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The CEO Mindset for Career Growth

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High Velocity Radio
High Velocity Radio
The CEO Mindset for Career Growth
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In this episode of High Velocity Radio, Lee interviews Michelle Enjoli, a career strategist on how to become the CEO of your career. She shares her journey from first-generation college student to landing her dream job as a news producer in New York City, and explains why professionals at every stage must stop waiting for permission and start creating their own opportunities. From redefining networking as authentic human connection to building a strategic personal brand that attracts the right opportunities, Michelle delivers practical—and sometimes tough—advice on taking ownership of your career path.

Michelle Enjoli is a speaker and career strategist who helps professionals and leaders confidently build personal brands, powerful networks, and meaningful careers.

A former TV producer and marketing professional for global brands, she brings real-world experience and practical strategies to every stage and session.

Her keynotes and workshops empower audiences to lead with purpose, communicate with authenticity, and navigate their careers like entrepreneurs. Her thought leadership has been featured in TED, Forbes, Entrepreneur, Business Insider, and more.

Connect with Michelle on LinkedIn.

What You’ll Learn In This Episode

  • Breaking the “wait your turn” mindset and recognizing when following the rules is actually holding your career back
  • What it truly means to be the CEO of your career and one practical shift you can make at work immediately
  • The truth about networking and personal branding—and what most people are getting wrong
  • How ownership looks different from college students to Fortune 500 leaders—and what successful professionals do at every stage
  • Balancing strategy and authenticity without feeling political or calculated
  • The critical mindset shift required to pivot after 10+ years in the same role or industry

Transcript-iconThis transcript is machine transcribed by Sonix.

 

TRANSCRIPT

Lee Kantor: Lee Kantor here. Another episode of High Velocity Radio and this is going to be a good one. Today we are going to discuss how to become the CEO of your career with Michelle Enjoli. Welcome.

Michelle Enjoli: Thank you for having me, Lee.

Lee Kantor: And while I’m excited to learn what you’re up to, tell us about your practice. How are you serving folks?

Michelle Enjoli: Yeah, so I help both leaders and professionals what I call stop waiting for permission and start owning their career trajectory. So what I’ve found throughout the years is that you have many people who are working today and doing all the right things. They’re going to the right schools, getting credentials, working really hard, and sometimes they struggle to see the growth that they want to see. And so I decided to help those folks learn, because no one has taught them how to position themselves in order to see that growth. And so I’ve focused on helping folks do that.

Lee Kantor: And then the type of people you help, are they kind of people early in their career, in the mid-career, at the end of their career? What where are they at when they get Ahold of you?

Michelle Enjoli: Well, so it’s interesting, I started this practice with early to mid-career in mind. And what’s the evolution of it has been that it’s been all over the place, from students about to graduate college to early, mid or late career people needing to pivot, wanting to pivot. So I’ve seen it at all different stages of people’s careers.

Lee Kantor: And this is a hot button issue for me because I’m always I don’t like to be waiting for someone to pick me. I like to try to take control as best as well as I can in order to be the chooser instead of the waiting to be picked person. Um, it sounds like philosophically we’re on the same page there.

Michelle Enjoli: Oh, absolutely. That’s exactly the foundation of what I teach today, because it’s necessary.

Lee Kantor: And that’s very counterintuitive because, you know, when you’re going to school, everybody’s just basically kind of telling you to just shut up and get along and just, you know, just follow this kind of escalator path to the next level and you’re just kind of waiting your turn until you just get the tap on the shoulder so you can, you know, enter into the room you want to enter in. How did you kind of land on this? Because I believe it is counterintuitive, is not what is conventional thought out there right now.

Michelle Enjoli: Oh, absolutely. So there’s been a number of things that led to this conclusion, even in my own life. So a little bit about me. I’m a first generation American and a first generation college student. So right from the beginning, before my career even started, I had to figure it out. I had to basically set a path for myself because one just even figuring out what college I wanted to go to and what I wanted to study, I didn’t have anyone who had done that before in my family or my close circles. And so that was the first start of it, of me having to initiate this, these steps for myself. Secondly was I came to the conclusion that my dream job was going to be to become a news producer in New York City. I was very specific about the type of job that I wanted. And as you know, the communications industry is very, very competitive. And so in order for me to accomplish that, I had to do the same exact thing, figure it out, build my own connections, build my own pathway. And so I thankfully successfully did that in college and ended up landing that dream job even before my college graduation, which was a miracle to me. At that point, I thought they were punking me when I received the offer, and so I think that was a catalyst for me understanding that I had to create my own path.

Lee Kantor: So when you were able to kind of land the job, you I mean, somebody might say, well, I got picked, I did everything right and I was the one who was anointed this position. But you saw it a different way. You said, I got this because I made certain moves. I was proactive, I took control of the situation. I did not wait.

Michelle Enjoli: Absolutely. Yeah. So instead of I mean, I used every resource in school. So I’ll give you a couple examples. I would interview people over coffee. I would ask even other students, faculty, do they know someone in the industry? I took a lot of odd jobs to learn and how to perfect. Whether it was writing and speaking. I was, you know, I became an anchor for this little news station up in northern new Jersey, where as a college student, I had the wonderful, wonderful schedule of waking up at 3 a.m. in the morning on Saturday mornings to anchor the morning, um, you know, uh, morning newscast on the weekends. That was not fun at all. But I did it because I knew that that was my way in of acquiring skill sets and making connections. So I had to do a lot, a lot of work to get there.

Lee Kantor: Now, when you’re working with people, especially young people, a lot of times they want to kind of make the their path go at a speed. Maybe that is a little unrealistic. How do you help them kind of manage their expectations when it comes to deploying a strategy like this? Because, you know, at some point, like you said, you got to do the thing, you can’t wait. And then just they’re not going to just believe you can do the thing. You got to actually do the thing.

Michelle Enjoli: Oh, absolutely. And this is something that is very, very common today, this mindset. Because unlike when I was going to school, I didn’t have social media. And today, you know, social media, these kids are being fed false information every day that you can build a business and become a millionaire overnight, or that you, you know, you can graduate school and everyone gets their dream job at the maybe the company or things like that. There’s a lot of unrealistic expectations. And what I help people understand is you have to be moving at all times. The timeline is going to depend on a lot of different circumstances. Yes, you have to work, but it also depends on the market, what’s going on. There’s politics involved, especially when you’re working at different companies. So I kind of walk them through this roadmap that teaches them a lot of those skill sets, not just, you know, having a vision for where they want to go in the next 2 to 5 years, but also how do you get there? And that mindset involves, you know, being realistic, you know, shifting your mindset, you know, building a good personal brand, learning how to connect with people. So I really focus on the entire process so people understand what it takes to get there.

Lee Kantor: Now for some people, I would imagine this is, you know, you’re doing some tough love here, right? You’re trying to help them. But this is not what a lot of people want to hear.

Michelle Enjoli: Oh, absolutely. Oh, I have plenty of stories that I can tell you, especially from younger folks of, you know, me giving them that tough love and and them rejecting it at first. I mean, I get all different types of scenarios. I have people who reject it and kind of don’t talk to me for like about a month or two. And then they come back and they say, oh, wait, I probably should have listened. Sorry about that. Or they reject it at first, but then quickly adapt and they start doing things and they start seeing results. So I get a lot of different reactions.

Lee Kantor: Yeah. I remember a young person came to me a few years ago and they’re like, I want to be a writer. And I’m like, oh, great, show me some of the writing you’ve done. I don’t have any examples. Like you, I go, you don’t have a blog, like blogs are free, like you can write and you know, no one’s stopping you from writing. There’s no barrier to entry to write. And then they just wanted in their head this kind of dream of what a writer would be like without the actual work of being the writer. Um, I just find that really interesting. In today’s the mindset is so different.

Michelle Enjoli: Oh, absolutely. And I do blame it. You know, I tend to not always blame it on them. I think I blame it on the access and the technology. And like I said, this perception that’s been created in the media, that’s been fed to them or is fed to them every single day, that these things happen to people without much effort. And that’s just not the case. People are not overnight successes. It looks like it, by the way. People edit videos and things like that on social media, but that’s just not the reality.

Lee Kantor: So now part of your methodology, um, and you mentioned this, that networking was kind of important as you kind of became the CEO of your career. Can you talk about maybe the misinformation that’s out there about networking and what networking really means to you and how folks should leverage it moving forward?

Michelle Enjoli: Yeah, absolutely. So here’s a thing that I’m going to bomb, I’m gonna drop. I actually hate networking. And when I tell that to people, you know, when I’m keynoting or giving a seminar, people look at me strange and I go, because if you really think about it and you look up the word networking in the dictionary, it’s a very vague definition of building business relationships. But again, you’re not telling me how to do that. And what I’ve learned is people need simple ways of understanding concepts. And so what I found that the way that I did it was something that I was learned naturally. And so I think about this. I grew up in a large immigrant family in a town in new Jersey outside of New York City. And I remember growing up being at my grandmother’s house. I had a large extended family, and waking up and coffee was a staple in the morning. And I remember waking up never knowing who was going to be at the kitchen table with my grandmother, because it could have been anyone a family member, a friend, a neighbor. But what I noticed as I grew up was that the conversations that were taking place at those tables were about solving problems as immigrants and people around our community.

Michelle Enjoli: It was about, you know, Did you find a job? Is your daughter getting better? And that naturally instilled in me a way to connect with people that was more natural. And so when I started doing this work, I came up with a definition for networking, which I call connecting and what it is, it’s the definition. It’s an authentic attempt to learn or assist someone. And so what that is, it’s not defined by a place or a time. This conversation, this connection, can take place anywhere in a coffee shop on the train. And it’s just simply thinking of three things being authentic and truly being curious about people. Learning about people. You know, why are you here at this event? You know what brought you to this city? And then if there’s an opportunity for you to assist, whether it’s you can assist or you have a recommendation or a referral that can help them with something that they’ve talked about, then you offer it. But that’s just like a natural way of learning about people and then solidifying connections by offering assistance any way that you can. To me, that’s very natural. And it’s not bound by an event or a specific scenario or environment.

Lee Kantor: Well, it sounds very human and it doesn’t sound very, um, marketing automation y.

Michelle Enjoli: Yes.

Lee Kantor: Um, I can’t tell you how many LinkedIn connections requests I get from people that with. If I connect within seconds, it’s buy my thing. Um, they want to just eliminate the humanity from the interaction. And I think that, um, people are hungry for human to human connection. So if you can actually do that in a, in a with a mindset of service rather than a transaction, you’re going to be better served in the long run.

Michelle Enjoli: Oh, definitely. It’s interesting. I can tell you a really cool story that I just heard a month ago when I was on a trip of someone, and it goes really in line with what we’re talking about. And it was, this is a guy, he’s in business development, and the services that he offers are not services in the hundreds or thousands. His services are in the millions of dollars. And he told me a great story where he was coming to an event to talk to someone who he wanted to pitch something to a potential client. And so what he ended up doing was he went to dinner with this gentleman first the night before, and he said, you know, we didn’t talk about business. We actually just ended up talking about family. They both have families. They had a couple things in common and they just went to dinner. Well, lo and behold, the next day, later in the day, he looked at me and he said, oh my God, um, he’s gonna sign with us. And I said, what do you mean? He goes, well, we never even spoke about business, nor did I give him a presentation. But my office just called and said that he had dinner with me last night and that he wants to move forward and see, that is awesome. He didn’t have to have a PowerPoint presentation or anything. He simply connected with him over dinner on a human level. And I guess the likability was so strong that the person felt okay moving forward with him. I think that’s awesome.

Lee Kantor: Right. And that’s what happens when you have human to human interactions. And it isn’t kind of a polished, scripted, um, you know, PowerPoint. It’s it’s a human being talking to a human being. And then during that conversation, you can tell, do we are our values aligned? You know, how are they treating people around them? Like, you can learn a lot just by having a human conversation and paying a little bit of attention. It doesn’t have to be transactional.

Michelle Enjoli: Oh, absolutely. And here’s the thing. I mean, this is something that I live by and what makes life exciting for me. And I tell people this can make life exciting for you, is lead with curiosity. Like, we live in a massive world. There’s. And you know, I was lucky where I was raised in an environment full of diversity and culture, and my family was really big on the weekends we’d go and, you know, into New York City and eat at restaurants, you know, in Chinatown that were underground and constantly just learning and engaging with people from all different parts of the world. And that’s how you have to go about this, is go about it with curiosity.

Lee Kantor: Now, how would you advise people when it comes to developing their own personal brand, like being able to stand out and being authentic is critical when you’re growing your network or you’re growing your career. So what are some do’s and don’ts when it comes to developing a personal brand?

Michelle Enjoli: Yeah. So first we’ll start with, you know, a personal brand is something that it’s a feeling that you create in others when they think and talk about you. So I tell everyone, you know, I know there’s a lot of effort into, you know, a great headshot on LinkedIn and appearing a certain way, but a great personal brand or a valuable one, as I like to call it, is one that helps attract opportunities to you. And the way that you do that is it’s by what people say when you’re not in the room. And so building a valuable personal brand is all about action. It’s not about what you’re saying. It’s not about what you’re appearing to be. It’s action. And so your actions every day determine how people see you. So I always tell people, you know, the way you build a valuable personal brand. It depends on what is it that you’re trying to accomplish. So for example, if you’re looking to break into a different industry, a different part of your company, you want to pivot. Build a valuable personal brand means one being known for being really good at that thing, whether it’s acquiring the skills, whatever that is, communicating that value, but also engaging and connecting with people in that arena so that when your name is brought up, right, you are known for that specific thing.

Lee Kantor: So it’s important to be kind of find something that you’re the go to person for.

Michelle Enjoli: Absolutely. And the way that you do that is in your actions, whether it’s online or offline, like you have to be intentional. I’ll give you an example. I was working with an athlete last year who wants to make it to the NFL. Very talented in college, and we were talking about what is building a valuable personal brand mean. And we came on the topic of social media. He has a massive following on Instagram. And, you know, he’s a superstar in school as athletes tend to be today. And his goal is to, you know, get nil deals and get brand deals and eventually get to the NFL. And what I told him was I looked at his profile and there were some questionable things. And I said, well, if this is where you want to go, the brand that you want to have, like, actually have and be known for, it needs to be there to get there by doing these actions. And I’ll give you an example. One of these actions were how you present yourself on social media, like maybe less partying pictures, and maybe it’s you training you, spending time with family, just being authentically you, but in a way that represents you. So that if I’m at Nike or I’m at another big brand. I look at your social media and you represent the type of athlete that we want to represent. And so making people understand that nuance is that, you know, understanding what is your goal, but then being strategic about how you express yourself, that is what becomes your personal brand.

Lee Kantor: And especially if you’re looking for, uh, corporations to invest in you.

Michelle Enjoli: Exactly, exactly.

Lee Kantor: They’re they’re looking for a reason to say no. So if you give it to them, they will take it. So, um, you have to protect your brand and their brand, too, because if they’re paying you, they are now associated with you.

Michelle Enjoli: Absolutely. And that’s part of it, right? A personal brand, like when I say a valuable personal brand, because we all have a personal brand, that’s also something to talk about. And I, especially with young people that are on social media, I say, whether you want to or not, you do have a brand today. You have a brand that you’re building online and there’s one that you’re building offline in your interactions. But if you want a valuable personal brand is one that gets you the opportunities that you specifically want. So in the scenario that I just described with the athlete, that’s exactly what you say he has to think about. Well, what would be if someone were to sign me? What kind of person do I have to be to be attractive for those kind of offers? And that’s how you should be displaying yourself. That’s strategic.

Lee Kantor: Right? Unless he wants to be sponsored by somebody, that’s okay with partying. And like if that’s his dream sponsor, then go boldly forward there, guy. Exactly. Now, um, is there you mentioned a few examples, but is there a story that you can show that that’s maybe the most rewarding, where somebody came to you and maybe they were stuck and you were able to help them get to a new level? Obviously don’t name their name, but maybe share the challenge that they had and where they were at and how you were able to kind of help them elevate.

Michelle Enjoli: Yeah, absolutely. I actually have one, the one that comes to mind because I just engaged with her not too long ago. It’s personal and professional. It’s interesting. I was, um, I babysat her in college, and so obviously she grew up. I grew up, and eventually she went to school, went to college, and she had this dream job that she wanted, just like I did. It’s so funny. And she came to me, this is this might be now maybe 5 or 6 years ago now. Anyway, she came to me and said, hey, Michelle, you know, you know, I just saw this job posting. It’s my dream job and it’s a really big job where she lives. And so I worked with her and gave her, you know, a couple of strategies to practice. And lo and behold, she ended up getting that dream job, which I think she was like the youngest person ever to get that job. So that was super exciting because that wasn’t just a professional accomplishment for me. It was just very endearing because I was obviously she was a personal connection, someone that I saw grow up. So that was, I think, really, really cool.

Lee Kantor: Now, is there, um, in the services that you, um, Deliver. You’ve mentioned a few different ways that you interact with folks. Is it, um. Is your work primarily kind of coaching them in terms of, okay, here’s some. Here’s how I would do that, or this is your next move to make. Or are you actually, like you mentioned with that athlete? Are you helping them kind of build that brand and helping them with social media and and helping, you know, where does your kind of, um, services begin and end?

Michelle Enjoli: Sure. So it’s very interesting because I, I don’t like cookie cutter services because what I do is not really cookie cutter in the way that I do it. And so here’s what where it is, I built a foundational roadmap that helps people strategize for where they want to go in their career. And so I deliver it in a number of ways. One is through keynote speeches, so I speak for universities, business school, corporate companies on a couple of different topics that have to do with career ownership. So I speak on how to become the CEO of your career. I also speak to leaders that are looking to take this CEO mindset and help their organizations and their employees grow. And then I also do one on one coaching, which is what I’ve spoken about, which is depending on your goals. So I have a framework that I use, but every single person is different. One minute I could be working with an athlete who’s looking to grow his personal brand and attract sponsorship opportunities. The next minute I could be working with someone who is 52, who has been working, have been working in the same industry and area their whole lives, and due to a reorg or a layoff or a desire to pivot, now they want to rebuild and try to work towards rebuilding a brand that will attract new opportunities in a different area. So it depends what it is in terms of the one on one coaching. So I do essentially the same thing, which is I’m a career strategist, I call it I help people strategize how to grow depending on where they want to go. But the process can be unique depending on where someone is in their career and what their particular goal is.

Lee Kantor: So if somebody wants to learn more, have a more substantive conversation with you. What’s the website? What’s the best way to connect?

Michelle Enjoli: Sure. Well, most people love to connect with me on LinkedIn, which I welcome. So it’s Michelle and Julie on LinkedIn. They can go to my website. Uh michelangeli comm or on socials as well. Instagram. I get a lot of messages as well under Michelle Angelique.

Lee Kantor: And the spelling is m I c h e l l e e n j o l I.

Michelle Enjoli: Yes.

Lee Kantor: Well, Michelle, thank you so much for sharing your story today. You’re doing such important work and we appreciate you.

Michelle Enjoli: Thank you for having me, Lee.

Lee Kantor: All right. This is Lee Kantor. We’ll see you all next time on High Velocity Radio.

The Leadership Reset: How to Thrive Amid AI Disruption and Workplace Volatility

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High Velocity Radio
High Velocity Radio
The Leadership Reset: How to Thrive Amid AI Disruption and Workplace Volatility
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In this episode of High Velocity Radio, Lee interviews Aday Adetosoye, founder and CEO of 1099 Impact Street, about the impact of AI on leadership, organizational culture, and employee burnout. Aday emphasizes that AI amplifies existing leadership and organizational dynamics rather than serving as a quick fix. They discuss common pitfalls in AI adoption, the importance of principled leadership, and the need for clear communication and strategic planning. The episode highlights the necessity of human-centered, ethical approaches to AI integration to build resilient, adaptive organizations amid technological change.

Dr. Aday E. Adetosoye is a leadership strategist, advisor, and founder of 1099 Impact Street. She works with executives, organizations, and mission-driven leaders navigating burnout, organizational volatility, and AI-driven disruption.

Her work focuses on principled leadership, disciplined judgment, and building resilient systems that do not collapse under pressure.

A former diplomat with more than 25 years of experience across global health, nonprofit leadership, and complex organizations, Dr. Aday helps leaders design sustainable performance in the age of AI.

She is the creator of The Leadership Reset, a framework for resilient leadership and ethical decision-making.

Connect with Dr. Aday on LinkedIn.

What You’ll Learn In This Episode

  • The impact of artificial intelligence (AI) on leadership and organizational culture.
  • The relationship between AI adoption and employee burnout.
  • Challenges organizations face when implementing AI, including leadership burnout and workplace disruption.
  • The misconception of AI as a quick fix rather than an amplifier of existing leadership qualities.
  • The importance of principled leadership and disciplined judgment in navigating AI integration.
  • Strategies for mindful AI deployment, including clear policies and communication.
  • The cultural implications of rapid AI implementation and its potential to strain organizational culture.
  • The significance of involving employees in the AI adoption process to alleviate fears and foster trust.
  • The necessity of a strategic approach to AI that aligns with organizational goals and human resources.
  • The Leadership Reset Framework for managing disruption and building sustainable performance in organizations.

Transcript-iconThis transcript is machine transcribed by Sonix.

 

TRANSCRIPT

Intro: Broadcasting live from the Business RadioX studios in Atlanta, Georgia. It’s time for High Velocity Radio.

Lee Kantor: Lee Kantor here. Another episode of High Velocity Radio, and this is going to be a good one. Today on the show we have the founder CEO of 1099 Impact Street a day, Aday Adetosoye. Welcome.

Aday Adetosoye: Thank you so much, Lee. Glad to be here.

Lee Kantor: Well, I’m excited to learn what you’re up to. Tell us about 1099 Impact Street. How are you serving, folks?

Aday Adetosoye: Excellent. You know, right now a lot of organizations are investing millions in AI and wondering why the leaders are burning out. We work on that gap at 1099 Impact Street. We work with leaders and organizations that are sort of navigating volatility, disruption, the AI shift and just general disruption in the workplace based on systems. So our focus is really principled leadership, discipline, judgment and ensuring that we’re all building systems that hold under whatever pressure, whether it’s technological, whether it’s personnel. So we’re here to just ensure that organizations are looking at the right systems, that hold the right people to do what they need to do.

Lee Kantor: Now, you mentioned AI at the jump. Is there a correlation between people who are kind of leveraging AI or experimenting with AI and burnout? Are those two connected?

Aday Adetosoye: Yes, absolutely. Especially right now, AI is accelerating everything. And leaders at the top are wondering how they fit in and how does AI fit into their companies or organizations. So it then makes leadership clarity and decision stability that much more important. So I’m sure, you know, everywhere we look now we’re talking about AI. We’re talking about robots. We’re talking about this new technology that’s really just come to stay for now. So how do we ensure that people who have been doing their jobs, who have been relatively secure in their jobs, are not only freaking out about AI, but also are not burning out by this additional pressure of what AI means in their entity.

Lee Kantor: So is burnout happening statistically more today than it was five years, ten years ago?

Aday Adetosoye: Not necessarily. I haven’t looked at the latest statistics in that particular way. But what is happening for sure is that this idea of artificial intelligence is adding to the burnout, right? We are demanding more of our employees. We are asking, you know, there’s a lot of do more with less. You know, last year we saw record numbers of people get laid off, and those who are left behind have to do the job. So with or without AI, we’re already seeing that, uh, a lot of people are having to do much more than they were doing five years ago. And so what we’re seeing now is that with the additional layer of AI and the quote unquote threat, depending on how it’s defined, we’re starting to see that people are even feeling more burnt out as a result of this threat of AI, may replace me, may take my job. And so what we need to do is really work with organizations to sustain people, to sustain people, and to not reward overextension and compress timelines and treat people as if they’re endlessly adaptable. We’ve got to strengthen our systems to deal with burnout that is real, and burnout that is artificially extended because of this new AI situation.

Lee Kantor: Now, if this situation is systemic at the heart of it. You’re saying AI contributes to it, but from a leadership standpoint, aren’t most leaders kind of seeing the possibilities of AI and how it can enhance and help their people perform more effectively, more efficiently? Isn’t kind of that the heart of at least their belief? Maybe that’s not what it is in reality, for the kind of the people farther down the org chart. But in the minds of the leadership, don’t they see this as kind of a way to exponentially improve productivity, which should lessen burnout? But you’re saying that that’s not what’s really happening.

Aday Adetosoye: Well, yeah, it’s it’s a little bit of both, really. Li we see some leaders who are embracing AI as exactly what you just described, and we also see some leaders who view AI as a threat and also don’t know how to incorporate AI without, um, freaking out their employees. I see fear. I see a lot of fear of the unknown when I talk to leaders at the top. And if we say, well, how is AI changing their expectations? Ai does not replace leadership. And this is the core message is AI does not replace leadership. It magnifies it, right? It accelerates our ability to make decisions, to communicate and to execute. So when we use it the way we’re supposed to, it’s not supposed to add judgment and ethics or wisdom. So if leaders already overwhelmed AI will only help you burn out faster if you’re not using it correctly. But if you’re a leader who is clear and grounded, what AI does is reduce noise and protect your focus and help you strategize better. So what I’m seeing is that the mistake most organizations are making is they’re treating AI like a fix. Um, and it’s not a fix. It’s an amplifier, which means that the state of the actual leader who uses AI or who chooses to use AI matters more than the actual sophistication of the technology.

Lee Kantor: And that they have to use it strategically. And it’s not just kind of a blunt instrument, that it’s going to solve all your problems and make everything bad go away. Like, it has to be kind of strategically implemented in a manner that achieves the outcome you desire, not just creates chaos. So as part of your service that you go in and help leaders really understand how to deploy AI in a more strategic, meaningful manner.

Aday Adetosoye: That is exactly right. You just articulated that beautifully. That is exactly what we do, is we come in and we say, tell us what your current strategy is. Tell us what you’re thinking about AI. How are you feeling about it? What are you what are you thinking about doing with it? And then we find those gaps and try to fill them in with that strategy and making sure that, again, it’s amplifying and not replacing. Excellent. The way you put it.

