Lois Songster with Eon Hawk

Intro: [00:00:07] Coming to you live from the Business RadioX studio in Woodstock, Georgia. This is Fearless Formula with Sharon Cline.

Sharon Cline: [00:00:17] Welcome to Fearless Formula on Business RadioX, where we talk about the ups and downs of the business world and offer words of wisdom for business success. I’m your host, Sharon Cline, and today in the studio we have an eco forward artist based in Canton, Georgia. Her work focuses on finding moments of joy in the surrounding environment, giving a viewer a break from the real world who couldn’t use that. Let’s welcome to the studio Lois Songster. Hello.

Lois Songster: [00:00:46] Hello. Hi. Thank you so much for that wonderful intro.

Sharon Cline: [00:00:48] Oh, thank you. You wrote that. So it’s gorgeous. You did a good job. Well, you know, it’s artists is different. It’s not like you say I’m a plumber and I do this. You could be an art in so many different mediums. So why don’t we start with what your mediums are?

Lois Songster: [00:01:00] Sure. I work in like I’m a multi media artist, so I work in a variety of mediums. I grew up as a child dabbling in watercolor, so that’s how I started. And then I fell into college. Gouaches printmaking, paper making, wood burning, painting on wood, like with acrylics or gouaches as well. And then digital art. So like I know Adobe, I know procreate. So I do a variety of stuff.

Sharon Cline: [00:01:27] You are a true multi-media artist, so all right. You started when you were a child in watercolor and so did you always stick with this when you were young? You just knew that you liked to create art. I always wonder where people sort of discover that their their talent or their joy is creation like that.

Lois Songster: [00:01:44] I like that you say joy because, like, I’ve met a ton of people who say like, Oh, I’m not creative, I’ve never been creative. And I absolutely think that’s not true. Everyone is creative in their own way and they find joy in what they want to do. I always drew things. I always liked taking out a pencil, drawing shapes. I made my own comic when I was like six, and I just knew that I always wanted to do something creative. I just didn’t know if I could do it as a business and I kind of got scared away from it at the end of high school and then came back into it in college. So I think that’s a big turning point for people.

Sharon Cline: [00:02:18] Right? So you went you grew up in Athens, You went to University of Georgia. So did you do art work in in college like that?

Lois Songster: [00:02:25] I did. When I was a freshman. I had to decide between being an ecology major, which is what I came in as, and then being an art major. Oh, gosh.

Sharon Cline: [00:02:33] They’re so different.

Lois Songster: [00:02:34] Aren’t they? They are. And I didn’t know what to do because they were both very intensive. I could either be ecology and basically be sad for four years, taking hard courses and then having a job. Or I could be an art major for four years and be very happy and learning what I wanted to do, but not sure how that was going to pay out. And I decided to take the risk and do art school because I felt like I didn’t want to torture myself for something I wasn’t sure about and I wanted to do, like, see if I could make this work.

Sharon Cline: [00:03:03] So okay, so that’s a big leap because a lot of people, it’s like saying, I want to be an actor or a voice actor, voice over artist like me, you know, to to not know what your work is going to be, to not have steady work, to not know that you can count on anything that does require a big leap of faith. But how did you decide that it was worth it to you? What did you do to kind of make it okay? Because a lot of people have these dreams and wants, but like that leap of actually doing it, it’s very difficult.

Lois Songster: [00:03:29] That’s a great question. Well, I grew up my parents run a small business, So part of it is like I always saw small business as an option. I never saw them work a corporate job. My dad worked for other small businesses and then started his own. And my mom was always supporting him and being the accountant, like she’s like the office manager for all that. So they run a small business together. And then when I decided to be an artist, I was like, I don’t know how I’m going to make it work, but if other people can figure it out and they can do it, I can make it work too. And being around other artists as well, I had a lot more business mentality already in college, so I was like, Look, if I can’t make it work, then none of these guys are going to make it work either. So I got to try.

Sharon Cline: [00:04:09] So you felt like you had the right support and sort of a good foundation of what you could expect as a small business owner, so to.

Lois Songster: [00:04:15] Speak, Right? Yeah, yeah. I had a growing up around that, so I kind of knew how difficult it could be. There wasn’t any like rose tinted glasses about like, No, I’ll just fall into it. I’ll start making money my first year. Like, no, like it takes work. It takes time to build up the revenue to actually, like, support yourself on your small business.

Sharon Cline: [00:04:33] What did you start with when you were first making your business? What was your first sort of art or product that you were making money from?

Lois Songster: [00:04:41] So when I started my business, it was about two years after college because I kind of everyone graduates college and they’re like, What now? And so I kind of panicked and had a lot of jobs figuring out what I wanted to do, how I was going to build up my art. And then I had a part time job as a legal assistant, and that allowed me enough time to start doing. And this. Was during Covid. Oh, wow. I saw that a lot of artists were struggling during this time, but I also saw a lot of people getting Covid pets. And I was thinking if people were going to spend money on art, it was going to be for their pets that they were now spending a lot more time with. So I started doing pet portraits a lot.

Sharon Cline: [00:05:18] Oh, that’s clever. That was good marketing in your mind, I guess. You know, you put that together. This is where people’s loves and hearts are. Let me make it more, you know? I mean, who doesn’t love something personalized about their pet? I don’t care what it is. An ornament, A mug. I don’t know if people love all of that.

Lois Songster: [00:05:37] Yeah, it’s a whole market. And it’s also like, that’s kind of what I work in. I like drawing environmentally things. I like drawing mythological things and I like drawing pets. So that just kind of fell right in line for me.

Sharon Cline: [00:05:49] Wow, that was so smart. It’s interesting, too, because so many people, we talk about what it’s like on during the pandemic, on the show in particular, and some how people adapted. Some people didn’t survive and wound up doing something completely different. One of my favorite stories is Bananas in Beehives, Lori Sutton. She talks about how they had a storefront, but then during the pandemic, they really wound up wholesaling more. And now that’s almost strictly what they do. And but that they flowed with the circumstance that they were in. And so it sounds like you did the exact same thing. Yeah.

