breaks the your scores down into ten different categories. And it could be financial performance, leadership, uh, business operations and continuity, um, and so forth. So ten different areas puts it in a spider graph. And then it will outline specific areas within each of those categories based on your responses to the questions. And we’ll show you some things that you might need to pay immediate attention to other things where you’re doing really well.

Lee Kantor: Good stuff. Well, Rob, thank you so much for sharing your story today. You’re doing such important work and we appreciate you.

Rob Young: I really have a passion for helping small businesses. It’s it’s a lot of fun.

Lee Kantor: All right. This is Lee Kantor. We’ll see you all next time on High Velocity Radio.

Make Them Remember You: The Neuroscience of Unforgettable Business

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High Velocity Radio
High Velocity Radio
Make Them Remember You: The Neuroscience of Unforgettable Business
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In this episode of High Velocity Radio, Lee Kantor interviews Thomas Trautmann, the “Brain Guy” behind Happy Brains, about using neuroscience and ethical persuasion to help business owners and executives become unforgettable to their ideal clients. Thomas explains how understanding the brain, focusing communication on the other person, using “you language,” practicing silent listening, and telling compelling stories can build trust and create stronger business connections.

Dr. Thomas Trautmann is a neuroscientist, executive coach, author and speaker dedicated to making business owners unforgettable. As the founder of Happy Brains, he deploys the Science of Ethical Persuasion to transform lives and businesses, building communities that thrive on mutual growth and success.

With a Ph.D. in artificial intelligence and an engineering degree in computer science, he built his early career inside some of the world’s most demanding organisations: IBM, HP, AOL, Bosch and Steelcase. He did not learn business from a classroom. He learned it from inside revenue targets, product launches and enterprise sales cycles that forgave nothing.

As a former Certified Neuromarketing Instructor, he spent years deploying cutting-edge brain science in service of corporate marketing machines. He was good at it. He was also uncomfortable with it. NeuroMarketing optimises for the company’s result at the expense of the individual in the room. That discomfort became the Ethical Persuader System: the only framework designed to get the decision you want from someone while ensuring they experience it as entirely their own.

Central to Thomas’s work is the conviction that you cannot make yourself great by trying to make yourself great. You make yourself great by making your clients great. This is not a philosophy. It is neuroscience. The brain responds to contribution before it responds to acquisition. The Make Me Great! system is built on that sequence.

As a 10X Certified Business Coach with Grant Cardone, he combines the neuroscience of decision-making with Cardone’s expertise in money mindset, marketing and sales. The combination produces something neither alone could: clients who understand why they buy, how to make others want to buy from them, and how relentlessly to pursue the growth they deserve.

He lives in the south of France with his wife and three children. He has two marriages, one divorce, and a career built on understanding the exact same pressures his clients face. He is not advising from a distance. He is the client. That makes him the only coach in this space who can say so honestly.

Connect with Thomas on LinkedIn and follow Happy Brains on Facebook.

What You’ll Learn In This Episode

  • Making a memorable first impression in seconds
  • Understanding how the brain influences business decisions
  • Using ethical persuasion to create genuine connections
  • Shifting communication from “me” language to “you” language
  • Practicing silent listening to better understand clients
  • Connecting with clients through relevant stories and questions
  • Identifying subconscious frustrations that influence decisions
  • Building a communication toolbox tailored to different audiences
  • Using neuroscience principles to strengthen sales and marketing

Transcript-iconThis transcript is machine transcribed by Sonix.

 

TRANSCRIPT

Intro: Broadcasting live from the Business RadioX Studios in Atlanta, Georgia. It’s time for High Velocity Radio.

Lee Kantor: Lee Kantor here another episode of High Velocity Radio and this is gonna be a good one. But before we get started, it’s important to recognize our sponsor, Business RadioX. If you’re a business coach or consultant who’s tired of being a best kept secret, set up a call with Stone Payton at brookstone.com to unlock your perpetual prospect pipeline. Today on the show, we have the brain guy with Happy Brains, Thomas Trautmann. Welcome.

Thomas Trautmann: Thank you, thank you. Happy to be here.

Lee Kantor: Well, I am happy that you are. Please tell us about Happy Brains. How are you serving folks?

Thomas Trautmann: So what we do at Happy Brains is that we make business owners and high level executives Unforgettable in 11 seconds by speaking to the decision makers.

Lee Kantor: Brain 11 seconds you time this. How did you figure out 11 seconds? Not 10 or 12 or five.

Thomas Trautmann: It’s. It’s some brain stuff. It’s. I’m not the guy who made this up, okay? I’m the guy who buys it and makes it usable for users. But there are different steps where the first the brain is going to assess if it’s going to like you or not define your status and if it wants to listen to you.

Lee Kantor: So how do you manage those 11 seconds in order to become unforgettable?

Thomas Trautmann: That’s exactly what we explain our clients. So you start by, yeah, five steps in the system, which is called Make Me great. So the first one is to know who you are. If I ask you who you are, if you tell me, well, I’m Lee, I’m sorry. There are many guys who are called Lee, their family name, same thing, etc. etc.. What makes you unique? Who are you? So people can listeners can start thinking about that. Who are you? What makes you unique? So that’s going to be to, to show through how you behave. That brain in front of you is going to assess how you smile. If you’re smiling, not smiling, what are the microexpressions you have on your face before you open your mouth? And then when you speak? Is it all about you or is it about me, the brain listening to you? Because that brain shouts and screams at you make me great.

Lee Kantor: Now what do you do? Like I’ve interviewed in the past, there’s a company in America called chick fil A. Are you familiar with that? No. Okay. It’s a it’s a restaurant. Fast food, quick service restaurant chain that sells primarily chicken sandwiches. Okay. And there’s they’re usually rated in America as one of the top, if not the top fast food restaurant in America. And they’re based here in Atlanta where I am. And I’ve had the opportunity to interview some of the leadership there. And one of the things that they told me that struck me, and it kind of aligns with what you’re saying is they only hire people who are natural smilers. So when they’re interviewing people in a fast food restaurant to work there, if you’re a natural smiler, you’re you got a big edge because they feel that they can’t train smiling effectively. What’s your take on that? Because you mentioned, uh, that’s one of the things that people are assessing in that first 11 seconds.

Thomas Trautmann: Well, you know that there are a lot of steps, but it takes the brain in front of you when you are face to face, okay, in a, in a face to face situation. 0.3 seconds to decide if it’s going to like you or not. So as you said, it’s very difficult to fake to, to sorry to have a real smile when you try to fake it. Politicians are very good at faking smiles and you can see it. I mean, if you see any of their of their of their, the pictures they are showing, etc., they’re sharing when they do some advertising. And so You see, it’s a fake smile, you know? But when you do, the real smile with the little wrinkles on the side of the eyes, which are called the Duchenne wrinkles, when you do that nice smile, genuine smile, you give your brain a shot of endorphin. It makes your brain happy, and the brain’s in front of you are going to get the same shot because of based on the mirror neuron theory, the same brains that are active in my brains are activated in your brain, even if you don’t do the same thing. So you also get a good shot of endorphins. So people who are smiling definitely win the race because they make the brain in front of them feel great. So I mean, that chicken feed, I think they are absolutely right on that one.

Lee Kantor: Now when you’re working with your clients, how do you help them be authentically and ethically? Themselves in order for them to get the outcome they desire and not use kind of some of these neuro. Um, I don’t know what you call them, uh, neuroscience tactics. Uh, you know, you want them to use it as a force for good and not to kind of, uh, unethically manipulate people to, for, for a bad outcome.

Thomas Trautmann: Yeah, yeah. That’s why the, the core element of the make me great system of everything I do is called the ethical persuasion system or the ethical persuasion formula. And it’s called ethical because it’s based on how the human brain makes decisions. The, the one thing that triggers a decision. There are many other ones, but the primal one is called a subconscious frustration. We have many subconscious frustrations, okay? We make decisions with something called the primal brain. The lower the lower part of our brain, which stopped evolving around 50,000, 100,000 years ago. So it’s a pure survival tool and it takes care of only 1 in 1 person on earth itself. So when you show to that brain that in relation with the decision you want from that person, that you know, the subconscious frustration and that you may be the one who is going to remove that subconscious frustration. That’s why you are ethical, because you get a decision you want and they make the decision they need. So that’s why you are ethical. You can of course use manipulation, influence techniques. And I mean, there are many out there. Many websites do use them, you know, uh, air travel, uh, companies are very good at it’s the last seat at 20 bucks. Then the next one is at 200 bucks. When you come two hours later, the the seat is still there. So stuff like that is manipulation and the brain goes for it because it loves to to win something. But if you do it properly, then you’re ethical. And that’s how you become unforgettable because then you’re going to stick inside that brain because you have showed the brain that in fact, you care to make it great.

Lee Kantor: Now, um, when you’re doing your work, what is kind of the challenge your clients are having right before they hire you? What is, how does this show up on somebody that they may need some help and counsel in this area? What are their signals or their things that are happening in their life or in their business that says, you know what, I should probably call Thomas and his team?

Thomas Trautmann: Yeah, it’s definitely when you are the best offer in the room, for example, and it’s always someone else who gets the deal or you are working your whatever off, you know, like crazy. And it’s always that guy who does nothing, who gets the promotion or, uh, the, the person you would like to spend your life with is leaving you and so on because something is wrong. So all those things are signals, you know, or your team is listening to you, but they are Speak, talking in your back and they are leaving the company, so something is off. And each time you want to win a deal, the client asks you for a rebate for a longer test, time for more samples and so on. That typically shows that you are trying to be rational, when in fact the brain in front of you makes primal decisions. We rationalize afterwards that has been scientifically demonstrated. There is even a guy who got a Nobel Prize for that. Unfortunately, 97% of people on earth still think that we make rational decisions when in fact we make private decisions that we rationalize afterwards. And everyone who wants to get more decisions made and become unforgettable should call me.

Lee Kantor: So what are some of the ways, like you mentioned, that, um, I guess intellectually people think that, oh, I just have to have all this proof and evidence and facts and that, and then I will, um, be successful. But I hear you saying that that is not that’s secondary. That first you have to kind of become unforgettable and trustworthy and believable and likable, and then the other stuff will come later just to justify their decision.

Thomas Trautmann: Absolutely. You’re absolutely right on that one. Yes. People will anyway be rational at one stage, but the rationalization process is there to justify the decision that has been made at the primal level. And what’s very funny, if I may say so, is that that primal brain has a a selling proposition if you want, which is it’s better to be stupid and alive than smart and dead because it’s a survival tool. So every decision is going to make is based on is it going to help me survive? And it’s not a smart decision. Okay, definitely not. But that is that’s the way it works. And because it hasn’t evolved, I mean, it’s 500 million years old. It stopped evolving 100,000 years ago. It still runs the processes we were using in the cave age. So that’s can be summarized in something like the 180 plus cognitive biases that have been identified. So things that make us make decisions like, I mean, you know, that what I’m going to sell you now, for example, is a prototype. If you wait, okay, you will get the final product for cheaper in one year. Your brain prefers to have the prototype now, even if it’s not working properly. Now, for example.

Lee Kantor: When you’re using the word survival, um, you know, I guess 100,000 years ago, survival meant one thing and survival today means another thing. I don’t think many of our lives are really at stake in some of these decisions that we’re talking about.

Thomas Trautmann: Absolutely.

Lee Kantor: What, um, how are you defining survival now? Is that could that be just not being embarrassed? Like, like what are some of the, the kind of, uh, fight or flight, uh, feelings that a primal brain is dealing with in today’s world where it isn’t literally life or death?

Thomas Trautmann: Yeah. It’s still, I mean, uh, you use a very good example. And, and that illustrates definitely that all those primal decisions are made for the human being in which the brain is okay. It’s my survival, it’s not yours, it’s not the survival of my children, etc. it’s my survival. So my brain wants you to make me great. That’s very important. And, um, those subconscious frustrations. So before it was, am I going to survive? Am I going to be eaten or am I going to eat something? And you mentioned fight flight, which is a very good example. Nowadays it can be as a business owner, I’m, am I going to show that that I can make it, you know, that he can be proud of me or am I going to provide for my family, or are they going to leave for someone else? Those are the type of things that that drive a lot of decisions and fight flight is still active. We still have fight flight running in our brains and nowadays a few words can start it. If you’re in a corporate relationship, you know, when um, she comes and says, we need to talk. It triggers the fight flight process in the male brain. Uh, and when he says later, it triggers her fight flight process. Just a few words nowadays trigger that process. Look at when you have an argument at work or something like that, the stress you are feeling, that’s the fight flight process.

Thomas Trautmann: It’s a it’s a crazy one because when it starts, it triggers the amygdala, which is releasing, releasing adrenaline in your body. You have cortisone that sent so that you feel less pain. Blood is removed from your limbs so that you bleed less in case you get hurt. You you’re breathing rhythm accelerates, your heart rate accelerates. I mean, all those crazy things happen with just a few words because that process hasn’t changed. So and that drives absolutely crazy situations. So we may not be dying at every street corner, but that’s still driving all the things. They were experiments in a supermarket. I think it was in Germany. You know, the the aisle where you buy your your bread or stuff like that. At the end, there are always very sharp angles. Okay. So when you arrive at the end of an aisle as a normal rational Homo sapiens sapiens, okay, you are conscious to be conscious. It’s just the end of the aisle. I’m going to turn left or right with my trolley and go buy some coke, for example. But your brain, your primal brain is in overdrive. Because first of all, there are those sharp angles which, oh, that’s aggressive and maybe someone is going to kill me when I’m going at the end of the aisle. That’s the primal brain reacting. Okay. And they rounded the corners in one supermarket and the sales went up by, I think it was 13 or 16% just because of that.

Lee Kantor: Now, do you have any advice for a lot of our listeners are business coaches and business consultants. Is there any advice on how they should be communicating with their clients and with their prospective clients? When it comes to kind of leveraging some of the things that you talk about? Is there some do’s and don’ts in your communication when it comes to being an effective communicator, in terms of leveraging all of this kind of neuroscience to your benefit?

Thomas Trautmann: Yeah. Well, if you just want to communicate is when you start a relationship with a client or with a lead, don’t talk about yourself. I mean, their brain doesn’t care about your brand, your services, yourself, your products, your company. They don’t care. Their brain shouts at you, screams at you make me great. Talk about them. Pay attention to them, listen to them. I mean, I did coach once, uh, a team of a company and one sales guy was really excited about using all the tools that he learned. It took him four weeks, but after four weeks, he because it’s a 180 degree shift to use the ethical persuasion. But he did it. And he said, Thomas, it’s absolutely crazy. I went to a client I never saw who never heard of us and so on. And for once, I didn’t speak about who we are, what we do, etc. the meeting took one hour, he said, and at the end I. He told I didn’t, I didn’t really not speak. But they said, we’re going to work with you because we trust you. So it’s just get used to stop talking about yourself when you write an email, when you go on the phone, do something that I call the you language. Every sentence should be you, you, you, meaning you are talking to that person and not. For example. Hello Lee, I am sending you a brochure where I want you to discover Dadada, which is about myself. In fact, it should be. Hey Lee, you are receiving this brochure which is going to show you how you could get this and that. I’m still saying the same thing, but just in the you language.

Lee Kantor: And then so does that require you to, um, be better at asking questions and being an active listener?

Thomas Trautmann: Yeah. Well, you should, you should know what question to ask that connect with the primal brain. That’s one thing. And you should not be an active listener. I’m calling that very differently. I’m calling that silent listening, which means that your brain shuts up. Active listening is you’re listening and you are thinking about what they are going to say or what you’re going to say that’s active listening, but at least you are listening. But your brain is still running, saying, okay, he just said that. So I’m going to talk about this. I’m going to talk about that and I’m not listening to you. Silent listening is working on that, practicing so that your brain goes silent inside. Okay. It doesn’t say, I need to talk about this. I need to talk about it. It’s really listening. So use a pencil, take notes. Okay. Explain that you’re going to take notes because that’s a conscious effort to listen.

Lee Kantor: And then when you listen, um, how do you then take what you’re the notes you’re taking? How do you move the conversation in the direction you’d like? Or is it something that you don’t really worry about you and you’re just focusing in on the other person.

Thomas Trautmann: But if you know how you answer their subconscious frustrations and how you can solve that, um, you just need to listen that that requires, of course, that you have all the tools before because then you may want to. There is one mandatory tool, which is a story. You need stories, but very specific stories built in a very specific way so that they connect with you, because stories are very strong on the brain, because they drive trust if they are well told and something. And one other factor. So you have to put all that together, which means that again, you know who you are talking to. If I’m talking to a CEO, I will not use the same subconscious frustrations. If I’m talking to the head of, of, of, uh, of the computer department, I’m not going to use the same subconscious frustrations as the marketing guy. Uh, if it’s a woman, it may be a very different subconscious frustration from a man. So I have to know who I am talking with. That’s the first step. I’m now really paying attention to who I am talking with.

Lee Kantor: Now, when you’re working with clients, is this something that you help them kind of build out this toolbox with the assets they need in order to be successful.

Thomas Trautmann: Yes, we we definitely work on the toolbox. It’s a workshop takes minimum one day if they want to rework their marketing, their sales pitch and so on, it can last from 2 to 3 days. But we definitely dive deep into the brain of their clients. So they have to understand who their clients are, what are their subconscious frustrations? How do you trigger these, what type of questions you can ask, what type of story you can ask, the tools, the objects, how you move your body, even if you have a presentation to do, there is a way to do that, to be ethically persuasive.