Lee Kantor: Well, I think it’s one of those things where if it’s not deployed mindfully, it can be a distraction and a disruption and lead to that kind of downward spiral pretty quickly, because it’s easy to get overwhelmed, because you start asking your questions or you start putting data in and you’re going to get lots and lots of data back, and all of a sudden now you’re down 50 rabbit holes. That can be a distraction and not really strategically help you. So I think people do need to kind of rely on an expert or a Sherpa to help them kind of focus in on what outcome they desire, and just use AI as a tool to help you do that.

Aday Adetosoye: Yes, yes. And it’s really about what you put in is what you get. And so we talk a lot about prompt engineering, which is just really a fancy term for, you know, how do you tell this tool to give you what you want? So if you go in and try to sort of say, um, you know, you give it a very generic or a vague, um.

Lee Kantor: Yeah, like make me a marketing plan, you know, like, that’s not helpful.

Aday Adetosoye: That’s not helpful. You’re going to get those 50 rabbit holes that you just talked about. You’re going to keep going and going. So you have to be very clear and precise about what it is that you want it to do. You know, down to if you were blue Sky and your marketing plan had these five things and these ten outcomes, make sure that you’re putting in those precise, specific outcomes that you desire into that prompt, and then that’s what you’re going to get. So part of it too, is just having leaders and teams define exactly what they want to do with AI and not just see it as we’re just going to have it do all these things well, what are all these things? And that’s some of the things we help folks clarify.

Lee Kantor: So now what is happening before they hire you? What kind of pain or friction are they having? Uh, that is kind of the trigger to say, you know what? I gotta get a day in here.

Aday Adetosoye: Um, uh, what we’re seeing is there is a sort of, um, it’s a sort of frenzied moment, is what I would call it right now is, uh, and this FOMO, this fear of missing out because people are on LinkedIn or, um, various, um, social media platforms or even in the literature saying that, you know, uh, entity, a adopted AI and their output was so much greater. And so what we want to do that too, without really thinking through how you’re going to bring it in on an enterprise level and how you’re going to stagger it, um, onto and into your current human potential that you have. And so there’s this, you know, a CIO goes out there and gets, you know, um, a system and just brings it and says, now we’re going to be using AI. There’s no real strategy, there’s no policy, there’s no thought through, um, how this actually integrates with the human beings that are there and how the leaders are using it ethically, what the governance frameworks frameworks look like. It’s just sort of like the in the moment. Well, all we have to do is just get, you know, paid or pro ChatGPT or paid or pro, um, Microsoft Copilot or whatever tool it is that folks think they need and they just get and these are the ones I hear of the most is the ChatGPT and and, uh, here, Claude now a lot.

Aday Adetosoye: Oh, we’re just going to bring that in at the enterprise level, and we’re just going to tell everyone to use it. Well, no, you have to think through what again, as you mentioned earlier, Lee, what is your strategy and what is it that you want to achieve and how does it blend in with people? So by the time they’re calling me, they’ve already tried something. Um, AI related. And it has created more chaos than, uh, how it was before they brought AI into it. And so they call me in and say, well, we got the AI and it’s not working. Our staff are deflated and they’re feeling like we want to replace them. So we need your help and just, you know, strategizing and building out what our policy looks like, what the implementation plan looks like, and what success looks like down the road.

Lee Kantor: But, I mean, that makes perfect sense that that would occur like that, because AI isn’t that kind of a tool. Like if you put AI in the hands of ten people, those ten people are going to all use it differently, like some people are going to go crazy and think, this is the best thing that ever happened. Another person’s going to hate it and say, what is this doing? You know, it’s a robot revolution. Like, um, get it out of here. I mean, people some people will be threatened, some people will be thrilled. I mean, you yeah. It’s not something I think that you can just deploy just that casually.

Aday Adetosoye: Correct. Correct. But that’s what’s been happening. So people have been leaders have been feeling under pressure. And effective leadership is not about moving quickly or moving faster than the next. It’s about staying stable and staying steady. Right. So when you are stable in your decision making, it means that you are able to pause. You’re able to assess the risk, assess the outcomes you’re looking for, and act with clarity, even when everything feels urgent, you know. And teams at the end of the day mirror their leadership. And that’s why we say leadership matters. So when leaders are reactive, we see the situation we’re talking about where organizations become volatile. Like you just said, ten people will react ten different ways. That’s why that policy is important. The change management, the open communication, why we’re going this route, what we expect to happen, channels of communication. If you run into any issues, here’s what the organization is going to do about it. So that calm is important because that’s what increases trust and that’s what improves execution.

Lee Kantor: And if you do it, if you deploy it that casually, I would imagine if there’s any cracks in your culture, this thing just explodes it.

Aday Adetosoye: Yes, absolutely. Absolutely. And I say that’s why I say that, you know, there’s a saying that culture eats strategy. And I say strategy eats culture because the culture will not fail on its own. Strategy overwhelms it. And especially when a strategy is not executed properly, it’s one thing to have a strategy and it’s another thing to execute it. So when the strategy applies, pressure on your culture is when you know whether your cultural culture will stand or not. And what we’re seeing is this strategy around AI and just adopting it willy nilly, or adopting it out of FOMO. Um, you know, it is definitely putting a strain on whatever organizational culture was there to begin with, if it was. We’re seeing a lot of strain on that.

Lee Kantor: So do you have any advice for folks out there that are struggling in this area? And they’d like to have some cogent AI strategy? Is there kind of a minimum viable product when it comes to AI strategy? Like what are some of the basics dos and don’ts when it comes to deploying AI?

Aday Adetosoye: Some of the things we’ve been talking about, it’s really important to understand where your organization is. What are the pain points that you believe AI is going to help you solve? How do how does the introduction of AI blend with your human, um, potential and and resource that you have? And those are the questions that leaders really need to think about. You’ve got to think about the leadership part before you think about the technology, because it’s just a tool, and it’s what matters most is what is it that you want this tool to do for you? And it’s not just bring it in because it’s available. Um, but bring it in because there’s a pain point you have and it’s going to help you. Um, and maybe you haven’t identified that pain point yet. So that’s where you look inwards at your strategy and whatever risks you have that you think, you know, the adoption of AI can mitigate. Um, so that’s that’s sort of on the leadership side. On the technology side, again, it’s tied to the pain point, right? Each of these tools is better at different things. So you also don’t want to just introduce a suite of AI tools. I was recently working with a client who had many tools all at the same time, and they were misusing them unintentionally, but just because the tools were there and they weren’t leveraging the power that tool A had over tool B, because they just they were so interested in bringing so many tools in. So again, it boils down to what are those pain points And which tool out there can help you solve the pain that you have, the problem that you have, and then you bring that in. And again, the change management, because a lot of employees today are freaking out about AI replacing them. So you’ve got to you’ve got to hold your team because that’s your most precious resource. That’ll hold your team through it and solicit as much input from them as you as you go this route. That’s what I would say there.

Lee Kantor: Now, is there a story you can share about one of your clients? How don’t name the name of the client, but maybe share the challenge they came to you with and how you were able to help them get through it and get to a new level?

Aday Adetosoye: Yes, absolutely. Several. But I would say one of the the more recent ones, um, is one who came there. Um, I would say about five years into they’ve got about a little over 50 employees and um, what they are social impact organization. They work with homelessness and, um, and people who are not housed across the country. Um, and one of the things that they wanted to do, uh, when they approached me was, well, we don’t want to have any more, um, administrative staff. So we’ve run into some hard times. We’ve lost contracts that we had with the government, and so we’re going to eliminate our administrative team. And, um, we brought in these tools. And what we’re finding now is we’re not able to do anything because there’s now chaos in the organization, our administrative staff, who who are still here when we brought in the tools, didn’t quite know how to react. Uh, we were being quote unquote transparent by telling them that we wanted to bring in these tools to ease them out and have the tools take over. So we wanted them to write out all the stops of the things that they were working on so that these tools would take over and we would just have like one person, uh, do what the team of five were doing. Um, using the AI tools. And what ended up happening was their team, um, remained, but they weren’t really working. They showed up. They were disenfranchized, uh, the person who was supposed to help them utilize the tools and sort of guide the process resigned, um, because the other ones felt that, um, she had turned against them and was working with the management to get rid of them.

Aday Adetosoye: And there was just general chaos, so work was not happening. The people who made the decision to bring in the tools were not the everyday users and didn’t quite know how to use the tools. And so that’s it was at that point that they came to me to say, we now have not only, um, a crisis where we’ve spent all this money to bring in the tools. It’s not being used. We also have the HR crisis. Our team is showing up, but they’re not motivated to work. We have used pips, uh, all kinds of things, to try to get them back on track, but they’re just. We believe they’re all looking for work, and the person who’s supposed to do all the work has resigned. So help. So what we did, we had a half day session, and we brought in all the the leaders who had made this decision to just talk through why, what what made you feel this was the route to go. And again, it boiled down to we heard of some organization that did it and it was working well for them. They cut XYZ costs of benefits and salaries. And so we felt after we lost the contract, it was important for us to also cut costs and use technology as best as we could. We were coming from an altruistic place, but our delivery looks like it landed wrong and our staff is mad at us. And even others who aren’t necessarily affected are also feeling like, could they just do this to us? And after I heard what they had to say.

Aday Adetosoye: I also talked to the middle level managers and the junior level folks, and that was pretty much the case. Um, so one thing that I gave to that leadership team was that they were able to keep a finger on the pulse of what was going on. Um, because when I spoke with the others, they pretty much verified that that was what was happening. In a nutshell, what I did for them was to bring back, bring everybody back to reality. Number one, you don’t tell your team that we’re going to replace you with this tool and say that you’re being transparent. What you do need to say is that we have lost funding, and we’re looking for ways to, um, cut our costs. And we’d like for you to help us with that. But we’re not going to let you go, per se. I mean, one of the things that you could do is reduce time, but not just, you know, declare that you’re letting them go. So we talked about now what is it that is really going to be replaced? Can you replace everything that person A was doing. Can you really do that. And found out that no, you can’t replace everything, so you’re going to need the human piece to guide the AI to what you need it to do. Uh, as much as we have these Agentic AIS and everything else, you know, build an entire system that doesn’t really work at the enterprise level of a social impact organization, because all of the social impact is about humanity and ethics and governance, and not so much just automated decisions.

Aday Adetosoye: So we got to the happy place. We’re still working through it, but we’ve gotten to a happy place where, you know, there is a recognition that humans are needed for this type of work and that you leverage all of the power that AI does to speed up things, speed up your reports, speed up the clarity, speed up the data. And as we all know, and I’m sure Lee, you know this too, that AI hallucinates and lies sometimes. So you have to check everything. And so you can’t just put the data in and believe everything that comes out. You’ve got to Fact, check it and make sure that it’s clear. And then also put in the right information. So where we are now is that we we are solving a few things at the same time. One, the strategic use of AI, which we’re now starting to see, you know, much better reports coming out. We’re starting to see much more confidence in using it from top to bottom. Um, how to strategically, strategically place it within humans and the technology itself to get the results that you need. And then finally, we’re also seeing that the leadership team is recognizing the value of their human resources and not to just get rid of them. So we’re we’re not quite there yet, but we are definitely, um, miles away from where we started, from the chaos of the org culture that I walked into.

Lee Kantor: So who is that ideal client for you, or is it mostly nonprofits or do you work with? Are you industry agnostic?

Aday Adetosoye: I’m industry agnostic, but I. I lean toward social impact nonprofit organizations just because of my background in global health. But I, I, um, at the end of the day, you know, the the the intersections are are very similar. You know, bringing in a new technology. It’s it’s still very similar.

Lee Kantor: Now, is it organizations of a certain size, number of employees, uh, amount of sales each year. Like, which when you hone in on that ideal, um, client.

Aday Adetosoye: Oh, I see what you’re saying. Yeah. My ideal client, I would say, is somewhere between, uh, 50 to 150 employees. Um, revenue is somewhere around, um, somewhere between, I would say 5 to $30 million per year. Um, distributed, um, operations. So either, um, across the country, across a region, or even internationally, um, but has, you know, staff in different offices and needs to, you know, usually has this pain point of how does everybody use the same tool to get fluency in the technology and in their operations?

Lee Kantor: So before we wrap, can you share a little bit about your Leadership Reset framework?

Aday Adetosoye: Oh yeah sure. So that I’ll I’ll quickly say I think we’ve got about four minutes here. Um, it’s got three parts. And the first is recognition. So that identifying, you know what the pain points are leaders. You have to be able to name where your strain and your misalignment are entering your system. You can’t fix what you’re not willing to see is what I say. So recognition of your problem. Second is regulation. The missing link in most leadership models is that, you know, leaders need capacity to stay steady under pressure. I worked in a very high pressure, 25 years in global health, working in infectious diseases around the world. It’s a lot of pressure and you’ve got to be able to stay steady. So you’re not making reactive decisions in high stakes moments. So I’ve worked with leaders across 40 countries, and I’ve seen the same pattern everywhere. When regulation breaks down, organizations pay for it. So second is regulation and the third one is reconstruction. So once you’ve identified your problem, you’re able to stay steady under the pressure of the problem. The next thing is how do you build. How do you rebuild to get beyond the problem. And this is where leaders redesign their boundaries, their authority, their purpose. So that performance becomes not a seasonal thing, but a sustainable, um, expected outcome. And it’s not about doing more. It’s about rebuilding leadership architecture that can hold the complexities that we’re facing today. So I say that regulation is a missing link, and most leadership models skip it entirely. So for for me, it’s, you know, the three things. It’s recognition, regulation and reconstruction. And understanding where you are in the regulation piece is the most critical.

Lee Kantor: So if somebody wants to learn more, have a more substantive conversation with you or somebody on the team, what’s the website? What’s the best way to connect?

Aday Adetosoye: The best way to connect is a day. A day at 1099 Street.com. Our website is WW 1099 Street.com. And we have a contact form on there. Or you can just email me directly. Either way is fine. You can also follow us on LinkedIn. We’re there at 1099 Street and on Facebook and Instagram.

Lee Kantor: And it’s the numbers 1099 impact Street.com.

Aday Adetosoye: That is correct. Lee. You got it.

Lee Kantor: All right today. Thank you so much for sharing your story. You’re doing such important work and we appreciate you.

Aday Adetosoye: Thank you. Your questions are great.

Lee Kantor: All right. This Lee Kantor we’ll see you all next time on High Velocity Radio.

Racing Ahead: How Mountain Motorsports Became a Leader in the Powersports Industry

by

High Velocity Radio
High Velocity Radio
Racing Ahead: How Mountain Motorsports Became a Leader in the Powersports Industry
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In this episode of High Velocity Radio, Lee interviews Ryan Hardwick, co-founder of Mountain Motorsports and professional race car driver. Ryan shares his journey from riding dirt bikes as a child to building one of the Southeast’s largest powersports retailers. He discusses the company’s growth through acquisitions, the importance of core values and team culture, and draws parallels between racing and business leadership. Ryan also highlights trends in off-road vehicles and invites listeners to upcoming racing events, offering insights into entrepreneurship, teamwork, and the powersports industry.

Founded in 1999 by lifelong friends Ryan Hardwick and Justin Price, Mountain Motorsports began as a single-line Honda dealership in East Tennessee. Since then, it has grown into one of the nation’s largest powersports retailers, operating 12 dealerships across the Southeast, including five locations in the greater Atlanta area.

Mountain Motorsports remains family-owned and operated, and represents numerous of the world’s leading powersports brands offering motorcycles, ATVs, UTVs, and personal watercraft all under one roof. Guided by the motto “Greatly Exceed Expectations,” the organization continually reinvests in its people and communities, fostering long-term customer relationships through exceptional service, expert training, and community engagement.

In addition to his work with Mountain Motorsports, he is a professional endurance racer, racing for Manthey Racing’s Porsche 912 team, recently became the first Atlantan to win the 24 Hours of Le Mans in the LMGT3 Division, which is the largest and most difficult class, and cemented his legacy by becoming the first American to win the FIA World Endurance Championship in the LMGT3 Division.

For his efforts in the final race of the season, he was awarded the Goodyear Wingfoot Award, given to the race’s MVP across all divisions.

Connect with Ryan on LinkedIn and Facebook.

What You’ll Learn In This Episode

  • Ryan Hardwick’s journey from childhood dirt bike riding to professional racing and entrepreneurship.
  • The founding and growth of Mountain Motorsports as a major powersports vehicle retailer.
  • The range of products offered by Mountain Motorsports, including motorcycles, personal watercraft, and off-road utility vehicles.
  • Insights into entrepreneurship, including the challenges and rewards of starting and running a business.
  • The importance of leadership, team dynamics, and company culture in both racing and business.
  • The development and significance of core values in guiding business decisions and team interactions.
  • The strategic approach to business expansion through acquisitions and partnerships.
  • Market trends in the powersports industry, particularly the growth of off-road utility vehicles.
  • The parallels between racing teams and business teams in terms of teamwork and precision.
  • Upcoming professional racing events and the excitement surrounding endurance racing.

Transcript-iconThis transcript is machine transcribed by Sonix.

 

TRANSCRIPT

Intro: Broadcasting live from the Business RadioX studios in Atlanta, Georgia. It’s time for High Velocity Radio.

Lee Kantor: Lee Kantor here. Another episode of High Velocity Radio, and this is going to be a good one. Today on the show we have Ryan Hardwick with Mountain Motorsports and Professional Racing. Welcome.

Ryan Hardwick: Hi. How’s it going?

Lee Kantor: I am doing well. I am excited to learn what you’re up to. Tell us a little bit about Mountain Motorsports and professional racing.

Ryan Hardwick: Yeah, two very exciting worlds. A lot of similarities and some differences. But Mountain Motorsports is we are one of the largest retailers of powersports vehicles in the world, powersports vehicles being motorcycles both on road and off road, personal watercraft like jet skis and also off road utility vehicles, you know, like Polaris Rangers and Can-Am ATVs. So all of the fun things, you know, people use to have adventures and explore the great outdoors. And we’re headquartered here in Atlanta, Georgia, and currently have 11 dealership locations around the Southeastern United States representing all of the top brands you know, in the industry, all the Japanese brands, as well as several brands you know, from Europe, like like Ducati and KTM and and also American brands like Polaris and Canadian brands like Can-Am. But so we’re a multi-line dealership, you know, with, uh, you know, lots of locations but all focused around fun and the outdoors.

Lee Kantor: So what was what was kind of the genesis of the idea? When did like, did it start with motorcycles? Like where did it what was kind of how it began? The origin story?

Ryan Hardwick: Yeah. It’s, uh, it started with motorcycles of me growing up with my dad. My, uh, my father raced dirt bikes, uh, just on the amateur, you know, level. He was never professional, but, uh, he enjoyed racing dirt bikes. So from like age four, I was, I was riding and dirt bikes with him. And then by age six I was racing and really just kind of grew up on two wheels in the woods with my dad. He got my best friend into it a young age, and so we really just kind of grew up on dirt bikes and loved them, and it was how we spent time together as a family, really. And so I, you know, I followed that passion, as you know, throughout school, I, I was racing and, you know, kind of rising through the ranks and, and eventually that’s how we got into the dealership. But it started with that, you know, that that love and passion of the sport. So, you know, you always hear do what you love and you’ll never work a day in your life. For me and my best friend that was learning to ride, you know, with my dad and I, the two of us become we’re lifelong business partners. We started Mountain Motorsports together. We we started the business when we were 19 years old, opened our first dealership at 20 years old. So when our doors open. And that was 25 years ago. So we’ve been in business together for more than half of our lives. And it’s a lot of it’s a heck of a lot of fun. You know, we’re still just a couple. Couple of young guys that enjoy riding dirt bikes.

Lee Kantor: So what was it like, though, transitioning to being a business owner? Because that’s a you know, that’s a sport of its own. Being an entrepreneur, can you talk about, you know, kind of some of the things you learned or lessons learned or advice you would give other people who are passionate about something and were able to turn their, you know, their hobby or their passion into, you know, a business.

Ryan Hardwick: Yeah. I mean, first and foremost, for anyone who’s on that path in that road, I think it’s I think personally it’s one of the best things you can choose to do in life is to go into business for yourself. Um, it’s not for everybody. Um, and it doesn’t mean, you know, you’re you’re you’re not cut out for great things. I mean, being a valuable team member is also, uh, not the easiest thing in the world to do either. Um, but in my opinion, uh, if you if you have the guts. Really? And the bravery to go your own way and start something yourself. Uh, the world of entrepreneurship can be very rewarding, not only just financially, but just, you know, personally and professionally. You know, I, I’ve just always enjoyed, um, being in a leadership role. Uh, I’ve enjoyed, you know, guiding other people. I’ve enjoyed sharing, you know, from my experiences what I’ve learned. And, and, you know, we do that within our businesses and, you know, within our dealerships. And so, um, I think it’s a great way to spend, you know, your, uh, your career, um, if you really enjoy, you know, creating something. Right? You know, um, it’s, uh, there’s there’s not, I would say only childbirth. You know, I, I’m blessed with two amazing sons and, uh, you know, the feeling of, you know, raising two, two boys in this world and seeing them grow and seeing them develop is very similar to the feeling I get, you know, creating a new business, uh, that didn’t exist before, you know, we were there and seeing it grow and thrive and seeing our team members grow and thrive. And, you know, themselves, you know, buy new houses for their families and new cars and, uh, you know, it’s it’s just very personally rewarding. So I’d highly recommend it. Um, not for everybody, but, uh, you know, if you have the guts, uh, I’d highly recommend you to take the joke.

Lee Kantor: Now, when you were growing up and you were racing that obviously you’re the one that’s on the bike while the race is going on, but it takes kind of a team to get you on the bike. Uh, can you talk about maybe some similarities in being an athlete on a, on a team like that as it is to kind of okay, now you walk into your dealership and now you have a team around you and you’re leading that. Can you talk about similarities from those two worlds?

Ryan Hardwick: Yeah, I think that the similarities you’re drawing there is, uh, quite a bit much more connected to the racing I’m doing now, later in life. Um, I’m racing professionally for Porsche, um, in the World Endurance Championship and the, the largest, uh, sports car endurance races around the world that this sport, uh, automotive racing it it requires, uh, a tremendous amount of people to make one race car go around the racetrack. Um, and so when you tune in and that’s any kind of auto racing. So if you’re watching, you know, the Daytona 500 and NASCAR or the Indianapolis 500 or Formula One or what, we do a race like the 24 Hours of Le Mans, you’re going to see lots of race cars out there going around a track together, and each one of those cars are backed by, at the minimum, somewhere around 30 ish people at the maximum can be upwards of a hundred people per car in what it takes to make that car go around. And these people are mechanics engineers. There’s logistics people. There’s people who are focused only on, you know, tires, uh, preparation wheels. So there’s there’s so many people it takes to make a race car go around, and there’s only one guy that gets to drive it, right. You know? So a lot of the times the drivers get, you know, a lot of the credit and and things like that. That’s who you see up on the podium at the end of the race. But there’s a tremendous amount of people behind the scenes that make it work.

Ryan Hardwick: Um, and there’s a lot of similarities to running a business, right? You know, in our dealerships, we have between 30 and 50 people at each dealership location. And we’re we’re at 11 now with, uh, 12 as under construction. And 13 is on the way shortly after that, uh, in the coming years and, and, you know, having, you know, you know, 30 to 40, 50 people at each one of those locations is, uh, yeah, it’s a lot of people all working together for, you know, what we try to make as one common goal. And that’s the same way a race team works, right? You know, if one person, let’s say, the guy who his job is to change the tires, if this guy makes one mistake in one tire change, and for us, it’s like a 24 hour race. It can totally ruin the race for where a driver, we’re we’re competing on track for tenths and sometimes one hundredths of a second. And if we drop the tire gun or we’re just, we’re just, frankly, 3 to 4 seconds too slow on the tire change that takes the driver to make up 3 to 4 seconds. That can take hours and hours in the race when you’re only, you know, you’re you’re only chipping away at it at a 10th at a time. So, uh, endurance racing is the ultimate team sport. I truly believe, you know, and, uh, and, you know, entrepreneurship and running a running a small to medium sized business is, uh, right up there, you know, as well.

Lee Kantor: Now, can you share maybe. I don’t know if there are similarities, but obviously choosing the right people to become part of the team that buy into the mission and the culture. Are there any suggestions on how to kind of vet people to make sure they are the right fit, and they are going to kind of buy into that culture because like you said, you know, in your world, milliseconds count. Uh, so there’s no nothing too small to kind of pay attention to.

Ryan Hardwick: Yeah. Um, you know, culture, uh, culture matters. I mean, it’s tremendous in any in any team, um, you know, sport or in any business. You know, I can tell you from our business standpoint at Mountain Motorsports, we really did a much better job, I would say, in the latter half of our existence, um, the first half of our existence, we had, um, we had a mission statement, you know, and we had a, you know, uh, you know, set of rules and, you know, employee handbooks and those things. But these types of things are what most businesses have, and they’re not really culture derived. Um, in the latter half of our business, you know, we learn from others that came before us that were doing it better than us. Um, but we developed, uh, after a lot of time and, and hard work, uh, we developed a set of core values that we really lives by. We. Really? It’s it’s what drives the business. It drives our hiring decisions. It drives our hiring decisions. Um, it drives how we interact with our customers, how we interact with our vendors. And, and, you know, defining a set of core values that are shared, that are listed there, there at Mount Motorsports, there on the wall, you know, for everyone to read and see. You know, our in our employee meetings, we talk about them, you know, daily, weekly, um, we make every decision, you know, based on this set of shared core values. And, um, you know, so I encourage you, if you’re a business, you don’t have a set of core values that you share with all your employees and your teammates. Um, you need to work on developing it because it sure does make every decision. And, you know, operating the business and running the business together, uh, a heck of a lot easier.

Lee Kantor: So what are some of the core values at Mount?

