Intro: Broadcasting live from the Business RadioX studios in Houston, Texas. It’s time for Houston Business Radio. Now, here’s your host.

Trisha Stetzel: Hello, Houston. Trisha Stetzel here bringing you another episode of Houston Business Radio. It is my pleasure. And I’m so excited about having my friend. And by the way, he may not remember this, but we met way back in 2008, in BNI. My friend Mark Taylor is on with me today. Mark, welcome to the show.

Mark Taylor: Well thank you Trisha. Of course I remember, uh, I remember a lot of details about that because it didn’t take long to anyone who’s been around you knows that you’re a shaker and a mover, and I picked up on that quickly. And do I recall correctly, we were starting a BNI chapter over in Air land. And you foolishly volunteered to help me do that?

Trisha Stetzel: Foolishly? Yeah. So I think that was a couple of years into. So I was a member in the League city.

Mark Taylor: Oh that’s right.

Trisha Stetzel: Yeah. And then I got involved and started helping with the Pair Land chapter, which is still doing amazing, by the way, and is led by some amazing people. Uh, and then we I was also involved in trying to get one over on South Belt off, uh, off the ground because we had some people out that way that were interested in, um, networking as well. But that’s not what we’re here to talk about, Mark.

Mark Taylor: Okay. All right.

Trisha Stetzel: I want to tackle this idea of HR outsourcing. And I happen to know that you’re pretty well versed in that area. So what do you know about HR outsourcing, Mark?

Mark Taylor: Well, I got to tell you something. Maybe you. Maybe I’ve never told you this. Um, I have an have an animal science degree and a and a master’s in in agribusiness. And so I was actually in that field for a number of years after I graduated from college. And a friend of mine called me one day and he said, hey, I just went to work for this company. They’re growing up. And he said all this. He said, you know, and they’re hiring. Would you like to consider going to work for them? And he told me it was an HR outsourcing company. And I said, Terry, you do know I sell livestock feed for a living, which is what I was currently doing. He goes, yeah. And I said, what in the world has that got to do with that? He said, I’m telling you, you’re it’s not about that. It’s about I’ve known, I know you, and you’re the kind of people we’re looking for. Come in and interview and I did. And so my point is I you don’t have to have a degree in this. You can like anything you can learn and I did. And in fact, the first couple of years I learned a lot about just, um, how HR outsourcing. What is that? What does that mean and why would people do that and so forth. Okay, that was back in 1991, and I’m still involved in the industry today.

Trisha Stetzel: Wow. All right. So long time in this industry. And before we started recording today, you were telling me how many business owners, uh, business leaders aren’t even familiar with the idea of an off site HR department. I’m using your words because I thought they sounded cool. So can you describe what it is that, uh, HR outsourcing does for a business?

Mark Taylor: Yeah. And let me just start with this, uh, when, you know, when you meet people, um, you know, some of the first things they ask you first, of course. What’s your name and where do you live and what do you do? But I mean, what do you do? Comes up pretty, pretty soon in the conversation. And I learned that when you say HR outsourcing, typically it’s amusing to me. Typically people will not as if they have any idea what you’re what you’re talking about, which I learned. They do not. I mean, it’s rare that I find somebody that goes, oh, yeah, I know all about that. And they can have a conversation with me. And so my point is two twofold. One, if you ask ten people randomly what is HR human resources you I’ve learned you’ll get likely ten different answers. Then they’re all elements of it. But or not. I mean, they just it’s just not one of those things where if you tell someone you’re a banker or a chiropractor or a plumber, they have an idea of what you’re talking about. But so not only are people unfamiliar with HR outsourcing, by and large, um, they’re not even real clear. Just what the whole gamut of what the the scope of what HR is, and particularly in we’re talking about as an employer. Um, and so that’s that’s my challenge right off the bat is how do you tell people, how do you describe what you do, uh, in a short period without boring them to death or giving them multi-paragraph answer.

