From Lawyer to Leadership Whisperer: Coaching Your Way Out of Corporate Chaos (No Magic Wand Needed)

Intro: Broadcasting live from the Business RadioX Studios in Atlanta, Georgia. It’s time for High Velocity Radio.

Lee Kantor: Lee Kantor here another episode of High Velocity Radio, and this is going to be a good one. Today on the show, we have executive coach, leadership and well-being trainer with Your Coach To Soar. Anjli Garg. Welcome.

Anjli Garg: Thank you Lee, wonderful to be here.

Lee Kantor: Well, I’m excited to learn what you’re up to. Tell us about your practice. How are you serving folks?

Anjli Garg: Well, I’m an executive coach and leadership and well-being trainer. As you said, my biggest thing is to help clients achieve the kind of success that feels as good as it looks.

Lee Kantor: So what’s your backstory? How did you get involved in coaching?

Anjli Garg: So this is interesting. I never imagined that I would be in coach. I actually didn’t even know what executive coaching was, but I started my career off as a lawyer. I practiced law for 24 years. I practiced at law firms. I practiced in-house at places like Citibank and American Express, and I’ve led global teams. And one of the things I found in my practice is that when you’re navigating these complex matrix global organizations, there’s a lot of unwritten rules that go along with the territory of thriving in those environments. And one of the things that I’ve discovered is that knowing those unwritten rules is such a key to the success of those organizations. And at the same time, the kind of leaders who make or break those organizations are the ones that are self-aware, that lead people through influence, through great communication, through transparency, through heart. And those are the kind of leaders that I want to see more of in the corporate space. And that’s what inspires me to do this work, because I work a lot with high achievers that are hard on themselves, that are there to transcend and get to the highest levels of the organization. And at the same time, they want to bring others with them. They want to be leaders who inspire people as opposed to cut them down.

Lee Kantor: Now, when you were in your corporate career, what was coaching offered as something for their employees, or did you ever get coaching during that time?

Anjli Garg: I was part of coaching programs and leadership programs, I would say, but I wasn’t somebody who received the one on one leadership. It’s always been limited to the C-suite in terms of and some place like Citi, the C-suite is like very, very high up. And that that opportunity isn’t offered to most of the employees in the organization. Now, having said that, when people invest in that success on their own, they actually get the edge that others don’t have. And so I didn’t learn about executive coaching through that process. I learned through it from connecting with an old law school friend of mine who became an executive coach. And that’s how I learned what she did. And that’s what inspired me to become a coach myself, because everything she said, she said, you’d be an amazing executive coach. And I said, well, what’s that? And as she explained what she does, it just seemed like everything within me lit up and it felt like such the right move for me because I wanted to do that work. I wanted to help others. I wanted to bring that confidence, that power, that unique secret sauce that they have to the surface for them to use in their own career and for themselves, and also to help others in their orbit.

Lee Kantor: Now, are you finding that organizations are more open to having coaches trickle down deeper and deeper within the organization, or is it still kind of relegated to the C-suite?

Anjli Garg: No, it is coming more and more into into corporations because they’re seeing the ROI from coaching. And although they may not offer it one on one, they will offer it in leadership programs. And I’ve been part of those leadership programs. I’ve done that for fortune 50 companies, where they brought me in for their leadership programs on a year long basis to help their people advance, both through workshops and one on one small, smaller, one on one coaching opportunities or cohort coaching opportunities.

Lee Kantor: Now, when you’re working with large organizations like that, what is that conversation like and what is the value proposition you’re giving to them? And kind of the ROI projection you’re, uh, talking about with them?

Anjli Garg: Well, their leaders are at this place where they achieved a certain level of success through grinding, through hard work, through doing the work, and from knowing all the answers. One of the things that they don’t necessarily know or have is what it takes to get to the next level. The playbook, if you will, the the next level of playbook that they need, where they’re not grinding and burning themselves out, but rather using their time more wisely and strategically knowing how to influence others, knowing how to delegate, knowing how to have the hard conversations, how to align with other stakeholders. Up, down and across and be able to move in that environment. And that means also being able to navigate the politics of these organizations. And when your employees are able to do that, your, your, your highest performing leaders are able to do that. What you do is not only maximize and leverage the leader himself or herself, but also the teams that they are leading, because if they’re able to more effectively delegate and identify the opportunities and strengths of their team members and have inspire them and be able to empower them to take that bigger platform, then you’ve just increased the ROI to the organization.

