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Search Results for: kids care

Barron Segar With World Food Program USA

October 7, 2025 by Jacob Lapera

Atlanta Business Radio
Atlanta Business Radio
Barron Segar With World Food Program USA
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Barron Segar is the President and Chief Executive Officer of World Food Program USA, the nonprofit charged with inspiring and mobilizing people in the United States to support the U.N. World Food Programme’s mission to save and protect the world’s most vulnerable lives against hunger.

He has more than 25 years of experience growing philanthropic and cause marketing platforms for organizations spanning global humanitarian aid, public broadcasting and finance. Under his leadership, World Food Program USA quadrupled its revenue in less than three years and has earned exceptional ratings from multiple trusted agencies for its financial health, accountability and transparency.

A leading voice on global food security, he has been featured in major media outlets including Bloomberg TV, NBC News Now, CNN, MSNBC, Forbes, The Hill, The Guardian, The Chronicle of Philanthropy and at events hosted by the Reuters, Devex, Axios, World Affairs Councils of America, and the Global Philanthropy Forum. He has led visits to field operations in multiple countries including Lebanon, Liberia, Ethiopia, Nepal, Guatemala, El Salvador and the Polish border of Ukraine to shine a light on the lifesaving work of the U.N. World Food Programme.

Prior to World Food Program USA, he served as the Executive Vice President and Chief Development Officer at UNICEF USA, with organization-wide responsibility for strategy, budget, and critical operational priorities. He led the strategic direction of the Development Division and all regional offices, raising $500 million in annual revenue.

Previously, he served as the Director of Development for Georgia Public Broadcasting, where he and his team were nationally recognized for record breaking fundraising performance. Barron also has experience in the private sector working in financial services.

For the past five years, The NonProfit Times has recognized Barron on its Power & Influence Top 50 list for leadership centered on innovation, broad sector influence and developing replicable organizational models. He is a Founding Board Member of the Elton John AIDS Foundation, serving over 30 years on the National Board of Directors. He currently serves on the Advisory Board for Open Hand Atlanta and Board of Directors for the Non-Profit Alliance.

He is a graduate of Leadership Atlanta and earned a bachelor’s degree from Hampden-Sydney College.

Connect with Barron on LinkedIn.

What You’ll Learn In This Episode

  • The mission of the World Food Program USA and how do they work to combat global hunger

Transcript-iconThis transcript is machine transcribed by Sonix.

 

TRANSCRIPT

Intro: Broadcasting live from the Business RadioX studio in Atlanta, Georgia. It’s time for Atlanta Business Radio, brought to you by Kennesaw State University’s Executive MBA program. The accelerated degree program for working professionals looking to advance their career and enhance their leadership skills. And now, here’s your host.

Lee Kantor: Lee Kantor here, another episode of Atlanta Business Radio. And this is going to be a good one. But before we get started, it’s important to recognize our sponsor, CSU’s executive MBA program. Without them, we wouldn’t be sharing these important stories. Today on Atlanta Business Radio, we have Barron Segar, who is the President and CEO with World Food Program USA. Welcome.

Speaker3: Hey, Lee. So happy to be here today. And, uh, and as you mentioned, I’ve lived in Atlanta for 26 years, so I miss all my friends and, uh, colleagues there, probably listening in today.

Lee Kantor: Well, I’m excited to learn about the World Food Program USA. Do you mind sharing a little bit about mission purpose? How you serving folks?

Speaker3: Yeah, sure. So I’m based in Washington, D.C., the World Food Program, USA. We’re the nonprofit arm supporting the work of the United Nations World Food Program. Our job here for World Food Program USA is to make sure that we’re advocating, uh, from a policy perspective, developing partnerships with the private sector, businesses, faith based organizations, individuals and raising awareness. There are a lot of people, unfortunately, today that are suffering because of a lack of food. So our job is to make sure that we’re amplifying those stories. And again, our work is to support the World Food Program. The recipient of the Nobel Peace Prize in 2020, largest humanitarian An organization in the world fighting global hunger.

Lee Kantor: So do you mind sharing a little bit about some of the stats, and give us some idea of the context in which we’re dealing with when it comes to hunger?

Speaker3: Yeah, sure. I would say unfortunately, we’re at a pretty unprecedented level today. 300 million people around the world don’t know where their next meal is going to come from. And the very sad part of that narrative is in two countries, we are facing pockets of of famine. And I will say that, you know, on the positive, we always have to remember that hunger was actually on the decline up until about ten years ago. And so I have a lot of confidence that we’ll be able to reverse the trend today, and we’ll be able to see hunger declining. We are seeing, by the way, pockets of hunger declining in parts of central South America. So, you know, our job, though, is to make sure that everybody around the world has access to a nutritious meal.

Lee Kantor: And then what is some of the ways that you help them have access to it? Is it bringing them food or is it helping them kind of grow their own food or provide for themselves when it comes to, you know, having the food they need?

Speaker3: Yeah. So how about if I, if I told you if I gave you the answer all the above. So one of the ways that the World Food Program works, unfortunately, right now a lot of war is happening around the world. And this is where the World Food Program will transport deliver through trucks, planes and cargo ships, food. So on any given day. Lee, this is a pretty amazing statistic. The World Food Program has on the on the go about 5300 trucks, 30 plus cargo ships and about 100 planes delivering food. So again, emergency relief supplies going out today. We also provide what’s called a cash based transfer. So where you have individuals where there are functioning marketplaces, we do temporary cash based cards, uh, so that families can go in and buy food, um, on a very temporary basis. And the other part of, of our job at the World Food Program is around resiliency. So there are a lot of parts around the world that are creating income and sustainability for their families. When you think about business and you think about agriculture in most countries, uh, most individual lives, um, revolve around agriculture. So our job is to make sure that, uh, individuals have the training, the tools, the resources necessary to grow their crops, to feed their local communities, and to take those products to the market to create income.

Lee Kantor: So when you when you’re kind of transporting some of this food, where are you getting the food?

Speaker3: So, um, I’ll give you an example and I’ll give you two different examples. One is one of the hallmark programs of the World Food Program is called Homegrown School feeding. Um, about, uh, 20 million meals last year, uh, were provided through the help of the World Food Program. But this is not, uh, the World Food Program. Putting food on a truck or a plane. You have to remember that’s really expensive to do. And that that is a last resort. But what we do is we provide funding and a lot of different, uh, context is to make sure that, uh, that communities can have the funding so that they’re working with farmers to grow the food. Communities are, um, are then rallying around to, uh, to make the food for kids. And so it’s called, uh, locally homegrown school feeding. Uh, it also provides a resiliency factor for income for the, um, the local community. Li one of the things I have to tell you is when I was in Liberia, uh, earlier this year, a teacher came up to me and said that, um, that without school feeding, uh, kids wouldn’t be in school. They said you could have all the desks and the teachers and the training and the chalkboards and the latrines, but without school, kids are working. So, um, I’m super proud. So again, that’s homegrown school feeding. The other part that I may surprise some of your listeners is that the World Food Program, through the work of partnerships with, uh, the US State Department and USDA, we buy a lot of food from farmers here in the United States, putting them on cargo ships. And they typically go to countries that don’t have the ability of growing their own food.

Lee Kantor: Now, what is the the state of the Union when it comes to the United States, when it comes to hunger?

Speaker3: So, uh, the US, um, so what I would say is we have to care about hunger everywhere, whether it’s happening in our backyard or whether it is happening halfway around the world. We should be investing here in the United States. And and by the way, the US, I think does a pretty good job. There are safety nets here in the US. So I would say, you know, you don’t see, uh, you don’t see famine, you don’t see starvation. Uh, however, you see a lot of struggles where people struggle to find their next meal. When you think about the World Food Program, our work is really, you know, I would use the word we’re feeding the hungriest of the hungry. And so what that means is we’re talking to people that don’t have access to maybe it’s a Snap program or a local community food bank. These are individuals that are facing extreme levels of hunger.

Lee Kantor: Now, what’s your backstory? How’d you get involved in this line of work?

Speaker3: So, uh, my story actually has some ties to Atlanta. I’m very honored, uh, to be a founding member of the Elton John Aids Foundation. Li. We started that foundation, uh, in Atlanta back in 1992. And, uh, I knew Elton, Alton because of his, uh, recovery. Um, moved to Atlanta, and then he asked me to be one of his founding board members when he started the foundation. Long story short, um, through Alton’s foundation, I had the opportunity to go to the field. Um, and I met with so many individuals who were impacted or living with HIV Aids, and I saw the vulnerability of humanity and felt that personally, I could play a role, uh, around alleviating some of that hurt some of that, uh, that, that, um, the the lack of dignity that goes in to whether it’s an individual having HIV or an individual that can’t feed their kids because of school. And so I would say it’s a product of experiences, a product of opportunity. But, uh, again, through the honor of being a founding board member of the Elton John Aids Foundation, had an opportunity to go to the field, see firsthand what very few people get. And I gotta tell you, you know, I never got some of those images out of my mind, by the way. Not all negative. A lot of them. Very positive messages of hope. Um, but I really determined that this was going to be the future of what I wanted to do, and it was going to be that my life would really revolve around impact.

Lee Kantor: So when you’re working in an organization that you are, how do you. It seems so overwhelming. How do you kind of choose and prioritize where the effort needs? Like you said, this is kind of a global problem. How do you kind of decide where to put your energy and efforts and how to reach those people most effectively?

Speaker3: You know, it’s it’s probably the toughest, toughest decision again at the World Food Program USA. Our job is to support the programmatic efforts of the global organization. But I would tell you what I’ve learned is that it’s a very difficult process of deciding who eats and who does not. I cannot imagine anybody on this earth wanting to be put in that position. But there are some factors and some factors that are dependent on levels of nutrition, uh, whether it’s with children or whether it’s with families, how many days an individual or family goes without eating, uh, and general lack or access to food in those specific communities. Uh, I would also say, um, access, um, we have to have access to, uh, to feeding people. And unfortunately, today we’re living in an area where war is now, the number one reason that people are hungry and people are starving. Um, and so our job is to make sure that we also have to secure the safety of workers at the World Food Program, but it is really determined based on the hungriest of the hungry. Can we reach, can we get into these communities, can we effectively serve? And, you know, like a lot of organizations, Lee, you know, we’ve seen, uh, some cuts, uh, around federal funding. Um, we are still getting funding. I’m very grateful for that at the World Food Program. But we also have to have to look at how can we make a dollar go further. And in some cases, and in many cases, it also means, um, some people, uh, unfortunately have to go with fewer meals or in some cases, uh, not having meals provided at all. But in most cases it’s reducing the number of meals. And I would say this is where it comes to having really thoughtful partners like UPS here, um, in Atlanta, who’s helping us do more with less. They’re looking at our efficiencies. They’re looking at our transportation hubs. They’re investing in the World Food Program to help us make sure that we can reach the most number of people in the most efficient way.

Lee Kantor: So, um, what is that? Ask to the folks in the private sector, as you mentioned, that funding is a challenge. Uh, And nowadays, in a lot of areas, I would imagine that you have to lean more on the private sector and individual philanthropy. How, you know, give me the sales pitch to help them understand why this is where they should be investing their dollars.

Speaker3: Yeah. Uh, for for me, it’s a very easy, um, offering. I would say that I have always believed that we have a moral and an ethical responsibility, uh, to provide food for those who are hungry. Um, and I would also say that I’ve really been humbled at the number of, um, companies and foundations and individuals and faith based partners that have rallied around hunger. Um, I would say that we’re seeing a lot of companies that are partnering with the World Food Program who are going all in because their employees are demanding it, and their customers are also, um, really stakeholders to make sure that if they’re buying a product from a company, that that company is doing good. I’ll tell you a story that happened just last week. Um, I talked to, uh, one of our emerging corporate partners. It’s a fortune 100 company, and they just surveyed, um, about a thousand customers around what? What was important to them. And they thought that the answer would be climate or maybe education. But guess what? It was hunger. That hunger was top of mind for their audience. So they’re now going more all in with the World Food Program because they they believe it’s not only the right thing to do, the ethical thing to do. Everybody deserves the right to food for food, but it’s also good for their business that Gen Z and millennials are going to go more all in to companies that are giving back and that are supporting issues that they’re concerned about.

Lee Kantor: So how would you, um, how would you have the private enterprise, the private companies, the entrepreneurs and the business leaders out there? What’s a way, uh, that they can kind of make that decision to partner with your organization? How would you recommend that they, like you mentioned, maybe poll their customers, poll their employees, get a feel for what are the issues that are important to their constituents. And I’m sure that, uh, your organization would be on the list of that, but is that a good starting point for them to just get an idea of what issues are important to their constituents, and then have them invest some of the dollars into supporting and serving these types of organizations?

Speaker3: Yeah, I think Lee. Oh, actually, no, this, uh, more companies are leaning into food than ever before, and our job at the World Food Program USA is to really co-create, I would say, with companies, if they have an interest in the World Food Program, particularly with global food. Uh, the, the the best way is to get in touch with us. But I would also say, you know, know what’s important to your employees. And I have to say, you know, we talk a lot about, uh, about, uh, the customers. But the most important factor companies are listening to their employees and their employees want to work for a company that is thoughtful, that gives back, that cares. And hunger again is top of mind across the board for almost every company. And so, uh, I would say that, you know, yes, you want to have some data points to look at what your customers, what your employees are interested in. Uh, and then if you go to our website at the World Food Program, WFP, USA, there are lots of ways to get involved. We’ve also just launched a, a youth, uh, Gen Z, uh, a zero hunger generation program that engages Gen Zers around book clubs and and engagements with country offices and gaming and volunteerism. So I would say, and in all honesty, there are lots of ways to get involved. Some of them include just financially supporting us. Um, and then some of them, uh, involve more integrated partnerships. So I wish I had a one size fits all. But the good thing is, I don’t. Uh, I think the first step is determining that you want to be engaged with the World Food Program. You want to be engaged with solving hunger globally, and you want to have a voice in a seat at the table.

Lee Kantor: Now, do you have, um, kind of chapters and presence around the country, around the world, or is this something that’s based out of D.C. that is just kind of serving everybody virtually online? Obviously you have boots on the ground wherever they’re needed, but are there chapters around the country to get involved in?

Speaker3: You know, it’s a really, Um, great question. And I work for an organization previously that had regional offices and chapters. But I would tell you that one of my jobs here is not only to raise revenue, but to do it as efficiently as possible. So, you know, this year, our efficiency ratio, meaning the the amount of money that goes to programs, will be somewhere between 88 and $0.90 on the dollar, which puts us in the very top, probably 2 to 5% of all nonprofits in the US. Uh, we are based in DC, but we have staff, um, in multiple states. Um, so whether it’s whether it’s Texas or whether it’s Atlanta, by the way, uh, could be New York, could be California. We have staff, uh, located in various, um, cities throughout the US. But I did make the decision that we just couldn’t afford to open an office because the expense just gets too high. And my job is to make sure that as much as possible, uh, dollars go to support the programs supporting those who are hungry, or those programs that are creating resiliency and jobs to create incomes to stop hunger.

Lee Kantor: And then one more time, the website. If somebody wants to learn more, get involved.

Speaker3: Yeah. So I can’t say that too often. Right. Uh is w um dot wfp USA? Org. We just, uh, recently launched a hunger relief fund. Um, so check that out. That’s a way that companies can get involved with their employees. Um, and you know, Lee, we have a lot of companies that are interested in very specific parts of the world. So when you think about the World Food Program, we’re in about 120 countries. So you may have a specific interest in, uh, central South America. Maybe it’s, uh, it’s Gaza, maybe it’s Africa, maybe it’s India or Southeast Asia. Um, you know, there are a lot of different areas that we support that you could choose to support as well.

Lee Kantor: Well, thank you so much for sharing your story today. You’re doing such important work and we appreciate you.

Speaker3: Lee, I’m. Hey, I’m grateful for the opportunity to to share with your audience. I know it’s an important audience, and I would I would just end by saying, I’m. I need your help. Everybody listening? Please lean in to the World Food Program, USA. Please reach out to us. There’s an opportunity to engage you. Um, the world is depending on us. Um, and, uh, we just can’t keep going at the pace we are. There are far too many people that are hungry around the world that need our help.