Lee Kantor: Now, is there anything that a person, a listener right now could do? Is there anything actionable you can share that is low hanging fruit that would give them a kind of a good bang for their buck in terms of, uh, something they can do right now.

Thomas Trautmann: And something they can do right now is really use the you language practice that it’s a tough one because your own brain wants to talk about itself, right? It it wants to show to itself. It made the right decision to sell what you are selling or do what you are doing. So you work on the you language. And I can tell you it’s a tough one. It’s a tough one.

Lee Kantor: And then what are some examples of how to use the you language?

Thomas Trautmann: Again, if I give you one, if you write an email, don’t send the email, read the email again and see if you’re talking about you or if you’re talking about them. And rewrite rewrite sorry, every sentence so that it’s about them. There should be only you, you, you, you, you in, in your email, for example. Same thing if you make a script for call for a call or something like that, make sure it’s about you, you, you practice when you get home, you know, instead of, hey, I had a great day. So how was your day? You know, same thing.

Lee Kantor: So just, uh, just try to emphasize you instead of me or I, um, more often, uh, in your conversations or your communications.

Thomas Trautmann: Yeah. You will see that brain in front of you is going to love you.

Lee Kantor: Now, is there an example you can share of what it’s like to work with you? Uh, do you have, um, maybe a story that you can share? Don’t name the name of the person or the organization, but maybe share the challenge they came to you with and how you were able to help them get to a new level.

Thomas Trautmann: Yeah, it’s a, it’s a manufacturing company. They produce a very specific plastic parts. And they were the leader in the, in the market worldwide. And they got slowly, uh, yeah, not killed, but eaten by the competition. And in fact, they lost their, their mojo. If you want, uh, some sites were in Germany, you know, in Germany, uh, we have very, very clean manufacturing sites you could eat on the floor and theirs was a bloody mess. So they lost. They lost their employees. They were losing their clients. So we worked with the CMO on the on how to focus on the brain of their clients. And we came out with a message that was, it all starts with you because the whole company could start because their clients were there. So it was again, it was not about the brand. It was it all starts with you. They went on a trade show, uh, and the booth we created, the booth that was fully white with mirrors on it. So when the client came to visit them, the first thing they saw were themselves in that mirror.

Thomas Trautmann: And inside each mirror, there was a picture of the clients of the client of that company. So they could see themselves and their clients using their products. That’s all that was on the booth. And the booth was white, was light from the back. I mean, it was it was a very beautiful booth, but it worked like crazy. Once the people wanted to start the conversation, then they could take them in the back room where there were the tables and so on, and they could show the products. That was the second stage. That was rationalizing the whole thing. So and that whole campaign went into the press, the press, the professional press wrote him a letter saying they’ve never seen something like that. It was incredible. And they saw a 70% increase in in demands, in leads and stuff like that just after that. But they had the courage to go all in. And the message, it all starts with you was also valid for the employees because without the employees, that company could not survive. So it also helped in that direction.

Lee Kantor: Now, you mentioned this was a manufacturing firm. Is there is that your niche or is what you do your work you do? Is that kind of industry agnostic?

Thomas Trautmann: I am completely industry agnostic because I’m focusing on the human brain. And aside politicians, everyone has a brain.

Lee Kantor: So you don’t do much political consulting?

Thomas Trautmann: I absolutely refuse to do it.

Lee Kantor: There’s a line. You have a line?

Thomas Trautmann: Absolutely. I have an ethical line.

Lee Kantor: So if somebody wants to learn more about Happy Brains, what’s the website? What’s the best way to connect?

Thomas Trautmann: It’s on the website, which is happybrains.com, or they can find me on LinkedIn also mostly everywhere else, but LinkedIn is the easiest one.

Lee Kantor: Well, Thomas, thank you so much for sharing your story today. You’re doing such important work and we appreciate you.

Thomas Trautmann: Thank you. Thank you for having me on the talk. I appreciate it.

Lee Kantor: All right. This is Lee Kantor. We’ll see you all next time on High Velocity Radio.

From Tactical to Strategic: The Leadership Shift That Drives Growth

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High Velocity Radio
High Velocity Radio
From Tactical to Strategic: The Leadership Shift That Drives Growth
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In this episode of High Velocity Radio, Lee Kantor interviews Mike Lemire, founder of Harmonic Leadership, about helping executives transition from tactical operators to strategic leaders, with a focus on customer success. Mike shares how organizations can strengthen customer retention, turn existing customers into referral sources, optimize customer success systems through data, and develop leaders who can adapt their leadership style to different people and situations.

Mike Lemire is the CEO and Founder of Harmonic Leadership, a coaching and consulting practice that helps B2B SaaS companies build and scale their customer success functions.

He currently serves as Fractional Chief Customer Officer at STOC, and previously held customer facing leadership roles at HubSpot, Toast, Notarize, and Overjet.

He is an ICF ACC certified coach, a DiSC certified facilitator, and a LEGO Serious Play facilitator trained through the Center for Executive Coaching.

Mike works with companies at the point where customer success needs to evolve from a support function into a strategic growth engine, typically between $5M and $200M in ARR. He’s known for staying through implementation rather than handing off a strategy and walking away.

Outside client work, he facilitates peer groups for Hampton and facilitates the CS Festival in New York and teaches as part of Pavilion’s CCO School.

Connect with Mike on LinkedIn.

What You’ll Learn In This Episode

  • Moving from tactical execution to strategic leadership
  • Building a customer success strategy around clear and actionable data
  • Turning satisfied customers into valuable referral sources
  • Optimizing existing customer success systems for growth
  • Developing executive presence and strategic thinking
  • Understanding and overcoming imposter syndrome in leadership
  • Applying situational leadership to different team members and tasks
  • Using effective questions and coaching to improve leadership decisions
  • Measuring leadership development through clear goals and outcomes

Transcript-iconThis transcript is machine transcribed by Sonix.

 

TRANSCRIPT

Intro: Broadcasting live from the Business RadioX Studios in Atlanta, Georgia. It’s time for High Velocity Radio.

Lee Kantor: Lee Kantor here another episode of High Velocity Radio, and this is gonna be a good one. But before we get started, it’s important to recognize our sponsor, Business RadioX. If you’re a business coach or consultant who’s tired of being a best kept secret, set up a call with Stone Payton at bookstonephone.com to unlock your perpetual prospect pipeline. Today on the show, we have Mike Lemire with Harmonic Leadership. Welcome.

Mike Lemire: Thanks, Lee. Happy to be here.

Lee Kantor: Well, I am excited to learn what you’re up to. Tell us about Harmonic Leadership. How are you serving folks?

Mike Lemire: Sure. So Harmonic Leadership is an executive coaching firm started in 2024. And we focus on helping executives grow from the tactical to the strategic, with a specialization in customer success.

Lee Kantor: Customer success. One of my favorite topics, I would love to kind of get a little deep into what that means for folks and why you decided to specialize in that. So can you first, by kind of defining some of the terms, what are you defining as customer success?

Mike Lemire: Yeah. So customer success is the discipline within, usually within SaaS or software companies. In the old days, when you’d release a software, have an account manager who would come back and sell you the next version of that software. Once it became a software as a service and sort of a subscription model, they realized just going back and selling wasn’t as valuable anymore, but was more valuable as having someone work with the customer to make sure they were ultimately seeing the, the value from the product itself and such birthed the discipline of the customer Success Manager. That’s how I grew up within the tech industry, was leading customer success teams, building customer success teams. And that’s why I specialize my coaching within that discipline today.

Lee Kantor: Now, why do you think so many organizations just don’t value their existing customer base? And they’re always looking for new customers. And that’s where a lot of their investment and resources and time go into finding the next person, rather than just making sure their existing person is served well and refers them to their next client.

Mike Lemire: Twofold. I think one, a lot of more successful CEOs that I’ve worked with and around have a background in sales themselves, so they just understand that discipline quite well of what it is to go out and fill the top of the funnel, move a prospect through that funnel and close them. So just the practice of generating net new revenue as opposed to retaining it is more deeply understood. The second is sort of a belief in the product itself and the software and what it can and should do. So if I’m coming on board as a new chief customer officer, or partnering with a company as sort of an advisor within customer success, I will say to the product leader, it’s my job to put work with you so that you put this team out of work, right? If the product is smart enough, it shouldn’t have to. You shouldn’t have to have customer support. You shouldn’t have to have onboarding, shouldn’t have to have customer success managers helping the customers. The product should be able to do that. And it’s. You could argue that having a customer success team is therefore a deficiency with the value of the product itself. If you have to have someone calling the customer to help them use it better, the product isn’t fully, um, actualized. Um, and so I think there’s some discomfort in that and there’s a lot of confusion around what exactly the Customer Success manager is doing all day. Um, and so that’s part of what I’ll do within my coaching is work with customer success leaders to better communicate that to an executive team that may be more familiar with the go to market process than with the post live process.

Lee Kantor: Now, is there a research or any evidence that kind of backs up the importance of investing in existing customers and making sure there is customer success? Because, I mean, just it makes sense to me that if you have happy customers that are using whatever it is, your product or service, that they are the first place you should look for your next client, not a stranger and a Facebook ad.

Mike Lemire: Yeah, exactly. It’s not only the value. There’s data backing up the value of it, but also, um, the cost effectiveness of it. Um, I don’t have all the stats off the top of my head. I I actually teach a course, um, through an organization called Pavilion, and I have a slide in my class that shows five different stats from different organizations from Forrester to Salesforce, um, to Harvard Business School that articulate essentially, it is significantly less expensive to invest in retaining the dollars you have in the door for a customer today than it is to go out and get a new one. Um, so the math is there for customer for investing in customer retention. Um, I think the tricky part comes with great, what exactly should or do I invest in? Um, it’s one of the first areas where I’ll typically start with is data. And most of the time organizations just haven’t structured their data in a way that will give them the clarity as to how to best use that investment to retain or grow those customers to your point, your next best customer should come from your customer base as well. So, um, what I’ll see a lot of the time is, is a focus on just maintaining, uh, the customer base, keeping them copacetic. Um, they’re not at risk of churning. Great. We’re in good shape. Um, I’d argue not only do you want to make sure that they’re satisfied, but they’re promoters of your company as well. Um, I’ve seen in organizations, um, that I’ve been a part of about a quarter of net new business comes from referrals from the existing customer base. The cost to acquire a customer from a referral is significantly less than going out. To your point, buying ads on meta or buying ads on LinkedIn for them. Um, so running a healthy referral business from your customer base and having people who know how to get a customer successful and then help preach the gospel of your organization can be really, really valuable.

Lee Kantor: So what advice would you give the leader who has been under investing in this area, and to your point, would want to turn that that faucet on? What are some of the dos and don’ts in having kind of a thriving, healthy customer success environment in your organization?

Mike Lemire: Yeah. So as I mentioned, I think starting with the data, right, and making sure your product and engineering team are instrumenting all the data points that could be possible in validating what a healthy customer, what a successful customer would a not successful customer looks like. Um, I’ll then go through it’s a bit dry, but some vocabulary work with them, um, defining what it is to be activated, um, in certain features within your product or versus adopting certain features of your product. To me the separation is activation is binary. You have done it or you haven’t done it. Adoption is more of a rolling perspective of ongoing utilization if you have a foundation of that data as a starting point, you could be really dangerous with what to do there. Um, following that, it’s somewhat dependent on are you a business to business product, a business to consumer product? Um, are you more heavily focused on enterprise versus SMB? And within that, there are sort of standard playbooks that emerge. Um, for me, the separation between SMB investment and an enterprise investment is SMB is much more of a science. Um, you would produce repeatable outputs and get repeatable, um, results from your customers. So if we show them how to do this, if we instruct them at this point how to do this, we tend to see similar behaviors and responses. Um, so you can launch a one to many um, style program there on the enterprise side, I view it as much more of an art than a science. Um, it’s about investing in the right type of CSM or account owner to manage the personalities or human beings on the other side of that who are making the enterprise level decisions. Um, so maybe more of a classical music versus jazz or a science versus art, um, methodology there, but really that, that foundation of healthy and clear data giving you the signals on how to operate is where I would encourage everyone to invest in. No questions asked.

Lee Kantor: Now in your work, do you spend more time fixing, fixing broken systems or building? Uh, kind of the first system.

Mike Lemire: Um, I’ve done both. Um, and, you know, even building systems from, from scratch, um, would require optimization down the stream. Um, and I wouldn’t say fixing broken systems. It’s just optimizing existing systems. Um, so is what I’ll focus on specifically though, where I’ve spent most of my time, uh, over the last few years is in the optimization. Um, so I’ll come in when a company has maybe reached a, uh, just closed their series B round of funding, starting to think about hitting hypergrowth. Uh, the unit economics are where they need to be. They just need to grow like crazy. Um, what they’ve been doing isn’t going to get them to where they need to go. So how can they rethink or reset on their, their systems as it is today? Um, so that’s what I’ll come in, I’ll assess what’s going on with them. Um, develop an audit, uh, understand what their needs are, make their recommendations on how to build from there, um, both strategically and tactically with the team. And then the other area that I’ll focus on with them is building up the leader. Um, at that point in, in company maturity, oftentimes I’ll hear, you know, we’ve got a head of customer success. She’s grown up with the company. We love her. We’re just not sure she’s the right fit to bring us up all the way through an IPO. Um, can you help develop her executive presence so that she can start reporting out in the board meetings and developing some of this longer term strategy that you’re helping us develop? So that’s typically how I’ll operate, um, with fixing the existing systems.

Lee Kantor: So is that the problem your clients are having, uh, right before they hire you that they want to upskill somebody or they have something in place and they want you to work with the leader that’s running it to make sure that it’s optimized.

Mike Lemire: That’s correct. And that’s, that’s part of what separates me from other CS. Um, consulting firms is they are, you know, my, my colleagues in the industry or my peers are very skilled at delivering. Here’s the strategy you should, um, go forward with. I usually take it a step further to say, here is the strategy and let me help the people you have in house change the way that they work, change the way that they think about their work so that they can continue on with this process. Once your engagement with me comes to an end. Um, I, I hear so often from leaders that I work with, like I’m being told I need to be more strategic. I don’t know what that means. I don’t actually know, like what it means to be more strategic. And that’s kind of the hard work that I work on with them is developing that muscle, uh, clarifying that point to them and then showing them how to do it so that they can go, um, and continue to do that work. Uh, once I’m, uh, on to the next.

Lee Kantor: So what do you say that gives them that aha moment when you’re working, uh, moving from tactical to strategic, like what is the advice that you’re giving or counsel to help them kind of make that leap?

Mike Lemire: Typically starting with what is a tangible artifact of strategy, like this is what a strategic artifact or document looks like. Um, here’s a few different flavors of that in terms of strategic planning. Um, and then working, starting with the finished product of we need to create this, this is your strategic plan. This then gets translated into your project plan for your team. Um, and let’s work backwards from how we get to this finished product to all the things we need to collect, create, understand, brainstorm along the way to get to that. So once I show them an example of, um, strategic output, that’s usually when it’s more clear of, okay, this is my job now as the company is growing around me and I’ve got more lieutenants to rely on and focusing on the tactical day to day, it’s my job to clarify the direction my ship is is going, um, and give the marching orders to those underneath me. So once they have that, it’s a little bit easier for them to conceptualize it and go along with the development of it.

Lee Kantor: Now, do you find folks that, um, maybe they were placed in their position like the person you described, maybe just because they were there and now they’re still here. So now they’re in charge and, um, versus the, and they feel maybe, I don’t know, some imposter syndrome that maybe I haven’t really earned this or I don’t deserve this, but I’m in it now, so I gotta figure it out.

Mike Lemire: Yeah. Yeah. Almost universally, um, I would say imposter syndrome is present. And I’ve seen it from, you know, heads of customer success all the way to CEO founders and CEOs of publicly traded companies. I think that is, uh, almost a universal feeling, um, for people, um, in the workplace. Um, so that does tend to, to be one of the challenges, um, for people showing up, uh, when I’m working with them. Um, also just a sense of what it is. There’s this sense that a term that comes up as well with around imposter syndrome is I need to work on my executive presence. Um, and there’s almost this belief that they need to be really polished and learn the secrets of what happens behind closed doors when executives meet. Um, it is not, it may surprise some of them. It’s kind of the same type of meetings that they would be exposed to otherwise. Um, there’s no secret language they need to learn. Um, I think most of the time it’s just about saying what’s most important to executives and then moving on quickly, as opposed to giving a lot of background and a lot of explanation on what they did and what they tried when they get to that level, a lot of that anecdotal evidence no longer matters. And what matters are here are the numbers. Here’s what we’re doing going forward. Um, so working with them to shift that and get them to be much more comfortable, um, when they’re in that executive, um, space, then the space that they sort of grew up in. Um, I think it’s really common though for people to, who’ve done really well as an individual contributor within their discipline to be elevated to a leadership role. And when companies are growing really quickly, the opportunity to shift how they operate in that leadership role, there’s not always a lot of instruction for them. So partnering with an executive coach who can guide them in that, especially one who’s native to their discipline, um, can be really, really valuable.

