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Automate Your Way to Security: The Essential Role of IAM in Modern Enterprises

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Automate Your Way to Security: The Essential Role of IAM in Modern Enterprises
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In this episode of Sandy Springs Business Radio, Erik Boemanns talks with Bill Morse, a seasoned expert in identity and access management (IAM) with over 30 years of experience. Bill, who founded his own IAM consulting firm three years ago, discusses the critical role of IAM in automating employee onboarding and offboarding, enhancing security, and boosting productivity. He highlights the challenges of managing digital identities and the importance of principles like “least privilege.” The episode also covers Bill’s journey into consulting, the financial benefits of effective IAM practices, and practical security tips for organizations.

Bill-MorseBill Morse has a 25-year career as an IT leader in the Financial Services industry including Chase, Prudential, First Data and Fiserv. ​

In January 2021, Bill started Airitos, providing Identity & Access Management (IAM) architecture and strategy to Fortune 500 companies across industries such as Financial Services, Pharma and others.​

In his enterprise career Bill provided IAM leadership through major events including Mergers & Acquisitions, Divestitures, and implementations of new HR Systems, access management and identity governance platforms.​ Airitos-logo

Today Bill uses this experience to advise companies on their own IAM journeys.

Connect with Bill on LinkedIn.

Transcript-iconThis transcript is machine transcribed by Sonix

 

TRANSCRIPT

Intro: Broadcasting live from the Business RadioX studios in Sandy Springs, Georgia. It’s time for Sandy Springs Business Radio. Now here’s your host.

Lee Kantor: This episode of Sandy Springs Business Radio is brought to you by Mirability, providing unique IT solutions, leveraging cloud, AI, and more to solve business problems. Here’s your host, Erik Boemanns.

Erik Boemanns: Thank you, Bill Morse, for joining me today. I’m glad to have you here to talk to us about. We’re going to talk about identity access management, which is probably a term that nobody’s ever heard of. So we’ll dive into what that really means in a bit. But I wanted to start maybe just with a quick give yourself an introduction, tell, you know, tell us a little bit about yourself.

Bill Morse: Sure. And thanks for having me. My name is Bill Morse. I’m about a 30 year career doing different enterprise roles for a for large financial services companies. Towards the end of that time started to focus on what we call identity and access management. We’ll explain what that is in a in a second here. And then about three years ago, I started my own company doing the same thing, but as a as a consultant. So get to get to help, you know, several several organizations with some, some shared lessons. And that’s what we’re here to talk about. Awesome. Thanks for having me.

Erik Boemanns: Yeah. And so that company name is Aretos. Right. And it’s we focus on identity access management. And we will I want to talk a little bit later about kind of that journey to a founding a consulting company and, and some of the things there because that it’s always interesting as well. But, um, maybe just start with what does Aretus do? How do you help your clients? What is maybe even take a step back? What is identity access management?

Bill Morse: So we focus on, uh, so if you think of a large company, kind of, you know, hiring and firing, you know, potentially hundreds of people, you know, weekly, monthly, etc., we do is we help automate that whole process. And, you know, what we what we focus on is when you bring a new employee in, you don’t want to just give them a computer and joke around how it’s going to take a week to get them all the access he needs. You know, we want to get people productive on day one. And more importantly, when they when they leave your company either on their own or, you know, a mutual decision, we want to make sure they lose all the access that they have. And this this is much more important now than it used to be in the old days and the old days, you’d go to a building, and if you lost access to that building, you couldn’t get to any of the computer systems in it. But now, as you know, everything tends to be in the cloud. So what we do is automate what we call the provisioning and the deprovisioning of that access across all the different applications. So, you know, keep the the enterprise more secure, but also make the the resource more productive, you know, give them access to everything they need kind of on on day one where, you know, where possible. So if you, you know, we’re talking about large enterprises here. Banks and pharmaceuticals etc.. But you know, everyone kind of has this need right from the, you know, at the at the lowest level If you have a PC in your house and you want your you know your child to use it, you might create an account for that, for you know, for your child and say you have access to this, this and this, but I don’t want you messing with quicken.

Bill Morse: Right. So, you know, at all levels, there’s kind of this, this concept of of identity, right? Kind of prove who you are and then access management. So based on you being Eric and you know, your level of trust and training, etc., I’ll give you access to, you know, these things and, um, you know, the bigger the enterprise gets, the more complicated that gets. Right. One of the things we deal with is, um, called separation of duties. So, you know, maybe if you have this access over here, I shouldn’t give you that access over there. You shouldn’t be able to, you know, approve your own time sheets or, you know, write, write checks and then, uh, you know, make journal entries that kind of, you know, wipe away the fact that you wrote that checks and stuff like that. So, you know, it gets gets more complex the the more complex the business gets. Uh, but it’s basically the same thing as, as just, you know, that that that first use case of, you know, based on who you are. I only want to give you access to what I feel comfortable giving you access to. So that’s that’s I am in a in a nutshell.

Erik Boemanns: Gotcha. And I think something to point out too, is that not only when the employee starts and leaves, but even in the middle as they get promoted, as things change within the organization, they may also gain access. Because I’m thinking a lot of breaches happen when a person, an individual’s computer gets hacked through, you know, ransomware or something, and then whatever they have access to is the target. Yeah. And so if they have access to something that they shouldn’t have access to because they’ve either changed departments or it wasn’t poorly managed or was poorly managed, that kind of access control, I think, matters too. So it’s not just that beginning and end.

Bill Morse: No, definitely. There’s there’s a lot a lot of concepts. Some. So there’s a concept of what’s called least privilege, right. So you should get the least amount of privilege to do the job that, that you’re supposed to be doing. But in the industry we we have different jokes. Right. So we call people packrats. Right. If you’ve if you’ve been in an enterprise for a decade and change roles three times. You know, sometimes people are afraid to remove permissions because they might need you to kind of come in and help them out. That kind of thing. But, you know, over the course of, of a long career, you might have access to too many things. So that’s that’s one of the things that I am looking at, right. Do you, you know, have roles that can can conflict with each other over time. And, you know, as as people leave departments, they should lose access to the old department and just have the access they need for the for the new department they’re moving to. So great. Great point.

Erik Boemanns: Yeah. And so understanding the kind of complexity, like you said, as the organization gets bigger, they’ll have multiple systems, but even a small company now will have multiple systems and probably a a login and account in each of those systems. So the complexity may vary, right, depending on the organization size. Um, what is it? How does Airbus come in and help? What is kind of that first type of engagement if you will?

Bill Morse: It differs. So one of the things we offer is called a IAM maturity assessment and the use case. There will be typically a new CIO, new CISO. There will be a merger. There will be a divestiture. Something significant will happen, and someone will bring us in and say, hey, just just give us an inventory of what we got from an IAM perspective. Sometimes they have 2 or 3 products to do the same thing. So, you know, help us help us rationalize this to, you know, can we get down to one? Is there a is there a good reason to have two products to do the same thing? Um, a lot of times the the event will be, like I said, either a either a merger or a divestiture. So you’ve got to figure out, um, how do we combine these different user stores or split them out? And a lot of times with, you know, big organizations, the divestitures is announced. You know, we’re going to we’re going to spin this company off, etc.. But there’s a period of of, you know, sometimes a year where the, the company that was spun off still has to use systems at the, at the parent company that that spun them off.

Bill Morse: Um, but, you know, there’s a limited amount of stuff you want that that spun off company to have access to. Um, so we’ll kind of come in, look at the whole picture. Um, you know, a lot a lot of what we do, um, from an architecture and strategy standpoint, is draw pictures, right? Um, and, you know, the simpler the picture looks at the end of the day, the better. But typically it takes, you know, hundreds of interviews and a lot of research and stuff to figure out what does the enterprise look like. And then you show that picture to people, and it makes it a lot easier to say, you know, see this redundancy here? We’re going to get rid of this, this and this, consolidate it into that. This is, you know, the future state that we we suggest. And then we talk about how to get there. And um, again, the bigger the organization, the longer these processes take. Because, you know, systems that have been around forever, they they tend to grow legs, right? They’re used in ways people forgot they were used. So you really got to kind of, you know, go through and dissect these things carefully.

Erik Boemanns: It makes sense, especially in the divestiture where your point was exactly right, where you have a user base that’s now no longer part of the company, but still needs to access those resources. But I think something I heard you say, as you’re talking about that is the multiple systems. What do we even have? And we may have 2 or 3 systems. So I assume one of the outputs of what you’re doing is to actually help simplify, which then probably one could improve their security, but two has a cost saving.

Bill Morse: It definitely is. Yeah. And there’s there’s a couple of ways where I am can can help you save costs. So one of them is, um, you know, knowing who has access to different systems. So, you know, a lot of these cloud systems, you provision people, they they leave the company, you kind of forget to deprovision them. So, you know, going in and looking at your email provider or looking at your CRM provider, etcetera, looking at all the accounts that are still active that you’re still paying for and make sure you’re, you know, those people are still around. That’s that’s one of the, the easiest ways to kind of, you know, show some show some cost savings. Um, but on the, um, on the, on the what we call the harmonization side. Right. If you have three, three systems that do the same thing, you know, the goal is always to get, you know, down to one, you know, reduce your attack surface, you know, run one thing and run it well. Um, but we joke it’s a lot like painting a bridge. So it takes, you know, it takes a year to paint it. By the time you’re done painting it, they’ll merge with someone else. So now they. You know that. And that other company might have a, you know, a fourth technology. So now you have to kind of take a look at that, you know, hey, they’re using this other technology, you know, how are they doing with it? Can, can our technology do all the stuff that their technology does, that kind of thing.

Bill Morse: Um, so, you know, one of the things about IAM is it almost never ends, right? You’re always trying to get simpler. Um, from a, from a user access standpoint, we’re always trying to make it easy so that it’s, it’s role based. Right? So if you join the company and you’re a, you know, tax accountant one. Um, you should get access to six different systems to do your job. You know, by just by just by putting you in that one role. Um, so we have, we have concepts that we call birthright access, right? So as you, as you join the company, you kind of get everything you need just because you’re in that role. Well, these roles change, right? As you know, your CFO says, hey, we’re not going to use that tax platform anymore. We’re going to shift to this one. Now someone has to go in and see what permissions. Tax accountant one should have. So it’s kind of a it’s always an evolving thing. We always try to evolve towards a, you know, simplified, easy to manage model. Uh, but it’s uh, you know, it’s a journey.

Erik Boemanns: I think the other thing that I heard just now, if a person is leaving the company and you forget to de-provision their account, if you forget to delete them from the system, or you’ve got so many systems, you remember to do it on two, but you forget on the other eight. If you also are either interested in going through an audit, a security audit, like a soc2 or something like that, that’s something that the auditor is going to check. And then they’re going to have all sorts of questions about like, why is this person still in your system if they haven’t worked for you for six months.

Bill Morse: And so it’s an uncomfortable conversation. Exactly.

Erik Boemanns: So if you are thinking about that sort of audit or or already under it, having something like this looked at and and fixed is almost a critical item at that point. Yeah.

Bill Morse: Yeah, that’s that’s one thing we’ve seen. Auditors love automation. You know, they love the ability to, you know, push a button and run a report. Um, you know, even if the report has, has bad news on it that at least you can run it, right? It’s much better than, um, you know, having to make the auditor go go dive for it. My wife’s an auditor, actually. So there you go. She always tells me the, you know, the the friendlier you are with me, the better the audit goes. So I try to I try to put my clients in a way where they can, you know, kind of make the order. They’re happy.

Erik Boemanns: We talked about cost savings. We talked about some security benefits and a lot of business owners, when they’re thinking about security and they’re thinking about risk, it’s it’s cost that I spend to not lose more money, but it’s just still a cost center. It’s still me spending money. And this could feel that way to other than we said, there’s a few cost savings, but I think the an aspect of this that’s missed is that these can be a business enabler as well. So how do you see that in terms of identity, and how does it having a good practice around identity actually become an enabler, not just a cost?

Bill Morse: That’s a great question. Yeah. Since since I’ve been in this business we’ve almost joked about it, you know, can can security be a business enabler. Right. And you know, the people that just want to get some functionality out of it when the when the security department says, hey, you can’t do that. And here’s why. You know, there’s all these jokes, right? Where the department that says no and all that. So we, you know, we always try to say, hey, you know, we can be a business enabler. I think we’re finally getting to the point where people are believing that. Right? So when you when you wake up and your system is not ransomware, you know, when you’re when your website’s not defaced, etc., um, you know, hug your CISO. So, um, you know, we’re at the point now where like, like from an identity standpoint, I’ll give you some specific examples, right. You mentioned a minute ago that, you know, all these different cloud systems. You might have your own ID and password. Yeah. So if we go in and we enable them all for single sign on, we’ve made ourselves way more secure. Right? I know that if you don’t have access to the thing that you can single sign on through, then you lose access to all these things immediately. And I can worry about deprovisioning your account later on.

Bill Morse: But from a user perspective, I can now give you, you know, a portal where you can just click on all the access you have, all the apps you have access to, and kind of, you know, log in directly without worrying about, you know, an ID and password for, for each one of them. Um, so there’s, there’s, there’s different um, you know, another even even simpler. Right. People used to complain about, um, you know, I step away from my desktop for ten minutes, and when I get back, it’s locked. Now I have to log into it. Well, you know, with with, um, Windows Hello and touch ID, depending if you’re, if you’re a PC or Mac, it’s not that big a deal anymore, right? But now, you know, I’m authenticating you with a with a biometric, not just a simple password. So you’re more secure, and, you know, all you have to do is drag your smile, your camera, drag your finger across the fingerprint scanner so it’s, you know, it’s easier for the user and more secure, you know, and I do want your desktop to lock when you walk away. So there’s there’s several examples where, you know, you can be more secure and make the user happier at the same time.

Erik Boemanns: Yeah. And so happy users, obviously more productive users. And I think you start talking about fingerprint biometrics and the idea of password lists is is a topic that people may have heard about. And we’re so focused on making sure that that people have different passwords and strong passwords, and all of a sudden we’re saying actually just don’t even have a password. You’re going to be more secure if you just skip that step altogether, which I think also can result in more security and more productivity and lower risk as well.