Lee Kantor: Well, thank you again for sharing your story.

Speaker3: Thank you. Lee.

Lee Kantor: All right. This is Lee Kantor. We’ll see you all next time on Atlanta Business Radio.

Tagged With: Barron Segar, World Food Program USA

Laura Ries With RIES

October 6, 2025 by Jacob Lapera

Atlanta Business Radio
Atlanta Business Radio
Laura Ries With RIES
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Laura Ries is a globally recognized positioning strategist and bestselling author. Since 2022, she continues her father’s legacy as Chairwoman of RIES, guiding the expansion and global influence of the firm where she has helped Fortune 500s and ambitious startups win through bold, focused brand positioning for over 30 years.

She’s a sought-after speaker, trusted advisor, and author of “The Strategic Enemy,” her new book that helps brands of any size build a position—and a business—worth fighting for.

Connect with Laura on LinkedIn.

What You’ll Learn In This Episode

  • The Strategic Enemy – How to build & position a brand worth fighting for
  • The biggest branding mistake entrepreneurs make

Transcript-iconThis transcript is machine transcribed by Sonix.

 

TRANSCRIPT

Intro: Broadcasting live from the Business RadioX studio in Atlanta, Georgia. It’s time for Atlanta Business Radio, brought to you by Kennesaw State University’s Executive MBA program. The accelerated degree program for working professionals looking to advance their career and enhance their leadership skills. And now, here’s your host.

Lee Kantor: Lee Kantor here, another episode of Atlanta Business Radio. And this is going to be a good one. But before we get started, it’s important to recognize our sponsor, CSU’s executive MBA program. Without them, we wouldn’t be sharing these important stories. Today’s show, the topic is The Strategic Enemy how to build and position a brand worth fighting for. Our guest today is Laura Ries. She is the author of the book The Strategic Enemy and chairwoman of the company RIES. Welcome.

Laura Ries: Thanks so much for being here. For me being here.

Lee Kantor: We’re all happy that we’re all here.

Laura Ries: Yes we are.

Lee Kantor: So, um, before we get too far into things, just tell us about Reese. How you serving folks?

Laura Ries: Well, um, we do brand strategy and positioning work, of course. Known for our books for many years. This is one of many of the Reese books, starting from positioning in the 22 Immutable Laws of Branding. And so, yeah, so we work on top level positioning strategy with clients around the world, as well as give speeches and do other workshops and of course, the books.

Lee Kantor: Now, um, as most of your work with enterprise level organizations or some of these strategies, can they work for small or midsize businesses as well?

Laura Ries: Yeah, we don’t focus on any one type of business or industry or size or anything because we’re all thinking about, you know, how that brand is positioned in the mind. And the mind doesn’t matter how care how big your business is. So we have over the decades and I’ve been at this three decades, um, you know, worked with global five hundreds as well as entrepreneurs and startups, nonprofits, institutions, all types of businesses, companies and organizations to help them with their brand of what they stand for in the mind of the consumer.

Lee Kantor: Now, in this book, the strategic enemy, are you talking is the enemy. Your competition is the enemy. Something else like why? Why the word enemy?

Laura Ries: Sure. Well, you know, as I said, I mean, our focus has always been about positioning, and positioning is about owning an idea in the mind. But really the best way to, you know, get that idea in the mind. Understood is by contrasting it to something. And that’s what the strategic enemy is about. It’s that oppositional force that your brand or category stands against. Now. Yes, it could be a competitor. Many times it is. It many times is another category, right? You’re a new category and the enemy is the old category. You’ve got electric vehicles then. And we have gas vehicles. It could be a convention of, you know, the old way of doing things or a concept or an idea. It’s just something that you are against, right? It is what you say no to what you are not. And sometimes by clearly defining what you’re not, it makes it easier to understand what you are.

Lee Kantor: So if you were counseling a new brand, is this something that would be at the forefront? Are you trying to kind of really understand, you know, what they stand for and then where they fit into the matrix of the decision making process.

Laura Ries: When thinking about, you know, branding and positioning differentiation is is a core idea necessary to build a brand? Um, you want, you know, if you can be new first, you’re pioneering an idea or somehow being different than what’s already out there and available. Why? I mean, that drives interest, excitement and shows the reason for your being. And really, most times entrepreneurs, you know, they start a company because they see a problem. And often that problem is the strategic enemy that you’re there to solve. Um, Kim Kardashian, you know, she went up against Spanx, which was beige. And she her is her shapewear is inclusive of all colors and sizes because that was an issue that Kim was facing. She was having to put her shapewear and, you know, try to get it a darker color to match her skin tone. Um, and that, you know, became a core principle of what her brand stands for and what it stands against.

Lee Kantor: But when she started and she was Kim Kardashian, she wanted to stand out and be noticed as an influencer. So her strategy, how did she, um, differentiate herself at that time? At the beginning, because it’s easy to talk about a lot of these brands that we know now, but that’s not how they started.

Laura Ries: Well, Kim Kardashian, the thing, she became famous, right? She became a famous celebrity personality and in the media and Keeping Up with the Kardashians. But she also put an attached her brand and her celebrity and tried to pitch many products. Most of them are forgettable and we don’t remember. It was the one business that really, I think, connected to what she stands for and her beautiful shape, um, being, you know, a standout feature that that is very recognizable but also solved a key problem and hole in the in the marketplace itself that was not being filled by everyone else. And so you have the traditional brand Spanx. And then for a newer generation, always, you know, what the young girls don’t want to wear with their moms were and I’m a mom and I’m wearing Spanx, right? And so the younger girls are maybe wearing skims, as you know, a choice of a new generation that’s always an opportunity in branding. But here, I mean, that is one example where you have a celebrity, but that’s not necessarily, you know, part of the equation. I mean, there’s many examples. How about dude wipes? These were some guys out of college who realized, you know, the benefits of using baby wipes and said, why isn’t there a product for us, something that’s flushable, that has, you know, branding that speaks to us, that, you know, really gets the job done? And they did a tremendous job by going up against the enemy, which was the category dry toilet paper and became a fabulous success.

Lee Kantor: So if you were starting from scratch and say you’re just a professional service B2B firm.

Laura Ries: Yeah.

Lee Kantor: How would you go about like say you’re you just graduated college, you’re an accountant, you want to put up your own shingle and be a lawyer accountant. How would you go about building a position for yourself?

Laura Ries: Absolutely. One another. One of the key principles of positioning, of building a brand is having a narrow focus. When you try to be everything to everybody. How are you going to communicate that, even if it’s true? It’s very difficult, almost impossible to communicate. So a narrow focus is key. Um, it means, you know, saying no to something, being a specialist in something. And so, yes, if I was setting up my own B2B accounting firm, I would think about what what can I focus on? Right. Can is it going to be the size of the companies I serve? Is it going to be the speed of of how I serve, or am I more personal? Am I more electronic? Am I more old school? I mean, what one thing can set me apart from again, looking out about the competition? I mean, who is my strategic enemy? Is it the big firms? Right. And I’m the more personalized touch because you’re working directly with Laura, and Laura’s going to sign off on everything. Um, you know, all of those things. Or maybe I have a specialty that I only work with personal trainers, and that’s my specialty, right? Or maybe it’s doctors. Um, all of these things can be leveraged to be able to narrow your focus so you can stand for something, you can be remembered, and you could be seen as the best in class into whatever category you’ve set yourself up in.

Lee Kantor: So if you were this accounting firm. So the first step, is it assessing what your superpower is or what your interest is so you can specialize. Is that the first step.

Laura Ries: Yeah. But I think that has to be done in parallel to what else is out there in the marketplace. Because too often you’re right. You think about what’s my superpower? What do I want to do? Well, that’s well and good and important, but if somebody else already owns that space, if, you know, Larry is set up a block away and he has the same specialty I want to be in, and Larry is known by everybody, it’s going to be very hard for me to, you know, nudge Larry out unless I have something that can truly differentiate myself. Maybe I need to tweak so I can, you know, better, distinguish myself, find that open hole and opportunity that’s not being served out there that I can stand for. And hopefully, you know, hopefully I’m excited and good at it too.

Lee Kantor: So in so in concert, you have to identify what you’re good at because you don’t want to own a space that isn’t something you like or are good at, right. That’s not going to help in the long run. But you also want to find kind of the blue ocean area where there may not be somebody else right now in that space, so that it’s more affordable for you to invest resources to own that sliver rather than, like you said, go for the whole pie there.

Laura Ries: And think about it. And most times, you know, companies, um, or even people are chasing, you know, who whatever the hot brand, whatever the hot product is, right? Everyone’s jumping on to copy that instead. Sometimes the best thing is to go in the opposite direction and do something totally different. Um, I mean, even think about what did liquid death do, I mean, all water was sold in plastic bottles. Well, they went the opposite and put it in cans, right? I mean, that was a major difference. And it also set up I mean, their stance was, you know, the death to plastics, that plastics was ruining our environment and then also positioned it in cans that had, you know, a more loud and beer like marketing, if you will, so that people that you know, didn’t want to be drinking alcohol could have and hold a can that was just as cool, um, as if they were.

Lee Kantor: And they had the kind of sense of humor in the wink at, you know, water is supposed to be good for you. And this is positioned as liquid death. So, I mean, does humor work in a B2B setting?

Laura Ries: I think it can, um, you know, look at if you go back in history, look at what Salesforce did, I mean, with their, you know, end to software, no software. And they were picketing Oracle conventions and they really went all out on on talking and proclaiming how software was the enemy. Software was not the future. Um, and made a very bold stance of it. Now, listen, I mean, humor doesn’t have to be, you know, part of it, but I think the core essence is if you can stand for something, you can have, you know, fun and hopefully, maybe even visual ways to talk about it. I worked with a software development company. And what was their, you know, difference? What were their what was their focus? Well, they’re in South America and that is in fact different. It’s um, and they were worried. They were like, oh, well, you know, should we we don’t really want to promote that. We want to try to look like we’re global. Well, I’m like, you’re not you know, 90% of of your people are in South America. Your name, in fact, was South Works. And so, you know, the best thing we can do is to own it, promote it, and build that. In fact, the reputation and it has been on the rise of South America as being a fantastic place for development. It’s got time zone affinity, right? It’s not 12 hours ahead or behind, like like Eastern Europe and India. And so there was a lot of advantages. And so we honed in on that. And not only that, they went again. What else could we say no to? I mean, thinking about, you know, instead of serving your customer, what more can we give them? What can we say we won’t do? And one other thing they said is we don’t do long term contracts. In fact, we named it development on demand. So you could ramp it up. Ramp it down. You’re not, you know, beholden to anything. Um, it was totally flexible. And that was a way that, you know, for people to grasp and understand what you are is by defining exactly what you’re not.

Lee Kantor: Now, in, uh, is is the customer the same, like your company goes back, uh, a while in terms of, um, being around and involved in marketing and advertising, obviously, um, is the consumer of marketing and advertising. Are they behaving in the same way that they did, you know, 50, 60 years ago? Is that is is the brand hold as much weight and and give the consumers much confidence in a world where I can go to Amazon and buy an item with some name I can’t even pronounce in a list of, you know, similarly named, um, products.

Laura Ries: Well, I mean, there’s a lot to unpack there. So let’s start with the first thing. Um, I mean, people are basically the same, but, you know, think back to, um, you know, I as you many may know, I work with my dad for, for decades. And, you know, when he wrote and talked about the problems of advertising in the 1970s and he said it was, you know, so over, you know, there was too much communication, the over communicated society. I mean, it’s kind of laughable. We think back now to I mean, that was the good old times. There were three channels on the, on the TV. Um, but that was the start of it. In terms of initially advertising, there were so few media out there that and so few people could afford advertising. It was fantastic. Right. So if you just got some ads out with a fairly decent product or service, you know, you were golden. Um, well, those days certainly are long gone. And, you know, the reality is, is people don’t love advertising, right? They don’t want to have advertising. What? Advertising is incredibly effective and important today, even today, is as a reminder to people to remind you of the power of, of the brand, of the company, of the category. But and here’s the thing, when you mention about going to Amazon and, you know, getting the knockoff at a good price, you know, delivered tomorrow, people don’t really care about brands. That’s the fallacy. They care about categories. And it is those cat. We verbalize those categories as brands. And you know, if that brand is strong and it can be symbolic and, you know, used as an, as a, you know, stand in for the category itself, it becomes powerful. So you have Kleenex tissue, right? You have bounty paper towels.

Laura Ries: And for people I’ve been buying bounty or Kleenex is the real thing. Anything else is a substitute. Now, maybe some people do want to save money and they will. But you know, those brands have tremendous power as being the real thing and dominating those categories that in most cases, you know, they were the brand that pioneered them as the quicker picker upper or the first, you know, facial tissue and a pop up box. Um, you know, those are powerful ideas. The problem long term at too many companies is, you know, the weakening, um, by a line extension of putting one brand name on too many categories and products. That’s what some brand like Scott did, right? It was scottie’s toilet paper. It was Scott toilet paper. Then it was scottie’s tissues and paper towels and napkins. All of a sudden it just became a company name with no real power, no real emotion. It wasn’t a substitute for any one category itself, and it lost its power and really then ability to drive, you know, profits and margins and all those good things that a real brand will deliver. Um, and so, you know, we see the, you know, both of those things happening out in the world where there are places where, you know, the brands are so weak they don’t really deliver. And people, you know, will buy anything on Amazon. Um, because it seems like a reasonable substitute. Um, yet in many categories we have those strong brands. I mean, you know, it’s for me, it’s tied or nothing or bounty or Kleenex or many of these products. Um, and so, you know, that’s the real difference. And that’s the, you know, the true opportunity of, of owning something and becoming the real thing in those categories themselves.

Lee Kantor: Um, but is the younger generation as brand loyal as maybe our generation was? Um, does it does it mean the same, like, does tide mean the same to a 20 year old today as it did to us or our parents?

Laura Ries: Well, if it doesn’t, shame on tide, because what an opportunity. But today we have tide. There’s a lot of line extension tide pods for one. Is it a liquid or a pod? I don’t know. They’re confusing people. Um, you do build that mind memory of those brands. Um, and that is the challenge. Because a new generation is born, new people are born every day. And so the consistency of those brands in understanding what they stand for and, you know, continuously reminding of that, like chick fil A and the chicken sandwich and telling us to eat more chicken, you’ve got BMW, the ultimate driving machine. I mean, those are powerful ideas of companies that are dedicated to it. So it is, you know, it is in fact, a challenge for these companies to make it relevant to a new generation and continually reinforce that one key idea. But sure, I think I think the younger generation is just as is interested in brands. If those brands, um, can clearly communicate, their difference and their importance to them. But here’s the thing not all brands are going to survive, right? I mean, some brands will, you know, unfortunately, are going to pass away. I mean, we’ve seen in our lifetime, I mean, things like Blockbuster Video and Kodak film. Why? Not because the brands were sad or weak. It was those categories themselves. Um, you know, suffered a demise. Um, and those brands, as a result, were not able to kind of go on into the future because they were too entrenched by owning and standing for those, you know, deceased categories in the mind.

Lee Kantor: But it’s, uh, it’s kind of a double edged sword, though, because you can you can die on your hill. And when the when your technology has been disrupted and then you’re the last one standing, you know, advocating for, you know, the Kodak film when a world that doesn’t use film. Uh, so that’s okay.

Laura Ries: I don’t. Don’t you worry. I’ve got the answer for you. It is called giving birth to your own enemy. Companies need to launch new brands. Instead of thinking, you know, how can we use the our Kodak name on Kodak Digital, right? Or Blockbuster on Blockbuster streaming or these things? The real opportunity for companies and the one that is going to ensure their future success, is always looking for ways and new categories and new brands they can launch. Where would Toyota be if they didn’t launch Lexus? Where would the gap be if they didn’t launch Old Navy? And one of my favorites, Mike’s Hard Lemonade. This was a big success in the early 2000, as kids were turning away from from beer and looking for other drinks. This was a hard lemonade. But then what happened? We all realized how much sugar, calories, and carbs were in those things, right? This was a big problem. What did they do? Well, yeah, they did do some line extension, but then they thought of a new brand and a new category called Hard Seltzer, and they called it White Claw. White claw has dominated the market and made the company more successful than ever. That’s the exciting opportunity, not trying to, you know, maintain the past success of those brands because, you know, sometimes things do go out of fashion. Um, and, you know, you continue that and, you know, drive it as long as it goes. But the real chance is to launch those new brands and new categories, and it’s something more companies need to think about doing.