Lee Kantor: I recently interviewed, I do a show where we interview veteran entrepreneurs and this person, um, who came from the military was telling me about how in the military it was very directive, uh, the leadership and he was more collaborative and, um, and he found a way to make that work for him. Um, how do you help folks that aren’t like you said, maybe they’re the Michael Jordan of their whatever tactic they were doing, and now they’re in charge of, you know, they’re over other people and managing other people. How do you help them kind of choose the leadership style that works for them, that is authentic to them, but also is effective in what they’re trying to accomplish?

Mike Lemire: Yeah, that’s a great question. And I think it’s sort of, um, there are these stages of leadership development, you see in sort of stage one is I was really successful doing it this way. This is how I became the Michael Jordan. Let me tell all my direct reports to do it exactly like me so that they can be Michael Jordan’s too. Uh, and that rarely works. Um, applying your strengths, um, and assuming your team or your organization will have those same strengths as you, um, is kind of the first mistake in the, um, stages of leadership development that I see made, um, in terms of divining or deciding or developing their own, um, leadership methodology. Um, I’ll usually introduce them to one that I was introduced to in one of my first leadership trainings 15 years ago, um, when I was at HubSpot called situational leadership. And what I liked about the example you gave to the entrepreneur you were talking about is sort of originally grew up in a very directive, um, style of management. He preferred a more collaborative style of management. What I like about the concept of situational leadership is it allows for both, um, and most importantly, it gives the leader the opportunity to adjust their leadership style to what the needs of that individual is that they’re working with. Ah, it also breaks out the requirement or not requirement, but it breaks out, um, an individual into their specific tasks that they’re working on, or skills versus bucketing them as a whole person into one category. So, um, with situational leadership does in a brief explanation is it’s a four box model. Um, and the axes are essentially skill versus will. Um, and the first box is low skill high will. Um, so the example that I give is if I was working as a head of customer success and my CEO said to me, Mike, we need new office space in Boston, I’d say that sounds cool.

Mike Lemire: Great. Happy to help. No idea how to go find us office space, but let me know what I can do. Um, so in that instance, her style of leadership with me would need to be very prescriptive. Here’s who did this last time. Here’s what they did. Well, here were the mistakes they made. Why don’t you go take a run at having some of these conversations? Check back with me, share with me the feedback, um, that you’re getting and what you’re thinking about for next steps. I’ll validate that before you move forward. Right? She’s very collaborative or very directive rather in that point, telling me exactly how to move. Very prescriptive. I feel very supportive as an individual at that point. If she were to take that same style with me as Mike, I want you to go run this team meeting. Let me show you a good template for it. Let me give you the examples of how other people have run this team meeting. I would feel offended. Right? Like this is I can do this quite well. Thank you very much. You don’t need to be that prescriptive. So that’s an example where even as the same person, two different skills that I’m being asked to focus on need different styles of, of management and situational leadership takes you all the way through different, um, uh, high skill, high will, low skill, low will and everything in between. And it allows the manager to change their style, um, accordingly. Um, so that’s typically what I’ll work on with folks to help them adapt their leadership style to be more effective with the people who report up to them.

Lee Kantor: Now, how do you help the individual kind of read the room and understand, um, when they’re on the right track, when they’re not, when to kind of lean into it and when to pull back. Because a lot of that, I mean, what you said requires, um, either some knowledge about that individual or you better be paying attention to some body language about what they’re telling you or what they’re showing you, maybe not telling you.

Mike Lemire: Yeah. So I think the, the most important part of my job is asking good questions. Um, I guess it’s arguably it’s the same for your job. Um, is asking good questions, right. Um, and so that is how I’ll do it is I will ask them sort of probing questions. How do you know that? Why do you believe that and also challenge them. Um, that’s a part of coaching is not to just accept what people are saying is if I’m not buying what they’re saying or I don’t follow it or believe it, I’ll challenge them accordingly. Um, and if they’re coming around and saying, uh, okay, that’s fair. I maybe don’t know what motivates this person or what might inspire them to take action differently. Um, I’ll then provide them with options or examples of questions they can ask, um, to better understand that. Um, so a lot of it is just, it’s challenging and question asking.

Lee Kantor: Now, is there a story you can share that maybe illustrates what it’s like to work with you and your team? Um, don’t name the individual or the company, but maybe share the challenge they came to you with and how you were able to help them get to a new level.

Mike Lemire: Sure. Um. I want to think of a good example here. Yes. So I was this is a favorite of mine. Um, so I came on board with a head of customer success and was asked to help elevate them to someone who can lead a large team. To that point, they’ve only let a team of four. And for them, what large meant was a team of 50 or greater. Um, someone who can develop strategy, um, for that organization and ultimately get that strategy and execution against that strategy across the finish line to have a net positive impact on the business. Um, and so I worked with this individual for a six months to begin with. That’s usually how we start. Um, and what the process is, is I will meet with them and better understand their goals. I’d already had that from the stakeholder. I want to make sure that the individual’s goals align with what the stakeholder, um, wanted to see. Once we had that clearly defined, we would talk about how we were going to measure, um, the progress against those goals. And I will communicate with the stakeholder. Here’s what I’m seeing in terms of their progress being made? Are you seeing progress being made in similar areas? Make adjustments or tweaks because we were so clear on exactly what they needed and what good looked like against those goals? Um, not only was I able to help this person with those areas, I was also able to articulate very clearly the changes being made to their CEO, such that at the end of the six month engagement, they said, um, this is great.

Mike Lemire: We’re going to move forward and promote them to VP. I knew before the individual did, um, the individual found out and called me before they even called their wife. Um, which was a very cool moment for me, um, to have them sort of value the partnership so deeply that before they even told their family, they called their coach with that. Um, and then the outcome for, for the business for me was also that they said, you know, we’d like you to work with the rest of the executive team here at the company because we were so pleased with the transformation you made with this this one individual. Um, so for me, it comes down to it’s probably my background in customer success, just being really clear on what the goals are, how we’re going to measure that, and then updating progress towards those goals throughout the engagement.

Lee Kantor: Now you mentioned kind of your expertise in technology SaaS. Um, do you have do you have a preference, a sweet spot when it comes to working with organizations? Do you prefer B to B, b to C? Does it matter?

Mike Lemire: It, it doesn’t matter. Um, on the coaching side, I would say my background personally is in B2B. Um, and so the playbooks, the, um, here’s what I’ve seen work. The pattern recognition. I have a lot more of that on the B2B side, um, than B2C. I have some experience working in B2C. Um, and a lot of the foundational elements of good customer success Is there, but if I had to say, my sweet spot would be B2B SaaS company seed round up through series D.

Lee Kantor: And if somebody wants to learn more, have a more substantive conversation with you or somebody on the team, what’s the website? What’s the best way to connect?

Mike Lemire: Yeah, um, harmonicleadership.com is the website. And on there there’s a contact us form. You can schedule a call directly with me or a member of the team right there. Um, or you could just reach out mike@harmonicleadership.com. Happy to connect with you.

Lee Kantor: All right. Well, Mike, thank you so much for sharing your story today. You’re doing such important work and we appreciate you.

Mike Lemire: We a pleasure to be on the show. Thank you.

Lee Kantor: All right. This is Lee Kantor. We’ll see you all next time on High Velocity Radio

Lead with Trust: Building Teams That Deliver Results

by

Veteran Business Radio
Veteran Business Radio
Lead with Trust: Building Teams That Deliver Results
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In this episode of Veterans Business Radio, Lee Kantor interviews Dr. James Walsh, author of You’re a Leader—Now What? Build Trust, Inspire Teams, Drive Results. Dr. Walsh shares practical leadership lessons drawn from decades of military, Department of Defense, and teaching experience, emphasizing trust, active listening, emotional intelligence, collaboration, and adapting leadership styles to different people and situations.

Dr. James Walsh is an Air Force veteran, retired Department of Defense civilian, and educator with extensive experience teaching leadership and management worldwide.

He has taught graduate and undergraduate courses across diverse professional settings and currently teaches online at Park University. Dr. Walsh resides in Stafford, Virginia, with his spouse, Mary.

Connect with Dr. Walsh on LinkedIn and Facebook.

Episode Highlights

  • Building trust through effective listening and meaningful collaboration
  • Using emotional intelligence to understand and support team members
  • Adapting leadership styles to different situations and generations
  • Creating a culture where people feel heard and valued
  • Turning constructive conflict into productive teamwork
  • Aligning individual contributions with organizational objectives
  • Inspiring internal motivation through trust and genuine leadership
  • Applying practical, transferable leadership skills in a new role

Transcript-iconThis transcript is machine transcribed by Sonix.

 

TRANSCRIPT

Intro: Broadcasting live from the Business RadioX Studios in Atlanta, Georgia. It’s time for Veterans Business Radio, brought to you by ATLVets, providing the tools and support that help veteran owned businesses thrive. For more information, go to atlvets.org. Now here’s your host.

Lee Kantor: Lee Kantor here another episode of Veterans Business Radio. And this is going to be a good one. But before we get started, it’s important to recognize our sponsor, ATL vets, inspiring veterans to build their foundation of success and empowering them to become the backbone of society after the uniform. For more information, go to ATL vets.org. Today on the show, we have Dr James Walsh, who is the the author of a book, YOU’RE A LEADER—NOW WHAT? Build Trust, Inspire Teams, Drive Results. Welcome, Jim.

Dr James Walsh: Well thanks, Lee. Great to be here, I appreciate it.

Lee Kantor: Well, I am excited to learn about this book. Tell me what compelled you to write this thing?

Dr James Walsh: Well, I really wasn’t going to write a book, but I did a dissertation and folks said, hey, you should write a book from your dissertation, you know? And my dissertation was on leadership skills for Air Force captains, you know. And so I said, okay, I’ll write a book, but it’s not going to be anything like the dissertation. I would like to have transferable skills be brought out in folks who are in leadership positions, particularly folks that are just hired as the leader, and the hiring authority recognized their skills. And that’s why they’re hired. But they may be, you know, a little bit nervous about how to proceed and all that. And the the book serves to remind them that they already have these skills and that kind of thing over. Sorry about the overs.

Lee Kantor: I got you now. Can you share a little bit about your backstory, some of your experiences that led you to be the right person to be writing a book like this?

Dr James Walsh: Sure. I’ve been of well, I’ve had a military background for about 20 years in the Air Force. And then I had a DoD background as well, a Department of Defense civilian, and just retired from that in, uh, February of 2025. So I had like 44 years altogether. And all during that time I was teaching after work, you know, teaching was sort of a hobby with me, you know, so wherever, wherever the Air Force sent me or the Department of Defense sent me, I was teaching after after the job. So roughly about a half a century, I would say that, you know, I’ve been compiling all this experience and I just thought it was kind of time to, uh, give back. I have an opportunity to share with folks. So that’s what this book is all about.

Lee Kantor: So now let’s kind of discuss some of your philosophy around leadership. Do you believe that a leader is like a natural leader, that certain people are leaders, or do you think this is something that anyone could be a leader if they have the right training or the right desire?

Dr James Walsh: Well, I think both of those answers are correct. There are some folks that seem to have natural leadership skills, and you can also learn a lot about leadership as you go. And I’ve had a lot of students that kind of take leadership courses, uh, leadership and management courses. And I’ve asked them the question of, do you really want to do this in life? Are you taking this as another course? And so we’ve had, uh, dealings with that already. Uh, and, uh, the fact that they have learned, uh, and they can learn, uh, and, uh, apply, uh, leadership skills, concepts, uh, perhaps learned in the classroom to real life.

Lee Kantor: Now, do you ever find that, um, an organization might kind of anoint someone as a leader and then all of a sudden this person doesn’t kind of believe that they are the leader that maybe the organization believes them to be. Is there some imposter syndrome kind of in some folks?

Dr James Walsh: Gee, I don’t know. I haven’t thought about that. Um, there are, uh, it’s true that, uh, someone can be appointed as a leader without the skills because of, uh, of, uh, perhaps political connections or maybe they’re whatever the reason is, um, that, uh, you know, they may not have the, the skills that, that are needed, uh, you know, and so, uh, that, that certainly happens.

Lee Kantor: And then how would you recommend that person kind of move forward in that new role if they if they feel doubt themselves?

Dr James Walsh: Okay. Yeah, that’s kind of what the book is about, uh, gaining trust, you know, because, um, leaders are only as good as the people that work with them and for them, uh, they can’t do stuff by themselves, you know? And so what the book is all about is, uh, effectively communicating, uh, team building, collaborating to gain trust, uh, of the folks that are actually going to do the work, uh, that the, the leader is responsible for.

Lee Kantor: So what are some of the ways that a new leader can establish that trust within a team?

Dr James Walsh: Okay. Yeah. Uh, first, uh, effectively listening to them, uh, you know, and, and I focus on listening more than speaking, um, particularly as you, uh, to, to your point, if the leader doesn’t have the confidence and doesn’t feel like they have gained the trust, you know, uh, you, uh, learn about folks that are on your team and you learn to listen to them and to take their inputs. And particularly when the inputs are for, uh, organizational objectives for which everyone’s responsible.

Lee Kantor: Now, in your experience, is this something that, um, if you don’t establish trust right away, like what are some of kind of the ramifications of not doing that part well?

Dr James Walsh: Well, people, uh, would not support you if you don’t have their trust and, uh, they may not support you, uh, you know, and, and, uh, so, uh, you don’t achieve organizational objectives as fast, um, as efficiently. Um, because, um, people, uh, maybe doubt your abilities or maybe they feel that you’re not listening to them. Uh, and they’re not your, their inputs aren’t, aren’t being, uh, uh, seriously considered and all that kind of thing.

Lee Kantor: Now when you talk about trust and you talk about feelings, uh, this sounds like you’re in a kind of a realm of maybe emotional intelligence. How important is kind of that soft skill when it comes to being an effective leader?

Dr James Walsh: Oh, that’s vitally important. Uh, that’s another part of my book that, that, uh, emotional intelligence as far as dealing with and emotions of people who are really, uh, really, uh, show the emotions really show when they’re giving their inputs, you know, and so leaders have to be attuned to those emotions and, and, and, uh, show particularly that they’re listening and that they’re really seriously considering, uh, and they’re sensitive to the emotions that, uh, people are showing.

Lee Kantor: Now, what about kind of the old school my way or the highway just, you know, kind of just do your job. Like, how does kind of that play into this type of emotional intelligence?

Dr James Walsh: Well, uh, you know, that is another leadership approach that, uh, um, I’ve sort of lived through from the military. You know, it was, it was, uh, you know, jumping how high when I joined the military way back when. And then that evolved into, uh, jump. And why do we have to jump to today’s, we, we want to participate in the jump, you know, and so directive leadership has, has proven to have its place and it does have its place. That’s a that’s one of the leadership styles that leaders can can select if they feel that it’s appropriate, it’s their judgment to do that. But they should understand the the shortcomings of that approach as well, particularly when it has to do with understanding people and their, uh, they’re trying to communicate, uh, and emotional intelligence.

Lee Kantor: So if, if somebody maybe is from another generation and they, you know, grew up in that environment of, you know, how high should I jump and all that stuff. It, I would imagine that in today’s world, especially among the younger folks listening, the aspiring leaders, that’s going to degrade trust, that’s going to degrade communications. They’re going to I mean, I don’t know how effective that’s going to be in, uh, in today’s world. How do you recommend kind of the old school folks manage the the younger generation when it comes to things like this that maybe just because they didn’t grow up, you know, in that environment, that seems to be kind of the environment we’re in now.

Dr James Walsh: Oh, I couldn’t agree more, Lee. And there really have to adapt to change. Like I had to adapt to change, you know, and I’m of that generation as well when, when, uh, you know, jumping how high that’s, that’s my generation. I am a boomer. Uh, but, uh, and then, uh, they have to recognize the fact that, uh, younger folks today, uh, different generations don’t respond well to, uh, direction, uh, the directive type of leadership. And, uh, they need to understand that, uh, um, leaders need to understand that they’re leading all kinds of folks. Uh, boomers like me are are Gen Z folks as well, uh, that have a different, uh, a different, uh, perception of work. And in fact, that’s one of the questions that I’ve asked over the years in class, you know, and, uh, right after we introduce ourselves, I, I asked them the rhetorical question of, uh, how many of you are going to stay until the job is done, no matter what, you know? And, uh, the boomers would raise their hands, you know, very affirmatively. And, uh, the generation’s ears or the Generation Xers, uh, would, uh, say, well, uh, we, we prioritize work just like everyone else. However, it’s got its place. We have other things to do, other responsibilities. We have family responsibilities. And that’s why we need to leave it at quitting time to address our other responsibilities. So my message to the leaders, essentially, is to recognize the fact that you have different, uh, folks with different perceptions of different generations, with different perceptions of work and, uh, that they respond differently to, uh, the directive leadership style. And perhaps, uh, you may want to consider changing your leadership style because you have the ability to do that. You can, you can go to a participative, uh, type of an, a collaboration type of style, uh, for the good of not only yourself, but the, particularly the organization and, uh, the folks that really have to do the work.

Lee Kantor: Now at the heart of the book, obviously it’s about leadership, but from an organizational standpoint, aren’t you really talking about culture, um, and the culture of the organization when it comes to communicating and, um, and managing the folks on the team.