Lee Kantor: Now, when you’re talking to these leaders before you start an engagement, are you talking about some of the pain that they’re having where coaching might benefit in terms of, like you mentioned, maybe preventing burnout or increased productivity or, uh, more efficiently, um, or more organizations moving more efficiently and collaboratively. Um, how are you? Like, what’s the pain that they’re feeling where they’re like, you know what, maybe we ought to give this coaching thing a try.

Anjli Garg: All of the things that you mentioned, I build the program around what the company’s needs are, where are the things that are the biggest opportunities for them, the low hanging fruit. So if you have people who are exceptional and they’re exceptional at what they do, but they haven’t been taught how to lead people and how to navigate inside complex organizations, then you need to equip them with the equip them with those tools. And those tools could vary based on what it is that they need. Right? Some places It’s how. It’s how to give effective feedback. Some places it’s how to delegate and some places how to run efficient meetings in some places, how to manage their time and energy in the best way possible. So it’s it’s different things for different leaders, but the through line is always about the emotional intelligence that’s needed in these roles to be able to, to work smarter, not harder. And so that’s the piece. But in terms of the specific areas of focus that’s really determined by the company or the leader, depending on what the engagement is.

Lee Kantor: Now, are there signals from an organization that you see that might be clues to them, but maybe they’re just not connecting the dots that coaching could benefit their organization. Like, are there signals or some things that are happening within the organization that are telltale signs that, hey, if you insert some coaching here, you might have a better outcome?

Anjli Garg: Yes, sometimes it’s more transparent and other times it’s not. You need to take a little bit more of a, of, of a deeper look to find that. So what do I mean by that? If there’s an organization that’s had a lot of structural changes or leadership changes and a lot of uncertainty, then that in itself can be a signal of what may or may not be working, especially for leaders who are sandwiched in the middle where they’re reporting up the chain, and they also have people reporting to them. And the lack of transparency is very evident to that leader because they don’t know what’s going to happen. And so how do they lead their own people that are depending and looking up to them for answers through that uncertainty when they themselves don’t know what’s happening. So that is a situation where you can say, okay, there’s a gap here. How do you equip your leaders to be able to lead through that uncertainty when they don’t know the answers themselves, and yet show themselves as someone who can remain even keel and calm. And it doesn’t mean that they’re lying to their people. But it’s a question of what level of transparency do you give and how do you give it, and how do you say it in such a way that it doesn’t result in panic? Right. But at the same time, there’s an authenticity and a transparency there so that people understand you don’t have all the answers. But here’s what you do know. For example, in other situations, it might not be that clear as to what exactly the breakdown of the gap is, and that’s where more conversation needs to be had. And sometimes there’s shadowing of leaders and interviews with others to figure out what exactly is the missing piece.

Lee Kantor: How do you help organizations that might be struggling with a maybe a trust issue within the organization? Like you mentioned, there could be a lot of outside change, maybe merger, acquisition, and both sides of this and their trust level maybe isn’t where it should be or could be. How do you help, uh, organizations manage that trust? And I’ll give you an example. A lot of organizations, um, want people to, uh, take risks. They say fail fast, fail forward. But then if somebody fails, then they get dinged or they get, you know, they don’t get the promotion or they, there’s some, uh, negative, um, uh, negative impact on their career for not failing, but they want them to try, but they just don’t want them to fail. But it’s impossible to experiment and try without having failure.

Anjli Garg: Well, what you’re talking about is an environment that doesn’t really have psychological safety, right? So there’s an expectation that you do and take a certain action, but then there’s no safety for the person if they actually take that action and fail. Right.

Lee Kantor: Right.

Anjli Garg: And so of course, there’s going to be a breakdown in trust because then people are going to say, well, then why would I take that risk? Because if I can’t guarantee the outcome, which no one can guarantee, right? I don’t know anybody who can guarantee an outcome to this day. Then your people are obviously going to shy away from taking risk. So the question is those organizations you’re asking what how do you rebuild trust? Well, you have to figure out what’s more important to you. Is it more important to you that people take risks and, and, and are innovative? Or is it more important to you that they don’t fail? Because that’s going to that’s going to determine what your employees are going to do. Now, you can also create a hybrid where you create a container like Google did, for example, where they created, um, a situation where a part of your time, you could just use that as, um, creative time without question where you could experiment, take risks. And so it wasn’t the entirety of your time, but there was a small portion of your time that you could use to just play around. And that is resulted in, in different kind of outcomes that were really, really beneficial to Google, right? For example, kind of a laboratory approach, but it’s hard to speak out of both sides of your mouth. And then, and then expect that there would be trust on the part of your employees.

