Intro: Broadcasting live from the Business RadioX studios in Atlanta, Georgia. It’s time for High Velocity Radio.

Lee Kantor: Lee Kantor here. Another episode of High Velocity Radio, and this is going to be a good one. Today on the show, we have Emotional Intelligence coach, keynote speaker, and author with Hampton Morash, Emily Morash. Welcome.

Emily Morash: Thanks, Lee. How are you?

Lee Kantor: I am doing well. I’m so excited to learn what you’re up to. Tell us about your firm. How you serving folks?

Emily Morash: I am an emotional intelligence educator. I do a whole lot of workshops and coaching. I work with all types of companies nonprofit, for profit, small, medium sized companies working with their leadership teams to help them be a little bit more connected and efficient with their own teams, and helping teams connect to one another so that we have some productivity and we lessen burnout.

Lee Kantor: Now, for folks who aren’t familiar, can you share a little bit about emotional intelligence? What does that mean and how does it kind of affect an organization?

Emily Morash: Absolutely. Yeah. Emotional intelligence has become kind of a buzzword, which is a little annoying because when things become buzzwords, we lose the actual meaning. So emotional intelligence, really, when we boil it down, is are you self-aware and are you socially aware? And to be emotionally intelligent, it’s imperative that we’re socially aware. First, we have to understand ourselves. We have to understand our triggers. We have to understand what makes us tick, what we like, what we don’t like, and why. And that translates heavily into the workplace, because we are constantly navigating other human beings who also have their own triggers, things they like. They don’t like, the ways they function, which are different than ours. So. So when I work with companies on building emotional intelligence. It’s not this, like, frou frou fluffy crap. It’s like you’re a human and the people you work with are humans and you’re all different. And we are persistently, consistently misinterpreting other people’s signals and other people’s behavior. And this is where we run into a lot of conflict. So a big piece of what I do when I’m working with companies and leaders, excuse me and teams, is we’re working on where the conflict is actually coming from. And typically it’s somebody’s own lens of how they are viewing the world around them. So emotional intelligence really boils down to, are you self-aware? And from that, are you socially aware? Can you function well with other people? And that sounds kind of like sort of basic, and it kind of is, but it’s a foundation that holds up all of our relationships.

Lee Kantor: Now. I think some of the confusion around this is when they refer to EQ. A lot of people are familiar with IQ, and when they hear IQ they think, oh, the higher the number then the smarter I am. And is it work in the same way with EQ? Is it a similar thing? The higher the number you are, the more, um, emotionally intelligent you are.

Emily Morash: Um, I guess that’s kind of a that’s a good question. Um, and I really think it’s, it’s in the application of the EQ. So, I mean, it’s sort of the application of IQ as well. You can have numbers all over the place, but if you can’t necessarily apply what you think that means, then it doesn’t really matter. So um, so I guess, you know, if you’re, if you’re taking and there are so many different EQ assessments, right? So there’s not it’s similar, there’s a few IQ tests as well. So what are you actually measuring? Um, and I feel like some of these assessments give a false they kind of give false information about how emotionally intelligent you are, because you’re taking assessments in a vacuum of a test where really the application is in the middle of a conversation or a disagreement or an argument, um, or, you know, with your spouse where, where you’re having some really significant, difficult long term conversations. That is where the application comes in. So you I guess you can score really well, whatever that means in an IQ test. But can you actually apply it? And so not that I don’t discourage people from taking these assessments. It’s really good to know where you are. And it gives you an idea of how you think about particular things. But it’s hard to get a grasp via an assessment on how a human looks at the world around them, and how you navigate with that world is really. It’s the practice that tells you how emotionally intelligent you are and isn’t.

Lee Kantor: Um, is it fixed? Like an IQ is kind of fixed. Um, is an EQ fixed where you are, where you are, and then you just learn tools to adapt around wherever you are. Or is this something that I think this is where there’s, um, a gray area and maybe creates confusion because, um, using EQ versus I or people are going to think about IQ, uh, when you hear EQ, because IQ has been around a lot longer than EQ has. So I think that it does it a disservice by using that frame. But so how would you is your EQ fixed number one. And if it is or isn’t a what can you do to just be better at it? Is it something? Is it learn that you can just have, you know, different tools and skills just to be kind of the most, most intelligent, emotionally intelligent as you can be.