Ryan Hardwick: You know, these are unique to every business, right? You know, at Mountain Motorsports, a lot of it is defined from, you know, the founders, right? You know, from myself and my best friend, uh, Justin Price. You know, we looked at what is how do we live our lives, right? You know. And what is it that we, um, you know, that we believe in? That is just the correct and right way to live. You know, I’ll I’ll give you one of ours is we do what’s right. Uh, all of the time, even when no one is looking, you know. And, yeah, that’s easy to say, but if you really think about it and do it, I mean, to really apply that to everything in your life, uh, whether it be family, relationships, um, you know, how you treat your friends, uh, you know, and especially how you treat your customers and your teammates is you just you just do the right thing. When you’re faced with a challenge, you do the right thing. And even when no one’s looking, and even if you could possibly get away with it, nobody’s really gonna know. We still do the right thing, even if it costs us money, even if it costs us, you know, profit.

Ryan Hardwick: Uh, we do what’s right, you know? And we believe that if you do what’s right over and over, you know, good things tend to, you know, come back to you. Um, another one for us is competitiveness. We live to compete. That is our core value. I mean, obviously come from racing my whole life. I think competition is good. I love it. Uh, I love to win. I hate to lose. And we bring that as a part of our business. You know, we compete on everything. We measure ourselves. Uh, we measure ourselves against our competitors. We measure ourselves against ourselves. All of our different dealerships are always competing against each other. And we like to know who’s the best, who’s on top, who wins, who loses. We keep score, we keep track, and we reward winning. And, um, we we we we condone failure. We don’t like it, but we, you know, someone does have to lose in competition, right? Um, but, uh, yeah, we love to compete and we play to win. And, uh, that’s another important core value for us.

Lee Kantor: Now, when it comes to the business and growing the business, um, what, um, where did the opportunity start bubbling up like you expanded obviously, from motorcycles to all kinds of motor sports. Was that kind of a gradual thing? Or, you know, when a new thing was invented, you’re like, okay, well, that we should be selling some of those as well. Like, how did you kind of capitalize on this trend?

Ryan Hardwick: No, it’s much more a bit more complicated than that. We’re very similar to, uh, we’re extremely similar to automotive dealerships. So, as you know, if you, uh, are able to grant it from, say, Ford to open a Ford dealership, those are licensed and franchised dealerships, right? Not anyone can open a Ford dealership. You have to apply. You have to be approved by Ford. There has to be an open territory for you to open a Ford dealership. And basically that comes at the control of the manufacturer. So for us, uh, we represent now we represent 12 different manufacturers. They’re all the top manufacturers in our industry. But we sure didn’t start that way. You know, we we began life as a single line Honda dealership. We were approved for a Honda dealership, uh, very close to my hometown where I grew up, uh, in East Tennessee. Um, and, uh, and that’s how we started, uh, we applied for and got approval. And it was a very competitive process. This was in the late 1990s. Um, the Honda did have a open point, is what they called it. So, uh, an area, a geographical area near our hometown where they were lacking sales in their current dealer network, and they assigned an open availability and were accepting applications for anyone, uh, you know, who could own and operate a motorcycle dealership in that area. And so that’s how we started life. We applied. There were thousands of people, I’d say thousands. There were hundreds of people that applied, uh, you know, at that time to, you know, have a Honda dealership, most of which were people who already had Honda dealerships, and they were trying to open their second or third one.

Ryan Hardwick: And, um, and our application was approved after there’s several layers. You have to go out and do a live in-person interview and, um, uh, myself, my business partner, we were young guys, you know, full of passion. Um, I was currently a student at the University of Tennessee. I was I was going to business school at the time, so I hadn’t even graduated college. Uh, but, you know, I was passionate studying. We, you know, we came from racing. We told our story of how we grew up with our father and, you know, loving, you know, these machines and dirt bikes and how we wanted to share, you know, that passion. And I think we just stuck out from our age, right. And our in our passion. And, uh, we went out and we, uh, obtained a really good partner, uh, to help us start the business. Who, uh, the guy was, uh, he owned the Yamaha and Kawasaki dealership in our hometown, and we were customers of his. We we that’s where our family, you know, bought motorcycles and jet skis and and we convinced him that. Hey, man, you know, you should be our partner. Uh, because, honestly, it was a prerequisite from Honda. You you they weren’t going to grant a dealership to a couple of, you know, 20 year old kids who had it never, you know, owned or operated any business in their entire life. Uh, so, uh, we had to have a partner who had to have a minimum of 25% equity in the business, uh, that had previous dealership ownership or general management experience. And that’s where our partner Charlie came in.

Ryan Hardwick: Uh, so there were three of us there to start, you know, that business. And, uh, and they approved us. You know, they approved us. And, you know, that was in 1999, and we were off to the races with construction and opened our first store in 2000. And how we grew, uh, in just like an automobile, automobile landscape, you can’t just choose to put a, you know, a Ford or a Chevrolet or a Honda or Yamaha dealership anywhere you would like. Most of the dealer network is built out across the United States of America. And so now to expand, to go from one dealership to two to 3 to 4, you have to do it through acquisition. So we had to become able and willing to be able to reach out and, and uh, you know, acquire, our competitors or dealers that were currently in the marketplace that were maybe looking to retire or just looking to sell their business. So, um, we’re we were essentially over 25 years. We became quite a regional consolidator of motorcycle dealerships. Um, to create our 11 dealerships we have now, we’ve had to make 26 acquisitions. So we would go in to a market that may have 2 or 3 motorcycle dealerships, each having 1 or 2 franchise brands. And we would go make deals to acquire, uh, all three in that market, and then we would combine them into one location. Uh, so each of our dealerships are really large facilities that have, you know, ten, 11 or 12 different, uh, brands within them. So, uh, we would combine smaller dealerships into larger ones, um, all around the southeast.

Lee Kantor: Now, how did the boats and the, um, you know, the other kind of water sport? Stuff.

Ryan Hardwick: Intertwined. That’s.

Lee Kantor: Is that the same? Is it the same rule like that? You like just anybody can’t sell a boat. They have to, you know, kind of be a licensed boat salesperson.

Ryan Hardwick: If you want to sell a new one, I guess you could. There’s a lot of less rules if you want to open a pre-owned, you know, boat or Marina dealership. But if you want to be a franchised retailer or the new, uh, manufacturer brands, um, yeah. You have to be approved by the, the original manufacturer.

Lee Kantor: So then does that do you have to like, is your locations near water all the time or some of the time.

Ryan Hardwick: No, we’re not with all of our markets are yes, close to water, but our locations don’t have to be on the water per se. So we’re more we like to be located more convenient for our customers. So most of our locations are like right on major interstate highways or, you know, major, you know, thoroughfare, you know, roadways. So like here in Atlanta, we’re on the Cobb Parkway in Marietta. We have locations on Interstate 20. Um, we have, you know, locations in Roswell and up in Buford. So we’re around the lakes, like in Atlanta, for example. We have dealerships close by to Lake Allatoona, Lake Lanier, and also Lake Oconee. Uh, so all of the watercraft that we sell, it’s convenient, uh, you know, for, like, the people traveling and stuff to those lakes to stop in, uh, for any service or maintenance needs they may have. Um, uh, yeah, but we’re not necessarily right on the water. That’s a little less convenient to get to for everybody.

Lee Kantor: And then you sell new and used.

Ryan Hardwick: Yes, sir.

Lee Kantor: On on all your brands.

Ryan Hardwick: Yep.

Lee Kantor: And so what do you need more of? How can we help you? You have locations right now in Georgia, Alabama and Tennessee. Uh, is that the plan to just keep expanding from that base?

Ryan Hardwick: Yeah, we just we we really like the southeastern United States. We’ve had opportunities to expand elsewhere in the country. We just for our industry, you know, it’s, uh, it’s more enjoyable to do these things and relatively warmer climates. You know, we we like areas with lakes. We like areas with public riding areas, you know, for all our off road vehicles. Um, and we love areas with, you know, awesome, you know, twisty, you know, pavement roads. Right. For all the on road motorcycles. So, you know, East Tennessee, North Georgia, you know, you know, uh, western Alabama, these are these are great markets for, you know, our products. So, uh, yeah, our, you know, uh, growth and expansion plans are centered, uh, not necessarily just in those three states that we currently are now, but around the southeastern United States.

Lee Kantor: Right. So I would imagine people in adjacent states are driving in to get to see the large selection and all the cities you offer them.

Ryan Hardwick: Yeah, we do. We pull in a lot of customers, especially from the Carolinas. Um, our Tennessee stores sell quite a bit into Kentucky, you know, to the north and Virginia, um, but, uh, uh, yeah, the state of Florida is very well covered. And, you know, dealer network, we don’t have a lot of people come up from Florida, but, uh, yeah, Tennessee, Georgia, the Carolinas, Alabama. Uh, yeah. We’re we’re we’re we’re the largest around for sure.

Lee Kantor: Now is the trend. Are you seeing more kind of motorcycle, uh, sales or versus kind of water? Uh, crafts.

Ryan Hardwick: It’s off road. Off road is really growing. Um, you know, both in the not really the ATVs, but the larger utility vehicles. I don’t know if you’re familiar with, like, the Polaris, uh, Ranger and Razor, um, you know, the Can-Am Maverick that these, you know, off road vehicles that are essentially kind of like small jeeps, but much more, uh, you know, uh, sophisticated, uh, suspension and, uh, and even powertrains and transmissions. So really off road capable vehicles that you can enjoy with multiple people. I mean, some of them seat like six people in them. So you can take your whole family and, you know, go camping and go off roading and, uh, you know, go up in the mountains. And so it’s a tremendously fun sport. And we’re seeing a lot of growth in that area.

Lee Kantor: So if somebody wants to learn more, have more substantive conversation with somebody on the team, what’s the website? What’s the best way to connect? And also maybe the best way to follow you in your racing.

Ryan Hardwick: Yeah. Uh Mountain Motorsports. Com. I mean, if you just do a simple Google search for Mountain Motorsports or, you know, largest retailer of motorcycles in the southeast, you’re we’re easy to find. And, uh, like I say, yeah, uh, several locations in Tennessee, Georgia and Alabama. Um, yeah. And then on the racing front, uh, currently this year I’m racing in North America’s leading championship, uh, which is called the IMSA WeatherTech Championship. Uh, we just finished our first race of the year. It’s the Rolex 24 in Daytona. Um, and next up for us is the 12 Hours of Sebring. Uh, another really grueling, uh, long endurance race in Florida. And we actually finished our championship in October, uh, here in Atlanta, uh, the Petit Le Mans at Road Atlanta. So it’s a ten hour endurance race. Awesome. Awesome event up in Braselton. Uh, if you’ve never had the chance to go. I mean, it’s an amazing time to come out with your family. Uh, you can get really close to the cars. Uh, just a general admission ticket. You can get down into the paddock, uh, and see all the teams and the the the pit road and the, you know, uh, all the, you know, tire changes and pit changes. You can see them all really up close and personal. Uh, a lot closer you can get than, like, a NASCAR or Indy car race. So, um, I’d love to invite anybody in the Atlanta area to come out to the petite Mama in October. It’s an amazing event, and I’ll be racing in it. Uh, in the number 912, uh, factory Manthey Porsche.

Lee Kantor: Good stuff. Well, thank you so much for sharing your story.

Ryan Hardwick: Yeah. Appreciate you having me on.

Lee Kantor: All right. This is Lee Kantor. We’ll see you all next time on High Velocity Radio.

Exploring Personal and Team Development Through Favorite Films: A Unique Approach to Building Trust and Understanding in the Workplace

by

Atlanta Business Radio
Atlanta Business Radio
Exploring Personal and Team Development Through Favorite Films: A Unique Approach to Building Trust and Understanding in the Workplace
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In this episode of Atlanta Business Radio, Lee interviews Bryan Coley, founder of REEL Experiences. Bryan shares how his program uses people’s favorite movies as a tool for personal and team development in business settings. By exploring movie themes, characters, and stories, teams gain deeper self-awareness, empathy, and connection. Bryan discusses the program’s origins, its impact on leadership and organizational culture, and how movies foster authentic conversations. He also introduces new virtual offerings and reflects on analyzing Oscar-nominated films as cultural indicators, emphasizing the power of storytelling to inspire growth and understanding in the workplace.

Bryan Coley is a graduate from NYU Film School and the founder of Reel Experiences, a company that helps people and teams see themselves and each other more clearly through their favorite moves.

He discovered that people could gain insights and change their lives based on their top 10 movies. Reel Experiences works with businesses to help develop their employees and teams.

Prior to REEL Experiences, Coley founded Art Within, a nonprofit organization with the goal to integrate faith and art in order to impact contemporary culture.

With 30+ years of storytelling experience, he is a skilled screenwriter and film director. He lives in Marietta, Georgia, with his wife and two children.

Connect with Bryan on LinkedIn and Facebook.

What You’ll Learn In This Episode

  • The use of favorite movies as a tool for personal and team development.
  • The evolution of REEL Experiences from assisting screenwriters to corporate team-building.
  • Benefits of the program in fostering team cohesion, leadership development, and organizational culture.
  • Customization of sessions to meet specific corporate needs, including DEI initiatives.
  • Structure of a typical session, including discovery and personal storytelling components.
  • The significance of participants’ movie choices in revealing personal insights and team dynamics.
  • The role of movies in facilitating difficult conversations and enhancing empathy among team members.
  • Introduction of new initiatives like “Reel Everywhere” for remote engagement.
  • Brian’s analysis of Oscar-nominated films as reflections of societal themes and cultural currents.

Transcript-iconThis transcript is machine transcribed by Sonix.

 

TRANSCRIPT

Intro: Broadcasting live from the Business RadioX studio in Atlanta, Georgia. It’s time for Atlanta Business Radio, brought to you by Kennesaw State University’s Executive MBA program. The accelerated degree program for working professionals looking to advance their career and enhance their leadership skills. And now, here’s your host.

Lee Kantor: Lee Kantor here, another episode of Atlanta Business Radio. And this is going to be a good one. But before we get started, it’s important to recognize our sponsor, CSU’s executive MBA program. Without them, we wouldn’t be sharing these important stories. Today on this show, we have the founder of REEL Experiences, Bryan Coley. Welcome.

Bryan Coley: Thanks for having me. Yeah, it’s great to be here.

Lee Kantor: Well, I’m excited to learn what you’re up to. Tell us about REEL experiences. How you serving folks?

Bryan Coley: Yeah. So REEL.

Came out as a happy accident. Uh, I spent most of my career in story and media arts and mainly working with story makers. So screenwriters, playwrights. And part of the way that we would help screenwriters and playwrights find the script that they could only write was we’d ask them what moved them and quickly that became their favorite movies. And so over time, we would use their favorite movies as a means of finding themes and connections in their movies that they should write about. Well, fast forward several years. I ended up making a movie. I am in the edit suite, kind of bored out of my mind working on, uh, editing a movie, and I decided to take these methods that we were using with writers and use it with just average, everyday people, and it kind of blew up. People were literally changing their lives based on the insights that they were finding in their movies. And so then it was like an oil well spewing out of different ways to look into their movies and ask questions and then different audiences that we served. So we first started serving marrieds and all kinds of nonprofit, like small groups and veterans coming back from war. And then eventually a friend of mine brought his team, his chick fil A team in, and we changed over to a for profit. And that was about nine years ago. And we’ve been working with all kinds of companies and government organizations, nonprofits, churches, all kinds of staffs, helping people see each other more clearly through the power of their favorite movies.

Lee Kantor: So how does it work in, uh, kind of in a business setting? So what is kind of the challenge the business is having where going through this exercise would be useful?

Bryan Coley: Yeah, most of the time people come to us because they’re going through change. Maybe it’s a new team leader, new team members or reorg, things like that in which they’re trying to figure out, how do we get to the work faster? Yet we know there’s this period of time of formation in which we need to establish trust. We need to understand each other’s stories. We need to be able to create a environment and a team culture. And so we’re really we had one team leader tell us that we do what would take six months. We do that in a day. So we kind of accelerate that time in which you’re trying to connect and and form as a team. Although I will say that we do all kinds of real experiences, we’ve been able to customize so many real experiences over the years based on the needs that corporations have. Like, for example, we help, uh, you know, teams be able to understand their brand through their movies or understand their vision and values. Um, we’ve done Dei experiences where we help people see and be able to share their story that maybe, you know, they wouldn’t be able to share without their movies, uh, kind of standing in for them and allowing them to tell their story. And then we’ve done all kinds of leadership experiences. Uh, helping people understand what kind of leaders they are. Helping them understand what triggers them to frustration. All kinds of ways in which movies are visual articulations. Uh, visual articulations of what? Um, maybe is, uh, going on with them as far as their growth, their personal growth, their leadership growth. And then ultimately their team development as well.

Lee Kantor: So what what does it look like when you’re in one of your sessions, or one of your experiences with a team or an individual, like is it is the starting point always like kind of your top, your favorite movies or the most impactful movies, or however you frame the list?

Bryan Coley: Yeah. Good question. I mean, usually people are like, I kind of get it, but what exactly are you doing? And so, uh, we have an app that team members submit their favorite movies, and it usually for the non movie lover, it helps them figure out what their top ten movies are for the movie lover. It helps them narrow it down and and so that’s done prior to the experience. And then in the experience, we have two halves of what we do. They’re usually the same no matter what we’re exploring. The first half is just what we call discovery, where we’re asking you questions about your movies, and that’s usually really dynamic. You’re rotating with different team members. It’s really fun. And you’re looking at trailers. Maybe you’re looking at clips and you’re really focused on the movie and just what the movie is telling you, or answering questions about the movie. And then we do a Jedi mind trick about halfway through in which we’re like, hey, maybe these insights that you’ve captured about your your movie characters actually have something to do with you. And so the second half of our experience is really diving into, you know, what, these movies and your story, how they intersect and ways in which, you know, those intersection kind of allow you to be seen more clearly by your team members.

Lee Kantor: So when you’re doing the first part, it’s kind of you’re just like your favorite ten movie. So you don’t say like my favorite ten comedies or it’s just general. What is kind of the broad, you know, my Mount Rushmore of ten movies?

Bryan Coley: Exactly. Yeah. A lot of people who are movie lovers, it’s really frustrating because they’re like, you gotta narrow it down to ten. Um, but, uh, you know, it really forms a palette. I call it like, a palette of parables that are just yours. So believe it or not, Lee, we have seen over 6000 top ten movie lists at this point, and not a single one has ever been the same. And we just believe that just speaks to your thumbprint being on your movies. And and one of the things we love about reel is that, you know, um, a lot of times people may use movies as illustrations for their points or, you know, they may have a keynote in which they add some movie clips or something like that. But what we try to do is we try to allow people to bring themselves to the table. So when you bring your movies to the table, it’s like you’re bringing a piece of yourself to the table. And so it’s not top down. It’s like a bottom up perspective. So even an experiment like, you know, a reel experience, like, uh, defining your vision and values, uh, allowing your team members to actually show you what they believe are expressions of your values or expressions of your mission. Um, is just so beautiful. Whenever you’re looking this wide range of the way people are showing you what you know, the company’s brand is or something like that.

Bryan Coley: So just really a way for people to bring something that connects to them, connects to their heart, connects to makes them laugh, you know, moves them to all kinds of different ways, whether it’s just entertainment, but it’s connected to them and they’re able to, you know, bring that to the table versus, you know, we had a a head of innovation, um, from a company. And he came and said, I want to, you know, do the real experience based on innovation. And I want you to show Apollo 13 and he gave me these all list of, of movies. And I said, well, you don’t need me for that. You just need a DVD player. But if you want me, then let’s bring your team in and bring their top ten movies in. And let’s ask them what’s the best image of innovation in their top ten movies. And so we would tease that out and make it into an experience where everybody has their own brand of innovation, you know, through their movies. And so it’s just a great expression of people having a sense of their thumbprint on whatever thematic or, or whatever, uh, we call it lens that we’re looking into in their movies.

Lee Kantor: Now, when you do this exercise, are you getting kind of the person’s best self in terms of how they want to present themselves? Like, are they going to really say saw four was my, you know, favorite movie?

Bryan Coley: We have had all four. I’m sure I’m not. You know, the day that I was really wondering whether it would happen and we had, you know, 50 Shades of Gray come through the door, and I was like, okay, well, here we go, you know? And it ended up being, you know, very insightful, believe it or not. Um, but yeah. So, you know, just last week, I had a group of C-suite executives from a company that’s been almost everybody there had been in the company for like over 20 years. And one of the guys was presenting, and his character that he identified with was Happy Gilmore, and he was just apologizing and apologizing the whole time, going, oh my gosh, there’s nothing here for me like, this is ridiculous that I pick Happy Gilmore. You know, like, you know, it’s just, you know, I just love comedies, that kind of thing. Well, the more we dived into it, he was totally Happy Gilmore and everybody on that team was like, this makes total sense now. Like, you are that person who, you know, like, our company tends to be the golf course, you know, like, and the golf culture. And you’re that guy who is bringing your hockey stick into that culture and like really being able to be authentic within that culture. And it just made him feel like, oh my gosh, yeah, this is me, you know, and and so even a movie like Happy Gilmore, I love because it’s like, you know, the the person was like, no, you’re not gonna find anything here. And I’m like, well, let’s just see. And sure enough, all of his team members were rallying around and celebrating the fact that he was Happy Gilmore.

Lee Kantor: So when you’re doing the exercise, are you at some point kind of honing in on the character, or is it maybe the director’s perspective, like, what is the kind of the the, um, focus point when you’re trying to to kind of, um, find that, you know, where is it the heart of what makes it their favorite?

Bryan Coley: Yeah, exactly. So our questions, you know, we’ve we’ve spent years and years designing questions that, you know, are just these set of questions that really we know the articulation of them and the follow up for them as far as facilitating really allow us to kind of bring out a person’s story. So for example, our character question, you know, we have four lenses that we do for what we call storyboard, which is pretty much our bread and butter. It’s the one that most teams go through. And they look through four different lenses. So they’ll look through the lens of character, they’ll look through the lens of desire, they’ll look through the lens of conflict or antagonism, and then they’ll look through the lens of change. And each of those, you know, we have questions that we’re asking the person. So for example, with character, we’re asking, you know, what character do you like and resonate with most. And then we’re exploring what are the heroic traits of that character. And so it’s all designed based on the way the person looks at the character. So for example, we might have a person who comes through and they’re looking at, uh, you know, a, let’s say a Top Gun Maverick or Maverick in Top Gun and you’ll have someone in one breakout room who talks about the heroic traits of of Maverick.

Bryan Coley: And then maybe somebody in the other room picked the same character. And when they come out and they do their presentations, they’re totally different because of the way that they look at that character. So we’re always trying to find what we call the specificity of how you look at, uh, your movies and how you look at those characters. Um, and so whenever we look at those four lenses, we’re looking at who you are. What you want is, is the desire lens, uh, what comes against you, like, you know, the lies that come in the internal struggle of the character. How is that possibly, maybe an internal struggle that you might have. And then, um, and then those keys to growth and change that are a part of every story we look at. What are those keys to growth and change for you as well. And that forms what we call your storyboard, which is, you know, drawing out those key elements of your story to be able to share with your team.

Lee Kantor: Now, one of my favorite movies is Pulp Fiction. Um, and what I like about that, I think, is just more about the structure and more Quentin Tarantino than any given character in there. His storytelling, the dialog, the pacing, the visuals, those kind of things are what makes it what I believe. One of my favorites, as opposed to any given character within the story.

Bryan Coley: Yeah, usually what happens is we hear that a lot. You know, where people say, well, I just picked this because, you know, like it makes me laugh or I pick this because I remember seeing this with my father when we were growing up. Or I picked this because, you know, it was a special movie that, you know, my wife and I when we were dating or something like that. And so different reasons and even technical reasons, like you’re saying. But ironically enough, what’s crazy is because you have ten movies, somehow that movie, like a movie like Pulp Fiction, you won’t expect it, but it’ll have something totally to do with another movie on your top ten, either thematically or something else that that you weren’t even expecting. We see that all the time. We call it the preponderance of evidence, because suddenly within your movies, you don’t just see one character who’s like something or who has a desire or who has an internal struggle. You start to see that, you know, there’s five characters in your top ten who have a similar internal struggle, you know, and so it creates that preponderance of evidence going, yeah, you know, like possibly this may be, you know, a part of your story.

Lee Kantor: So that’s why it’s important for you to have ten. That wasn’t just like, oh, I’m doing top ten. But like if you were to pick one or 2 or 4, that’s not enough data to kind of see a trend.

Bryan Coley: Exactly. Yeah. You know, oftentimes people are like, well, here’s my favorite movie. Now tell me everything about me. And I’m like, well, um, first of all, I’m not a tarot card reader. And second of all, you know, I want to hear what you think of this movie. And then third of all, you know, I’d love to surprise you with the fact that there’s probably connections within your movies. You know, um, there’s a game on the New York Times. I don’t know if you’ve ever played connections in the New York Times games and it, you know, has 16 words and you’re trying to figure out what four groups, four groups of four words go together. And then what’s the connection between those four words? And that’s sort of the way people’s top ten movies are. Is there this just like group of connections that you’re trying to find, what are the threads and patterns and connections between, uh, these movies that really are meaningful, um, to the person who suddenly sees them and is surprised by them, you know?

Lee Kantor: So is there a story that you can share about a team that’s gone through this experience and then maybe got an unexpected, uh, benefit from having done the real experience?

Bryan Coley: Yeah. I mean.

Lee Kantor: Obviously don’t don’t name the name of the yeah, the company, but maybe share the challenge that they were trying to work through and how you were able to help them.