Lee Kantor: But don’t you feel that a large number of organizations do do that?

Anjli Garg: I can’t speak for all organizations, but you asked the specific question of the corporation saying, this is the situation. We are asking our people to take risks and then if they’re not, and then if they take the risk and it doesn’t result in a positive outcome, we’re not promoting them. So how do we build trust so that people continue to take risks? Right. That was your question, right.

Lee Kantor: Well, I’m just trying to get your take on it. Is that uncommon or is that common in organizations that you work with?

Anjli Garg: I haven’t found that to be common with the organizations that I work with, to be honest with you.

Lee Kantor: Well, really that’s encouraging. So, um.

Anjli Garg: I mean, there’s, there’s organizations that have different profiles if you are in a financial institution. There are regulatory constraints and there’s a certain risk profile that the organization will tolerate, right? You have different kind of verticals. Tech space has a different kind of risk tolerance than another kind of area. Like I said, like financial institutions or healthcare. So you have to see what you’re operating in and what is the risk tolerance of the organization.

Lee Kantor: So what are the types of organizations you work with? Primarily, you mentioned you came from a legal background or a lot of your clients in law or legal profession?

Anjli Garg: Yes. I do work with law firms and I also work with corporates, both financial institutions as well as tech and healthcare. So I tend to work with these industrials.

Lee Kantor: And is there a common thread amongst those organizations that you find in order to get the most out of coaching, are you working primarily organizationally or individually?

Anjli Garg: I do both. I work both with the organizations as well as with individuals. So if you’re asking if individuals come to me on their own, um, on a B2C level, yes. And organizations also hire me on a B2B. And that’s with all of these types, law, uh, healthcare, financial institutions and tech companies.

Lee Kantor: And how would you regard the split of your work? Is it 5050 or do you do more one than the other?

Anjli Garg: I do both. So it’s, I, it varies in terms of what the split is, but it’s, it’s, it works out to be about 50 over 50 over time.

Lee Kantor: Now, when you’re working with an individual, is there a story you can share? Maybe you don’t name the name, but maybe share the challenge that came to you with and how you were able to help them get to a new level.

Anjli Garg: Yes, absolutely. A lot of the times that my clients are coming to me with tactical points. So for example, they want to get a promotion and they’re not able to get a promotion or they haven’t been able to do so so far. So one of the things I do and this is this is a real client example, is we get really clear on what it is that the promotion means to them and why they’re why they want that promotion. And once we clarify that, it makes it very clear for them what’s at stake for them. If they really want that promotion. Then we get to the point of where is the stuckness? Is it an external issue? Is it an organizational issue where no matter what they try, they’re not going to get that promotion just because of how the organization stacked, because there’s no upward mobility or their leader is not really in support of them, or the business is not in support of them. Whatever the situation is, if there’s an external piece, then we look to see what their next step is. If that if they really want that promotion, they want to go somewhere else, then we we work on their exit. Now, I’ve been successful in helping them get promoted within their org as well, which is through getting really clear on what story they’re telling. Are they making the ask, first of all, and who are they making the ask of? Do they know what are the clear parameters for promotion? Both the written parameters, if you will, or the the published parameters and the unwritten rules.

Anjli Garg: What are the requirements to get promoted? And then who are those decision makers? And how do you tell your story in such a compelling way that you show your value proposition in dollars and cents so that somebody looking at you is, is, is or hearing your story is can see the clear ROI for promoting someone like you, right? So what are the challenges that you’ve solved? How have you solved them and how have they resulted in revenue for the company, for example? So once we put that picture together, they’re able to make that compelling case to their, their managers. We also work on strategically, how do you have those conversations in a way that that is effective? Part of that, what I find find with my clients is that they themselves haven’t been clear on their own unique value proposition. They haven’t owned it completely. And that’s where I use my, my framework with them, which I call the career North Star. It’s, it’s a framework where I get really crystal clear with them on three pillars. One is their core values. And that’s important because that’s what drives them. And if their values aren’t being honored, then they’re not going to find alignment in that role. The second is their core values. That’s the second pillar. And that’s really important because that is their differentiator. That’s their unique value proposition that they bring to the table. And the third is what they need to thrive in their role, their non-negotiables. What is it that they need in a role that is or isn’t being provided in this situation?