Dr James Walsh: Oh, absolutely. Absolutely. And the, uh, the culture of the organization is established by your senior leaders, uh, you know, and, uh, but they also give some flexibility at times. In other words, uh, my example in the military as a commander, of course, the military’s directive by nature, uh, you know, but, uh, within the direction, uh, the directive culture, I should say, uh, I was given latitude to use my personal preferred style of leadership, which was, uh, participative and collaboration, uh, you know, and, uh, so, uh, for example, uh, folks knew I was the commander, you know, I didn’t have to remind him of that fact. And when they came to see me, we had to have a serious discussion. Uh, but I would talk to them as, like, I’m talking to you right now. Uh, you know, in fact, I was confronted by a senior noncommissioned officer the first time I. I used this style, and he said that, uh, this is the first time you’ve ever had to administer discipline, isn’t it? And I said, yeah, as a matter of fact, it is. And it was. And, and he said, well, you should have been very directive and you should have made them feel like they’re like three inches tall and, and really chastised them and all that. So I asked him one question, what is what was the result? The result was that the person was severely disciplined, but we did it in such a way that we had the discussion and everything came out. And, uh, all parties understood why. Uh, he was, uh, being disciplined and all that. So I, I actually changed my style toward the senior noncommissioned officer. And I said, just don’t let the door hit you in the back on the way out. That was the directive.

Lee Kantor: And it shows that you could adapt.

Dr James Walsh: Yeah, I can adapt. And, and this, this was his leadership style that he was trying to project on me. Right. And the book, uh, I really try to make that point in the book that, uh, you have a choice of leadership styles. You can adapt your leadership styles to the situation, situational leadership. It’s your judgment as to how you need to, how, how you need to act. But don’t, uh, I, I wouldn’t project my leadership style on anybody else if they feel like directive is, is the most appropriate way to be. Thanks.

Lee Kantor: Now isn’t um, isn’t it the case where this is your collaborative, collaborative leadership style? It that’s a, a nice tool to have in your tool belt. I mean, you shouldn’t just have one tool in your tool belt. You know, if if you only have a hammer, everything looks like a nail.

Dr James Walsh: Oh, absolutely. Yeah, absolutely. This is why you, you can, uh, be aware of the different leadership styles, uh, you know, and you can be directive when it calls for it, when you feel in your judgment, it calls for it to be, uh, you can be, uh, participative when, when, uh, you know, when you feel like the situation, uh, or collaborative, uh, when the situation calls for that as well. So you have multiple tools in your toolbox as to your point, you should have, uh, based on your judgment and situation that you can apply, uh, as you would need to as a leader.

Lee Kantor: So how did you kind of land on the leadership style that you gravitated towards? Did you try on a few and then landed here, or was this just something that you were naturally this way?

Dr James Walsh: I was naturally comfortable with, with collaboration and participative. Um, there was like four years as a commander. I think I can count on one hand the times that I had to be directive to people. Um, and, uh, in fact, I, uh, um, the, the 32nd war story. I had a visitor. My cousin visited me when I was in Greece and, uh, he went to the gate to the security police man at the gate and says, hey, do you know Captain Walsh? And they said, yeah, we know Captain Walsh. I was their commander, uh, you know, uh, and, but they, they volunteered and they said, uh, he’s tough, but he’s fair. And, uh, you know, I could live with that. And, and, uh, I don’t know if they would ever tell me that directly. Uh, they told my cousin that he told me of that incident. I says, yeah, that’s, that’s really good feedback.

Lee Kantor: So now in your book is your book have um, is it like you mentioned there was maybe inspired by a dissertation, but so is it super researchy or is it more, um, anecdotes and stories? Um, what’s the structure?

Dr James Walsh: Okay. The structure of the book is very, very much pragmatic. Uh, it is not conceptual. It is not a textbook. Um, and it was done by, uh, purposely, you know, I, my, my general guidance was to, uh, have, uh, a very pragmatic, practical approach, um, to, uh, people who have the skills, who have the transferable skills and they’re new to an organization and it’s a short book. I mean, you can read it on a, on a, on a two hour plane ride, I would say, uh, and, uh, it is research based and there is an appendix with all the references and that people want to look at to, to validate what I’m saying. But the approach itself, the book itself is, is more of a primer, you know, for, for, uh, new leaders and old leaders who are in a new position, uh, that, uh, really need to, uh, regain their confidence. And, uh, at the end of each chapter, most, I think they conclude, most of them conclude with, uh, the, the fact that you’ve got this, you’ve got the skills. Think about when you’re in situations like this before and how you’ve handled it. And, uh, take a look at the culture to your point that you’re in now, the position that you’re in now. And, and, uh, think about how you can apply what you’ve done before because you have the skill, you have the transferable skill, uh, or you wouldn’t have been hired for the position.

Lee Kantor: So do you have a piece of advice for maybe that aspiring leader who hasn’t gotten that opportunity yet to lead? What should they be doing to be, an effective leader when they do get the chance.

Dr James Walsh: Well, they have to, uh, they have to gain the trust of the people. Uh, and, uh, it’s a, it’s a, your question is, is, uh, very generic. And, uh, there’s some folks that may already have the trust, uh, because, uh, there could be promoted, uh, within an organization, uh, you know, and, uh, they were a technician. Now they’re a leader. They’ve made that transition. People already know them. So they already know, you know, they already know the culture and they’re aware of how to effectively operate within that culture. Okay. That’s a different situation from, uh, from, uh, somebody hired, uh, outside, uh, from outside the organization who has to learn the culture, you know, then has, has more, more of a, uh, a lot little longer road to gain the trust of folks, uh, you know, so, uh, leaders, uh, can, Can gain trust by, uh, you know, effectively communicating and, and, uh, collaborating and building teams, uh, you know, team building and, and using emotional intelligence. Uh, and, uh, we’ve, uh, discussed now.

Lee Kantor: Uh, in the subtitle of the book, it’s build trust, inspire teams drive results. Is it possible to inspire someone? Is it possible to motivate somebody else? Or does this have to be something that’s done internally by the individual?

Dr James Walsh: Well, I believe it has to be done internally by by the individual. But, uh, you, you can, uh, really bring that out, bring out their motivation, uh, you know, uh, by, by establishing trust by, by listening to them, by, uh, positively reacting to their emotions. I really believe that’s going to ignite their internal motivation to really, uh, say, uh, thank God it’s Monday versus, uh, thank God it’s Friday. Uh, you know what I mean? And, and, uh, and so, uh, yeah, I think, I think the answer to your question, it’s both, you know, people are motivated internally for sure. Uh, but they are also, uh, inspired by leaders or are impacted by leaders. And I believe it’s, it’s, uh, it depends on the leader’s ability to really listen to their inputs and sincerely, um, respond and, and, uh, all that. And then that motivation, the internal motivation comes out.

Lee Kantor: Now, what about the, um, kind of getting everybody on the same team when it comes to the why behind, uh, you know what, what they’re doing, how important the mission actually is.

Dr James Walsh: Yeah, it’s a good, good, good question. And, uh, just finished an article on that. And part of the book talks about, uh, uh, conflict, conflict management and, uh, constructive conflict. In other words, you’re on the same team. You all want to contribute to the organizational goal, but you have differences of opinion. And, and, uh, the leaders, uh, job then becomes to becomes to recognize everybody’s input and, and, uh, inspire them to, uh, work towards what’s best for the organization, you know, and, uh, sometimes what’s best for the organization may not agree with the input that you want to give or your team member wants to give. Uh, but they should be mature enough to understand that, you know, and, and, and accept that that doesn’t always happen. Uh, but, uh, yeah, that’s, uh, that kind of dynamic has to happen. And, and, uh, and, uh, attack a problem, not a person. That’s the other thing. Sometimes there’s personality conflicts that come out and maybe some agendas that people have that they feel like they maybe should have gotten promoted and weren’t or whatever their, their agendas are. Uh, you know, you, you need to be able to, uh, work together as a team for the organization because, uh, in the final analysis, that’s what it’s all about. And the leader’s job is to listen to everybody’s inputs, uh, you know, and then have everyone collaborate and the group come to a decision also on what’s best for the organization. So, uh, that may help to ameliorate or placate the person who who lost. You know, they didn’t they didn’t have their inputs. Uh, b a plot. Well, they they were listened to, but they, they weren’t, uh, they weren’t implemented because the group, not just the leader, um, decided that, uh, that was, uh, you know, what’s best for the organization may have not been that this individual’s input.

Lee Kantor: Now, what if you’re, uh, a person on a team and you feel like the team’s going in the wrong direction. Uh, what are some strategies for that person to be heard and, um, maybe sway the others or else if they’re not going to be swayed, what should their next move be?

Dr James Walsh: Okay. Um, well, uh, in the book, I talk about management by objectives and the group has come to, uh, to, uh, Agree to what the objectives of the teams are. And I talk about, uh, um, periodically going back, you know, first first meeting with the meeting with the, with the team, establishing collaboratively the objectives, you know, and then, uh, letting them go out to, uh, accomplish those objectives without, without interference. But you’re there to support them, you know, and then, uh, you have a, the third step would be the, the, uh, a return meeting to see if the objectives were, were, uh, achieved. Why or why not? And, and, uh, that’s when, uh, maybe these differences would come out, uh, as, as well, uh, you know, and so again, what, what, what drives me here with that management by objective process and, and what I hope would drive the majority of, uh, of the team is, uh, the objectives established to, uh, for the organization. You know, you have your strategic objectives at the top and then your, your operational objectives, which is what, uh, the new team leaders would be dealing with the operational objectives that, that fit into the strategic ones, you know? And so while this process is happening, my, my goal is to have folks, uh, buy into it, uh, you know, and then when there’s some, uh, some disagreement, then we have to, we have to take a look at it and say, well, why is why what, what’s going on? You know, why wasn’t the goal achieved? Uh, you know, and, uh, and all, I don’t know if I completely answered your question or not.

Lee Kantor: Yeah. Well, I’m just trying to get to the heart of say you’re on a team. Uh, you don’t agree with, uh, maybe the objective and you put forth your opinion or your, uh, you know, your thoughts on the matter And now you have a choice to go along and just shut up and go along. And because you’re a team member, you’re not the leader of the team. Um, but, uh, is there anything else that person could do to, um, you know, if it’s important to them, if they think that this is, this is a mistake, we shouldn’t be doing this. Um, just how that person should, what they should do in order to be heard and maybe affect change from within.

Dr James Walsh: Yeah. I think, uh, what I would recommend there, essentially, as I, I’m hoping I have their trust as the leader and I’m hoping they know they can talk with me offline or in addition, uh, after the group has, has, uh, has made the decision and, uh, I go along with that. And if I agree with the group, the majority of the group, that this is what’s best for the organization, and then the individual that, you know, didn’t, uh, had a different opinion, um, wanted to talk with me about it. I certainly would have an open door policy to consider everything that they are trying to, you know, uh, to have considered as to why the decision may not be best for the organization. I would hope that they would know that I would listen to them, um, after the decision was made as well, because I have open door policy and, uh, I’m a sort of a collaborative participative guy, you know, and, and, uh, I can be collaborative and participative and you still don’t get the answer you’re looking for, uh, you know, uh, but I’m, I’m going to listen. And they’re going to know that I listened and that I considered and all that. So that’s how I would approach it.

Lee Kantor: Now, is there any story you can share, maybe people you’ve worked with, maybe leaders that you’ve trained up, maybe share where they started and how you were able to help them get to a higher level or a new level when it comes to leadership skills and impacting folks.

Dr James Walsh: Oh, sure. Um, I’ve got, uh, probably more war stories than we have time for today.

Lee Kantor: Right. You don’t don’t name the name of the individual. Maybe share the challenge they came to you with and how you were able to help them.

Dr James Walsh: Oh, sure. Sure. No. Uh, the challenge, uh, was when? When, uh, I was a commander. I had someone working for me that wanted to be an officer, and he wasn’t being supported by his direct supervisor. So he came to me as a as a commander, and I gave him a recommendation for officer training. And, uh, he subsequently was accepted to officer training, and he came back to the same organization as a lieutenant. And, and, uh, and, and got promoted all the way up, up to captain, uh, you know, so he was always grateful to me for that. And, uh, I saw the potential in him. He wasn’t, uh, he was an excellent technician, but, but he had skills that were go beyond that. And ultimately, he was promoted to colonel. He retired as, as as a full colonel. Uh, you know, and he never forgot my, my recommendation. And I, I saw in him the fact that, uh, he’s got more skills than, than what he’s, uh, what his job calls for currently.

Lee Kantor: Now, when that happens, and obviously that person went over the head of somebody else does. How did that friction get handled or was there friction?

Dr James Walsh: No, there wasn’t really friction. Uh, there wasn’t there wasn’t really friction, uh, at all. And, uh, I just let him know that I gave the recommendation and they didn’t. And that in that case, they didn’t contest it.

Lee Kantor: So now if somebody wants to get Ahold of the book, what’s the best place to do that? I’m sure it’s available everywhere, but is Amazon the best place to start looking for this thing?

Dr James Walsh: Oh yeah. It’s on Amazon. It’s on Amazon. You can you can preorder it or actually you can order it because, uh, the, the book launched yesterday. And so you go to amazon.com and plug in the title, um, you know, or my name and the book will come up and it’ll show you that you can order it.

Lee Kantor: All right. And the book is titled You’re a Leader Now what build trust, inspire teams drive results. Dr James Walsh, thank you so much for sharing your story today. You’re doing such important work and we appreciate you.

Dr James Walsh: Well thank you. Thank you for having me.

Lee Kantor: All right. This Lee Kantor. We’ll see you all next time on Veterans Business Radio.

From Meal Prep to Healthy Habits: Making Better Choices Easier

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High Velocity Radio
High Velocity Radio
From Meal Prep to Healthy Habits: Making Better Choices Easier
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Baumeyer-Coaching-Sponsor

In this episode of High Velocity Radio, Lee Kantor interviews Sharon Reitman, owner of Smart Meals®, about the evolution of meal prep, healthy eating, and making nutritious food more convenient for busy people. Sharon shares how she started Smart Meals® in 1994, the importance of having healthy meals readily available, and how meal prep can help people save time, reduce food waste, and make better food choices. She also discusses macro-friendly meals, meal planning strategies, GLP-1 users, and the future of Smart Meals® through franchising.

Sharon Reitman has been building Smart Meals® for over 30 years, with a focus on helping people eat better without making their lives harder. She creates convenient, balanced meals that support real fitness and health goals—not just quick fixes.

Everything she does is centered around consistency, quality, and making healthy eating something people can sustain long term. She has built a strong foundation in Houston, with the goal of bringing Smart Meals® to communities across the country.

Her background is rooted in nutrition and real-world application, with an understanding of macros, portioning, and what works for long-term success. She focuses on practical, uncomplicated solutions that help people stay on track.

At the heart of Smart Meals®, Sharon is committed to giving people an easier way to live healthier without sacrificing convenience or results.

Connect with Sharon on LinkedIn and follow Smart Meals® on Facebook.

What You’ll Learn In This Episode

  • The evolution of meal prep and the growing demand for convenient healthy meals.
  • How meal planning can support healthier and more consistent food choices.
  • Using meal prep to save time, reduce food waste, and manage food expenses.
  • The importance of understanding calories, protein, carbohydrates, fat, and other macros.
  • Practical strategies for preparing meals in bulk and staying consistent throughout the week.
  • The role of convenience and preparation in avoiding unhealthy last-minute food choices.
  • Nutrition considerations for people using GLP-1 medications, including the importance of adequate protein and healthy eating habits.
  • How a simple meal-prep routine can support long-term health, fitness, and lifestyle goals.

Transcript-iconThis transcript is machine transcribed by Sonix.

 

TRANSCRIPT

Intro: Broadcasting live from the Business RadioX Studios in Atlanta, Georgia. It’s time for High Velocity Radio.

Lee Kantor: Lee Kantor here another episode of High Velocity Radio and this is gonna be a good one. But before we get started, it’s important to recognize our sponsor Baumeyer Coaching. Multiply profits, magnify impact executive coaching to elevate individual and team performance. To learn more, go to baumeyercoaching.com. BAUMEYER coaching.com. Today on the show we have the owner of Smart Meals®, Sharon Reitman. Welcome.

Sharon Reitman: Hi there.

Lee Kantor: Well, I am so excited to learn what you’re up to. Tell us about Smart Meals®. How you serving folks?

Sharon Reitman: Well, we meal company we’ve been serving since 1994. That’s when I started my company before meal prep was even called meal prep. I don’t know how familiar you are with the industry, but it’s getting quite popular throughout the United States. Almost every city now has different businesses that prepare and make foods on an individual basis that people can purchase and have for at home, you know, for dinners or to have lunches at work that are healthy or kind of within the diet genre that they’re they’re in. So that’s kind of the basic basics of it all.

Lee Kantor: So now what was kind of the genesis of that idea for you? You were so early on in this trend.

Sharon Reitman: It’s a it’s a good story. I was actually went back to college a little late in life in my late 20s, and I could not afford my personal trainer any longer. And I had said to him, hey, how about if I make you some meals in exchange for training and I am not the best cook? So it was kind of an interesting endeavor. But what happened was he was like, well, I have a client that would like to get some meals and so on and so forth. And it just kind of dawned on me like, there’s a business opportunity here. At that time in Houston, there was one major company doing like diet meals. And she had a great business and there’s really nobody else doing it. So I thought, I’m going to try this. And that’s how it all started.