Bryan Coley: Yeah. Um, I love that question because it actually happens every single real experience. But I’ll share the one that I love to tell the most. Um, and that is, uh, there was a leader, and I usually do a pre-brief meeting before every real experience, and I asked the leader, so tell me, your people, each one of them, and tell me what your development goals are for your people. And so she she was telling me about this one guy on the team and he just, you know, had been with the company about 15 years and he just could not, uh, well, she couldn’t get him to see that he could be a mentor on the team. Like there was something blocking him where he just didn’t see himself as a mentor. And, uh, so that was her development goal was for him to see himself as someone who could be a mentor on the team, uh, based on his years of experience. So we get to real and we get into the real experience. And he has a lot of films that are just fun films. You know, a lot of, you know, National Lampoon vacation and European vacation, you know, and all these kind of fun comedies. And we get to the to the part where he’s presenting, and he gets up and he presents his character, he presents his desire, and then he gets to the conflict lens, which is really him expressing like, what is the lies that a character would believe if you were a bad guy, what would you be telling this character? And so he reads these lies which are like, you are all washed up, like, you know, the industry has moved on without you.

Bryan Coley: Uh, you are, you know, just old and and you, you know, uh, don’t have any relevance, uh, anymore. And so, obviously, the next question I usually ask is, well, you know, what’s the movie? And he goes, well, it’s, it’s anchorman. And he said, it’s that moment where Ron Burgundy is in that telephone booth and he’s thinking, you know, all of they have women anchor women now, you know, and it’s the industry’s moved on. And, you know, he’s a relic. And, uh, you know, his whole life is falling apart because the industry is changing. And, um, and he no longer feels relevant. And so, you know, the natural next question is, well, so how does this intersect with you? Like, how is this maybe the way a bad guy wants to take you out? And he says, well, I mean, look at me.

Bryan Coley: He says, and look at them. And he points to his team and his team. He says, they’re all a bunch of, you know, uh, Gen Zers and millennials. And here I am, this old guy like I, you know, I feel like the industry has moved on without me. I feel like I’m no longer relevant. I feel like, you know, like I’m the old guy in the room. And of course, what happens in that moment is all of his, you know, Gen Z millennial, uh, teammates rush in and, you know, immediately in that moment say, oh my gosh, no, you have so much to offer us. You know, like, we need you, you know, like you’re not old, you’re not a relic. And and so in that moment, what happened was exactly what the team leader wanted, uh, which was for him to see that his team really wanted him to be a mentor and that he could be one for them. And it all came from Ron Burgundy and Anchorman, you know? So that’s the reason I love telling that story is because, yeah, it changed the team and it changed the team dynamic. And it happened in such an unexpected, surprising way through anchorman.

Lee Kantor: And it’s I mean, to the heart of what you’re doing is you’re you’re enabling kind of layered conversations with people who probably wouldn’t have these conversations if there wasn’t a safe frame to have the conversations.

Bryan Coley: Yeah, that’s a great way to say it. I mean, that’s that’s perfection right there. That is exactly the way I would say it is. I I’ve seen it over time that the movie characters are like stand ins for people, you know, they’re they’re they allow people to say things that they would never say, but they’ll, they would say it because the character is saying it or the character is an expression of it, and they’re able to have that character as a buffer so they feel safe. And, you know, it doesn’t feel so serious because it is fun. It’s movies, you know, um, and, you know, it allows them to, um, I call it visual articulation, which is visually articulate things by saying, hey, that up there on the screen that that’s me. That’s kind of a part of me, that’s a part of my story.

Lee Kantor: And they can share it easily because it’s like, oh, everybody’s seen that movie, or they know of that movie. It’s not me saying that. That’s me. You know, like there it’s done in. It’s they’re removed from the character, but they are the character. Um, you know, if you dig a little deeper, which you obviously are skilled enough to be able to do that rather than let people see it or not see it, you bring it to their attention.

Bryan Coley: Exactly. Yeah. Our job is just to say, you know, just ask the question, is this, you know what? What part of this is you, uh, you know, oftentimes what we do in rooms is we’ll maybe show a trailer and we’ll just tell the participant, hey, the one who’s whose movie it is, we’ll just say, hey, watch this trailer. And when you see something that you feel like is you like, you know, when it’s done, just point it out to us and say, I own this. This is me here. This is what’s great about me, you know? And then for the other teammates to be able to look at that same trailer and go, oh my gosh, that is so, you know, whoever the participant is, their name. And for those visuals to to be able to stay with people. So that’s one of the other things I love is that, you know, most of learning that you have kind of just fades away. But with movies, I have people all the time come back to real or come back to me and say, oh, you know, I still remember this person by their movie, and I still remember this moment for me.

Bryan Coley: You know, where it was, uh, this movie. And so, uh, you know, I have one team leader. He’s my star team leader. Uh, he’s come. He just came for his 14th time to real bringing, uh, bringing his team to real. And anytime he has a new team member, he just brings everybody back to real again. Um, or he gets a new team or something like that. And and, you know, at this point, I know his movie so well and know him so well that, you know, is so fun for almost me to watch his team get to know him through the fact that now he can articulate so well why he’s Rudy and why he’s Kevin Costner’s character in Draft Day, you know, and and I know him so well through these movies as well, you know? Um, so it’s just one of those things where, you know, you’re able to, uh, really know the people that you serve, uh, by remembering them through their movies, you know.

Lee Kantor: So you mentioned that the company has gone through some iterations and maybe, uh, change a little bit on your structure and how you’re serving and who you’re serving. Is there an ideal client Now that you’re looking to serve more.

Bryan Coley: Um. Good question. I think that, uh, one of the things I’m always cognizant of is just trying to find what is the needs of the marketplace. You know, like, where are people right now? Like, we’ve introduced two new real experiences this year. One is around change because, you know, we’re all going through so much chaos and change that we wanted to address that and say, okay, how can we create an experience where people understand how to navigate change better? Um, and then we, uh, introduce another experience this year around conflict and sort of what triggers you to conflict so you can understand what it is that’s frustrating you and what’s at the core of what’s frustrating. What are you fighting for? Um, and all through your characters and your movies, you’re finding this as well as what does it look like to be on the other side of you? If you know someone’s frustrated with you and have empathy for that person? So we just realized that the marketplace is is such right now that maybe those are some of the things that, um, you know, clients would be interested in as well as we do a lot of gatherings. So we do a lot of retreats, you know, where they just need some team building versus team development is what I would call those in which they’re just kind of looking for something fun.

Bryan Coley: And if it’s insightful, that’s a bonus. Or it might be around a thematic that the company is going through. And so we’re always looking for that. We’re always looking for like, what are what is it, you know, is there a corporate value that you’re really trying to get across this year? Let us help you with that. Let us help you help your people with that. Um, so it’s not necessarily a different, you know, vertical or anything like that as far as, uh, marketplace, but it’s more of, you know, how can we serve people in a way that feels, you know, a part of the the pain points that they have right now? Um, we are launching this year, um, really excited. We’re in beta testing right now, and we’re, um, doing focus groups next month on what I’m calling kind of, like real everywhere. Uh, the actual title is called A Real Story Map, in which anybody, anywhere could do real because we’re creating sort of an online experience, uh, almost like an assessment, but with your movies. So that’ll be the next thing I’m tackling is, uh, we’ve been limited so far with a little bit of, you know, either us having to come to people or, um, people having to come to us. And so this is our way of allowing anybody, anywhere to be able to do real.

Lee Kantor: Now, within the organization is the person that hires you, typically HR or the C-suite?

Bryan Coley: Question. Yeah. Um, I would say the, the, the most success we’ve had has been organizations in which the team leader, uh, you know, comes to us and finds us, and then they spread it along to other team leaders. Nothing against HR. In fact, I’m I’m speaking at Sherm this year here in Atlanta. Um, and I spoke last year at Sherm as well, so I really love the HR community. Um, sometimes HR is really hard to get through because they have their own initiatives and their own things they’re trying to to do, and so we end up being a part of some piece of, you know, um, their learning and development. But, um, the most success we’ve had has been companies where it kind of goes viral, where one team leader tells another team leader.

Lee Kantor: So if somebody wants to learn more, have a more substantive conversation with you or somebody on the team, what’s the website? What’s the best way to connect?

Bryan Coley: Yeah, the website is reel experiences. Com and that’s re experiences. Com and then um, you know we’re all in all the social media as well. But um, but ultimately, you know uh reelinfo@reelexperiences.com is uh an email, if you want to email that email it’ll come right to me. So reelinfo@reelexperiences.com and I can definitely, you know, help with pricing and with customization. Usually where we start is tell us how many people, how many people you have, uh, you know, how long you want us to do it for and then where we want to do it. So those are kind of the three starting points for how we start to customize the real experience for people.

Lee Kantor: Well, Brian, thank you so much for sharing your story today. You’re doing such important work and we appreciate you.

Bryan Coley: Lee I mean, come on. Thank you for this opportunity to talk to you. Hey, I want to know before we leave, like Pulp Fiction and like, what are some of the other movies?

Lee Kantor: Uh, other movies on my list would be mostly comedies, but Pulp Fiction is kind of an action movie that I like, but I. The list that you were naming are probably. I like planes, Trains and Automobiles. Nice. So I like things with heart and, um, and I like a good story, but I like movies, so I’ll watch bad movies. I just like movies. So, um.

Bryan Coley: That’s really good. Yeah, yeah. And one last thing to tell you is that every year I do the Oscars. Um. And I treat it like America’s top ten. Like, as if a participant gave me their top ten, and I kind of look and see what are the themes. And this is my 13th year of doing a breakdown of the themes of the Oscars. So, um, if people want to look on our, our, our YouTube, uh, reel experience, reel experiences, digital or you can find it at Reel Experiences. Um, then we’ll have a live, um, a live stream on Oscar Sunday, right before the Oscars, in which we will reveal, like, what are the themes that are coming out of the Oscars this year? I’ve found that most of the Oscars are actually highly prophetic, and they’re highly relevant, even though people don’t think they are at all. But it’s only when you look at them through, uh, them as being a palette of films versus just what wins. So, um, it’s a really wonderful exploration I’ve done. And believe it or not, the Oscars have predicted some of the most significant, uh, Events that we’ve had over the last 13 years of me studying it. Um, they foreshadowed it. I would I would say that our story. So, um, so.

Lee Kantor: You’re looking at the best pictures or all the best totality. It’s all the Best picture nominees, and you’re kind of taking that pile and saying and analyzing it from a cultural standpoint.

Bryan Coley: That’s exactly right. So I just looked for those connections and threads, just as if it was a person’s top ten. And, you know, I’ve been so, so blown away. Uh, you know, like last year, uh, was one of the bigger years where I, um, you know, said last year that all the Oscars were sort of looking at the concept of who will who will we be? All the characters were kind of asking this dramatic questions of who will we be? And and the answers in most of the films was we have to kind of defy the powers that be. Um, in order to do that. I think wicked is probably the best example that most people would know of the Oscar films, where you have a character who’s, you know, definitely dealing with identity and who she’s going to be. And she gets selected by the wizard to come to Oz, and then she finds out it’s kind of, you know, he’s kind of a puppet master. And so she defies the wizard, and that was part of it. And and this year, I think I said last year, I said, I think this year is going to be a year of defiance in some way. And of course, depending on what aisle you sit on, you know, you could look at Trump being the person who’s defying all kinds of norms, or you could look at, you know, all the kinds of defiance of different, uh, from elections to Minneapolis to I think the biggest thing I think that is kind of a little wink is, um, you know, Marjorie Taylor Greene was sort of that person who was like an insider, um, who immediately defied, you know, uh, the wizard and and ironically, her name is Marjorie Taylor Greene, which, uh, goes with Elphaba really nicely.

Lee Kantor: So it all ties together in a boat.

Bryan Coley: It all ties together. So, yeah, this is where people are going. Oh, this guy’s crazy. But believe it or not, um, you know, it has happened, uh, year after year where the Oscars have. Have been, uh, very relevant to what happens the next year in society.

Lee Kantor: So is that, um, kind of. Does that speak to the people who choose the best picture people or the people who make those movies because they’re curating that list?

Bryan Coley: Yeah. So I think, uh, you know, I think that’s the most wonderful part of it is you could easily see this as like, oh, well, Brian, you know, is, uh, liberal holiday Hollywood. And they’re they have their own agendas. And all these films are liberal agendas and things like that. But ironically enough, this is where you can take that out, because, you know, I could look at, like, one battle after another is probably the movie that will win this year, and it is definitely a thesis to like, immigration has all these kinds of, you know, strong themes to what’s playing out in society right now, but in relationship to the other films, it has nothing to do with that. Like, the filmmaker’s intent has nothing to do with the fact that what ties all the films together, you know? So that’s what I love, is that I even love to tell people that the three Oscar, the three Oscar years leading up to the first presidency of Trump were paving the way for a person like Trump, because it was all anti-establishment. It was all, you know, can we survive and be great again? These were some of the questions that were coming out of the Oscars.

Bryan Coley: And they were they were fulfilled by, I wouldn’t say fulfilled, but they were foreshadowing. A person like Trump to to to be the president. And so so to me, you know, when I look at that, I go, well, you know, like even that is goes against the grain of, of what you would think would be tied into the films. And, and likewise, it’s been the same from the other side. If you look at, um, years where, for example, right after Trump was elected in 2017, all of the Oscars were saying, we need to go back and look at our past and look at the sins of our past and get an accurate picture of our past. Well, that year, after the Oscars played out, was Charlottesville, where we were looking at statues and things of our past. And we were. And then the MeToo movement happened that, um, that, um, fall in which we were uncovering all the sins of, you know, these, uh, these people who had, uh, abused women. And so it was definitely one of those things where it just was playing out in society. Um, as far as, uh, you know, how we were to become a we as a culture, which is what the Oscars were asking.

Bryan Coley: So different things like that. And then in 2020, about a month before the pandemic, the Oscars were there. And the theme that came out of the Oscars, uh, that year, you know, I got up at what was then Pinewood Studios at the time before a gathering. And I said, the theme this year is that we need to test our devotion to each other to see if we’ll be our brothers and sisters keeper. And I don’t know how this is going to play out in society, but I just feel like, you know, this is the theme for this year. And then that was all 2020 was, was testing our devotion to our money, to our to masks, to everything else, to see if we would be our brother and sister’s keeper. And, um, and George Floyd happened, Covid happened. The, uh, you know, then we went into, uh, January 6th. So it was all in the election. It was just all very much testing our devotion to each other, uh, as a country, um, to see if we would be our brother and sister’s keeper. So that’s an examples of just how how the Oscars have been relevant, you know.

Lee Kantor: And if somebody wants to kind of check it out that you do this every year right before the Oscars.

Bryan Coley: I do. So, um, is.

Lee Kantor: It a live like you’re live and just, um.

Bryan Coley: Yeah.

Lee Kantor: You know, on video sharing it.

Bryan Coley: Yeah, we prerecord it live. The day before. And then we air it. Uh, right before the Oscars. So.

Lee Kantor: And then how many minutes is it typically?

Bryan Coley: Um, I try to make it short, so it’s usually about 30 minutes at, you know, around 30 minutes where I try to give the themes how the themes of last year played out in society and then the themes of this year and, you know, not being predictive, but just saying, hey, this is this is what I’m seeing as far as I usually I usually create a dramatic question like, here’s what the question is. These these films are all asking. And here’s what their answer is as far as you know, what I can see as their answer. And then trying to see, you know, what those words say about, you know, where we might be headed. So.

Lee Kantor: So the movies are your tarot cards.

Bryan Coley: Well, I don’t want to do tarot cards, but the movies are. My palette of parables is what I call it. Okay. Yeah. In fact, uh, this will take you into a whole nother level. But, you know, um, you know, for me, I’m a person of faith, and. And I just believe, you know, maybe maybe God is is a storyteller. Maybe that’s his language is is moving pictures and story. And so maybe he’s trying to talk to us, you know, and foreshadow where we’re headed. You know, I know that sounds even crazier. And a lot of people who are people of faith going, you gotta be kidding me, you know? But for me, I just have seen the supernatural nature of it all that I go, maybe God cares about our narrative and where we’re headed, you know?

Lee Kantor: Yeah. And and you’re seeing it through films and you’re able to kind of, um, you know, be an interpreter of of that language. Well, we appreciate it. And thank you again for sharing your story.

Bryan Coley: Thank you. Lee, I appreciate the time that you’ve taken with me. I appreciate it.

Lee Kantor: All right. This is Lee Kantor. We’ll see you all next time on Atlanta Business Radio.

Your Franchise Friend: Expert Guidance for Making Informed Franchise Decisions!

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FMR-Franchoice-Feature
Franchise Marketing Radio
Your Franchise Friend: Expert Guidance for Making Informed Franchise Decisions!
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In this episode of Franchise Marketing Radio, host Lee Kantor interviews Charles Stovall, FranChoice owner and consultant. Charles shares his journey from corporate sales to multi-unit franchise ownership and consulting, offering insights into the realities of franchising. He discusses common misconceptions, the importance of understanding franchise disclosure documents, and why business acumen outweighs passion for a product. Charles also highlights the challenges of franchise ownership, the need for commitment, and how his consulting firm helps individuals find the right franchise fit. The episode provides practical advice for aspiring franchisees seeking to achieve their entrepreneurial goals.

Charles Stovall, is a Franchise Consultant & Business Strategist based in Charleston, SC, he brings over a decade of entrepreneurial experience to the table. From scaling a single location to 20 successful units across multiple states, he understands the grit required to succeed.

As a consultant with FranChoice, he uses his real-world experience to guide individuals through the due diligence process, helping them avoid common pitfalls and find the perfect business match for their lifestyle and financial goals.

He doesn’t just talk about franchising; he has lived it. After owning and operating four different franchise concepts, he realized that the biggest hurdle for most aspiring entrepreneurs isn’t a lack of drive—it’s a lack of clarity. Today, he serves as a Franchise Advisor, helping candidates cut through the noise to find a business model that truly aligns with their lifestyle and financial goals.

His approach is built on the Blackbook of Franchising methodology: identifying the red flags most people miss and focusing on proven systems that create long-term wealth. Whether discussing the tactical side of a $1M+ build-out or the mindset shift required to move from employee to owner, he brings a no-nonsense perspective to the conversation.

When he’s not helping people find their perfect business fit, he can be found on the golf course, planning the next family adventure to Europe, or navigating the beautiful chaos of life in Mount Pleasant with his wife, their two sons, and their Golden Retriever, Brody.

Connect with Charles on LinkedIn.

What You’ll Learn In This Episode

  • The realities and challenges of franchise ownership, including misconceptions about success.
  • Importance of understanding franchise disclosure documents (FDDs) and their limitations.
  • The necessity of evaluating business acumen over personal passion when choosing a franchise.
  • The commitment required for successful franchise ownership, including time and resource management.
  • The emotional aspects of transitioning from corporate jobs to franchise ownership.
  • Trends in franchising, particularly the involvement of younger individuals and family support.
  • The significance of thorough candidate evaluation and character assessment in franchise selection.
  • Strategies for prospective franchisees to align their goals, budget, and lifestyle with franchise opportunities.

Transcript-iconThis transcript is machine transcribed by Sonix.

 

TRANSCRIPT

Intro: Coming to you live from the Business RadioX studio. It’s Franchise Marketing Radio.

Lee Kantor: Lee Kantor here. Another episode of Franchise Marketing Radio. And this is going to be a good one. Today on the show we have the owner and a consultant with FranChoice, Charles Stovall. Welcome.

Charles Stovall: Hey. Thanks, Lee. I appreciate you having me today.

Lee Kantor: Well, I’m excited to learn what you’re up to. Tell us about FranChoice.

Charles Stovall: Yeah. So FranChoice. Our tagline is we help people realize their dreams. But essentially what I do is I, you know, work with people to help them find a good franchise fit. You know, ultimately, uh, people who are looking to escape corporate America or diversify their income, uh, they typically look to our services to help them find something that would be a good match for them.

Lee Kantor: So what’s your backstory? Have you always been involved in franchising?

Charles Stovall: So for the past 15 years I’ve been in franchising. You know, my my story before that was kind of a typical guy who was in corporate America in a sales role, who had been passed up for promotions, much like a lot of people experience in corporate America and ultimately decided that, you know, taking control of my own destiny was was an order. And so. So about 15 years ago, I opened up a boost mobile store up in Harrisonburg, Virginia.

Lee Kantor: Was that a franchise or was that just a I’m going to open up a kind of a cell phone store here in town?

Charles Stovall: Yeah. So, uh, so Boost Mobile acts as like, kind of like a franchise, but they, they do more of, like, an agent operator model. It’s basically the same thing. You operate underneath their umbrella and have to sell their products.

Lee Kantor: And so there were rules to work with them, like you never considered. Hey, I’m a smart guy. I’m good at sales. Let me go out and sell people something.

Charles Stovall: Yeah. That’s right. Yeah, yeah. Well, you know, ultimately I just saw, you know, I was in cell phone sales at the time, and so, so I was, I was helping people open up these stores. And then ultimately I was like, I think, I think I can probably do this. And and we did, you know, and that’s, uh, and that’s kind of it took off from there. And we grew to 20 locations, 20 Boost Mobile stores across five states over those next four years.

Lee Kantor: So then so you’re you’re now kind of franchise adjacent, I guess you would call that at this point.

Charles Stovall: Yeah. That’s correct. Yeah. And then, you know, we sold that to a private equity group in that in the cell phone space. And then we transitioned into full, full blown franchise ownership with Massage Envy. And so we had, uh, seven massage envy’s in the state of Virginia as well.

Lee Kantor: So now you’ve kind of got the bug, you got some capital now, and you’re like, okay, let me dip my toe in, you know, pretty far if you’re I guess that was was that a master franchise or was that a region like how how was that structured?

Charles Stovall: Yeah. So, you know, ultimately they were just like individual licenses that, that we acquired, um, you know, over time. And um, and whether that was building a new or acquiring existing, uh, we, we, we did that, you know, over the course of about five years. Um, and then, uh, and then Covid came along and then we sold in 2021 after Covid, uh, kind of had, you know, dwindled down a little bit. And we sold to, to a private equity group.

Lee Kantor: So now so now you got a system, right? I’m gonna launch build and then exit.

Charles Stovall: That’s right. Yeah. So, um, so we attempted to do this with a company called yoga six. Really? In the middle of us owning, um, massage envy, me and a couple of other Massage Envy franchisees got together. We bought the rights to develop yoga six in the state of North Carolina and the Raleigh area. And, um, and then ultimately we, uh, Covid came along and really paused those development plans. Um, and so, um, so we ended up we ended up selling those licenses back to the franchisor. Um, and then, uh, and then after I exited Massage Envy, I became a consultant and, um, and have recently became a franchisee of a concept called, uh, Image Studios. And, uh, it’s a salon suite concept. And so we have the rights to build three of those here in the state of South Carolina.

Lee Kantor: And then you’re also a franchisee, uh, franchise. Is franchise a franchise?

Charles Stovall: No, they are, um, essentially just individual consultants. Uh, you know, we’re a smaller, more boutique group in, in the consultant space. Um, there’s a lot of, uh, there’s a lot of firms out there that have hundreds and hundreds of people who kind of treat this as a part time job. Uh, we have about, you know, I think we have like 100 consultants, probably 70 or 80 or full time active. Um, we typically have, uh, extensive franchising experience. Um, and that way whenever we consult with our candidates, then we can give them appropriate advice on, you know, basically on what they’re looking for.

Lee Kantor: And then it’s kind of, um, agnostic to the franchisers that you’re representing where like, like some of the franchisor franchise type companies, they have a portfolio of franchises that they’re supposed to encourage people to buy, right?

Charles Stovall: Yeah. So we have like 300 franchisors that we work with. It’s kind of like a rotating list sometimes, you know, of like, you know, maybe 2 or 3 in 2 or 3 out, um, just depending on what their development looks like. So, you know, if you’re looking at something like an orange theory or a subway or, you know, massage envy, even, you know, like they don’t really have any more development opportunities, so they don’t really need us, you know. And so, um, so we’re typically working with, you know, brands that are either emerging, um, you know, they may have the 50 to 100 open, uh, something like that is typically our wheelhouse where people are going to be able to identify an opportunity that’s on the upswing that still, like, has some good validation, meaning that they have franchisees who’ve been operating for, you know, a few years that they can at least, um, you know, get some understanding of the business and how how the first couple years have been.

Lee Kantor: And so, um, when you’re going, is it the same model as a lot of the franchise brokers that you have people in local markets that you’re kind of networking, joining chambers, you know, going about your business that way to attract people that are like, hey, I you know, I just got laid off, so I need something to do now.

Charles Stovall: Yeah. So, um, you know, so franchises nationwide, some of the other networks are more regional now. We do operate nationwide. But, you know, a lot of, you know, a naturally a referral would come through, you know, your local market or people who know you locally. Um, so, you know, a lot of your business will come from your backyard, but, you know, franchises, um, you know, we’ve, uh, we operate nationwide.

Lee Kantor: And so, like, you were in a local market, obviously, where you live, but you can help somebody anywhere, I guess, in the world, if they’re interested.

Charles Stovall: Yeah. Essentially anybody in the United States, we we we could help them.

Lee Kantor: And then when they’re coming to you, are they typically is the franchise e of today the same as it was when you became a kind of involved in franchising? Is it the person like you said, you know, I’m frustrated with my job or I got laid off or, you know, something was a trigger of me working, and now I’m trying to explore something a little more entrepreneurial.

Charles Stovall: Yeah. You know, you see all walks of life, you know, and, um, you know, and I think that people who are, you know, the question you’re gonna that people a lot of times ask, you know, are, you know, was it going to take to be successful or would I be a good franchisee. And and so sometimes that motivation that’s coming from not being, you know, promoted or being laid off is a really good motivation for you to go be a successful business owner. But we try to peel those layers back whenever we are working with somebody to ultimately make sure that they’re also not making, you know, a bad decision, an emotional decision, and really make sure that their heart’s in the right place. And the expectations of what business ownership and franchise ownerships is going to be like for them. And, you know, sometimes I think people feel like, hey, if I just buy this business, it’s gonna eventually just start paying me my salary here in the next few months. And that’s just not going to be the case. You know, you kind of have to rewire your brain. You know, this isn’t a W-2 job anymore. You’re not going to get a bi weekly paycheck. Um, you know, so what does that look like for you? And we try to walk people through that before they make this decision.

