Lyn Wineman: When Your Brand Becomes a Leadership Problem

Intro: Broadcasting live from the Business RadioX Studios in Houston, Texas. It’s time for Houston Business Radio. Now, here’s your host.

Trisha Stetzel: Hello, Houston. Trisha Stetzel here bringing you another episode of Houston Business Radio. It is my pleasure to introduce you to my guest today, Lyn Wineman, president and chief strategist of KidGlov, a purpose driven marketing agency, and certified B Corp that helps changemakers clarify their message and amplify their impact. Lyn is an award winning brand strategist with more than 30 years of experience, creator of the brand advancement process and author of Untangling Spaghetti, a Branding fable. She also Hosts the agency for change podcast and has been recognized with honors, including the AMA Hall of Fame and a Silver Medal. Lyn, welcome to the show.

Lyn Wineman: Hello, Trisha. I’ve been so looking forward to talking with you and your audience. Thank you.

Trisha Stetzel: I’m so glad that you’re here with me. Okay. So all of that amazing. All of your amazing accomplishments there. What else do we need to know about Lyn?

Lyn Wineman: Oh, okay. So here is something I usually like to say because it’s unusual and you will remember me by this. I live on a historic farm and raise a small flock of peacocks. How about that? Wow. That’s amazing.

Trisha Stetzel: I love that every time I think about peacocks, I think of my great grandmother. She had peacocks on her land and always had peacock feathers in a vase in her house.

Lyn Wineman: When they would lose.

Trisha Stetzel: Their feathers.

Lyn Wineman: I have so many feathers right now. So because it’s just that time of year when all the males drop their feathers, I have so many feathers. So I’m going to give out my LinkedIn connection later. If anybody needs feathers, hit me up in my LinkedIn messages.

Trisha Stetzel: I love that, Lyn. Absolutely. Okay. I want to start with the hardest question of all.

Lyn Wineman: Okay, I’m on the hot seat.

Trisha Stetzel: Trisha, you are on the hot seat. So I want to start with something that sounds very simple but probably isn’t. So when you use the word brand, what are we actually talking about?

Lyn Wineman: I’m so glad that you asked that, because I actually think that the field of branding has a branding problem because so many people think of different things. And so a lot of times when I talk about branding, people will say, oh, we have a name and we’ll never change it. Or we love our logo. And really, when when we think about branding, I use a graphic of a branding pyramid. And at the top of the pyramid is of course your name and then your logo, but then it goes into what’s your tagline that pairs with that? And what’s your messaging that you use consistently? And what are the visual identity elements that you use? And then it goes into how do you express yourself in marketing and advertising? And then even what kind of experiences do you provide to your audience? So all of those things come together to make up your brand.

Trisha Stetzel: That is a lot.

Lyn Wineman: It is a lot. It is a lot to think about. And that’s also why it’s not just a simple process, right? I mean, a, a strong brand is going to be clear it’s going to differentiate you from others in that same consideration set, and it’s going to resonate with your target audience. So, you know, in order to untangle your spaghetti and create a great brand, you’ve got to really get clear on your vision. You have to understand how you fit in the marketplace, and you have to understand what your audience is looking for and how you can translate your uniqueness to them in a meaningful way.

Trisha Stetzel: Yeah, absolutely. So you said something that makes me very curious around. They are, they love their brand or they love the name of their business, and they’re so married to it that they may be missing something. And I know that you work with organizations that have been successful for years in many cases. So what are the warning signs that their brand is just no longer helping them grow and may actually be holding them back.

Lyn Wineman: Yeah. I’m so glad that you asked me this because this is something I really like to speak to. And the signs of a weak brand or brand confusion may be different than you think. Because often the signs are slow growth, audience disengagement, low morale. And if you have slow growth, audience disengagement, and low morale, you’re going to have leadership frustration because those are the things that make leaders frustrated. On the flip side, if you have a strong brand, you are going to benefit from the ability to ward off competitive threats, to command a higher price and to set the stage for a strong internal culture, because your team can really get behind and understand the brand.

Trisha Stetzel: Wow. So I think what I heard, Lyn, is that you said that a strong brand actually bleeds into good leadership. Did I get that right?

Lyn Wineman: Yes. It really, really does. Because, you know, brand and vision go hand in hand. And so in order to build a strong brand, you have to have that clear vision. And the clear vision comes from leadership, right? And so, you know, I love, I love to read business books. And one of my favorite authors is Patrick Lencioni. And in his book, The Four Traits of an Exceptional Leader, he speaks to the fact that it is the leader’s job to speak to the vision over and over and over and over again. And that’s what your brand does for you. Your brand goes out ahead of you, whether it’s in a personal brand or an organizational brand. Your brand goes out ahead of you and tells people what to expect. So if your brand is outdated, it’s going to tell people you’re behind the times. If your brand is sloppy or disorganized, it’s going to tell people that you don’t pay attention to detail. If your brand looks like everyone else in your universe, it’s going to tell people that what you do is the same as everybody else. So then you become a commodity and commodities cannot command higher price.