Lois Songster: [00:06:24] I mean, I had I think a lot of people had time to think and having that space to think really helps you figure out like, what do I want to do? Like, how is this going to work? And I didn’t want to run an art business if I couldn’t make it work. And that was the most important thing for me. Like, I love art, but if I can’t make it a sustainable business, then it’s not right for me or I’m doing something wrong and I have to pivot and find something creative I can do and I can do art on the side, but like I need to make it work, right?

Sharon Cline: [00:06:52] And you were talking about environmentalism. You have a passion for that in your art. Can you talk about that?

Lois Songster: [00:06:57] Sure. So I grew up that’s again, my parents influence. We were always eco minded growing up and I really appreciated that. And in my art, I saw a lot of other artists when there was ecological art being made very obviously styled for like recycled fibers, like any kind of eco fashion. Ten years ago, you could see the recycled fibers, you could see the tan coloring. Interesting. Yeah. And so I wanted to find a way to design things in an environmentally friendly or sustainable fashion without needing to have that style to it. I didn’t think that was necessary. So you can do that by sourcing local sourcing zero waste. So I use a shipping company, eco clothes, zero waste, recycled packaging and anything on that website. And it’s interesting, pretty close to regular packaging as well. So that’s one way that I’m like very environmentally conscious.

Sharon Cline: [00:07:49] Wow. I have not heard of this before though.

Lois Songster: [00:07:52] Oh, I’m happy to share them. They’re a great website. I use them for all my packaging and then other examples as well. So I partner with a local print shop in my hometown. So then all my prints are made locally rather than like large corporations, smaller carbon footprint as well for traveling. They make sure that they use bamboo paper. So like that’s environmentally friendly. It’s a good source for paper. And then they also work with recycled products as well because we we worked on that agreement together.

Sharon Cline: [00:08:19] How difficult is it, do you think, for a company to go that route? Is it is the challenge just really in their mind? Or is it would it be a real adjustment?

Lois Songster: [00:08:29] It depends. Like I’ve talked to other clients before when I’m working on art stuff and I come to them saying this is how I work. If you don’t work like that, then we can’t work together. And we have those environmental discussions for large companies or small companies to pivot to environmental environmentalism. I think it depends on their values. Sometimes certain industries, it might cost more overhead and then you’ll see returns later on, which is a hard sell.

Sharon Cline: [00:08:58] Well, you’re talking about the environment where sometimes there isn’t anything quantifiable. You can’t measure it exactly right.

Lois Songster: [00:09:04] You can’t. But you’re also talking to a company that wants to make a profit at the end. And if that’s cutting into their profits, like, I don’t like that. But I can’t disagree. I disagree with it either. And so it’s just a continuing conversation. Same with like getting solar power as an energy source Now, like convincing homeowners to do that nowadays it’s the conversation of no other utility can bring you back money like solar can like you’re actually getting money back on your power. But that’s another.

Sharon Cline: [00:09:33] Conversation.

Lois Songster: [00:09:34] For environmentalism and art. It’s more of like it might be a little bit more upfront, but then you can always label yourself as that.

Sharon Cline: [00:09:42] So do you do you think that environmentalism is also what inspires you for your art?

Lois Songster: [00:09:48] Um, I think it’s just a necessary part of it. I think if I want to run my own business, this is just a natural part of that of that process. Like, I don’t make things Sometimes I make things politically motivated in my art, and environmentalism is one of them, Yes. But generally I don’t make subjects so much about that, partially because I don’t want to remind people of what’s happening in the world.

Sharon Cline: [00:10:10] I like that you want people to escape. I mean, it actually is a gift in this way because it’s so much of what we see on our phones and everything in front of us all the time has got some message about something we should be spending or doing. But when you’re talking about being inspired with something beautiful, that’s a totally different reaction, totally different motivation. And so talk to me a little bit about sort of what inspires you and what kind of artwork is your favorite.

Lois Songster: [00:10:36] So I, I struggled with that idea for a long time because throughout art school, seeing things on social media, you see all these arts like there’s so many artists making such good art and way better than me. Like, I just know that. Oh, um, but what they talk about is a lot of the time, either a lot of things are happening in the world around them. They make responses to that. There’s protest art where people are reacting and trying to educate people on what’s going on in the world. And I struggled with that, saying thinking, should I be doing this? Is this my place where I need to be educating people as well and letting them know about what’s going on? And if I try to make escapism art, am I helping people in that way? Am I just running away from the problems and trying to bury my head in the sand? And I was worried about that and beating myself about it? Um, it’s really.

Sharon Cline: [00:11:28] Interesting too, because you feel like you almost have a responsibility, but then you also don’t want to to create stress for someone.

Lois Songster: [00:11:35] Yeah, and that’s what I came to. I realized that it’s not I’m not trying to escape. I’m just trying to bring comfort for myself, selfishly, and then also for other people where I want them to look at my art. And I’ve had these comments before when I’ve had shows or people have seen my large works where they’re like, I just like looking at it. I don’t know why.

Sharon Cline: [00:11:55] I just it just felt.

Lois Songster: [00:11:56] Nice to look.

Sharon Cline: [00:11:57] At and.

Lois Songster: [00:11:58] That, that, that one comment like I have had that a couple of times and that’s been the thing that’s stuck in my head. Nothing else. People are saying I like your work or I like the message or whatever, or I have some sassy stickers that are people just chuckle at. But the comment of it’s just pretty to look at and I just it makes me really happy. That’s the best thing I’ve ever heard.