Lee Kantor: So to kind of, um, put yourself or that brand out of business or be open to like, I mean, Netflix is kind of doing that, but they kept the brand Netflix. I mean, they’re one of the few places that blew themselves up.

Laura Ries: Yes. Well, I cover the Netflix story in, in, in full in the book because it’s such an interesting case. Um, you know, they they were the pioneer, as you and I, I’m sure remember the DVDs by mail. Right.

Lee Kantor: So that but the the enemy was blockbuster. That was an easy one. They were they were following your playbook.

Laura Ries: They were.

Lee Kantor: And and then they said, you know what? I see the future and it’s not this. And then let’s just do streaming and we’ll do House of cards. And now we are this other thing here that’s even better than forget about mailing things back and forth. But that is the exception. I mean, there’s a short list of companies that did that.

Laura Ries: Well, here’s here’s the thing about Netflix. What they didn’t do was wait for streaming to be big and then jump on it. They pioneered streaming. They did streaming before anyone even thought it was a good idea. They in fact, they gave it away initially to their, you know, mail by, you know, DVD by mail customers. They kind of get them hooked because back then streaming sucked. We didn’t have good Wi-Fi. It wasn’t very good, but they had they got in the mind early with the category itself. And then they they one day when they said, that’s it, we’re going all in on streaming. No more DVDs. They just shut it down. They didn’t shut it down, but they stopped talking about it. That was the they just. Well, they try to it’s a long story, but they tried to rename it Qwikster and do all these things and they realized, you know, don’t make a whole hullabaloo about it. We just very quietly never talk about the DVDs again. And about a decade or so later, it finally shut down. All everything went into Netflix being, you know, the the streaming service and building and pioneering the category. The thing is, most companies, they can’t do it because they weren’t first. Right. So Redbox, you know, they were the pioneer of the, you know, DVDs in the supermarket, right? Terrific. Yeah, they jumped on streaming, you know, in the way after, you know, Netflix is a huge success. Jumping on later as a me too ain’t going to work. You can’t make that transition. You can only do it if you’re the pioneer. And that happens as to your to your point, very few and far between times. Um, you know, most often companies sit around like blockbuster. I mean, at the very end, blockbuster Nokia dumb phones are making a ton of money before you know, it all goes away with a shift to a new category. And as a result, a new brand for that category like the iPhone or like Netflix and streaming.

Lee Kantor: I mean, it’s hard for, I mean, any business that’s mature and has a board of directors. I mean, the person that’s signing off on taking that kind of risk is, again, a very short list. I mean, only an entrepreneurial organization could pull something like that off.

Laura Ries: It’s you you do have to have a very tough stomach. Another one that did it was Nvidia. And why? Because Jensen Huang is a you know, he’s got a stomach of iron. Um, you know a brilliant I mean he an entrepreneurial type of CEO leading that company. And, you know, they did a lot of amazing things in pioneering the GPU and the graphics processor for, you know, basically high end gaming PCs. And then what did he do? He made a dramatic shift to reposition, refocus the company on AI chips, which at the early days everyone said he was crazy. The stock price took a huge hit. Um, but he saw the future. And you know, sometimes, you know, these people like Elon Musk seeing electric vehicles. Um, and, you know, honestly bet the company’s future on it. And of course, it, you know, paid off spectacularly. Um, because in today everyone’s into AI. But, you know, Nvidia is the leader in chips.

Lee Kantor: But is this, like, kind of a survivor bias? Um, where, you know, we’re not remembering all the ones that went all in on the bad bet that didn’t make it.

Laura Ries: Well, a little, but I mean, I do think in terms of, you know, and here’s the thing, Nvidia was doing fine. Um, and I think, you know, that the GPU was, you know, a big success. Um, but, you know, even greater success. What I study is, of course, you study things that fail. But when you look at the successes, you know, what was the thing that happened? And if you look at it, it is being first pioneering. Um, you know, jumping on the bandwagon doesn’t, you know, usually lead to success. Um, line extensions don’t usually lead to success unless everybody else’s line extended to, um, you know, so that’s where you know, these rules or, you know, you can look at a case and, you know, say, oh, well, you know, if all the beer, all the beer brands were line extended. So line extension is a good idea. Well, what if there wasn’t one? Right. Um, and you see then the rise of, of brands, like, for example, athletic beer, You know, a beer pioneered to, you know, be the not the only brand that you can order. You know by name. As you know, they’ve all in on nonalcoholic, you know, rising and really making a big deal about the category. It only comes in cans because they feel it’s for, you know, active lifestyles taking it places. Um, and because they’re focused, they can really have fun with the messaging. I mean, to your point about, you know, using humor. Well, they they can go all in on it and say, why are you, you know, why are you still drinking alcohol? Don’t you want to wake up and have a better tomorrow? I mean, they can go in on it. Where, you know, Heineken zero. How can they say alcohol’s bad when, you know 99% of their business is selling Heineken with alcohol.

Lee Kantor: So that you have to have congruity like, it has to all make sense in the mind of the consumer, or else they’re going to like, call it inauthentic, or maybe subconsciously they’re going to rebel against it and not buy it.

Laura Ries: Yeah, well, you don’t stand for anything.

Laura Ries: I mean, that’s where I mean, I, you know, how do you how do you establish authenticity, right? I mean, it’s kind of this mythical type of thing. And I do think consistency is a big part of it, of, you know, being one thing, standing for it, and then of course, reinforcing it. Um, you know, for, for many years and having, um, you know, authentic spokespeople that can, you know, be the voice and talk about it. I mean, that that over time, I mean, change is what undermines it. And that’s where you see the strong reactions to companies when they make even minor changes to a logo. I mean, two great examples. You look back at when Tropicana dropped the orange and the straw. I mean, the consumers revolted. Can you imagine just for a logo and a package, it was the same orange they didn’t touch. The orange juice was still, you know, fresh from concentrate, not fresh fresh juice from the orange, not from concentrate. Right. I mean, that was a pioneering idea. And then, you know, the more recently we have the Cracker Barrel debacle, You know, where they took off the, you know, iconic. When you have a visualization of your brand of your specifically your brand name that is very well known, removing it tends to be very jarring to people. Um, and you see the results of, of the, you know, all of the consumer uproar around it.

Lee Kantor: Now, um, it sounds like a lot of your work, you’re you’re not just sitting in an ivory tower coming up with great ideas. Research is at the heart of what you’re doing. You’re you’re kind of looking at case studies and you’re understanding or you’re trying to understand what is kind of the common threads where let me connect some dots that maybe other people aren’t seeing. Is there anything that came up in your research that maybe went against what you anticipated and surprised you?

Laura Ries: It’s a good question.

Laura Ries: I mean, you definitely, you know, you definitely got to get out into the marketplace, out in the muck. I think research is important, most importantly, researching what people are thinking about right now. Um, the one thing that’s very difficult is, you know, to try to predict what people will do in the future. Um, you know, there no one knows, right? It’s very hard to say what they would do when given a choice of a new brand, for example. Um, but I’m trying to think of there’s nothing really too shocking. I mean, most of the situations, um, you know, tend to be pretty straightforward. It’s just always, um, I find the stories of these brands, um, you know, fascinating. I mean, looking back and, um, studying the history and, of course, the brands that, you know, I’ve worked with for, for, for a long times. And, um, so now I can’t think of a good story on that one.

Lee Kantor: What about, um, how Costco’s been able to build the Kirkland brand? That goes kind of against what you were saying earlier about Scotts, where there’s one Kirkland brand, there’s not. You know, the Kirkland batteries are the same as the Kirkland jelly beans. It’s, uh, you know, we all know that they’re being made by another leading producer of those items, but it’s all going under the Kirkland brand, and the Kirkland brand is kind of dominating, um, as a private label brand. I don’t know if there’s many other private label brands that are larger than Kirkland. And and it’s really driving a lot of revenue for Costco.

Laura Ries: Um, gosh. Yeah. So well, it’s well, here’s the thing.

Laura Ries: I mean, Costco is a fantastic idea, right? I mean, the warehouse approach they have, you know, they stock fewer items, um, they make all their money on the membership card, right? So they can, you know, sell the stuff dirt cheap. So you always feel like you’re getting a deal. It’s also a pleasure to to go there because there’s not, you know, 18 choices. You know, there’s basically one choice in each category or there’s the one choice and there’s the Kirkland choice. Now, here’s the thing. They’ve built Kirkland over, you know, many, many years. It’s it’s a nice, simple name. And they’re very strategic about what they go in against and up against. Right? So they pick categories where they really feel they can deliver, you know, a good quality. Um, they can, you know, match or, you know, beat expectations. Um, and have, you know, a good shot where people will, you know, be very inclined to go with the Costco brand and those things. But Costco is itself is, you know, people are have such a strong feeling about it. And because they love Costco, because they know Kirkland is Costco’s brand, um, you know, that is built a very strong reputation. And so in any case, where the, you know, big named, you know, national brand is a little bit weak, that leaves an opportunity for Kirkland. People will jump over to Kirkland, and once they then have a good experience with the product, you know, they keep going back. And people are very loyal, um, to both Costco and Kirkland.

Lee Kantor: And they’ve been able to, um, really, I think dominate and attract a younger audience. This isn’t a brand. That’s just your grandfather’s Costco. I mean, young people are flocking to Costco nowadays.

Laura Ries: Oh, my, oh my my my son and his girlfriend. I mean, they’re obsessed. I mean, that’s their daily ritual. I mean, and what a what a, you know, interesting way because it, they have, you know, been very approachable to, to the younger generation. And I think because they want to save money, there’s an atmosphere of going and shopping in person. Right.

Lee Kantor: That and and discovering that, you know, that deal or that thing that you never knew you wanted and found that that treasure hunt kind of, uh.

Laura Ries: Well, that yeah, the the experience of going and touching and sampling, um, is, is very, very strong. And I think, you know, relevant just as much to, to my generation as to the younger generation and continually to, to not only do it but and outdo themselves. Right. They haven’t gotten lazy. Right. They are continually to improve, you know, their methods, their store, their Kirkland brand. What they’re doing, all of that is very strong. Instead of, you know, trying to go out in different directions. Now, I know they have an online, but you know, that in-store experience is so critical and they do such a great job of it. Another one is Trader Joe’s. Right. I mean, they also have, you know, their their home brand kind of focus as and make it also a simple pleasurable experience. It’s a smaller footprint of store. You don’t have a lot of options. And you you know and trust that Trader Joe’s is going to deliver, you know, a highly, um, you know, quality curated brand, product, etc..

Lee Kantor: So if you were counseling some of the others in the markets, like, like how does a, uh, a Kroger or a Publix, how would you if you were counseling them, how would you, uh, counsel them in terms of differentiating versus vis a vis a Trader Joe’s or a Costco?

Laura Ries: Yeah. Well, listen, I mean, there are little bit stuck what I call in the mushy middle, right? Because you’ve got at the high end, you know, you’ve got the Whole Foods and you’ve got the premium markets. And then at the low end, you know, you’ve got the Costco which kind of is a premium low end right discount. And you’ve got, you know, the behemoth which is Walmart. Um, so you know how you know what is a Kroger right. It’s not as you know, fancy and premium as Whole Foods, but it’s not as cheap as Walmart. It’s probably a little bit more convenient. You don’t have to drive as far. But I think one thing I mean fresh for everyone I think is a is a good message and slogan for Kroger. Um, because they are the the neighborhood store. The fact that and if they they need to deliver on it consistently across all stores, but the ability to have that good pricing fresh for everyone, um, you know, is, is probably their best bet. Um, and you know, the in-store experience and making sure that that is, you know, stellar is, you know, a challenge. But maybe, you know, opportunity. Publix has done a very good job on the service angle, right where shopping is a pleasure.

Laura Ries: Again, you got to deliver on that. That isn’t, you know, necessarily easy. As you know, you don’t have enough shopper lanes or, you know, help at the checkout. Um, but that perception and the continue if you can succeed in, you know, getting that idea people remember Publix is a pleasure to shop but you better deliver when you get in there because when people don’t have that matching and there’s a disassociation, um, that can be problematic. And listen, that’s what has happened in target, right? So target had a very good reputation as cheap chic, right. You know, Walmart was always low prices but target was a little bit more fashionable, right. They had a little bit more design touch. The stores were nice and clean, a little bit friendlier. Um, but you know, as costs went, you know, we’re tough. Um, and they lost some of that focus and they had some, you know, bad customer experiences. You know, they’ve been having some, you know, tough times recently. So it’s, you know, once you own an idea you’ve got to continually, you know, keep Keep the pedal to the metal on it. Right. Continue to get get better at what you’re doing. Reinforce in what you’re doing. Um, and, you know, continuing to drive that growth.

Lee Kantor: And it’s hard when you’re tying yourself to fashion, which is so subjective and fickle. That’s a tough one. You really got to be nimble because that things change and you better be moving or else you’re you’re old news.

Laura Ries: That that is very true. It is always, uh, you know, difficult. Which is crazy because what you’ve seen recently is Walmart trying to become more fashionable. They were at Fashion Week. They do these spreads. I mean, it is just insane because the thing you cannot do is change a mind that’s already made up. And to most people, Walmart is not where you go for fashionable stuff. Cheap? Yes. Right. So you know the best brands at always low prices. I mean, why isn’t anyone ever happy with having an amazing focus and business? Why does the grass always look greener. I mean, you probably remember back, you know, Sears. What did Sears I mean, Sears was the dominant hard goods leader. Yet they were running campaigns, the softer side of Sears and trying to sell dresses and ladies fashion disaster. When you have something so strong, you’re not going to be able to change a mind. And I don’t know why companies waste their time doing it.

Lee Kantor: Yeah. For Walmart, the thing that struck that I struggle with is like, I don’t like to go into it because it’s a mess. There’s stuff on the floor. It’s just a terrible experience for me to go in and do anything in there. But I never consider them online where I wouldn’t have to deal with any of that stuff, and I would just have the good price part of it. Um, but but there’s a disconnect in my mind. Like you were saying earlier, that once it’s locked in, it’s hard to unlock it.

Laura Ries: It’s it’s nearly impossible. And, you know, the funny thing is you got to go back to Walmart because they’ve made strides in making their stores much cleaner and much more organized. Guys and you know that person. But listen, that’s why perceptions last a long time once they’re strongly in that mind. And so, you know, they’ve been really fighting to to battle back for people who did have that experience. But um, you know, they’ve done very good in store. And they really they’re trying to ramp up. And it’s interesting you say that because I, I just recently used the Walmart, um, website to buy something. I kind of wanted to do my own customer research to test it out. Listen, it was pretty, um, pretty nice experience, actually, but who thinks of it? I go immediately to Amazon. I mean, trying to change my behavior to go to Walmart, which I instantly as soon as you say Walmart, I think a store, um, is a big challenge. I mean, again, they would have had such a great opportunity for a second brand in that case. I mean, you think about, you know, you have, you know, PetSmart, which is, you know, the store where you go for your pet stuff and buy pets. But chewy is a second online brand is such a great move, right? They purchased it, but they kept it separate. Um. And so chewy is becomes the dominant, you know, online shopping experience that can go all in on that. Yet you still keep the pet stores because if you need to buy fish or want to buy your kid a lizard, we’ve got a leopard gecko. I mean, I really don’t think you can order those online. That’d be kind of weird. Not to mention the fresh crickets. The thing eats like five times a week. Um, so, you know, but, you know, keeping those separate each can, you know, do best at what it does best. Um, and that’s the opportunity that too many companies miss.

Lee Kantor: Yeah. And I was saying that now there’s Chewy Vets or they’re, they’re some licensing of the brand for vets.