Mark Taylor: So, but but let me answer that. Um, my clients have one thing in common. Whether they’re white collar, blue collar, large or small, my clients have the one thing they have in a client is they have in common is that they have employees. Mhm. And many don’t really stop and realize that what that means is they are like it or not. In the employee business there are literally thousands of regulations and requirements and expectations that government does a great job of adding red tape, um, to to employers and expecting them to know and do certain things, many of which if you are not in compliance, there’s there are penalties focusing on the fundamental things you, Trisha, if you were to be an employer that you would have to address and whether you and many times people will well, they’ll know. It’s like it’s like sitting down deciding to just work on your taxes tonight. Very few people actually look forward to that. So this is a thing that’s easy to put off. Uh, entrepreneurs, business owners are really excited about their business, understandably, and they’re not inclined to be motivated to check out all things HR. Mhm. Um, there are exceptions of course, but that’s the general general um, viewpoint on air and on air items. And just to be clear, I’m talking about um, saying things as simple as of course, producing payroll and the associated payroll taxes, keeping up with those, that’s um, that’s an element of it.

Mark Taylor: And then there’s, uh, when you hire somebody, there’s there are ways that you can and should hire and ways that you can’t and should not. Uh, how do you know that kind of stuff? Uh, there are there are issues that can arise in the workplace. Um, I gave Trisha a raise. I didn’t give, uh, Valerie a raise. She’s mad. So maybe it’s a it’s a loss. I mean, there there are suits that arise out of this, uh, discrimination, uh, gender discrimination, racial discrimination, sexual harassment, all I mean, all those things that, again, don’t often happen, but when they do, people are ill suited. It’s never happened before. It’s like if your house burns or you have a car wreck. I mean, if you’ve never had that happen before, you’re completely at a loss for you know, what to do next or how to confidently work through that. So, uh, there’s benefits. Employee benefits are a big, um, concern with employees, and rightly so. Uh, there’s compliance and safety and regulatory things that that just unfortunately go or and unfortunately many times those things go unaddressed and everything’s fine until something happens and then it can be devastating. It could be business ending depending on the nature of the issue.

Trisha Stetzel: Yeah. So Mark, I want to make sure I heard you right. Did you say that those all of those things that you just talked about are part of what you bring to the table as an HR outsourcing partner?

Mark Taylor: Yes, exactly. If you’re. Yes, the idea is this. So I’ve described a familiar scenario for a no employer. Listening to this would be in the dark about this. They are at some level aware that there is a business of being an employer.

Trisha Stetzel: Mhm.

Mark Taylor: Um, and so then you then you have to decide, well, how are you going to handle that? Here’s how many. And my clients tend to be small business. Um, I’m going to say generally probably 90% of my clients fall between 25 and 100 employees. Okay. Um, so, um, that’s that’s my target market because they have enough employees to finish every sentence I start. I mean, they know what it’s like to deal with employees, and yet they don’t have any. They don’t have really an HR department. What they like to do, this is what most people do. They want to hire an employee and say, you’re our HR manager. Good luck. I don’t care. Just just do it. Uh, make sure that in this in this field of HR landmines, make sure that we can navigate through it without stepping on one. See you later. And they step out of the room and go back about managing their business. And the And the sad fact is, although I would probably do that myself if I didn’t know an alternative, there is no one person who is an HR specialist any more than there is a doctor who is an I can do it all specialist. I mean, my goodness, there’s probably 200 different professionals from the top of your head that literally the tip of your toe.