Emily Morash: This is a really cool question, and I’m glad that you asked this. So, so no, nothing is. When we talk about neuroscience and psychology, which emotional intelligence is rooted in both. Nothing is fixed. Um, our emotional intelligence ebbs and flows related to whatever stimulus we’re trying to navigate at the time. And so let me give you an example. So, um, every whoever’s listening, I’m sure you all have a job, right? Or you have worked for people. And so if you are fairly uncomfortable with your boss, um, your emotional intelligence level related to, like, navigating that relationship might be a little bit lower because Neuroscientifically speaking, when your boss, um, gives you a project or criticizes your work. The way your brain interprets that is probably different than when your best friend tells you something. They may be criticized. So it’s important. I have to kind of like tell you a story, to tell you a story, to get to this place. So our brains are limbic system specifically, is constantly scanning our environment to determine whether we are safe or not. When our limbic system comes up against a stimulus that it determines is not safe, it sends your brain into survival mode. When that happens, our logical thinking brain, that executive functioning brain goes offline because our our survival brain is trying to get us prepared to either fight or flee. What this has to do with emotional intelligence. And this goes back to the Know Thyself piece. The whole self-awareness piece is if you work with someone or you work in an environment that is constantly piquing your survival brain, your logic center is offline more than it’s online. And so your ability to actually navigate intellectually is diminished. So therefore the emotional intelligence in that moment is lower than it would be if you were in an environment that you’re comfortable in, or working with someone who makes you more comfortable.

Emily Morash: I hope that makes sense. I mean, and that’s why I’m saying this, it’s not fixed. Um, and anything can be learned. But really, this is this is a practice of sitting down with yourself and understanding. What is it that that triggers me? Um, so if I, if I don’t like my boss, well, why don’t I like my boss? Is it is it just because there’s more of an authoritarian relationship here, or is there something about that person that really bothers me? What is that? Why does it bother me? So it’s having these exploratory conversations with yourself to understand why you react the way you do around certain people. So, um, the emotional intelligence piece really starts with that conversation with yourself about, you know, pick somebody that you work with that you don’t like. Why don’t you like them? There are reasons other than that person’s a jerk. Okay, so let’s dive down a little bit further. Why is that person a jerk? But really being able to to recognize that that person is tripping your limbic system into your survival brain and you feel a fight or flight around that person instead of staying logical. So. So that’s a really long answer to your question, but it’s important that people understand that EQ isn’t this static thing, and it’s not something that you can aspire to because it’s not a fixed it’s not a fixed, um, object. Right. It’s not like you’re trying to get a personal record on A5K, like it doesn’t work that way. It really has to do with how your own brain is wired and how you’re interpreting all the various stimuli around you.

Lee Kantor: Now, how is an organization, a leader of an organization? Um, how are they best situated to give everybody the feeling of safety where they don’t get into that fight or flight mode, uh, in order to be their best self in the organization, because that the person that is triggering me say it might not really be a them problem, it might be just be a me problem. Like, how does an organization kind of understand, um, you know, who the problem people are and, and, um, and what can they do to help those people, you know, create that, um, culture of safety in order to get the most out of everybody without anybody. You know, if I don’t even know if this is possible without people getting defensive about kind of the way they are, um, showing up at work.

Emily Morash: This I love so much that you asked this. And I kind of want to piggyback on something that you said, which was maybe that’s not really a you problem. It’s a, it’s a me problem. Right. And when we look at conflict and so when I talk to when I go into companies, usually I’m brought in because there is some sort of conflict in a team.

Lee Kantor: But is it like you got to fix a fix, Bob? Is that like they’re hiring you to fix Bob or they’re they do.

Emily Morash: Yeah. They’re like, we got this person. And he kind of sucks. And I’m like, really? Let’s see what’s going on. And a lot of times when I come in, um, the conflict and I’m using air quotes, the conflict has to do with some communication styles and and challenges. But really when we look at this sort of stuff, nine times out of ten, what we’re looking at is self-awareness issues among the team. So when we talk about conflict, people tend to see conflict as something that is outside themselves. That has to be fixed, right? When really conflict is your own mindset about a thing. So, like, Lee, if you and I, um, were traversing the highways in Atlanta to go to a concert, right. And we are inevitably going to hit traffic, and we might be driving. And here we are in traffic, and I start freaking out because we’re in traffic. In this freaking traffic in Atlanta. Can’t you get your highways together? What’s the problem? Blah, blah blah. And I’m all sorts of mad because I want to get to the venue where you are like, you know what? This gives us more time to listen to this band’s new album. This is really not a big deal. So the traffic is the traffic, right? But how we see the traffic is where the conflict comes in. I see it as this massive problem. You don’t see it as a big deal, but the traffic hasn’t changed. So it’s the same thing when we’re looking at workplace dynamics. And to get to your your question about what can leaders do, really the answer is get to know your people.

