Intro: [00:00:02] Broadcasting live from the Business RadioX studios in Atlanta, Georgia, it’s time for Association Leadership Radio. Now, here’s your host.

Lee Kantor: [00:00:20] Lee Kantor. Here, another episode of Association Leadership Radio. And this is going to be a good one. Today on the show we have Jason Cline with SHRM-Atlanta. Welcome, Jason.

Jason Cline: [00:00:32] Hi there. Thank you. Lee will be here.

Lee Kantor: [00:00:34] I’m so excited to learn what you’re up to. For folks who aren’t familiar can you talk a little bit about SHRM-Atlanta. How are you serving folks.

Jason Cline: [00:00:41] Sure. So I’m CEO of SHRM-Atlanta and I’ve been here about three years and we serve at the air community of the Atlanta metro area from at all levels, at all sized organizations, we provide education and resources and benefits like many other associations do, but specifically for the air space. But we’ve also realized, especially coming from my background in association management, that there are folks out there that do HR functions every single day, but they don’t call themselves an HR person. So they could be small business owners. They could be association leaders like myself that do the day out HR work. But again, they’re not HR professionals and they need the same resources and information that we provide.

Lee Kantor: [00:01:23] Now, you mentioned a background that has been in this kind of nonprofit association space historically. Is there something unique to the HR world that’s different than your other experiences in the variety of other associations you work with?

Jason Cline: [00:01:37] There is I mean, the industry itself obviously is different than the associations I’ve worked for. It’s my fifth one that I’ve worked at, but they all face the same challenges. They all have the same types of issues. They’re all working to make themselves and their organizations better. And that’s what makes associations unique or common ground is the fact that that we’re all trying to help our members accomplish whatever it is they’re trying to accomplish in their own professional space.

Lee Kantor: [00:02:02] Now, are you seeing any concern or interest in AI, and how are you dealing with kind of some of the rapidly evolving technology changes that are occurring in the marketplace?

Jason Cline: [00:02:14] Yeah, that’s certainly a hot topic in the air space, especially as it comes down to confidentiality. I think a lot of folks want to use it for to free up some of their time and their day. They might be writing policies or might be putting together presentations or things like that, but they also deal with sensitive information. And as you know, once you put something out in the world of AI, it becomes the something that could be grabbed from other entities in that space. So we certainly have many conversations about what a good use of AI is in the HR world and what isn’t. And especially as you deal with sensitive employee information and company information data.

Lee Kantor: [00:02:52] Now, is it impacting in any ways the way you kind of measure and report successes and just document things.

Jason Cline: [00:02:59] A little bit? I think you have to be careful. Like, you know, like I said, it’s AI is put out there to pull in information from a lot of different sources. And and once you enter that information into that, it becomes a part of that collection of data that could be pulled from other users. And so as you’re working with it, it’s really important to make sure that you are thinking about the end result of what you’re working on through the AI system before you start entering things into it. So it’s something that I’m sure is on the minds of all HR professionals, all business owners, or really any type of professional out there, but specifically so when you have that sensitive data about your employees.

Lee Kantor: [00:03:38] Now, um, as a leader in this space, is that something that you’re trying to just kind of are we at the stage where you’re just kind of learning what’s out there to determine what the best practice is, or is it something that you’re kind of leading and then trying to determine what. And you tell the folks what the best practice is?

Jason Cline: [00:03:57] There are certainly leaders in the AI space, specifically in HR, and we have certainly pulled in. Those professionals who have already been through the process have already learned some of the things that are do’s and don’ts in the in the world of AI. Um, we certainly I don’t think we could say safely that we are a leader, uh, in the information that’s being, uh, that we’ve developed. But we certainly have professionals in our space that are leaders, and we certainly utilize them to our best ability to inform the other members in our association that can learn from them.

Lee Kantor: [00:04:29] Uh, I probably didn’t ask this the way that I intended, but are you are we at a stage right now where everyone’s still kind of at the learning stage and just assessing kind of the best way to deal with it? Or are we are we coming to a point where we kind of have a best way to deal with it, and then you’re just sharing that?

Jason Cline: [00:04:50] Yeah, I think there are probably more on the side of still learning. I think there are plenty of people out there, um, that, you know, kind of didn’t jump on the the AI bandwagon early. And so they’re still looking a wait and see approach. So there are probably many more of those folks out there. And so in that regard, I would say that we’re still learning, um, because there aren’t the number of people that have that have adopted the practice of using AI yet within their workspace. But like I said, there are certainly those that embraced it early on and are helping us find the way and what best practices might be.