Sharon Cline: [00:12:17] Oh, that’s good to know. Yeah, well, I think too, it’s art is so interesting because it’s so subjective. It’s the same as a voiceover artist. Not everybody. Can you believe it? Not everybody likes the life. Sorry, I was going to do it without laughing. Oh, not everybody likes how I sound, believe it or not. But it’s interesting in that way because there is a voice for every, you know, every, I guess, person out there that wants to sell something. But there’s art for every kind of person right there is.

Lois Songster: [00:12:42] And it’s finding your audience for that. Or just like this constant struggle for an artist like, Oh gosh, any artist who talk to and I’m sure voiceover as well, there’s going to be imposter syndrome of just like, I’m not good enough for this or I can’t do this. I’ve talked to people who have worked for Cartoon Network, who work in big companies and stuff like that, and they still say, like, I think I’m a fraud.

Sharon Cline: [00:12:59] Yeah, I know. I can’t believe they let me in this building still. Like I know the code and everything. Like, how come at some point it’s going to be over, right?

Lois Songster: [00:13:06] And so that’s like everyone’s personal struggle of like the reason of should I be making this art? Do people actually like this? Like, I’m going to show it to you on the Internet? Like, is this okay?

Sharon Cline: [00:13:16] Well, you were talking about knowing your audience. Who do you think your audience is?

Lois Songster: [00:13:20] Instagram says it’s people between 20 and 35 female. But who I think my audience is I think it’s a mixture of people. Like there I have these like what I said, sassy stickers or kind of these funny animals and people like the messages or they kind of cackle it like, yes.

Sharon Cline: [00:13:35] So you do you make stickers as well, which I don’t think we had mentioned, but you do, and you’ve got several of them on your website. So it’s kind of cute to see the different sassiness, but like so, so your they think your audience is like 20 to 25 year old females, right? That’s so funny because they’re really specific.

Lois Songster: [00:13:53] Oh Instagram like yeah it can really pinpoint audiences of like, this is your demographic right here. And TikTok is the same. It can pinpoint very specific groups or even tell you where people are viewing the videos. And I’m like, That’s a I have a large American audience that makes sense. But sometimes I’m like, Oh, someone looked at me from Italy. That’s cool.

Sharon Cline: [00:14:11] Exactly. Okay, so let’s talk about your stickers, because that’s like a huge thing right now. I’ve seen lots of different kinds. Like even at YPO, there’s stickers. There’s like the hedgehog hedgehog sticker. Those are cute. Yeah, they are cute. So tell me about what inspired you to do that.

Lois Songster: [00:14:26] So I have quite a few stickers and they’re different inspirations. There’s these I do vinyl stickers because I want them. You can’t get away environmentally with like paper stickers don’t last long and I don’t want people to pay for that, like if they’re just going to water away. For the vinyl stickers. I want them to last a long time. If I’m going to make something made out of plastic, let it last a long time. Make it worth it. But for the sassy animal ones, it was kind of after there had been some political rumblings about rights of women and their bodies. And I was kind of I don’t usually make politically minded stickers, but I was, in this case, trying to vent some of my feelings about that. And so I made like a skunk that said my body, my stink. I made like things like that, like little messages that are kind of like toeing the line, but not trying to be trying to make a joke out of it. Make it humorous in a way, because I don’t like such heavy handed of like or the aggression of it. I know there’s a lot of anger out there, but I want I just want someone to laugh or like kind of chuckle being like, ha ha. Or like, I have this print and the sticker of this raccoon that says, Today I’ve chosen violence. And I’m like, You know, sometimes you wake up with a mood.

Sharon Cline: [00:15:38] And today’s my my choice.

Lois Songster: [00:15:40] That is not to be like frowned upon. Like sometimes people are like, Don’t touch me. And that’s okay. Emotion to have.

Sharon Cline: [00:15:48] So you use social media a good bit for your art?

Lois Songster: [00:15:51] Yes, I’m a millennial. I heavily use social media.

Sharon Cline: [00:15:55] Was there life before social media for you? Pretty much. No.

Lois Songster: [00:15:59] No. Yeah, I have a childhood memory of like starting on a Facebook and like, being like, wow, I can be friends with like, I remember the beginnings of Facebook, so I’m dating myself.

Sharon Cline: [00:16:08] Okay, well, how do you, as an artist distinguish yourself on social media and how do you use it, social media for yourself? And do you also advertise that something people talk about, like on Facebook, you can buy an ad or whatever, but I was wondering what you do in order to use social media to grow your business.

Lois Songster: [00:16:26] So I do use social media. I think it’s an important I do think it’s an important connection point. I’ve met wonderful artists through there. I’ve had wonderful conversations. I’ve seen people who react to my art in such a wonderful way. I also think it’s a cancer that, like people doomscroll, I think people get really addicted to it. And I think it it’s just we don’t talk about the moderation of it so much. It’s either one or the other. It’s not like, Hey, maybe just use a little bit of it. And when you catch yourself, just stop. Or like, you know, maybe not make that comment when you’re really agitated right now.

Sharon Cline: [00:16:57] That requires discipline. And, you know, I get a notification every Sunday about how often or how long I’ve been on my phone, how many hours or whatever, which is kind of horrifying. But you’re right, there is a balance. And I think it’s very easy to get out of balance completely.

Lois Songster: [00:17:11] Yeah. And I think it’s like it’ll be a continuing conversation, but I think it’s like here to stay. I think it’ll just change in different ways. But I do think there needs to be conversations of moderation or not, just like throwing away new ways to connect with people because there are good things about it. Like I think people have had wonderful communities on Facebook and Instagram and TikTok. Although worries about TikTok being banned in the United States, probably fair, but there’s going to be some form of that, right? Right.

Sharon Cline: [00:17:36] So you’re on TikTok. Yeah, I’m going to friend you. Yeah, you’re on Instagram. I don’t know if I offended you there yet. You’re also on LinkedIn. Where else can people find you? Like where else do you have do you have pictures of your art on your website as well?