Lee Kantor: So how did you come up with that methodology? Is this something you just figured out on your own, or did you have mentors or or how did you come up with that?

Anjli Garg: This is something that I came up with from all of the different things that I’ve done in my career, whether it’s my own, my own legal background in terms of thinking through this and the ways that I’ve interviewed and what’s been successful for me. My coach training and the tools that have been really fundamental in understanding myself and connecting with myself, like the core values as well as the other work that I’ve done over time for my own self development. And so that’s how I came up with that. And for all three of these, I created detailed assessments and I came up with those assessments. And when I say assessments, they’re like questionnaires. They’re not online assessments like Myers-Briggs or anything like that. These are detailed questionnaires that I put together so that my clients, it’s not difficult for them to answer the questions, right? They don’t have to sit and stare at a blank sheet of paper. Okay, so now what are my strengths? I asked them very, very specific questions over multiple criteria to get to them so that they can catalog their strengths. And then we take that data, and then we create a unique picture and integrate it for them. For example.

Lee Kantor: Now if you’re giving advice to other coaches out there when it comes to creating a methodology like yours, how do you go from in your head? This is an idea of this is what I would like it to be, to kind of Honing it and, and maybe tweaking and iterating around the different elements of it so that it is delivering the outcome that you hope it will.

Anjli Garg: Well, some of it is trial and error, but the question is, what’s the need? I mean, I’m a very creative person. I have always been, if that’s something I’ve always enjoyed. And one of the things that I looked at with this methodology was what’s the gap? What’s really the gap? And I realized that one of the things I struggled with in my own career, and what I see a lot of high achievers struggle with in their career is, is really believing and valuing your own contributions and what you bring to the table. A lot of times, both myself and my clients often devalue the thing they do really well, but value the thing that that somebody else can do that they can’t do as well as that other person can do, if you know what I mean. Does that make sense?

Lee Kantor: Yeah. So you’re saying that you’re anything you’re doing, you’re kind of dismissing it or not valuing it as highly as a gap that you might have that somebody else is doing.

Anjli Garg: Correct? Correct. Often, often we’ll dismiss that as something that, oh, anybody can do that. And so I realized that that is something that happens. And it’s very difficult to convincingly. Articulate your value proposition and what you bring to the table. If you yourself don’t own it and believe it. They just become words on a piece of paper. And I hear this a lot from my clients. I’ve had clients literally look at this stuff and be like, wow, I feel it. Finally, for the first time when I bring to the table, I’m like, I’ve heard them say, wow, I’m awesome. And these are really humble people. And so this process, I’m sorry, you’re going to ask me something.

Lee Kantor: Well, I was just going to see if we can make it actionable for a listener. Is there an easy or a low hanging fruit exercise someone could do right now to maybe get that aha initial belief in themselves in the manner that you’re discussing.

Anjli Garg: Yeah, absolutely. One of the things they can do is, and sometimes it is hard when you stare at a blank sheet of paper, but think about, think, think through your career and think about what are the top five compliments you’ve gotten from people that you respect? And that’s important, right? What are the top five compliments you’ve gotten from people you respect? About your professional, about your professional contributions? What is it that they said? Just write them down and then do a further exercise of why do you think they said that? What was it about you that made them say that? Right. So let’s say that they called you. Um, I’ll give you an example from my own background. I had a business head, a global business head who I respect enormously. Say to me that I’m a legal eagle and, and I, I remember pondering that and wondering what what did he mean by that? And as I was looking back into my career and saying, well, here are the problems I solve for him, and here are the things that I did. And this is what led him to say that that backs you into what is your unique, what are your strengths that people are seeing? If they give you that compliment and they may give it to you in the context of a specific matter or transaction. And so when you start to do that, it’s not about you making an assessment of your strengths. It’s actually seeing yourself through somebody else’s eyes.

Lee Kantor: Now, for most people, are they able to do that? Because I would imagine a lot of folks out there, they remember the slights and the, the, the times somebody said that they, they weren’t a rock star, but maybe it takes a while and maybe it even takes the exercise of writing down. If someone gave you a compliment, write it down so you remember it for future. You will appreciate that. Where you may not remember even going back in time, the compliments as quickly as you’ll remember the slights.