Lee Kantor: So now what makes a kind of your Smart Meals® different than some of the other folks doing this?

Sharon Reitman: Well, our focus, our genre has always been to make meals that are a little bit lower in fat. We really pay close attention to the fat content of our meals. So now with all the different companies that are out there making meals, you know, internet, I mean that ship and also local, the focus is high, high protein, especially with the GLP one community, which is what we do as well. But we still keep our fat relatively low, around the 20% mark. There are a few meals that will be 25% fat, and that’s kind of our little niche. It works well in fitness, especially depending how lean you know or what someone’s goals are in the fitness world.

Lee Kantor: Now, is your business kind of still referral based and working with trainers and other fitness professionals?

Sharon Reitman: Absolutely. I think, you know, I’ve been in business for so long. We we have a name here in the Houston area. So yes, trainers definitely will refer dieticians, nutritionists. And now I think because meal prep has become such a industry, more and more people just on their own are looking for the big thing in meal prep is convenience more than even the fitness element. And that’s what I’m realizing after all these years in business. It’s so much about convenience. People just don’t have time to cook or prepare meals. And when you don’t have time to cook and prepare, you end up making poor choices. And that’s kind of the the way it goes. So having these meals available can eliminate that from happening.

Lee Kantor: Now, does do your are your clients kind of individual like single folks or are they families like, or does it work for both.

Sharon Reitman: Across the board? I have families, I have husband and wives. I have young, um, you know, students. I have people just right out of college getting their first jobs. It’s really about convenience. If you think of your own schedule and what you do on a daily basis, how much time do you have to go grocery shopping, preparing, cooking, cleaning. So some people have the time and they enjoy doing it, and that’s great. But the majority of people nowadays just don’t have that kind of time, and they at least need to have some healthy meals available for when you know, they don’t have time to cook and they can weave it in with all their own good cooking. And that’s a long term, uh, plan for success.

Lee Kantor: And it’s one of those things where it doesn’t have to be all or nothing. You don’t have to replace every single meal, but you can replace some of the meals with healthy choices like you’re delivering, right?

Sharon Reitman: Yeah. And it’s funny that you say that because back in the old days, that’s how I always promoted my foods. Like I, I didn’t, I mean, of course we love big sales, but the minute you sell someone breakfast, lunch, dinner, you know, seven days a week for 21 days, you know, they’re going to be tired and burned out. I don’t care how great the food is. So I always tell my customers, think about what meal or meals are the hardest for you to do during the day. And once you have that, that’s what you need to prepare for. So for example, let’s say breakfast is easy. People make their own breakfast, they can make breakfast for the kids, this and that, and then they go to work and it’s just lunches and maybe a mid-afternoon snack that’s hard for them to plan because when they get home for dinner, maybe the husband likes to cook or they like to grill. You know, most of the week or whatever they like to do. So they really don’t need dinner. So I tell customers and just buy lunches and snacks for the week. You have that at work. It helps you stay on track and it’s economical. You don’t waste food.

Lee Kantor: And it’s one of those things where, uh, if you, if you can eliminate going out to eat even a few times a week, you’re going to have there’s, I believe it has to be kind of monetary savings there, but it’s also the hidden calories that are in a lot of these restaurant meals that you can’t even, you can’t even tell how many calories are in any given meal. Yeah.

Sharon Reitman: That, that is so true. You’re absolutely right. First of all, depending on what, uh, what someone’s goal is. Yeah, it’s very hard to know what’s in the foods that excuse me, that, that you’re purchasing and you end up eating a lot worse and a lot more. And it really can throw your, your plan off. But besides that, especially nowadays. I mean, it is so expensive. I mean, I personally went and had Vietnamese lunch because I love Vietnamese food and just spring rolls in and um, seafood pho. I ended up spending with tip $35 for myself. And I’m like, this is crazy. So it really is economical and it saves you money and you have a lot less waste, even if you do your own grocery shopping and cook. You’d be surprised how much people do throw out that they end up not using. So your point, right?

Lee Kantor: And if you’re even trying to meal prep on your own, like you said, if the recipe requires some weird ingredient that now you have to go out and you have a jar of something that you’re going to use one time, and now you’re going to throw it away in two months, um, because you’re never going to use it again. To me, it’s such a better way to kind of manage your eating is through a service that you’re guaranteeing you’re getting healthy choices at every meal. It’s not one of these kind of, oh, I’m starving. Oh, why don’t we just drive through somewhere or get something, you know, a quick service restaurant or something like that. It just eliminates all of that temptation. And that’s the best way to quiet the food noise is by not having the food in the house.

Sharon Reitman: That that’s very true. And the thing now with meal prep, since it’s so popular and almost every city has a business or two in some of the big cities, like in Houston, there’s a lot of companies that provide different types of meals, and everyone has their own kind of flair about what they sell and what they do it. There’s so much variety for people out there, so and it’s comparable price rise, even with fast food, like when you if you went to, you know, any of the burger places and got a sandwich and, you know, a coke or iced tea with tax, by the time you do that, you could almost be spending money, you know, on having a healthy meal and you just heat it in your microwave or in your oven if you prefer, and you’re good to go and you’re eating something healthy and definitely higher in protein for sure. Most likely. I just encourage people that, you know, whatever meal prep they are purchasing to really read, you know, what they’re buying, what the ingredients are, what the macros are. And what I mean by macros, I mean the calories, the fat, carbohydrate and protein in each meal. So they understand what they’re getting. You know, that’s an important thing. And especially if they have any kind of health and fitness goals.

Lee Kantor: So now how does it work with Smart Meals®? Like what is the commitment and how does someone get started?

Sharon Reitman: Well, for, for us, it’s pretty simple. People can go to our website, they can they can create an order online, they can preorder twice a week. They can also do weekly subscriptions where they just pause and reactivate and save a little money. Or we have a storefront so they don’t have to preorder. They can always come shop anytime they want. The only risk with doing it that way is we could be potentially sold out of an item that they prefer. And so we tell everyone if you’re really, you know, particular and you want certain things, it’s, it’s best to do a preorder. They can do a preorder for pick up at my store or for local delivery.

Lee Kantor: Now how does it work when it comes to selection? Is it a set menu every week or do I have some, um, latitude in what the choices are in a given week?

Sharon Reitman: There’s some latitude. We have our main items that kind of stay on the menu because they’re popular. The minute I try to change things, I get complaints. It’s so funny. So we try to rotate and do new menu items each week or every two weeks. A few menu items, just, you know, for variety. But we have a huge menu. And I think what we do best is we take all the different food genres. We have Mexican food, we have Asian food, we have American food, we have fast food categories, but we take the popular meals from those categories and make them healthy. So we have right now a summer burger that’s on the menu. It’s delicious. It’s made with our 98% grass fed beef, and it comes with yam fries or potato fries. Now those fries aren’t fried. They’re baked. And they’re so good in the air fryer, you’ll never need to eat a real, you know, fried French fry. They just totally satisfy your craving. Delicious. But I think that’s one of the best things that we do. We make every day regular food healthy now.

Lee Kantor: Um, does it require me to have an air fryer or a microwave or some combination or.

Sharon Reitman: I mean, you got to warm the food up. I mean, it’s better warmed up for sure. You can do a lot of things in the microwave. Some people don’t like a microwave, so they want to use their oven. Um, you don’t have to have an air fryer, but to me, the air fryers are a great gift idea for the holidays. They’re not expensive and they’re so easy to use and fast. It’s just kind of like a glorified toaster oven. We have artesian style macro friendly pizzas and those just eight minutes in the air fryer and you’re good to go. And they’re amazing. Our quesadillas, great in the airfryer are burritos, will crisp up the tortilla in the air fryer, the French fries, the potato fries, the yam fries. So much better in the air fryer. And it’s the second. They’re super easy to use. So I tell everyone, invest in an air fryer. They’re anywhere from 50 to $100, you know, for a decent one. And it’s a great appliance to have for sure.

Lee Kantor: Now, what about people with food allergies? Are there ways to kind of work around that?

Sharon Reitman: We do work with people with food allergies. We list the ingredients on the on the label, you know, however, we do just have one kitchen. So I always worry that God forbid, of, you know, cross contamination. So someone that has a very serious celiac or seafood kind of allergy, you know, we tell people that we are not, you know, our kitchen is a single kitchen. I don’t can’t guarantee with 100% certainty because of that. It’s just like a catering kitchen. It’s similar to if they went to a restaurant to eat.

Lee Kantor: Now what about, um, specific diets like vegan or keto or things like that?

Sharon Reitman: Most of our foods will work with any of the diets. We don’t have a lot of vegetarian or vegan options. I tried, I wish I would love it, but we just for some reason did not have the people enough people that wanted it. And believe me, I, I wish we did because I like so many aspects of the vegan diet, um, or vegetarian. So that’s how any of the other um, genres though we can, we can accommodate because one of the other things that we do that’s very helpful is you can order items in bulk. So for example, instead of ordering the meal, you can order a pound of the protein, uh, or a pound of the carbohydrate. And there’s several on there. So some people can, they can put together their own meals or they can make their own carbohydrate and just order the protein from us. So it gives them a lot of flexibility. And that is another way to order where you can save a little money. It’s a little more economical to do it that way.

Lee Kantor: So like you could order like a week’s worth of chicken tenders if you know, your kid likes chicken tenders.

Sharon Reitman: Absolutely. We have people that do that all the time. I have a lot of people that do that.

Lee Kantor: Now what?

Sharon Reitman: What? I’m sorry.

Lee Kantor: What about desserts? Do you have desserts as well?

Sharon Reitman: We do have some desserts. The desserts are always a little trickier to make macro friendly. We have a line of protein muffins that I think are delicious. It’s a Kodiak cake bake mix, uh, base with a lot of other ingredients that we put together for our own custom recipe. And they’re delicious. They’re really delicious. We have a chocolate chip, a blueberry, pumpkin, and a dark chocolate chip. We also have a Hershey Kiss cookie. That’s fun. We have some protein puddings. We’re working on some cheesecakes. We have a healthy version of our carrot cake. That’s that’s pretty good to satisfy your sweet tooth.

Lee Kantor: Now, when, uh, sometimes so a person can get it delivered to their house as well as pick it up at the location, it’s either or.

Sharon Reitman: Yeah. Either way, they can save the money and come shop at our store. Or a lot of people opt for delivery. And the charge is dependent upon the area that they’re in. And we now just started with Uber Eats within a ten mile radius of our store. Uh, so people could order from a selected menu items and get their men get their food, you know, in 45 minutes. And that’s really geared for people that just want something to eat.

Lee Kantor: Now that’s like for a meal, like one meal, I want dinner or something.

Sharon Reitman: Yeah, exactly.

Lee Kantor: So now, um, when you started this, is it what you imagined? Is it going in the, the way that you imagined it was going to go?

Sharon Reitman: Um, it’s a good question. Uh, yes. Yes and no. I mean, when I started, I just fell into it. I had no plans. This was, you know, my area’s exercise science. I’m more of the front of the house, so to speak. I love dealing with customers, talking to customers, customer service, making sure everything’s running smoothly in retail. The kitchen is my least favorite, uh, part of the whole process. And I always like to joke with people that I really am my own best customer. I use my food and just like a customer of not more. And so I can I really get a good idea of what’s convenient, what’s not, what needs to be better because there’s always room for improvement. Always. And times have changed. I mean, a lot of things have changed since the mid 90s. Since I started.

Lee Kantor: Now, um, when a person is working with you at the let’s go to the beginning when you first started and that trainer said, hey, can you make this for my clients? When did you kind of, when was the aha moment? Was it just that action by the trainer saying, hey, will you make this for my client where you’re like, okay, I could be on to something or did something happen later on after you got a few clients that you were like, okay, this thing has legs.

Sharon Reitman: Yeah. I mean, it wasn’t immediate and I almost didn’t want to do it, but at that time, I had just finished and got my degree. I was, uh, waiting tables at a steak restaurant and trying to figure out what I wanted to do with my degree. And, um, so when he said, hey, I have a client, I said, okay, I’ll do it. And then so I ended up with like three, four people and I’m doing it out of my house, which that’s how most people start and very limited just grilling chicken and very basic, like very, very basic. And I’m like, there could be a business here. And that’s the kind that’s when it kind of happened within the first few months. And within six months, I, through my network of friends, I was introduced to a girl who I took in immediately as a partner. It was, you know, we were so small business, it wasn’t going to lawyers and figuring all this stuff out, hey, you want to be partners and do this thing with me? It was that’s kind of how it started. And she’s a very talented, self-made chef who is actually now in the Georgia area. And she private chefs for some well-known people over there. But she’s very, very good. And we’ve remained in contact through the years. So that’s kind of how it started. And she helped develop some recipes and one thing led to another.

Lee Kantor: And then how long did it take for you to kind of find a commercial kitchen?

Sharon Reitman: We got into a kitchen right away after six months because you really can’t cook properly. That’s that’s something I would tell customers. Um, you know, if they buy from individuals, I apologize. My dog is barking downstairs. Um, I, uh, so give me one second, I apologize. Okay. Sorry. Um, so I would tell people to make sure that when they buy from a company, they know where their food is being cooked because in a home, it’s hard to cool it up, cool it properly and keep it at temperature, at the proper temperature and follow all the health safety laws. So that’s, that’s just something a lot of people don’t think about, especially when you’re cooking for the masses.

Lee Kantor: Now, what about the folks who maybe are just trying meal prep for the first time on their own? Are there some do’s and don’ts when it comes to that? Like you mentioned that a lot of times just people do a protein, some rice and, uh, and, you know, throw some vegetables and call it a day. Is there some do’s and don’ts for the, the home meal prepper?

Sharon Reitman: I mean, the whole meal prepper, I would tell them to kind of think what they want for the week ahead And then on the weekend, if that’s their time to do it, is when to do it. Like I would get some rice cookers to do the rice’s and do it in bulk and cook their their carbs and bark. They. And in bulk they could do their sweet potatoes and even potatoes. They could just do those in the oven in bulk. Everything’s kind of in bulk. And just to pick some, maybe like 3 or 4 proteins that they like, they don’t have to make creative meals for every meal. Most people eat the same thing. And this is just like a staple during the week. Save your, you know, um, going out to eat or your salads or your sushi and things for the, for what you can’t meal prep. I would be consistent with the foods that you like and just make those.

Lee Kantor: Now, is there a story that you can share about kind of the impact that this type of, uh, getting meals delivered or, or picked up from Smart Meals®, the impact it can make on a person or a family is there. Don’t name the individual, but maybe share the challenge they had when they started. They found out about you and how you were able to help them, maybe lose some weight or get healthier.

Sharon Reitman: Well, I mean, there’s quite a few different people that come for different reasons that are they’re going to be doing a show and they need help. But one of the people, um, I and it’s funny because she remembers the story better than I do, but, you know, she, she was traveling and she really serious on eating healthy. And this was when I first started. And you know, I, when she told me that I was like, here, this is what you need to do. And I kind of gave her the one, two, three. And I think I even lent lended her a, uh, cooler to use and just kind of went through the whole routine and that that whole story kind of stayed with her. And it made me smile when she told me years later, like, even like we were talking about it this year, 25 years later. And I’m like, really? I’m like, you know, I’m so glad that that had such a positive impact because it’s just something that I had done for myself prior to having my business, because I was very much into fitness in my 20s and 30s that I wanted to eat, you know, that was kind of the 80s and 90s. So there you go on age.

Sharon Reitman: But it, it was something that I knew well. And there’s so many ways to stay on track, so many ways. And so I think, you know, a lot of people already know how to eat. They just need to know some of the tricks. You know, uh, one of the nutritionists that I’ve worked with for almost the entirety of my business, very well known person here in Houston, Texas. He’s retired now. Wonderful guy. He, he used to I went to him before I even had my business. And one of the things I learned from him, and this is a great tip for everybody is he’s like, just carry around a little cooler in your car, bring your food with you and you’ll have it wherever you are. If you, if you, if you, if you’re driving and doing sales, you can always stop at a stop and go and use the microwave or you just take it to work, have it with you so you’re not without and it doesn’t force you to go get the bag of chips or the junk food. I think that’s some of the best advice. It’s basic, very basic because I think most people already know how to eat. They know by now how to eat.

Lee Kantor: Yeah. But so many people, it’s like they get surprised that they get hungry at 3:00 when they get hungry every day at 3:00, and it’s like, oh, I’m hungry. And then they go and make a bad choice at a vending machine or, or junk food. And it just like you said, if you just kind of have a little self-awareness to go, you know what? I usually get hungry in mid-afternoon. Why don’t I, you know, have a bag of nuts in my pocket or something that is going to alleviate some of that, just to take the edge off until we get to dinner.

Sharon Reitman: And you should like people should have a little snack so they’re not starving when they get to dinner. Now, of course, if they’re, you know, skipping and not eating anything until like 1:00. You know, that’s not ideal either. But if people are eating consciously and they’re having, you know, breakfast and lunch, they should definitely if they’re at work, they should have a snack, you know, maybe a Greek yogurt snack, a few nuts, you know, you have to watch how many nuts you do eat. Nuts are good, but nuts can build add up very quickly. Uh, you know, in terms of fat. Um, so, you know, there’s things that they can have, they can make a half a sandwich and have to work or we have snack burritos people love to take to work or even the mob. There’s so many options now. And you’re absolutely right. People just need to think a little bit ahead and they’ll feel better. They’ll feel better in the long run. The healthier you eat, the better you feel.