Bill Morse: Yeah, yeah, shared secrets should, uh, you know, and that’s, that’s a fancy way of saying passwords and other things that, you know, you know, but someone else can, can guess or find out or whatever. Just a public service announcement, right? When we when we tell you to use a different password for every site, you know, there’s there are reasons that we’re we’re telling you that. Right? We can kind of scare the audience by, uh, you know, explaining that, you know, as, as, as, as sites are hacked and IDs and passwords are kind of, you know, discovered there is really simple technology that can kind of, you know, spray those IDs and passwords across every other website on Earth, right. So that’s that’s why we don’t want you to have the, uh, you know, the same password more than more than once. But another example of how, you know, security can make users happy. Um, they’re a very good password managers. Right. It’s trivial now to have a, you know, strong, unique password for every site, and you don’t even need to know it, right? You just, you know, unlock your, your, uh, you know, keystore on your computer and, um, you know, pass that, pass that password. So.

Erik Boemanns: So I’m going to pivot the conversation a little bit. I mentioned we want to talk a little bit about the business itself, consulting and how kind of what motivated you to shift to that mode of.

Bill Morse: I’ve wanted to have my own business since I was a child. So it was it was it was time. Right, right. Um, so I was looking for my next my next role, um, had several offers to take another kind of enterprise role, but I got one offer that was a, you know, an offer to come in as a consultant and, um, you know, working, working through the details, I realized this was my this was my chance to kind of, you know, come in, start my own business, come in as a consultant, um, you know, through through another consulting company that had the actual contract, but then try to build, you know, my, my book of business on my own. Um, so that was about three years ago now. Um, you know, I’m I’m enjoying the journey. So, you know, one of the, one of the things that, um, is kind of fun about it all is, you know, if you come from the enterprise side, where, you know, you’re supposed to secure the the ERP platform and the accounting platform and HR platform and all that, but you don’t really understand 100% what these things do. Now you’re running your own business, and you need an HR system and a CRM and an accounting platform and all that. So, you know, these days, um, you know, if you’re if you’re out there thinking about starting a business, I would say go for it because, um, you know, it’s a lot easier. You know, you can subscribe to all these things. You don’t need to stand up a data center, etc.. You know, all this stuff is kind of available. Um, you know, the more people that use something, the easier it is to find other people to, you know, ask for advice and etc.. So, yeah, you know, the process of getting this all started was, uh, was very exciting. And anytime anyone and I could go for a couple of hours about starting a business up and integrating all your systems together and all that. So if anyone wants to know more about that, please, please reach out. It’s one of my favorite topics.

Erik Boemanns: You did mention one thing, though, that I think scares people the most about starting a new business. You should build your own book of business. So getting customers, getting clients that obviously once you get past that curve, having your own business is amazing. It’s fun. It’s getting to that first customer second, and then a repeatable process. Um, so do you have any secrets you want to share about how are you acquiring new business?

Bill Morse: So our so one of the things about identity and access management at the enterprise level is it’s, it’s difficult for a very small business to knock on, you know, a large bank or pharmaceutical store and say, hey, I can I can help you with your problems. Right. It’s it’s almost impossible. Um, but what we do is we, we call them our channels, right? So we partner with much bigger consulting firms that already have those relationships. And in the ideal situation, they don’t do IAM. So they might do ten other things for a for a company. And if they hear I am they’ll kind of call us and say, hey, we you know, we just heard that this company has this problem. Can you can you solve it? Um, sometimes we can’t. And I’m and I’m happy to, you know, stay in my uh, my wheelhouse. Um, you know, one of the things is, is people, um, often ask me, hey, is this guy your competitor? And I always joke, I’m too small to have competitors. You know, there’s enough business out there, um, that, you know, the crumbs that fall off the table from from some of the big guys are big enough to to, you know, run your own consulting firm on. Sure.

Erik Boemanns: So you’ve been doing this a few years now looking forward. What are you excited about?

Bill Morse: Am I excited about I, I personally want to get to the point where I’m no longer billable. Right. So we right now we have about a dozen people, um, you know, there there is work involved in, you know, going on podcasts. Actually, this is this is great. Thanks for having me. But there’s there’s work going out there, marketing, you know, running the business, finding, finding the next job, etc.. And, um, you know, when I stand up and say, yeah, I’ll get that spreadsheet to you next week, you know, I need someone to smack me and say, no, you can’t. You know, you’ve got other stuff to do. Like, you know, delegate that. Um, so 2025 is going to be the year where, you know, Bill is is less billable. The guys in the office are kidding about that, but also want to want to get bigger. We have some some revenue targets for this year that we think we can hit. Um, you know, I’m making it sound like it’s great. One of the scariest parts of starting your own business is, well, talking to other people that have a successful job into quitting it and coming along with you. That’s that’s the most terrifying part. Yes. So, you know, you got to remember you’re bringing other people along on this, on this journey with you. But it’s it’s been, you know, a lot of fun, very rewarding so far.

Erik Boemanns: That’s great. Um, so real quick as we are getting close to the end here, how can people find out more about Erdos and reach out to you?

Bill Morse: So we have a website just w WW. Com has a contact us link. That’s one of the best ways to to kind of get our attention. Um, we’re also on LinkedIn. Uh, we have, we have a page on uh, on LinkedIn. If it’s okay, we’ll put links to both in the, uh, in the comments and all. Um, and, you know, bring bring us your, uh, your questions, comments, concerns. You know, one of the things we, um, we really believe in is, um, you know, as an industry, as a society, etc., we’ve got to talk about these things. And one of the things I wanted to I want to talk about today is, you know, we, you know, if some someone wakes up and their system is ransomware, like I said a minute ago, it’s not something to be embarrassed about. It’s something to tell everyone about and tell them what you could have done differently so that we can all kind of learn from the experience. So, you know, if you if you want to tell me something I said here was wrong or if you want to ask for advice. Either way, you know, feel free to reach out.

Erik Boemanns: Yeah. And real quick, if you don’t mind spelling the company name as well.

Bill Morse: So it’s, uh, I r I t o s. So, yeah, some people do tell me it should be pronounced like like the bag of chips, but but it’s it’s it’s supposed to sound Latin sound.

Erik Boemanns: Yes. Not a snack. Um. So awesome. Appreciate that. I just want to close out. Maybe, um, what are three things that people could do as they today to make themselves more secure?

Bill Morse: That’s a good question. So we mentioned one of them. So, you know, talk to each other. Right. Learn from each other and and, you know, share your experiences. Share your your good experiences, but also your, your bad ones. So we can all learn from it. Um, have a healthy amount of skepticism. You know, so, um, you know, when you get that link that says click here, your package can’t be delivered or you got a wire or whatever. You know, think think twice about where it came from. Uh, you know, all the advice people give you. Check the URL, make sure it’s a known sender, make sure it’s a, you know, SSL cert, etc. but be skeptical when you’re when your bank calls you out of the blue and they’re asking you for more information that they should probably know already. You know, make sure it’s really your bank. So we all have to be skeptical. But we all we all have to tell each other about this so that we all understand, you know, where to be, where to be skeptical. And then if you’re, you know, if you’re a you’re a service provider, your bank, your insurance company or your travel agency, whatever. If they’re offering more security, take them up on it. Right. You should, um, you know, we talked about having unique passwords for all your sites, but if they offer what’s called multi-factor authentication, where, you know, you can’t log in without, um, you know, acknowledging a notification on your phone or that kind of thing. Take them up on it. Right. You know, it’s our responsibility to be as secure as we’re we’re able to be. If the vendors were working for our, um, I’m sorry, if the vendors were using our offering security, we should take them up on it. And if they’re not offering these levels of security, we should we should push back and ask for it be.

Erik Boemanns: Consider different vendors. Right.

Bill Morse: Right, right. Part of part of due diligence.

Erik Boemanns: Right, exactly. Well, thank you again for coming. I appreciate the time and the insight and look forward to next time.

Bill Morse: This was great. Thanks for having me.

 

About Your Host

Erik-BoemannsErik Boemanns is a technology executive and lawyer. His background covers many aspects of technology, from infrastructure to software development.

He combines this with a “second career” as a lawyer into a world of cybersecurity, governance, risk, compliance, and privacy (GRC-P).

His time in a variety of companies, industries, and careers brings a unique perspective on leadership, helping, technology problem solving and implementing compliance.

Connect with Erik on LinkedIn, Substack and Medium.

BRX Pro Tip: Healthy Communities Do This One Thing Well

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BRX Pro Tip: Healthy Communities Do This One Thing Well

Stone Payton: Welcome back to Business RadioX Pro Tips. Lee Kantor, Stone Payton here with you. Lee, what’s the key, man? What’s the best way to build and sustain a truly healthy community?

Lee Kantor: Yeah. I think that healthy, engaged, invested communities do this one thing well. And this one thing is participation. You really – if you have a community or you’re trying to build a community, you should be actively thinking of ways to drive more community participation. And that might start with something small, like getting small groups together to do something, and then try to expand that to as many people as possible.

Lee Kantor: But if your community is already doing things on its own, it’s a good thing to kind of invest in whatever activity they’re organically doing on their own and seeing what other resources you can add to it to get more of that participation. Because organic participation is always better than manufactured participation.

Lee Kantor: So pay attention to what your community does and wants more of and then help them get it. So that’s a great way to get more participation within your community. And like I said, healthy, engaged, invested communities have a lot of participation.

BRX Pro Tip: 4 Ways to Become an Indispensable Professional Services Provider

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BRX Pro Tip: 4 Ways to Become an Indispensable Professional Services Provider
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Stone Payton: And we are back with Business RadioX Pro Tips. Stone Payton and Lee Kantor here with you. Lee, one of the challenges, in my experience, in being in the professional services arena is, sometimes, our work is really characterized and thought of as a discretionary expenditure. What, if anything, can we do to actually move from discretionary to indispensable?

Lee Kantor: Yeah. There are certain things you can be doing right now that can help you kind of elevate yourself to that level of being indispensable, so that you’re not a nice-to-have. You’re a must have. The first thing you could do is specialize and showcase your superpower and your unique expertise. Be one of one, not one of many. Number two, keep showing up. Tenacity and persistence win over time and business is a war of attrition. Most people are going to quit too soon. Number three, provide excellent customer support and white glove service. Do the things your competition doesn’t want to do. And lastly, number four, keep getting better. Focus on continuously learning and improving, so you can stay ahead of your clients and teach them new things every day.

Empowering Veterans: Overcoming Employment Challenges with Work for Warriors Georgia

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In this episode of Sandy Springs Business Radio, Lee Kantor and Rachel Simon talk with Patrick Rivers and Lacy Turner from Work for Warriors Georgia. The discussion highlights the organization’s mission to provide free employment assistance to veterans, service members, and their families. Lacy and Patrick discuss the challenges veterans face when transitioning to civilian life, such as translating military skills into civilian job qualifications. They emphasize the importance of personalized support, proactive outreach, and employer collaboration to help veterans secure meaningful employment.

Patrick-RiversCSM (Ret) Patrick Rivers enlisted on active duty in 1997 and began his Infantry Basic Training on Station Unit Training (OSUT) that summer with 2-58 Infantry Training Battalion at Ft Benning, Ga., graduating (11B Infantry) in October 1997.

After attending Basic Combat Training CSM (Ret) Rivers was assigned to Ft. Lewis, WA, where he served as a Riflemen, Grenadier and Team Leader. His other assignments include B co 1-22 IN (Regulars by God), Ft. Hood, TX, where he served as a Team Leader deployed in support of OIF I; A co and D co 1-187 IN (Rakkasans), Ft. Campbell, KY, where he deployed as a Squad Leader for both companies in support of OIF I and IV; B co and E co 2-60th IN (Scouts Out) where he served as a Drill Sergeant at Ft. Jackson, SC; D co 1-327 IN (Bulldogs), Ft. Campbell, KY, where he served as an Anti- Armor Platoon Sergeant, deployed in support of OEF X-XI; A co 1-327 IN, Ft. Campbell, KY, where he served as a Company First Sergeant; Military Science Instructor (MS II and III’s) with The Georgia Institute of Technology and Kennesaw State University; C co 3-13 IN (40 Rounds), Ft. Jackson, SC, where he served as a Basic Combat Training Company First Sergeant; 101st NCOA (Train to Lead) where he served as a Deputy Commandant, Ft. Campbell, Ky. and the Operations Sergeant Major for the 5-7 Cavalry Regiment (Garryowen), 1ABCT, 3ID, Ft. Stewart, Ga. CSM (Ret) Rivers then assumed responsibility as the Battalion Command Sergeant Major for 2-58 Inf Regt (Patriots) on Sandhill, Fort Moore, Georgia, the only gender integrated Infantry Training Battalion in the United States Army. CSM (Ret) then retired in October 2022 and is now a Regional Employment Coordinator in the Atlanta area for the Work for Warriors-Ga program.

CSM (Ret) Rivers’ military education includes Basic Leader Course, Advanced Leader Course, Senior Leader Course, SMC Class 68 (Ultima; By Example), Drill Sergeant School, Air Assault and Pathfinder School. CSM (Ret) Rivers’ awards and decorations include the Legion of Merit, Bronze Star (1 OLC), Meritorious Service Medal (4 OLC), the Army Commendation Medal (4 OLC), the Army Achievement Medal (6 OLC), the Expert Infantry Badge, the Combat Infantry Badge, Air Assault Badge, and the Pathfinder’s Badge. CSM Rivers has a Bachelor’s of Science in Liberal Arts with Excelsior College.

Lacy-Turner

Lacy Turner is the Director of Work For Warriors Georgia (W4WGA), the Georgia National Guard’s free employment assistance program.

Since 2012, Lacy has been a part of the program and was instrumental in expanding the program from a two to ten person team with an annual operating budget of $1M. Under her leadership, the WFWGA program has participated in multiple state and national workforce initiatives.

WFWGA Candidates report that the program has improved their financial situation by 79% and decreased their stress level by 90%. For more information about the program, visit www.workforwarriorsga.org.

Lacy is a graduate of The University of Tennessee as well as Leadership Georgia (Class of 2023) and White County Chamber of Commerce’s Leadership (Class of 2022). Prior to WFWGA, she has worked for various nonprofits and in the financial industry.

Follow Work for Warriors Georgia on Facebook.

Transcript-iconThis transcript is machine transcribed by Sonix.

 

TRANSCRIPT

Intro: Broadcasting live from the Business RadioX studios in Sandy Springs, Georgia. It’s time for Sandy Springs Business Radio. Now, here’s your host.

Lee Kantor: Lee Kantor here with Rachel Simon, another episode of Sandy Springs Business Radio, and this is going to be a good one. Today’s episode is brought to you by Connect the Dots Digital. When you’re ready to leverage LinkedIn to meet your business goals, go to Connect the Dots Dot digital. Rachel welcome back.

Rachel Simon: Hi, Lee. Happy new year. Are we allowed to say that still or people are like.