Laura Ries: Yes. Well there, there is. You know, there’s online docs for people. And now we’re getting these online doc brands for pets. But think about it. Do you want a pet you know, chewy doctor or do you want like a more appropriate doctor kind of website? I mean, the opportunity to go to. I mean, there’s no advantage in, you know, when online something is a click away, you can go to a specialist. I mean, the specialist has great advantage. Um, and, you know, taking that opportunity instead of companies thinking, you know, what else can we get into? Uh, what else can we leverage our brand? Instead of thinking maybe that might weaken our brand. Um, and, you know, maybe we can set up a new brand.

Lee Kantor: So when it comes to a brand and there’s someone out there listening and wants to connect with you or somebody on your team, what is that ideal customer look like for Reese?

Laura Ries: Well, anyone that has a passion for improving their positioning, building their brand, finding their focus, identifying their strategic enemy. Um, you know, I just I’d love to work with entrepreneurs, companies, um, to, you know, to really get in there and understand it, to clarify things, to simplify things. I mean, it’s a challenge to simplify, but when you can nail it, um, it leads to really great brand success and, you know, success. But to find me, I am just at com and it’s Aria com, we’ve got books, consulting, consulting, all sorts of resources to check out.

Lee Kantor: And the book, The Strategic Enemy, that’s out now. Right.

Laura Ries: It is. It just came out had the big party at the country club last week. So fun. Um, it’s been, uh, the first book I’ve come out with in about ten years. So there’s a lot of great, um, updated examples, excitement on how you can best position by first identifying that strategic enemy to position against.

Lee Kantor: Good stuff. Well, Laura, a pleasure talking to you. And congratulations on all the success. You’re doing such important work and we appreciate you.

Laura Ries: Well, thanks so much. So fun to talk.

Lee Kantor: All right. This is Lee Kantor. We’ll see you all next time on Atlanta Business Radio.

Tagged With: Laura Ries, RIES

Debbie Longo with Life In Bloom NY

October 6, 2025 by angishields

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Houston Business Radio
Debbie Longo with Life In Bloom NY
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Debbie-LongoDebbie Longo is an executive behavioral coach, entrepreneur, and founder of Life In Bloom NY, a consulting firm that transforms leadership performance and workplace culture through strategic behavioral change. With over 20 years of experience in human resources, leadership development, and behavioral strategy, Debbie works with executives and business owners to identify and shift the behavioral patterns that hinder performance, profitability, and team dynamics.

Her coaching method combines principles of behavioral psychology with real-world business applications—focusing not just on surface-level solutions, but on the root behaviors that influence decision-making, communication, and leadership impact. Debbie believes that true growth comes from within, and that sustainable change is only possible when leaders transform how they think, act, and lead.

In her conversation with Trisha Stetzel, Debbie shared the origin story of Life In Bloom and her mission to help business leaders unlock their highest potential. She discussed her consulting approach, which includes free consultations, workplace culture assessments, and personalized behavior-based improvement plans. Her process often begins with leadership coaching before expanding to team-wide interventions—ensuring alignment from the top down. Debbie-Longo-logo

Debbie also emphasized her passion for helping entrepreneurs, especially in holistic health fields, overcome mindset blocks and workplace challenges such as burnout, compensation issues, and low morale. Her work focuses on moving leaders from reactive to proactive behavior, fostering environments where people can thrive.

As the host of two popular podcasts—Behavioral Profit and The Six-Figure Shift Show—Debbie shares insights, interviews with business leaders, and actionable strategies to help others build profitable, people-first organizations. Whether working one-on-one or speaking from the stage, Debbie’s goal is to help business owners and executives lead with clarity, empathy, and confidence.

Her mission is simple yet powerful: shift behavior, lead with impact, and create growth that lasts.

LinkedIn: http://linkedin.com/in/debbie-longo-life-in-bloom-ny
Website: http://lifeinbloomny.net

Transcript-iconThis transcript is machine transcribed by Sonix

 

TRANSCRIPT

Intro: Broadcasting live from the Business RadioX studios in Houston, Texas. It’s time for Houston Business Radio. Now, here’s your host.

Trisha Stetzel: Hello, Houston. Trisha Stetzel here bringing you another episode of Houston Business Radio. Today’s guest is Debbie Longo, executive behavioral coach and founder of Life in Bloom, New York. With more than 20 years of experience in leadership development and behavioral strategy, Debbie helps executives and business owners identify and shift the patterns that hold back performance, profitability, and culture. She is also the host of two podcasts, Behavioral Profit and the six Figure Show, where she shares how subtle changes in behavior and mindset can create major business results. Debbie’s approach blends behavioral psychology with practical, real world tools, and her mission is simple help leaders shift behavior, lead with impact, and unlock growth that lasts. Debbie, welcome to the show.

Debbie Longo: Thank you very much for having me, I appreciate it.

Trisha Stetzel: I’m very excited to have you on the show today. So tell us a little bit more about Debbie. And then I want to dive into Life in Bloom.

Debbie Longo: Okay, so I’ve been in this business for about 25 years, and I had a spiritual teacher until 2021, until she died when she died of cancer. So I was. Now I’m on my own. But I was doing a lot of things with her, and so I was kind of doing some things independently also. So it kind of just was a flow, you know, just a natural flow that I could just turn around and start my own business because it was very sudden that she passed away. So that was exactly what I did.

Trisha Stetzel: Okay. Well, I’m sorry to hear of the passing, but it does sound like that’s part of your story and how you started this business that you’re in. So talk to me about behavioral psychological psychology and coaching, especially in this executive space. How do how do all these things come together Debbie, in your practice.

Debbie Longo: Thank you for that. So the reason why I call it behavioral is because I’m focusing on it’s almost natural to say that it has to do with psychology. Okay. But I’m focusing on the behaviors of the employees and the executives and the business owners, which based on what their behaviors are exactly right most of the time negative and how it’s negative, that’s decreasing sales and profits. So just by changing their behavior, I can increase sales and profits. Okay. So, um, people think that it has to do with psychology. What I do is actually the opposite of that. Okay. Because I don’t want it to sound like. And be traditional psychology. Okay. If you believe in that, that’s fine. But I’m just going to say that there are people, individual people, business owners, all kinds of people that have tried that and that does not work. But if it works for you, you know, then that’s fine. But I’m focusing on the people that it doesn’t work for that need help that have decreasing, um, sales and profits that are going out of business. Maybe they file bankruptcy, um, you know, recently or, you know, and then they really need to, uh, get back on their feet again. Maybe they can’t afford to put food on the table for their family. You know, maybe they can’t afford to put gas in the car. You know, these are real world things that happen, you know. All the time. Right. They’re happening now. Right as we’re speaking. So, you know, there’s a lot of things here and a lot of people need help, but if they’re going to seek the help, then they’re going to want to do it. They’re going to have to see that just a little bit even there’s something wrong, just even a tiny bit, you know, and that this will help them increase sales and profits 100%. Because I know because I’ve been doing it 25 years and I know exactly what’s going to happen. And I don’t have to be a psychic to know.

Trisha Stetzel: Because you’ve seen it over and over and over again. So I heard you say that this negative behavior, these negative behavioral patterns are what’s limiting growth and profitability. How do you help shift that mindset from negative to something that’s not negative.

Debbie Longo: Right. So there’s about a hundred different ways. So what I do is I give people a free consultation okay. And possibly two. So and then I fill out, you know, I have them fill out things a survey and you know, some questionnaires and different things. And then, um, I make a plan for them. I make a whole outline for them. Okay. And then I give it to them and I discuss it with them, and then it’s their decision, okay. Whether they want to go through that or not. Right. So that’s basically my process. But I can tell you that there’s, there’s, um, control in the workplace where the executives are trying to control the employees and also vice versa, okay, where the employees could come in and they could just do whatever they want, right? They don’t focus on job duties or, you know, they’re doing insubordination. You know, where the executives are telling them what to do, and they’re blatantly just not doing it. You know, there’s so many things, but a control is a very big thing. Because here’s the thing if a company starts doing good, then it’s natural that the, um, executive or business owner, their ego is going to start to grow. Okay. And when they do that, right, then they try to control more. But I teach it that there really is no control. You can make goals. And there’s nothing wrong with that. I think every every company should make goals. But we don’t know if you’re going to reach those goals or not. And that’s why it’s called the goal. And that’s why it’s called goals okay.

Debbie Longo: So. Right. And the the last thing that I want to say is, um. When I am doing something physical, okay. So the mind controls what I do physically, right? When I do something physical, right? I want to be able to produce results, like we said, like making goals and helping people. Okay. Speaking nice to people, respecting Thing, people, you know where it could be anybody in the company. Okay. And when I do things like that, those thoughts turn into physical things that I do. Okay. So I might, you know, throw papers around okay. Which these things are very common. They might sound like, you know, like people don’t do this, right. Like executives don’t do this. Right. But that’s what they do. This is all stuff that’s realistic. Okay. They might, you know, you know, just throw a pen, you know, or something at an employee, okay. Not even realizing it. So just expressing anger in all different ways, they don’t have to be yelling and screaming, you know, at the employee or something in order for them to, you know, to get the point across that they’re being angry. And that creates a lot of negative negativity. I want the employees to be excited to wake up and be excited to go to work every morning, that they have the best job on earth, and they love everybody in their workplace and they love their bosses, and they’re going to respect them and they’re really, really excited to go to work every day. That’s the workplace that should be happening.

Trisha Stetzel: Yeah, I love that. And I love that culture shift where everyone is happy to be in the workplace. So in your work, Debbie, are you working with just the leaders or are you working with the entire team?

Debbie Longo: Right. So I start off with the leaders, business owners and executives. Usually is what it is. And then if they have a problem, you know, a widespread problem, right, with the company, then as it grows with them. Okay. I would suggest to, you know, can can we do a team call where we have all the employees on. Can we do groups, small groups. Okay. Or can we do maybe one on one with the client and a few employees or one employee, different things like that. So that really depends on what the situation is. Okay. So everything that I do is tailor made to that client, right to that organization because there are so many different scenarios. You know, I can’t even, you know, I can’t even really give you really like an outline, you know, of what that would be. But the idea is to fix the whole workplace, right. So, you know, however I’m going, right, however I have to do that is how I’m going to do it. Okay. Providing that the business owner is willing to do that. So if they say, oh, I just want you to help, just me, you know, and that’s all the that’s all this. The problem is just me. And I know that’s not true. And then I say, okay. And then as we go along, I’m helping them, I’m helping them. And then he sees that it’s working.

Debbie Longo: And then he might say, oh, I have one employee that has this problem. Meanwhile, he’s got like 20 employees. I have one employee that has this problem. Okay. Can you help that one employee? Okay. So we’ll do that then he says I have another employee, you know. So so this is common. You know, that we start off gradually unless he really knows the problem. And then he says, you know, we gotta I know there’s a problem with everybody and, you know, everybody has to leave. I gotta fire everybody. Which is like, it’s a horrible way to do business, you know, because then he’s going to get more people. The problem is going to continue, right? Because he didn’t solve the problem to begin with. And then he’s going to fire everybody. And then the cycle is just going to keep going on. I have a store across the street from me that I buy vegetables from, and that’s what they do. That’s exactly what they do. And they just did it again, you know. So so this is the that’s why there’s so many different examples. And these are things that happen. It’s not you know, this is not like, you know, if you’ve never saw this before, you know, then if you’re listening to this podcast then you’ve just never seen it, you know. But I could tell you that it’s common.

Trisha Stetzel: Absolutely. Well. And oftentimes it’s the leader that needs the cultural shift. Right. And so probably why they continue to fire the entire team and hire a whole new team and have the same problem because they didn’t get to the root of it, which is in between their ears. I’m just guessing it happens, right? What? Um, so you described the negativity and how some of that may be seen physically in the workplace, maybe throwing a paper or throwing a pen. And so we see that negativity when you’re working with teams and you actually see that cultural shift from that negativity to positivity. What does that look like in the workplace and how does it impact performance and revenue in a business?

Debbie Longo: Well, if it a lot of times it happens pretty quickly. Okay. It’s unless it’s a serious, serious issue and it has to be done very gradually. But even though if I give them a plan and I say, oh, you know, it might take months and months and months, they’re going to most likely nine times out of ten, start to see results almost immediately, right within like maybe a week or a month or something like that. And that’s just because the way that I work, right? Because I know you know what’s going to happen, right? So when I see that, that’s why when I start to see that change. Right. The business owner, the client is seeing that also. Now it’s a lot of times somebody sees the the gifts that we get or the positivity somebody else sees it before we see it in ourselves. Okay. So you know that happens a lot okay. But again, there’s so many different situations. But it’s you can see it’s like literally a miracle coming true. Because if somebody knows that they cannot fix themselves. It cannot happen. It’s impossible. And I just sit there and I’m like, okay, you know? And I just listen because it’s only words. Because it’s not true what they’re saying, you know, because I know that I could fix whatever, whatever it is, it’s, you know, it it it doesn’t matter what it is, but they don’t see it that way because they don’t know. Okay. So, you know, there’s a lot of things here, but it’s a it’s a huge transition to go from negative to positive. There’s so many different, you know, ways that I could feel it. You know, that the business owner can identify it. It’s just hundreds of ways I do something negative and then I’m not doing that thing anymore. Right. So that’s positive. It’s the opposite.

Speaker4: That’s good.

Trisha Stetzel: Yeah, absolutely. Well and you know the the things that we think about and practice the most do become our reality whether it’s negative or positive. Uh, and we push that into culture in our businesses. So we’re about halfway through, Debbie, and I’m sure that there are people who want to connect with you already. How what is the best way for them to get connected with you?

Debbie Longo: Sure. Well, I have a website, Life in Bloom, NY for New York, and, um, they can fill out a contact form and everything on there. They can also look on the website because I have a lot of information on there too. And I’m on LinkedIn. Okay. Um, they can just punch in my name, Debbie Longo, and it’ll come up. It comes up as a, um, revenue strategist on LinkedIn only because I’m doing audits right now, so but it’s part of the coaching thing. So if they if they, you know, you know, get in touch with me, I can you know, I can explain it. Um, so but it’s really the same thing. But so those are probably the two primary ways.

Trisha Stetzel: Okay. Fantastic. Debbie. So you guys, life in bloom NY dot net is where you want to go. Or you can look up Debbie Debbie Longo. Longo life and bloom bloom, NY on LinkedIn and connect with her there. That’s how she and I found each other is on LinkedIn. So, Debbie, let’s jump back into the conversation that we were having and I’d like to tie this into burnout. So we talked about moving from negative to positive, creating unlimited growth and profitability in these businesses. Can we talk about how burnout plays into the the negative side of things and can maybe carry over when they’re first building this growth and profitability? Profitability?

Debbie Longo: Sure. Well, there’s it produces negativity obviously. You know, which is the most the most important thing that we don’t want. Um, but if I’m burned out, the common sense part of it is that I get very tired. Right. And I get sick and tired of being like this, having this attitude, doing these things. Okay. And this could be anybody, an employee or a business owner or whatever. But a lot of times the thing is that the burnout comes from what does it come from? Overworked and underpaid. So if they if the boss says, and again, this is another common issue, the boss says, oh, the person works till five, right? I know a lot of people work online and people work different hours. Right. So I’m just giving an example. Okay. The person works till five and the boss says the boss comes and pats them on the back and says it’s like 430 and says, oh, can you just stay an extra hour to do this one thing for me? And then the person says, okay, the next day the boss does the same thing. The person says okay. The next day the boss does the same thing. Now the employee is annoyed, okay, because they have things to do, and maybe they have to pick up their kids from school. Okay, you know, they might have to cook dinner or whatever. And the employee doesn’t want to say no because the employee thinks that she’s going to get fired. Okay. And she says yes. And then the paycheck comes. The end of the week comes. She gets the paycheck. She didn’t get paid for any of those days, any of those hours. Okay. So it’s like 3 or 4 hours in one week, okay. That they would say, oh, excuse me. They would say, oh, just do a little bit of this work.