Lee Kantor: I think that’s really important for people to understand that buying a franchise is not like buying an ATM machine, where just people show up and give you money, right? Like, this is you have to kind of grow your business despite with a lot of people think I think a lot of people think, oh, I’m buying this brand. They’ve already done the heavy lifting. I just have to show up and be a good, you know, steward of the brand, and then I’ll just be successful. And then they got to earn each client one at a time, right?

Charles Stovall: Yeah. Right. Exactly. Yeah. You know, like and that’s kind of why you have franchisees, you know, like if it was that easy, then, you know, the corporation would just go do it themselves. And so we need people who are involved in the community, who are involved with their employees, you know, who can give back and who can like, you know, have real empathy on the ground, you know, and not just be this corporate umbrella that’s, uh, that’s overlooking this, this whole thing nationwide. So, um, yeah, you know, it’s like I often joke with people like, you know, I’m, I’m in my car, I’ll go up I-95 and, you know, for the weekend to go, you know, whether it’s to go visit some family or go on vacation. And I’ll pull over to the chick fil A, and the owner of the chick fil A is the guy holding the door, you know, and you know, he’s not he’s not visiting family that weekend. And, you know, he’s he’s putting in the work and that’s what it takes. You know, you gotta be involved. You gotta plug yourself in and you gotta understand your business and you gotta wear the brand.

Lee Kantor: Yeah, I the reason I keep kind of harping on this is I talk to a lot of franchisors. I talked to a lot of franchisees, and sometimes there’s this, I believe, a misconception that if you buy a franchise, that’s almost a guarantee when you’re going to be successful. And I just don’t think that’s true. I think there’s ways that franchisors, um, can not tell you everything. Like you, part of what I think makes a layperson feel secure is there’s an FD that they have to document a lot of stuff and, you know, kind of the ins and outs of that FD much better than I do. But can you share some, um, kind of maybe misconceptions about FD? It’s not a franchise, isn’t a guaranteed win.

Charles Stovall: Sure. Yeah. Absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. So you know, the FD is like kind of part of this whole scaffolding that you need to put together to, you know, interpret whether this business is going to be a good fit for you. So it’s only it’s a small piece of, of a, of a much bigger puzzle. And so, you know, you can kind of frame an FD in your favor. You know, if you’re a franchisor and you know that that doesn’t necessarily mean that they all do. And but what you really you know, what you’ll typically see is that, you know, they may not disclose, you know, any type of numbers or they may disclose just their corporate locations, numbers which have been open for 15 years, you know, and all of a sudden they, you know, it took them, you know, 12 to get to those numbers. You know, and now they’re reflection of those numbers to people who are just getting into the business. Think that that’s something that they can get to, you know. Um, so, you know, it’s it just should help you frame questions as you go through the, the discovery process and, you know, really start to peel back the layers.

Charles Stovall: Um, what I typically will tell the candidates I work with is when they’re looking at PhDs. You know, compare similar PhD to a similar brand. So just, you know, if you’re looking at a painting concept, then go go look at another painting concept. If the painting concept that you’re looking at says, hey, there’s 25% margins here. And and then there’s another one that shows ten, you know, well, you know, paint still the same cost labor still the same cost. So you know there there’s there’s something going on there. And um, so ultimately, you know, there’s a lot of ways that you can kind of interpret an PhD. Again, it’s not the truth. It’s not the it’s not the word often is, you know, is the prior year’s numbers. So there’s some instances where it could be a year and a half old data, you know. So um, so again, it’s just kind of part of the bigger piece of the puzzle.

Lee Kantor: Now, how would you, um, how would you help a person that’s considering a franchise understand that? Okay. I’m especially an emerging franchise. Okay, this this place has ten units. It’s. I look on their feed and there’s ten. It says there’s ten. And then I can see ten people’s names. But aren’t there ways a franchisor can either buy back or kind of massage those numbers? Um, that might be hiding something that, um, they’re still following the letter of the law, but there’s ways to kind of, um, let a person maybe draw a conclusion that isn’t totally accurate.

Charles Stovall: Yeah. You know, there’s like, there’s definitely, you know, franchisors don’t want locations to close. You know, and and, you know, and the thing is, is that, like, you know, if something does close, that doesn’t mean that it’s a bad concept. You know, and and, you know, there’s a lot of bad operators out there too. And I think that people will typically, you know, want to blame somebody but themselves. And so that’s kind of like always my first inclination is like, well, you know, I’ve seen people be really successful in bad brands, you know, and I’ve seen really good brands with bad operators be really successful. And I’ve seen it all, you know. So it’s so like there’s ways that the franchisor will say, hey, I know that you’re struggling. Or maybe they had a life event, or maybe they just were incapable of running the business. You know, maybe the business wasn’t working. Um, but, uh, there’s definitely they definitely will take over, you know, leases. They will definitely, um, you know, go in and try to salvage the business so that, you know, I mean, part of it is so that they don’t have to take a hit on the head and show a closed location. But another part is they just want to make sure that, you know, they salvage the brand and the identity and really, you know, um, not put a bad taste in the mouth of that local market. And so, um, so there’s definitely ways that that, you know, that they can construe some information in the PhD. And again, a lot of it is timing on when they file an PhD and when people close and what actually counts as a closure. Um, so, um, so, you know, there’s there’s definitely some strange things in there. And again, it’s just like a, it’s a smaller piece of a bigger puzzle of whether you as a candidate can operate that business.

Lee Kantor: And that’s where the franchisor and consultants like you, you have to kind of tell the whole story the good, the bad, the ugly, because you don’t want to have a mismatch in terms of expectations and skill and what they think is going to happen. Um, in terms of once they buy this thing. Because when you buy this thing, it’s one of these, you know, you break it, you own it kind of situations like it’s, it’s not that easy to get out of it.

Charles Stovall: Right. Yeah. Exactly. You know, it’s it’s easier to get out of than, you know, if you were to go and open your own type of business, you know, because if you have a failing business that you opened on your own, you know, and hey, my, you know, my own Pilates studio didn’t work. Well, you don’t have a whole group of other franchisees that think that they can do it better than you and come in and take over the take over your lease, or come in and buy you. So there there’s not necessarily a safety net with franchising, but there’s definitely some people sitting on the sidelines waiting for you to fail that think that they can do it better. And so, um, so, you know, so I think there’s, uh, you know, there’s a little bit of in people’s mind like, okay, I see all these other people doing it, I can do it. And if I don’t do it, well, then the franchisee will take it well or the franchisor will come in and save me. That’s not always the case. Um, but but there’s definitely some operators sitting on the sidelines ready to pick you up for pennies on the dollar.

Lee Kantor: Now, when someone is at that point where they’re like, okay, I gotta make a move here, I need the money. I, you know, I’m in I’m in this transitional place, I think I can do this. I talked to, uh, Charles and his team. I think I’m going to pull the trigger. It. What are some things that maybe I don’t that I think I know, but I really don’t know. Like, for example, like, hey, you know what? I’m a great person on the grill. I’m going to open a barbecue franchise. That’s my dream. It’s my passion. I’m really all my neighbors say I make the best brisket in town, so I’m going to look for a barbecue. Uh, franchise. Is that a good move to follow the thing that, you know, is my maybe a hobby or a passion of mine?

Charles Stovall: No, actually, quite the opposite, I think, if you were to ask me. So I typically will tell my candidates that, you know, franchising isn’t a passion play, you know, like, you have to be passionate about building a business. You have to be passionate about leading people. But if you’re passionate about a product or a service that you do well or something that you love, then go do that. You know, like go do that on your own. You don’t need a franchise, you know, you can go do this yourself. Franchising should be an opportunity for people to plug themselves into a proven system where they can just execute the game plan, lead people and, you know, go build a real business. And that way they can go spend more time in their passions. And like, that’s what franchising is really about. Like, I didn’t wake up one day wanting to go sell cell phones and or go have a massage place. Like, that’s not what gets me up in the morning, you know? But what does get me up is the ability to spend more time in the things that I love, and franchising offered me that. And so that’s the message that I try to get across to my candidates. You know, when I show them ugly businesses that have low startup but good margins, you know, like I’m showing them that because I think what they ultimately want is more time Him doing the things that they love to do, like, you know, barbecuing or spending time with their kids or family.

Lee Kantor: So they got to kind of separate their identity from the whatever the business is.

Charles Stovall: Yeah, I mean, that would be my suggestion. You know, again, it’s like, you know, if you’re going to grow to hate it, you know, like there’s going to be good days and bad days and, you know, and that’s often the mistake that people will make is that they will buy a business that they like the product, you know, like, hey, I’m, I go to this fitness concept. I really like this fitness concept. You know, like it’s gotten me in shape. It’s gotten my friends in shape. I’m going to go now open up a fitness concept, you know, and then it’s like, okay, now you have coaches calling out at 530 in the morning and.

Lee Kantor: Now it’s a you problem.

Charles Stovall: Right now it’s a you problem right. You know and now you’re working weekends. You know, you’re hosting you know bridge runs and marathons and you’re doing all this stuff and and that’s okay. Is that what you really want to do? You know, and, um, and I think, you know, some people are like, no, what I actually want to do is like, I just want to go work out and come home and then maybe run my business at that point.

Lee Kantor: So, yeah, I think it’s important for folks to understand if they’re going to buy a business. They got to like all of it. Like they can’t like just the good parts, because there’s a bunch of other parts too, that you’re not seeing, that maybe not obvious and you really got to get comfortable with if you want to be successful. Like if it takes, like you were saying, to run a fitness studio requires, you know, you know, six times a year we have to do some sort of a fun run at four in the morning. And I got to get there on a lot of holidays and a lot of times that I used to spend with my family, or I have to put somebody in place, I either have to have the resources to afford to put someone in place to do it for me, or I have to do it like there’s all that has to be done. If you want to run a successful operation.

Charles Stovall: That. That’s correct. Right, exactly. And again, I just, you know, and so when people are leaving their corporate America, they were just let go, you know, like there’s that that emotion is high. And so they just say, okay, I’m going to do this. And then, um, you know, but then they didn’t really make an educated decision. And, you know, and that’s why that’s why franchise exists.

Lee Kantor: Right. Well, it sounds like you’re trying to tell people the truth and not what they want to hear, because they might have hated that job, but they didn’t bring the job home with them. You know, when they clocked out, then they were done. They didn’t think about it. But when you have a business, you can’t clock out.

Charles Stovall: That’s right. Exactly. Yeah. You know, it’s it’s the entrepreneur entrepreneurship. You know, that’s what it is. It’s uh, it’s 24 over seven.

Lee Kantor: Right. And that’s a mental shift for a lot of people. If they thought they were the job, that they were a rock star and they never thought about it when they were home or on vacation, that may not be the right fit to run a business.

Charles Stovall: Yeah. No doubt. Yeah. I helped this lady down in Texas once, and she was a, um. She was a doctor, and she had, you know, uh, she was really wanting to get into doing Botox and hormone treatments, stuff like that. And she bought a franchise, and, um, it was like a year and a half had passed, and she, uh, and and she had emailed me and, uh, and it turns out she, she got everything she wanted. Now, the franchise that were doing great, the revenue was really high, you know, everything was going great. And she emailed me and she said, I want my old life back, you know, and, uh, and sometimes that is, you know, she bought what she thought she wanted, you know, and, uh, but, you know, but it became something that she didn’t, you know, and like, and it’s just because, you know, you you like, you fall in love with, like, escaping this, uh, this corporate reality when sometimes it’s just not a good fit for everybody.

Lee Kantor: Right. And and it’s not. It’s kind of you got to be all in like. I mean, I’m sure there’s opportunities you can share where. Hey, this is a I don’t want to say passive, but you can. If you’re willing to spend money, you can delegate a lot of the activities. Um, but you better have a lot of money. Like it’s not. You can’t have it both ways. You know, you’re either going to spend time or money.

Charles Stovall: Yeah. Absolutely. Yeah. And I typically would share with my candidates that, you know, passive ownership is never given. It’s always earned and it’s always earned over time. And like, you know, so you know, you’re gonna have to put that time in to generate enough money in order to be able to put the right people in place in order to run your business. But that doesn’t mean that you’re completely out of it, you know? But it’s going to allow you to get you some more time. And so, you know, whenever, you know, people are really familiar with, like the brick and mortar franchises, you know, and the things that we see on the side of the road, right? Those are, you know, like those obviously, cause they have more capital. But, you know, but people can put you, you, you got to really think bigger whenever you’re thinking about those types of businesses. If you just have one, you’re always going to be in that business. You’re always going to be involved with that business if you just have one. But if you have the money and you have the capital to and the time to be able to go out and build 3 to 6 of these, you know, then then you can earn your way to semi absentee ownership. Um, but it’s going to take some time.

Lee Kantor: So now is there a story you can share that maybe illustrates what it’s like working with you or somebody on your team, like maybe don’t name the name of the person, but maybe share what they came to you with, or what their expectations were and how you were able to set them up.

Charles Stovall: Yeah. You know, I mean, I work with so many people, um, you know, like every week and there’s so many personalities and I, you know, and most people come from this same place of, I want to be an entrepreneur. I don’t know where to start. And, um, and like, even so, I, my most recent, uh, placement was a a family here in Charleston, South Carolina. I’m based in Charleston and and they had a troubled past, you know. And, um, from like 15 years ago. And, you know, but they’ve now they’ve gotten everything in order. They they have, you know, beautiful kids. They have a really good family, but they have this past. And so when somebody works with somebody with franchise, like, I can speak on your character and I can speak on your behalf of getting approved by a franchisor with the good ones, you know, like if, if, um, if there’s franchises out there, they’ll approve anybody that can fog a mirror. But, you know, like the type of brands that I like to work with are going to be the good ones that, you know, want you to be able to pass the character test.

Charles Stovall: And so, um, so whenever, you know, somebody has this pass and I can speak on their behalf and I can go to bat for a candidate, you know, because it’s an opportunity that, that they really want. Um, you know, I was able to do that last week. Um, but I think a lot of, you know, when people are able to come to us who are just now exiting corporate, you know, whether that was because they were laid off, like, I really just try to sit down with them and put a framework of what the next six months to a year is going to look like for them from their personal expenses. You know, like from what? How are they going to save money? How are they going to build this business simultaneously? And we try to work from the end result backwards. And that way we can kind of find a business that’s going to work within their budget, within their lifestyle and their time, the type of person that they are, the type of people that they can manage.

Lee Kantor: Now, are you seeing is there any type of a trend of younger kind of people getting involved in franchising? Instead of going the traditional, I’m going to go to, you know, go to college, you’re going to get a, you know, some corporate job. And then, you know, I’ll find, you know, my own thing down the road. Are you seeing either the parents funding or partnering with the younger people to maybe skew a little younger now in types of some types of franchisees.

Charles Stovall: Yeah, we definitely see a good bit of that. There’s no doubt where like, I’ll have a call with like a, you know, a gentleman who maybe 62, you know, and he’s like, yeah, my son’s 25. He hasn’t really found his way yet, you know. And I think I’m just going to buy him a business, you know. So there’s definitely been some of that. Um, but again, it’s kind of it is always all across the board, but I think you’ll, you know, you’ll see a lot of that for people who, you know, they just they’ve had a, they’ve had bad luck with, you know, entering into the corporate America world. And their dad’s like trying to help them or their family’s trying to help them. So that’s definitely out there.

Lee Kantor: Now you’re I’m sure you’re still having those hard conversations with the kid, right. Like because there’s no that’s not a cheat code. I mean, you might have a bank that’s quote unquote funding you, but it’s still the work has to be done every day.

Charles Stovall: Yeah, absolutely. I mean, you know, again. And what will often happen is that the the father, the family wants to pick the business for the kid, you know, even better. I’m like, how about how about we get the kid on the phone?

Lee Kantor: Yeah, I think at some point the kid’s got to get involved in this thing.

Charles Stovall: Yeah, right. You know, and so, yeah, you know. Absolutely. You know, it. The one thing that they’re blessed with is time. You know, like, it gets increasingly hard to invest in a business, whether it’s franchising or not. As you get kids and as you’re um, as your cost of living continues to increase over time, you know, like, I wish I had the expenses I did when I was 24, 25 and, you know, could live off ramen noodles. But, um, you know, now, you know, it would be increasingly difficult for me to enter into a franchise, you know, and also have the cost of, of living that, that we have. And so that’s, you know, it’s a it’s a tight balance, you know, and, you know, between people who really need income versus people who can kind of delay that income for a year or two.

Lee Kantor: So if somebody wants to learn more, have a more substantive conversation with you or somebody on the team, what is the best way to connect?

Charles Stovall: Yeah. So the best way to connect with me is through my website, which is Charles Stovall. That’s s t o v as in Victor aol.com. Charles stovall.com. My tagline is I’m your franchise friend. So if you just need some honesty and somebody that would want to talk to you about, you know, some franchises happy to do that. You can look me up there.

Lee Kantor: All right. Well, Charles, thank you so much for sharing your story. You’re doing such important work, and we appreciate you.

Charles Stovall: Yes. Thank you. Lee.

Lee Kantor: All right, this Lee Kantor. We’ll see you all next time on Franchise Marketing Radio.

Building High-Impact Relationships: A Comprehensive Guide for Local B2C Businesses to Attract and Convert Leads

by

High Velocity Radio
High Velocity Radio
Building High-Impact Relationships: A Comprehensive Guide for Local B2C Businesses to Attract and Convert Leads
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In this episode of High Velocity Radio, Lee interviews Chris Troka, CEO of Focused-Biz, a marketing agency for local B2C businesses. Chris shares how his agency helps brick-and-mortar companies—like dentists and plumbers—overcome marketing challenges by building relationships, increasing visibility, and implementing effective CRM systems. He discusses balancing automation with personal touch, the importance of referral programs, and practical strategies for reactivating past clients. Chris emphasizes transparency, measurable ROI, and a hands-on partnership approach, offering actionable insights for business owners seeking sustainable growth and improved client acquisition.

Chris Troka helps solopreneurs and small businesses save time, nurture leads, and scale through smart marketing and efficient automation.

With a background in building an award-winning Wedding DJ business, Chris specializes in leveraging automation and the buyer’s journey to drive growth.

Connect with Chris on LinkedIn.

What You’ll Learn In This Episode

  • Strategies for improving marketing for local brick-and-mortar businesses.
  • Challenges faced by business owners in marketing, including visibility and follow-up processes.
  • Importance of building high-impact relationships and community connections.
  • Multi-channel visibility strategies, including press releases and online presence.
  • Nurturing and converting leads effectively to reduce friction in the buyer’s journey.
  • Balancing automation with a personal touch in customer follow-up.
  • The significance of Customer Relationship Management (CRM) systems for tracking leads and customer interactions.
  • Addressing client skepticism and ensuring transparency in marketing efforts.
  • The role of referral programs in generating new leads and expanding client bases.
  • Low-cost, actionable strategies for immediate client generation without heavy advertising spend.

Transcript-iconThis transcript is machine transcribed by Sonix.

 

Intro: Broadcasting live from the Business RadioX studios in Atlanta, Georgia. It’s time for High Velocity Radio.Lee Kantor: Lee Kantor here. Another episode of High Velocity Radio, and this is going to be a good one. Today on the show we have the CEO and founder of Focused-Biz, Chris Troka. Welcome.Chris Troka: Lee. Thanks so much for having me. How are you doing?

Lee Kantor: I am doing great. I am so excited to learn what you’re up to. Tell us about Focused Biz. How are you serving folks?

Chris Troka: Of course. Uh, Focus Biz is my marketing agency partnership, where I work with founders and B2C companies to help them attract, nurture, convert and amplify their marketing systems. And this was started for me starting a DJ business 12 years ago. I ended up loving marketing and sales so much. I went back to school to earn a degree, and this was the culmination of those efforts of real life, practical business experience, plus the degree to create this marketing agency.

Lee Kantor: So what was kind of the challenges you were finding that business owners were having when it came to their marketing?

Chris Troka: Of course. So a lot of businesses are great at the skill or expertise within the industry that they’re doing, but not everyone is really cut out for sales or marketing. A lot of people know about tactics. They’ve heard about things, what might be good, but what they’re struggling with is that having a real, consistent strategy on how they can get found and get in front of the right people. So what we focus on is mostly developing high impact relationships, increasing your visibility through press releases, podcasts, anywhere you can be found online. This is how we like to amplify who you are and what you do. So when we combine the strategy, this is supposed to help bring you more organic leads. People can find you online and then get get connected to learn more about you. And then the nurture and convert phase is really about telling people about who you are, what your offer is, making sure that it’s communicated clearly, And then through that, we make sure we reduce friction within the buyer’s journey where people wonder, ah, is this the right person I want to work with? I don’t know how this works. What are the next steps? We try to make that process flow simply and easily for everybody, so that way people can take the next steps. So businesses, you know, they struggle with the overall strategy. They’re doing tactics. But this is how we actually move the needle and get them higher visibility and more clients.

Lee Kantor: Now when you say B2C companies, are you talking about kind of brick and mortar B2C? Are you talking about kind of e-commerce, B2C or both? Great.

Chris Troka: Great question. I can do both. However, most of my focus has been in like the local brick and mortar B2C. So dentists, roofers, plumbers, anyone with a local service or a physical location, those are typically the businesses that our experience matches best.

Lee Kantor: So in those cases and you say relationships, is this relationships with somebody in their neighborhood that maybe doesn’t know about them, and you’re helping them get to know via advertising or marketing.

Chris Troka: Right? And relationships expand beyond just your typical, you know, customer business relationship. This can be high influential people, whether it’s, you know, potential for referrals in the wedding space. As an example, potential referral spaces can be wedding venues. This can be wedding coordinators. So any vendor that you have a chance to work with, that is an opportunity for a referral source. This can expand even beyond to, you know, for example, dentists for them. They have insurance referrals. So if you’re able to collaborate with other local businesses, maybe they don’t support, you know, one, one type of insurance plan. Or maybe you can create a cross referral network source. This is a great way to build those high value relationships. Um, so it starts with, you know, it’s the clients, it’s the customer service, but it expands beyond who can, uh, who else can be, um, a, an influential source, uh, for potential clients. And this can go both ways.

Lee Kantor: So you’re kind of trying to look at their business more holistically rather than saying, oh, you’re a dentist, let’s run ads that say, do teeth whitening. Right.

Chris Troka: Absolutely. And those can be effective. We do utilize paid ads, paid search for some of our marketing tactics. However, when we take a step back and look at the whole picture, we found that we’re able to produce better results when we have a partnership with the business. So that holistic approach, where we’re able to take a step back and look at the entire process and the strategy. Um, because oftentimes we can get more visibility, we can get more leads into your business. But if you’re not following up properly, if you’re not nurturing and converting those people, they’re just leaving money on the table. And that’s, you know, for us, when we’re trying to demonstrate an ROI for their investment, we want to make sure that we’re able to hit as many positive numbers as we can. Uh, so that way we don’t leave anything on the table.

Lee Kantor: Now, what is kind of the pain that these people are having right before they call you and your team, do they? Is it just kind of lack of sales or did they plateau? Is there something happening in their business that’s kind of a trigger for them to go, you know what? I should call Chris and his team.

Chris Troka: Yeah. Of course. Yeah. So it’s it’s usually one of mean, one of two main things. It’s either that they’re struggling so they lack visibility. They don’t have, you know, phone calls or form submissions coming in. So they’re lacking sales and they’re just wondering, okay, what’s missing? Am I in the right industry? Is this the right offer? So they’re struggling with that or they’re struggling with the growth mode. So maybe they’re, they’re doing uh, they’re doing too well in terms of, you know, new clients onboarding. So we’re able to go in and, um, look at their process to help automate and create a better flow for everyone. I see too often a lot of these businesses are doing manual follow ups. They want to make sure that each each point has a, uh, human touch point within it. But unfortunately, um, that creates friction. And there’s a lot of time spent where someone can research solutions from a different competitor, and if they feel like they’re being helped a little more quickly, um, chances are they’re going to unfortunately move with that, uh, that other business. So it’s important to combine both the automation AI robot sort of follow up with the human touch point as well.

Lee Kantor: So how do you, um, help them execute some of that automation? Is it sometimes you have to kind of blow up their CRM system or their marketing automation, or sometimes they don’t even have that right.

Chris Troka: Absolutely. So most often, um, you know, it’s kind of a 5050 mix. Either the business does not know about a CRM or the benefits of it, um, or they’re working with a system that they’re just not sure how to utilize. Other companies maybe have a very robust CRM system. Uh, but they’re just not utilizing it. So what I like to do is we go in and we, we talk about what is the first touch point where someone reaches out to your business, what happens? So they reach out. How long does it take to follow up? What information do you provide to them? What do they need as their next steps? And then we look into the conversion rates and take a look at the at the data and what it’s showing. So with that we’re able to use our past experience and implement that into their business. So that way they can they can take their time, their human time and spend it on more high value tasks. Whereas the automation pieces can pick up a lot of the admin work that, you know, unfortunately there it kind of feels like busywork for them. They’re, you know, it’s important work, but that that type of follow up can definitely be handled with tools and systems.

Lee Kantor: Now when you’re working with folks and you’re explaining all of these possibilities, how do you kind of protect from the overwhelm where, okay, this just seems way too complicated. I just want to, you know, cut someone’s hair. I don’t want to be in the marketing automation business. Do you? Is this something you do for them, or is it have to be something that they do for themselves? That you just teach them how to do it.

Chris Troka: Oh, that is an excellent question. So for us, we like to work alongside the founders and the business owners. So this is a hands on done for you, done with you sort of execution. So this is what businesses really love. They can actually focus on, you know their passion, their industry, what they’re good at. We just don’t want to, you know, bark at them and give orders on here’s what you can do. Because we know they they lack the time as well. And if we’re being honest, it’s much faster for us to just execute it than to try to explain and, you know, have them do it for them. But it’s a difference between the founders and the business owners. You have a lot that love to do it themselves. They’re they’re tech savvy, they’re willing to learn and they’re able to execute at a high level. And then you have those who, you know, they just want the end result for. So for those people, we don’t like to tell them, you know, about the tech that’s behind it or the reasoning why. And you know, we just let them know, here’s the end result we can get for you. We can get you a full, full appointment calendar. Um, increase your sales, uh, within this amount of time frame, and that is usually the message that resonates with them. So it definitely is more of a hands on, done with you execution partnership that we like to work with our businesses.