Lee Kantor: What’s the the window? What’s the date.

Rachel Simon: That you’re not allowed to say it anymore? But anyway, it’s the first time I’m seeing you in 2020.

Lee Kantor: Happy New Year to you.

Rachel Simon: Um, I’m super excited about our show today, and I think it’s a great show to kick off 2025. 25. So we have two guests joining us from work for Warriors Georgia. So I’m happy to welcome Lacy Turner, who is the director, and Patrick Rivers, who serves as regional employment coordinator. Welcome.

Hi, Rachel.

Lacy Turner: Thank you.

Rachel Simon: So let’s kick off with tell us about your organization. Who do you serve? What’s your mission?

Lacy Turner: So I work for Warriors. Georgia is a free employment assistance program actually housed in the Georgia Guard. But we help veterans, family members, and service members on educating them and assisting them and connecting them with meaningful employment opportunities. So we want to really empower individuals and provide them with the tools and resources and support they need to really get a job that they are looking for that will work with them and provide growth opportunities with them so they can really find meaningful employment.

Rachel Simon: And is it are there specific challenges that veterans are facing when they’re moving from the military into the workforce.

Patrick Rivers: Rachel, there’s a lot of obstacles.

Rachel Simon: I’m sure that’s a big question.

Patrick Rivers: Yes, ma’am. From the transitioning. You know, you have soldiers that, you know, wore the uniform for ten, 20 years and, you know, not abreast of the, you know, the resources that we have, you know, in a civilian world, like work for warriors like me, when I was, I did 25 years in the army, and I had no clue that I worked for warriors. Georgia even existed until, you know, I connected with one of the coordinators for a veteran initiative that I was trying to establish, and I was like, man, I work for Warriors from Georgia. Actually. It’s a great program, and here I am now, you know, as an employment coordinator.

Rachel Simon: So if I could ask, when you were transitioning out of the military, what was some of the challenges that you were facing, kind of looking to find employment?

Patrick Rivers: I would say the big one is just trying to, you know, translate that resume from military terms to civilian. I think the second one is to is also not knowing the, you know, the jobs that are out there for, you know, military veterans.

Rachel Simon: Yeah, I think that transferable skills is a really important topic to talk about. So, you know, how can people who are leaving military service kind of think about transferring their skills into, you know, more of a civilian role?

Lacy Turner: Yeah. So I think one of the things that our program has really identified is really a gap from the information and the military to the civilians. So we really work hard with our service members to really figure out one, what are they looking for? What is their experience and what are they looking to do long term? So for instance, they’ve done logistics in the military for 20 years. Are they lean Six Sigma certified? You know, do they have the civilian qualifications. And we really work with them to provide them with a lot of free training opportunities to really make sure that they have their skills, and then they can apply for jobs for which they’re qualified.

Patrick Rivers: And Lacy brought up a good point. Rachel, you know, we’re we have a lot of certifications in the military, you know, Air Assault School, Pathfinder, sniper and all those, you know, courses that you need to be that that soldier in the Army. Um, but you literally find out later on as you’re transitioning or afterwards that there’s certain civilian certifications that you need, like your PMP or your Sherm, you know, but, uh, sadly, we find out too late.

Rachel Simon: Are those things that if you had known when you were still in service that you could have gotten then or not necessarily. Yes, ma’am. Okay. So it’s also educating current service members on as you’re thinking about leaving the military. Here are some things that may help you in that transition.

Lacy Turner: Right. Like for instance, a lot of human resources, um, service members want to go and find air jobs, and when they go apply for them, they don’t necessarily have the civilian certification. So we have worked with society for Human Resource Management here in Georgia to help bridge that gap and get them their certifications that they need, usually using credentialing assistance. So then they can get their SHRM certification and then apply for jobs and become employable in the civilian workforce.

Rachel Simon: Oh that’s great. That’s great. It seems like there’s real opportunity for again, people from sort of depending on even if they’re thinking about leaving military service within the next 3 to 5 years being how do they prepare for that transition right now?

Lee Kantor: Um, can you educate the listener who didn’t go through the military, like, what’s it like when that day happens where you’re like, okay, now I’m a civilian because I don’t think the civilian side understands that. That transition is pretty abrupt, right? There isn’t a oh, here. Now we’re going to offboard you and onboard you into the civilian world. It’s kind of like, see you later. Bye. Right. Like that. You’re now on your own. And and these kind of services aren’t, like, obvious to you unless you start seeking them out.

Patrick Rivers: I think the military does a good job with, you know, preparing, helping you prepare for the civilian life, as far as you know, attempting to, you know, go to job fairs and do the homework to try to try to get those, you know, uh, knowledge from when you get out, you know, to obtain employment. I think it’s really up to the individual, you know, to put in the legwork, you know, to use the, you know, the resources that the military gives. Like, uh, I retired from Fort Moore and Fort Moore, Georgia. Uh, every Army, um, unit has or installation has SFL tap. It’s a transitioning program, right. And you’re actually allowed to start, you know, um, going to those job fairs for SFL type probably a year out. There’s also a program called the CSP that you can do internships and what have you. So that will prepare you to get out. So like I said earlier, I think it’s based off of that that individuals, you know, legwork whether or not they’re, you know, right afterwards.

Lee Kantor: And that aligns with the mindset of somebody in the military, right? They are proactive. They’re um, take personal accountability and things like that. There’s but like this program, you weren’t aware of this program until you found it on your own, right? It wasn’t obvious, right? And that’s kind of the challenge, right? You want to give the military veteran that bridge to an easier path without having to, you know, do some of that legwork.

Lacy Turner: Well, and we work to with the transition assistance programs and a lot of veteran service organizations throughout the state to really educate our population in Georgia of the opportunities that we have. So a service member, for instance, is looking to retire from active duty or complete their guard service six months out. So we try to really be proactive, get in front of them, attend a lot of different briefings, then say, hey, John Smith, you’re looking for a position. You know, let’s go ahead and start the the intake process. Let’s review your resume. Let’s see what you’re interested in. For instance, you might have been managing somebody for 20 years. Or do you still want to manage somebody or do you want a position where you clock in and clock out? So we really look at the service member, figure out what they’re looking for long term, their qualifications all in an intake process. Then we begin. Like Patrick mentioned, the resume review process. And we say, okay, do you still if you’re living in Savannah, do you want to stay in Savannah? Do you want to relocate to North Georgia? Really? What are you looking for? Your salary. You know, we do a variety of different intake questions to really get a pulse on exactly what the service member wants. So when that day comes and they’re separated from the military, then we can go in and say, hey, let’s complete the resume, get you your interview training, see if there are any Skillbridge program you can go into, and really set them up for success.

Lee Kantor: Now, are they taking advantage of it? Like what percent of the people are kind of leaning into all of these programs that are available, and what percent are just like, well, that was my last day, so now I got to figure this out.

Lacy Turner: So I think it varies on the person. I don’t have an exact percent, but I would say we have an active caseload, a very robust active caseload of service members and family members and veterans throughout the state who are constantly looking for employment. And that could be looking for employment, as employment is and they got laid off yesterday, or they’re coming up on retirement in the next three months. And they want to go ahead and start the conversation right now. So it really just depends.

Patrick Rivers: And I think what makes our program so good, Rachel, is that, you know, we have seven coordinators across the state of Georgia. So as opposed to a program that’s a national program, right. That you’re not very personable with that that candidate, we have that advantage. Like right now I have 46 active candidates that I communicate with, you know, on a daily basis, you know, to make sure the resume is good, to coach them in interviews and what have you. So we have coordinators in Augusta. We have coordinators in Savannah, uh, northwest, northeast, Atlanta, southwest, and uh, you know, so we’re able to get in there in the trenches and actually help these candidates personally.

Lacy Turner: Yeah, I like that you brought that up, Patrick, because I think it’s crucial to know that if a service member is looking for a position in Savannah, we’re going to connect them with the Savannah employment coordinator versus Atlanta, because that Savannah employment coordinator knows what’s going on within their map of within their. Districts of Georgia, and they have the pulse on the technical colleges, the training programs, the employers, the different economic climate of that area and really can understand what is a good path to walk down. And really one that’s kind of like a tried and true, you know, we’ve tried this hasn’t really worked. So let’s hang out down this one.

Rachel Simon: Yeah. That’s. Oh go ahead.

Lee Kantor: Do you work with the employer to help educate them on how to best leverage this opportunity with this potentially great employee? Because I think it has to work from both sides.

Lacy Turner: Absolutely right. It does. Do you want to talk about that, Patrick.

Patrick Rivers: Oh, yes. Lacy. So like with me right now I have I want to say 60 active, you know, employer partners and a preliminary thing is to, you know, go and, you know, do a face to face. Just last week I visited an employer partner, just we met on LinkedIn and he invited me for a tour. I think it was cross link. And, you know, we talk about our program. We talk about, you know, how we can best serve that candidate, you know, from work for Warriors Georgia with the employer your partner and we pretty much, you know, try to get to know what are their requisites for us, you know, to try to get that candidate in front of them.

Lee Kantor: Right? Because you want to do a good match so that it’s a win win for both sides where the the veteran has a place that’s going to embrace them and kind of help them speak the language that they need to speak. And the employer gets a motivated person that kind of has the right mindset to help them.

Lacy Turner: Right. I’m really glad you touched on that, because there are a lot of times I think with my team, I joke with them because they get so much into the weeds of businesses, so they go, they like to do site visits and really learn what the employer is looking at. For instance, if you if your shift or your time to report is 8 a.m. and you have kids that you have to get off the bus or put on the bus or whatever the case is, drop them off at school, then you know the clock starts backwards. So to be able to make sure you’re being a good employee, you know, we need to learn what are do you have a three kind of items, you know, that are non-negotiables within 90 days or, you know, is the parking garage a very far distance from the location that you report to? What is what are the benefits? What is the progression of moving on up and maybe obtaining another position with the employer? So really we do work with the employer. We learn exactly what they’re looking for.

Lacy Turner: The candidates are looking for the non-negotiables. For instance like if they have three strikes and 90 days, you know, so we can best equip our candidates and say, hey, you know, if this company really practices starting right on time because it’s a shift at 7 a.m. to 7 p.m.. So you need to make sure you know your life is squared away from 7 a.m. to 7 p.m., so you can really be the best employee there, too. And we really do educate. We have a lot of different opportunities where we bring employers in to our units and actually can talk to our service members one on one. Or for instance, we’ve even taken a couple different employers out to the southwest border with us and talked with them and showed them done resume classes and employer briefings with some of our service members so they can get a head start and really kind of learn what it’s like to one be a soldier and then two, how the soldier can then learn about the company so they can apply for positions there as well. Yeah.

Rachel Simon: I mean, it sounds like such a truly comprehensive, uh, group of programs, both on, on both sides of, of that relationship. Right. So a question I had, you know, you had mentioned HR and like sort of transitioning from HR services in the military into the civilian world. Are there any other industries that are pretty like hot in your area where a lot of people are moving from their military service?

Lacy Turner: Yeah, I would say it. How about you?

Patrick Rivers: It for me in metro Atlanta, cyber security. And I would say also logistics.

Lacy Turner: Yeah I would say I would agree with that too, as well as general manufacturing different things like that as well.

Rachel Simon: Is there any industries that are a little bit of a surprise that could be a, you know, good fits?

Patrick Rivers: I had a candidate a couple months ago that threw me off. He was a UGA graduate and he had a biological engineering degree, and for me, I was new to the work for Warriors Georgia. And I was like, man, how do I get this guy hired? I looked into it, sent his resume to Emory, and he got hired a month later, and they saw his resume and they were like, whoa, we’ve never seen anything like this before. It was just, you know, and he was hired within two weeks.

Lacy Turner: And I think that’s really a good point, too, because Cho, for instance, people would be like, oh, it’s just healthcare, it’s just nurses or it’s just medical staff, but really, like they need security or, you know, um, marketing personnel. So really, when we’re educating our service members on different opportunities, we really have to look at the position that you’re looking for and then look at the company for what you’re interested in, because, I mean, you think of I think sometimes the mind defaults to, oh, it’s just healthcare. But healthcare can be so vast and the variety of different Um, positions that they offer. So really, we have to make sure our candidates are taking a good 360 perspective.

Rachel Simon: Well, right. And today, every company is a tech company, right? Right. Every company has a financial services department. Security services, security marketing. I mean, so there is just because it serves this group doesn’t mean there aren’t all these other opportunities internally.

Patrick Rivers: And since we’re talking to, you know, transitioning members and, you know, National Guard, you know, soldiers, I usually break it down to them in a military way, like you said, Rachel and Lacy, you know, like the Army, they have their functions, you have your HR, you have your, you know, your S2 security, you have your S3 operations, S4 logistics. So I put it in that language. It’s like, oh, okay. Well I’ll submit this application for this, this, this this company. They get it afterwards.

Rachel Simon: Do you have any of your candidates that are looking to start their own businesses?

Patrick Rivers: Yes, we do have candidates that are looking to be entrepreneurs.

Lacy Turner: And we refer them to like the SBDC, Small Business Development Center, um, small Business Administration, different groups like that to best assist them. Yeah. So.

Rachel Simon: Um, right. I mean, and we were talking prior to the show, there’s so many veteran organizations to collaborate with in Atlanta. I think that we’re pretty lucky here, and I don’t know if it’s like that. I mean, obviously you’re serving the whole state of Georgia, but specifically here in Atlanta, there’s a lot of different groups to kind of partner and take advantage of.

Lacy Turner: Right. And I think that’s one of the best things is that we’re all here to help the service member. At the end of the day, while we all have our own priorities. The end game is to help our service members find meaningful employment and a purpose that is outside the military.

Patrick Rivers: And I think, Rachel, you know, with my job, I think I like it so much because of I didn’t have that advantage of having to communicate with employers or, you know, having someone to mediate for me when I was applying for jobs. Um, with me, I have that I can talk to my employer or partners and say, hey, you know, this application was submitted two weeks ago. What’s the status? Um, I may have some employers that may take 2 or 3 weeks to answer. I may have some that may answer in two hours, but I will have an answer for that candidate to see. That way, they know where they’re at as far as employment. Hey, you didn’t make the cut, man or two. Hey, you’re currently your application or resume is in front of a hiring manager. You should get a call back today. Um, so that’s usually how it works with me, I love that.

Rachel Simon: So you shared your success story about your one candidate who was hired at Koa. Do you have any other stories that you are really proud of?