Lois Songster: [00:17:49] I do.

Sharon Cline: [00:17:50] So these are for sale as well?

Lois Songster: [00:17:52] Yeah. So I do a web store. I think any small business owner in the arts having multiple streams of revenue. Sorry, I can’t talk. Revenue is really important. So not just relying on a web store and not just relying on like Patreon or stuff like that. Like make sure that you have a well rounded cushion. Kind of like investing, Right? Right.

Sharon Cline: [00:18:10] But you also have stores where you’ll do or you’ll go to an art show or something like that. Yeah. So I’ll do that. Oh, you do conventions? Yeah. Well, dang. So tell us where you go. Where, where can people find your art in person if they ever wanted to?

Lois Songster: [00:18:24] I set up a schedule, so I’ll tell people when I’m going somewhere. The last convention I went to was a sakura-con in Seattle, which was awesome. It was really big. So many fun people there. People made comments about my art because it wasn’t fandom, so it was like, Wow, this is like really different. I’m like, Good, glad you like it.

Sharon Cline: [00:18:41] So explain to me fandom. So as if you were drawing like a Spider-Man or something like that. Exactly. Yeah.

Lois Songster: [00:18:47] So it’s kind of like and it depends on the convention. There’s all these rules, like kind of this whole community of artists who just go to conventions, they’ll go to like ten in a year. Wow. And you can make some good money there, but you need to know your market and you and some conventions are kind of anti fandom. So they’re like, you can’t you have to have original content and artists try to sneak under that and be like, Oh, it’s not. This shows character. It’s like they’re like, if my original character of that, you know, it’s not.

Sharon Cline: [00:19:14] But it’s like a.

Lois Songster: [00:19:15] Lot of kind of like dodging the rules or trying to see if you can actually get through selling merch. Some others don’t care about that. But it’s kind of the Wild West of like different conventions, especially after Covid. Like those things have exploded.

Sharon Cline: [00:19:26] No way. I didn’t think about that at all. Yeah, well, so what would you say is your favorite type of artwork to create?

Lois Songster: [00:19:34] When I have time. I really do like painting gouache on wood.

Sharon Cline: [00:19:38] So gouache. We had talked about it before the show because I wanted to make sure I said it correctly. And I’m so glad you said it a couple of times. I’m like, That’s right. What is gouache?

Lois Songster: [00:19:49] Okay. People who know it are going to get mad at me because I don’t know the chemical makeup of it, but I like to describe it as if, you know, watercolors. Watercolors are a beautiful, transparent layer. You can build up the colors. You always kind of have to protect. The white on the paper. And gouache is a much more is a thicker matte variety, I would say, of watercolor. It comes in smaller tubes. It’s a beautiful I don’t know how to describe the texture, but just think of it as this flat matte kind of wash that you can get. And it’s a very it’s thicker than transparent. So it’s a really beautiful material when you see it.

Sharon Cline: [00:20:22] Interesting. So you like to create art using that medium.

Lois Songster: [00:20:26] It flows. It’s a very lovely flow and it has beautiful pastel colors like all the Instagram artists are like, I use this brand and it’s these beautiful, like peachy colors.

Sharon Cline: [00:20:35] Oh, interesting. So what do you like to it? So can you imagine describing some of the art that you’ve loved for a listener who is trying to picture it in their head?

Lois Songster: [00:20:46] I make like very bright colors, either mythical creatures, kind of like my own creatures that I make up in my head, or I have animals usually of a larger size, usually very comfortably fed, and also just like organic scenes. So like environments of flowers or native plants and things like that. Those are kind of things that inspires me. I really like doing Animal like designs.

Sharon Cline: [00:21:17] Got you. And specifically, we were talking about how you have been able to do dogs as something. So do you still help people like do artwork for their dogs?

Lois Songster: [00:21:27] I can. I have commissions closed currently because I’m pivoting. I just don’t really have the time right now. I’m pivoting to doing murals or wholesale, which is a whole different beast. And I’m and other things as well, like reopening my Patreon, changing up the merch on my store. So like I have a lot of things going on right now.

Sharon Cline: [00:21:44] What was it like to create this business? And so you have your name of your business. Ethan Hawke. Ethan Hawke So, and it’s an LLC that’s like what mine is as well. So if someone were looking into creating their own business, that is art. What would you suggest are the best ways to get started? Like, I mean, you think about it, you’re relatively young and here you have this great company that you’ve created, you know, that’s intimidating for someone who doesn’t know even where to start.

Lois Songster: [00:22:11] Yeah. And I always, like any artist, can reach out to me if they find me and they’re like, Hey, I’m trying to start, what do I do? And I’m like, I’ll take care of it. I’ll help you wherever I can. It’s so sweet because I love like, it’s hard for artists like either if you’re self-taught or you go to school, they don’t talk about how to start a business. They talk about how to be an artist. But nowadays, being an artist and running a business is the same thing in my mind. So I have a lot of conversations, the same conversations with artists of they’re stuck. They don’t know what to do. And I’m like, Well, this is what I did and maybe it’ll work for you, maybe not. But I can at least be a voice to like, listen to you. And it’s kind of also like comforting. Like a lot of artists are panicking. Like, I don’t know what to do. Am I good enough? And I’m like, Yes, yes, you are.

Sharon Cline: [00:22:51] I promise. How sweet is that? Yeah, but people need a hand. It is a scary world out there, especially when you’re talking about someone who uses is it their their right brain so much as a creative way. But you really need to be able to access the logic part to be able to have a business plan or, you know, accessing numbers, you know, keeping your budget or whatever it is. So I think you’re right these days you have to be strong in both ways, right?

Lois Songster: [00:23:17] Or just like opening up for support so many artists have talked to are like, I’m going to make my own website, I’m going to run my own business, I’m going to try and do my accounting. And I’m like, No, you don’t have to do all that. And no one expects a small business to do that. Don’t, don’t do that because you’re not going to be good at it. All of it. I’m not.