Emily Morash: And it’s what’s wild is when I say to different leaders, I’m like, so tell me about, you know, let’s say they’re bringing me in to fix Bob. Bob’s a problem. Bill would tell me about Bob. And they’ll be like, oh my God, he you know, he’s entirely too serious and he doesn’t know how to take a joke, and he’s just. And all these things. Right? And, well, tell me about, you know, how does Bob communicate? What’s his communication style? Typically they don’t know. And, well, what’s his motivation style? They typically don’t know what makes Bob’s clock tick. They typically don’t know. So what we tend to do as humans and everybody does this, and this isn’t like because we’re terrible people, it’s just how we’re wired. We see the world through our own lens. And and then we apply because we don’t necessarily think outside ourselves. We apply our lens to everyone else. So if I’m the kind of person at work that likes to cut jokes and I like to chat with people, whatever, the person who doesn’t like to joke and doesn’t like to chat with people, well, I’m going to see them as a problem because through my lens, that’s how you’re supposed to function. But Bob might just be a when I’m at work, it is nose to the grindstone. I get my stuff done. Socializing is for after 5:00. Et cetera. Et cetera. It’s actually not a problem. So what leaders need to do is really take stock of who is on your team. And if you have a quote problem unquote person, what is the actual problem? Is it a perception like do you really have someone that’s not doing their job? Or is this a perception issue? And so a lot of times I talk about how conflict is a construct, and the construct comes from our own mental roadmap of how things ought to be.

Emily Morash: And if they don’t match our roadmap, then they are a problem. But for other people that’s not a problem. So. So it really is for leaders and teams. It’s understanding one. Everybody’s different and there’s nothing wrong with that. We all say that in theory. Oh, everybody’s great. Diversity is great. But it’s in the practice of this person is a complete opposite personality Than mine, but we still have to figure out how to work together and not see it as a conflict. And so it really does come down to get to know your people. And there’s a ton of tools that I offer. Um, they’re actually in the book. There’s a communication style assessment in the book that I wrote that helps people understand the nuances of how people communicate, which is really a foundation of how we all function together, um, and, and other types of tools related to how do people, how are people motivated, what matters to them most in their life? Are they a work hard, play hard? Are they a work to live? Live to work like what? Who are these people? Because they’re not. We’re not all like widgets in a machine. We’re humans. And every human has a different method of being motivated. And when leaders can learn what those are, they’re incredibly powerful and then they create incredibly powerful teams.

Lee Kantor: Now, um, is some of this or it sounds like a lot of this is just clarity around communication, even the word conflict, I don’t know, is it has a lot of, uh, emotion and it has a lot of semantic weight where friction to me has less, even though they might mean similar things. Um, you know, friction creates diamonds. Uh, conflict kind of in some people’s minds might create, you know, arguments or fights and might be seen as a negative. Uh, how much of your work is kind of just getting everybody on the same page when it comes to using language, um, more effectively and creating more clarity around, look, we’re all in this together. You know, like you said, Bob is a live to work. And then, you know, Mary is a work to live. They but we all want the company to do well. We just have to kind of get on the same page and understand, um, you know, where we are instead of, like you said, reverting maybe to our own internal biases. Like if, if I am a work to live. And my boss’s boss is a work to live. We might be kind of simpatico where if the middle person isn’t, that person looks like a, you know, oh, they’re the problem. When in fact we’re just kind of just reaching ourselves. But we’re not kind of aligned on on how we are and how to communicate.

Emily Morash: Um, right. So, um, to answer the question, all of it, all of my work, it’s getting people on the same page. You cannot read from the same book unless you are on the same page. And so it is the idea behind the workshops are getting everybody to understand the neuroscience behind their existence and then diving into what is communication? What does it look like? What are the behaviors look like? What is your communication style? What are the things that matter to you? And having having leaders and teams do this work together in person and actually seeing there’s so many. It’s the stuff that I do is very interactive, um, where people are literally learning right now on the fly with each other. And, and I see so many light bulbs go off. It it’s it’s very cool. Um, watching people go, oh, my God, I didn’t know about that. Know that about you or. Oh, I, I didn’t understand that about you or like, oh, that’s why we have a hard time communicating because we’re actually saying the same thing. But our interpretation of what we’re saying is different. So we do the purpose of the workshops. The purpose of my work is to get human beings to be socially aware and empathetic to the other people with whom they’re working. And so instead of seeing somebody as a competition to you or some kind of weirdo that works different, it’s broadening the perspectives to not only understand yourself, which is something that we immediately do when we start working in these workshops, is we we’re doing a ton of self-awareness work.