Lee Kantor: Now, are you noticing anything, um, happening in your business because of so many people on these, uh, kind of GLP ones?

Sharon Reitman: I definitely think so. I mean, I noticed it, I think, um, I think the GLP one, uh, is, is good for people that need to have that initial push. And apparently there’s some other health benefits that are coming out. I don’t know much about those, but I think for the people that really need to quiet what you like, you brought up earlier that food noise, but the key, the whole key, once they’re on it is so critical. They’ve got to eat enough protein and they got, they, they must change their eating habits because otherwise they’re going to be on it forever. And if they don’t, you know, if they get off of it, they’re going to go back to the old habits. It’s kind of like, you know, the, the yo yo dieting type of thing. But furthermore, it’s just, it’s, uh, it has caused people to, to probably not eat as much. So they’re not necessarily looking for meal, healthy meals for their weight loss, but they may be. I’m hoping it’ll translate more into having healthy meals for their maintenance and getting the protein that they need. Because like I said earlier, when we first started, the number one thing with meal prep, even more than health is the convenience of it all. It’s all about convenience. All about convenience, right?

Lee Kantor: But you also want to make sure that your nutrition is there. Just because you’re not hungry, you still need the nutrition you do.

Sharon Reitman: And you’re absolutely right. Some of the people that are doing the GLP that are not eating at all, they’re, you know, losing their hard earned lean body mass. They’re just lowering their metabolic rate. And it’s, it’s a recipe for disaster. So if anyone is on a GLP one, it’s critical they work with their doctor, not have more than, I don’t know what the percentage. I think it’s like 10% lean body mass and really don’t do it fast. And, and I would also say it’s a good idea to track your macros so you know where you’re at. That’s been a big game changer for me personally, as I put myself on a get back in good shape. I just turned 63 and I was like, mm, it’s time to get a little more serious. Uh, right now, because I’ve been a little slack the last few years and I started tracking my macros. Uh, and it’s, it’s just a major, major difference when you know what you’re taking in, what you have left, where you’re at, it really makes a difference.

Lee Kantor: And with Smart Meals®, it makes it easy.

Sharon Reitman: It does make it easy. You just scan the barcode. But you know, for those people that I encourage everyone to try to get as much variety in your diet. Try to cook the things you like, you know, use meal prep and you may buy meal prep from, you know, a few different companies. Everyone does it a little differently. But, you know, it’s kind of like it should be a habit, a staple in your weekly diet to have some backup, you’ve got to have the backup because the minute you don’t have that backup is when you reach for stuff you should not be eating because you’re hungry or go through a drive thru because it’s just right there in too easy. And that costs a lot of money that you end up spending so much money doing it that way too.

Lee Kantor: Right. And you get a worse product, like you’re getting less nutrition. All you’re doing is, is, is having convenience. That’s the only thing you’re gaining.

Sharon Reitman: Yeah. It’s, uh, it’s, it’s, it’s, it’s an interesting puzzle, but the people that do the best are the ones that you just have to put a little bit of thought. You don’t have to put a lot of thought, just a little bit of thought into it. And it really can make a difference in, in someone’s life, their overall energy. And just, you know, the, the time it takes for everything.

Lee Kantor: Yeah. So if somebody wants to learn more about Smart Meals®, uh, in the Houston area, that’s right. Now you’re exclusively in Houston right now.

Sharon Reitman: We are working on franchising and that’s something that should hopefully be available next year. I’d love to see Smart Meals® in other states and other cities across the country. It would be. It’s kind of like a little dream of mine. We’ll see what happens. I’m working hard towards that. Um, but currently, uh, we are in the Houston area. It’s smartmeals.com and we also operate old school. So people are welcome to call us at (713)868-9800 anytime or text and we will get back, you know, as quickly as possible.

Lee Kantor: Well, Sharon, thank you so much for sharing your story today. You’re doing such important work and we appreciate you.

Sharon Reitman: Thank you so much for having me. I really appreciate your time.

Lee Kantor: All right. This Lee Kantor we’ll see you all next time on High Velocity Radio.

Leading with Heart: The Power of Compassionate Leadership

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High Velocity Radio
High Velocity Radio
Leading with Heart: The Power of Compassionate Leadership
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In this episode of High Velocity Radio, Lee Kantor interviews Brett Horton, founder of b3 Remarkable, about compassionate leadership, executive coaching, and helping individuals and organizations become better versions of themselves. Brett shares how empathy, trust, kindness, and intentional leadership can strengthen teams, improve engagement, and create meaningful business results. He also discusses the GROW coaching model, family business leadership, succession planning, and the five principles from his book, Five Words to Change the World.

Brett Horton, PhD, is the CEO and founder of b3 Remarkable, a leadership development firm dedicated to empowering leaders who guide with compassion, kindness, humility, gentleness, and patience through customized coaching, speaking engagements, and leadership training sessions.

He draws on more than three decades of professional experience that span higher education, hospitality, executive coaching, and business strategy, aligning leaders with deeply held values and inspiring them to lead in ways that honor both people and profit.

Prior to founding b3 Remarkable, he served in a variety of professional roles, including as senior director of operations at the WinShape Retreat Center, founded by Truett Cathy, founder of fast-food restaurant chain Chick-fil-A. In higher education, he taught and mentored students at institutions such as Iowa State University, James Madison University, and Kansas State University, sharing his passion for service oriented leadership with emerging professionals.

Earlier in his career, he gained foundational experience in world class hospitality settings, working at The Greenbrier Hotel and Resort and The Broadmoor Hotel and Resort, and establishing his appreciation for service excellence.

Dr. Horton earned his doctorate in hospitality management at Purdue University, his Master of Business Administration at the University of Colorado, Colorado Springs, and his bachelors of science in hospitality administration from Kansas State University.

He lives with his family in the Kansas City area, where he enjoys being outside in all types of weather, running to clear his head, preparing food for his family and friends, and a wonderful bottle of wine with his amazing wife.

Connect with Brett on LinkedIn and follow b3 Remarkable on Facebook.

What You’ll Learn in This Episode

  • Building stronger leadership through compassion, empathy, and emotional intelligence.
  • Balancing people, planet, and profit for sustainable business growth.
  • Creating trust as the foundation for effective teams and healthy conflict.
  • Recognizing how employees prefer to receive appreciation and celebration.
  • Using the GROW model to clarify goals, reality, options, and the will to move forward.
  • Understanding the difference between coaching, consulting, and leadership development.
  • Preparing organizations and family businesses for leadership transitions and succession.
  • Leading with compassion, kindness, humility, gentleness, and patience.

Transcript-iconThis transcript is machine transcribed by Sonix.

 

TRANSCRIPT

Intro: Broadcasting live from the Business RadioX Studios in Atlanta, Georgia. It’s time for High Velocity Radio.

Lee Kantor: Lee Kantor here. Another episode of High Velocity Radio and this is gonna be a good one. But before we get started, it’s important to recognize our sponsor, Business RadioX. If you are a business coach who’s tired of being a best kept secret, set up a call with Stone Payton at bookstonephone.com to unlock your perpetual prospect pipeline. Today on the show we have Brett Horton who is with b3 Remarkable, welcome.

Brett Horton: Thank you. I appreciate that, Lee.

Lee Kantor: Well, I am excited to learn what you are up to. Tell us about how you serving folks.

Brett Horton: We are a leadership development and executive coaching. So we help people become the best version of themselves by asking them questions and helping them and their teams grow. So we’re doing a little bit of both from the concept of if it’s an individual, I’ll start working with them and we’ll do coaching in a traditional sense. I like Sir John Whitmore’s grow model, and so we start with that and build around it. And if we’re working with teams, I always try to make sure that we walk away with something that they can implement in ten days or less. And then I check back with them and say, how did it go? And we have that relationship, and I think relationships are all that matter.

Lee Kantor: So what’s your backstory? How’d you get involved in this line of work?

Brett Horton: Well, I grew up on a family farm. If we start there. I had a wonderful mom and dad and some siblings that, uh, kept me humble and taught me a lot. My my dad taught me to ask questions. And that’s kind of where we started, went off to college, spent time in the high industry or high end industry of resorts. Working at the Broadmoor in Colorado Springs and the Greenbrier in West Virginia. Got into higher education for a while. I have an MBA in finance. Uh, got a PhD from Purdue University. Go Boilermakers. And then went off and taught at Iowa State and James Madison University. Had the opportunity to go work for chick fil A for about seven years, running a retreat center for them. So that was kind of fun. An 800 acre, 80 room marriage retreat taught me a whole lot about running, working with people and helping them become their best selves. And then we had a chance to come back to Kansas City, back to where I, uh, closer to where I grew up. I’m still seven hours from home, but back to Kansas City and my wife of 32 years and I have decided we love Kansas City. Taught a little bit here. And then we decided to launch be three remarkable and really help companies grow and become better. Had a fortunate opportunity to work with a former student who’s the chief Operating officer of what is now Lucky Strike Entertainment. And that contract and rewriting their training program really launched the B3. Remarkable. It made us that company that said, you know what? We can make it through that first 2 or 3 years when it’s usually pretty lean.

Lee Kantor: Now, from a background in hospitality, and especially at high levels of hospitality, people who are really trying to, you know, kind of be the best of the best. How does that inform your leadership coaching? Where do you see learning opportunities for leaders to lean into some of the tenets of some of the great hospitality brands?

Brett Horton: You know, growing up, um, I had the opportunity my first job out of school was at the Greenbrier Hotel and Resort. And my boss was a fine gentleman by the name of Rod Stoner, but he was like the third of the, um, major individuals who built their food and beverage program. And it was all around, ladies and gentlemen, serving ladies and gentlemen. And I think if we understand that we are all ladies and gentlemen, and we’re all serving, ladies and gentlemen, it becomes a much more compassionate world we live in. And so I really try to help people understand that, you know, we all have our different stories. We all come from a different place. And if we can just embrace the fact that we don’t know where people are at, but help them get to the next level, it becomes real powerful. So I try to help leaders find out where their employees are at, where their their peers are at, where their, um, supervisor is at, and then work with them to become better. And that becomes real powerful and arguably remarkable.

Lee Kantor: Now, how do you, um, help your clients kind of turn on that empathy gene if they don’t have it already in terms of looking at things through the lens of their people rather than the lens of what my company needs to be successful.

Brett Horton: And it’s interesting, I’m just working on a presentation right now and it’s, uh, my premise of our company has always been focusing on people, planet and profit. So you have to balance all three of them. We have to take care of our people. We have to take care of the bottom line. Otherwise we can’t take care of our people. Um, and then let’s be honest, we’ve only got one planet right now. No matter how hard we’re trying to get off of it and build another one, we are here on this amazing earth. And let’s, let’s take care of it as we go forward. Um, the first thing we have to do is think more about the other person than we think about ourselves. And that just, uh, was kind of revealed to me in some work I’m doing right now and, and reading some work by, uh, tick, not Han and, uh, the Dalai Lama and, um, another individual, uh, father Richard Rohr. And it’s like, you know, when I start thinking about others as opposed to thinking about myself, compassion and empathy and emotional intelligence becomes very, very possible. But when I’m only thinking about me, it becomes almost impossible. And so if we can begin to ask the question, what is the other person thinking at this time? What would an outcome look like in their world? It’s amazing that we can get into the other person’s head and we can go, oh, I see kind of where they’re coming from now.

Lee Kantor: Now when, uh, somebody hires you to do this kind of deep leadership work. Does it require them to kind of have that self-awareness that to even unlock some of the things you’re talking about or, or certain things happening within their organization, it’s almost forcing them to, to make some changes and to, to maybe, um, to have these kind of deeper conversations like, and if so, then what are some of those signals to a leader that maybe it is time for me to, to rethink some things.

Brett Horton: You know, an easy one is oftentimes their engagement scores, if they’re doing a, a employee engagement, uh, concept. Uh, so that’s a key performance indicator is, oh, my engagement scores are not great. And I don’t know what the problem is. Okay. Well, then we’re gonna have to do some discovery, some problem solving, see if we can figure that out. Uh, oftentimes is KPI, you know, your key performance indicators of revenue, sales, Profitability. Some of those types of things. Turnover is another easy one. It’s like, man, we’re just churning through people. That’s a classic example in the hospitality industry is we’re getting, you know, taking us so much time to train people. It’s like, well, have we thought about why that that’s actually the case? Um, and if we can begin to delve into that, I will say the one character that is necessary for somebody to work with me and, and I can work with them is a desire to get better. Uh, you don’t have to know how to get better. You just have to want to get better. So if, if the organization or the individual says, you know what, I want to get better, then we can make it happen. If they’re not invested in in wanting to improve, then probably they’re wasting their money on me.

Lee Kantor: Now, is there any advice you can give to that leader that wants to get better, like what’s low hanging fruit for a leader that wants to get better.

Brett Horton: Um, you know, one of the questions I ask people oftentimes is, um, we, we do a piece on celebration, I believe a strongly in the fact that we celebrate other individuals. And if we celebrate them, that helps, you know, people like to be celebrated. The difference is we like to be celebrated differently. So for example, one individual might want, uh, a, some additional time off. Somebody else wants pay, another person wants to be celebrated in front of their peers and, and rewarded with claps and, and a, a plaque. Another person just wants to kind of slink into the back and have somebody just say thank you. And so the first thing I always ask is, I want you to list all of your employees And right down beside them how they like to be celebrated. And nine times out of ten, the employee will go. I have no idea how they like to be celebrated. We just have a standard celebration concept. You know that the human resources says, you know, if somebody does a great job, you give them 50 bucks. Well, that may or may not be what they want. And most people will take the $50, but that may have very little meaning. And you could save yourself $50 by simply saying, you know what? You did a great job. Thank you. I appreciate you.

Lee Kantor: Now, is it that simple? Just ask them at the beginning of when they start with you, how you like to be celebrated. You know, that’s the start.

Brett Horton: We we have to have a trust. Um, Patrick Lencioni, uh, does a lot of work with, um, the In the advantage or his second book, The Five Dysfunctions of a team. And he says the foundation of any great organization is trust. You know what? What Michelle and I have is 32 years of trust. And we might run into a rough patch here and there, but we’ve got to trust and and building that trust. So rod Stone or that guy that hired me up 31 years ago, him and I still trust each other. And so we can have those open conversations. But you have to have a foundation of trust before we can get all the way up to making changes and creating great results and having, uh, good conflict with each other. Because again, there is a difference between bad conflict and good conflict. And we talk about that and we help people understand that, um, good conflict helps us get better. Bad conflict shuts us down.

Lee Kantor: Now, uh, you wrote a book, Five Words to Change the World, leading with compassion, kindness, humility, gentleness, and patience. What was the impetus of that? What what motivated you to get everything down and, and write about it?

Brett Horton: Well, one of the things I do to center myself every day is to wake up early when the house is still quiet and I read some devotions. Um, some of them are are Christian esque devotions, some of them are not. But I try to focus myself and I was reading the Bible at this time, and these are Paul’s words. So I totally, totally plagiarized his five words, but they really resonated with me. At one point, I, I mean, I’ve read the Bible multiple times, but this time these five words stuck. And so I just literally wrote on the word compassion until I had nothing else to say about it. And then I moved on to the next one. And it was all just longhand journaling. And then a prior super administrative assistant of mine said, Brett, I would be willing to type that up. And I’m thinking that’s a huge undertaking. But she was one of the only few people who could read my writing. And so, uh, Suzanne Mitchell typed it all up for me and it sat there for another 2 or 3 years. This probably took five years from writing until book. Um, then we found a company that was willing to help me and edit it. And Jamie Fleming with Bright Rays helped me throw this together and say, you know what, we can make this a great book.

Brett Horton: And, and I, I give all the credit to the other individuals because it was just my initial thoughts on how do I become more compassionate? How do I become kinder to myself and to the world? Um, how do I lead with humility? Um, I think that that word has, it needs to figure out a new way for us to understand humility because it’s not about being self-deprecating. I’m always an early Johnny Carson fan. And so Johnny Carson made his humor by making fun of himself. But. And it worked for Johnny. Uh, but, uh, you know, how do we do that? Humility. How do we treat the world and ourself gently? Uh, I don’t always do that well, but that’s, that’s a goal. And then ultimately realize that, uh, I’m a work in progress and I better be patient with myself. And so over the course of about three months, I just hand journaled those, uh, five words. We got them typed up. We worked with an editor. They made it, made make sense out of it. And lo and behold, we now have a book that’s, uh, available for purchase.

Lee Kantor: Now, does the book, um, obviously it was you were writing it from a place where you were heavily invested in those words at that time. Does it kind of Summarize kind of the be three remarkable foundational elements to your coaching.

Brett Horton: That’s a great question. And I think it is more and more every day. Um, in, in me trying to make sure that I’m compassionate, uh, that I’m trying to be kind as we go forward. But be honest, if somebody is, is totally out in left field, it’s like, hold it time out. I want to be kind, but I want to bring you back to reality. Uh, I want to, I want to make sure that you’re focused on what, what you can, where you can improve and be the best possible version of yourself. So it does. Those five words are part of our, uh, value statement. And so, uh, the other one is, uh, do small things with great love. And, uh, if, if I can just do the little things every day, then I’m a happy camper. Just like what you’re doing. You’re, you’re interviewing people, you’re doing small things with great love and you’re doing a great job of it.