Trisha Stetzel: Yeah. Yes, yes and yes, all of those things. I heard you make a distinction between personal brand and then you didn’t say corporate brand, but the business brand. So can you talk a little bit about that and the difference between the two.

Lyn Wineman: Absolutely. And, um, I mean, a personal brand really speaks to and a lot of leaders now do focus on thought leadership and personal branding. Your personal brand is about what you want people to believe and know about you, the corporate or I like to say organizational because KidGlov works with a lot of nonprofits that have a different corporate status. Your corporate brand is going to be what you want them to believe about your organization. And as the leader of an organization, there should be some similarities between the two. But unless you’re a solopreneur, there also should be some differences between the two.

Trisha Stetzel: Yeah, absolutely. Okay. I heard you say nonprofit. Let’s dig in. You and I had a conversation Of several weeks back. And I know that you also have an affinity for the veteran space. And so I want to talk a little bit about who your clients are, who you serve that nonprofit space, and also pepper in a little bit for my veteran, uh, nonprofit leaders out there to be listening in. So let’s talk about that.

Lyn Wineman: Yeah. So KidGlov, our name, KidGlov, our brand is very intentional because what we want people to know about us is that we treat people and brands with great care. We treat them with KidGlovs, right? And so it’s a different name. And a lot of times I will get that question. Uh, you know, why? Why is that your name? And every time anyone asks me that question, they are giving me an invitation to speak about what makes us special. So before we became KidGlov, we were Weinman Communications Group, which explains exactly what we did. Nobody ever asked me that. So we intentionally serve organizations that make the world a better place. So that includes nonprofits. It includes veteran organizations. It includes healthcare organizations. It includes public health movements like suicide prevention and the promotion of mental health. We also serve a number of community banks and credit unions because they also are helping people and helping organizations achieve their dreams. So, you know, we’re very intentional in going after those specific organizations because we’ve got a lot of expertise that makes us differentiated in those spaces.

Trisha Stetzel: I love that. So Lyn, what personally draws you to these nonprofit organizations?

Lyn Wineman: Oh, you know, we had a morning meeting three times a week. We have a morning meeting where everybody on our team gets on, on teams together. And we talk about what we have ahead of us for the day and we prioritize workloads. And last week, there was a meeting where we were talking about all of the different projects we had in the house. And at the end of the meeting, I said to my team, do you realize what we’re doing? The work that we’re doing today is going to help senior citizens find more options for their health and betterment. We’re going to help more foster kids find parents and homes. We’re going to help people find options for mental health. We’re going to help dissuade young people from starting to vape. You know, all of those things. It’s like, this is a pretty great gig to be able to know that the things that we are working on are making the world a better place.

Trisha Stetzel: Yeah, really coming back to that purpose driven organizations, and I love that. Thank you so much for being in that space and caring enough to be a part of these organizations and really help them catapult their brand out there. So they’re creating awareness about all of the work that these organizations are doing. All right. I know people already want to connect with you, Lyn, and I want to make sure that everyone, if they’re looking for KidGlov, one word, K, I’d g, LOV is the name of the name is the name of the organization. And Lyn, where can people reach out to find out more or connect with you directly?

Lyn Wineman: Yeah, absolutely. Well, KidGlov.com is a great place to start. And for what it’s worth, we’re KidGlov without an E, because when we came up with that name, we did want to make it unique to us. But KidGlov.com with an E was already taken by a lovely transportation company in Indiana. So if you need transportation, check out KidGlov with an E. If you need marketing and branding, check out KidGlov without an E. And then I love and spend a lot of time on LinkedIn. I love sharing ideas, connecting with people there. So I believe I am the only Lyn Weinmann on LinkedIn and that’s Lyn, Lyn and Weinmann just like it sounds WINEMA. And I love that connection. And let me know that you heard it on this show so we could talk about this show too.

Trisha Stetzel: I love that. Thank you so much. Okay. I want to dig into this proprietary brand advancement process. Walk us through how you approach building a brand strategy. Where should a leader begin before they start changing things? Tell me more.