Lee Kantor: Now, how do you kind of get over maybe some of the skepticism that this seems too good to be true? I’ve been in business a long time. I have never gotten that kind of a response. How do you kind of get them over the perceived risk of of investing time and resources with you and your team?

Chris Troka: Right, absolutely. So anything in business is a risk. We’re all taking calculated risks. We’re trying to, you know, find where can we put our money to get an investment back for us? What’s going to be the best value for us? And I find that the skepticism isn’t so much that it it might be too good to be true, but rather that they’ve worked with other marketing agencies before or have had some done work done with them, but unfortunately they didn’t do anything. And I hear this quite often is, oh yeah, I spent, you know, $5,000 for this package. And yes, they said they were doing this, but I never felt like they were doing anything. It didn’t seem like it moved the needle. Um, so for us, that’s really important is to show what work that we’re following up on, why it’s important to them, and just that they know that it’s working in the background. And that’s when we work alongside the the business owner to make sure that we’re hitting those key performance indicators. We ask them, how many calls did you get? Is it more or less? Um, and that way we can actually demonstrate okay, this is this is where you were and this is where we’re trying to take you and where you are now. So that’s when they start, uh, things start to click for them and they start to understand, okay, this is this is both an investment. I’m seeing the improvement. This is what has worked for other businesses. And I just need to stay true to the course here to follow it through.

Lee Kantor: So what is kind of realistic for most businesses? Um, when you start working with them of course.

Chris Troka: Yeah. So each business can be a little bit different. What we, what we focus heavily on, uh, time, time and time again, the long, you know, the best return on your investment is going to be organic search. So this is where people, you know, real people are searching for solutions to their problems online. And if you can be a contender within their their solution that they’re looking for, this is just a perfect match. Because now you have someone who has a problem, they want it fixed, and now they’re just trying to find out who’s going to be the right fit for me. So the organic search is going to be the highest ROI. But all of the tactics that we put together help, uh, help improve the visibility and the authority all around. So that way you might get, you know, not just from search, you might get, um, some social media referrals that we’ve seen before. Um, for example, the dentist, um, long term, ah, ROI on the first initial visit is a 1.7 ROI. So on average she spends maybe $450 to obtain a new client. And this is, um, all the marketing efforts, um, that we’ve done for her so we can take a, uh, customer acquisition from 450 and she returns $800 per visit.

Chris Troka: Lifetime of that customer is 3 to $5000. So even on the initial visit, she’s she’s in the profit, she’s showing profitable numbers. And over the lifetime of that patient and that client, that is just compounding effects that show, okay, this takes it from a 1.7 ROI to maybe a two, 3 or 5 x back on their money. And that’s just at the initial visit, which is crazy, right? You have to think about all of the referrals that you could get from one individual. We were pretty surprised to find that, uh, the largest majority of the referral sources, uh, was internal referrals. If you have amazing customer service, if you do what you’re saying you’re going to do and you take care of the customer, they will be a promoter for your business and help return that money as well. So that’s how we like to look at the ROI investment and return as far as what we focus on in our on our tactics.

Lee Kantor: So you mentioned referral programs as a tactic. Can you share maybe some best practices when it comes to putting together a referral program. If you’re trying to use, uh, happy customers to help you get next customers.

Chris Troka: Absolutely. So this is a huge leverage point for businesses is utilizing their their current clientele to help promote their business because now now they, uh, become a promoter for you. And this really doesn’t cost you any money. If they have a great experience, they’re going to want to, um, you know, tell people about it. And this can compound itself even more if you put in this referral system, like you mentioned, the referral system should have some sort of tangible benefit to both parties. So it’s going to be the referrer and the referee who is receiving some sort of compensation or benefit. There’s a lot of businesses who will either offer a one time cash promotion. Um, here you can get, you know, money back or cash towards your service. Some, uh, places will offer like a, uh, some sort of raffle or a drawing. So enter your name to, to win a prize. Um, that gets people really excited. But I think that the most effective is is money. People. People love money. They love saving money. So if you’re able to, you know, offer that to both parties, you can provide an incentive for someone to talk about your business. And then the other person receives a benefit for actually using the service.

Lee Kantor: Now, um, you mentioned some other ways to get businesses to buy what you’re selling that maybe, um, ah, I don’t want to say unique, but maybe unique to the new, uh, customer of yours. Is there anything you can share that can help somebody kind of get a client in the short term, or that doesn’t cost a lot of money? Is there anything like low hanging fruit that a business owner listening right now could be doing that could bubble up a client for them without, you know, spending a fortune on ads or even your services?

Chris Troka: Right, right. Absolutely. So the low hanging fruit will depend on what business you’re in and how long you’ve been in business. Typically, the low hanging fruit is going to be any past clients you have. So anyone you can use as a past client to offer some sort of referral promotion, now you have, you know, it’s the cost of an email or a phone call for you to make that conversation with someone and make that offer. And that is a great way to offer that to current clients. You can also look at what is called a database reactivation. So these are all your past leads who were interested but did not purchase. This is a great way for you to offer some sort of special promotion to the past leads. Again, you’ve already either paid for them or they’re in your system. So if you offer a special one time promotion, give them something that they can’t say no to. It sounds amazing. This is exactly what I need. So that’s what people can focus on, is their past leads for database reactivation or current clients to create a referral network. And then from there, honestly, it’s really just up to the business owner’s time, right? We either we either have more time or money. So it’s up to you whether you want to invest your money into that. If you don’t have the money, you typically have the time. So if you’re able to utilize those past clients, uh, your past leads, and then just look for ways to find visibility and make relationships grow. Um, this is again up to you. As you know, you’re only spending time on it. So if you can identify high value people that can be a benefit or resource to your business. Go ahead and start that conversation. Build that relationship and you’ll be surprised how many people are going to go to bat for you and your business and send you referrals. If you’re doing a great job and you build that relationship now.

Lee Kantor: Do you believe that every business has to have some sort of database, whether it’s emails or texts, some way to communicate with people who enter into their, um, funnel or their pipeline?

Chris Troka: 100%. It’s funny, there’s not many things that, you know, I, I go on to a, um, my soapbox to stand up for, but honestly, the, the biggest, uh, driver of growth was simply having a CRM system. A CRM stands for Customer relationship Management. So like you mentioned, this is either a database, maybe it’s a system, maybe you have an Excel spreadsheet. But there has to be one single point of truth where you can find the customer details, their customer journey, any notes or conversations that you have from them. Because this allows you, as you know, for most business owners, they’re um, they’re actually kind of in the day to day work as well. So for them to have, you know, take on that mental workload of trying to remember who did I talk to? What did we talk about? Because you’ll you’ll get to a point in your business where you have too many leads where you couldn’t possibly even remember mentally how many people you worked with or what the conversations were. So that CRM is able, is able to take that mental workload off of you, and then you can provide better service if you can quickly look for the past notes, the conversations, what’s unique about this customer that I need to address that’s really important to them. This can be a huge driver for growth and organization for the business. And anytime you have an outside agency or you want to look at your own numbers, you’re able to see, okay, I had X amount of leads this month. I had X amount of customers this month. And you’re able to back with data. What drivers of growth are in your business now.

Lee Kantor: Is there a story you can share? You mentioned the dentist a little bit, but maybe share the most meaningful for you, a client you had that came to you with a challenge. You don’t have to name the name of the organization, but maybe share their their challenge and how you were able to help them get to maybe a level they couldn’t even imagine that they got to.

Chris Troka: Yeah, absolutely. So I see this with a lot of entrepreneurs and business owners. Maybe they’ve been in business for a certain amount of time where that wasn’t important to them, or they’re doing a low enough volume where they don’t find that as important. So we have had some clients who did not have any idea when we asked them, okay, how many, how many leads do you get per year and how many customers do you get? Well, it’s I don’t know, Maybe it’s about this number. Maybe it’s about that. And, you know, we’re trying to understand it. So when we work together, we realize it is probably just better that we are able to take over some of those systems and build them for them. So one of our clients offers us offers a a divorce service, right. So what they do is they help people, um, they teach them how to handle their own divorce to save money as opposed to going to a lawyer. Right. So there’s a huge product differentiation there. But what we were able to do was replace the forms on their website that automatically logged the customer’s details into our CRM, and that would allow us to follow up and nurture them, uh, short term and long term to build more referrals, clients and relationships. So coming in with the system, the business doesn’t have to necessarily understand it.

Chris Troka: They don’t need to be in there working on it. We set up systems, uh, so that way we just do the work on our end, and then we let them know what to expect on their end instead of them going into, you know, a fancy CRM database, maybe we just send them email updates. We’ll say, hey, this, this, uh, this person reached out and is interested in learning more. This person took the next step. And so we just find ways to work within their current workflow and their process. So that way they don’t feel like, you know, too many things are changing. So once we were able to add that we had we had A2X increase into, uh, you know, people went from a lead into the next step. Uh, I wouldn’t call them a customer yet, but they took the next steps into filling out the information, and it’s quite a long form. So for someone to begin taking that next steps, they’re already invested a lot more, so much more likely for them to convert as a client. So it’s just one example of many where implementing a CRM, some sort of database for tracking and following your client communications has been so important for for growth of the business and backing that with data.

Lee Kantor: Now, you mentioned that your, um, I guess ideal client or ideal client? Uh, fit would be B2C, uh, local in terms of they’re frustrated with being kind of a best kept secret. Is there a size that, uh, you like to work with? Do they have to have a certain amount of sales for this to make sense?

Chris Troka: Sure. Um, so they may not need to have a particular amount of sales already. Typically businesses that are, uh, doing 50 plus. So at least maybe six figures would be great. Um, or a little bit more. The size of the team can either be a solo founder, maybe up to, you know, 10 to 20 employees. We’ve kind of seen a range between those businesses. Um, it’s funny because each business, they kind of evolve at their own pace, uh, in certain ways. So in, in one ways, one business develops and processes systems a little bit more, the other develops, um, their team a little bit more. So to be able to go in and kind of see what they’re looking at already, uh, the right fit client is, uh, customer who their lifetime or I’m sorry, not lifetime value, but their initial visit can be $1,000 plus or lifetime three K to infinity. So it’s really about that benchmark. On as long as your first initial touchpoint you’re you’re selling point is going to be about $1,000. This is a great way for us to be able to test different marketing strategies, find the the best return on investment, and then be able to demonstrate that to the business on what’s best for them.

Lee Kantor: So they don’t need to have $1 million in the bank to get launch with you. You have affordable ways to just kind of get it going, knowing that if it’s 1000 bucks at least, then that’s going to pay for itself down the road.

Chris Troka: Right? Absolutely. And that’s really important is that, you know, you don’t need to have a bunch of money to have to, uh, you know, be able to afford a marketing service. Uh, because honestly, it’s the five figure businesses that turn into the six figure. We’ve turned the six figure into the seven figure. So it’s really about, okay, you know, where you’re starting at. Like you mentioned, maybe they’re the best kept secret. Those are the businesses that we really like because they’re ambitious, they’re eager, they know what they have to offer and they’re willing to fight for it. And when you combine that with their customer service and our strategies, we’re able to just catapult and amplify that business.

Lee Kantor: Good stuff. Well, if somebody wants to learn more, have a more substantive conversation with you or somebody on the team, what’s the website? What’s the best way to connect?

Chris Troka: Of course, anyone can find me online, either searching Chris Trocha Trocha online, or they can go to my website at focus.

Lee Kantor: Com well, Chris, thank you so much for sharing your story today. You’re doing such important work and we appreciate you.

Chris Troka: Of course. Thank you so much, Lee, I appreciate it.

Lee Kantor: All right. This is Lee Kantor. We’ll see you all next time on High Velocity Radio.

TRANSCRIPT

The Human Element: Why Your CRM Needs More Than Just Software

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High Velocity Radio
High Velocity Radio
The Human Element: Why Your CRM Needs More Than Just Software
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In this episode of High Velocity Radio, host Lee Kantor interviews Jason Kramer, founder of Cultivize. They discuss the challenges businesses face with sales follow-up and CRM adoption. Jason explains how Cultivize helps companies choose, implement, and optimize CRM systems to improve lead conversion and prevent lost opportunities. He shares real-world examples, highlights the importance of ongoing support and accountability, and warns against underestimating CRM complexity and hidden costs. The episode offers practical advice for businesses seeking to build scalable, effective sales processes and maximize the value of their CRM investments.

Jason Kramer founded Cultivize, a CRM consulting firm specializing in lead nurturing strategies and technology. With 15 years of experience running a creative agency, he identified revenue gaps in marketing and sales funnels for distributors, service providers, marketing agencies, and manufacturers.

He launched Cultivize to provide customized CRM solutions and empower businesses to improve productivity, amplify lead conversions and provide detailed insights on customer journeys from the top of the funnel to the sale.

When not strategizing in CRM, he enjoys family time with his wife, two kids, and two dogs in their lively New York home and, when it’s warm, cruising on the Hudson River.

With over two decades of marketing experience, Jason’s career began in the early 2000s as a designer. He had the privilege of crafting campaigns for renowned brands such as Virgin Atlantic Airways and Johnnie Walker, igniting his passion for marketing and setting the stage for his future endeavors.

Fueled by an entrepreneurial spirit, he established a boutique agency where he and his team leveraged their expertise to launch numerous small businesses.

In 2018, he embarked on his second entrepreneurial venture, Cultivize, with a clear mission: to empower B2B and D2C organizations through tailored strategies. These strategies not only convert leads into loyal customers but also promote seamless collaboration between their sales and marketing departments.

Today, his team not only enables their clients to identify warm and hot leads instantaneously, but they also help sales teams guide prospects through their buying journey, ensuring they are educated and primed for conversion. Additionally, they help company leaders identify underperforming marketing campaigns to ensure their resources are invested wisely.

Connect with Jason on LinkedIn and YouTube.

What You’ll Learn In This Episode

  • Challenges in follow-up sales processes for businesses
  • Importance of Customer Relationship Management (CRM) systems
  • Common issues with CRM usage, including lack of tools and inconsistent application
  • Tailoring CRM systems to specific business needs
  • The significance of ongoing support and accountability in CRM implementation
  • Hidden costs associated with CRM software and the importance of understanding total cost of ownership
  • Differentiating between CRM systems and marketing automation tools
  • The role of expert guidance in successfully implementing CRM systems
  • Identifying gaps in current sales processes and improving lead conversion
  • Ideal customer profile for CRM system assistance and lead nurturing services

Transcript-iconThis transcript is machine transcribed by Sonix.

 

TRANSCRIPT

Intro: Broadcasting live from the Business RadioX studios in Atlanta, Georgia. It’s time for High Velocity Radio.

Lee Kantor: Lee Kantor here. Another episode of High Velocity Radio, and this is going to be a good one. Today on the show we have the founder of Cultivize, Jason Kramer. Welcome.

Jason Kramer: Thanks, Lee.

Lee Kantor: Well, I’m excited to learn what you’re up to. Tell us a little bit about cultivars. How are you serving folks.

Jason Kramer: Shirley. So we are helping a fundamental problem that I would say almost every business has. And you might ask, well, what is that? Um, and what I’m talking about, Lee, is follow up, um, salespeople don’t mind doing the follow up. We all know that, um, the problem is the process, right? Having a process to follow, to remember to do the follow up. And so what I help companies do is to make sure that things don’t fall through the cracks when it comes to their efforts to grow their business, to grow relationships. And we do that in a multiple. Different form of ways. But mostly we’re helping them build better systems to increase the lead to conversion they have for their business.

Lee Kantor: So where do these systems begin? Like where is usually kind of the hole in their swing?

Jason Kramer: So the hole is a great analogy. I love that one. It’s the first time I heard that. It usually begins because they don’t have a tool that they’re using, right? They’re working off of spreadsheets. Maybe they have a CRM, but they don’t really know how to use it or they’re not using it consistently. More importantly, management or leadership isn’t really giving them a clear direction on how to do what they need to do. So in other words, they’re hiring a salesperson because they’re a salesperson. They expect them to have all the tools in the toolbox. And I’ll throw another analogy at you. It’s like, hire a contractor who shows up with one hammer and one nail and one piece of wood. It’s not going to get very far if he doesn’t have the tools. Right? So that’s where we see the biggest flaws. The people are not given the tools to succeed.

Lee Kantor: So now so what happens? They say, okay, I’m having these issues. I call the folks at cultivars. What how does kind of relationship begin?

Jason Kramer: So think of me, Lee, as walking into a third grade classroom. I’m going to start talking to everybody to understand what are they doing now? Right. What are they doing at a very. The phone rings. Ring, ring. Somebody calling you to to potentially hire you for whatever you sell. What is the first thing you do? What are the questions you ask them? What’s the second thing you do? The third thing you do that starts to finding their process. As you can imagine, Lee, most people have that process up in their head. They don’t have it written down and they don’t follow that same process day in, day out. So we help them identify what their process is today, where those gaps are. Typically, we’re bringing in a piece of CRM software if they don’t have one. Or we might be looking at the current tool they have and figuring out why it’s not working, and make improvements and fixes with that tool.

Lee Kantor: So a CRM is that kind of a must have thing or a nice to have thing?

Jason Kramer: It depends upon what you’re doing. I would say in today’s day and age, I would say it’s a must have. Um, working off of scattered Google Sheets, writing things down on sticky notes or legal pads. It’s nearly impossible to scale a business with that mentality in that process. So if you’re in a business that I would say is over $1 million a year in revenue, you need to have some type of system where all your data is going in, and they can leverage that data to find those gaps, find what’s working, find what’s not working so that you can actually grow that business.

Lee Kantor: Now let’s play this out. So say I mean, I’ve been in business a long time and uh, we have used quite a few CRMs over the years, and I don’t think it’s the CRMs that are doing anything wrong, because I think inherently they’re doing, you know, what they’re supposed to do. But I think that the human that is working with it tends to be the, uh, kind of the, the thing that’s getting in the way because some of the CRMs are just too complicated. Like if you don’t, I guess if you don’t set them up properly initially or you don’t match the right CRM with your specific circumstance, you can run into a lot of problems. And there’s so many out there, some of them that are disguised as free or they start out being free, uh, can kind of get you into a path that might not really be the best end result.

Jason Kramer: I couldn’t agree more, Lee. And you said it very well. There’s nothing really more I can add to that to say that there are literally thousands and thousands of different CRMs out there. And you’re right, some of them are not even a CRM. They’re a project management tool that sells themselves as a CRM. And so it’s not the tool that’s going to make you a better salesperson or make the company grow or make your marketing better. It’s about understanding what it is you do right with your business, what makes you different, and and how are we going to use this tool right, to to enhance that. And so our role is what we we have something called the CRM fit assessment. And what that does is it helps identify where those gaps are, what the needs of the business are. Every business has a different need. You might have a business where you have 30 people driving around all day, going from house to house on appointments. You need something that’s mobile friendly, that’s going to help them track those routes, to organize them, to make them efficient. Another company may be just sitting at a desk all day writing quotes. So every business has different needs, different purposes. Um, our job is to find out what is the right solution to fit those needs. Um, but it comes down to something you mentioned, Lee.

Jason Kramer: Really important. You could have the best CRM out there, best one that money could buy and it could still be failing miserably. And you brought up the point. It’s about the people. If the people aren’t using the tool correctly, it’s never going to work. The biggest differentiator we have is that we’re not just coming in and making these recommendations and building a beautiful system. We’re an accountability partner. And that’s really our sweet spot, is that we’ll stay on board indefinitely. We’ve had clients we’ve had for years. Every single month we still meet with the entire sales team. We still meet with the leadership team on an ongoing basis. We look to see how the CRM is being leveraged. Is it being used in a way that is meaningful? Are there things we can improve? Um, that’s the other piece of this is that a CRM is a living, breathing thing, right? We both know that. And for the listeners that don’t know or may have seen this frustration, you can’t set it up and build it. It’s not like a website where you can just build it and walk away, and five years later it’s going to function the same way. You have to be in there consistently making adjustments to serve the better good of the company.

Lee Kantor: And, um, how do you help kind of manage, uh, create a balance, maybe is a better word than manage between or instead of balance, maybe a harmony between all of the things that a CRM can do and all of the things I needed to do. Uh, because a lot of these CRM just seem loaded with all kinds of features that sound good and would be fantastic, but I don’t know, sometimes that creates too much complexity that gets too hard to even, you know, input information or manage the information. So it doesn’t really serve me in the long run. Like how do you help me? Number one, choose the right CRM. And number two, um, make it work seamlessly in the way that my people work.

Jason Kramer: Sure. So to answer the first question, we have to identify the immediate needs. What are those needs? You might be a need to track your pipeline, right? The deals that are going through the stages of your sales process. It might be a need to do email marketing. It might be a need to build better communications between prospects or existing customers for your customer service team. So we have to identify what those needs are. And you’re absolutely right. Most CRMs are going to have more tools than you actually need, or even have a value for it to bring to the company. It doesn’t mean you’ll never need those tools. It just may be a phase two, phase three, or even a year or two down the road situation where that might come into play. Um, we do a lot of work with HubSpot. Hubspot is a great platform, but it’s a perfect example where there’s all these different tools they offer. Every set of tools is a different price point. And so sometimes you get sold all these things that you don’t really need. Um, and so that’s how we do it. We, we, we understand what are the immediate goals and the future needs. And we make sure that the tool we’re providing and recommending is going to service both you in the short term while you’re meeting those initial goals. But it’s also going to help you in year two, year three, year five to meet those new needs as your company grows. And I’m sorry, if you don’t mind repeating the second part of the question, I’d be happy to answer that as well.

Lee Kantor: Sure. I just think that, um, a take HubSpot, for example. I mean, they start out with some free thing that you can kind of they the implication is this is easy to implement in, uh, in, you know, to start with. Right. And then as soon as you take a step in, all of a sudden there’s a lot of choices I have to make. And there’s a lot of, you know, it’s a choose your own adventure kind of thing starting to happen here. And and as you’re doing it, you’re realizing the more I do this, the more I’m getting wed to HubSpot. Um, and I gotta. Now I have to be kind of careful, because do I really want to go down these variety of paths before I even know if this is going to work?

Jason Kramer: Absolutely. And so and that’s a great example where, you know, there’s a study that Harvard Business Review did that said, almost 70% of businesses that try to implement a CRM on their own will completely fail. It’s not because they’re not smart people. They’re doing something they’ve never done. If I were to go to my car in my driveway, Lee, and try to rebuild that engine, and I’ve never rebuilt that engine before, I might be able to figure it out. Chances are I’m going to break something, cause more damage, and it’s going to be more expensive to fix the mess I made. A CRM is no different. Um, and by all means, you know, and HubSpot does one of the best jobs, and I’m not knocking them because there’s a great product. They make these systems seem simple. We’ve been doing this for over 15 years. It still takes us 30 to 50 hours to fully set up, at minimum, a HubSpot account the right way. And we know what we’re doing right. So imagine we didn’t know what we were doing. Now you’re talking about probably six months to a year of fiddling around on and off, and it’s still not perfect. And so that’s the trap is that it’s the allure, that it looks simple. But the reality is, is that you have to understand the inner complexity of how it all works and how all the pieces go together. Otherwise it’s never going to deliver what you’re hoping it’ll deliver.

Lee Kantor: So now it sounds like, um, your hypothesis and your value proposition is that, look, CRMs, they might be selling it to the end user as a simple, easy to implement solution, but in fact, it’s not. This is something you need an expert to really help you, um, launch if you want to really get the most out of it and that you can’t kind of not have an expert holding your hand to sherpa you through the beginnings of this, or else the odds are this is not going to work for you in the manner that you’re you’re thinking it is.

Jason Kramer: Yeah. And the other piece too, is so there’s other two huge factors that people don’t think about. So one is the total cost of ownership. You brought up a great point, Lee, where a lot of these software companies will offer you a free trial or they’ll they’ll come in and be like, oh, it’s $50 a month for a basic tool. But then when you realize that you don’t have access to like 80% of what the tool can do, and now you go from 50 a month to 850 a month, or to a couple thousand a month, you don’t anticipate what the total cost of that tool is going to be as your team grows over time as well. And so what I often caution people is if you could afford even $50 a month today, the real question is, can you afford $2,000 a month in year two when you need to afford $2,000 a month or a year from now. And if you can’t afford that, and if you have no budget for that, you shouldn’t even be using the $50 or the free version. Reason being moving from one CRM to another, and I’m sure I don’t know. Lee, I’m sure you’ve moved from one house to another at least once in your life. And how I have. It’s like moving, right? It’s a pain in the butt. It is not a pleasant experience. It’s not difficult in the sense of when you work with somebody that knows how to do it, but it could be a real time suck. And it could be expensive too, perhaps. So it’s not to say that it can happen, but it’s the one thing you want to try to avoid.

Jason Kramer: So my point is, is that you don’t want to use a tool and be like, oh, this tool will be good for for me for six months, for a year. But then I know I’ll grow it. I’ll move into something else. You’re better off waiting to have the budget to get into that better tool, so that you can grow and scale into it. The other thing people don’t think about is support. A lot of these platforms have really terrible support. So now imagine I’m out there trying to change the engine to my car. I don’t have access to anybody with experience. You know, I’m sending an email to somebody that’s getting back to me three days a week later with a potential answer that may not even be the answer I’m looking for. And so it becomes a very frustrating experience. And so one thing that you always want to ask people when you’re looking at a CRM or quite frankly, any piece of business software, what kind of support do you have? And what are your your response times and how can I communicate? Can I actually get on the phone and talk to somebody in support? Can I get on a video call and share my screen? Is it going to be me submitting a ticket and waiting a week to hear back? A lot of people don’t ask that question, and often get quite unpleasantly surprised on how terrible the support is. And generally, the rule of thumb is the less expensive the software, the worse the support is.