Lee Kantor: [00:05:26] Now when you’re, um, leading an organization, uh, like the folks that are in the air space. How do you kind of create engagement amongst your members and try to provide as much value to them as you possibly can, knowing that this is such a, that this space is impacted so much by technology and kind of some of the trends in hiring nowadays.

Jason Cline: [00:05:53] Sure. I mean, HR just in definition is about humans in the connection that humans make, um, specifically at work. And so as HR practitioners, um, I think they really enjoy getting together and talking with other folks that have been through the same types of things that they have and learn from them, learn from each other about the practices that they’ve that they’ve been through. So, you know, I think our members generally want to do that. So, um, we we certainly provide the number of opportunities that as many as we can for those folks to get together. We like to do that in person. And we’re and we’re getting back to, you know, hopefully a pre-pandemic status when it comes to, uh, in-person engagement. Um, we just had our annual conference two weeks ago. Um, and it was the largest one since the pandemic. And so we’re very proud about that. But we also enjoy seeing folks come out, reengage and reconnect with the community that they are in, and develop those relationships that will last, uh, in their careers and that can help them throughout many different challenges they face.

Lee Kantor: [00:06:56] Are, um, is is HR still a career that young people are, are kind of gravitating towards?

Jason Cline: [00:07:03] Absolutely. Um, in fact, we, uh, we there are student chapters of Sherm National, um, and we have a new one in the Atlanta area, um, the Atlanta University Consortium, um, which is a collection of three campuses of Clark, Atlanta University, uh, Morehouse and Spelman, um, that just started its own student chapter. Um, and those student chapters are made up of students that are in the air space. And so we do see a number of, uh, younger folks still engage with, uh, human resources and finding their way through the, the professional network that we create.

Lee Kantor: [00:07:39] And what are some of the the best ways you would recommend a young person kind of leveraging their experience at one of these associations?

Jason Cline: [00:07:49] Yeah, I would just say get involved. Um, as as professional members of our association, I hear almost after every single meeting or event that we have that somebody either found their next job because of a connection they made, or learned something about how to do something more efficiently or better at their workplace. And so that’s what we are here for, is to make those connections. And so the earlier you can do that the better. Uh, Sherm Atlanta, you know, if you’re a member of one of the student chapters, you automatically get membership in Atlanta for free because of that student chapter membership. Um, but we also offer reduced rates for those folks that don’t have a student chapter on their campus. Um, and also reduced rates for all of our programs and services. And so it’s it’s important, I would say, for them to get involved early because you never know who you’re going to meet that might help you now or might help you down the road in any aspect of your career.

Lee Kantor: [00:08:40] Now with hiring as kind of tight as it’s been lately, is there any kind of job advice that you would give somebody? Forget about just being an HR, but just trying to get a job in today’s marketplace? Is there any kind of do’s and don’ts you can share? Because I’ve heard some horror stories from individual candidates, like they’re being ghosted by companies and they’re not, or they’re asking them to do free work, or there’s been a lot of, I want to say, a difficulty for some people to kind of get their foot in the door when it comes to, um, getting hired. So is there any advice you can share for somebody that’s out in the looking for a job right now?

Jason Cline: [00:09:23] Sure. Um, I, you know, I’m sure there are examples of of employers, uh, ghosting and, uh, candidates, but I think it’s most much more prominent the other way around, uh, because there are so many options for, um, uh, job seekers out there. They have they could be more selective, um, because so many companies are looking for workers right now that they don’t feel the need to if they if they no longer want to be in the process, they just simply go away. And they don’t make them aware that they don’t make the company aware that they are no longer interested. And so the HR professional or company has to work a little bit harder to bring in a greater pool of candidates, because they know that those types of individuals are going to be in the pool and potentially go away because they found a better offer or some other opportunity that exists. So, um, you know, I think it’s always been the case that it’s about who you know. And just like I mentioned, with HR professionals being open, saying yes to things, um, taking on opportunities or, uh, participating in, in community events or things that you may not necessarily participate in normally as part of your life. You never, like I said, you never know where you where you’re going to meet somebody that might potentially influence your career or your career path down the line. So I would just say to be as active as you can in many different areas, because those opportunities can arise from anywhere.

Lee Kantor: [00:10:43] Now, is there any advice regarding kind of. When you’re submitting a resume or a cover letter into one of these systems, people are always kind of fearful that they’re going to say the wrong thing, or their their name’s not going to appear in the algorithm to be the, the, you know, the one chosen. Is there any secrets to that, or is that a myth of this kind of magic algorithm that’s picking and choosing?