Debbie Longo: Right. Sorry. And when they know that that work is going to take an hour, and that boss knows that that work is going to take an hour, and then he says, oh, can you just do a little bit of this? It’s not going to take that long. And then they’re there. You know what I mean? They’re there for an hour. So this is the thing. So that is a huge thing that bosses do. And then they feel that because the employee said that they would do it, that the boss doesn’t have to pay them. Now they get resentments. The employee gets a resentment, the boss, they have an argument about something, and then they get very angry. And then the employee now doesn’t care, right? Because of all this, that’s happening because she’s not getting paid. And then the boss says, we are going to have to come to an agreement that either you’re going to leave or you’re going to get fired. Okay. And now the employee loses her job when none of this had to happen at all. Okay. If the boss would just pay if you asked somebody if the, the the job duty and the contract that you signed with that company is 9 to 5. If you ask one employee or anybody to work 5:01. That is the the the manager’s or the executive’s duty. Okay. Ethically and morally and legally to to pay that employee. That’s what the employee is there for to get a paycheck and to, you know, be, you know, like what they’re doing or whatever. Right. But this is the thing. So there are a lot of examples of this, right? But to me this is like the most common sense thing. And it’s also the most common.

Trisha Stetzel: Yeah, absolutely. Um, can we talk a little bit about six Figure Shift Show, which is one of your podcasts? I’d love to hear a little bit about the show. And if it’s I don’t is it a solo podcast? Are you inviting guests and what that looks like?

Debbie Longo: Right. So I have two podcasts, Behavioral Profit and six figure shift show. But what happened was people were because I have a forum for people to fill out, right. And I have a lot of episodes. I have like 25 episodes in like three months. Okay. So what people would I know what people were doing was they were filling out. They were starting to fill out the application for the behavioral profit, and then they realized they didn’t qualify because they couldn’t answer the questions. So they called me or, you know, on email or whatever, got in touch with me and said, I don’t qualify for this. And I said, why? And then they said, well, you know, this is my business. I do this and that, this and that. So I made a show. It all started with one person. Okay. So I made a show just for I know it’s like, you know, this is what I do, right? I’ll do it. You know, anything for anybody. It’s like weird. So I made a show just for somebody. Then somebody else came along, the same thing happened, and then somebody else came. The same thing happened, right? And so now I have the show, but the whole thing is on behavioral profit. Okay.

Debbie Longo: But it indicates it, right? It tells you in the beginning, you know, even in the title. Right? It’ll say six figure shift show, but it’s all on behavioral profit. But eventually I’m going to separate it. Okay. And the behavioral profit is exactly what I talked about in the beginning of this podcast in my introduction. It’s the opposite of psychology. I don’t do psychology. Okay. I’m not a psychologist. I’m not a therapist. I’m not certified. Okay. In that field, not only would it be illegal for me to do right, but this is what I’m trying to not to do, okay? Because so many people, for so many people, it just doesn’t work. Right. And I’m the type of person that even if it’s virtual, right? I’m not sitting at a desk, okay? They’re showing me, you know, their office through the camera, you know, through video conferencing or whatever. It’s a very on, hands on thing. Believe it or not, even though I’m not really there. Right. So there’s all, you know, there’s all different things. You know, I have them sometimes I have them put up posters like in their office, like think positive, different things like that. It’s called visual manifestation. That’s what it’s called. But that’s another whole story.

Trisha Stetzel: That’s another podcast I think. Daddy, don’t start another one.

Speaker4: Right. Exactly. Don’t start another one.

Trisha Stetzel: Um, tell me who your who are your best clients? I know that they need to want and, uh. And they need to want change. They, they need to want to get from negativity to positivity. But who are your typical clients that you work with.

Debbie Longo: Right. So believe it or not, okay, like any business or anything, the people who are familiar with your business are most likely going to be your best clients. Okay, from down from the fast food store, you know, restaurant all the way up to, you know, stockbroker, you know, financial company, okay. Because they’re going to understand really what you’re doing, okay. And they’re going to 100% believe in it rather than trying to convince somebody to believe in it. Okay. So the people that really understand and anybody I can help anybody, they don’t have to be in this specific field, okay. But I’m just doing it for the purposes of answering your question and just making sure that, you know, this is clear, which is fine. The question is fine. Okay. So. People who are in the health field, in the mental field, natural health, chiropractors are okay. Astrologer I had an astrologer on my show once. Um.

Speaker4: Okay.

Debbie Longo: Maybe medical doctor, because a lot of times they medical doctors now they teach about health and holistic different things like that. Okay. But most of the time a massage therapist. Okay. I had another guest, too. That was a massage therapist. I had one that was a psychotherapist. Also. I had another guest too, but she was a coach and she did other things too. She just didn’t do, you know, she just didn’t do your typical talk therapy. She did other things also. So people who are in the holistic field, okay, and who understand mental health and who go beyond giving medication, you know, what we teach in the Western world, okay, take a pill and that’ll solve your problem. You have anger. Okay. I’m going to prescribe you some medication. Just take a pill, okay? If you’re in a depression because of why, you know, there’s a lot of.

Speaker4: Reasons why, right?

Debbie Longo: I’m going to give you a pill. Take this. Right. And then you’ll get out of the depression. It works. And then this is just my experience. If you’re taking the pills and it’s fine, that’s great. But a lot of people, it works. And then it doesn’t work anymore. And then they come back to it because they haven’t solved the problem in the first place.

Speaker4: Right.

Trisha Stetzel: And one pill leads to the next pill to the next pill. And by then we’re just masking side effects of all of the things right that we’re putting into our bodies. So I love that you, um, have a lot of clients that are in the holistic space. Uh, I love, uh, that we take care of people holistically from, you know, business all the way to personal and sleep and all of the things that we should be doing. But I also understand that you can help anybody out there who’s looking to move from this negative space to this positive space. So as we wrap up today, I have one more question for you. Your company is called Life in Bloom. So if you could leave our listeners with one piece of advice about how leaders can truly bloom in both business and life, what would it be?

Debbie Longo: Think about what we talked about today on this podcast. Everything that we spoke about and think if you can relate to anything. If you can relate to one single teeny drop of one part of any sentence that we talked about in this podcast, then think about if you might need help in any way, shape or form. And also you can do an inventory yourself. You know your workday. You know your workplace. Okay. Take a piece of paper. Say this is the start of my workday. And as things go on, do write it down. This one was angry at me. I was angry at that one. And then do an inventory. And then by the end of the day, look at that. Okay. And that will tell you most likely. Okay. What your problem is. Right. So these are things that people can do on their own. But that’s not going to solve the problem. That’s going to tell you what the problem is. That’s it.

Speaker4: Mhm.

Trisha Stetzel: Okay. And then you’re going to help them get to the core and actually make the shift.

Speaker4: Right. That’s the point. Right. Exactly right. Exactly.

Trisha Stetzel: Debbie this has been such a great conversation. Thank you for coming on with me today.

Debbie Longo: Thank you for having me I really appreciate it. It was fantastic.

Trisha Stetzel: Yeah, absolutely. So you guys, if you want to connect with Debbie, of course all of this will be in the show notes. So if you’re sitting in front of your computer you can just point and click. Otherwise, when you get home from listening to this in your car, you can visit Life in Bloom, NY for New York dot net, or you can connect with Debbie on LinkedIn. Debbie I l o n g o and it will also say life in bloom and why there? Debbie, again, it has been such a pleasure to have you on the show.

Debbie Longo: Thank you very much. I really appreciate you having me. Thank you.

Trisha Stetzel: That’s all the time we have for today. If you found this conversation that I had with Debbie today. Of value or even of greater value than you could have ever imagined, then please share it. Share it with a fellow entrepreneur, a veteran, or a Houston business leader. Ready to grow. Be sure to follow, rate, and review the show. It helps us reach more bold business minds just like yours and your business. Your leadership and your legacy are built one intentional step at a time. So stay inspired, stay focused, and keep building the business and the life you deserve.

 

Nathan Turner with Earnest Investing

October 6, 2025 by angishields

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Nathan-TurnerNathan Turner is a seasoned mortgage note investor and the visionary behind Earnest Investing, a firm dedicated to helping individuals achieve passive income through note investing. With a strong foundation in real estate, Nathan made the strategic pivot from traditional property ownership to mortgage notes—an asset class that allows investors to diversify their portfolios while generating reliable, secured cash flow.

Through Earnest Investing, Nathan guides investors in understanding and entering the world of note investing with a focus on sustainability, ethical loan structuring, and long-term wealth building. His approach is rooted in years of hands-on experience and a commitment to education, transparency, and trust.

In his conversation with Trisha, Nathan detailed his journey into note investing and the motivations behind launching the Diversified Mortgage Expo, an annual event that brings together thought leaders and practitioners from across the note investing and seller-financing sectors. He emphasized the power of seller-financed notes—particularly in Texas—and how they can serve as a powerful tool for both buyers and investors. Earnest-Investing-logo

Nathan also previewed his upcoming book, “Passive Secured Unique”, where he shares strategies for building a retirement portfolio through mortgage notes. Throughout the conversation, he underlined the importance of investor education and ethical practices as key drivers of long-term success in the note space.

Whether you’re new to note investing or a seasoned investor looking to expand your portfolio, Nathan Turner offers the tools, experience, and community to help you earn passively, securely, and intelligently.

LinkedIn: http://www.linkedin.com/in/nathan-turner-a9a1b510
Website: https://earnestinvesting.com/

Transcript-iconThis transcript is machine transcribed by Sonix

 

TRANSCRIPT

Intro: Broadcasting live from the Business RadioX studios in Houston, Texas. It’s time for Houston Business Radio. Now, here’s your host.

Trisha Stetzel: Hello, Houston. Trisha Stetzel here bringing you another episode of Houston Business Radio. Today’s guest is Nathan Turner, founder of Earnest Investing and a seasoned mortgage note investor. We’re going to talk a little bit more about that later. After years in traditional real estate, Nathan transitioned into specializing in mortgage notes, helping investors diversify their portfolios and generate steady passive income. He also runs the Diversified Mortgage Expo, an annual event that brings together experts in note investing and seller financing. Nathan’s mission is to build lasting relationships and educate investors at every level, and he’s here to share why? Note investing is a powerful alternative to traditional real estate. Nathan, welcome to the show.

Nathan Turner: I’m so glad to be here. Thank you so much.

Trisha Stetzel: I’m very excited to have you today. So tell us a little bit more about Nathan and then let’s dive into earnest investing.

Nathan Turner: Yeah. Sounds good. So I’m Nathan Turner. I have been in note investing for about 15 years. But outside of that, probably the most unique thing is I live in Canada, so I live just outside of Calgary, Alberta. Uh, which, if you don’t know, that’s fine. There’s the Calgary Stampede. If you’re in the rodeo business, you maybe have heard of that. If not, I’m about an hour outside of Banff and I think everyone’s heard of that one. And it’s it is as pretty as all the pictures. It’s as pretty as everybody says. So if you haven’t visited yet, it’s definitely worth it. Um, I, uh, I’d like to just be outside as much as I can. I’d like to go and visit all the mountains. I like to go and hike. I like snowboarding, I like doing all those fun things and got my three kids, and we tried to go on as many adventures as we can. And, uh, my wife, of course, is always by my side and she’s the best.

Trisha Stetzel: And we had to put that in there. Uh, she didn’t pay us. I’m just kidding.

Nathan Turner: No.

Trisha Stetzel: Well, we. And we have something else in common. We love snowboarding, too, so we’ll have to have a.

Nathan Turner: Fantastic.

Trisha Stetzel: Nathan. Excellent. Uh, okay, so let’s talk a little bit more about your business. So tell me more about earnest investing.

Nathan Turner: Yeah. So earnest investing is a is actually a fund that we put together a little over a year ago. Um, and it is based on, you know, investors put money into the fund, and then I go out and buy mortgage notes. And in Texas there are deeds of trust. But same thing. Uh, not the same thing, but For our purposes, the same thing. It’s. It’s a loan against a property. Uh, so somebody, you know, they want to go and buy a house. Great. So you typically we go to the bank, uh, we get a loan from the bank. They set it up as either a mortgage or deed of trust, depending on the state. At some point in the future, uh, the bank or the lender, whoever it is that gave you that loan says, you know what? I would rather recapitalize, get my cash back and move on and do something else with that capital. So then they contact somebody like me and I say, well, I will do that. I will buy whatever that loan is that you’ve got. Outstanding. Uh, and I step into the role of the lender. So I don’t actually lend out the money, but I do. I technically am a lender. I step into that role and I become the bank for whoever’s living in the house.

Trisha Stetzel: Okay. Very interesting. So you started in traditional real estate, uh, before you transitioned into mortgage notes. So number one, what made you shift and what advantages denotes offer that people often overlook?

Nathan Turner: So why did I shift? That’s a great question. So I really like let’s just, you know, get it straight. I love real estate. I’m a big, big fan. Um, I was doing fix and flip back when it was really easy to do that 2005 and six, where the market was just really conducive to fix and flip. It was very easy to do. Um, as the market turned, I got stuck with actually just one property that I ended up becoming a landlord. I liked that much less, uh, being a landlord was a lot more work and, uh, just yeah, a lot more to do, more headaches and things to deal with. Uh, but I did like that monthly income, and that was an attractive part of it for me. So I didn’t like the landlording thing I did. I do like real estate. I like that there’s a hard asset there. I was introduced into this world of of note investing, uh, about late 2008 and 2009, where, um, you can buy just the loan instead of taking over the property as the bank. We don’t actually take ownership of the house. So whoever’s living in the house, they still retain ownership, but the loan itself transfers over to me. So what that means for me is I get all of that monthly income, the part that I did like without having to take care of the property, the part that I didn’t like. So to me, it was just like the perfect marriage of of how this all comes together and best of both worlds in my mind.

Trisha Stetzel: Yeah, absolutely. So my next question was going to be, how does the investor actually make money from buying the loan? So do you want to take that a little bit deeper for us?

Nathan Turner: Sure. Yeah. So um, when I’m looking at buying any kind of a loan, Let’s put some numbers behind it just to make it a little easier to visualize. So we’ll use easy numbers. These are maybe not realistic, but just stay with me. So let’s say the balance of the loan is $100,000. The house is worth 150. Um, I would come along and there’s a lot of factors that go into it. What’s the interest rate? You know, how long is the term, uh, where is it located? When what’s the payment history? All those kind of things go into it. But for super simple discussion we say, okay, so if the balance is $100,000, um, I’m willing to pay out the bank and become that the new bank and step into that role. I anytime that I’m going to do that, I am taking on a little bit of a risk. Uh, you know, I haven’t formed this relationship with the borrower. I this is stepping into a different situation. So it’s always done at a discount. So if it’s $100,000 balance, I’m probably not going to pay more than, let’s say, 80,000. And again, like I said, there’s lots of factors and there’s lots of things that go behind that. But in any case, I’m going to buy it at some kind of a discount. So because I’ve bought it at a discount, whatever that posted rate is, let’s say the rate today is 7% because I bought it at a discount. My return would actually jump up to nine, ten, 11 somewhere in there depending on on all those other factors. So automatically I end up stepping into a higher return. Plus I’ve got an additional equity position in there. So it just increases my safety, helps me feel a little bit better about the whole investment as a whole.

Trisha Stetzel: Yeah, absolutely. Okay. So I’m guessing I’m not the only one. Some of the listeners have probably never heard of this before.

Nathan Turner: Most likely.

Trisha Stetzel: Yeah. So I’m curious because you’ve been doing this, it sounds like since around 2008, 2009. Um, are you seeing trends in your industry where more people are doing node investing? Or is it still like this big secret?

Nathan Turner: It’s mostly secret still, which is it’s fascinating to me because it’s actually been around a very long time. And especially in Texas, seller financing is done more in Texas than anywhere else in the country combined. In fact, there’s a higher rate of seller financed loans being created than anywhere else. Even if you combine all the other states together, they don’t add up to what Texas does. So I’m actually a big fan of Texas loans. They’re fantastic. But because of that, uh, I forgot where I was going on that.

Trisha Stetzel: Yeah. No worries. It was. I was asking if it’s still secret or are you seeing.

Speaker4: Yeah. Yeah, yeah.

Trisha Stetzel: That way.

Nathan Turner: Right. So yeah, it’s still relatively unknown, which is kind of interesting and I, I honestly don’t exactly know why. Um, it’s a great business and there’s not a ton of barriers to entry there. There’s certainly some education that you need to get because we’re dealing with the finance, not the property. Uh, which takes a little while to get your head around, but, uh, but because of that fact, maybe that’s what it is, but I’m not exactly sure why. It’s not as well known as I think it should be. But anyway, I don’t mind it being a secret either, so I guess I’m okay.