Lee Kantor: Well thank you. Um, is there a story you can share that maybe illustrates what it’s like to work with you and your firm? Um. Don’t name the name of the company, but maybe share the challenge they came to you with and how you were able to help them get to a new level.

Brett Horton: Um, you know, it was interesting. The one that comes to mind off the top of my head is a, is a small company I started with, uh, about two years ago. And literally they were not profitable. And the individual I was working with said, I’m trying to get the company set up so I can sell it because this is just killing me. Uh, I have a beautiful grandchild and I want to spend time with them, but I can’t because I’m spending all this time with this operation and I can’t spend time there and, and, and take care of myself. And so it was all about Brett, can you help me get this company to the point at which we can sell it, and I can get out from under it and I can just move on. And so we started working together, uh, just the owner and I, and then we brought in some management individuals, but she got to the point where she was able to realize that she could make money as an, and be an owner. And it was a transition from being the manager on the floor every night to being the owner of this operation, being more profitable and being able to step back and have time for herself, her, and to build the, the operation itself.

Brett Horton: So that’s my, my one success story, uh, that I love because it’s so distinct. It’s what we as small businesses do. It’s how do we, how do we do our business really well? And I’ve worked with big companies as well, uh, developing training programs and, and those types of things, which are exciting, but you just don’t get to see the, the detail of, of the one individual growing and, and sooner or later she got to the point where, um, um, she said, you know what, I’ve made it this far. Um, let’s stop for a little bit and, and um, reap the rewards she has and, and I’m certain we’ll work together again at the future. But right now she’s in a pause. So that’s been really positive because the goal is to see us succeed. Honestly. You know, you don’t want to if you’re working with them forever, then you got to ask the question, well, are you really doing them a favor now?

Lee Kantor: Is your work primarily coaching or it sounds like some of this kind of could bleed into consulting? Is there is that a gray area for you?

Brett Horton: It it bleeds over between coaching and consulting and leadership development. Uh, I try to strongly start with a discovery plan of, hey, what, what is it that you need to establish? And then we’re, I’m happy to, to transition one way or the other. Uh, if it’s like, I just need to stay at the coaching level, then that’s what we’ll do. Uh, I’ll lean into my coaching accreditation and, and just ask questions. But at times somebody will say, you know what? I, I want your advice, Brett. And I said, okay, well, I’m going to give you my advice, but that’s, that’s a consultant, not a coach. And, and I try to help them understand the difference between that and the fact that when I become a consultant, you don’t have to take my advice. Um, I’m like, um, there’s a model I use called rasky, responsible, accountable, supportive, consulted and informed. And the consultant individual in that model are like the points on whose line is it that just don’t matter. You don’t have to listen to the consultant. You just have to say, here’s what they said, and then take it and internalize it and, and make it your own and, and take it forward. And so I try to help people understand that when I’m in the consulting mode, they should, uh, should take it as that.

Lee Kantor: It sounds like you’re very focused on whatever outcome they desire and just trying to make that happen for them.

Brett Horton: Absolutely, absolutely. Um. The goal is it’s not my, it’s not my journey to take. I, I’m on my journey. I’m working on that. But if I were working with you, it’d be, where do you want to go and how do you want to get there? That’s that goal, that grow model. What is your goal then? What’s your reality? Where are we at currently, uh, that we want to go, that we, we identify these are the challenges we have. Uh, if you look at my journey, it’s like reality was my daughter was out of high school so we could move from Georgia and move back to the Midwest, where we were closer to my family. So reality changed and we could change. And then what options do we have? Well, I had the opportunity to, to teach for a while and start to build my own consulting firm. And so I did that. Those were options. And we kept looking at them. And there’s other options coming at me right now. And it’s like, I have to decide which is that, which of those things that I want to embrace and which do I not? Uh, and I do the exact same thing with each and every client. We talk about what your goals, what’s reality, what options do you have? And then the hardest one is what is your will to move forward? Um, I happen to be, uh, I don’t know if it’s middle aged or at 57. Does that make me middle aged?

Lee Kantor: Well, how lucky are you that, uh. Yeah.

Brett Horton: Yeah, but that concept is what is my will to get up and go for a run? What is my will to go? To stretch, to lift weights, to eat right to. And so I have to have a strong, strong enough will to make some of that stuff happen. And if I’m not, then the goal, the reality, the options don’t matter unless I have the will to make it happen. And so we spend a lot of time on that because that’s the last step of the, of the grow model that I really like. And you can make it really complicated. There’s lots of things you can add to it, but I love the fact that the model is simple enough for everybody to, to really wrap their head around is what’s my goal, what’s reality? What options do I have and what do I have the will to, to make happen?

Lee Kantor: Now, in the past, you mentioned, uh, you’ve worked with some family owned businesses and your business is a family owned business. Can you share some of the insights that you’ve learned from being part of a family owned business and working with family businesses, they’re a little different than, um, maybe conventional businesses.

Brett Horton: I think they are. I think they’re, they’re very much different. I grew up on a family farm. Um, mom and dad built a great farm. Dad, um, grew up on a farm, but a, a very, uh, he was one of six brothers and sisters and, and so, and it was a small farm, lots of story there moved. Uh, when he was married, he was in higher education, had the opportunity to go back to my mom’s, uh, dad’s farm and, and co farm with his brother in law. So they, they farmed together for a while and then ultimately have the two farms individually. Um, and it worked really well. Now we’re in the stage of that next generation of, of mom’s still around, but dad’s not there kind of leading the farm. And so we as siblings are trying to figure out how do you how do you move to that next generation? And I think that’s real important. And that’s been a great learning environment that there’s a lot of emotions around that. And some of them are logical and some of them aren’t, but there’s still emotions.

Brett Horton: Um, so anytime you have a family business, um, you need to be thinking about how do you transition not just the business as a whole, but the leadership of that. Uh. We, we were talking about it within a family business I was working with. And there’s the strategic transition, but then there’s also organizational staff planning. I’m working with a company right now. And, uh, this is not a family business, but he says within two years, we’re going to lose three very, very key people and it’s going to make our lives very difficult. And I said, so what’s the plan? You know, you’re going to lose them within 2 to 3 years. Do you have a plan for that? And they go, we haven’t thought about it yet. And I’m just, you know, this is when I kind of hold my head and go, okay, how do we get to a plan so that it doesn’t become a dumpster fire in three years? Because if we work on it right now, it doesn’t have to be a dumpster fire.

Lee Kantor: Now is there when it comes to family businesses, this is something I for a while, I did a show on family businesses and something that’s always fascinated me. And I had the privilege to interview some of the folks from chick fil A during that time. It was here in Atlanta. Um, so the dynamic of a family business for folks who aren’t aware is different kind of from a structural standpoint in that the families, typically the leadership of the organization and that they’re, you know, sometimes the younger family member will get promoted to a high level faster than maybe somebody who had worked there a long time could have gotten there, or even if it was even possible. But from a family standpoint, just a family relationship dynamics in a family, the family is always trying to kind of protect the weakest member of the family, just as a kind of a core value. Typically, we’re in a team or in a business that isn’t family run. They tend to want to get rid of kind of the weak performers so that they only have the best, you know, a players on their team, the right people in the right seats on the bus and all that. How do you kind of, um, or what advice would you give to family businesses when they’re struggling with some of that?

Brett Horton: Yeah, I think the key is to figure out what is that skill that that person brings to the Organization and to the family because everybody brings a talent. The challenge is we often don’t spend enough time, uh, with that gentleness and kindness and maybe even compassion to discern what is that skill that they bring to that family business. Um, you know, I’m, I’m sitting back here in my, my head is just spinning and the fact that I had the opportunity when I, um, operated winshape retreat to, to have a very close relationship with the three, uh, gen two is what they called it with Truett and Jeanette being gen one. I, I met both Truett and Jeanette and had some brief conversations with them, but I really knew, uh, Dan and Bubba and Trudy. And they have a distinct difference in how they look at life. Uh, but they all bring such marvelous things to chick fil A. And I think what, uh, Truett and Jeanette and then ultimately, Dan as the CEO, kept leaning in to his brothers and sister, uh, to say, hey, what, what is it that you bring forward? And I hope that Andrew and I’m certain he has I don’t know Andrew well, but I’m certain Andrew has said, what is it that those. I think there’s 12 maybe Gen three individuals on that. Don’t quote me on that because I can’t remember how many kids they’ve got of each. But, you know, 10 or 12 individuals as they get around the table, what do they each bring as their, uh, talent? And if they bring that talent and we celebrate that talent. Then the organization is going to continue to get better. That doesn’t mean Andrew as as the head of the organization, isn’t charged with doing some different things, um, that are maybe different, but he still has to lean in on his cousins and his brother and say, you know, what is it that you, you can add to this organization and make a family business continue to grow and prosper and thrive? I mean, here’s a multibillion dollar company still family owned and operated.

Lee Kantor: Right? And in America, that’s the exception, not the rule. Uh, no.

Brett Horton: No.

Lee Kantor: I mean, in Europe, there’s, you know, family businesses that are hundreds of years old. Obviously, America is not that old, but the most family business in America barely make it to the second generation.

Brett Horton: Yeah, we grew up. It was a standing joke was the first generation makes the money. The money, the second generation holds the money and the third generation loses it. I don’t know if that’s necessarily the case, but there are a lot of small family businesses. I just don’t think we see them as large. I mean, I’m I’m here in the Midwest where family farms have have gone to multiple generations, and I haven’t done the research recently. And I understand that corporate farms are, are having an impact on different things, but there’s still a lot of small independent family farms that go back multiple generations. Um, our, our farm itself is over 100 years. And this is in southwest Kansas, which the state’s barely that old.

Lee Kantor: Well, Brett, uh, if somebody wants to learn more about your book or about your firm, get on your calendar, uh, what’s the website? What’s the best way to connect?

Brett Horton: Best way to connect is just go to the website, uh, b3remarkable.com. Uh, you’re welcome to email me at brett@b3remarkable.com. And, uh, I look forward to having a conversation, learning more about the person who’s reaching out. Uh, let’s have a discovery. Let’s have a conversation, and then let’s see if we can work together to make the world a better place because that’s ultimately what we want to do. Um, and hopefully in the, in the meantime, I’ll make enough money to pay the mortgage, but I really just want to make the world a better place.

Lee Kantor: Good stuff. Well, thank you again for sharing your story. You’re doing such important work and we appreciate you.

Brett Horton: I thank you for having me on.

Lee Kantor: All right. This is Lee Kantor. We will see you all next time on High Velocity Radio.

From Ducks to Peacocks: How Brands Can Stand Out in the Age of AI

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High Velocity Radio
High Velocity Radio
From Ducks to Peacocks: How Brands Can Stand Out in the Age of AI
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In this episode of High Velocity Radio, Lee Kantor interviews Scott Goodson, founder of StrawberryFrog, about movement marketing, brand purpose, and how businesses can stand out in an increasingly AI-driven world. Scott explains how companies can build genuine movements around ideas people care about, use AI to transform marketing and customer experiences, and embrace a distinctive “Peacock Mindset” to rise above commoditized content and capture attention.

Scott Goodson is a titan of the global advertising industry. As the co-founder of StrawberryFrog with offices in Europe, Asia, South America, the Middle East and New York, he transformed the agency into a worldwide powerhouse through a philosophy of Movement Marketing.

He is the visionary behind some of the most enduring brand ideas in history, including Emirates Airline, Google, Heineken, Jim Beam, Bluetooth, Smart Car, Truist and Northwell. He has been awarded top awards at the Cannes festival and
D&AD awards.

He is the thought-leading expert, bestselling author, his foundational work in Movement Thinking, the idea that the most powerful brands don’t advertise at audiences but ignite shared purpose, has redefined how global companies approach culture, creativity, and growth. His seminal work, the best seller “Uprising” first defined Movement Thinking, the discipline of turning brands into cultural forces that build a community of passionate advocates.

His second book “Activate Brand Purpose” is a powerful, thought-provoking guide that redefines the way we think about leading a company in these times and how to motivate employees towards positive business outcomes by activating purpose with Movement Thinking.

His agency is ranked among the very best and continues to challenge conventional thinking, working with the world’s most ambitious companies to replace jargon and bureaucracy with breakthrough strategy, exceptional activation, and measurable outcomes.

Connect with Scott on LinkedIn.

What You’ll Learn in This Episode

  • Turning brand purpose into meaningful action through movement marketing.
  • The distinction between big-M societal movements and small-M community movements.
  • Identifying cultural ideas that genuinely matter to audiences.
  • Building trust through authentic purpose and avoiding purpose-washing.
  • Using movements to help smaller companies and startups compete with larger brands.
  • The impact of AI on marketing, consumer insights, content, and customer experience.
  • Using the Peacock Mindset to stand out in an increasingly commoditized AI world.
  • Creating a competitive edge through distinctive ideas, bold positioning, and human creativity.

Transcript-iconThis transcript is machine transcribed by Sonix.

 

TRANSCRIPT

Intro: Broadcasting live from the Business RadioX Studios in Atlanta, Georgia. It’s time for High Velocity Radio.

Lee Kantor: Lee Kantor here another episode of High Velocity Radio and this is going to be a good one. But before we get started, it’s important to recognize our sponsor, Business RadioX. If you’re a business coach or consultant who’s tired of being a best kept secret, set up a call with Stone Payton at bookstonephone.com to unlock your perpetual prospect pipeline. Today on the show, we have the founder of StrawberryFrog, Scott Goodson. Welcome.

Scott Goodson: Hello. Thank you so much for having me.

Lee Kantor: Well, I am excited to learn what you’re up to. Tell us about StrawberryFrog. How are you serving folks?

Scott Goodson: We’re doing great. So StrawberryFrog was designed to be this agile, innovative marketing partner and media and marketing. And we’ve been in the business for about 28 years, and we work with some of the largest and most famous names in the world. We started with a very simple idea, which is you don’t have to be huge to be great. You just need to be highly technically advanced and be able to use the power of technology to help large companies grow and transform.

Lee Kantor: You’ve been around for 28 years. Was your focus always on enterprise level organizations, or was that something that just evolved over time?

Scott Goodson: No, I think our starting point was the launch of the smart car, which we did for Mercedes in Europe. Our first office was in Amsterdam, and that was a startup client, was the launch of this brand new two seater vehicle, which needed a very different marketing strategy, and we at the time realized that the most powerful human organizing frameworks was this idea of movements, which obviously going back 10,000 years has really shaped human behavior and mindsets. And we basically studied the principles of societal movements and distilled that into a formula that companies could use in order to build their own movements for their brands. So when we launched the smart car as our first client, it wasn’t an ad campaign. It was a movement to reinvent the urban environment. So I’m sure you can immediately imagine all the issues that people that live in cities face. Bad parking, traffic, etc. when you build a movement and launch a new brand, it allows you to not only engage with consumers who might be aligned with your idea of what the brand stands for and brand purpose. It also lets you bring in other strategic partners who otherwise would not be interested in helping a car launch, like, for example, mayor’s offices and parking organizations and rental car companies that have airport parking lots full of cars on weekends. Things like that, which have problems to solve, that are connected to the idea of reinventing the urban environment. So that was our first launch. We gave birth to this idea of movement marketing, and since then we’ve worked with Walmart. We did the launch of Truist, which is a very large financial institution in the country. We’ve worked with tech brands. We did the launch of Google. We’ve worked most recently with Afterpay. We work with Northwell Health, which is one of the largest health systems in the country. All sorts of industries, um, where we’ve applied this movement thinking.

Lee Kantor: So do you mind kind of like digging in a little deeper for this movement thinking kind of methodology? How would that become actionable with, for the listeners of this show and the, and the leaders of brands that are working or listening to this right now. How, how do you kind of begin the process of, uh, utilizing this type of movement thinking when launching, you know, any brand?

Scott Goodson: Well, um, there are two types of movements. Uh, the first I call a big M movement. And that is the type of societal movements that, you know, you’re, you, know, you can name when I say, you know, name a movement like the civil rights movement or suffrage movement or, you know, environmental movement, things like that. And, um, so when we launched, for example, Northwell Health, which is a relatively new health system in the most competitive health market in the world, which is New York state, where you have, you know, some of the largest and most famous venerable systems in the world, including New York Presbyterian that was founded by King George in 1777 in those, um, capital, those big movements, uh, you’re really tackling big societal issues. So for Northwell, the idea that the existing health system is broken and needs a new approach, uh, engaged people, um, and helped us establish a really strong and distinctive voice for Northwell in New York State. And as you can imagine, a lot of people would immediately say, yeah, that makes sense. I, I see the existing system as broken and I, I would be welcome. I would welcome a new system that, you know, had values that reflected my values. So we, we did that launch in New York State together with the leadership there. And today, Northwell is the number one brand in New York and Connecticut. That’s a big M movement. A small M movement would be ideas that are relevant to a specific community. So, for example, when we reimagined Pampers, when Pampers had fallen into second place behind Huggies, they hired us to help them reinvent the brand. And we came up with an idea for this really well engineered poop catcher, which was baby development. A baby development is something that all parents would agree with as a valuable goal.