Lacy Turner: Yeah, I think we have a great story of the service member who’s in the Army Reserves, because, remember, we help. Even though we’re in the guard, we help all branches, all services and family members. So he was here, and then he moved out to the West Coast and then he relocated back during Covid. Was looking for positions applied. I’m not even kidding. You like probably 400 positions. We were working with them. We were working on interview skills. We were referring him being like, we we just kept hitting walls every time we would refer him to somebody or he would interview, and it’s like he kind of made the cut, but not specifically. And then one day we referred him for another position. I think he had like 4 or 5 interviews, and then it ended up getting like an $80,000 position with this great company that we work closely with. And it was just it was so successful and so exciting because we could hear the excitement in his voice, not just, of course, getting an $80,000 a year job, but just the sheer fact of I’ve tried. I’ve applied online, I’ve interviewed, I haven’t been successful. And now finally, I got the break and I got a great break that I’ve been looking for. So just things like that. And then the fact that they want to go in and they’re just so excited that they can now support their family and they can contribute to society and just really utilize their skills. It’s those moments like that where, in my opinion, Patrick, you might say something else, but when a service member is just like, thank you so much for helping me get a position that I enjoy. I like the company. You know, it checks all the boxes. It really brings satisfaction to our.

Rachel Simon: Our jobs. I mean, I can’t imagine why any employer wouldn’t want to be hiring veterans. Out of the military, based on just all of the traits that somebody has when they have dedicated. You know, many years to to service. So it’s one thing that I always suggest to anybody. Anyone that I’m working with on LinkedIn, if you if they served in the military, that needs to be front and center in their LinkedIn profile. Because I think it’s instant credibility.

Patrick Rivers: And, Rachel, you know, a part of my job as well. You know, I’m a big believer I was a former senior leader in Army. And, uh, my thing is, just because you wore the uniform doesn’t make you qualified. That’s just me as a former senior leader. So my job also is to vet those candidates. So I’m not sending someone unqualified in front of that employer partner, you know, because we’re talking about the company’s image and our image as well.

Rachel Simon: Yeah. Well, obviously. Yes. You want to have the right the right person and the right right in the right role. Um, you know, tell us a little bit more about like, advice you would give to employers as far as you know, why they should be looking to hire veterans, how they can and then how you can potentially help them to connect them with the right people.

Patrick Rivers: Well, Rachel, you know, again, coming from the Army, you know, I don’t know if you’ve heard the saying that we do more than anybody else by 8:00 in the morning. Right. We get up at 430 to get ready to go to physical training. You have to go to accountability formation before the formation to get accounted for. And then you have physical training. Then you go into the workday. I would say to any employer that wants to partner with work for Warriors Georgia, it’s like, you know, to hire a veteran or a Guardsman, anyone in the military, it’s a it’s a win win. You know, you’re going to get someone that’s going to give you 100%. You’re going to give someone that’s motivated, passionate, you’re going to have someone that’s really, you know, certified, you know, maybe not on paper, but just as a, you know, former soldier or Soldier or veteran that can do a lot more than the normal civilian or person.

Rachel Simon: So tell us a little bit from both sides, from both the, you know, the the individual who is looking for employment, but also for the employer, like what’s the best way to get started with your organization?

Lacy Turner: So I think the best way for a job seeker and employer, but a job seeker will start out with that is to go on our website at Workforce Warriors. Org backslash register, click the register button and then upload some information like Lacy Turner where they live in the state, and a variety like a resume, different things like that. And then once they hit submit, then it’ll be sent automatically routed to the employment coordinator that services their county, and then the service member should reach out to them within 48 hours and connect with them and start the intake process and really start the job search process. And then for employers, the same thing, they can go to our website at work for Warriors GAA and click the employer link and then register. And again their information will go straight to the Employment coordinator of where they are located. If they have a variety of different positions throughout the state. A couple of my employment coordinators will be reaching out to best serve them and go from there.

Rachel Simon: And it’s any size employer.

Lacy Turner: Yeah, any size employer, small or large. And we help all branches, all services, any rank as well as well as spouses.

Lee Kantor: Now you mentioned work for Warriors Georgia. Is there work for warriors around the country or is this just a Georgia centric organization?

Patrick Rivers: There are 16 work for warriors. And that’s why, like you said, you know, we’re respective to Georgia. We’re for warriors. Georgia. So there’s 15 others across the United States, I want to say as far north as Ohio and as far west as California.

Lacy Turner: So actually a comprehensive list is Arizona, California, Florida, Georgia, Hawaii, Indiana, Louisiana, Mississippi, Nevada, North Carolina, South Carolina, Ohio, Oregon, Tennessee, Texas, and Washington. They Washington. They might not all necessarily name their program as work for warriors, but they all work with us and all part of the same idea and coalition as us. So and you can actually go on our website and see the variety of different states.

Rachel Simon: And is that from like under a national umbrella or are there.

Lacy Turner: All we all receive funding from the office of Secretary of Defense.

Lee Kantor: Now, what do you need more of? How can we help you?

Lacy Turner: I think we want to make sure that our, your viewers actually are aware of our program and how to register on there. And if any employers are looking to fill some vacancies, reach out to us as well. Patrick, do you have any other suggestions other than that?

Patrick Rivers: Lacy, you cover that? Also, I think LinkedIn is a great tool, you know, for, you know, trying to, of course, networking. Um, you know, I’ve reposted jobs on LinkedIn from, you know, Non-employer partners. And then about probably a day later, hey, what is this program about? And we’ll talk about it then to become an actual, you know, employer partner. So partners. They become very interested in the program because I’ve actually had two candidates that were hired by someone that was not an employer partner based off of me reposting that for their job needs.

Lacy Turner: Yeah. And another thing too is we always like to work with our employers. For instance, bring them to yellow ribbon events when our soldiers are either coming back from deployment or going to deployment so they can kind of it’s like a mini job fair. Also, we, um, Patrick has done and a couple of my other employment coordinators have done some really great one on one, um, events with employers, for instance, where they might have like a mini job fair, for instance, we did it with Kia where they told us about some open positions. We sourced our candidates and helped them, helped our candidates tailor their resumes, and really did a lot of interview prep. We they brought Kia, brought the service members in for interviews and really got to know them and had a tour of the facility and then ended up actually hiring some candidates off of that job fair. So really like there’s a variety of different ways that we could work with our employers.

Patrick Rivers: We also had a phenomenal event that we did. I want to say it was last year in May at the Porsche Experience Center. Uh, we brought in like 5 or 6, uh, employer partners, and we had a couple candidates that were actually hired, uh, from that event.

Rachel Simon: Well, what about anything coming up this year? Is that wise.

Patrick Rivers: Respective to me? I have one next month, uh, with, uh, Napa. Uh, we’re doing an open house at their facility. Uh, you know, same thing that Lacy said we’re going to vet, you know, source our candidates, we’re going to vet, you know, resumes. And then that resume vetting is going to be the their ticket into that, uh, into that event. We also have the, uh, the civic leader flight in April, which, if you’re not familiar with that, Rachel Lee, uh, we’re going to invite, you know, uh, elected officials, our leaders across the metro Atlanta area or Georgia. Uh, we’re going to meet at, uh, Dobbins Air Reserve Base, uh, hangar five, uh, Clay National Guard Center. So we’re potentially going to have a, uh, employer panel. We’re going to have, uh, two big companies, you know, have that panel. We’re going to feed you, and then we’re going to give you a little safety training on how to board a Army military Blackhawk. Then we’ll throw you in that Blackhawk, and you’re going to tour around the metro Atlanta area. We did one in April. We had over 100 attendees, and we flew over Mercedes-Benz Stadium, Truist Park. We we saw the Atlanta skyline flew over Buckhead and then Marietta. So it’s a pretty cool event.

Rachel Simon: That is awesome. It is a really cool event.

Lacy Turner: And I think the best thing is we get to bring employers that might not necessarily have military experience in and show them what it’s like to a life in the day of a military service member, and then show them exactly how we’ve worked with different employers to really help our service members and our veteran population obtain employment.

Rachel Simon: That sounds like such a fun event.

Lacy Turner: Yeah.

Patrick Rivers: It is. And then we have another one that’s not really respective to us, but we’re actually helping with the initiative. So this past September, it was the military influencer conference that was held here in metro Atlanta. It was actually the first time they did it here in Atlanta. And now they’re going to come back in September again to do another one. So we were chosen or we were just, you know, to help spearhead the the job fair portion of that military infrastructure conference you’re going to have. I think Jon Stewart was the actual keynote speaker at this last one. So we’re going to have probably 40 to 40 to 50 employers come through. And, you know, job fair style. Uh, I think it’s 3 to 4 days at that event. We’re going to have a keynote speakers, a comedy night, and also a gala, you know, with awards for that event. And you have a lot of big name folks from the military and the civilian sector that actually, you know, participate.

Rachel Simon: Sounds like an exciting year ahead for for everybody.

Lee Kantor: Now, uh, Rachel, we always do a LinkedIn tip. You mentioned a little bit, if you were a veteran, to kind of the best way to leverage that, those kind of skills and maybe translate some of the leadership that you were doing as a veteran to the civilian. Uh.

Rachel Simon: Yeah, definitely. So I would definitely recommend to include military service in your experience section. Um, and particularly because I because I have had clients who have gone up the ranks when they were serving, making sure to include all of those different roles. Right. If you were continuously being promoted, um, thinking about the skills that you utilized and again, putting those in your skills section, and I really encourage in your headline listing that you were a veteran because, again, you can put your, uh, you know, where you served. If it was Army, Navy, Marines, whatever the case may be, or just say proud veteran or however you want to put it, but putting it in your headline, I think because when you go to connect with other people who served in the military, as soon as they see that, you’re instantly vetted, right?

Patrick Rivers: Yes, ma’am.

Patrick Rivers: Um, to add to Rachel’s point to is like, you know, uh, with with the resume, a lot of these resumes are being looked at by, let’s be real, you know, I. Right, right. And again, the benefit that we have here for Warriors Georgia is I’m able to actually send that resume to a actual hiring manager. Recruiter. I had a, uh, an issue one time with a candidate that, you know, she was told to apply for this job based off of that that company. Right. What they needed, she applied for it and within five minutes received a rejection letter. So I intervened. I got Ahold of that point of contact and she was like, wait, hold on. So I sent her the resume and then she was she got an interview.

Lee Kantor: Right. Because if you don’t know the keywords or the magic words that the algorithm is going to look for, then you can be put in the wrong pile. But if you know a human being, that’s an edge.

Lacy Turner: And I think that so many, um, you know, there are so many tools out there that help you with your resume. And every employer seems to want something a smidge different, whether it’s the layout or the skill section up top or the education up top, whatever it is. So really, by learning exactly what the employers are looking at and really getting kind of an advantage, I think has really helped our team be the best version of themselves.

Rachel Simon: Well, there is. You shared, you know, sort of the more the kind of phrase that more things get done before 8 a.m., you know, in the military. I think the other thing related to what you’re doing is that it isn’t always what you know. It’s who you know, right? When you’re looking for a job. And so you’re really serving such an important role as being that who you know, so that your candidates are not being rejected from a by eye scanners because their resume doesn’t match. Exactly. Like by being able to say, whoa, whoa, whoa, check this person out.

Lee Kantor: Because relationships are important and the impact you’re making is real. I mean, you’re affecting people’s lives every day, right?.

Lacy Turner: Yeah. I mean, our program, actually, on the guard side really is more of a holistic because we can help a service member get a job, but. And they can show up at 8 a.m., but if they have financial issues or transportation issues or need VA benefits, then it’s getting them. The job isn’t really going to help their overall picture. So really we focus in on our guard soldiers because we have a touch point with them and actually focusing on their well-being. So we can actually drill in and see, for instance, who needs VA benefits or education benefits, or maybe some other types of counseling that we can help. And then by utilizing that approach on the holistic side of things, we can really go in and help the service member be the best version of themselves and really get a job where they’re successful at. And the employer says, oh my gosh, thank you so much. Like, you’ve helped reduce my turnover, my, my cost to hire a new trainee and keep them on board. This service member is really working out for us. I really thank you and appreciate that.

Lee Kantor: And the website one more time for people who want to connect work for warriors.

Lacy Turner: Georg.

Lee Kantor: Good stuff. Well, thank you both for sharing your story today. You’re doing such important work and we appreciate you.

Lacy Turner: Thank you.

Patrick Rivers: Thank you, Rachel.

Lee Kantor: All right. This is Lee Kantor for Rachel Simon. We’ll see you all next time on Sandy Springs Business Radio.

 

About Your Host

Rachel-SimonRachel Simon is the CEO & Founder of Connect the Dots Digital. She helps B2B companies close more business by leveraging the power of LinkedIn.

Rachel works with professionals, both individuals and teams, to position their authentic brand on LinkedIn so they can connect organically with ideal clients, attract the best talent, and stand out as a leader in their industry.

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Connect with Rachel on LinkedIn.

Trust and Technology: How to Foster Collaboration in the Construction Industry

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Women in Motion
Trust and Technology: How to Foster Collaboration in the Construction Industry
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In this episode of Women in Motion, Lee Kantor interviews Valerie Crafton, founder of VALConsultants. Valerie discusses her consultancy’s mission to address inefficiencies in the construction industry by focusing on root causes rather than quick fixes. She highlights the importance of proactive problem-solving, organized data, and a culture of trust and continuous improvement. Valerie also explores the impact of AI on the industry, emphasizing that high-quality data is crucial for effective AI integration. The episode provides valuable insights for organizations aiming to navigate the complexities of project management and technology adoption.

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Valerie-CraftonValerie Crafton is a seasoned consultant and project controls expert with over 20 years of experience in the construction and high-tech sectors. As the founder and CEO of VALConsultants (VALC), Valerie combines technical expertise, strategic insight, and a forward-thinking approach to lead every project.

Her career includes dirt to delivery experience through working on both sides from General Contractor to Owner side, where she represented Tech Giants such as Microsoft, Intel, and Google, where she managed large-scale construction projects valued between $300 million and $18 billion, spanning data centers, semiconductor facilities, and other complex infrastructures.

Valerie’s journey is built on a solid educational foundation. She holds an MBA in Project Management with a focus on Data Analytics and has completed advanced studies in AI for Business Applications at MIT, equipping her to integrate modern technology with traditional project controls. Additionally, she has a B.S. in Industrial Technology and holds certifications in LEED, AI, and Six Sigma Lean Greenbelt, underscoring her dedication to efficiency and continuous improvement.