Trisha Stetzel: Well, it’s not a secret anymore, because everyone’s listening.

Nathan Turner: Nathan, right?

Trisha Stetzel: Yeah. Um, so we’re about halfway through, and I’m sure people are already interested in having a conversation. Especially my Texas friends may want to learn more or even have a conversation with you. What is the best way to connect with you?

Nathan Turner: Nathan I think probably the best way is to just go to the website, uh, which is Ernest Investing.com, and that’s e a r. So Ernest Investing.com is, uh, place where you can learn a little bit more about notes. There’s a link there to the Diversified Mortgage Expo. And then of course, there’s a couple of different places on there where you can create an appointment with me and we can have a conversation.

Trisha Stetzel: Fantastic. And you guys, as always, I’ll have that in the show notes. So if you’re sitting in front of your computer, you can just point and click to find out more about Nathan, his business, as well as a few other things. So, Nathan, I heard through the grapevine that you have a book coming out. Can we talk about that?

Nathan Turner: Sure. Well, I’m just putting the finishing touches on it, so it should be ready here very shortly. I think it’ll be ready by the time this airs.

Speaker4: But yes, it is.

Trisha Stetzel: Tell us more.

Nathan Turner: I’m really excited about this because it’s something that I’ve been thinking about for a long time. I think part of me thought, you know what? I think I need enough experience to be able to have the right to write a book. Uh, and I feel like I’m there now. So the book is really all about, um, my journey and notes in general and what that’s all about. And I’ll turns out it just kind of in the writing of it. It really kind of focused on the community of note investing and what a big deal that is and how important that is to just get into this world where generally we pretty much all know each other and I love it. I love that we get to just be this, you know, little secret society almost. We’re doing this business. It’s great.

Trisha Stetzel: Yeah, I love that. Okay. So have you titled the book yet?

Nathan Turner: Yes, it’s called Passive Secured Unique, which is the tagline for my business.

Speaker4: Okay.

Nathan Turner: And yeah, so it’s just talking about this really cool business which is passive and secured by real estate. And it’s really unique. Not a lot of people know about it.

Trisha Stetzel: I love that, that’s fantastic. So where can folks find it, since we know that it’s going to be out and ready for purchase?

Nathan Turner: Yeah. Uh, at the very least on the website, we’ll we’ll have links there to be able to acquire it. However that’s going to go out. We’re not exactly sure yet. But, uh, but definitely on the website. That’ll be the place to start.

Trisha Stetzel: Fantastic. Congratulations. That is an amazing accomplishment. And yes, you’ve been doing this business absolutely long enough to write about it. So you guys go to Ernest Investing.com e a n e investing.com to check out that information around the book. All right, Nathan, I want to know a little bit more about the Diversified Mortgage Expo. What time of year does that happen? Tell me who should come to it where it happens?

Speaker4: Yeah.

Nathan Turner: Diversified Mortgage Expo is so much fun. We we took this over. My wife and I, we, uh, took this over about three years ago. Uh, we run it at the beginning of May, typically that first weekend in May in Nashville, Tennessee. And it’s just a place for everybody to come together and everybody is anybody who’s brand new to the business, and they’ve just barely heard about this all the way to people who have multi-million dollar funds. And it just it it makes me so happy to see all these people coming together. And node investors are some of the friendliest people out there and so open and so sharing with everything. So somebody who’s brand new can show up and go and sit at the same table as somebody who’s very seasoned and, you know, has all these assets under management and everything else, and they can have a really great conversation and there’s no judgment. There’s no like, oh, well, talk to me when you’ve done this a while and there’s nothing like that. It’s very inviting. It’s very open. We come together the night before we start the conference. We do an ax throwing tournament, uh, just to help break the ice and have some fun. And then it’s a no sales, you know, purely in informational, educational, so that you can learn more about this. And, and really the idea is that you can meet other people that are in the business so that you can start making some connections and get some business done.

Trisha Stetzel: I love that. Okay, so Nathan’s giving us some information about the secret society of node investing and this expo. So you guys if you want, if you’re interested in node investing and you want to learn more about the expo, please reach out to Nathan. I am sure he’s happy to share the information about both with you guys. All right. I want to jump back if it’s okay. So that was fun, but I want to jump back over to node investing. What are some of the biggest challenges that you see in that space, and how do you coach others or even yourself, uh, to overcome those challenges?

Nathan Turner: So there’s a few things. Um, regulation is a big one. And just learning the ropes. And part of what makes that challenging is. Yes, there are some national standards, but then there are also some state specific standards. And so learning what’s okay in Texas versus Florida versus Ohio, uh, and they’re very different. And they’re depending on what happens and how it’s set up, how you deal with a non-performer if they start, if they default, what happens there? Each state has their own way of dealing with it. So getting that education up front is really important. And again, that’s not a pitch because I don’t teach. But I can certainly introduce you to some people who do. So understanding how it works to begin with, that’s a that’s a major challenge. And that’s something that you really need to focus on before you decide you want to jump into this. On the back end of that, let’s say you do end up getting a defaulted note. Let’s say, you know, somebody’s paying. Something happens. Uh, there’s some life challenge that comes their way and they’re not able to make payments. Almost always, I’ll just preface that almost always, if we do end up going to a foreclosure, it’s usually because the house is vacant.

Nathan Turner: Uh, and maybe they’ve passed away or they’ve abandoned the property. That’s usually when foreclosure happens. It’s very rare that we actually foreclose on a person. It’s usually just on an empty house. That being said, once we take back that property, that’s the next big risk is we’re getting into a property where because we’ve only bought the note, uh, we don’t actually have the right to go inside that house. Unlike traditional real estate. So as much as we have seen it from the outside, we’ve sent somebody out there to go and look at it and observe and everything else. It has happened for sure. Where we take back that property, we get inside and. Oh no. And it’s certainly not what we thought it was going to be. So that’s the it taking back that house. And then, you know, maybe we start doing renovations and we open up a wall and we go, oh, shoot, there’s that. Uh, and that’s the risk where we end up, um, having most of our challenges is when we actually start dealing with the property itself.

Speaker4: Wow.

Trisha Stetzel: Okay, that sounds a little scary.

Speaker4: Uh, so they’re a little bit risky.

Trisha Stetzel: A little risk involved, right? Uh, it’s not all, um, roses, right? Uh, and I think with any, any kind of investing, there’s a bit of risk or calculated risk.

Speaker4: Um, when.

Nathan Turner: Absolutely. And it’s something you need to be aware of and, and to take into account, like you say, it’s not all sunshine and rainbows. I wish it was. That would make my life so much easier. But no, it it’s a real business. There are real challenges. Uh, so you just need to be prepared for that.

Trisha Stetzel: Okay, so, Nathan, um, we know there’s a book coming out. It’s probably already out. Uh, for those of you who are listening today. So go and take a look for the book on Ernest Investing.com. What’s next for you, Nathan? And for earnest investing.

Nathan Turner: I. I am in the midst of, um, preparing my long term play. So as I’m running this fund, part of that, you know, my income is, of course, mixed in with that. Um, and then a big focus for me is building up my own portfolio. And for me, this is my retirement. Um, the plan is, you know, get a whole bunch of notes, uh, that are making monthly payments. And then there’s some management involved with that, of course. Uh, but more or less, I’m, you know, quote unquote, retired where my wife and I can go and travel. My, our kids are just about all gone. Uh, we’ve got one left in high school for another couple of years, and then he’ll move out. And then I don’t know, you know, whether that’s going visiting kids or whether that’s going and doing whatever, uh, different service around the world or who knows what. But, uh, but we’ll be set up to where we can make that choice, and we can have the freedom to be able to go and do whatever we want to do, whenever we want to do it. So that’s the long term play.

Trisha Stetzel: I love that when you first got into real estate, did you think this was going to be the legacy? Uh, the long term plan for you was real estate.

Nathan Turner: Um, I was hoping it would be I. But at the same time, when I very first got involved, it was fix and flip. And so that’s very physically taxing. And so I recognize that, um, you know, I can only last so long doing that kind of thing. Uh, so that was part of the question is like, how do we make this work long term? And, you know, you can hire crews and all those kind of things. Uh, and definitely that works. But the market’s not always really good for flipping. So. Okay. What about renting. Well same thing then you now you’re dealing with tenants and there’s turnover and again repairs to the property those kinds of things. So surely there’s something else, a different way that this can work. So that’s why I think notes is such a great fit for me.

Trisha Stetzel: Yeah. So you talked a little bit about or you just said you were introduced to note investing around 2000, 2008. Can you tell me a little bit more about that experience? So you’re in traditional real estate. You’ve done all the hard work, the labor behind fix and Flip. Uh, and you were introduced to note investing. So how did that even happen?

Nathan Turner: Yeah. You know, it’s another one of those cases of right place, right time, uh, where I, a colleague of mine, he called me up and said, hey, I’ve got this opportunity. Are you interested? We had, uh, been given charge over about 60 properties, mostly centered in the Midwest. Uh, a couple kind of spread out here and there. But it was a deal where these investors had bought this portfolio of properties. They’re supposed to flip it out to another group. Of course, this was back in 2007, when everything seemed like it was never going to end. Uh, the deal went south, and now they’re stuck with all these properties. So they’d contacted us and said, okay, so can you guys do something? Uh, they had their own, you know, full time jobs. Whatever. Can you guys figure this out? So we we thought we’d come up with the whole concept of seller finance. We thought we were pretty smart there, uh, because, again, we’d never heard of it. It’s still not that common. So we started selling these houses on terms. So basically seller financing, uh, we would take a down payment and then structure a monthly payment plan that included principal and interest payment.

Nathan Turner: And again, we thought we’d invented seller finance. So it was in the in the time where we had created some of these notes and I was looking for, okay, so what’s our back end like? We I don’t know that we want to hang on to these long terms. So surely, you know, you can sell a turnkey rental. So to me this is even better. We don’t even have to take care of the property. So, doing some internet research, I went and took a class down in Houston. In fact, uh, where it was all about this guy that was teaching about, uh, buying the kind of notes that I was creating. So I thought, oh, this is perfect. What a great fit. And then in the course of that, um, class, he said, well, there’s a conference coming up in fall of 2009, in New Orleans. You should come and check that out. And I go into this room and there’s like 200 investors in there that have been doing this for 30 years. And I’m like, this, this is a thing. People do this. No way. And so to me, that was it. Like I was hooked right away.

Speaker4: Yeah. That was really the introduction.

Nathan Turner: Right place, right time.

Trisha Stetzel: Yeah, I love that. Uh, maybe you should come to Texas and buy the billion dollar lottery ticket, and I’ll. I’ll be your best friend. I’m kidding.

Speaker4: There you go.

Trisha Stetzel: Right place at the right time.

Speaker4: Yeah.

Trisha Stetzel: Um, okay, I’ve got one more question for you as we wrap up, Nathan. Looking ahead. Um, what do you see as the future of node investing? And how do you think it’s going to open up new opportunities for everyday investors who have maybe never considered it, like you so many years ago?

Nathan Turner: Yeah, that’s a great question because, um, I think partially, you know, to understand the future, we got to look at the past. So as I was getting into this business, I thought, so how long is this going to last? You know, what’s the opportunity here is kind of trying to plan for the future, to see exactly this, you know, how long could I do this? And, uh, in the middle of doing that, I’m like, okay, well, these guys have been doing it for 30 years, you know, since the 80s. Whatever has been around longer than that. And then it was watching a movie with my wife about somebody in the 1800s where this guy had bought this woman’s debts, and he was kind of holding it over her. And now I own your debts. And I was like, wait, wait, that’s what I do. I buy other people’s debts. I’m like, okay, so it’s been around at least that long. And then later we’re, you know, in Sunday school and church and and talking about buying debts in the Bible, I’m like, wait a second. So it’s been around really pretty much forever. Uh, going forward, I think that seller finance is going to be I think it’s going to become more and more common.

Nathan Turner: Uh, dealing with banks is increasingly more difficult. And there’s a better way that within reason, of course, like we we have to set up these loans that are ethical and proper. We never want to be taking advantage of anybody. Um, but there are many situations where banks really don’t know how to deal with somebody who’s self-employed, for example. Um, and we’re seeing a rise in that, and people are starting to work for themselves more. Well, if banks can’t figure that out, that’s where we come in. And then we’ve got these seller finance, uh, type of offers that we can come up with. And then that creates a secondary market where somebody says, well, I’ve created this note now I’d like to cash out of it. So they come in, contact somebody like me. I think that that’s going to be a bigger portion of what we’re buying going forward. Uh, barring something happening in the world that that creates another opportunity. But there’s always going to be something out there for sure.

Trisha Stetzel: Yeah, absolutely. Well, this has been so much fun, Nathan. I learned something that I had no idea. I’m so glad that we, uh, had the opportunity to have this conversation today and appreciate you sharing so much information about the secret society. There might be people who are interested in joining. I’m just saying.

Speaker4: Absolutely, absolutely.

Trisha Stetzel: Nathan, one more time. Share your contact information with the audience, please.

Nathan Turner: Yeah. So the website is Ernest Investing.com. Uh, and that’s e n e s t, and, uh, that’s the place to go for whatever you want to learn some more about it. If you want to connect to the Diversified Mortgage Expo or if you wanted to set an appointment and come and talk to me, and I’m happy to chat and just see what we can do together.

Trisha Stetzel: I love that, or by or by Nathan’s book or by.

Speaker4: Or find the book there too. Yeah.

Trisha Stetzel: I love this. Well, thank you so much. I appreciate your time today, Nathan.

Speaker4: Thank you.

Trisha Stetzel: That’s all the time we have for today. If you found value in this conversation I had with Nathan today, share it with a fellow entrepreneur, veteran or a Houston leader ready to grow. Be sure to follow, rate, and review the show. It helps us reach more bold business minds just like yours and your business. Your leadership and your legacy are built one intentional step at a time. So stay inspired, stay focused, and keep building the business and the life you deserve.

 

Building a Performer Environment: Transforming Professional Practices for Lasting Success

October 1, 2025 by angishields

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Cherokee Business Radio
Building a Performer Environment: Transforming Professional Practices for Lasting Success
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Brought to you by Diesel David and Main Street Warriors

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In this episode of Cherokee Business Radio, host Joshua Kornitsky welcomes guests Robert Lee, founder of The Lesix Agency, Tiana Neal, CEO of Transcenders Consulting Group, and Farrell Middleton, Owner of The Bell Curve of Life. The conversation explores each guest’s unique journey and insights into business growth and professional development. Robert shares how personal loss and business setbacks inspired him to help real estate professionals improve their operations and quality of life, highlighting the industry’s lack of business education, the importance of mindset shifts, and the benefits of AI-powered tools. Tiana Neal discusses her approach to building strong client relationships and fostering resilience in the face of challenges, while Farrell Middleton offers strategies for navigating market changes and sustaining long-term success. 

Lesix-Agency-logo

Robert-Lee-bwRobert (Rob) Lee lives in Dallas, GA with his wife, girls, and pets. He’s an AI Branding Academy Partner, AI Persona Method Certified, REEA Gold Standard Instructor, and member of the Paulding Board of Realtors.

His marketing agency, The Lesix Agency, helps Real People make Real Money in Real Estate with AI Employees.

Follow The Lesix Agency on LinkedIn and Facebook.

Tiana-Neal-bwTiana Neal is the Founder and CEO of Transcenders Consulting Group, a firm specializing in Human Capital Management (HCM) solutions and the host of The Human Roll where she explores key topics in HR and payroll spotlighting emerging businesses in the HCM space all while sharing insights in leadership, trends and best practices.

With over 15 years of experience in the professional services industry, Tiana has a proven track record of optimizing processes, ensuring compliance, and driving seamless implementations to help businesses achieve operational excellence. Transcenders-logo

Her passion lies in empowering organizations to transcend traditional boundaries and unlock the full potential of their workforce through innovative and tailored HCM solutions.

Connect with Tiana on LinkedIn.

Farrell-Middleton-bwFarrell Middleton founded The Bell Curve of Life in 2022 to inspire positive change for individuals and organizations. His mission is to help people become A-level performers and support leaders in creating A-level environments.