Emily Morash: But then also, what does that mean? How does that translate out when you are judging or assessing your coworkers? So because what you said earlier about like, you might be, you know, a work to live kind of person and your boss’s boss might be. So you guys think that you’re on, you know, the right team, and then you got this other person and they’re a weirdo instead of rolling it back and understanding, oh, all these people function differently. But at the end of the day, we’re all getting the work done and we’re all building the company the way we’re expected to. We just get to it differently. So it’s taking a look at that, that, um, the conflict, which, you know, the construct of the conflict. And I appreciate what you say about like friction versus conflict, but they’re really the same thing because friction also causes burns. So how are you defining the words that you’re using? So in those workshops we absolutely talk about language. Language matters greatly. And then how are we defining what we’re defining. And and certainly, you know, each team, each company, their language is going to be different than another company or another organization. So it’s very company specific on on the words, the language that they’re using and what it all means, but definitely getting everybody on the same page and broadening perspectives so that um, so that the considerations for everybody’s, you know, nuances are considered, um, is incredibly important to get anything done.

Lee Kantor: Now at different stages of an organization. Is it better to hire people that are more simpatico, or is it better to have kind of, uh, contrarians in the mix as you at the beginning stages of an organization?

Emily Morash: That’s such a great question. So it’s funny that you bring that up, because I’m actually in the middle of this right now with the company. Um, I will have. Every time I work with a company, I will have executive leadership team or their board of directors do this communication style assessment. And a lot of times we have a whole lot of a similar style, and that’s not necessarily a bad thing. However, you need people who think differently than you. Um, who function a little bit differently than you because that’s where you’re going to get a, a more functional team. If everybody does stuff the same exact way to get from A to B, you’ll get from A to B, but you might have someone who understands there’s a more efficient way or a more lucrative way to do something, but you’ve never invited them in because they think differently than you do. So like, for example, um, I there’s this one board of directors I’m working with right now, and they have a lot of very, um, uh, relationship based. You know, they’re all about going and finding the donors. And they’re they’re all about the relationship with the people they’re serving. And this is all very good. They don’t have anybody on their board to hit the gas and make stuff happen.

Emily Morash: Not only that, they don’t have anyone on the board who’s super analytical to sit down and say, well, I’m looking at our fundraising projects and I’m looking at this, um, you know, our pipeline and our goals, and you think we’re going to hit $1.2 million in the next year, but we’re not we’re looking at 600,000. And so there’s you need to have these different styles of thinking and these different styles of communicating in a team setting to make sure that everything is being thought about. You have people who are more innovative and then people who are more analytical. These are very good things. They might not like each other, but that’s not the point. The point is, is that you’ve got some work to do. You want to raise $1.2 million. You need somebody who knows how to hit the gas on fundraising and somebody who knows how to analyze the budget. And so, um, is it good to have people who are similar to you? Sure. But it’s really important to find those people who are going to challenge you as well. Um, people are afraid to do that. This goes back to the neuroscience. This goes back to how our limbic system is interpreting different stimuli.

Emily Morash: And when we sit with someone who doesn’t agree with us or they think differently, we might. And this is subconscious. We feel threatened, we feel threatened, and then we don’t like that person. We can’t tell you exactly why. I just don’t like them. I just they rub me the wrong way. And that right there is a clear sign that your limbic system has hijacked your survival brain. And now you’re not thinking clearly about the skills and the talents that that person might bring to the table. And so the challenge for leaders, and this is a big thing that I work on with leaders is challenging that gut reaction that, oh, I don’t like that person. Well, why not? I just I don’t know, I just don’t like them. And that’s not a real reason. And so does that person have the skills that you need to be on this team to drive this team forward. If they do, then you need to figure out the conflict is your own deal, not them. And so, um, so to answer your question, it’s kind of a mix of both, but you don’t want to have everybody on your team be exactly like you because that’s not going to get you anywhere.

Lee Kantor: And I think that what you’re saying is where those kind of subconscious biases come in, you know, like if you went to Harvard and you’re preferring Harvard people, you might not be to, you know, uh, jazzed about the Stanford person that’s coming in that might look at things in a totally different way than you do because you just, you know, have been around and prefer people who have gone through the same path you have.

Emily Morash: Oh, sure. I mean, that that kind of tiptoes into all sorts of conversations about bias, that man, that’s a whole different conversation. But like, do you hire people who look like you? Do you hire people who sound like you? Do you hire people that graduated from a university? That do you think is more prestigious than the university that you went to or like, what are you basing your decisions on and are they truly fact based or are they emotional based? And and so this again comes back to the self-awareness work that we do, the emotional intelligence piece of understanding why you think what you think and how you got there. Um, so but yes, it’s important to be able to examine, um, how you’re interpreting people and in and environments and colleges like, to your point, um, and, and various ideas that are coming in to the companies.