Mark Taylor: And they’re all specialists. Well, it’s that same way in in HR. There’s too many elements, um, to reasonably expect anybody to know how to do it all. And so again, that’s, that’s that works until you get something happen that’s beyond the, the scope, the expertise of that person who is the HR manager. Um, which is is thus the advent of HR outsourcing. And the idea is pretty simple. And you’re right. I always tell my clients, I want you to I want you to imagine that you have an off, well, an off site HR department. When we enter into business, HR changes for you and it’s as if maybe it’s off site. Maybe you can imagine if you had a second floor to your building or an additional floor to your building, and that’s HR. You seldom see those people, although you can. Um, most of the work, it’s not necessary that they be in your office, uh, in person, speaking with you. They are performing their HR tasks, whether it’s acquiring, uh, attractive benefit programs or handling your HR or, I mean, handling your unemployment claims or work comp claims or whatever it may be doing, or maybe it’s just compliance, making sure that we are if OSHA were to visit, it’s not going to be a bad day.

Mark Taylor: Um, we’re prepared for that. We’re aware of them, prepared for them. And, and, um, and it’s not seen as a threat. So short of having your h your own HR department With people who specialize in these elements. Uh, the idea of outsourcing your HR to an HR company, uh, makes a lot of sense, because then you can, um, let me give you another example. A lot of a lot of my clients will have accountants, but they probably all do. Very few of them have one on staff 24 over 7 or 40 hour a week, because they just don’t have the the work to keep them busy that long. So they meet with their accountant. Uh, same thing with their insurance person. There’s certain professionals that are vital to their business, but they don’t need to have on staff. They just need them periodically. And so. Instead of having an HR person or looking for an HR person like I just described, what about outsourcing to a company who is fully staffed in all of these specialties to be able to support that business on all these different elements?

Trisha Stetzel: Yeah. So important Mark. And you know, there’s a big difference between you mentioned, uh, payroll companies. There’s a big difference between just having a payroll company to do payroll for you and having fully outsourced, uh, your HR department, basically, and having this offsite HR department. Um, can we talk about the liability is I think that’s really important. You talked about all of the services that an HR outsourcing business can provide to these business owners. What about the liability? So I, I say, you know, hey, Mr. or Mrs. Admin person you’re now my HR person. Go do the thing. And they have no idea what they’re doing where. So the liability lies with me and that person actually internal to my company. But if I hired somebody like you, uh, to come in and help me with all of my HR needs, where does the liability fall there?

Mark Taylor: Well, that’s a good question. Um. You’re right. Um, and that’s often the case where somebody is confronted with, um, an event that happened with relative to, with their employees or maybe a regulatory issue, whatever it may be, you like to be able to say, well, I mean, I just didn’t know. And that never flies. There is a certain there is an expectation if you are an employer, that you have certain expectations and obligations that you must address. And of course, one of those is you’ve got the liability and responsibility for the people who work at your business. Um, we’ve talked about a lot of the responsibilities. Liability could just be, uh, for injury, um, or for actions of employees. Uh, there’s there’s lots of liability. So to your question, one of the huge I think the big advantage to outsourcing, um, to, An HR outsourcing company. Is that you can address that very, that very topic, for example. Um, and there are companies that will just you can hire to do HR admin and they will produce your payroll for you. They’ll produce, um, maybe your employee handbooks, they’ll produce unlimited documentation and so forth, but they’re producing it for you. And once they have and you’ve paid them, they’re done. They have no liability. They’re just producing that for you. And I’m I’m not referring to that in our relationship, in our arrangement. Um, we have an arrangement or a utilize a concept called co-employment. Uh, it’s been around for decades, and it’s simply said, it works this way. Let me just I’m going to assume that you’re an employer and that you have 35 employees, and you have the Have the responsibility and liability that’s inherent with that, uh, contract.

Mark Taylor: Introducing this concept of co-employment works this way. We will delineate those items in the contract that you are totally responsible for. And those are the right of control, the daily, daily control of the employees, the hiring, the firing, and the direction of those employees is completely on you. And that’s, of course, to your your agreeable to that, because we don’t know how to run your business and you do. So we’re expecting you to do that. Uh, on the other end, all of the items that we are committing to by contract, uh, will be delineated. And those are many of the things we’ve already talked about, uh, responsible for payroll and responsible for, um, we without going into a lot of length, let me just say that we will delineate the responsibilities that we are liable for and responsible for. And then there’s a third category of tasks, and those are items that we are jointly responsible for. Meaning, if we’re going to produce a safety program for our client, it is it’s incumbent on the client to implement the safety program. So if by contract we are to do that. And yet the the client were to take and just pitch it in the corner in case somebody wants to come by and see it one day. Um, and, but in the interim there is, um, an issue involving safety that results in, uh, liability. There’s a, there’s a claim. Then in that case, we would we would be, um, have performed our role in, in producing that. But the client, um, failed in applying it. So that’s an example of a shared responsibility.