Lyn Wineman: Yes. So we have an eight step process, and we have employed this process nearly 200 times over the 16 years of our existence. And we know that if you follow this process, you will not only have what you need to create a great brand, you will have what you need to make confident decisions about that brand, because branding is a very visionary process. And you’ve got to be able to look into the future and say, ah, this brand is going to, you know, represent us in this way. So the first step is to really extract the vision of the leadership team. And it’s hard when you’re on the inside of an organization to see the forest from the trees. So we’ve got a great discovery process to really help us solidify that vision. From there, we like to go to a research process where we survey or do focus groups with your best audiences, the people who know you and love you most. We want to find out what they love and believe about you, and then transfer that to new audiences. From there, we do a peer review where we take a look at all of your competitors. What do they look like? What do they sound like, and where is your position in that universe? Then everybody’s favorite part is next, we define your brand archetype profile. It’s like a personality test for your brand. And we build a three archetype profile, because what we have learned is most healthcare organizations will have a caregiver brand archetype as part of their profile.

Lyn Wineman: But if we so if we stop at one, all of our healthcare clients will sound exactly the same. So we like to go to that three archetype profile so that we can say, hey, this organization is a caregiver, everyman hero, and each of those archetypes means something different and helps us really express consistently and emotionally who they are in a way that will resonate. From there, we lock in the brand strategy. So out of eight steps, the first five happen before we even start any creative work, right? And I think one huge mistake that we see, Trisha, is that people go straight in to trying to develop the name, right? The messaging design, the logo. And really, when you have all of those steps put together, that just clarifies and streamlines the creative process. So in the sixth step is messaging. We like to do name there. We like to do a tagline. So the two work together really well, elevator statements and then foundational messaging in the visual visual identity stage. We design the logo, the color palette, the fonts, the design elements, and then the last step is the most frequently missed step. And that’s the brand launch. Because once you’ve put everything together, if you really want to leverage it, you have to be thoughtful about the launch.

Trisha Stetzel: Oh, meaning it needs to be visible. People need to know that it’s out there. Oh my goodness.

Lyn Wineman: Yes, yes.

Trisha Stetzel: Yeah. Okay. So what’s what’s bubbling up for me, Lyn is fast forward diagnosing the health of that brand. So they’ve done all of the work. They have this beautiful brand and all of the work that they’ve done and many years down the road. Yes. Diagnosing the actual health. How do we how do we actually know whether it’s branding or marketing or maybe even a business problem?

Lyn Wineman: Well, you know, I love that you’ve asked that because we, we deal with that a lot. And so we’ve put together what we call a brand compass. And once again, if anybody reaches out to me on LinkedIn, I’d be more than happy to send you our brand compass tool. It’s also outlined in detail in chapter three of our book. Um, but it is a set of questions that in five minutes or less will help you diagnose, at least create a hypothesis of where you are because you know, you’ll either need a complete rebrand, you’ll need a brand refresh, or you’ll go, hey, our brand is actually fine. We just need to get it out there more. So the brand compass tool will quickly help you, um, put this information together and build a hypothesis. It is a tool that you can use on your own. It’s also a great tool to take into a leadership team, a marketing team, a board. Um, if you’ve got a group that’s like, I don’t know if we need to spend money on branding right now. It’s a great tool to take a group of people through and get them all on the same page.

Trisha Stetzel: Wow. That’s amazing. And by the way, if you ask Lyn for that tool, you better say that you heard it right here on the radio. I’m just saying. Okay, Lyn, uh, you mentioned it, I mentioned it. I want to talk a little bit about untangling spaghetti, a branding fable. Tell us about the book.

Lyn Wineman: Absolutely. So we wrote the book, launched the book in April of 2025. It’s a best selling marketing book. Um, it really, I know, thank you. It documents our whole process. And when we first wrote the book, we just wrote it as a straight how to book. And I went back and read it and I said, this is really boring. And we know we know the science behind storytelling. We know that if you communicate through story, it’s going to be more engaging, more memorable, more relatable. So we backed out the book and we actually turned it into a fable. And the fable is about a leader who’s experiencing some of those problems that we talked about at the top of this conversation. Slow growth, confusion, disengagement, low morale, and not really understanding what was behind it. And the leader goes through our actual brand compass and it helps her understand. She then takes her board through the brand compass. It helps them understand. And then they work through the eight steps of our process together. What I love about the book is the people in the book are kind of a composite of the 200 clients we’ve worked with over the years.

Lyn Wineman: So we’re in the book asking the same questions that we get asked. We’re giving you a sneak peek into what happens back at the agency. Like, what kinds of conversations are the. Is the agency having. We even, in some cases, go into. What are people’s fears around the process, right? Because branding is a process that does bring up some fears because you’re trying something different and people aren’t always comfortable with being different. And so it does all of those things. But the name untangling Spaghetti came kind of at the end of the process. I thought the name was going to be something different, and I turned it over to my wonderful creative team and said, read the book. Look at all the other books that talk about this topic, and let’s talk about what the names are. And they came back to me with several different names. And when we saw Untangling Spaghetti, we all said, that is the one because it is unexpected, it is disruptive, it does stand out, but it also really speaks to what the process feels like. Yeah.