Sharon Cline: [00:23:32] What do you recommend they do.

Lois Songster: [00:23:34] When starting a business? I like seeing what are you producing and what would you like to go into? And then I talk to them about making a plan. How much revenue do you want to make from this or what are your steps for that and when do you want to start? Because I’ve had artists being like, Oh, you do stickers, can I start doing inventory? And I’m like, It took me two years before I even felt like jumping off into doing this full time. Like, you are not going to start immediately unless you’re lucky or very talented or have been doing this for a while. Great. But not everyone is like that.

Sharon Cline: [00:24:02] The average isn’t right.

Lois Songster: [00:24:03] No. And for art especially, it is a slow turning wheel. Like you have got to get the presence of it. You’ve got to get inventory up. You’ve got to get like your idea of like your style and like I still work on those things or tweak them all the time. But you have to get into the routine of making in order to start selling or getting your feet wet and getting recognized by people.

Sharon Cline: [00:24:25] Okay, So there are two things I wanted to ask you about that. One is how do you keep your inventory going? So do you create art every day? Do you have to schedule it for yourself? Do you have to have business hours so that you don’t burn yourself out?

Lois Songster: [00:24:40] I keep business hours like I’m trying now not to work during the weekend as much unless I want to make something for myself. And I’ve seen I’ve talked to other artists. Like having a schedule and structure helps most people. And if not that, then at least having a clear idea of what do you want to make like having. A clean idea of who you are as an artist. And then what do you make that fills that niche? You don’t have to keep organized like that. You can do a lot of different things, but either continuously making in a healthy, regular way or being mindful of breaks. So you’re like, I’ve been making for a while, so let me just take a break for a little bit. Being aware of holidays like most artists start making for Christmas four months in advance. Oh, wow. Oh yeah. And getting all that ready. If there’s any challenges that are happening on the Internet that can help float your brand, get those ready in advance. But that also requires a very organized person. I am not perfect about that. I’m aware of what would be best. I don’t hit that.

Sharon Cline: [00:25:40] All the time. Do you think it’s really important for someone to have sort of their own niche like that?

Lois Songster: [00:25:45] I think it helps a lot. And I think if you’re not actively finding one, you’re going to fall into one because like artists kind of like they might develop their own style and then people just go to them because they’re like, No one else makes something like this. There’s an artist. I don’t know if you know anything about Magic, The Gathering I do, a little bit, yeah. So Seth McKinnon, he’s a fantastic artist, and I found him through those cards. And now I just love his art on just for what he does. I haven’t seen another artist make work like he does, and I think he’s just found a crowd of people who love his work because he’s made his own niche. I don’t think he was intentional in going in that direction. He just created what he loved and was very intentional in his inspirations to do that. But people now love him and search for his cards because he is so different than anyone else who creates cards for those industry. So it’s similar for a lot of artists who might not follow that.

Sharon Cline: [00:26:32] Interesting. So and have you ever considered maybe doing something similar where you are part of a bigger project?

Lois Songster: [00:26:39] Um, yes, I think so. But I want to get my own following larger first and like get more of my awareness out there first before I start going for the big corporations. Because like those kind of places are like applications that can take years or like you have to have a very strong personal style to do that. It it depends.

Sharon Cline: [00:26:57] Okay, It’s a whole world I don’t know anything about. I thought you just jump in. It’s fascinating, though, right? Yeah. I don’t know why. I just assume some things will be easy until you get there and you’re like, No, this isn’t easy. We were just talking about that with, like, voiceover work. A lot of people ask me, I want to do it. You know, I think I could do it. I’ve always wanted to do it. Like, let’s talk about like the background of because you can jump in some, you know, but most often it takes a lot of practice and work and instruction and understanding the industry. And so I guess I was similar with you, with your question where I’m like, why can’t you just like go do it?

Lois Songster: [00:27:28] But isn’t that fascinating? Like, I love learning about industries I know nothing about. I don’t know anything about voice overs. And I would love after this to talk to you more about like, how does that work? And not because I’m interested in doing it myself just because I don’t know it, right? So that’s a lot of art where I can find new things in the art world of like, I didn’t even know you could use wax crayons for this or I didn’t know you could reverse engineer watercolors like my new CRO fixation or Hyperfixation is making your own inks from scratch. So like, now’s the season to be collecting certain plants to make your own dyes and make your own inks. And that’s so cool.

Sharon Cline: [00:28:02] I’ve heard that’s how you create indigo.

Lois Songster: [00:28:04] Yes. Can you beautiful.

Sharon Cline: [00:28:06] Plant? It is beautiful. And it’s a special color blue.

Lois Songster: [00:28:08] It’s a really gorgeous blue. It’s like I can’t even describe the color. I wish if this was a visual medium, I’d be showing it right now.

Sharon Cline: [00:28:15] I know. Like holding up our phones to No. One.

Lois Songster: [00:28:18] But yeah, Indigo is very famous and well known idea of that. But you can make like I use walnut ink sometimes and that’s from processing walnut. So then it’s this beautiful brown, almost black ink and it has this musky smell to it until like kind of kills some of the bacteria in it or like the living organic matter in it. And that’s a really cool ink to use.

Sharon Cline: [00:28:40] When you look at art, that’s something like Native American art where they did use things like that. Do you ever can you ever tell, Oh, I know what they use to make this?

Lois Songster: [00:28:48] Oh, it depends. Like each culture has a different process for how they make their inks. And it’s even different, of course, than modern day processing of ink or how even people scavenge today because we have like soda ash and stuff like that.

Sharon Cline: [00:29:00] Soda ash.

Lois Songster: [00:29:02] Don’t ask me what’s in there. I know I used it for papermaking and stuff like that. I have no idea what it’s made of.