Scott Goodson: We want our babies to develop. We want their minds, their emotion to develop. If they move, their brain stimulates their. Their curiosity increases their vital. All the positive things that happen because of movement is directly related to the growth of the baby and the baby’s development. So we did a movement for baby development, and that movement engaged millions of moms across the United States and then globally, and helped Pampers to regain its number one position against Huggies. So those two those are two examples of movements. And brands can’t create a movement, but they can identify a cultural idea that’s highly relevant to a massive amount of people and then crystallize it in a way that if you do it in the right way, you tie it back to the brand or the product in a smart way? If you don’t do that, then you do what’s called green, not green. Excuse me. You do. Purpose washing, which is basically you fake an idea like you try to pretend that you’re doing a movement, but people can see through that BS pretty fast. So for example, a couple of years ago, Planters Nuts came out and said that they thought women should be paid the same as men because pay equality, if you’re not paying women the same, it’s nuts. And then when you looked into the company behind planters, you saw that they actually don’t pay women the same as men. So it was not a real movement they were doing. So those are two examples, big movement where we’re challenging people’s Expectations of health care for Northwell and in the small end movement case, this idea of taking a stand for baby development was highly relevant.

Lee Kantor: So if you’re a small to midsize company, is it something? Is this just too big for you to approach, or is there a way that you can, uh, make this work for a smaller brand, a mom and pop or a startup or something that doesn’t have an established identity just yet? Can you just, is there an exercise you would recommend them? Uh, leader kind of doing so they can see where maybe there is an existing movement that they can participate in. So they get some of the, at least the halo effect of being part of the movement.

Scott Goodson: Every organization, regardless of how big or how small, should have a movement that they are trying to build. Uh, Jim Collins, the, uh, highly regarded author that wrote B. E. 2.0. Um, which is a terrific book about entrepreneurship, says that in today’s world, whether you’re a startup with one person or 100 people, you really only need four things. You need a vision, you need a purpose, and you need, uh, your core values and you need a B hug. Your big, hairy, audacious goal. I add to that this idea of movement because movement activates your purpose. Problem with purpose is, uh, when you have a purpose, a lot of entrepreneurs spend a lot of time trying to figure out what is my purpose, and they end up with a couple of Silly words on a page, and then they present it to some friends who kind of shrug and go, yeah, that could be good. Um, the problem with that is what do you do with it other than put it on a poster behind your desk? You’ve got to do something with it. And if you think about what a movement is, movement, a movement inspires people to do something, whether they’re your own employees or other stakeholders, whether they’re customers or consumers or partners or suppliers. You want people to be building something with you. And if you start with a very simple movement idea, you’d be surprised how inspiring it is for yourself, for the people that work in your company, for your family and your customers and all other people who you want to attract to your business.

Scott Goodson: And every company can have a movement. Not every company deserves a movement, but certainly everyone could find something in the world that they can help make better change. You know, it’s like watching, um, old Hollywood movies. The storylines of those movies are almost the storylines for what a movement could be. So, for example, old Frankenstein movie you ever saw Young Frankenstein? It’s not it’s not an old Frankenstein movie, but it’s relatively old. Gene Wilder’s movie Young Frankenstein. So there’s a village. One day the monster comes to the village and everybody runs home and gets their pitchfork. So that’s a classic movement strategy. Basically, you find a monster out in the world and you rally people to slay it. So I used exactly that strategy for a major pharmaceutical brand. Um, there’s other very simple movement storylines, like a wrong in society that needs to be righted. Something that shouldn’t be needs to change that simple idea. Those are the those are the basis of great movements. Taking a stand for something and taking a stand against something. And I’m not talking about your competitor or a product that you’re against. I’m talking about a higher idea. Like the example I gave you with Northwell Health, where they were against the status quo health system, and for a more responsible, better, uh, system, in keeping with what New Yorkers are looking for today. So those are examples of of movements.

Lee Kantor: So what is kind of the movement that StrawberryFrog is for or against that is your kind of true north that you aim your purpose at?

Scott Goodson: We are against big, established, expensive, bureaucratic, slow moving, corporate thinking corporate agencies. And we are for agility, for speed, for innovation, for freshness, for new ways of solving old problems. That’s what we’re about. We’re frog versus the dinosaur. In fact, when we started StrawberryFrog, we said our we are against the dinosaur. The dinosaur is the big, slow, bureaucratic, expensive. Not interested in new ideas. That type of mindset. And we are for exactly all the things that I mentioned to you. And we created a little children’s book about the frog versus the dinosaur, how this little frog, this little strawberry frog, a red body with blue legs looks like it’s wearing jeans. It’s kind of like a rebel with jeans. Um, was challenging these big established dinosaurs. And we proved that to be accurate. We, as I mentioned, have worked with some of the largest companies in the world in the United States and across the globe. Um, by bringing fresh perspective and a faster, smarter way to solve problems for huge clients. And we’ve also worked with some small startups that eventually became really big, like Afterpay, which was two guys from Australia that started the Afterpay company and sold it to square a couple of years ago for $29 billion. So brands that start small can grow rapidly. If they have a purpose and a movement that unlocks it.

Lee Kantor: So now when you’re since you’re working a lot with these larger enterprise organizations that probably already have relationships with many agencies, many more than one, usually what is kind of the, the problem they’re going to you for that their current stable of agencies aren’t, it’s not working for them in the manner that they’re doing what they do.

Scott Goodson: I think it’s basically so smart clients are always looking for edge. They’re looking for a smarter way to solve their business problems. And I’ll give you an example. We have a media company. And in today’s media world, let me ask you a question. Do you have cable TV or do you have internet that then allows you to download apps and watch.

Lee Kantor: Yeah, we’re streaming. We we have streaming.

Scott Goodson: Yeah. So when you look at the media buying world, the old world was there was a handful of very large media buying agencies. So clients would go to those big media buying agencies and they would buy and they would. And these media companies would say, hey, we buy so much bulk, we give you better prices. Well, in today’s world, everyone’s cut the cord and there are about 200 platforms out there that are massive buyers of very focused, very targeted, focused expertise. So for example, if you want to buy programmatic, there’s like 3 or 4 huge media buyers out there that are global. If you want to buy SEO, there are three or 4 or 5 companies out there that are top of the by the bulk of the SEO. If you want to do AI search, um, work so that your brand comes up in the AI space, there are a handful of those companies that do that. If you go to a traditional media company, they use those guys. They don’t tell you that, they just charge you for that. So we created a media company to take that advantage to our clients and say, you don’t need media companies. We have strategic media planners that can devise a very smart media strategy. We can then cherry pick the platforms, much like you do with apps. When you have your streaming internet service for your when you’re watching content on your television, we can choose those apps, those platforms, and we can do it 50, 60% cheaper than you can from working with a big media company, and we’ve proven that with very large clients.

Scott Goodson: We have the Reuters global media business. We have Cheesecake Factory, which is a huge QSR client and many others. So we’ve proven that to be true. Um, and then in terms of the services we provide, we can do what huge clients need and want. We just do it, as I said, faster, better and cheaper than the large corporate agencies. And we’ve been doing it for many years. So we have a process that works. Um, clients are constantly looking for an edge, as I said, at the top. And when we meet them, we show our case studies and we show them how we can accomplish, um, transformation. If a company is trying to reimagine themselves, or if they’re trying to launch a brand or a product in a, in a contested market, you know, they want that the challenger mindset. All those things, um, are relevant to a lot of clients these days. And then of course, clients are, um, frozen. A lot of them are with AI, a lot of not just clients, but companies are, are frozen and not sure what to do in this new world of AI. So some of those clients come to us and we’ve worked with them and developed, um, some highly innovative, um, consumer. Basically, we can use AI to pinpoint consumer tastes, behaviors. We can, uh, find insights with AI. We can even use synthetic focus groups. Now we don’t, you know, you don’t need real people to, uh, you know, test ideas. All those things are possible. Um, they’re not always recommended, but they’re certainly possible.

Lee Kantor: So now when you’re working with a client that is struggling with AI, um, holistically throughout their organization. How do you kind of, um, approach that when they’re looking to leverage AI for their marketing or advertising? Because so many firms right now, they don’t even know how to handle AI internally. How are they, uh, looking to you to solve it externally?

Scott Goodson: So I think what you just said is really valid, valuable. You know, the first starting point when we work with clients is, um, is to understand their own enterprise AI transformation. Like how is AI being used internally? Because AI can help bring a lot of disparate systems together, can help, you know, departments that aren’t talking to each other or people that aren’t talking to each other, become more unified and share, um, tools that let them work together more efficiently, etc. so that’s really a starting point. And a lot of the clients we work with, we start there. We have our AI team that are very experienced. And when I say very, I mean it’s, you know, a five year old technology, but they’re pretty advanced. They’ve done this for a lot of systems, a lot of clients. Now, um, then you can really bring, um, you know, when you, when you understand the, let’s say the, where that client is, that company is in terms of their own internal transformation with AI tools, right? Then you can start to talk about AI as a marketing tool. Um, a lot of clients we talk to are trying to bring, um, customer experience, product innovation and marketing together because that’s the holy grail.

Scott Goodson: Those three things like if you, you know, historically, companies have had product innovation separate from marketing and separate from customer experience. If you can bring all those three things together, it makes it much more have greater impact. Um, so I think, you know, the cross cutting implications of AI are significant and they really touch all aspects of the business. I think the other thing to realize is if you look at the marketing funnel, right, if you think about marketing funnel, that is something which can be positively affected across the entire funnel. You can use AI to do everything from which I said to you at the beginning, you can find insights, you can pinpoint consumer data. Uh, that really paints an incredible picture of your customer or your consumer and their needs and wants, um, all the way through to the actual content. You know, we did last year a worldwide AI campaign for visa where 20,000, um, individuals received, uh, individualized personalized advertising, which is one of the things that AI can do today, um, right through to, uh, measurement and tracking.

Lee Kantor: Now what is, um, an area with AI that you’ve been able to deploy for your clients that even surprised you because it is kind of, I guess we’re, we’re in the beginning of the beginning here when it comes to really rolling out AI throughout, uh, organizations. What, what is something you stumbled upon that surprised you, um, in your work with AI?

Scott Goodson: I think for me, I think the most interesting idea was something I called the Peacock mindset versus the duck mindset. I’ve seen that in today’s world. Competence and competent content, competent strategy, competent marketing is duck. And it’s not enough because with AI. Everything becomes commoditized and good performance is no longer a moat, a protective moat for your company. Everyone has access. Think about it. It is a complete. It’s a moment in time when the amount of content. If you thought there was a lot of content out there, just watch this space. There is so much. And not just content, but incredibly well done content. That’s all I. And that that content, I call it a duck is efficient. It’s functional, it’s competent, but ultimately it’s average. And in the age of average, where everything sounds and looks the same in this AI world of synthetic agents that can imitate, replicate, automate everything, then you’re a duck and your company, your brand is going to be neutralized by AI overnight. Your distinction will disappear. So against that, you need to have peacock thinking. And the peacock thinking is basically the idea of a peacock versus a duck. You know, the peacock’s tail is colorful, it’s heavy, It’s biologically unnecessary, but it helps the animal survive and thrive. It signals unshakable strength and resourcefulness. And in business, peacocking is about investing in uncommon human ideas content, bold stances, distinctive flair. That is what’s going to separate you from your competitors. It’s never been more important than now. When the world is flooded with AI generated content. Human attention is the ultimate scarcity, and you can’t win with volume or micro-optimizations against AI machines. So you need this Peacock mindset. You need to be able to really flaunt it to thrive. Boring is too expensive. Surprise is going to help you succeed.

Lee Kantor: Now with AI, everybody has at their fingertips. Now you know the smartest people, the smartest, a tool that allows you to have you know, we thought the internet had gave us access to all kinds of information. But now you have a tool that not only gives you access to all kinds of information, but it also gives you a way to connect the dots with some of this information in very creative ways. It’s become table stakes that you have to be good or great nowadays, and with AI, everybody can become good or great. And like you said, there has to be a way to now stand out. But how do you stand out in a way that still is true to your authenticity and your expertise and your superpowers, and not just be something that looks good from the outside but isn’t really, um, meaningful. Better once you dig a little deeper. So how do you kind of marry the, the expectation of high quality with that, um, need to kind of surprise and delight to be noticed in a world, like you said, is just flooded with exceptionally attractive information that at least seems true and worthwhile.

Scott Goodson: There’s a lot of crap out there and it’s only going to look better, right?

Lee Kantor: But it’s not crap, though. There’s there’s crap. The level of crap is better than than just regular information was a few years ago. So we can call it crap. But it’s, it’s, it’s maybe commoditized information, but like in New York City, you can’t have a crappy restaurant and survive. Like you have to be at least good there. And you, you, you. In today’s world, there’s just so much information that’s good. Um, it’s just difficult for folks to elevate. And now I, your metaphor of the peacock is. Yeah, that’s great. It looks good. It catches my eye. But is it really, you know, good.

Scott Goodson: So I think the, the example you used isn’t really the challenge. It’s not so much about, um, the restaurant. It’s about a really great new product that has no audience, a really great new innovation that’s trying to establish itself in this market right now, a new product, a new brand. That is the challenge. Now, what you said is 100% accurate. It has to be fantastic. It has to be great. If it sucks, it’ll disappear. But if it’s very good. There’s no guarantee that just because it’s great, it’s going to get attention. What I’m saying is in that world, and I’ve written this in two books in my bestseller uprising, which is this whole idea of movements. And in the second book called Activate Brand Purpose, both of those books detail exactly how, if you’re a startup, how you can take the basics that Jim Collins mentioned in be 2.0, but then activate that with a movement. Movements can’t be faked or they shouldn’t be because if they are, then they will fail because they’re opportunistic or greenwashing. The core requirement for a movement is to deliver genuine value, to catalyze change, or build a real community around a shared value system like baby development. That’s not bullshit. That’s real. There are people that are passionate about that. You need to build your community with your movement.

Scott Goodson: That will then be the perfect place for you to introduce your product. That’s how you get it out there. That’s how you build it. Traditional advertising is dead, but empathy isn’t the. The main. The main idea starts with a brand that is trying to engage people and consumers. Today. They just don’t want to. They’re not listening to product messages and pitches anymore. So how do you engage them other than waste a lot of money in advertising? Movements shifts the focus from the product to the people. It identifies an idea on the rise in culture, an idea people are passionate about, and then aligns the brand with that shared human motivation. That’s why people care. Like I’m sure you that you care about certain things. And I’m sure if a brand came to you and said, hey, uh, business podcasts are really important in today’s world. And this movement is about helping business podcasts thrive. You would be more likely to be open to what they were going to say next. Or maybe you would even join a Facebook group that that believed in that cause. Maybe you could learn a few things. That’s the basic premise. Align with what people care about. Don’t just shove a product in their face with some really good content.

Lee Kantor: Right? But is this a world we live in now that the only winners are going to be the ones that have enterprise level advertising budgets to get the word out? Like, is it possible for an up and comer to bootstrap in the manner, um, that we used to be able to. Or is this now a world of the haves and have nots when it comes about communicating a message?

Scott Goodson: The have nots have used movements to become the haves for centuries. When my, my wife and I moved into our village where we live in New York, and every single morning, every parent or almost every parent drove their SUVs to the school. We live in a town that’s one square mile, and they drove their kids to school every single day in their SUVs. And my wife was like, and they would line up for an hour, you know, with the cars pouring out fumes and little kids walking by all these SUVs. And my wife said, this is nuts. So she started a movement called Walk to School. And today that village, every single parent walks their kids to school. Almost every parent. Anyone can do it. It’s about just taking a moment and thinking a little differently. Being curious about what’s going on in your little community, or whatever the product or service is that you want to launch in this world. Instead of thinking just about the product, just about the service. Think for a moment about the people you want to reach. What is important to them in their lives, not just in terms of the product, but in their lives? How might your product connect to a bigger part of their lives than simply just use case, right? Like products for centuries have been more than just use cases.

Scott Goodson: You know, you don’t buy a rock. Uh, that is clear To give to your your fiance. You do it because you love her. You want to be engaged. You want to be wed. You know, products have use cases, but they also have higher values and ideas. Just take a moment and think about it. What are some ideas in society that you passionate about? And many, you know, if you talk to a lot of entrepreneurs, they’ll tell you, like, I started this company because I just think there’s an opportunity here. People are just fed up with this and that and the other thing. Okay. All right. We’ll distill that a little more, spend a little time on that and try to write it out into a very simple movement framework. What are you for? What are you against? And try to articulate it in one simple sentence that your child would understand. And if you can do that, you’re on your way to a movement. And if you need additional help, you can listen to activate brand purpose on audible.

Lee Kantor: Well, Scott, thank you so much for sharing your story today. You’re doing such important work and we appreciate you. What is the best way for someone to connect with you or somebody on the team and maybe get a hold of your books, uh, and learn more about the movement thinking.

Scott Goodson: I would go to, um, my LinkedIn, Scott Goodson on LinkedIn or Scott Goodson dot m e.

Lee Kantor: All right. Well, thank you so much. And then StrawberryFrog. The website.

Scott Goodson: strawberryfrog.com. Yes.

Lee Kantor: All right, all right. Scott. Well, thank you so much for sharing your story.

Scott Goodson: Thanks, Lee.

Lee Kantor: All right. This is Lee Kantor. We’ll see you all next time on High Velocity Radio.

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