Trisha Stetzel: Yeah, absolutely. And, and what the business feels like sometimes, right?

Lyn Wineman: Yes.

Trisha Stetzel: Process. Like untangling the spaghetti in my head.

Lyn Wineman: Yes, absolutely.

Trisha Stetzel: So, Lyn, where’s the best place? If people would love to purchase this resource, where’s the best place for them to get it?

Lyn Wineman: Uh, two places it’s on. It’s on Amazon. So if you go to Amazon and, uh, and search for untangling spaghetti, a branding fable, you will find it. Or if you come to KidGlov.com, if you would like to request a signed copy, I’d be happy to sign one for you. And because I’m a branding person, the cover of the book is teal. I think I own the world’s largest collection of teal gel pens. I always sign it in teal, so I’d be happy to sign it and send it to you. And then Trisha, the other exciting thing that we have that goes with it is we just created an online program that goes along with the book. So if you want like a little extra teaching if you want some video interaction. If you want an online community and group coaching, we have that available now too.

Trisha Stetzel: Wow. That’s amazing. Lyn. That’s exciting. Okay. Well, I can’t wait to dig into that. And we don’t have time today. Darn it.

Lyn Wineman: I know, I know, I know, but I’m watching my clock. Trisha, I know we’re on the countdown.

Trisha Stetzel: I know you are. Um, but we do have time for a minute to talk about agency for change. I know you have a podcast out there, so let’s talk a little bit about that. Tell me more.

Lyn Wineman: Trisha. We started this podcast during the height of the pandemic. It was our ten year anniversary. We were going to have a big party and do all the things you do when your business becomes ten years. But we couldn’t. So I was like, well, let’s start a podcast. And so we’ve been going now for nearly six years. Actually, at this point, we might have just hit the six years. Next week I will record the 300th episode. I know and just have had the opportunity to talk with some of the most fascinating and interesting people, and I love podcast as a way to make friends who with people I might not have met otherwise, which you have to feel from this amazing radio show, right?

Trisha Stetzel: Yes. Agreed. I selfishly use this show to network and meet people that I wouldn’t otherwise have the opportunity to meet, just like what you said. And thank you. Shout out to Joshua Berry for introducing the two of us. Yeah.

Lyn Wineman: Josh was a great guy. So anybody listening, if you haven’t heard his episode of Houston Business Radio, you should definitely take a listen.

Trisha Stetzel: Yes. Thank you Lyn. Okay. As we wrap up today, the hardest question of them all because you might have to pick one thing. Just one thing, Lyn. What would you want if you could only pick one thing from our conversation today? What would you want our listeners to leave with today?

Lyn Wineman: Absolutely. A strong brand will help you ward off competitive threats, command a higher price, and set the stage for a stronger internal culture. It makes everything you do easier and more effective.

Trisha Stetzel: Oh, and it’s tied right back to leadership. And I think that that’s so important. Lyn. This has been absolutely amazing. Tell people one more time the best way to connect with you and find more information.

Lyn Wineman: Absolutely. That’s KidGlov.com. K I’d glov.com or hit me up on LinkedIn.

Trisha Stetzel: I love it, LIN you guys, LYNOIN1N.

Lyn Wineman: Yes.

Trisha Stetzel: I love that. And by the way, those of you who are listening, if you’re working on your graphic right now, your logo, and you haven’t done any of the other work that Lyn talked about, you need to go talk to Lyn. Just stop it because you really need to do the foundation work first.

Lyn Wineman: It makes me sad when I hear that doesn’t happen. So yes.

Trisha Stetzel: And and it does because that’s what people want to do. It’s so fun. Lyn. It’s so fun to design.

Lyn Wineman: Just as expensive to launch a brand that’s bad as it is to launch a brand that has a great strategy behind it. So that’s a great strategy.

Trisha Stetzel: Absolutely. And you have so many resources. You guys reach out to Lyn. She’s got online resources. She has a book, she has a podcast, and she is absolutely willing to have a conversation over LinkedIn and check out her content. It’s really, really good. Lyn, thank you so much for spending your time with me today. This has been so much fun.

Lyn Wineman: Trisha. Thank you. What a delight. And thank you to your listeners and all the hard work that you’re doing.

Trisha Stetzel: Thank you. You guys, that’s all the time we have for today. If you found value in this conversation that Lyn and I had, please, for gosh sakes, share it with a fellow entrepreneur, a veteran, or a Houston leader ready to grow, especially that person, you know, that is out there creating their brand logo before they do anything else. Colon be sure to follow, rate and review the show. It helps us reach more bold business minds just like yours and your leadership, your legacy are built one intentional step at a time. So stay inspired, stay focused, and keep building the business and the life you deserve.