Lee Kantor: Now, is there a piece of advice you can share right now for leaders to at least get a taste of, of how the impact of emotional intelligence can affect their organization? Is there some low hanging fruit that anybody could do right now, today that can, um, help their organization?

Emily Morash: Oh, yeah. So okay. All right. Leaders who are listening. Here’s what I want you to do. I want you to grab a piece of paper and a pen. Pencil. And I want you to make two columns. And on one column I want you to write worst, and on the other, I want you to write best. And then I want you to think about the worst boss you ever had. And I want you to write down adjectives of the worst boss you ever, ever had and give that some time. And I’m sure you will fill up the page and it will be a whole thing, and you’re probably going to get, like, sweaty while you’re doing it. Because we have we have a physical reactions when we do these emotional things. And then I want you to, when you’re done with that, take a big breath and then go over to the other side of the page and write down the adjectives of the very best boss you ever had, and what you will notice when you go to analyze what you wrote down. It has everything to do with your boss’s level of emotional intelligence. A lot of times when people write down the worst stuff like disrespectful, violent, demeaning, um, avoidant, there’s all sorts of things on this side of the list, and it’s all social and emotional aspects of how that leader has worked.

Emily Morash: It has nothing to do with their KPIs and their performance measures and their outcomes versus their projections. Like has nothing to do with that. It has everything to do with how they functioned as a human with other humans. And so that’s the first kind of like, I guess, look into the emotional intelligence piece. The self and social awareness piece of how we’re existing means everything. And like when you’re looking at that worst list, how productive were you for that boss? How productive did you actually want to be for that? But maybe you gave it 100%, but you really only wanted to give 70. And when you look at the best boss side, what do you want to do for them? 120. Why? Because they were more emotionally intelligent. And so it matters when we look at productivity. And we know this when there’s when there’s low psychological safety on teams production drops. You know, there’s a phrase like happy employees or productive employees. Well, yes. And the reason they’re happy is because their psychological safety on the team, and that comes from emotionally intelligent people on the team and that comes from doing the work.

Lee Kantor: Now, is there, um, kind of an avatar you use for an ideal client? You mentioned some work in nonprofit and for profit. Is there kind of a sweet spot in terms of your work, or is there kind of qualities that, uh, the right organization is a best fit client for you?

Emily Morash: You know, this is going to be like the worst answer because we’re all told we’re supposed to have our model client. But really, if you’re a human and you have humans that work for you, that is my ideal client. And I’m not kidding. It does not matter the size of the team. It doesn’t matter if your for profit, nonprofit, small, medium, large. I work with municipalities and state. I work with huge state organizations. I work with little bitty nonprofit. It doesn’t matter. It’s working with the humans and working with the teams. And so if you’re listening to this and you’re like, oh my God, my team could definitely learn to communicate a little bit better, well then yeah, you’re my kind of client because this is and one and here’s the here’s the sneaky thing Lee. We do this in the workplace, right? Like I do a lot of these workshops, workshops in the workplace, but we don’t live our lives in a vacuum. So like when you leave work and you go home, your emotional intelligence, your self-awareness that’s going to come with you. One of the most amazing emails I ever got was a couple of years ago, I had actually done I have this my signature workshop is called the Mindful Leader Practice, and I had done this with this huge law firm. And um, and I received an email, uh, maybe like a month and a half later from one of the folks that was in the workshop and it said, your workshop helped me at work, certainly. And our team is getting better, but I’m pretty sure it saved my marriage.

Lee Kantor: Yeah, these skills are transferable to all parts of your life, that’s for sure.

Emily Morash: So there’s like no ideal client, there’s no ideal industry. There’s no ideal age. It is if you’re a bunch of humans that are trying to work together and you’re finding that you’re just not well oiled machines, then you probably need a little bit of of EQ work.

Lee Kantor: So if somebody wants to learn more and connect with you or your team, what is the website? What is the best way to connect?

Emily Morash: They can get Ahold of me through, um, it’s Hampton morass. Com and, um. Yeah, that’s the easiest way to find me.

Lee Kantor: Well, Emily, thank you so much for sharing your story today. You’re doing such important work, and we appreciate you.

Emily Morash: Thanks, Lee. I appreciate you having me on. It’s been such a pleasure.

Lee Kantor: All right. This is Lee Kantor. We’ll see you all next time on High Velocity Radio.