A committed advocate for STEM and diversity, Valerie actively supports community outreach and mentors emerging talent. Her involvement with organizations like NAWBO, WBENC, and WiMCO empowers women and underrepresented groups in construction and tech. Through her children’s book series, That Construction Worker is My Mom, Valerie inspires young minds to pursue STEM careers, challenging industry stereotypes.

Valerie’s passion for innovation, combined with her dedication to empowering others, drives VALConsultants’ mission to set new standards in project controls and make a lasting impact on the industry.

Follow VALConsultants on LinkedIn.

Music Provided by M PATH MUSIC

Transcript-iconThis transcript is machine transcribed by Sonix

 

TRANSCRIPT

Intro: Broadcasting live from the Business RadioX Studios, it’s time for Women In Motion. Brought to you by WBEC-West. Join forces. Succeed together. Now, here’s your host.

Lee Kantor: Lee Kantor here, another episode of Women In Motion and this is going to be a good one. But before we get started, it’s important to recognize our sponsor, WBEC-West. Without them, we couldn’t be sharing these important stories. Today on Women In Motion, we have Valerie Crafton with VALC Consultants. Welcome.

Valerie Crafton: Hi. Thanks so much for having me.

Lee Kantor: I am so excited to learn what you’re up to. Tell us about VALC Consultants.

Valerie Crafton: Well, VALC Consultants was really born out of my experience of navigating inefficiencies in large scale projects, and the frustration of seeing some mistakes repeated due to siloed data and a resistance to overall change. And when I saw this critical gap in the industry, it was really driven by a lack of real time visibility. People were bringing technology in, but they were trying to make the technology fit something. They didn’t fit the problem, rather than understanding their problem’s root causes and then finding a tailored solution to fit that.

Valerie Crafton: And there really was more of a reactive approach rather than a proactive approach in managing projects, so my goal was to really create a consultancy that not only solves those problems, but empowers businesses to adopt innovative methods and thrive in a rapidly evolving environment.

Lee Kantor: Now, at first, were you working for another firm and then you decided to go off on your own or were you always kind of on your own?

Valerie Crafton: Yes. So, I have spent about half of my career in the field building and working in construction. So, I bring that dirt to delivery experience, and I recruit and bring team members on with similar experience, because I really believe that that helps us fast forward our clients to their future state. But, yeah, we spent half of our time in the field on general contractor side, eventually ending up on the owner’s side, representing owners working directly for Google, Microsoft, Intel, for example, and really starting to see the picture from both sides of the fence. And that really helped me develop what I knew was going to be needed as an improved consultancy.

Lee Kantor: And then, your focus is in the construction industry?

Valerie Crafton: Yeah, all construction and high tech, representing owners, contractors in creating project controls, lean project controls – I should say – preparing them to get their data organized so they can take on AI as an integration to their business, and then ultimately providing project control resources as well like cost managers and risk managers.

Lee Kantor: Now, you mentioned some mistakes that folks make or maybe some challenges they have when they implement large tech solutions, I guess they’re they’re buying something that maybe they don’t really understand how to holistically integrate it into their organization and you help them in that area as well.

Valerie Crafton: So, I usually start off with doing a forensic study that allows me to understand their pain point at a deeper level. For example, I have a story about technology that was actually brought in, and they were claiming that through this technology they were able to get visibility to red flags, that their schedule was behind, and that they could give them enough time to recoup that schedule. Well, my question really is why were you behind on the schedule in the first place that got you into that situation? So, we’re not really thinking about our root causes, we’re thinking about just basically Band-Aids that fix broken bones and that isn’t going to support long term adoption of technology.

Lee Kantor: Now, is that pretty common that people are just kind of putting out fires or triaging whatever is the thing that’s happening right at the moment, rather than kind of going a few layers deep to see what is causing these things to happen in the first place?

Valerie Crafton: Shockingly, I mean, really, it shocks me sometimes because I’m always surrounded by some of the smartest people in the world. But for some reason, you’ll have an entire team who doesn’t really see the root cause to the problem. It’s right there in front of their faces. They’ll even have identified it in, like, risk logs and so forth, but they don’t see it as a risk as an actual root cause to their pain points.

Valerie Crafton: So, what happens is, is they get to an end and then they find, they’re like, “Oh. The schedule is the problem.” I’m like, “No. The schedule is the — to your problem. Let’s talk about what was the problem.” “Oh.” “Well, let’s go back to the beginning. Well, look here, you identified very early on that you had a contractor who had never built your type of project before, never worked in that market. And they were doing design build. They were supposed to have had, you know, so many percentage of procured contracts completed.” And that’s where it really began within those first few months. And the fact that the entire team couldn’t even see that, and there was no real risk program set up that allowed them to escalate risk in a way to get in front of it. You fast forward, they were two years late.

Valerie Crafton: So, it’s interesting that when we get to end of the projects, what I’ve observed is they they will sit there, they’ll document it in a lessons learned, but it will die on the desktop or it will die in that project share folder. But nothing gets cycled back to the beginning so that we can implement it. No, we just keep moving forward to the next emergency. We don’t actually stop and pause and think about what we’ve learned and how can we make sure that it doesn’t happen again.

Lee Kantor: It sounds like one domino falls that triggers, you know, a hundred other dominoes, and they’re just looking at the last domino, and they don’t want to understand what caused the the first one to fall.

Valerie Crafton: Sometimes a lot of – I don’t want to call them excuses but reasons, and people genuinely believe it’s because I’m resource constrained. I’m too busy. I have teams who are green and have skill gaps. And that’s what I do, is I come in and let’s talk about what you think your pain points are.

Valerie Crafton: And I don’t think and from my discovery, it’s not typically about the people. It ends up being more about the fact that there’s misalignment between the cross-functional teams, or they’ve grown so fast as a business that what worked when the teams were very small and everybody communicated and knew what to do, and then suddenly fast forward, 5, 10, 15, 20 years and you’ve grown so fast and no one really spent the time to actually document and say, “Okay. Here is our best in class standard operating procedures.” They forget governance along the way, and there’s no continuous improvement built into the fabric of the culture or those processes.

Lee Kantor: Now, if an organization lacks that kind of self-awareness to kind of go back and examine these things, what are the symptoms that they’re having that motivate them to contact you and your team? Because it seems like that what you’re doing is trying to get to the heart of the things, and they may not have the self-awareness to see it themselves, so what would inspire them to contact you?

Valerie Crafton: Likely you’re starting to see resource turnover. You’re starting to see a loss of market share. If you can’t stand there and say why, why I’m losing money, why I’m not meeting schedules, and really get to be able to identify a root cause to that, and you’re repeating the same mistakes over and over and over, those are a lot of the symptoms.

Lee Kantor: So, when the leadership team is hearing kind of the same excuses over and over, that’s a signal that, hey, maybe we we need some fresh eyes on this, and let’s call VALC Consultants.

Valerie Crafton: That’s right, call VALC. Because when I come in, I’m looking at more than just the pain point itself. I will look upstream and downstream end to end, because at the end of the day, it goes back to a connection of handshakes. I like to say that I no longer build projects. I build bridges between silos.

Valerie Crafton: And so, a lot of times it’s because we don’t have all of the right people a part of the conversation upstream. And the folks downstream are impacted, and so the folks downstream have these pain points of things that are that are happening. And, again, it’s just processes and goals that work against each other inside the corporation.

Valerie Crafton: Also, building a culture where it’s okay. Rather than beat your people up, but celebrate that you’re willing to share your lesson and and teach it to others. Because I’ve watched it a dozen times where, you know, people are afraid, they won’t even put their name next to the lessons learned because they’re afraid of the backlash. They don’t want to share that. But it’s not just lessons learned, but it’s opportunities to improve. It’s an opportunity to improve, but it’s not just negative things, it’s positive things. So, if you don’t even have the negative stuff tracked, what about the good things that are happening on one site or one project that could be easily shared?

Valerie Crafton: So, if you’re implementing the right thing and you’ve got the right handshake approach in, and it’s set up with a correct escalation, and it allows you to instantaneously share with other teams and other projects anywhere in the world, that is when you start seeing real difference. I mean, if you think about your portfolio and having something like this and put in place and we only impact less than one percent, I promise you that’s in the millions of dollars.

Valerie Crafton: And I’ve done this type of analysis before and actually hold a green belt record on cost savings where just impacting one percent of a major corporation save them $1.623 billion that year. So, I know it ended up being more, but it can be a huge to the bottom line, not to mention the fact that you are now recouping lost opportunity that you weren’t tracking before, and that could be market share.

Lee Kantor: Now, it seems when you say this handshake approach where we’re just two adults having a conversation, and I’m sharing and I’m being vulnerable, and, hey, this didn’t work out, and I want everybody to know it and we can all learn from it, that sounds good in a conversation. But when it’s human beings and it’s their jobs on the line, like you mentioned the word culture earlier, if you don’t have a culture of trust and that it’s okay to take risks and make mistakes and share and learn, you’re going to have a difficult time I would imagine implementing something like this, because this requires trust and vulnerability, and not everybody signs up for that.

Valerie Crafton: It really does require that it comes from the top down. Really driven by the leadership and pushing it all the way down to the bottom, because otherwise it doesn’t get adopted. It takes time to get it a part of the fabric. But I’ve found that when I brought all the teams in to make them a part of the conversation, I ensured the handshake approach is implemented not just between human to human project to project stage gate to stage gate, but also between human and technology and technology. The technology, you know those. That’s where, you know, most consultants will stop short of just looking at, okay, here’s a solution for you. But I’m like, no, I want a solution that will impact your entire business and bring them together as one unit, not something that just is a quick fix. And it feels good for today.

Lee Kantor: Now, when you’re talking to leaders, um, do they have that kind of long term view? I know a lot of them give lip service to it, but a lot of folks just want that quick fix and get it off my plate and and move on. Like, I know it’s hard to find those best fit clients, but I’m sure they’re out there. But it’s not everybody, is it?

Valerie Crafton: It’s not. I mean, people have to be prepared for this. They have to have a growth mindset. You have to be willing to forward think, um, change is hard. It’s hard for a lot of folks. But at the end of the day, what I’ve discovered is everybody wants to change, but you just got to bring them in to the conversation because everyone’s perspective actually does matter. Um, they’re going to be standing and and because the reason why you bring someone from the outside in is because if you try to do it inside, there’s a lot of unconscious bias that gets applied, right? You want your you want to make sure your department’s taken care of at the end of the day. And I don’t think it’s intentional. It’s unconscious. Um, you want someone who’s, like you said, it’s fresh eyes, someone who’s actually walked in their shoes, knows where they’ve been and knows where they want to go. Um, and so that way we can easily connect the dots. You don’t have to spend a lot of time explaining to me what your job is, because I’ve been there and done that. I have experienced these same pain points. Now let’s talk about how this pain point is working in your department. So it’s it’s hard to implement, but we’re really, really good about it. We get we create a lot of excitement. And at the end of the day everybody wants to change. And adoption is at levels. By the time we’re done with our forensic studies, usually everybody is bought in, I would say at least 95% of them.

Lee Kantor: And then, um, what trends are you seeing? Um, you know, we’re talking all the time about AI. Um, how has that impacted the construction industry and how do you help your clients kind of get ready for this chaotic future that is rapidly approaching, if not already here? In a lot of cases?

Valerie Crafton: Yeah, it is definitely already here, and it’s been here for 200 years, which is really interesting. But we’ve been it’s just become very popular. And the thing that most people are concerned about is it replacing their jobs. Well, one of our biggest risks in the, in the industry is the fact that we don’t have enough skilled labor and humans are not going to be eliminated. We actually need the combination of AI and human to actually make it all work. Um, and where where my consulting firm comes in and helps them get ready for that. It’s really about, um, organizing your data in a way so that when you feed the machine, which we call machine learning, when you’re feeding that machine and it’s learning from the data, it’s not learning the wrong stuff. Right. And what happens is, is then AI spits out the report that gives you a false sense of security. You want to make sure that your data is organized in a way that is actually going to give you actionable insights that it’s really allows you to have a foundational approach and end up enabling you to make smarter business decisions, right. That’s going to improve your project outcome. It’s going to allow you to create repeatability long term.

Valerie Crafton: And I is so great at taking a lot of data. And humans aren’t great at that, taking a lot of data and actually analyzing it and spitting out information where the human comes in. And that is we need people who are used to looking at that data to understand that, hey, there is an outlier in this data. We should probably remove that and make sure we categorize our data and clean it up so that only the quality data is ending up in the results. So whether you know the financial field and medical fields are way, way ahead of the curve on this and they are just light years ahead of us. But the construction field that it is such a great way to understand your data, understand where your what your um where to focus your resources when you are already thin on resources. It’s a great way to set up a continuous learning. When you have folks, you need to upskill very quickly, right? So it has so many opportunities that allow you to do more with less. It is not taking away your job because we still need the human element to it.

Lee Kantor: But it does require you to upskill in some areas, right? Like it’s difficult for you to just show up the way you are and then leverage this technology.

Yes. Yeah, you.

Valerie Crafton: Definitely do need. And that’s what’s nice about it is it does create jobs too, at the same time. Right. Just like when social media came on board, you suddenly had to have a social media manager. It’s kind of like that.

Lee Kantor: Right? So I’m not saying that this is it requires some earth shattering, you know, skill set, but it requires some new skills. Or maybe some people that weren’t doing this kind of work now are the perfect people to be doing this kind of work because their skills map to what’s needed.

Valerie Crafton: Absolutely. There’s a ton of transferable skill there. And like I said, it’s about the people who can who’s used to reviewing that data, being able to see you read between the lines. Right. And so we can’t we can’t just take it for face value. We need to make sure that the results that we’re looking at are real, actionable results. And and the folks who used to do all of this manually, we still need them to evaluate it to make sure it’s spitting out accurate information.

Right?

Lee Kantor: I think people get kind of mesmerized at the speed in which it can find patterns, or it can find anomalies and it can find things. But if you don’t have good data to begin with, all of that’s kind of meaningless.

Valerie Crafton: Absolutely meaningless. So that is where you get, um, oh, what do they call it? Uh, trying to think of the.

Oh, the the.

Lee Kantor: Hallucinations.

Right. Yeah.

Valerie Crafton: You get the hallucination Data where, um, what’s what’s really interesting is I was built on a lot of news reports. So when you ask it to, um, evaluate a news report, it does a really great job. But something more simple, like a recipe, it actually does a terrible job because there’s not very much data it was trained on to understand recipes. So it just goes back to how we code it, how we train it, and the information that we’re feeding it will. And the more it learns, the better it will get. But you don’t want to build that learning on bad data.