Since launching the program, Farrell has connected with hundreds of people through one-on-one sessions, small groups, company presentations, contractor accreditation classes, and public speaking engagements.

After a successful 36-year career in residential land development and homebuilding, Farrell transitioned to his long-anticipated second career as a teacher, speaker, and author. This shift, made at age 57, has allowed him to share his passion for growth and leadership while engaging with people in meaningful ways.

In 2025, Farrell became a published author with the release of his first book, A Performer/A Environment. The book presents a practical framework for personal and professional growth and serves as the cornerstone of The Bell Curve of Life program.

Farrell’s programs draw on his extensive personal and professional experiences. A Georgia Tech honors graduate, he held senior leadership roles with both private and public organizations in the thriving Atlanta housing market. Over his career, he managed hundreds of employees, directed diverse teams, and navigated complex group dynamics. The-Bell-Curve-of-Life-logo

A Savannah native and the youngest of four, Farrell met his wife Kathy in high school. Married since 1986, they’ve raised two daughters, Pfeiffer and Collier, who now reside in the Atlanta area.

Follow The Bell Curve of Life on LinkedIn.

Episode Highlights

  • Personal and professional challenges faced by entrepreneurs and professionals across various industries, including navigating significant life events and setbacks.
  • The impact of adversity on business operations and the potential consequences, such as financial strain, burnout, or even bankruptcy.
  • The founding and mission of organizations dedicated to supporting professionals in enhancing their business operations and overall quality of life.
  • Unique challenges within different industries, such as the lack of formal business education and common misconceptions about professional roles and responsibilities.
  • The importance of mindset shifts and clear goal-setting for achieving success, regardless of industry.
  • The role of AI-powered tools in establishing efficient, repeatable processes that boost productivity and reduce stress for professionals.
  • The necessity for individuals to adopt a strategic, proactive approach to their work rather than reacting to daily demands.
  • The significance of building community and support networks within professional environments.
  • The value of engaging with clients or stakeholders through discovery sessions to identify opportunities for growth and improvement.
  • The philosophy of simplifying complex business concepts into actionable principles to drive high performance in any professional setting.

Transcript-iconThis transcript is machine transcribed by Sonix.

 

TRANSCRIPT

Intro: Broadcasting live from the Business RadioX studios in Woodstock, Georgia. It’s time for Cherokee Business Radio. Now, here’s your host.

Joshua Kornitsky: Welcome back to Cherokee Business Radio. I’m your host and professional EOS implementer, Joshua Kornitsky. And we’ve got a full studio today. Uh, three wonderful guests that I’m excited to get to. Before we get started, I just want to remind everybody that today’s episode is brought to you in part by our community partner program, the Business RadioX Main Street Warriors. Defending Capitalism, promoting small business, and supporting our local community. For more information, go to Mainstreet Warriors.org and a special note of thanks to our title sponsor for the Cherokee chapter of Main Street Warriors, Diesel David Inc. Please go check them out at diesel.david.com. Well, as I said, we’ve got a full studio today and I’m really excited to introduce my first guest, uh, Robert Lee. Robert, before I go any further, I’m going to screw up the name of your company. So please tell me the name of your company.

Robert Lee: Lesix Agency

Joshua Kornitsky: Lesix Agency. It’s a marketing consultancy focused on real estate professionals. Uh, your background is in engineering and Lean Six Sigma principles. You hope your clients streamline operations and adopt AI powered tools to elevate their impact. Would you say that? That’s about right.

Robert Lee: I would say the only thing that’s missing is we use a lot of theory of Constraints as well. So Lean Six Sigma, that’s where the name Lesix Agency comes from. But TOC is a very critical part of that as well.

Joshua Kornitsky: So let’s begin at the beginning. Tell us how we got here.

Robert Lee: Oh my gosh. Okay. So if everybody has a day and a half to hear my sob story, let’s.

Joshua Kornitsky: Reduce the beginning. No, please.

Robert Lee: That’s. That’s fair enough. In short, two years ago, two and a half years ago, I had a very successful direct mail business based out of Marietta and operated my consulting on the side. And in August of 2022, my wife and I lost her third child. She was about seven months pregnant. That sent me down a little bit of a hole. And while I was out, I don’t know if I was grieving or just kind of lost. But while I was out, the business continued to run. But I had a staff member that authorized some expenditures that were not exactly in the business’s best interest. So I got back in and wasn’t fully through that grieving process yet. I know nobody ever is. Uh, but got back in, made some changes, got everything aligned. And in February of 2023, my old man, the guy that raised us, my parents split when I was young. My dad taught me everything I know about how to treat people, how to show respect. I just get a phone call that he had a heart attack and a doctor’s chair. Wow. And so I have these three instances of where life and business were colliding. And so I went through to write the book on how to destroy a $2 million business in four months. Right.

Joshua Kornitsky: And that’s rough.

Robert Lee: I mean, I look at it and I say, I could have self-destructed through drugs and alcohol, like a lot of people do. Or. But but thankfully, I didn’t. I just destroyed a business. And my wife and I have everything separated in terms of business structure. So I had to go through the bankruptcy process. And as I’m fat man crying in my room while my girls are daycare and my wife is at work, I just I get a lot of sleep, which I hadn’t had in years. Right. And I started to get some clarity by asking the question, Why was I not set up to grieve the right way? Why was I not set up to understand how business impacted life and how life impacted business? And and that was the beginning of the process of really launching the Lee6 agency as my core business. And through that process, found that there’s a lot of real estate professionals out there that suffer through those same questions, and there was a great way for us to make money together, make memories together, go out there and just make the world a better place.

Joshua Kornitsky: That’s an absolutely incredible story to to go from the lowest point I imagine you’ve been, and then to lose your dad and then to to rebuild on top of it. So thank you for sharing that. Um, if you would share with us a little bit more about who and how you help with Lee6.

Robert Lee: Again, real estate professionals, Brokers, individual agents. There’s realtor associations that are really having a tough time right now with a lot of the industry changes around Nar and real estate schools, like, believe it or not, there’s a huge cottage industry of real estate educators.

Joshua Kornitsky: Right.

Robert Lee: That that have to provide the educational services to this professionally regulated industry here in Georgia, 36 hours of continuous education every four ish years, as you renew your license, you have to go through 75 hours of pre-license. You have to go through 24 or 36, I don’t know, education is miserable.

Joshua Kornitsky: Sure. Well, and it’s a necessity of a lot of industries. Right.

Robert Lee: Exactly.

Joshua Kornitsky: But it also keeps them current on things. So so with that being out there, how are you assisting.

Robert Lee: Yeah. And and to, to basically I outline all of that to say that the thing that each of those have in common, they’re very different from one another. They’re sets of experiences are very different. They’re very unique. But what they all have in common is they operate in an industry that doesn’t have a lot of business. Common sense. There are common practices that have been done in the industry for years, and it’s very reactive. It’s very shoot from the hip. I mean, there’s this thing that real estate agents are told you’re always on as a real estate agent 24 over seven. And I hear stories of people taking phone calls during kids recitals. And I mean, that just sucks, man.

Joshua Kornitsky: Just no quality of life.

Robert Lee: That’s not that’s not.

Joshua Kornitsky: And you had even shared with me kind of this perspective that you that you have, uh, that a lot of the real estate professionals don’t see themselves as business owners.

Robert Lee: And that’s it, right? They’re taught to be reactive to everything, because in many cases, these people are making a transition into the industry from another one. A lot of veterans choose real estate. But think about it. You go from being a very in a very structured environment.

Joshua Kornitsky: Right.

Robert Lee: Where you’re told what to do. You respect a chain of command into an industry where you’re not an employee of anybody. Most agents come into the industry not understanding that they are a business of one.

Joshua Kornitsky: Right.

Robert Lee: They don’t work for their brokerage. They’re not employees. They have to pay all of their taxes. They have to handle all of their HR issues, hire their vendors, all of that. Now, a brokerage will help out with that, but they don’t get that experience of business education while they’re getting their license. They’re taught in these real estate schools from the start how to pass a test. And so what happens is you have this vicious cycle where brokers who should be providing that business education never got it themselves. So it’s just this continuous years long re-investment in the idea that you have to go out and just do it as opposed to, again, common sense and common practice are not the same thing in this industry. And that’s not anybody’s fault. It just means that the industry has to be approached differently. You have to start asking the questions of why is it so miserable to take calls at 10 a.m. or not 10 a.m. it’s not miserable to take a call at 10 a.m. 10 p.m..

Joshua Kornitsky: Less so.

Robert Lee: Because you have a client that’s freaking out as opposed to approaching it from the perspective of how can I set up my business to prevent 10 p.m. calls? How can I set up my business to prevent these problems that we know are going to exist from ever happening?

Joshua Kornitsky: So at a high level, explain to us, how do you do that? How do you help them shift their mindset and their understanding? So what types of tools are you able to introduce? What type of approaches do you share in order to make that quality of life difference.

Robert Lee: Pretty simple. First thing we do, we start introducing clarity and clear thinking into their business. Start asking by questions. What’s the goal? What are the necessary requirements? What assumptions are you making about how to meet that goal? And then start teaching them from that foundational question. What’s the goal on how to align everything they’re doing with their particular business and personal goal, and teaching them that it is okay to not do things that do not help you meet the goal, that do not fall within the parameters of that necessary, those sets of necessary requirements. Because honestly, like 6,070% of the crap that people do in real estate don’t align with a well-defined goal. And imagine just being able to just kind of let it go like a that the rock and curling, right? You watch curling and you see these guys just slide across the ice and they just let go of the rock and it just goes. You just want them to let go of those things that are doing that don’t align with the goals. So once you introduce that clarity of thinking, that clear thinking process, get them used to saying, I’m not doing that and I am doing this and educate them on that, then we can start to use AI and the strengths of AI to actually create AI employees repeatable, predictable, consistent processes that the real estate professional, in whatever context they’re in, can pull off the shelf and use when they need it and put it back when they don’t.

Joshua Kornitsky: So thank you. Now I think we’re in is that I think the the term is agentic AI is that the.

Robert Lee: And this is part of the conversation that we have with folks is that Agentic AI there’s a lot there’s a lot of confusion about what that term really means. Most people begin with the question how can we use AI as opposed to how do we understand our business? Now, when you get to the question of understanding your business, then you can start to view AI in a variety of different ways. And we kind of look at it in three different levels. Okay, AI employees are documented processes that don’t run on their own unless you tell it to start. And you can do that in ChatGPT. We use a lot of cloud, but basically these processes don’t execute themselves. You have to start it. And it has a very well defined set of training and parameters.

Joshua Kornitsky: Do a do be do c stop.

Robert Lee: Correct. Right. Underneath that is automation which is not artificial intelligence. But it’s kind of the basis. Right. I mean it’s if A happens then B follows. If B follows then c, D and e follows. So on and so forth. Your automations can be defined by your AI employees. Okay. Right. And then you have agentic AI which is more autonomous. And these are things like Manus and these automated phone call systems that answer phone calls. You can actually use your AI employees to train your agentic AI to answer the phone in a certain way, collect certain information. Because if that agentic AI, that autonomous semi-autonomous AI isn’t trained well, it’s not going to do its job well. Just like a person.

Joshua Kornitsky: Just like real people.

Robert Lee: Just like real people. And so we always begin with the clear thinking about your business, because if you don’t have that right, you’re never going to use AI, right? And then it doesn’t. Then the definition of what agentic AI is and what an AI employee is, it doesn’t really matter.

Joshua Kornitsky: No. And I think you’re I know and you know, you’re 100% right on that. I do know that people don’t care what it’s called, if it does what they would like it to do. Exactly. But the fact that you’re introducing clarity on the front end, um, Probably has. Well, let me ask rather than than assume. Does that lessen that fear of adoption? Because you’ve you’ve taken the big scary unknown of AI, which, I mean, at this point, I think my refrigerator and my toaster have AI. Not for any reason I can think of, but I guess it’s just a great way to harvest more data from me. That’s, of course, how I like my toast is relevant to somebody. Um, what does that do for for your, um, clients from from an adoption approach? Once that that fear is diminished.

Robert Lee: Well, one, it gets them to slow down, which is the nice thing. It actually forces them to sit there and think through what it is they’re using AI for. And then second of all, it makes it less scary because it shows people that AI is not really intelligent. It’s a logical prediction engine, which is just a fancy way of saying it takes a bunch of data about how you like your toast, and about how you two here that are also guests might like whatever it is you like, and then creates the logical prediction of what the right output is. So when we talk about real estate, many people don’t know how to write a listing description. That doesn’t suck. And what I mean by that is this beautiful four bedroom, three bathroom house with 3500ft² in an idyllic neighborhood is a house of your dreams. Well, every damn house is the house of my dreams if it’s described that way, sure. But by understanding how to connect with their clients and understanding how you build profiles for marketing, they then can create AI employees to help them create those profiles, help help them create their marketing strategies that help them write those listing descriptions that are completely aligned to the goal inside of their business. And if that goal is to sell single mothers with children homes, right. You can still do that without running afoul of the regulations and the legal requirements of of how you you practice real estate.

Joshua Kornitsky: So please.

Robert Lee: Know. And at the end of the day, this is just a lot of different ways of saying no your business then use AI. And if you know your business, your AI use will be simple and easy to implement.

Joshua Kornitsky: That makes sense. So so do you. It sounds like there’s certainly uh customizable tools. Mhm. Um, but it also sounds like there’s a level of guidance or coaching involved here because it starts with mindset. And if you’re starting with mindset, what does the engagement look like? If someone wants to work with you and understand and benefit both from the mindset approach, from the quality of life approach, but also from the technical, uh, facilitation to make their life easier. Mhm. What does that look like?

Robert Lee: Yeah. Pretty simple. So our business we’ll just call it our business development process. We essentially walk up to people all the time and say, hey, how’s life going? What’s going on in real estate from your perspective? And then they start to find, I hear, a little hint of a complaint. They may try to to paint it over as being something amazing and wonderful and perfect in every way. But there will be a little hint of complaint in there, like, this really isn’t working. And then I just simply say, well, hey, I have this great process. It’s a TOC. It’s it’s basically the TOC tool thinking tools, right. The current reality tree and the future reality tree and the evaporating cloud and all of these things. I’m throwing those terms out there. If you’re listening, go read the goal. Go read. It’s not luck. Go look up everything by Eli Goldratt and you’ll know what those terms mean okay. But at the end of the day they’re they’re processes. They’re thinking processes. And so I just tell folks, hey, you have an hour a time I can actually help you change your business strategy. It’s not even I don’t offer it free of charge. We don’t even talk about money at that point. It’s just like, do you have an hour of time? And you’ll get a business strategy out of it. It’s up to you on how you implement that. Sure. But you give an hour of time. I’ll give you an hour of time. We will have a conversation. And then I introduce the AI employee that we use. Explain to them that our conversation will be used as basically data to help us use this process more effectively. By the end of it, we get into the discussion of how we might be able to help.

Joshua Kornitsky: So then let me ask the the most important question of all in this context, who are you best suited to help if someone’s listening right now? Uh, what are what are the right size organizations, the right type of people, the right type of roles within real estate profession that that are a good fit for what you offer and for being able to make the biggest impact for them.

Robert Lee: From a brokerage perspective, mid-size brokers that are looking to recruit producing agents that can produce more. So in other words, you might have 150 200 agents on your brokerage roster, and maybe ten of them are actually producing on a consistent basis. You know, at least 20 of them have the potential to produce better. And you know that there are thousands of agents out there that are unhappy paying their brokerage whatever they’re paying their brokerage. But you don’t have a way to necessarily recruit and retain and mobilize those agents. From a brokerage perspective, that’s who we’d like to work with. Individual agents. You’re doing 4 or 5 transactions a year. You want to get to 10 or 15. That’s a difference of six figures at least.

Joshua Kornitsky: Right?

Robert Lee: Those are the types of agents that we want to talk to from a business perspective. Sure. Real estate schools. I mean, really any size real estate school who is mentally ready to turn it into a business? And then any realtor association of any size, you want to build a business model that actually helps you grow in very difficult times. Those are the types of folks we want to to speak with from a business perspective. Now, from a personal perspective, my personal goal is that I have to be a happy, present father in the lives of my wife and children. I have two necessary requirements for that. I have to be home, pick up my girl off the bus, get dragged to Disney World four times a year because my wife and girls love it.