Sharon Cline: [00:29:08] I’ve never heard of it. It’s like two words you just threw together. I would have been like, Yeah, soda ash could be anything. It’s a soft.

Lois Songster: [00:29:13] Like I felt it before. It’s a soft, ash like material. My college professors are going to be pissed.

Sharon Cline: [00:29:18] Oh, that’s okay. We’ll move on. But. All right. So what other kinds of organic materials do you use to make ink? I’m thinking like, is it like berries?

Lois Songster: [00:29:26] You can use berries, leaves, flowers, roots. Ash makes a beautiful gray black. And, you know, charcoal is like a traditional way to make like a black as well.

Sharon Cline: [00:29:37] Totally makes sense.

Lois Songster: [00:29:38] So like, there’s tons of organic varieties like bark stuff, like whatever you see out there will make a color of some kind. You just might be surprised by like how many browns there are.

Sharon Cline: [00:29:49] Or greens I imagine.

Lois Songster: [00:29:51] To it. Actually. Green I think is hard to make, like from what I know. So there’s a color museum. I don’t know where in the United States but they. Keep in preserve like very rare pigments that can’t be made anymore or very hard to make. So there are stones that you can use to make blue or greens like Lapis lazuli is from that color is from a stone that is hard to find nowadays. And then there’s very famous examples like Mummy Brown, which you can’t make anymore.

Sharon Cline: [00:30:16] Mummy Brown.

Lois Songster: [00:30:17] Can you guess why you’re not allowed to make it anymore?

Sharon Cline: [00:30:20] Well I’m assuming they used it with mummies.

Lois Songster: [00:30:23] Mummy, bandages, bandages.

Sharon Cline: [00:30:25] Mummy bandages or maybe.

Lois Songster: [00:30:27] Mummy parts. I’m not sure but it was a very very specific brown. Oh wow. So interesting. They have that preserved in the color museum and you can kind of see a little bit of it and they use it for art restoration purposes or for research purposes, but not normal person can’t get it anymore.

Sharon Cline: [00:30:42] Wow. So a normal person, we’re not normal. We can get it. I like that you said that. Okay. So how do you. Business wise, How do you manage? What is the natural feeling, the natural emotion of fear? How do you manage to believe in yourself enough to keep going where if you don’t make a certain amount of money per month or whatever, it’s very easy for people to fall back into what they know as a standard. And so what is your fearless formula?

Lois Songster: [00:31:18] I’m going to make a joke of. The secret is I don’t stop.

Sharon Cline: [00:31:22] You got to make it. Oh, I know. Fake it till you make it. That’s the truth. Yeah.

Lois Songster: [00:31:27] Um, you go in with the plan, like you make sure that you can build up revenues of enough. Like, if I keep this up, you have a security blanket of funds. You make sure that you have savings going into it of, like, I can do this. Like, I had a conversation with my fiance of like, I’m going to do this for six months if I’m not making money, or at least breaking even or not making money. By this time, we have a conversation about what I need to do. I might need to retract and not ready to go fully freelance yet. And that’s not a failure. That’s a learning. You’re like, I’m figuring out how to be freelance. I’m not ready to do that yet. It’s kind of like a baby bird deciding to fly. And they’re like, not ready yet. No, hold on. Give me like, two more weeks and I’ll be good to go. So you make sure that you keep a security blanket of emergency funds on you. So then if anything is to happen, if you get hurt, you make sure that you have disability insurance or something, and you make sure that you take time. If like your body is breaking down, like you sit in a chair all day or you’re working and you’re like, I need to take a break, it’s very easy when you’re starting a business to think I have to work 12 hours a day. I have to catch up. I’m because you’re.

Sharon Cline: [00:32:28] Competing and you don’t want to miss an opportunity.

Lois Songster: [00:32:31] Right. And you’re not behind. I am telling you right now, go drink that water. Go stand up and go look at some trees just for, like 30 minutes. Yeah. Trust me. Your body, you’ll be able to last a lot longer if you do that truth.

Sharon Cline: [00:32:42] Because like, people talk about that, about how hard it is to shut their phones off and know that this is dinner time, this is my family time. And when you’re talking about an artist who’s local like you, but you also being on social media, you’re all over the world, you could have anyone needing something from you at any moment, right?

Lois Songster: [00:33:00] Yeah. I’ve had commissions in other parts of the world, like in England and Canada. I’ve sent it off to different parts of the country. So it’s like, yes, I could do that. But if I’m very clear that I work 9 to 5 and my time zone, people are very respectful of that. Yeah, if you set boundaries, you get a lot more respect from your clients that way. I learned that the hard way.

Sharon Cline: [00:33:23] Interesting. I think that’s something that I can take in for my own because it’s very easy for me to be like, What, you want me? Yes. And I don’t care what it costs, you know, in that way. But I also know if that were to happen over and over and over again, I would burn out very quickly.

Lois Songster: [00:33:37] Yes, I think there’s like specific people you can be like that for because you trust them or you know them or you’ve built a relationship with them and they might do the same for you. Great. But as a small business owner in general, and especially as a creative, people are always going to want your time. People are always going to want something free from you. I can’t tell you how many times people are like, Oh, this is great exposure, or would you like to do this for free? And I have to set the boundaries IT strategies I’ve developed of like I’m only available from 9 to 5. I’ll get back to you tomorrow. Automatic responses, having time off on the weekends and you can do art if you want, but it’s not a requirement. And then also for like free items, limit yourself to like three free projects in a year or have some kind of number and make sure that once you hit that, you’re like, I can’t do this anymore. I’m sorry, I’ve hit my quota for this year. Talk to me again next year.

Sharon Cline: [00:34:28] I love that because you’re teaching people how to treat you as an artist and how to look at you as an artist. Yeah.