Jason Cline: [00:11:11] Um, you know, that’s one of the functions of HR. You mentioned earlier, it’s largely based on technology and how how are companies use technology in their in their workplace. And that’s certainly one function that helps reduce time. Um, there are certainly, probably in every industry keywords that exist that will help get your resume or cover letter bumped to the top. But, you know, in general, I would say it’s more about persistence. Um, you know, because we’re in a we’re in an age where companies are looking for good individuals to, to work with, with them at their companies. I think persistence is the key there, because if you show you’re interested and you’re passionate about what that company does, you’re going to rise to the top and that’s going to come through on your resume.

Lee Kantor: [00:11:57] And I think the it always helps, like you mentioned earlier, is to have kind of some sort of a human connection with somebody there. And I think that’s kind of the cheat code, if there was one, is to know somebody in the company you’re trying to get a job in so that at least you have a human advocating for you.

Jason Cline: [00:12:18] Oh, absolutely. I would agree with that, and especially with social media, if you don’t know somebody at the company, I bet you know somebody who knows somebody at the company. And so doing your research and finding that finding that connection, that can that can help you in that journey is certainly going to be helpful for you.

Lee Kantor: [00:12:34] Now, getting back to your role as a leader in a variety of associations, has there been a piece of advice that you were given or a mentor that you had that has helped you in your career to, you know, be part of so many successful associations?

Jason Cline: [00:12:51] Yeah, absolutely. I think, you know, you go through your career and there are always those people that, um, see something in you that maybe you don’t see or maybe you don’t see could be developed and certainly had that, uh, few jobs ago. Um, when I was at the Association of College Unions International, uh, my, my CEO then at the time was, uh, Marshall Hermann Bengtson and, uh, she still, uh, even though she’s retired now, she still serves as somebody I can talk to and bounce ideas off of. But, um, I think she probably, you know, I remember her in my interview for the job, uh, where she hired me, and she asked me what I wanted to do with my career, and I said I wanted to have her job. And so she spent her time, uh, the eight years that I was there, helping me find the skills and have the experience to make sure that I was prepared for that. So that has helped me as a CEO now in making sure I have those conversations with my employees, because it’s important to know what they want to do so that you can help them get there. Um, no employee is going to stay with you forever. It’s very unlikely these days that that people stay with the same company for a long period of time. So helping them develop that into their next role, into their next opportunity is not only going to help them, but it’s going to help you as well because you’re going to get the best out of them throughout their career, throughout their time with you at your organization.

Lee Kantor: [00:14:10] Now, is there anything about just being in the association industry like you have been? You also are, uh, you know, work with the Georgia Society of Association Executives. Are you seeing the industry as a whole kind of grow? Is this an area that you’re kind of bullish in? Is the association work happening here in Georgia and across the country?

Jason Cline: [00:14:32] Oh, absolutely. I would say so. I mean, I think when I, I fell into association management by accident, um, and that’s probably true for many of my colleagues, especially those around my same age, um, because there weren’t, uh, college programs around association management mostly was in public sector work or, um, something related to charitable organizations, but, you know, nonprofit organizations that are more membership based or that are focused on providing education and resources to a to an industry or a profession. Um, it’s not something that you grew up wanting to do because you were probably unaware that it even existed. Um, and I’m sure you’ve heard the saying, there’s an association for everything, and that is 100% true. You can find any hobby or any profession or any group gathering of people, and there’s probably an association that represents them. So I think the opportunities to work in the association space are vast. And you can really find, um, you can really find a passion not only in association, association management, but if you’re passionate about a, a thing or an idea or a topic, you can probably find an association that is, uh, that is built around helping that that group of people.

Lee Kantor: [00:15:41] Yeah. When I first started interviewing folks in the association world, I didn’t realize kind of that kind of Russian nesting doll, uh, world of association for associations, for associations. And there are some companies that all they do is manage associations. And there could be ten associations in one office.

Jason Cline: [00:16:02] Absolutely. Yes. As a matter of fact, I used to work at an organization that managed multiple associations. So you get the, you know, the scalability that comes with the, uh, opportunity to do things like that. But you also have the opportunity to learn from each other because each each organization, like I mentioned at the beginning of the program, um, each association is there for a similar reason, but they serve a different industry. And so there’s definitely ways to share information and resources.

Lee Kantor: [00:16:31] Right? Because the bottom line is it’s it’s usually about education. It’s about, you know, kind of wrangling volunteers that’s putting on events. It’s um, you know, serving this niche, uh, to, you know, create that kind of community around a niche and, and create all the best practices that are necessary for to make that industry grow.