Mark Taylor: And so what’s important is that you delineate those in the contract so that we will both parties will know what they’re solely responsible and liable for, and both parties will know what they’re jointly responsible for. If it sounds like a partnership, it is. And what makes it a partnership is the employee base. So no longer would we consult with you about your employees. We would consult with you about our shared employees rather than standing on the side of the train track. And you’re laying on the track and we know there’s a train coming and saying, if I were you, I’d get off. We’re actually laying on the train track with you going, we need to get off of this thing. So there’s a there’s a commitment. There’s a difference in commitment level, whether you’re advising and providing services or you’re participating in the risk, which I don’t need to tell you. That’s that’s the that’s the critical element here. And that is choosing the right businesses that they’re going to offload liability. And they’ve got safety run amok and they’ve got employee, um, morale problem, all kinds of. It’s a mess. And they just want to know where do we sign? Because I’m going to get this off of my desk and onto yours. And it doesn’t go that that conversation doesn’t go long. You can tell. Um, it’s not hard to tell, uh, the kind of clients you’re looking for because they you leave tracks in the sand. There’s, there’s documentation about your, your history with as a business and particularly with employees. So those are a couple real fundamental elements of how this works.

Trisha Stetzel: Okay. Uh, very important. Right. That you’re assuming the risk alongside of the employer or the business owner. Right. Uh, I think that that’s huge because. Oh, by the way, many of us small business owners had no idea, number one, that this was a thing. Maybe. Maybe some of you did. Maybe you don’t. Right. Uh, but also really leaning into the liability that I have as an employer. Right? Holy cow. Wouldn’t I like to partner with someone who would take that risk off of my plate? Right. Or share the risk.

Mark Taylor: Share the risk. Yeah. So it’s like I mentioned earlier, a landmine, a field full of HR landmines. You can’t see them.

Trisha Stetzel: Mhm.

Mark Taylor: Uh, unless. So you need probably an HR landmine detector and diffuser. Uh yeah. And and so but that’s true. And you can say that about many different disciplines, many different professions with uh in this in this picture is inviting the right people to the party. Because when you have people who are aligned with you in the way you regard employees, and they’re more than just office furniture, we want we really want this place to be a place you can work for a career if you choose. And you don’t have to leave here for lack of benefits. So you don’t have to leave here because we’re. Um, just not legitimate in whatever way you want to describe it. We certainly want to. In fact, I will just tell you, because many of my clients are small businesses, one of their biggest fears is losing employees to bigger companies, maybe an hour drive from home. But they have good benefits. So they have good frankly, they have good HR. They’re stable. And and my message to our clients is you don’t have to do that anymore. Rather than settling for the second or third or fourth tier of available employees out there, you can go ahead and recruit the number one tiers, many of whom would prefer to work for a small local business for a variety of reasons. And you no longer have to say, well, because we’re small, we just have to take the, you know, accept the best we can get because we offer an inferior workplace. Not anymore.

Trisha Stetzel: Yeah, I love that. And it really does, uh, lift up those smaller businesses to be able to able to compete with those other larger businesses where employees may think that they can go and get something better. Right? Bigger. Better?

Mark Taylor: Absolutely.

Trisha Stetzel: Yeah.