Lee Kantor: Right? That’s why you need somebody on your team that has experience in kind of giving it the data. It needs to be effective and to get you to where you want to go, not to where the machine wants to go.

That’s right, that’s right.

Valerie Crafton: So I was speaking with a client the other day and, and I, we were talking about how we can actually apply a quantifiable value to each of their risks and their cost and change management. Um, database didn’t wasn’t categorized, and nowhere in the system could I determine what was the common trend for changes or why cost overruns were happening. There was zero categorization to it or coding structure that helped me kind of understand where my trends were with changes and cost overruns. Um, and, and so that was just going back and saying, okay, well, how can we reconfigure this database to, to then maybe go back a year and start putting them into certain categories, feed that to the machine and see what the results are. Then you just you might have to make a couple of adjustments, but you you get it right when you first implement it. And, and the next thing you know, you start seeing trends that you that you can really turn things around and make those changes mitigate it before they happen.

Lee Kantor: Yeah. That’s where I mean, there’s so much possibilities. And to have somebody like you on the team helping. I mean, it could really accelerate growth in ways they can’t even imagine.

Valerie Crafton: Yes, it is really exciting times right now. And and and understanding the history and being able to even come in and train teams and given the history of AI and how it all works, is very exciting for me. I love doing it. Um, and, you know, having the, um, AI Business Integrator certification through MIT, it has just been a very useful learning that my team brings to corporations to help kind of understand where has it been, where is it going, what can it do? What can it not do, and how do you need to get ready for it and then supporting them on that readiness?

Lee Kantor: Now, why was it important for you to become part of the WebEx West community. What did you anticipate getting out of it and what have you gotten out of it?

Valerie Crafton: Oh my goodness. So the the Witbank West, you know, getting the women owned certification has just been huge. It aligned me with a lot of corporations who are looking to bring in diverse teams. And interesting enough, they did a study at MIT and they talked about how a more diverse team created a smarter overall group. And and so corporations are taking that very seriously right now. And they’re looking for those certifications. So it is it is amazing to have that certification and be recognized on that level, not to mention the ladies that I’m surrounded by who are like minded, who are going through some of the similar things I have or I’ve already gone through as a business owner, being able to share those experiences back and forth and introduce each other to opportunities and teaming it is not. And let me just add to the top of that is all of the free education I get through Webbank is this been top notch? Absolutely top notch. I mean, I knew I was going to be a great CEO, but Webbank took me to the next level on what that meant.

Lee Kantor: So what’s next for your firm?

Yeah. I mean, the incredibly exciting for us.

Valerie Crafton: We plan to expand our partnerships, embrace more AI driven tools, of course, and develop proprietary solutions that push the boundaries of what project controls can achieve. And this includes, you know, becoming partners with, you know, technology like Smartsheet, where I’m able to build data tracking tools specific to client’s needs. And as we grow and focus, it remains on delivering tailored, innovative solutions while deepening our impact in our community and outreach with Stem advocacy. So my vision for Vousi is not only to set industry benchmarks, but to go and inspire a new generation to see the possibilities of construction tech and beyond to drive impacts globally.

Lee Kantor: So if somebody wants to learn more, have a more substantive conversation with you or somebody on the team, what’s the website? What’s the best way to connect?

Yes. Um, you.

Valerie Crafton: Can reach out to. My website is WW dot Val consultants. Val consultants.com. Or you can reach me at val c at val consultants.

Lee Kantor: Well Valerie, thank you so much for sharing your story. You’re doing important work and we appreciate you.

Valerie Crafton: Yes. Thank you. I appreciate you too. Thank you so much.

All right.

Lee Kantor: This is Lee Kantor. We’ll see you all next time on Women in Motion.

Help us kick me off when I’m down. Oh, me. Oh, my.

 

BRX Pro Tip: 5 Useful Rules of Thumb for Business

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BRX Pro Tip: 5 Useful Rules of Thumb for Business

Stone Payton: Welcome back to Business RadioX Pro Tips. Lee Kantor and Stone Payton here with you. Lee, we’ve been around the block. You’ve read a lot. I’ve read a lot. We’ve lived a lot when it comes to setting up and executing a profitable business. But if you had to boil it all down, are there just a handful of principles you would share with folks?

Lee Kantor: Yeah. There’s a few rules of thumb that I think are useful as you are kind of working your way through your business journey. I think, number one, start small, think big. I think it’s important to have big goals and big dreams, but always start small when it comes to executing. You know, test something, see what happens, iterate and grow. So, always aim high but always start small.

Number two sell what people will buy. I think a lot of times, people have an idea that they would like to sell, and then they get frustrated because no one’s buying it. So, if you focus on products and services that have market demand, life becomes a lot easier. And just make sure that you can deliver whatever it is you promise.

Number three, I think something that we learned and that a book we read that’s important to us is profit first. Always pay yourself first and then build all your expenses around what’s left rather than the other way. You have to pay yourself some sort of a livable wage in order to ensure that your business can support your basic needs. If you can’t do that, it’s going to be a struggle and it’s going to be difficult.

Number four, always try to increase sales and decrease costs. I mean, continuously working on growing revenue and reducing expenses is a great discipline to have.

And number five, I think in our business, we have learned this, and it is our true north that relationships are important. You should constantly be focusing on building and nurturing your network. And as they say, your network is your net worth. So, focus in on relationships and you are sure to have a successful business.

BRX Pro Tip: The Fastest Way to Find a Needle in a Haystack

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BRX Pro Tip: The Fastest Way to Find a Needle in a Haystack

Stone Payton: And we are back with Business RadioX Pro Tips. Lee Kantor and Stone Payton here with you. Lee, I got to confess, as much as I share counsel that it’s very important that you find that ideal client, that you ought to really target your efforts, I mean, candidly, sometimes, it really is like trying to find a needle in a haystack. What can you do to help?

Lee Kantor: Yeah. They say the fastest way to find a needle in a haystack is just to burn down the haystack. And that’s really what you want to do when it comes time to prospect. The best way for you to burn down your haystack when you’re looking for your next sales prospect is to make sure that you’re crystal clear on what that persona of that person looks like, and what offer can you be making that is super persuasive and enticing enough to that right person that makes them want to seek you out?

So, how can you be attracting the right people to the top of your funnel and only them? And that way, you’re only talking to the people that matter most to you. But before you can do any of that, you have to be crystal clear on who they are. You have to know that exact right persona. Then, you can start looking for them. So, spend most of your time identifying that best fit client. Who do you serve best? Who do you enjoy working with the most, and who do you deliver the best results for? Once you can answer those questions, then you can start burning down those haystacks to find them.

The National Black Business Pitch: How Support Networks Fuel the Success of Women-Led Startups

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Women in Motion
The National Black Business Pitch: How Support Networks Fuel the Success of Women-Led Startups
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In this episode of Women in Motion, April Kelly, CEO of the plant-based infant formula startup Sure! and her mentor Deborah Mackins, Senior Manager of Vendor Diversity at Arrow Electronics, join Lee Kantor to discuss April’s journey as a Black female entrepreneur, her second-place win in the National Black Business Pitch competition, and the challenges of securing funding. April shares how her personal experiences as a mother inspired her product, while Deborah emphasizes the importance of mentorship and authentic storytelling in successful pitching. The episode highlights resilience, community support, and the power of personal narratives in entrepreneurship.

April-KellyApril Kelly, the CEO and self-proclaimed startup supermom is the founder of Sure! a groundbreaking plant-based infant formula startup company trailblazing with their allergen-centric approach. Over the past few years, April has assembled a remarkable team of healthcare professionals, regulatory experts, and food scientists, setting new standards in the industry.

Her impressive achievements, including the NC Idea $10K Micro grant and National Black Business Pitch 2nd Place Winner, two-time participation in ECU’s I-Corp Program, and recognition in the Women’s Business Enterprise National Council pitch competition, highlight her potential to revolutionize infant formula and create lasting impact.

As the first black female-owned infant formula startup in the country, her mission focuses on fostering innovation powered by inclusion to create a healthier, more equitable world—a “sure” world.

Connect with April on Instagram.

Deborah-MackinsDeborah Mackins, Senior Manager of Vendor Diversity, joined Arrow Electronics in May of 2023 to launch and lead Arrow’s Vendor Diversity program. She has robust Supplier Diversity, Strategic Sourcing and Procurement experience in several industries including retail, financial services, electrical utilities, aerospace, and automotive.

Deborah is passionate about supplier diversity and has helped companies increase their spending and access to diverse suppliers, manage risk in the supply chain, and provide suppliers with opportunities for growth, mentoring and development.

Deborah currently serves on WBEC-West’s Board of Directors and is a recipient of DiversityPlus Magazine’s 2023 “Top 25 Women in Power Impacting Diversity”.

Follow Arrow on LinkedIn, Facebook and Instagram.

Music Provided by M PATH MUSIC

Transcript-iconThis transcript is machine transcribed by Sonix

 

TRANSCRIPT

Intro: broadcasting live from the Business RadioX studios, it’s time for Women in Motion. Brought to you by WBEC-West. Join forces. Succeed together. Now, here’s your host.

Lee Kantor: Lee Kantor here. Another episode of Women in Motion, and this is going to be a good one. But before we get started, it’s important to recognize our sponsor, WBEC-West. Without them, we couldn’t be sharing these important stories. Today on Women in Motion, we’re focusing in on the National Black Business Pitch. We have some of the people who participated, along with their mentors. And on today’s episode, we have April Kelly and her mentor, Deborah Mackins. Welcome.

Deborah Mackins: Thank you.

April Kelly: Thank you. Glad to be here.

Lee Kantor: Well, I am so excited to learn about each of you. And we’ll kick it off with April. April, please tell us a little bit about your company.

April Kelly: Absolutely. So, I am the CEO and Startup Supermom of Sure. We are a plant-based infant formula startup company trailblazing with our allergen-centric approach. So, we’ve been on this journey for about five and a half years now, and we are gearing up to launch our very first product out into the market. And so, the funding that we receive from the Pitch competition is actually helping us to do that. And so, it was a great opportunity working with Deborah, and I’ll pass it off to her to introduce herself as well.

Lee Kantor: All right. Deborah, do you want to tell us a little bit about yourself and how you got involved in the NBBP?

Deborah Mackins: Sure. And I’d just like to say thank you for the opportunity, Lee. My name is Deborah Mackins. I’m Senior Manager of Vendor Diversity with Arrow Electronics. I have been in this role for about a year and a half now to stand up our program. And I had the pleasure of meeting April Kelly and being her mentor for the National Black Business Pitch. This is my second year being involved with this. And for me personally, it was just a great experience, not only working with April, but just being involved with the National Black Business Pitch overall.

Lee Kantor: Now, April, can you tell us a little bit about this Pitch contest? Why was it important for you to get involved? And what did you kind of get out of going through it, obviously, other than the seed money and the victory or the second-place victory?

April Kelly: Yeah, absolutely. Well, when I first learned about the National Black Business Pitch, I definitely felt a need to participate and at the very least, shoot my shot because as a black female founder, that is one of our biggest pain points and obstacles is the funding piece. And so, that was the first reason. But after learning more about who they are as an organization and what they do and just some of the previous winners, it just seemed like a no brainer. And then, so after winning, coming in place, second place, just shy of about a full point. So, we did a great job, Deborah, working together to get me geared up for that. But the mentorship was really what made the difference for me because not only was it… did it help me to really refine my pitch, but it also boosted my confidence. Just having that additional layer of support, the expertise that Deborah was able to bring about, it really helped me to do things and see things from a different perspective than I had before.

And so even the pitch that we… our winning pitch, we continue to use that same pitch. So, it’s definitely a great wealth of relationship that I feel like I’ve been able to accomplish with Deborah. And then, also just getting better… well, more well versed on how to articulate, you know, our value proposition and what makes us different, what makes us stand out. And, you know, at the very end of the day, why should people support what we have going on with their time, with their connections and with their funding?

Lee Kantor: So, I’m going to ask you each this, and I’d like kind of your angle on it, but what are some of the key factors that make a successful pitch? Let’s start with you, April. Like what do you think was the thing that helped you get the victory that you got or the second-place victory that you got?

April Kelly: It’s definitely the authentic storytelling. That’s what always stands out. It doesn’t matter how well my deck is put together or the different visuals or even the stats, the numbers, it’s all about how it ties back into my own personal story as a founder and the why behind what it is that I’m doing. And that’s always been my secret sauce. And I think if I could speak for most entrepreneurs, it’s everyone’s secret sauce because no one can tell your story like you can. And all of our stories are a little different. And so, that’s what makes it interesting and makes you competitive in the market.

Lee Kantor: And, Deborah, when you’re mentoring folks, how do you help them kind of build this successful pitch? And what are the kind of key elements that you’re looking for when you’re helping them?

Deborah Mackins: Well, for me, it’s very important for me to do the research to understand what the products or services are that the business owner has developed, just to understand that and it’s really very close to having a very powerful elevator pitch. You know, I go to a lot of conferences and meet many business owners, and typically you have about 30 to 45 seconds to capture someone’s attention that they’re going to want to know more about your products or services. So, you know, just discussing that with April to ensure that she had that elevator pitch that was crisp, sharing her personal story. You know, April has a lot of passion on the product that she has developed. It is her own personal story, and it’s very impactful to large communities. So, I think when you tie that elevator pitch, as well as personal stories, passion, I think that can be very impactful. And also, the visuals. I think April mentioned having visuals, so that people can see your logo, see… you know, possibly see your product, something to capture someone’s attention and keep it. And April, she did a fantastic job doing that.

Lee Kantor: Well, April, let’s get kind of into the weeds about your product. Can you share us a little bit about your backstory and maybe a little bit about how this came to be?

April Kelly: I’d be happy to. So, as I mentioned, when I introduced myself, I refer to me as a startup supermom. And so, that would have to mean that I’m a mom and I am of four. And so, with my youngest daughter, when I brought her home from the hospital, I planned to nurse her, and I did for a very short period of time. Unfortunately, I started to struggle with postpartum depression and prematurely had to switch over from nursing full time to completely supplementing with the formula, a very well-known formula on the market. And so, about maybe 24 to 48 hours, somewhere in between that, into us transitioning over into the formula, my daughter ended up having a severe allergic reaction.