Lee Kantor: Yeah, this is an example. I think that, um, from a consumer standpoint, you think you’re buying something that is a set it and forget it, and it’s way more complex than that. And in order to really get any true value from it, you need help. And it’s not being sold that way. They’re selling it as this is simple and easy and anybody can do this. And so you always think that it’s not working for me because I’m doing something wrong. We used to have a client, um, a while ago. We used to do the radio for a group called Oracle Application Users Group. And this, this were consultants that if a big company installed Oracle, they had to hire consultants to implement Oracle. Like it wasn’t like Oracle was going to do this. There’s a whole ecosystem of consultants that help you after you spent millions of dollars to buy Oracle to make it work specifically for your situation, you have to hire them. It’s not going to work. You can’t just buy Oracle, plug it in and then walk away. It doesn’t work like that. So CRMs to me seem like kind of a watered down version of that. Like this is something that’s not super expensive up front, but you do need help to make it work for you. It’s not going to work off the shelf.

Jason Kramer: No. And I always say, and it’s kind of a little saying I have, but software will not solve your problems. It’s only the people that are behind it that are going to help solve the problems. And that’s a marketing does a good job of making you convincing you that the software will solve the problem. Um, but it almost never does on its own.

Lee Kantor: Yeah. And I think that I think people always blame themselves. It’s like when you, you know, get that new diet or that new, um, weight loss thing, you think that, oh, I bought it. So now I’m done. But you still have to do the work or hire some expert to help you make it work. Or else it’s never going to work.

Jason Kramer: Yeah, you have to put in the work, too. I mean, it’s like going to the gym, right? And you could be working with the best trainer that’s training all these celebrities and getting amazing results for them. But if you’re not doing the work at the gym or you’re doing the work, but then you come home and you’re eating fast food every day, you’re not helping yourself, right? Get to to your goal. And so there’s definitely a human element to make this work for sure.

Lee Kantor: So now is there a story you can share, maybe a company that came to you with a challenge, and how you and you were able to help them get to a new level? Is there you obviously don’t name the name, but maybe shared the problem they had before you and then after you how it turned out?

Jason Kramer: Yeah, I would love to. So about a year and a half ago, um, we had a family run business in the, uh, commercial and residential roofing business, um, in, um, and I’ll name this state, that’s okay. In New Hampshire and New York, for those that are listening, maybe abroad. Um. I’m sorry. New Hampshire, us And, um, their problem was, is that they were just working off of spreadsheets. Li this was a company doing about, um, $7 million, roughly a year. Um, with only two salespeople at the time. And what would happen is what you would, might expect. They would get a phone call for a lead. Someone’s interested in getting a quote. Salesperson has to go to the home, do an inspection, look at the project, give a proposal, and then after a few weeks, if they didn’t hear back, they would just assume that that homeowner decided to hire somebody else or decided not to move forward. And they didn’t have the bandwidth to follow up past about the five week mark. And so you could only imagine doing about a thousand quotes a year, how much millions of dollars of revenue they were losing because they just couldn’t follow up. And so the solution we built was a automated, um, email system where after that stage, after the the salesperson reached out a bunch of times, couldn’t make any headway while the person ghosted them and just sort of disappeared.

Jason Kramer: The system would kick in and it would send an email roughly every six weeks and would say, hey, Lee, we came to your house at 123 Main Street, you know, at the colonial Home. There you have, um, a couple months ago. We’re just wondering if you hired anybody for the roof. You know, we’d love to do the project if you have hired somebody, if you don’t mind taking a one question survey and letting us know, you know why you chose somebody else, we’d appreciate that. And if you’re still interested, let me know. And so different versions of those emails went out. Lee for almost a year and a half. Okay. And they all came from the salesperson’s email address from their name. It was a plain what I call plain text email. So meaning there was no fancy graphics or anything like that. It looked like, you know, John actually sent this message to you. And wouldn’t you know that in nine months, 15 months you had people responding to this email? Yes, we do still want to go forward. We didn’t hire anybody. We’re just waiting to for the tax refund to come. Or we’re waiting for the money for the insurance or what have you. And they closed last year in 2025, $4.1 million in revenue that would have otherwise been lost from a whole sequence of different automated emails we’ve set up for them.

Lee Kantor: Now, in your experience, what percentage of businesses do that where they just take one shot and then say, oh, that didn’t work out, and then just walk away and never pursue the person again and follow up in any meaningful manner.

Jason Kramer: I don’t have the actual number, Lee, but but I’m telling you, from my experience, it’s more than 50%. I mean, the majority don’t because they’re they’re just either uncomfortable. They’re like, I don’t want to be a pest. Lee, you know, I met Lee six months ago. Like, he’s going to think I’m annoying. I don’t want to call him again. Or they just they don’t have the confidence or whatever the excuse they want to make for themselves. They don’t have the time or they don’t have a CRM. Right? They don’t have even have a spreadsheet, so they don’t even remember that they met you six months ago. Right. They’re doing so many proposals every day. They don’t even remember who you are. So without a system this things like this fall through the cracks left and right at companies across all different industries.

Lee Kantor: So how are you differentiating a CRM from like a marketing automation system?

Jason Kramer: Oh, Lee, I love that question. All right, so let me first let me back up a little bit. So for those people that are listening, the audience here, I would define a CRM because everybody’s going to have a different definition. Um, a CRM is going to have the ability to store all of your contacts, whether they be vendors, customers, prospects, even, um, other people you association might be working with and be able to define them and segment them in a specific way. It’s also going to be a place where you can store all of your company records. So you might be a business where you’re selling into other companies. You might want information not only about the contact the person, but about the company themselves. It’s also going to have a sales suite of tools. You know, I think of it as like a dashboard to track all the deals you’re working on, all the opportunities. And the fourth component is going to be email marketing. A good CRM is going to have the marketing automation built into it, right? And that’s going to be marketing automation to help the sales team, but it’s also going to help the marketing team, and whether that be an internal or external team.

Jason Kramer: And what I’m talking about is monthly newsletters. Um, what we call drip campaigns, where you might get an email every couple of weeks, every couple of months. Um, for those people in e-commerce, it might be a thank you for your order. Or hey, we noticed you bought this from us a few months ago. You might also like this other product. So marketing automation is a huge. I can’t even stress enough a huge, huge component to a successful CRM platform. So now not all of them have it, by the way. You know, like the smaller, more expensive ones don’t have that tool. So, you know, definitely you want to be at the not not the, you know, Salesforce level or the Oracle level where you’re spending, you know, hundreds of thousands of dollars a year, but certainly something that’s going to be a step up from like a Pipedrive or something like that, where it’s not going to be as sophisticated to do those sort of things.

Lee Kantor: So how do you kind of describe your ideal customer? Is it that end user who is struggling with what they have right now, or do you work through third party partners? Like what? Who is your ideal customer?

Jason Kramer: Oh, sure. So, um, the ideal perfect customer for us. And this is, you know, a little bit of a broad spectrum, but it’s a company that’s generally been in business. So we look at companies that are generally $3 million and up, um, generally 3 million to 100 million is our typical range. They’re generally going to also have, um, anywhere from five to 20 or 30 salespeople working for them. Uh, and they’re also going to be spending money on marketing. Um, one thing to point out to your audience, Lee, we’re not a marketing agency. We do not provide any leads. We don’t do lead gen. We help with lead nurturing. So once the lead knocks on your door, we invite them in and help you build that relationship to convert them into a customer. Um, so we’re looking for companies that have a steady pipeline, a company that has no leads or gets, you know, five referrals a month isn’t really a good fit for us because there’s not much we could do with that such small volume of lead flow. So it’s not like we need hundreds or thousands of leads a month or a week, but we need a company that is getting consistent leads in the door. Um, and we work with a multitude of industries. I mentioned construction. We also do a lot of work in B2B, um, professional services manufacturing, um, and a slew of other industries where, uh, that consistent again, you know, problem exists where they’re doing a lot of proposals, a lot of quotes, and they just don’t have a system to follow up.

Lee Kantor: So what is kind of the main trigger, the main kind of pain they’re feeling right before they contact you. Where are they feeling? Like, who notices it first? Is this the CFO, the CEO, the sales manager? Like, who says, hey, we got a problem. We better call Jason in this team.

Jason Kramer: It’s usually the the head of marketing or the head of sales that recognizes the problem and the reason they recognize that problem. It’s pretty simple. They don’t have any any data. They don’t have any reports. So if the owner of the company, or even if the owner themselves is saying, what do we have that’s out there in proposals right now? Um, where are they at in the process? How long did it take us to close deals last year? What was the average amount of time? Um, what was the average order value or the or the deal size? Right. Or how much does Tony have in his in his pipeline right now versus Mary? If they’re asking questions and there’s no answers, that’s the aha moment. Like oh crap. Like like what’s going on here. Like how do we not know this information. And it’s surprising Even these companies we talked to that are north of $1 million. A lot of them don’t have this data. They just don’t have it because they haven’t built these systems to be able to gather the information that’s needed. Um, so I’d say that’s the change. The other change, Lee, is when you have, you know, the what I’ll call the heroes, where you’re coming new into a role. You’re now the new head of marketing, the head of sales in an organization. You’ve been there for a few months, you start seeing what’s going on, and you’re recognizing they don’t have the proper systems and tools to allow you to do your job correctly and to succeed. And so that’s where they tend to bring in, um, other vendors, partners like cultivars to help right the ship and fix the problems that their predecessor had created.

Lee Kantor: So if somebody wants to learn more, have a more substantive conversation with you or somebody on the team, or maybe take that assessment to see where they’re at and what they need. What is the website? What’s the best way to connect?

Jason Kramer: Sure. So the best place to get to me is going to after the lead com. I’ll say it one more time after the lead com. You can connect with me there. Um on LinkedIn all the social platforms we do have the assessment there and some other, um, quick downloads that are all complimentary to your audience to help them in any part of this journey they have. So the one thing to lastly point out is we’re not just out here selling CRMs. We work with a lot of companies that already have a tool. It’s a good tool. They just don’t know how to use it. And we’ll come in and help them get better leverage out of that platform.

Lee Kantor: Well, Jason, thank you so much for sharing your story today. You’re doing such important work and we appreciate you.

Jason Kramer: Thank you. Lee, appreciate the opportunity to be here.

Lee Kantor: All right. This is Lee Kantor. We’ll see you all next time on High Velocity Radio.

The Art of Listening: Best Practices for Growing Businesses with Davenport Capital

by

Atlanta Business Radio
Atlanta Business Radio
The Art of Listening: Best Practices for Growing Businesses with Davenport Capital
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In this episode of Atlanta Business Radio, Lee interviews Thomas Davenport, Managing Partner at Davenport Capital Management. Thomas discusses his firm’s patient capital approach to investing in privately held companies, focusing on long-term value and partnership rather than quick exits. He shares insights on selecting high-integrity management teams, the importance of cultural fit, and best practices for business growth. The conversation highlights Davenport Capital’s commitment to supporting family-owned businesses through thoughtful transitions, sustainable growth, and collaborative relationships, offering a compelling alternative to traditional private equity models.

Thomas Davenport is an entrepreneur, operator, and board member focused on building and overseeing businesses in manufacturing and commercial services.

He is the Managing Partner of Davenport Capital Management (DCM), a private holding company that owns a portfolio of operating companies across infrastructure, industrial services, and manufacturing.

DCM’s portfolio includes Direct Services Group, a technical infrastructure services company supporting telecommunications and energy networks; Steeltoe Advisory, an industrial-focused investment banking and advisory business; and Shakespeare Company, a materials science and specialty manufacturing company. Thomas serves on the board of each of the portfolio companies.

His work centers on leadership, execution, and long-term value creation.

Connect with Thomas on LinkedIn.

What You’ll Learn In This Episode

  • Davenport Capital Management’s patient capital strategy for investing in privately held companies.
  • The contrast between patient capital and traditional private equity approaches focused on quick exits.
  • Importance of integrity, management quality, and cultural fit in investment decisions.
  • Thomas Davenport’s background in investment banking and its influence on his investment philosophy.
  • Criteria for selecting companies to invest in, including management integrity and business potential.
  • The significance of thorough due diligence and post-acquisition planning.
  • The role of cultural alignment in fostering successful partnerships with businesses.
  • Strategies for sourcing investment opportunities and building relationships with potential sellers.
  • Best practices for growing businesses, including the importance of listening and understanding employee dynamics.
  • The benefits of a mindful, planned sale versus urgent transactions for business owners.

Transcript-iconThis transcript is machine transcribed by Sonix.

 

TRANSCRIPT

Intro: Broadcasting live from the Business RadioX studio in Atlanta, Georgia. It’s time for Atlanta Business Radio, brought to you by Kennesaw State University’s Executive MBA program. The accelerated degree program for working professionals looking to advance their career and enhance their leadership skills. And now here’s your host.

Lee Kantor: Lee Kantor here, another episode of Atlanta Business Radio. And this is going to be a good one. But before we get started, it’s important to recognize our sponsor, CSU’s executive MBA program. Without them, we couldn’t be sharing these important stories. Today on the show, we have the managing partner with Davenport Capital Management, Thomas Davenport. Welcome.

Thomas Davenport: Thank you.

Lee Kantor: Well, I’m excited to learn what you’re up to. Tell us about Davenport Capital Management. How are you serving, folks?

Thomas Davenport: Sure. So Davenport Capital Management is a holding company, and we invest similar to private equity, where we are buying companies that are privately held and implementing a value creation strategy to help grow those businesses, implement technological improvements and, you know, get a return for ourselves or our shareholders as we think about exiting. But being a holding company, there are opportunities in businesses where if it aligns appropriately, we don’t have to exit and we can keep those companies in perpetuity.

Lee Kantor: So is that a difference between what you do in a private equity firm, like a private equity firm is looking to exit?

Thomas Davenport: Correct. That that is a differentiator. And, you know, we everyone says that they have patient capital. But we’re you know, we’re walking walking the talk if you will.

Lee Kantor: So what’s your backstory? How’d you get involved in this line of work?

Thomas Davenport: Sure. So I grew up as a financial services professional and spent some time in New York on Wall Street as an investment banker, covering the types of companies that I work with daily. So I was in what they called an industrials investment banker. So I focused on manufacturing and distribution businesses as well as commercial services. So think kind of blue collar services. And those are those are the types of businesses and operators that we partner with in our day to day lives.

Lee Kantor: So what got you interested in that niche? I mean, what what about it kind of drew you to that?

Thomas Davenport: You know, for me, you know, when you’re when you’re going through the recruiting process that is investment banking, you know, it always comes up, you know, what are you you know, what sectors do you want to focus in. And for me, I like tangible assets I like companies that are making widgets, I like touring plants and facilities. I like thinking about line optimization. And so it, you know, the manufacturing space and space and the services ecosystem just resonates well with me. And I think it’s because I grew up where my, my dad actually was responsible for, for building post offices. And so he did a lot of infrastructure work. And I kind of gleaned some of the things from him about his day to day work. And then my mom is a financial services professional, so I kind of just blended, I guess, the elements of the two of them to, to formulate my own path.

Lee Kantor: So when you went out on your own and you were going to be the one making the investment in these organizations, what had you learned? That kind of gives you an edge to determine, okay, I should invest in this one, but not this one. Like, are there things you look for or are the red flags green flags? Like what? What is kind of gets on your radar or something positive and also what’s on your radar as a potential negative.

Thomas Davenport: So I think foundationally when I got into the investment banking business, my first clients out of business school were family offices. And so family offices look and feel like private equity at the larger levels. But again, they have kind of that patient capital. And in advising those companies I got to meet a number of managers. Um, and we you know, when you’re going through an M&A transaction, you’re spending a lot of time with these folks. Uh, and, you know, they would kind of tell me stories or give me lessons learned. And so I think that helped me develop, um, some instinct and intuition around what, what our red flags and what does good look like. And then so if you were to say, what what are we looking for? We want to be the first, uh, outside capital provider into a company. Um, we’re looking for businesses that have high integrity management teams, folks going through some type of inflection point, whether that’s succession planning, um, absentee ownership or some catalyst for why they need to find a new sponsor or need to exit the business. Uh, and we spend a lot of time with these management teams while we’re diligence ING the business, but also kind of looking towards the post close future with kind of our 100 day plan and, um, and our value creation exercise on the back end. And so it’s a lot, of, lot of legwork around, can I see myself working with these folks every day? Uh, one so call it they call it the airplane test. But two, you know what? What are the the growth levers that we can augment? And does it align well with, with our capabilities and our Rolodex and and our track record of, of growing and building businesses.

Lee Kantor: Now, you mentioned a couple times this, um, kind of patient investing style. Why do you see that as advantageous? Uh, rather than go to the private equity route where they are looking to exit after a fairly short period of time.

Thomas Davenport: I think for a lot of owner entrepreneurs, they they may be, you know, first, second or third generation business owners, and they’ve been pillars in their community and they’ve been a job creator and a job provider. Um, and so being in a situation where we’re patient and where we’re willing to kind of pay a fair value, but we’re, you know, we don’t want to over lever the business or we don’t want to come in and put too much debt in or strip it apart. That’s not our play. Um, that resonates well with folks that are thinking about the legacy and the continuity for their employees on the back end. And so the ability to to walk into a situation, evaluate and be thoughtful about your, your systematic change, um, tends to resonate really well with, with owner entrepreneurs. And to the extent they end up staying with us post transition, which often happens a year or two post close. We will work with with the seller, um, to truly transition the business. Um, just making sure that we’re going to be a thoughtful partner, um, in our evaluation of the business, but also in our, in our desires to kind of move processes and implement our own thoughts going forward so that that patient just seems to want to think it bodes well for really good decisions. But two, um, it aligns well with seller expectations around who’s here, who’s care. They’re going to entrust their business to post close.

Lee Kantor: Now I can definitely see how, uh, the person selling the business to you would appreciate that, because they don’t want to be another one of the horror stories of, you know, a company that just ladled with debt and then, you know, sold for parts a few years later. But why? Why did you choose to go the path you’ve gone? It sounds like that, that that culture and values are important to you. Like you weren’t looking at this as just a transactional, you know, way to make money. Um, just by, you know, kind of buying and selling and flipping a business.

Thomas Davenport: Correct. Yeah. I think the, the folks that I worked with early in my career and what I admired is that they were able to take companies and have them in kind of in the family business for, you know, a decade plus. Um, and that was really attractive just to see how they, they had evolved their holdings over time. Um, and I think, you know, from a, from a job creation and, you know, I also have a background in public policy. Um, you know, I think we’re we’re kind of doing our part as well in terms of contributing to the economy, upskilling employees and and making sure that in this in what is kind of an uncertain landscape in front of us, with all the technology advancements, that there’s good folks at the table helping create value and having respect and and reverence for for the people that do do create that value.

Lee Kantor: Now, in the industry that you’re in, um, what percent take the tact that you take versus the private equity kind of flip a business tact. Are you in the minority or do more?

Thomas Davenport: Yeah, I would say we’re in the minority. I think there’s there’s there’s a lot of pressure, um, from from the allocators to find teams that can go in, create value. And it has its place. I mean, that there’s they’re serving a need as well. But, you know, we’re looking to, to, to align with and partner with sellers, um, more so than kind of come in and and tell them everything was wrong and, and change everything up. But and certainly not to vilify or demonize other participants in, in the buyout space. There’s a lot of great folks. Um, But we just we found attacked. Uh, it seems to work. It seems to resonate. And so we continue to move forward.

Lee Kantor: Do you see more firms, uh, kind of going the way that you’re going or, like, is this a trend now or is this something are you kind of a contrarian?

Thomas Davenport: Uh, you know, I think we are. I think there is a trend. I think there’s, you know, anywhere you can make a profit, there’ll be folks to follow. Um, but I think this is something that I saw 20 years ago when I got into the business. And, you know, I’m kind of following in the footsteps of folks that I’ve personally admired and companies that I’ve seen grow and execute well. So.

Lee Kantor: So what if a private equity person was here? What would they say that to say? Oh, Thomas, that’s not how to do this. This. You’re doing it wrong. Like, this is like, what is the what is how are they seeing things so differently than you’re seeing them?

Thomas Davenport: Different incentives. You know, we’re we’re investing our own capital. And then I’m also aligning with and I’m aligning candidly with some private equity firms that that view the world similarly to us. Right. They do they do take a patient tack. They they are thoughtful about the, the, you know, GPS or holding companies or folks that they’re other investors they’re working with. Um, so there are people in the industry that definitely align with us. If someone was a little different than us, then they may say, look, we’ve got, you know, capital that’s been allocated to us. Um, we can be more aggressive because we’re time bound. Uh, and, you know, being more aggressive could end up being a better price for the seller, right? So the seller could walk away with with more cash at close than maybe what we’re looking to do, because we really seek alignment from from sellers. And that could be alignment, could be staying on in the business alignment could be, um, rolling equity. It could be, you know, helping us with some seller financing. Um, and so, you know, if you want a all cash deal and, you know, take it and run. We’re we’re probably not your partner, but there are enough participants in the, in the markets that you can probably find that partner if you got a good business.

Lee Kantor: Now, when you’re choosing which companies to partner with, um, are they typically coming to you or are you finding them and then saying, hey, you know, is it time to think about a transition? Like, like who is courting who?

Thomas Davenport: Uh, it’s a bit of a mix, probably 80 over 20. We’re courting the company versus them courting us. But there are times where I might get a center of influence. Maybe their attorney calls me and says, hey, I’ve got a situation that you you should look at. Um, so, you know, usually attorneys, accountants, other trusted That advisers may may knock on our door and show us opportunities. We see quite a bit from the investment banking firms around the country. And so there, you know, we’ve been doing this long enough that we get inbound deal flow. And then, you know, I attend a lot of trade shows for our portfolio companies. And so just in the natural ecosystem of meeting other operators that can spark, uh, opportunities and conversations around acquisition.

Lee Kantor: So what type of activity should a leader of one of these companies be doing to catch your eye? Like what? What are you looking for? Um, you know, when you are on the lookout for the next opportunity, what are some of the things they could be doing that you might perk up and say, hey, maybe we should check these guys out.

Thomas Davenport: Uh, you know, I think, you know, at the core for us is high integrity management team. So operating your business in a, in a, in a fashion that, that is, that is rigorous and credible, and and you’re following the rules. Um, I think that’s foundational. And then the other piece is, you know, we’re looking for companies typically that have diversified customer base, um, long standing relationships, um, some, some level of secret sauce or some edge in the marketplace. Um, and, and then the other piece is just, you know, as we meet folks through trade shows or, um, or find folks through centers of influence, um, being open to a conversation and being candid, um, you know, we’re we’re not going to abscond with the company. And we’re also not afraid of warts. I mean, privately held businesses do a lot of great things and do a lot of great things well, and there are some things that require some improvement or need a different perspective to, to help it execute efficiently. And I think that’s where we think we offer value. Uh, so we’re not afraid to have the tough conversations. We’re not afraid to talk about the deficiencies in the business.

Lee Kantor: Now, is there a story you can share? You don’t have to name the name of the company, but maybe share. They came to you and maybe they had plateaued. Maybe they were. You know, it was one of these succession situations where the leader just wanted to exit and wanted to partner with you, but you were able to kind of give them a boost and maybe get them to a level they had never attained on their own.

Thomas Davenport: Yeah. So I had a business that I worked with a handful of years ago. Um, the management team had actually bought the company back from private equity. They were not happy with their sponsor. Um, and the business kind of going through the Great Recession had had shrunk in half. And so management felt like they could they could grow the business back better and more efficiently than the sponsor could. Um, sponsor being private equity owner. And, uh, they bought the business back they had, you know, they had grown the business organically. They were in a legacy, um, Financing facility at a at a bank where they had changed relationship managers for 4 or 5 times through the ownership period. And so we’re kind of an orphan at their financial institution. Uh, and they kind of approached, um, us around, you know, could could we invest some, some growth capital in the business? Uh, and so what we did after looking at the business, we we ended up investing some growth capital, but also helped them move to a new bank home. Um, where we had a relationship and they would get the right kind of attention and guidance and support.

Thomas Davenport: Uh, and that business grew three x under our leadership. Um, we helped them, you know, originally they wanted to buy other companies, um, and we discovered that that an organic growth strategy in the sectors that they played was going to be a much better return on capital, and they were able to grow again three x organically, just through kind of evaluating without the headache of trying to integrate other kind of small engineering firms. And so that that was a success story. We helped transition. The existing CEO, helped him retire, groomed the CFO to take his place, and then backfilled kind of some key management roles in the organization. We formalized a board of directors to help provide them some guidance and also provide a bridge to help them with the business development side of the of the equation. And so, you know, all in all things, things worked well, doesn’t mean they weren’t challenging days, doesn’t mean that all all ideas were well received initially. But I think we we learned how to work well together. And that guidance ended up creating meaningful value for all involved.

Lee Kantor: Now for doing this for so long with so many different types of companies, have you learned some kind of Just best practices when it comes to taking a business to a new level that may be just a listener today might benefit from. Are there some do’s and don’ts that you like to implement when you’re working with a company that you know has a high probability of success that can help them grow or, or, uh, you know, maybe create the culture that they need to grow?

Thomas Davenport: Look, I think there are some foundational parts of the exercise that I think create value. Um, in every but the the value creation execution looks different in every company. So fundamentally listen more than you speak. You’ve got managers at the table sometimes have been at a company 30 years. I mean, take in and and hear, hear what they’re saying. Also hear what they’re not saying. Um, they’re there every, you know, every once we start telling our own stories, um, you know, we we become disciples of that story and so that that’s how we position it. But what are the what are they leaving out? What were the missed opportunities? What were some of the things in between the lines? Uh, and to the extent that you’re listening and not having preconceived notions, that’ll help you idiot. I think on better, better ideas and how to triage business issues. Um, and I think the other piece is just, um. Just being thoughtful about about execution and understanding kind of employee dynamics and some of the interpersonal piece. I think good bedside manner goes a long way. Um, and learning how to, how to navigate, um, the various personalities, especially as you’re, you’re an outsider implementing change. You may be the owner on the door, but they’ve been reporting to a different party for for years. So tread lightly with, with existing allegiances and learn how to curry favor appropriately. I think the the human people side of things is, is is a very big driver in getting getting the most out of the workforce that you inherit.