Jason Cline: [00:16:54] Absolutely. I think that’s 100% true. And I think that’s a reason why associations are so prevalent in the United States and around the world. Uh, because there are so, so many of them and there are so many opportunities to develop new ones, because there’s always a new group of people that want to better themselves in their in their space, and they want to, um, help each other in that way. So associations seem to be the choice for those.

Lee Kantor: [00:17:17] Yeah. And it’s important because it helps it accelerates the growth of all the members. I mean, they get to learn best practices from everybody and and to be creative and find fellowship amongst people that have like minded beliefs and and objectives.

Jason Cline: [00:17:31] Yeah, absolutely. I think that’s I think that’s why they call. Associations because they’re they’re groups of people that are similar, that have similar thinking or that’s not necessarily thinking, but similar goals. And they can work together, share ideas and um, and work to achieve whatever it is they’re trying to achieve.

Lee Kantor: [00:17:48] Now, it must be such rewarding work for you. Um, is there a story you can share that maybe illustrates kind of, uh, a time where somebody told you, hey, this really impacted me, or you really helped our our company or our group grow.

Jason Cline: [00:18:05] Yeah. I think, um, you know, one that comes to mind, uh, especially at a, at a previous job, uh, I served before at Sherm Atlanta. I was the CEO of the Printing and Imaging Association of Georgia. And, um, not long after I started, um, some of our members were having issues with, uh, uh, taxes on their equipment, uh, because they were listed as one type of business. And, um, somehow they got changed to a different type of business, which caused a huge increase in their tax liability. And you know, I, I’m from the association space. I was learning about the printing industry when I took that job. So I didn’t know too much about that. Um, but, you know, I worked through the system of Georgia government. Um, I did a lot of research and at the end of the day, end up saving many of our members tens of thousands of dollars, um, by getting their tax situation figured out. And that’s not my background. It’s not something that, uh, I went to school for, nor did I have any knowledge in the area. But, uh, I think association managers and people that work in the association space are very committed to being servant leaders. And so, you know, as an, as a new CEO, as a new CEO of this association in particular, I was determined to find a solution for them. And and fortunately for for me and for them, I did. And I still hear from some of those folks, uh, today about how much money I saved them in taxes that they shouldn’t have had to pay.

Lee Kantor: [00:19:30] Right. Because that’s your role is to just help solve their problems. I mean, you’re there of service for them to help them achieve their objectives. And if they had a pain, then you were trying to alleviate that pain to the best of your ability.

Jason Cline: [00:19:43] Absolutely. And I think that’s why people again, join associations. They, they want, uh, that collective work to be done. And again, it wasn’t for one specific person. It helped the industry for that solution to be found. And and I was pleased to have been able to do that for them. Um, but it also just furthers the, the argument, the reason why having a professional association to belong to is important because, again, you never know when something like that’s going to happen to you and others may have already been through that. It can help you through it a lot easier than they did. Yeah.

Lee Kantor: [00:20:14] And that’s why it’s important for all the constituents of that niche or industry to get involved with their local association, because not only can they benefit like you help them benefit tangibly, but also they can be sharing what they’re learning to help the collective group as well. So I think it’s so important that all the that people do join these and they get involved, not just write a check to it, but just get involved and share what they know because then everybody benefits.

Jason Cline: [00:20:43] Yeah, definitely. I always say to folks that are thinking about joining, it’s not just about us providing them information, it’s about the information the collective organization gets from each new member. Um, and, you know, with each new member, the, the knowledge of the organization just grows exponentially. And so it’s more it’s it’s equally about what they can bring to us as to what we can provide to them.

Lee Kantor: [00:21:06] Yeah, I agree 100%. And I think whatever group you’re part of, you should be joining and not just joining and writing a check, but just leaning in and volunteering and doing kind of some of the leadership work too, because everybody benefits when everybody is involved. Great. So if somebody wants to learn more about Sherman Land or connect with you, what is the website?

Jason Cline: [00:21:29] Sure. Our website is Sherm Atlanta. Org and that’s H SHRM Atlanta. Org. Um, you can find me on LinkedIn at Jason Klein or under the Sherm Atlanta uh, page.

Lee Kantor: [00:21:40] Well, Jason, thank you so much for sharing your story today. You’re doing such important work and we appreciate you.

Jason Cline: [00:21:45] I appreciate that. Thank you very much for having me, Lee.

Lee Kantor: [00:21:47] All right. This is Lee Kantor. We’ll see you all next time on the Association Leadership Radio.