Mark Taylor: And you can’t blame employees for doing that. It’s very common. No one I mean, everyone in the American business culture knows or assumes smaller company less to offer. Yeah. And I’ve known people who work at a smaller company knowing that they don’t have big company benefits. And I’m not talking about just like insurance and 401 KS and dental and vision, but just the benefits of working for a small company. Um, and yet they, they work for less because they like the culture of a smaller business. Well, and so the good news, as far as I’m concerned, is you can maintain the culture and you can also maintain those, quote, big company benefits extending beyond just what I just mentioned, but just the literally the benefits of sides, um, without having to be big to get it.

Trisha Stetzel: Yeah. That’s fantastic. So, Mark, I would be remiss if I didn’t say to the audience that’s listening today if they wanted to reach out to you because they want to know more, they happen to be a business, uh, that has 25 to 100 employees. And what other, um, things should the listeners be listening for to make a decision on whether HR outsourcing is for them?

Mark Taylor: Uh. Great question. The first thing I would want to do is have a conversation. And whether that’s in person, it’s probably best in person, but that’s not always possible. Um, because I want to find out if this is a good fit. I learned a long time ago, sometimes no business is better than some business, depending on the kind of business. And so, as I mentioned earlier, I’ve got to be a I got to do a good job of inviting the right people to the party. And so that’s going to take a conversation about what is it that’s prompted? What? Why do you want to talk to me? What’s going on? Uh, what’s your frustration? What are your issues? Uh, and then it may be that we can’t help you, and I’ll need to tell him that. It may be that we can help them. As I mentioned earlier, and I’m. I can’t get out of there fast enough. Uh, their their business is burning down from an HR standpoint. Uh, but it’s more likely the case. Um, there are many, many great businesses out there who are who are doing well as far as their businesses go, but they’re they’re distracted. Uh, maybe even impeded by some HR issues because they just don’t know. They just don’t know what they don’t know. Yeah. That’s why I need a plumber to come over when I have plumbing issues. Because it seems easy, but I don’t know. And I’ve got the same tools in my toolbox, don’t I? Right. Uh, and so that’s why, if I really am looking to interview someone to find out if they. What is air to them? Okay. Um, how important is it to them? Uh, well, let’s. I want to have that kind of conversation. So really, to summarize that, the next step is I would want to talk to them to find out if I think they’re a good fit for us and we’re a good fit for them.

Trisha Stetzel: Okay. Yeah.

Mark Taylor: So those those conversations tend to go in the direction of their need.

Trisha Stetzel: Yeah. Okay. Well and it’s personalized right. They may not need everything. Uh, that is in the basket. They may need a few things that are in the basket.

Mark Taylor: That’s a good point that you make. In fact, I liken this in this conversation that I’m having with folks because it’s all virtually always exploratory. I do at times get people who are maybe using an outsourcing and they or they’re familiar with it for one reason or another. But the majority of times this is all new to them. And so that question comes up. Well, do we have to participate in everything you offer. Uh, we’ve already got benefits through my brother in law, and I’m, like it or not, I’m not changing that. Uh, I’m married to his sister. Um, and so. So the answer to that is, think of this offering as, like, a buffet. Anyone who’s ever been to a buffet knows that you don’t have to, um, put. You don’t have to like everything on the buffet. You can choose what you want and that flexibility, so that’s great. Um, if someone says, well, I really just want a slice of payroll and a cup of coffee. Well, then they don’t really need us. And I need to refer them to a competent payroll company. Why would I try to talk them into the full meal deal when they clearly said, I just want a slice of payroll and a cup of coffee? So, um, that again, is part of that first conversation. And that is it’s not unlike going to the doctor. The doctor can’t look at you and say, uh, in most cases I know what’s it’s wrong. They say, well, tell me what your issue and I’ll tell you if I can help you. And that’s just the basis, I think, of not only good medicine but good, good business.

Trisha Stetzel: Yeah, absolutely. Okay, I’ve got one last question for you. As we get to the back end of our conversation today, Mark Taylor. Tell me a success story from your business or a great client story, something that’s memorable for you.