Lee Kantor: Now, when you’re deciding which companies to partner with, how are you kind of judging their culture? And is that an important kind of make or break part of the equation for you?

Thomas Davenport: Uh, yeah, I spend time. I mean, we spend a lot of time with the with the company and the management team members. I always tell them, look, we’re going to date for a bit here. Um, so we’re going to have dinners. We’re going to I’m going to pop by for coffee. I might do a ride along with you. Um, you know, depending on the advisor that they have in place, I mean, a good investment banker is not going to let you be too intrusive. Um, but to the extent that I can spend time with them and just get to know them and understand the business. Well, I think that’s a that’s a big piece of making sure we’re confident that we’re going to allocate millions of dollars towards, you know, buying this business and growing this business.

Lee Kantor: Now, what is kind of that ideal client for you? What is that business look like in terms of size, number of employees? Like what are the kind of at least the foundational elements you need for platforms?

Thomas Davenport: Now we’re targeting companies 50 million to $250 million in revenue. That’s kind of what they you know, it’s a broad range of what they call the lower middle market. Um, for add on acquisitions for existing portfolio companies will look smaller. I mean, it will go down as little as 10 million of revenue. If if we think it’s going to be added to the business. Um, but that’s, that’s kind of our, our sweet spot, which is below the radar of a lot of kind of large scale if, if there are household name private equity firms where they play. Um, but there’s a, you know, there’s a large swath of American businesses and, and baby boomer generation that need to need to sell and transact. And so there’s there’s a lot of fertile ground. And I think those types, those size businesses are also on the the precipice of opportunity where you can continue to scale them. And, and, and there’s a lot that you can do.

Lee Kantor: Now are you I would imagine you want to start a conversation with these people well before it’s time to make a decision. Like how far in advance do you like to at least initiate some sort of getting to know you conversations?

Thomas Davenport: Uh, outside of a catalyst, meaning, you know, something happens in, in they just have to transact, um, like life happens or there’s some dynamic at the table where they need to need to go. And we’d like to meet folks maybe a year in advance. Um, I think I think, you know, a long courtship is not necessarily the it’s not necessarily an advantage. Um, you know, kind of like you have buyers that are tire kickers, you have sellers that are tire kickers. And so if you’re courting someone two and three years, that’s, that’s that’s not our, our thing. We, you know, we like to find folks that are, you know, thoughtfully planning, thinking about a transition. But they’ve but they’ve kind of made there’s, there’s an emotional piece of this M&A process, especially if you’ve been owning and owning and running a business for a while, where they just need to make peace with the fact that they want to make the transition. And I think once that clicks, that’s probably a year’s worth of planning and then execution on a transaction.

Lee Kantor: But does it work better when there is some sense of I’m like, I’m mindfully doing this rather than I have to do this.

Thomas Davenport: Ah, yes, there there is. Yeah. I think, you know, books are better, things are cleaner. Um, your folks have had time to really think about it. Hopefully they thought about some succession planning. So if if there’s some thoughtful planning in front of it. One. You probably get a better valuation. And two. You’ve you’ve, um. You just likely inherit as a, as a buyer a better, um, management team and circumstance for, for the transaction.

Lee Kantor: Right. I would imagine if you have to make a move, then it could be more chaotic and there might be more triaging of situations where if they know, okay, this is going to happen at around this time, systems and transfers can be in place and nobody’s kind of blindsided.

Thomas Davenport: Correct. And that being said, that’s where it helps having a sophisticated buyer on the other side that’s gone through this multiple times because I’ve we’ve bought things out of bankruptcy. We’ve had, you know, very short, you know, court mandated timelines to get things done, diligence. And we keep a we keep an army of of due diligence advisors at the ready. Um, for circumstances like that. Uh, and so I think buyer sophistication matters a lot. If you if you got a situation where you need to move quickly and and thoughtfully.

Lee Kantor: But it’s interesting because you, you the the buyer, you’re the buyer who is seasoned veterans, but you prefer people that this is the first time they’re doing a transaction like this.

Thomas Davenport: Correct.

Lee Kantor: And what’s the thinking there? They have they’ve they’ve maybe got some scar tissue that just creates friction. Like what’s the reasoning behind that?

Thomas Davenport: Yeah, that’s part of it. Um, you know, it’s they’ve they’ve had a, um, they’ve had a bad marriage and so they may be less open. Um, or they could or some of the opportunities to create value have, have changed or someone’s, you know, attempted to create value and, and in the organization and they failed. I mean, that’s part of it is it’s just, you know, asset selection and failed execution tends to lead to the next sale from outside investor.

Lee Kantor: So you’d rather have kind of a clean slate.

Thomas Davenport: So clean slate with the owner operator understand the culture at its source. Um, and that that to me helps us understand what we’re working with. And because we’ve got a more of a patient structure, it is more of a family office type structure where, you know, we’re we’re inviting them into our ecosystem. My, my finance people across different platforms are able to leverage each other for for connectivity. And so it’s it’s more than just us at the table. Um, and making sure that we’re, we’re inviting folks that are good, good partners and we feel like we’ve screened them well because we’re plugging them into an ecosystem where getting along is important.

Lee Kantor: Right? It’s why we do a lot of interviews with startups and it’s like, you know, smart money versus dumb money. I mean, the money might look the same, but it’s really not.

Thomas Davenport: Correct, correct.

Lee Kantor: So what do you need more of? How can we help you?

Thomas Davenport: Uh, look, I appreciate the time and allowing me to get get our story out there. Um, I think the thing for us is, you know, if there’s owner entrepreneurs that are looking to exit or thinking about exiting their business, um, we could be a good resource, whether with the right buyer to be determined. Um, but we but we play in the market. We understand the private capital markets, know a lot of lenders, know a lot of centers of influence and advisors. And so, you know, there’s sometimes I have conversations with folks and we just solve their business problems and never speak again. Um, or make a referral to someone that can help, you know, execute on some of the things or pain points we discussed. Um, and so, you know, love to meet great, smart people running interesting businesses in an honest and ethical manner. And that’s our that’s our thing. So happy to happy to connect. And so I think, you know, your audience is probably one where there might be a handful of folks where that that resonates and would be open to a conversation.

Lee Kantor: And if they wanted to connect with you or learn more, is there a website? What’s the best way to connect?

Thomas Davenport: Yeah. So best way to connect I would say, is LinkedIn. I would look up Thomas Davenport and LinkedIn. I’m based here in Atlanta and we also have a website, Davenport cap com and that’s Davenport and cap like short for Capital.com.

Lee Kantor: Well Thomas, thank you so much for sharing your story today, doing such important work. And we appreciate you.

Thomas Davenport: Thank you Lee, I appreciate that.

Lee Kantor: All right. This is Lee Kantor. We’ll see you all next time on Atlanta Business Radio.

Breaking Through the Revenue Ceiling: Proven Strategies for Business Growth with Next Step CFO

by

High Velocity Radio
High Velocity Radio
Breaking Through the Revenue Ceiling: Proven Strategies for Business Growth with Next Step CFO
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In this episode of High Velocity Radio, Lee interviews Michael Barbarita, president of Next Step CFO. Michael explains how his firm helps small and midsize businesses double or triple profits by combining financial management with strategic business planning. He shares his entrepreneurial background, outlines common financial pitfalls, and introduces a four-part conversion formula for marketing. Michael emphasizes the importance of mindset shifts for business growth and illustrates his approach with a turnaround story. Listeners are invited to download his book and request a free consultation. The episode highlights the value of strategic, hands-on CFO services.

Michael Barbarita has owned and operated Retail, Manufacturing and Service companies over the last 30 years. One of the retail companies he operated called “Ski Town USA” grew from $2.5 Million to $8.0 million in less than 5 years.

One of the products he manufactured was “Cookies To Scoop Frozen Cookie Dough” and was featured on the QVC Home Shopping Network and was selected as one of the top 20 products in the State of Massachusetts in 1997.

Connect with Michael on LinkedIn, and Facebook.

What You’ll Learn In This Episode

  • Importance of fractional CFO services for small and midsize businesses.
  • Strategies to double or triple profits through financial management and business strategy.
  • Common issues faced by businesses without proper CFO guidance, such as cash flow problems and price competition.
  • The significance of integrating financial analysis with strategic business planning.
  • The role of mindset in business growth and the need for business owners to upgrade their thinking.
  • A four-part conversion formula for effective marketing and sales.
  • The hands-on approach of Next Step CFO in implementing strategies with clients.
  • Characteristics of ideal clients for Next Step CFO, focusing on businesses that have plateaued in growth.
  • Case studies illustrating successful turnarounds and growth strategies.
  • The holistic model of combining financial discipline with strategic insight to foster sustainable business growth.

Transcript-iconThis transcript is machine transcribed by Sonix.

 

TRANSCRIPT

Intro: Broadcasting live from the Business RadioX studios in Atlanta, Georgia. It’s time for High Velocity Radio.

Lee Kantor: Lee Kantor here. Another episode of High Velocity Radio, and this is going to be a good one. Today on the show, we have the president with Next Step CFO, Michael Barbarita. Welcome.

Michael Barbarita: Thanks. Thanks for having me.

Lee Kantor: Well, I’m excited to learn what you’re up to. Tell us about Next Step CFO. How you serving folks?

Michael Barbarita: Well, business owners hire us to double and triple their profit using business and financial strategies that their competition isn’t doing. So we combine the financial analysis and management with strategy, business strategy. You know, if you look at fortune 500 CFOs, they all know strategy. Otherwise they don’t get the job. But for some reason, fractional CFOs have a tendency to be able to draw away and fade away from the strips from the business. Actual business strategy. We have 23 strategies that we actually help business owners implement and show them how to implement. So in addition to the financial, which is basically the forecasting, the cash management and the critical metrics in the business, we also do the strategic side, which is, you know, how to increase revenue, how to reduce costs, how to increase margins, and so forth.

Lee Kantor: So what’s your backstory? Have you always been a CFO?

Michael Barbarita: Nope. Uh, actually, most of my my experience is an actual business ownership. I’ve owned retail manufacturing service companies. So back in the 80s, I owned a chain of ski retail stores. We grew the company from 2.5 million to 8 million in five years. And then in the late 90s, I bought some frozen cookie dough recipes from a husband and wife team in in Massachusetts and built that company up. Sold it. Then I had a failure. Uh, I wanted to serve the aging population. So I started an outpatient rehabilitation facility called Freedom Therapy Center. And, uh, essentially, I fell on my face. And the reason I fell on my face is in the aftermath of all of that, I analyzed what I did when I was successful and what I did when I wasn’t. And the critical component was that when I wasn’t successful, I implemented business strategies and financial strategies that my competition was doing. Whereas in the successful businesses I owned, I implemented business and financial strategies that my competition wasn’t doing, and it made all the difference in the world.

Lee Kantor: So taking that contrarian view was helpful.

Michael Barbarita: Yes. And you know, I must have taken stupid pills when I got into the medical business. That’s all I could say.

Lee Kantor: Now, when you’re working with folks, are they are they businesses right now that have a CFO that’s not working. Like, what are some ways you even know if your CFO is working or not? I mean, what are they charged with in your mind in growing a business?

Michael Barbarita: Well, first of all, as a fractional CFO, we really don’t take the we we don’t take the the place of somebody who has a full time CFO. They they usually don’t have a CFO at all. And we come in on a fractional basis to help them grow their to grow their business. As like I said, you know, things like identifying the critical metrics in the business. Things like, uh, forecasting so that they can make better decision making, uh, improve to improve the decision making.

Lee Kantor: So right now they’re they’re just they’re just kind of winging it or they have QuickBooks and they hand it to a CPA and they’re hoping that it all works out. Like, is that what a typical small to midsize business is doing without kind of a dedicated CFO?

Michael Barbarita: That’s very true. Uh, wouldn’t some of them, some of them are not that. Some of them definitely are exactly what you described. Some of them are not that seat of the pants, but almost.

Lee Kantor: So in your mind, though, a CFO is a is a key member of the team. And if you’re neglecting that in any form or fashion, you’re really limiting yourself.

Michael Barbarita: Oh, without a doubt. And and you know, it’s especially, especially what we do at NeXTSTEP CFO, where we combine the financial management with the strategy and the strategic side. And in terms of putting it all together as to how to grow, just like a CFO would in a fortune 500 company. They’re a they’re a driver. They drive they drive the, uh, the PNL.

Lee Kantor: Right. But in most kind of small to midsize businesses that are kind of founder led, if the founder isn’t kind of a CFO, then the odds are they probably don’t prioritize it in the manner you’re describing.

Michael Barbarita: I think that’s very true. Very true. That’s correct.

Lee Kantor: But. But what is what’s the pain they’re having where it’s like, dude, you’re neglecting something that if you get this right, it changes the game. Like, what is kind of some of the symptoms or signals that they could have a problem that the right CFO could solve.

Michael Barbarita: They’re competing on price. Number one. Number two, they’re losing money. Number three, they’re making money, but they don’t have any cash. So those those three things right there are pretty painful.

Lee Kantor: And those things, if you put the right CFO in place, you can fix that.

Michael Barbarita: Turn it right around.

Lee Kantor: And then when you say turn it right around, is this I can turn around in 30 days, 90 days a year.

Michael Barbarita: Uh, you’ll see, you’ll see, uh, a change within 30 to 60 days. Uh, you know, you’ll definitely see the ship starting to turn. It’s like turning around the Queen Mary. I mean, you’ll be you’ll you’ll be able to start to see the the the turn. But I think it think usually it usually takes a year for for everything to settle in.

Lee Kantor: So if you kind of, uh, give NeXTSTEP CFO a year commitment, things will be different next year.

Michael Barbarita: Totally.

Lee Kantor: Now, you mentioned a lot about marrying strategy with the role of the CFO. And, um, what are some of the strategic rules or formulas you’ve learned? I know that you talk a lot about sales. Is there something that you can share when it comes to converting prospects to sales?

Michael Barbarita: There is. There sure is. We have you know, when I was doing research for my book, uh, I found that the key to successful marketing was getting into the mind of the prospect. Well, anybody can say that, so. But what? I dug a little deeper. I found that when you get into, in order to get into the mind of the prospect, it’s centered around two emotional issues. Number one, the problem the customer has and doesn’t want. Number two, the solution they want they can’t find. So what we did is we took those two principles and we created a formula called the conversion formula. And it’s a four part formula needs to be done in the right order. And it’s like any other formula, you know, like for example, water is H2O, two parts hydrogen, one part oxygen. If I give you one part hydrogen and one part oxygen, I don’t have water. Well, it’s the same concept here. If you don’t follow this formula to the T, then you know you’re out of luck. So the four parts are. The first part of the formula is called captivate. That’s the problem the customer has and doesn’t want this. This is the headline or the first thing that you should say, or that the prospect should see when they come in contact with your brand. That’s the captivate. The the fascinate is the second part of the formula, and that is the solution that they want. They can’t find. So the captivate is the problem. Fascinate is the solution. The third component of the conversion formula is educate. Now that I’ve captivated them with the problem, fascinated them with the solution, I now need to educate them on why my solution is superior. And then the fourth component is what we call the close, where you have to submit an offer that’s so compelling and so irresistible that the client can’t turn it down. And we have five components that make up.

Lee Kantor: You couldn’t get a word that rhymed. How about activate.

Michael Barbarita: I, I like that that’s right. We couldn’t find it.

Lee Kantor: So you need somebody to write a check at some point. So try activate. That might work.

Michael Barbarita: All right.

Lee Kantor: Um, so if they just kind of think in those terms. Now, does your fractional CFO actually do they just hand them the formula and say, okay, go at it or they’re kind of there.

Michael Barbarita: Oh, there’s a oh God, no, there’s a whole process in determining what the problem the customer has and doesn’t want is. There’s a whole process behind it.

Lee Kantor: So you’re a CFO who’s not coming in there with a playbook and saying, here, do all this. They’re kind of joined at the hip and they’re working together to to move the business.

Michael Barbarita: No question. Yeah. No, we just don’t give you a bunch of manuals and stuff and or read my book, and that’s the end of the ballgame. No. We walk you through a step by step roadmap, um, to, uh, you know, to be able to implement these strategies because, yeah, there’s one thing to learn them. You can you can basically learn everything by just googling it. Right. That’s just it’s just how to learn. It’s the the point is, is to implement and to put things in action. And that’s and that’s where the process, that’s the process that takes place. I gave I just in the with the conversion formula as one minuscule example, I gave you the framework for, for for strategic thinking. But that’s not how to go about implementing because it, because a lot of business owners can listen to my formula and come up with the wrong problem.

Lee Kantor: Right. So it’s like they say, you know, if you’re climbing the ladder of success, make sure the ladder is on the on the thing you want to climb to the top of, because if you put it in the wrong place, then it’s not helping much.

Michael Barbarita: Right? Like for example, let me give you an example. So let’s say a painter is listening to the show. Oh, I can implement the conversion formula. The problem the customer has is that they really don’t know what color paint to pick. Well, to every painter can do that. So that’s not really the problem that the customer has. It’s deeper than that. And it’s usually something to do with the industry. For example, every time I call a painter, they never return my call. It’s an example. So there’s there’s it’s usually the problem that the customer has is an industry specific problem usually. But, but but there’s a process in order to capture the real problem because you have to capture the real problem. Otherwise, you know that Mickey Mouse problem that I gave you with the paper? It doesn’t work. It doesn’t work.

Lee Kantor: Right? Because then the painter, the painter thinks that it’s just I gotta help people pick colors. Then they’re spending all their energy learning how to pick colors. But if their real issue is, you know, they’re frustrated or their wife wants something that, you know, to freshen something up, that’s a different problem.

Michael Barbarita: Different problem. And so that’s, that’s, that’s that’s what I mean by how we go deep into it.

Lee Kantor: So now, um, it sounds like you have two clients. You have one client is the business owner, but you also have to attract team members, CFOs that want to go out there. How do you find those folks?

Michael Barbarita: When you say CFOs that want to go out there, what do you mean.

Lee Kantor: Like your team? How do you or do you do all the work?

Michael Barbarita: Oh, no, I don’t do all the work. I have a team.

Lee Kantor: Right. So how do you find is that are these people former CFOs or are they former accountants? Like, what’s the prototype of your team member.

Michael Barbarita: They are CFOs. First and foremost. And they’ve been trained on, uh, strategic implementation.

Lee Kantor: Now, was that a is that a big lift for them? Because a lot of these, that personality type, you know, they think they know some stuff.

Michael Barbarita: Oh yeah. No, it can be it can be a big lift. But the but our training program and the strategies that we train on are just so, um, you know, they’re not state of the art. They’re just hardly used.

Lee Kantor: So this is kind of the common sense. It’s not so common.

Michael Barbarita: Yeah. I mean, let me give you another let me give you another example. I call it I hope so marketing. All right. Just about everybody says largest selection, lowest prices, best service, highest quality, most convenient. Been in business since 1941. Largest in the state. We’re the experts. We work harder. We’re honest and sincere. Just about everybody. Okay. That’s how they promote the customers. Say. Well, I hope so, I hope. I hope you’re honest and sincere. I hope, I hope that you’re most convenient. Why would I do some business with somebody who’s inconvenient? That’s inconvenient. I hope you’re the professional. Why would I do business with amateurs? So this is how everybody markets. They market with? I hope so, marketing. And so you know when, when my when my team gets getting trained this this stuff resonates with them because that’s all they’ve seen.

Lee Kantor: So then you’re going into the business and you’re really kind of going layers deep to get to the big why behind what they do or what makes them unique and special. You’re you’re not just saying, okay, you’re this business has, you know, I’m going to get their financials in order. You’re really looking to fundamentally change the course of the business.

Michael Barbarita: Right? We do both. I mean, we get that financials in order. That’s definitely.

Lee Kantor: Right. But that’s like you said that’s like everybody else does that. Like that’s not the hard part that, you know AI could probably do that next year.

Michael Barbarita: Um or 15 minutes. Yeah, I get it.

Lee Kantor: So you’re bringing something a lot different to the table. So your value goes well beyond what a CFO does. You’re you’re really helping change fundamentally change the trajectory of growth for these organizations.

Michael Barbarita: Correct.

Lee Kantor: Now what is um, I would imagine folks that are considering this, they’re going to be a little skeptical. Like how do you help them get over their skepticism?

Michael Barbarita: Well.

Lee Kantor: Um, is there a way to kind of limit the risk or to kind of alleviate some of what they might perceive as risk?

Michael Barbarita: Well, here’s here’s most business owners situation is that they want leveraged revenue or at least want an increase in revenue, and they want time freedom associated with that. So they want time freedom and consistent profits. It’s a real quick way of saying it. That’s what most business owners want. And you know, the way we present it, the way we present it to the business owners is the way we implement the strategies. You know, whether you work with me or someone else, uh, there are five steps that you have to take in order to properly implement business and financial strategies that your competition isn’t doing. And step one is clarity. So before you could do tactical things, you got to strategically understand why am I doing this? Where am I headed and what does success look like? But not for your business, for your life. And I’ve seen Lee. I’ve seen this mistake happen over and over and over again, where people are so excited to make their impact in the world that they jump out there, they create this business, and all of a sudden they’re building their life around this business thing that they created, because the way it’s supposed to work is that you create the life you want, and then you let the asset, which is the business, serve you, allowing you to get to that life. That’s the order and that’s clarity. So that that’s that’s what like once again, this is where this is what we show the business owner. We show them that clarity. And then the second thing that we do is we give them a step by step roadmap to get to that life and a step by step roadmap of the strategies to build the asset that’s going to serve them.

Michael Barbarita: The third thing we do is we upgrade their skills because the business doesn’t grow unless they do the fourth. The fourth thing we do is we optimize their environment. Why is that? Well, they have saboteurs. I call them saboteurs. Sometimes I call them organizational terrorists. They’re normally family and friends, by the way, and they’re always constantly questioning what their what the business owner is doing, the spouse or friends or family constantly questioning because they have a W2 mentality. And of course in business we don’t have to be two mentalities here. So that’s the fourth thing you want to do, is you want to put them in an environment that’s supportive. And then finally, um, after that, we want a massive what’s called master of the psychology, which basically is mastering their mindset because the mindset that got them there, they are where they are today with the mindset that they have. And that could be, you know, it could be, you know, a decent business, don’t get me wrong, but that but it’s the mindset that got them there, the mindset they have today. In order to grow, your mindset has to shift, because the mindset that it took to go from 0 to 250,000 is totally different from 250 to 1 million, million to 3 million and so forth. So we work on mastering your mindset, mastering your we call it mastering your psychology. Um, And, uh, so those five things we have to work on, because those five things are critical for a business owner, uh, to implement business and financial strategies. And like I said, whether they work with me or somewhere someone else, it’s clarity step by step roadmap. Upgrade your skills, uh, optimize your environment and master your mindset.

Lee Kantor: So now is your ideal customer. Are they like a startup that just started or are they, um, kind of a business that has maybe plateaued? Or are they somebody that’s close to exit and wants to, you know, kind of get the business in shape for an exit?

Michael Barbarita: Um, we don’t really deal with startups that often. Uh, we’ve done it. We’ve done it. You know, it’s in our history. We’ve certainly done it. We look for businesses between 500,000 and 3 million, 4 million that, you know, that are kind of plateaued at those revenue levels. And, and they’re kind of stuck. Those are ideal, uh, clients for us because we can unstuck them.

Lee Kantor: So they’re. So they might have. Maybe they had been growing, and then maybe they’ve stopped growing, or maybe they’ve gone a little backwards. But once they’ve gotten over kind of the critical mass and got a little escape velocity, then they they have something that’s kind of somewhat proven that you feel like you can really make an impact and get them to a new level.

Michael Barbarita: That’s right. And their revenue might be increasing, but so aren’t their hours.

Lee Kantor: Now, is there a story you can share that maybe illustrates how you work? Like maybe you don’t have to name the name of the company, but maybe share the problem they came to you with and how you were able to help them get to a new place.

Michael Barbarita: Okay, sure. Um, you know, the one that comes to one that comes to mind, uh, and this might not be a situation that everybody’s in, but there was a construction company who, um, was, uh, ready to file, uh, bankruptcy. And they came to me. Uh, and we worked out a workout plan with the trade. Uh. And, uh, we, uh, changed some things relative to how he was collecting receivables. Uh, we changed some things relative to how he was promoting his business. We changed some things relative to his cost structure. We changed some things to increase margins. Uh, and he’s a thriving business today.

Lee Kantor: And how long did that take about.

Michael Barbarita: Uh, the turnaround itself took, uh, took 12 months to where he was now square with the trade.

Lee Kantor: And they he just keeps growing.

Michael Barbarita: Right.

Michael Barbarita: And now he’s just elevated.

Lee Kantor: Good stuff. Well, congratulations on all the success. If somebody wants to learn more, get Ahold of your book or connect with you or somebody on the team. What’s the website? What’s the best way to connect NeXTSTEP CFO.

Michael Barbarita: Net. That’s NeXTSTEP CFO. Net. Uh, and uh, we, uh, there you can download a free copy of my book called Powerful Business Strategies. Uh, and then you could also go to the contact page, which is on the website at. Or just click the contact button on the, on the main site. And uh, as for ask for an appointment. And I’d be happy to be happy to discuss your problem. Uh, free consultation, no charges. Be happy to discuss your situation.

Lee Kantor: Well, Michael, thank you so much for sharing your story today. You’re doing such important work, and we appreciate you.

Michael Barbarita: Thank you. Lee.

Michael Barbarita: Thanks for having me. A lot of fun.

Lee Kantor: All right. This is Lee Kantor. We’ll see you all next time on High Velocity Radio.

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