Anjli Garg: That’s absolutely true. And that you’re making my point right there, which is a lot of high achievers don’t remember or don’t they kind of tune out the good stuff and remember all the bad stuff, right? And so this exercise, yes, it’s a little bit difficult in the beginning, but it can be something that if they sit down and really think about it, they will find those moments in their career where they’ve heard good things said about them. So taking note of it over time is a great exercise. Having a feedback folder for yourself where you write these good things that you hear from people so you remember them. Some people put them in a jar, right? They write it down on a piece of paper, or they have a note in their iPhone. Whatever it is, this is this is a great thing to collect over time because when you’re feeling down on yourself, it’s a great thing to look back to all of the great, all of the lovely things that people have said about you over, over, over the course of your career.

Lee Kantor: Because to your earlier point, um, having that kind of data is real, right? Like you can’t deny if a hundred people said nice things about you, you can’t be a terrible person. Like the odds are lower when you have a preponderance of evidence that says otherwise.

Anjli Garg: You’re absolutely right. But you’ll be surprised at how much that power to tune out. Good stuff really affects you. And that takes me to deeper issues. So one of the things that I do with my clients is I work very tactically with them and strategically with them, but I also work at a deeper level on the mindset pieces, because we have these programs that are running below the surface that Aren’t really in our conscious control. And that’s why I call it programs, because it’s not logical and it’s not something you can override. It’s something you can rewrite. But you have to first find out what that program is. And that program are these patterns of, of behavior like perfectionism Overgiving worrying. Overfunctioning. These are all patterns of behavior that have been coping mechanisms for beliefs that we’ve taken on over time, limiting beliefs about ourselves, about the world, and about how what’s available and possible for us that keep us stuck and small. And some of those, those, those limiting patterns and beliefs are what help us tune out the good stuff because hey, I’m wired to wait for the other shoe to drop because things have been difficult in life, right? I, I don’t want too much. I don’t want to get too happy. Because if I get too happy, then I’ll be setting myself up for disappointment. So these are coping mechanisms. And once we deal with those deeper issues, actually that’s where the real meaningful change happens. So my clients often tell me that they’ve gotten more than they bargained for in the coaching because they came with some tactical issue, like promotion or having a difficult conversation, dealing with strategy, coming in like I’m coming into a new role, how am I successful here as a new leader? And they get so much more because they go to their core of their confidence, their anxiety and other beliefs about themselves, so they can let go of patterns that have been holding them back for many, many, many, many years and, and, and decades for most people.

Lee Kantor: Now, how do you deliver your coaching to the individual group and also the organizational group.

Anjli Garg: Uh, when you say, how do I do?

Lee Kantor: You mean like, do you do you do one on ones? Is it group coaching? Is it an online course? Uh, for the individuals and for the organization? Is it speaking lunch and learns webinars? Like just how can someone buy what you do?

Anjli Garg: Yes, that’s a great question. I in a short answer is I’ve done all of the above. So I do in-person as well as, as, um, as remote one on one sessions and, uh, workshops and speaking engagements and trainings and part of multi, multi month and even year long programs, as well as shorter lunch and learn type of opportunities. So I’ve done the gamut. And in terms of online courses, I have a 12 week program for high achieving professional women that I, that I created from scratch. And I’m very, very proud of it. And it’s, it’s led to a lot of transformations for people. Even four years later, my clients come back and tell me that that was a catalyst and, and a turning point for their life. It’s a, it’s a hybrid program in the sense that they have. It’s, it’s accessed through online every week. There are modules, video modules that they have, which are like coaching sessions with me and workbooks where they can do the work on their own time. And then we meet once a week for an hour and a half to do a live coaching group coaching session where whatever issues are coming up for them, any questions? I provide coaching and they get support from each other as well as a community build. And what happens is that there’s a that the learning gets amplified in that setting, and it’s still intimate enough that they can be safe and vulnerable to show up.

Lee Kantor: So if somebody wants to learn more and have a more substantive conversation, What is the website? What is the best way to connect?

Anjli Garg: Great question. Thank you. They can visit my website at w w dot your coach tucson.com. They can email me as well. And I they can subscribe to my newsletter to keep connected. I, I share tips, I don’t, uh, I have a monthly newsletter. I don’t make it a practice to spam people so they can keep in touch with me through that way.

Lee Kantor: Well, thank you so much for sharing your story today. You’re doing such important work and we appreciate you.

Anjli Garg: Thank you Lee. I appreciate you having me and, and listening to my story.

Lee Kantor: All right. This is Lee Kantor. We’ll see you all next time on High Velocity Radio.