Lois Songster: [00:34:33] And having those it’s basically what I call educating your client of like, you’re training them on how to respect and respond to you, and no one’s ever going to be mad. Okay, wait. A reasonable person will never be mad that you set boundaries because they also want those boundaries in return. And and you have set a clear deadline of I’ll be done by this time or we’ll get the project done. Constant communication is key for any creative relationship. I’ve seen so many creative projects crash and burn around because an artist just drops off or something happens. They don’t talk like it scares the heck out of me when I have to make a call. Being like, Hey, this project, it’s going to be late. Something has happened, but the client would rather know and respond than just not know what’s happening.

Sharon Cline: [00:35:16] But that takes some self esteem, though, I would have to say, and strength in knowing that you’re doing the best you can because you’re not. Everybody’s strong like that, you know, it’s like the dreaded phone call of saying, I can’t do what you’re actually paying me to do in the way that you want. Oh, yeah. But there have been many times that’s happened to me this past year. In this year I had a death in the family. And so having to explain to the author of this book, like I have to take two weeks off, I hated saying it, but someone who values your work, I can see how they would be like, Well, whatever it takes, you know? I know that the author was incredibly kind to me. And I tell you what, there’s something very wonderful about having someone look at you as a human, not just for what you’re doing, but just the fact that you’re here on the planet trying to juggle a bunch of different things. I have such gratitude toward that particular author, and I’m sure you’ve had moments where people have been willing to work with you and it’s like, Yes, I’m a human too. Not just a voice or You’re not just an artist.

Lois Songster: [00:36:10] Yeah, I’ve had moments where I’ve really appreciated the clients, where they give me time and I’m like, I’m sorry. Like this is going on or like I’m having some style problems right now. Like, you know, I’m stalling in my work. Like, I’m figuring this out. I can talk with you next week, but like, just give me a little bit of time. And they’ve been great. So and then I’ve had clients who like, don’t respect that or they get frustrated and impatient and I’m like, Hi, here’s a refund. I don’t think we’re going to work well together anymore. I think this is the better option. Wow. Like learning to fire your clients is like also important. You don’t do it all the time. Don’t fire every client. But every once in a while, a client needs to get fired.

Sharon Cline: [00:36:44] You just know it’s not a good fit.

Lois Songster: [00:36:45] Yeah, and it’s not like it just means the relationship isn’t working. It’s not a bad thing. It’s not a failure. It’s just like, I’m sorry, this is not going to work out.

Sharon Cline: [00:36:53] I like that you look at it from a very objective point of view because some people could take that so personally.

Lois Songster: [00:36:58] Oh yeah. In hindsight, everything’s objective in hindsight. Like when I’m in the middle of it, the first time I was like, like, what.

Sharon Cline: [00:37:04] Do you mean?

Lois Songster: [00:37:05] Yeah. Oh, this is like, terrible. Yeah, I got fired from, like, a book. I think one of my first firings was like a book author, and I’d been working with him for months trying to get this right, and he just wasn’t going to be happy. It wasn’t going to be what he wanted. And I knew it wasn’t me. I was really trying my best. I was so excited about this. And then like the publisher office, like, came to me and was like, Hey, he doesn’t want to work with you anymore. And I was like, What? Me? The work was.

Sharon Cline: [00:37:29] Me. How did you deal with that, though? In the moment, it’s painful.

Lois Songster: [00:37:33] It was painful. I think I took a day or two to like, I think processing emotions is very important. It’s not bad. Like as a baby artist, I was like, I’m going to go cry. This is my fault. And then after that I step back and I was like, All right. To be honest, though, I wanted him to fire me. He was insane. This was for the best, honestly. And I got to keep like, most of the money. So like, we’re good. And I just walked away from that, like, took a breath and I was like, Don’t have to talk about that again. Moving on. Yeah.

Sharon Cline: [00:37:58] Only one time have I had a very difficult book author who I just could not please and I was would verbatim do back exactly what they’re wanting. And then they would just be like, Why did you do it that way? I’m like, Oh my God. I was not trying to create trouble for myself, but I finally did have to fire them and I had never done that before. It was very uncomfortable for me, however, very empowering because I was miserable and I thought, Why am I doing this? Why I do commit and I sign a contract and but I like that you’re the same. It’s like I had to protect my own mental health here. And that was more important to me than whatever they were paying me.

Lois Songster: [00:38:32] And isn’t it a relief like, you know, you did the right thing? When you step away from that and you’re like, wow, like this weight has just lifted off of me. Like, I feel like I can work again and, like, breathe.

Sharon Cline: [00:38:43] Yeah, Because I went back and found the book that they found somebody else to do and listened to it, and I was like, Yeah, I did not sound like that. So ultimately and it was just.

Lois Songster: [00:38:53] Misaligned needs like it wasn’t a bad thing, like there was nothing on your character. It just didn’t work out.

Sharon Cline: [00:38:58] No, it did not. It was very, very interesting. But I like that you’ve had similar experiences and you bounce back. And I have too. I mean, that’s part of just being a human. You just figure out what works for you and what doesn’t. And I did feel wiser afterwards.

Lois Songster: [00:39:10] So yeah, I felt a lot wiser. There was a lot of red flags to help me get away from that. And I was like, Wow, I’m going to look for those next time.

Sharon Cline: [00:39:18] Yeah, we could talk red flags all day. I bet. All right, Lois, let’s talk about where people can find you if they’re interested in seeing where you where you’re. Artwork is going to be in person and how they can look up some of your stickers. Oh, wait, wait. I wanted to talk to you quickly about tattoos. You said that you do tattoos from home, like temporary tattoos.