And so, at this point, I was really frustrated and holding on to what little sanity I had left. Because we were a vegan family at the time, it was very difficult to find a formula that was plant-based and that had, you know, more natural, recognizable ingredients than the preservatives and the fillers. And so, my husband and I really were kind of at a lost initially and didn’t know, you know, what the next best option would look like. And so, we kind of pulled our family together and we were, you know, just saying, “Hey, just be on the lookout for different formulas or if you come across a safe, healthy recipe that’s been published, please do share it with us.” We, then, begin to just research and spend hours honestly in the grocery stores looking for formula, but not only looking for formula, also educating ourselves on what’s actually in formula, which is a question that I had never asked myself prior to this experience. I kind of just took, you know, what worked for other moms or what the doctor recommended, but I never turned the container to the back to really look at the ingredients that are in formula.

And one thing that I found that was kind of mind blowing was that the number one ingredient in most formulas is corn syrup. And so, we think about, you know, some of the issues that we see our kids having or our infants having when we’re feeding them formula, and one of those is constipation. And corn syrup, actually, causes or attributes to that. And so, we were able to thankfully come across a recipe that had been published and that partnered with the research that we had already been doing gave us enough confidence to go into our own kitchens, and really start to dig into ingredients, and think about, you know, what do we want our baby to eat? Like, how do we want to make sure she’s gotten that complete nutrition?

And so, we started to look at, you know, what… which of these ingredients can be substituted for plant-based, natural, recognizable, store-bought ingredients? And so, once we came up with a recipe that we felt was pretty satisfactory, we went to our pediatrician and kind of told them what our plan was and what we had been doing, and we actually let them screen our recipe, and he ended up giving us the go ahead to feed it to our daughter for the first year of her life. And so, once we made that switch to our recipe, the symptoms that she had started to have as far as the allergic reaction, they started to subside within that first 24 hours. Within 72 hours, she was completely free from all of the symptoms. They had all gone away.

And so, we would continue to monitor her for the first couple of weeks to the next few months, and she started to gain weight. She started to become regular with her bowels and everything was great. And so, I had planned to go back to work. I was actually working in corporate America at the time. And so, I was on my way back in to work. But shortly before that, I decided to hop on to Facebook, and I was going on a mom community at the time, and I started to just… that mom group was really just for moms to come together in a safe space to share some of the more taboo things that we don’t always get the opportunity to discuss in open forum. And so, I talked about my postpartum. I talked about how we came up with this, you know, new recipe for milk for our baby and how she was doing. And while I was doing that, I was making the actual recipe on the live, and I had my daughter wrapped, how they do the baby wearing. I had her wrapped around me and she was asleep.

And so, once I got off that live, I started to get pinged left and right from other viewers that had watched it or that were on during the time that I was or during the live, and they were saying things like, “Hey, I wish I had something like this around when my kids were babies,” or “I could use it now. Is it safe for me to follow your recipe?” and “Thank you so much for sharing your story.” And that, Lee, was my aha moment that led me to believe that “Okay, I thought this was a personal problem, but it sounds like it might be much more of a bigger problem.” And so, from there, we started walking in the dark and trying to put steps in place to figure out if our solution could be commercialized.

Lee Kantor: Now, were you or anybody on your early team food scientists? Like, how did you even like… Or you were just kind of fooling around in the kitchen, just mixing stuff up, and hoping that it tastes good, and it works?

April Kelly: We were literally just parents trying to find a solution for our child. And one thing I like to say is that I truly believe that moms are the world’s best problem solvers, because on a day-in and day-out basis, there’s so many issues that we come about with our little ones, and we have to just throw on the hat and figure it out as we go. However, I will say, after having that success with our pediatrician and being given the green light and then deciding that “Okay, we’re now wanting to see how we can commercialize that,” we very quickly got in contact with the experts because we wanted to make sure that safety was our first and main priority. So, we then partnered with universities like NC State and UNC Chapel Hill and graduate students from their marketing or that were studying marketing and things of that nature, market research, and food scientists, manufacturers and they were able to help us to tweak it just a bit. But I’m proud to say that our recipe is still about 98% the same as it was when we first started. So, we got it almost close to being exactly right.

Lee Kantor: So, at what stage are you at now? Do you have it out in the marketplace?

April Kelly: So, no, we don’t have it out in the marketplace. What we’re doing, we have to do somewhat of a pivot. And because the infant formula industry has such high barriers to entry, and we truly are a startup company building it from the ground up, we noticed that it was going to take a little bit longer to get the infant formula out into the market and to be able to market it as that, as an infant formula. So, we have to continue to do some additional animal studies, human studies and other research before we can get the FDA approval to do that. And so, we pivoted into a toddler beverage, a complete nutrition toddler beverage, very similar to our infant formula recipe that allows parents to safely introduce allergens early and often to de-risk the chances of their child developing allergies later in life. And so, that product is complete and will be on the shelves in the first quarter of next year.

Lee Kantor: Deborah, you must be so proud of April and the progress she’s made.

Deborah Mackins: I am. I mean, it was a total pleasure working with April. Actually, I think I learned a lot just from the experience. I would say yes, I was the mentor but, in some ways, she was the mentor. So that in itself is just remarkable. I’ve never worked with anyone that was a startup owner or business for any type of food or beverage products. So, just learning about that, learning about the product. April also has a marketing background. So, she… and this is very natural for her to, you know, do her due diligence, you know, on the product and, you know, just understanding what customers are looking for, so on and so forth. So, I mean, it was just very, very easy to do. Just a total pleasure.

Lee Kantor: Now, Deborah, do you have any advice for other corporates out there that haven’t gotten involved with the National Black Business Pitch Contest or just any of these other kind of opportunities to mentor? I think that a lot of corporates like yourself, you mentioned you can benefit by learning about these startups and businesses of a smaller size, and that could bring insight to you and your work every day.

Deborah Mackins: Yeah, absolutely. And I think that some corporate members may feel that they don’t have anything to offer to these types of pitches and events, but you do. You know, you work with businesses, whether it’s small or large business every day, you hear some of the things that are going on within your company and others. And so, you have a wealth of knowledge to be able to bring to these entrepreneurs. So why not share it? You’re in these positions, you know, not only to be a benefit to your company, but I think also to entrepreneurs and small businesses. So, I just say just give it a try. And who knows, you may participate year after year, which is something that I’ve been doing for not only with the National Black Business Pitch but with other pitches for some years now. Just give it a try.

Lee Kantor: And would the same thing go towards kind of becoming part of the WBEC-West community? That’d be… I would think that if you’re a woman business owner, that’s kind of a no brainer.

Deborah Mackins: It is. WBEC-West. And actually, I’m on the board of directors for WBEC-West. It has been an absolute pleasure to work with this RPO. Some of the things that WBEC-West does, they certify women business owners. So, basically, if you say that you’re a woman-owned business, they validate that. They also provide opportunities for these businesses to connect with other women businesses to share best practices. WBEC-West also provides opportunities to build relationships with the women business owners and representatives from corporations such as Arrow Electronics, which is the company that I work for. And it’s a great opportunity to build relationships because why people do business with people they know, like and trust. And also, I’d say if you get involved with WBEC-West, get certified, really do get involved. So, that means participating in events, taking advantage of the webinars, perhaps even attending the regional conference. And I should say Dr. Pamela Williamson, who’s the president and CEO of WBEC-West, her and her staff are phenomenal and that’s a bonus as well.

Lee Kantor: So, April, what do you need more of? How can we help you?

April Kelly: Absolutely. As we are gearing up for first quarter and our product debut, we invite anyone who’s listening to check out our website. We are going through a rebrand, so we will no longer be known as The Sure Company. We will be changing our name now to Hello Tavi. And that’s T as in Tom, A, V as in Victor, I. hellotavi.com. Tavi is actually my daughter’s name. And so, just as a nod to her for being our first Sure baby, we are rebranding to fall under her name, and there will be several different micro brands that fall under that. For example, Tavi Babes will be the infant formula. Tavi Tops will be the toddler beverages. And then, as our product portfolio grows, you’ll see the names and the new brand names come out as well.

So, definitely check us out, hellotavi.om. And then, on Instagram follow us at @thetaviway. And we are looking for investors right now. We’re gearing up for our biggest trial run at the end of 2025. And so, every little contribution counts. So, no matter how big or small, we are actually entertaining serious conversations about or with angel investors as well. And so, we would love to have some introductions to investors that may be listening or that you may know of in your network. And then, lastly, introductions to different pediatric or different healthcare professionals in the pediatric and immunology space. We are looking for someone to come on board with us and lead the research project or partner with me in doing so for the human-centered studies that will be happening later on next year.

Lee Kantor: Well, April, congratulations again on being the second-place winner of the $10,000 microgrant from the National Black Business Pitch. And Deborah, thank you so much for your mentoring and all the service you do for WBEC-West and the community. And thank you both for doing the important work that you do. We appreciate both of you.

April Kelly: Thank you. Lee. Thank you for having me.

Deborah Mackins: Great.

Lee Kantor: All right. This is Lee Kantor. We will see you all next time on Women in Motion.

 

Danielle Hendon with 4 Corners CFO

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Houston Business Radio
Danielle Hendon with 4 Corners CFO
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Danielle-HendonDanielle Hendon is a dedicated wife, mom, and the founder of 4 Corners CFO. With over a decade of corporate finance and accounting experience and CPA certification, Danielle specializes in helping small business owners understand their numbers, grow their profits, and pay themselves what they’re worth.

Her mission is to empower business owners to make confident, intentional financial decisions by breaking down complex financial concepts into actionable strategies. Danielle combines her love for numbers with a genuine passion for people, making a meaningful impact on livelihoods and legacies.

Inspired by her experience navigating corporate closures, Danielle now focuses on transforming businesses from burnout to balance, helping entrepreneurs focus on their joy and purpose while building sustainable profitability. 4 corners cfo logo

Connect with Danielle on Instagram and follow 4 Corners CFO on Facebook.

Transcript-iconThis transcript is machine transcribed by Sonix.

 

TRANSCRIPT

Intro: Broadcasting live from the Business RadioX studios in Houston, Texas. It’s time for Houston Business Radio. Now, here’s your host.

Trisha Stetzel: Hello, Houston. Trisha Stetzel here bringing you another episode of Houston Business Radio. I am stoked about my guest today, Danielle Hendon, who has been a friend, a client, a partner, a collaborator for several years now. And as a matter of fact, we spent a whole lot of time talking before we even hit the record button. I’m stoked to have her here from 4 Corners CFO, Danielle Hendon. Welcome to the show.

Danielle Hendon: Thank you so much for having me, Trisha. I love any chance I can at least get somebody to think about numbers, because they’re not as bad as we all think they could be. Right.

Trisha Stetzel: And one of the reasons why you and I engage so many years ago is because I have so many clients that just bury their head in the sand. They’re so afraid of the numbers, they don’t even want to look at them, which is what gets us in trouble. And on the back end. Right. Or even on the front end for that matter. So it’s something that we have to do. And what I love about what you bring to the table, Danielle, is just the simplicity behind how you teach your clients, or even help your clients do what they do around their numbers. So before we dive into all of that fun stuff, the numbers, would you just do a quick intro? Where you been, what you’re doing, what your business looks like, and who you’re looking to meet?

Danielle Hendon: Absolutely. I actually I love to start off by telling people I went to college to be a music major. I thought I was going to make a living as an opera singer and, um, no. I learned very quickly that I don’t have friends in high places, and I was going to be broke and needed to figure out a out a better way to actually foot the bill for living life. Um. I did, however, have friends in the accounting school at the University of Houston, and I tried it. Loved it. Stuck with it. Got my degree in accounting, and did like all of us do, and went into public public accounting on the other side of it. But like most people, when you work 60 hour work weeks and you have a baby at home, it tends to create a little bit of conflict. And I didn’t want to maintain that pace with a newborn. So after having kids, I decided to leave public and go into industry, which being in the Houston area meant I landed in oil and gas. That’s where all my experience was. It’s what I loved doing. It’s the people I loved working with. That being said, I was there for over a decade when oil prices tanked. And we’ve all, we all, anybody who’s in or around the Houston area knows the price of oil dictates everything. Um, and when they did tank, they ended up going through bankruptcy, which was a unique experience and not something I ever would have wished for.

Danielle Hendon: But hindsight being 2020, it gave me a lot of tools and a lot of flexibility and adaptability that has actually allowed me to create the business that I have today. So as they were downsizing from this billion dollar business to, I’m going to be honest, closing their doors, I was running the audit department, getting the phone call saying, look, I’ve got two people left. How do you want me to do this? Because I can’t do it the way we were. And we were constantly changing processes and procedures on the accounting and finance side of things, so that we could keep meeting our standards and our covering our risks, which was my job as the audit supervisor to make sure that we were doing. So all of that being said, they did finally close closed their doors, um, right in the middle of the pandemic. So I had what I will say is a unique opportunity. Oil and gas takes care of its people. And I was not left high and dry, but I was left unsure of what the future could hold while also having this eye opening experience. And I don’t want to take away from anything that people have struggled with because of the pandemic or the pain that people went through and the suffering that happened. But I think all of us experienced a silver lining in the sense that life slowed down. It had to. It was so much slower than the pace of normal American business, and for me, that meant getting a completely different perspective of parenting.

Danielle Hendon: I had two kids home at the time, and I became make sure they’re on their calls for school, and I know what they’re doing and how can I help them do it. And figuring out swim when or when it was or wasn’t still happening, and getting to know the parents and the friends and the coaches and the teachers in a way that I had not done before. We were honestly looking for a nanny before all of this happened, because I was like, throw somebody else at it. But I realized I didn’t want to throw somebody else at it. I wanted to get to do it. So taking a big step back in life, I was like, what? What can I do that allows me to do what I love and be there for the people that I love? And I love numbers. I know that sounds totally cheesy, but like, I can geek out over some spreadsheets and some numbers and strategy and it just makes my day. I also love being with my family, and I don’t want to be working ridiculous hours or driving two hours back and forth downtown. So I started Four Corners CFO to help other small business owners take control of their numbers and really understand the story that the that the numbers are telling. Because when you realize your numbers are just like any other language and they tell a story, you get to help write that story going forward.

Trisha Stetzel: Oh my gosh, I love that so much. And you know, opera singer accountant I don’t know. I don’t know. I’m just I’m not sure about that one. I thank you for telling the backstory. You’re so much fun to be around because you have such a diverse background and you do love numbers, unlike many of us, right? And the simplicity that you bring to the table. So I’m thinking about pulling out the one word because a lot of people are talking about their one word this year, and you happen to share yours with me, which I think is very interesting. So would you share your one word and what that really means to you and your business, and how you might share that with others?