Mark Taylor: Oh, I could tell you a lot of it. In fact, as I think about that, every single client comes to mind when I think of, um, making a dramatic difference because it truly is, uh, big difference in how they do their business. Uh, but and I can think of times when people call me and said, man, I’m so glad we did this, because now when we get to the employee in the interview, the initial interview, uh, the hiring interview, and when they, you know, when they ask me, do you have benefits? And I used to hate that question. Now, if they don’t ask that, I can say, aren’t you going to ask me about benefits? Because we got that covered? Uh, but I but but specifically, I’m thinking of a client who was, um, in a in construction, and he had, um, he had a work comp claim that was really complicated. And it was it was large and it was one of those potentially business ending issues. And because those our employees, our shared employees were covered on our work comp policy. Um, yes. He did have to tell us the details of what happened. And then beyond that, the paper trail of our documents and our contract says, you need to talk to us about this.

Mark Taylor: And for us, it’s a routine thing. Doesn’t mean it’s not catastrophic and horrific, but it’s routine. We handle these our comp um compliance and um that off that that section of our business takes care of that on a routine basis. So he was you can imagine he was extremely relieved that, uh, he still had stress of the, of the whole issue. But he knew that we were handling the comp claim, um, for us, not for him. I mean, when I say us, us collectively, it was right. And it it I’m I don’t know, I can’t say that it saved his business. He will he was he sent me a lot of clients, a lot of prospects after that because that people who knew him knew about that. And they of course want to know what happened. And he’s like, man, if you’re not outsourcing this stuff to somebody who can slip in the driver’s seat for you on this, you’re crazy. So that’s one that comes to mind. That was a long time client of mine, both before and after that issue.

Trisha Stetzel: Yeah, I bought okay, Mark, if people want to have a conversation with you, what the best way to connect.

Mark Taylor: You know, the best way is to call me on my cell phone. I am what you would call an independent representative. I don’t represent any one particular company by contract. I do by choice, though I only have usually keep 1 or 2 or maybe three companies in my briefcase. And the reason for that is I. I’m picky about who I introduce my clients to. I want them to have, um, a personal relationship with these people, not just, um, uh, a personal relationship with them. So for that reason, before we even get to that, I want to the best thing they can do is just call me. Let’s have a conversation. I want to know about you. You’re going to want to know about me and the company and all. And and it may be a one conversation. Then we’re done. It could be. We’ll not know. Just not now. Maybe the timing isn’t right. I don’t know, but have them call me I. I love to talk to small business people and especially love to liberate them from just this thing that hangs over their head. This air. This mysterious air. Obligations and responsibilities that they have. I think we talked about this earlier. Um, you know me. Know me long enough and well enough to know that, um, a frequent tagline that I, that I use in talking to people is, um, if you’re in our business is really none of your business. And that sounds a little snarky, but if you think about it, nobody will say, no, that’s not true. Mark, I got into this business so I could manage, hire, and manage employees. It’s only your business if you’re in my business. And so I you know, it’s probably a good rule of thumb to outsource whatever you can that someone else can do better so that you can focus on what you actually do to generate revenue.

Trisha Stetzel: I love that. Thank you for being on the show with me today, Mark.

Mark Taylor: This has been my pleasure.

Trisha Stetzel: Yes. And, uh, all of the information how to get in contact with Mark will be in the show notes. So if you’re listening or watching, please just point and click and have a conversation with Mark. And I happen to know that Mark Taylor is very well connected. So if he can’t help you, he probably knows someone you can connect with, which is a another benefit of having a conversation. Mark. Uh, thanks again for being on. I appreciate your time today.

Mark Taylor: Appreciate it. My pleasure. I always enjoy talking with you. And so thanks for inviting me.

Trisha Stetzel: Absolutely. And that’s all the time we have for the show today. Join us next time for another exciting episode of Houston Business Radio. Until then, stay tuned, stay inspired, and keep thriving in the Houston business community.