Lois Songster: [00:39:37] I do. So I love temporary tattoos because I have, like, a FOMO, like, not fear of missing out, but, like, I don’t fear commitment. Fear of commitment. Exactly. Of permanent tattoos. I’ve designed permanent tattoos. I’ve had people get them. But for me, I just. I cannot do that. I don’t know what it is. I’m going to look at something ten years later and be like, even if I design it, I’m going to be like, I hate this. So temporary tattoos are a way to get around that. And what you can do is I design something on procreate, so I use my iPad or Photoshop and then I go, You can print it right out. You set it up on Photoshop to have an eight and a half by 11 sheet, you can get these temporary tattoo sheets on Amazon. There’s better ones like Ink Box and stuff like that are coming out with really amazing tattoos. But you can go on Amazon and get some nice temporary tattoo paper. You print it out, you cut it out and then you just apply it like a regular temporary tattoo and you can have color on it. It prints it right on the sheet. Or you can do black and white, like whatever you want.

Sharon Cline: [00:40:31] So I could at home create my own temporary tattoo if I wanted. I never even knew that I know.

Lois Songster: [00:40:36] Like, so how I found it was I was just looking through Etsy because sometimes I’m like, What are people selling?

Sharon Cline: [00:40:42] It’s a great idea. What could you be doing? Potentially?

Lois Songster: [00:40:44] Pinterest and Etsy are great for just kind of seeing like what people are selling. And I saw this one store selling temporary tattoos for your kids when they go to parks. So then the phone number is on their arm and it stays on for the day. So then if they get lost, the name and the phone number is right on their arm. And I was like, Oh, well, why don’t you just do like, I want to do self help temporary tattoos of like, remember to drink water or a little bit of image to make you smile. And so that’s what I started doing.

Sharon Cline: [00:41:09] So your energy really is of making the world a better place.

Lois Songster: [00:41:13] Oh, thanks.

Sharon Cline: [00:41:14] It is right. Like you’re like you’re talking about giving people inspiration of not only just taking care of their physical health, but their mental health too.

Lois Songster: [00:41:23] Yeah, I guess so. I just. I don’t know. I want to take care of people or I just want to people to look at my art and be like, Oh, I need to take a breath. Like, I want them to have that space. And I think there’s very clever visual ways to do that without like writing it or having it on a calendar or looking at your medication or like, whatever.

Sharon Cline: [00:41:40] Phone alert.

Lois Songster: [00:41:41] Yeah, exactly. Like you could have a fun little temporary tattoos. Like, did you drink water? And you’re like, No, I didn’t. And I think there’s fun ways to remind yourself of like taking care of yourself.

Sharon Cline: [00:41:51] But also that and I know we’re wrapping up here, but that also plays in your art too, because you’re talking about how you’re giving people an escape from the stresses of life and you’re giving them like we were talking about joy or something beautiful to look at, which I think is underestimated in the world, I think.

Lois Songster: [00:42:10] Well, yeah, that’s very relevant for all the news articles and stuff like being very negative. I think it gets a lot of views that way. But like I think quiet but strong joy and cheer, although that sounds really cheesy, I think it’s really important. I think that’s a very strong undercurrent of just caring for people. And I just, you know, I want people to feel like they can take a break when they look at what I make.

Sharon Cline: [00:42:35] I love it because it’s like the energy of who you are gets played out in lots of different ways. Yes. Through your medium. Yeah. Which is kind of like the dream, you know? Yeah, I hope so.

Lois Songster: [00:42:45] I like that. My art. And it’s a struggle. Like, you know, artists you feel influenced by things on social media, like, I should be drawing this cat because this cat’s really famous right now, so it’s hard to, like, put yourself out there. I mean, I just took a break from social media because I was like, I can’t do this. I need a break, guys. I can’t. I’m not going to be consistent. And immediately I started drawing things that I wanted to draw, and I didn’t feel pressure pressure from that. So it’s hard to like. It’s a strength to be yourself and to put yourself out there.

Sharon Cline: [00:43:13] In a world that’s constantly telling you not to be yourself, to conform.

Lois Songster: [00:43:17] Yeah, to conform or just to be like it’s a vulnerable thing, like showing your art and putting it out there. That’s a very vulnerable thing. And I think with social media, it’s become faster and easier and you see everyone doing that, so you feel like you’re expected to do the same, but it is hard to do that.

Sharon Cline: [00:43:34] Interesting. Well, thank you so much, Lois. How can people find you? What’s your website?

Lois Songster: [00:43:39] Yeah, so my website is W WW dot Ian Hawk. Ian H. I’m on Instagram under the same name. Ian Hawke. That’s the one I use the most. I’m really into TikTok now. Re into yeah, it’s, it’s a love hate relationship on TikTok And then you can also always message me on Instagram or send a message to my website and I will happily talk to you about anything you want to talk about the weather? Fine. You want to talk about art or like what’s going on in your visual brain? Fine. I’m there for you.

Sharon Cline: [00:44:09] Always be ready to be inspired, right? Yeah. Well, thank you so much for coming and sharing. I’ve always wanted to kind of hear about your backstory, and I appreciate people who have artists minds and are creative this way because I find there are so many different ways to be creative. But one of the best joyful moments I’ve ever had is. Is when a little bit of media goes out in the world that came from my brain or my voice, and it just makes me feel like so special. So thank you for doing the same for people, giving people an opportunity to see who you are in a way that they can receive it well, you know, and have access and maybe even be in their house. You know, that’s.

Lois Songster: [00:44:44] The that’s the idea. But I really appreciate being on here. This is a wonderful setup. And if anyone ever gets invited, this room is amazing. Like, it’s so wonderfully decorated, It’s so cool. So I’m so happy to be here speaking with you.

Sharon Cline: [00:44:54] Oh, awesome. Well, I know. I’ll have to tell. All right, Stone, if you’re listening, this studio is amazing. I should take more video and put it on social media for it because I can help you with that. Yeah, you can call. We’ll talk after the show. All right. Well, thank you, everyone, for listening to Fearless Formula on Business RadioX. And again, this is Sharon Klein reminding you that with knowledge and understanding, we can all have our own fearless formula. Have a great day.