Danielle Hendon: Yeah, so I know, thinking back through the four years now that I’ve been in In business, we’ve gone through slowdowns with Covid to burnout. On the other side, when life got back to normal, too. I don’t think life’s ever going to get back to normal, and we all just sort of feel in this overwhelmed state. And I say all because so many of my clients are going through something similar. And it brought me to the word homeostasis because balance doesn’t cover it. And sometimes there isn’t balance. A lot of times we have no control over what’s going to happen in the future, but we can set up systems, whether that’s people or technology or coaches or whatever it is, that help bring us homeostasis between the business and our personal life.

Trisha Stetzel: I love that. So where as as I’m thinking about I don’t like numbers or I know people who don’t like numbers. Well, really, I don’t like numbers. Uh, where do we start? Where? How do we start to build this homeostasis in our lives. Because you’re right. I mean, honestly. So. Yes. Oh my gosh. It’s slowed down in 2020. And it was amazing. And now we’re going ten times faster than we were before we even went into the shutdown in 2020. So people are running themselves ragged ragged. How do you see homeostasis happening? Where do we start as business owners?

Danielle Hendon: This is going to sound totally cheesy, but you’ll get it. As a coach, it really starts with understanding why you are in business. I have had and I’m almost positive you’ve said this to me at some point, but I’ve had multiple, multiple people say this to me in the sense that I very quickly went from working my butt off in a corporate environment to working my butt off for myself, and that makes no sense. Like why I built this to not work my butt off. So asking yourself why you’re doing this. And a good friend of mine was actually like, if you’re just going to keep working your butt off, take away the anxiety of running a business and go do it in corporate. Like, if you’re not building a business that’s working for you because you’re working for it, what are you in this for?

Speaker4: Mhm.

Trisha Stetzel: Yeah, absolutely. So ask yourself why. Why am I in this business. What was the passion that I had before I started. Before I named the baby right. I had this passion for this business. So now I found that passion again. And I really want to make 2025 the best year yet. What do I do now?

Danielle Hendon: You define that. What is the best year yet? Means so many different things to people. I will tell you for me, because I know that I’ve been working my butt off homeostasis. The best year yet means my team doesn’t need me this year. And I’ve actually told them I could care less if we add any additional clients or revenue this year. I want everybody functioning fully efficient, doing what they need to do, and they don’t need me. That would be my best year yet. But for some people and some very good friends of mine, that best year yet means we ten-x revenue or the best year yet might be doubling revenue. You need to know what you need from your business and what the best year yet means to you personally, and translate that to what the business needs to do to serve it.

Trisha Stetzel: Yeah, I love that. Okay, so let’s talk numbers. I know everyone’s favorite subject. No, wait. It’s Danielle’s favorite subject.

Danielle Hendon: It is, I love it.

Trisha Stetzel: So, uh, a lot many business owners get into business. They don’t know the numbers. They don’t understand them. They’re afraid of them. They don’t look at them. The only time that we’re looking at numbers is when we send our books, which may or may not be done right over to our CPA, uh, April 14th, hoping that they that they might actually, you know, file on time or just file an extension and then do them in October. Right. So, hey, give me an extension. I’ll just get it done in October. Well, by the time we get to October, we’ve already lost a whole nother nine months worth of data moving into the next year. So we’re so far behind because we’re not even looking at the numbers. So for those that are just completely terrified of looking at the numbers, besides that terrible number that they see in the bank account every time they go and look at it, right, to see if they can write the next check. Where do we start?

Danielle Hendon: Now is the perfect time, because while you do have until April to file, your bookkeeping should be wrapping up right now for multiple reasons. First of all, you need to make sure everything’s booked and you know who you’ve paid and who paid you because 1090 nines are due in January. That doesn’t wait until April. So if for no other reason than to make sure you’ve got everything booked and you send off all the 1099, you need to be looking at your books this month. But also because I want you to look at last year and see how you did without judging yourself for it. No preconceived expectations. No. I wish we had this. You probably went into last year with a goal, but if you’ve never really looked at your numbers, that goal came from where? So take all that away and go look at last year’s. I want you to look at three things. I want you to look at your revenue. I want you to look at what is called your gross profit. So revenue minus cost of goods sold. When you look at a PNL, a profit and loss and income statement, whichever word meshes better with you, when you go look at that statement. You’re going to see revenue. You’re going to see a section for cost of goods sold. And then you’re going to see they’ll either call it net revenue gross profit. Something along those lines. I want you to know the overall revenue number for the year. I want you to know that gross profit number for the year. And then I want you to go all the way down, and you’re going to see a number that should likely say net income. And I want you to look at that number. The reason these three numbers matter revenue is what you sold.

Danielle Hendon: And I bet most of you have a pretty good handle on what that number probably looks like. A lot of people know their sales cost of goods sold, which then factors into your gross profit is all of those revenue generating costs. And if you are a service based business owner listening to this and you have zero there, I want you to go back and talk to your bookkeeper, because you and the people serving your clients in your business are a cost of goods sold. You need to know your profit margin. And then at the end of the day, what’s actually going to get left in your bank account is down on that net income line at the very bottom. I want you to know what those three numbers are. And then I want you to think, how did you feel about the year? Did 2024 feel like a gangbuster year for you? Did it feel weird? And I’m going to be honest, for a lot of my clients, 2024 felt weird. Election years are weird, and people have concerns that may have absolutely nothing to do with your business or what you do in business, but it will still keep them from spending money with your business. So think about what kind of year 2024 was for you, and what kind of year you want 2025 to be back to that, like where we were in the beginning. What do you want out of 2025? And reflecting on those numbers that you had for had for 2024. We’re not going to get super technical. We’re not going to even go look at monthlies or talk about budgets or all the other things we could do. I want you to have a goal for your revenue, your profit and your net income for 2025.

Speaker4: That’s so simple.

Trisha Stetzel: That’s why I love you. I’m so glad you’re here. Um, so I’m I’m. I’m thinking about how simple this is, and I’m thinking that there are still people out there like, oh, my gosh, way too technical. I’m not sure. I don’t know where to. I’m not I don’t even know what an income statement is. And what did she say? A p and a what? Uh, you know, so can you just real quick, wait before we go there, Danielle, if people are already interested and they want to find you, how do they find you right now?

Danielle Hendon: Best way to find me is going to be my website, which is the number four, not the word the number four corners cfo.com. And we will have a separate landing page just for you guys. And it’ll be Houston Biz Radio.

Trisha Stetzel: Freaking cool. Thank you so much I appreciate that. All right. So, um, back to my question. I think there are a lot of people who maybe confuse Danielle between the bookkeeper. And the CPA and what Danielle does. So can you explain at a high level, really, the difference between what you’re doing for business owners and what their CPA is doing for them already?

Danielle Hendon: I’m going to give a traditional accounting answer which says it depends because everyone’s a little different. But I will give you sort of the buckets that things sit in your bookkeeper normally, if all they’re doing is bookkeeping, is categorizing the activity that happens in your bank statement and on your credit cards. They’re categorizing the past of what you have already done in your business so that it can be reported on in those financial statements we talked about. Generally, a CPA, if they are tax focused, is helping you file your tax returns. Making sure you make any estimated payments throughout the year. And I hope if you’ve got a good one, they’re helping you strategize every quarter to spend as little money as possible in taxes. Occasionally you will see some mesh between bookkeepers and CPAs, just like you will see some crossover between bookkeepers, CPAs, and CFOs. There are three different types of CFOs you might experience. One is the let me go get funding CFO. You just got started. You’re looking for venture capital, equity loans. You’re looking for funding to get going. That is a very specific type of person that knows how to work that banking environment to help you get funding. There are also going to be what I would call project based CFOs as a company gets larger and they might need to go through an IPO. So they they want to go public or they need to go through different audit mechanisms for whatever their nonprofit requires.

Danielle Hendon: They might hire a CFO for a very project oriented process, or even implementing a new CRM or a new accounting system might take somebody to come in and do that accounting piece with you. Then you have CFOs that work very similar to how we do it for corners, and that is your operational CFO. They’re like your day to day accounting best friend. That’s going to be like, hey, what are we doing now? Oh yeah. This is this is what the numbers say. I think this will work. One of my favorite things to do with clients, from an operational CFO perspective is when they get the bright idea, because our entrepreneurs are often visionaries, when they have a bright idea and they’re like, oh my gosh, I’m going to go spend $4,000 on this thing because it’s going to be amazing and we’re going to do X, Y, and Z and wait, but how do I do that? And a lot of times people will reach out to a bookkeeper, accountant, CFO and say, can I, can I go do this thing? Can we afford to? And my response is always going to be, you can afford to do what you need to do in your business. You can always afford to. But what are we willing to sacrifice to get there? And how do we make sure you get an ROI, a return on investment on the other side of it?

Trisha Stetzel: Again, so simple. Right? Um, so let’s circle back to homeostasis. You know what you want in your business. You have a lot of I’ll call them products and services in your business that you can offer to other business owners. So if they too want to embrace the word homeostasis. What tools do you have to help them get started in that direction?

Danielle Hendon: In order to achieve homeostasis, you have to have systems, processes and people. And we embrace that by offering clients a variety of ways to learn your numbers. We know that not everybody can afford somebody else to do it for them. I’m going to be entirely honest when I tell you this. You are not going to want to be in your numbers. And I very rarely tell people we have a course because you’re not going to want to do it. But if you are really wanting to understand how to tell the story in your numbers, we do have a DIY course where it will walk you through all of our six part framework, as if you were doing it with us in a course format so that you know how to be your own CFO. By the time you finish it, you’re going to want to hire somebody. I’m just going to tell you that right now. But it’s a it’s a balance between time or money. And depending where you are in the business right now, it may not be the best move for you. If you are just getting started and just starting to look at your numbers. The first thing you want to do is make sure you’ve got a good bookkeeper. You’ve probably already made sure somebody’s filing your taxes, whether they’re strategic or not. That’s happening.

Danielle Hendon: I hope you’ve got you need to make sure you’ve got a good bookkeeper, because they’re just saying and I’m sure it applies in other industries, but especially in accounting, we always say garbage in and is garbage out. If you’ve got bad numbers going into that, you’re going to have bad numbers coming out in the reports and you’re going to make bad decisions. So a good bookkeeper is absolutely necessary. And our course is not meant to teach bookkeeping or how to use QuickBooks or any of that. We’re assuming that you’ve got someone on your team, but if you want to know how to tell the story that your numbers are, understand the Understand the story your numbers are telling. This course will walk you through how to dig in and build a budget and analyze your revenue. And what are your profit margins, and how can I cut my expenses and all of those things that help get you to that goal that we talked about. Now, if you’re listening to this and you’re like, there’s no way, no way I am going to do this for myself. Then we offered two other options. One is a VIP day where we will do it with you, and a very long six hours of finances. A lot to go through, but we will record it. We’ll do it with you.

Danielle Hendon: We will sit down and get through it together. And then we will follow up with you to make sure that you’re maintaining it. And we’ll do some quarterly strategy calls. Last but not least, if you’re like, I don’t want to touch it and I can afford not to touch it, and I’ve built a business so that I don’t have to touch it. You’re probably also thinking, what do I need this for? Because I’ve built a business without ever looking at it. I promise you, you need to look before you need to look because it’s really painful if you wait until you need it. That being said, getting someone on board to help you look, we do a done with you in the sense that we do all the numbers, but you make all the decisions, you have all the know, you have all the information to make that next best decision. And we do that in a done for you, done with you format along with the people, which is the next thing I’m going to mention. And this is a an offering. We are actually not yet launched but is in the works. So I’m going to tell you guys about it. We are working on our clockwork certification, which will help us help you work yourself out of the business and run a business like clockwork.

Trisha Stetzel: I love that. Oh my gosh, such a wealth of knowledge you guys! Danielle brings big corporate knowledge and all of the things that she’s done over the past decade or so to small businesses. What a special treat. I’m so excited to have you on today. All right, before we leave, we’ve been reflecting on the past. We’re moving into 2025. Do you have a favorite client story from last year? Something that you can tell us about?

Danielle Hendon: Oh my gosh, I just got an email that lit me up actually just this week. We have a client and this is to show you guys you don’t have to have somebody else do it. You really can if you’re committed to it. Do this yourself and the course and the VIP day and all of those things work if you work them. So I met with this client for the very first time for a VIP day three years ago, and she had just broke into the six figures, wanted to get more into her numbers. We meet on a quarterly cadence just to see how things are going, and when we met in Q4, she was a little bummed. Like a lot of our clients have been, 2024 was not the easiest year for a lot of people. And she just felt like, why? Why are we doing this? Why? Why are we working so hard? I’m not paying myself enough. You know all the things. She sent me an email and said, thank you for making me look at my numbers. I just compared the last four years and guys, she grew by 50% from the first time I met her to her 2023 number. And that 2024 number that she was so afraid to look at was just as good as 2023. It’s not as bad as you think it’s going to be in your head, and what your bank account shows you is not always true.

Trisha Stetzel: That does not tell the story. It does not by far. Thank you for sharing that. I’m so glad you came on with me today. Uh, would love to have you back after tax season so we can talk maybe in the middle of the year and talk more about strategy for the back half of 2025. I think that would be a ton of fun. Uh, anything that you’d like to leave our listeners with today?

Danielle Hendon: I’m going to make you laugh, Trisha, because, you know, I can’t go on one of these and not talk about how important it is to pay yourself. So when it comes to homeostasis, when it comes to burnout, one of the biggest reasons business owners quit is because we quit because we’re burnt out. And if you are not paying yourself, I don’t care how well the business is doing, you’re going to go out of business. And I get it. I serve from a heart centered passion place, and you want to help all the people you can. But if you can’t stay in business, if you can’t pay your personal bills, you can’t help anybody. So make sure that you are putting your profit first. And I’m going to tag that one. Who? Mike Michalowicz is a huge, huge book author that I love. Um, he’s also the author of clockwork. But if you have not read profit first. If you are not putting your profit first, practice putting aside just 1% of your revenue and paying yourself first. It will make a world of difference in your business.

Speaker4: I love that.

Trisha Stetzel: All right. Tell folks how they can find you one more time.

Danielle Hendon: The number four corners cfo.com/houston biz radio.

Trisha Stetzel: Awesome. Thanks so much Danielle for being on with me today. This is amazing. What a great way to kick off 2025. Thanks again for being with me.

Danielle Hendon: Thanks, Trisha.

Trisha Stetzel: That’s all the time we have for today’s show. Join us next time for another exciting episode of Houston Business Radio. Until then, stay tuned, stay inspired, and keep thriving in the Houston business community.

 

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