Joshua Kornitsky: I was there last week.

Robert Lee: Oh, I was there last week too. You know how it was like walking in to the sun with humidity of 100%? It was miserable.

Joshua Kornitsky: Yep.

Robert Lee: But that means being a happy. That means being a present father, which I didn’t have the opportunity to do beforehand. The other necessary requirement to be happy. I’m an extrovert. I love to talk. I love to problem solve, which means I have to be around people. So from a personal goal perspective that aligns with business, I’ll talk to anybody involved in any size organization that really meets some standard of they want to grow their business, they want to improve processes, and they want to make more money in less time. I will have a conversation with any of those businesses. For some reason, I got hooked up with non-profits lately that are wondering how to write better grant proposals. I can’t tell you how to do it, other than the fact that I had a. I had breakfast with a long time friend who was involved in a nonprofit. Uh, I’ve been dealing with roofing companies the past couple of years. Right. I mean.

Joshua Kornitsky: So across the spectrum.

Robert Lee: It is. Right. Because good business, common sense and common practice are not often the same thing in small businesses.

Joshua Kornitsky: Fair enough. So what’s the best way for people to reach you?

Robert Lee: Rob. Dot. Dot com will give you access to my personal socials, which you’ll see all kinds of sage advice and wisdom on. Uh, it will give you access to the six agency socials and website, which has all kinds of sage advice about real estate. Specifically has a way to download our Ultimate Guide to AI employees, which is basically a Google Doc and an eBook that is designed to give you access to the core of our knowledge about how we build processes from an AI perspective, and a way to just schedule some time with me.

Joshua Kornitsky: Perfect. And we will also share that link or links. Uh, when we publish and go live. Uh, I hope you have time to hang out. Robert. I’ve got a few more folks here to talk to. I can’t wait to introduce you to 100%. Uh, thank you again. Robert Lee, founder of Lee six agency. Uh, we’ll come back to you real fast when we close out, but I appreciate your time. I appreciate you sharing your knowledge and your wisdom.

Robert Lee: Look, it is a privilege because it is part of my goal to spend time around people that love to talk and love to listen. So, really, I owe you the thanks here because you’re making my day awesome.

Joshua Kornitsky: It’s our pleasure.

Robert Lee: I appreciate it.

Joshua Kornitsky: So my next guest is someone that I met recently, but we have just hit it off in a great professional sense. I’d like to introduce Tiana Neal. She’s the founder of Transcenders Consulting Group, a consulting firm specializing in human capital management with an expertise across payroll tax, HR benefits, o HR, comp benefits, project management, and system implementation. Tiana is an HR leader, also a podcast host who probably doesn’t get company names wrong like I do. Uh, and a connector with really a strong passion for rehumanizing the workplace conversations. She bridges the strategy and empathy, helping organizations see people beyond the policies. Welcome to the show, Tiana.

Tiana Neal: Thank you. Thank you. Josh, really excited to be here.

Joshua Kornitsky: I’m really happy to have you here. You and I had some great conversations when we first met, sort of about the HR universe. And I really thought you had a refreshing perspective on it. So let’s let’s let me start by asking what kind of brought you into the world of HR.

Tiana Neal: Yeah, absolutely. Um, so I initially got started in the payroll space. Payroll and taxation was my thing. And then I got into the role of air operations, where I handled more benefits and heavy implementations. And from there, that got me really close to the people side of the business, which is where I really found my niche. I would say, I think just, you know, listening to people, um, bringing that human back to HR. It was really important for a lot of populations that I worked for. Um, sometimes when you get into the day to day, companies can miss that. They can miss that, like your people are the most important. And so once I became more personable and built proper relationships with, you know, my employees around the office, that was really where I realized I was a great fit and could add, um, really good value. And then not to mention, I had really good system experience on the HR tech side, and I loved to untangle the web of a lot of things. So there I was, just found my match.

Joshua Kornitsky: Well, and I’m going to ask you about your spaghetti, your spaghetti bowl concept here in just a minute. But one of the things that I remember, uh, from our initial discussion was around sort of how HR has changed over time. And, and as you just mentioned, you know, through your own evolution, your perception of it changed over time. Just looking at the last few years, how are things different? And to Robert’s point about AI, I imagine AI in the workplace has changed a great number of things.

Tiana Neal: Yes, as Robert was talking about, AI in my head was spinning because there is a very unknown. It’s very unknown in our industry, and I’m involved in a lot of webinars that I, you know, tuned into every week. The HR tech side is changing and will continue to change drastically from, you know, within our world. And so it is very critical that most people in our industry start to learn AI and not push it away. I can admit that some years ago when AI was coming, you know, to becoming a big topic, I was just like, this is not taking my job. It’s not taking payroll. This is ridiculous. Until I started going to my annual conferences, you know, adp’s, the workday’s HR techs. And as soon as you walk into the room, AI is on the screen. And so I was like, oh, okay. So this is really happening. Um, and so from there, I started playing around with it and realizing that it was here. Right? And I just you can’t ignore it. And so being a systems person, I started jumping right in. Um, and that has, you know, really helped because a lot of times if I’m interviewing with clients, they will have a question now involved where it entails AI, because a lot of if you’re a true, true HR person, I would say most HR people don’t necessarily like to get involved with the system aspect.

Tiana Neal: You know that there’s a different you know, obviously the HR role that typically heavily handles systems. But true HR people from R and usually like to deal with employee relations and, you know, hiring, firing, recruiting. But getting in that back end system is not a lot of people’s things. And now it’s almost going to become a must. I think for the most part, you’ve got to start understanding what AI is doing, um, and not get too far behind just because the younger generation that is now in the workforce. They are heavy, demanding. And so, um, you know, they’re used to using these phones and these platforms and they do not care about pizza like that. To have a pizza day, you really have to show them the growth and show them that, you know, you’re in the know of tech because that is truly going to be, you know, a long term thing on the tech side.

Joshua Kornitsky: That makes sense to me and kind of opens the door for me to ask, you know, how when. So when you are engaging with the organizations you work with, I presume oftentimes these are relatively new avenues for them that you’ve got experience with. Are you able to help shepherd them through the the embrace and transition into these types of systems?

Tiana Neal: Yeah. So surprisingly, though, a lot of times I’m having to just go back to start with the basics. Um, and even though that seems kind of odd, a lot of companies, just from the basics, need to get the right people, not only on the bus, but also in the right role. Right. So it could be a perfect person for your company, but if they’re in the wrong role, it’s not going to be good for your population. And a lot of times executives will typically overlook HR, especially payroll. Starting off in payroll, I always say payroll is like the red headed stepchild, which is very odd because, you know, we process the bacon for everybody, right? And so from an HR stance, you have to have the right people in the seat that care about the company that are loyal. And you know the CEOs need to also treat HR properly. Right. And then from there the rest of your population will typically go smoothly. So we need to have like right training for our people. Make sure there’s the right, you know, vision and mission and that everyone is abiding by it.

Tiana Neal: So from the top of the chain of HR down to your supervisors, directors, managers, everyone has to, you know, show well with that stance and be a good example for your employee population, and a lot of times that gets lost in transition naturally, I think. And so I think even before jumping to the high AI system part, people really just have to get to the basics, understand foundationally where the company is going, start getting your employee population to begin to trust HR. We are a partner, but here, if I had a dollar for every time I heard HR is just for the company, not the employee, it’s like, okay, we’ve got to change that narrative. A lot of times people don’t see what’s happening behind the scenes. And then from there, once the foundation is set, then we can start adding in new systems and start implementing AI and be transparent with it so that people don’t think that they’re going to lose their job and then, you know, run away from there.

Joshua Kornitsky: Well, and so you touched on this briefly, but it really was the foundation of what you were sharing, that there’s a lot of misconceptions, particularly at not just employees thinking that that HR is just protecting the company, but backing it up to the higher level at the leadership team level. There are often um, we’ll just go with misconceptions. And, you know, I guess it comes down to and I’ve, I’ve got sort of a linear mind. Is it that do they view HR as an expense or do they view it as an investment, or do they view it as a necessity?

Tiana Neal: Probably one of the first two initially until there is no HR and then they start to see how needed it is. I will say I have worked for and have seen companies just not pay attention to HR or go without having an HR.

Joshua Kornitsky: I’ve seen that too, but that’s scary.

Tiana Neal: Yes, it’s very scary and that’s when you get into heavy compliance issues. I mean, the legal side of things, I mean, the lawsuits that come through are just sometimes insane. Lots of times. Obviously, companies are settling behind the scenes, but there’s a lot of companies that I’ve just had to step away from because of just when you’re on the side of the house of HR, obviously you see a lot of unfortunate things that happen and you hear a lot of things. And so the leadership from the higher up, not every CEO or CEO or C-suite executive of a company is this way. But I ran into more than a few born with a silver spoon in their mouth, and are just so used to having certain things that they don’t necessarily pay attention to the bottom end of the population that is actually doing the work. And so having a very strong HR team that gets to know the population has those conversations and understands what people are going through in life is very helpful because sometimes employees may act out, but it might just they might be dealing with a breakup, going through a divorce, you know, they may have had a miscarriage, you know, just something of that nature may have happened and they just need to step away. And so, you know, giving them some time off or some leave. I’ve seen that work wonders for people. But if people don’t trust HR or don’t know HR or don’t feel like they can come to HR, then you essentially lose out on a really great asset in an employee if you’re not paying attention. So a lot of times, um, it sometimes it’s unfortunate a little too late for a CEO to, to realize the necessity of HR, but it is very critical. And the companies that recognize that early on, um, I see do very well when they, you know, when they put, um, money towards HR to ensure there’s proper training, they have the proper people that helps the population accordingly.

Joshua Kornitsky: Well, and you you bring up an interesting point, right. Because if you’ve got legal compliance issues, and I know Farrell will speak a little bit to this, and I know Robert sort of implied that in real estate as an example. Right. There’s there’s legal compliance stuff that’s a mandatory but that’s, uh, often more a function of just training than actual understanding, you know, to check in a box that we did this training, we did this training. But understanding how to how to not only protect the organization, but to protect the individuals within the organization. That takes a lot more planning and that takes a lot more work, I imagine.

Tiana Neal: Yes. Um, planning for your employees. I think one thing that I did want to touch on is there are a lot of back in executive conversations that obviously the employee population isn’t privy to. And there are a lot of HR teams that have fought for heavily, right, for, for for the executive C-suite executives to understand certain things. Sometimes you win those battles, sometimes you don’t. Um, but yes, I would say just ensuring that your focus on your employees and knowing that having them know that they are supported is top key priority and brings in a lot of loyalty, right? Makes employees stay there. So your tenure is top heavy. There’s reports, you know, EEOC reports that are filed every year to show different races and genders and tenures. Now, um, you know, pay transparency is a really big thing, right? So years ago, when I started in the industry, it was very disheartening doing payroll and seeing the difference in pay. And so the fact that, you know, many people fought to kind of get that transparency out there is really critical and definitely helps ensure that companies are having to be mindful of that. Right. You can no longer get away from having, you know, someone in the same seat doing the same role. One making 100,000, one making 50,000. Right. Like you got to stay within range. So all of that is very critical.

Joshua Kornitsky: And and I think that the the fact that you’re helping clients understand that and again it’s not and I choose my words carefully. It’s ultimately about protecting the organization from harm Because ethically, morally, I’m not even touching those arguments. You are legally at risk if I am playing employee A this amount, and employee B regardless of the difference, less than this amount, though, they have the same education and experience. I put the company at risk, and ultimately the c-suites role is to keep the company safe and profitable.

Tiana Neal: Correct. Um, and I would also say this, I mean, there’s many companies still skating by. I mean, there are some, um, even a recent, you know, client of mine that is in some heavy taxation issues. Their VP stepped in to hold the project. Sometimes they just don’t see the risk too much, you know? Sure. I mean, the entire HR team was fighting to get things pushed through myself. And, you know, my consultants were ready to get things pushed through. And, um, sometimes when you’re dealing with those executives, you can only explain to them what the compliance is. They, you know, call us when you’re when you’re ready, but this is what you’re about to get into. You know, we can help. So there’s some times where you just aren’t going to win that battle where they’re, you know, they just don’t understand a lot of times when they’ve had so much large money for so long, they would prefer to go with the risk.

Joshua Kornitsky: Oh, sure. Versus sue us and we’ll.

Tiana Neal: Yeah.

Joshua Kornitsky: It’ll cost me less for the lawsuit than it would to pay for HR.

Tiana Neal: Exactly. What are my chances of someone actually reporting until someone does report and then you have a class action? So, um, unfortunately, at this level and stage in my career, I’m brought in when things. It’s a little too late. You know, they should have brought me in six months or a year before. And so I’m doing a lot of cleanup, and I see a lot of things and things are always fixable. But there is a cost to that. And right now states are struggling. I mean, when I first started over 15 years ago in this industry, it would take states and the IRS years before they sent you a notice. You’d get a you know, you’d get a notice from something that happened 3 or 4 years ago. Right. But over the last few years, you were getting.

Joshua Kornitsky: Notices that automation in AI right there.

Tiana Neal: You were getting notices within like 1 or 2 quarters, 3 to 6 months. And it was like, oh, they are not playing around here. And a lot of times, even when employees were catching on, they may file an employment even though they left a company. If you don’t respond in enough time, they would win that claim. I mean, it was just it’s especially since Covid, it’s just been a battlefield. Osha has been, I think one company I was working for, OSHA, had showed up so many times. Right, because they were just looking for ways to find companies. And so you do have to be mindful of it now. But yeah, unfortunately some some executives still try to um, they might be gamblers, they might like to roll the dice.

Joshua Kornitsky: And that’s their privilege, right? It seems to me like they’re taking unnecessary risks, but that’s up to them. Very true. So I do want to touch on your the last superpower that we discussed of yours, which we touched on. You touched on briefly and gave me the term, and I’m coming back to it. Let’s talk about that bowl of spaghetti.

Tiana Neal: Yeah.

Joshua Kornitsky: Uh, because I thought coming from a technical background myself, I knew exactly what you were referring to once you spelled it out. But. But share with me, if you would, and share with those listening. What is this superpower you have as it relates to spaghetti?

Tiana Neal: Yeah. So I just like to untangle, um, untangle every single noodle, every single web spider web there is. Um, I have a really good sense of discernment now where I can identify when I’m having an HR conversation with someone if they’re, you know, feeding me nonsense. I’ll say, sure. I won’t say the other bad word, but if they’re feeding me nonsense.

Joshua Kornitsky: I.

Tiana Neal: Will. Okay. Um. And I can also tell when someone hasn’t been supportive. I mean, or if someone just is very green in their seat and just needs a little bit more training or coaching or if it’s like, no, um, got to get them on the bus because they’re not just the company or team player in general and ripping that band aid off, you know, earlier instead of later, because a lot of times keeping the wrong person in the seat, naturally your good employees will step away. So from there, getting back to the people aspect, setting the foundation. But then when you’re digging into the system aspect, once you have the right people in place, cleaning up, going through automation, I mean, we’re about to approach 2026, right? So it’s literally unfathomable to me how many companies are still doing things manual on manual paperwork and just getting that to be automated to make the hiring process more seamless for employees, and making sure that everyone is trained, but also accommodating your employees who aren’t used to using technology. I mean, that’s still a big thing in the workforce now, and just making sure that outside of sending one pagers or, you know, a PowerPoint or having one, you know, basic quick training call. Really make sure you are hand-holding those employees that need that support so that they feel comfortable and allowing them to reach out to you whenever they need something, and then from there, just sticking to the process.

Tiana Neal: Um, there’s very rarely naturally where you might have to accommodate a higher end C-suite executive. Sometimes that happens, but, um, you know, you got to at least have 95% of the process on board and have everybody participate in it just to make sure things are flowing smoothly. And then your HR payroll process can go really smooth. You know, of course, there’s those day to day fires that come up that are unexpected. Um, but sometimes it just doesn’t have to be that hard. And a lot of times with AI coming in place, too, there’s so many laws, especially if you’re a multi-state, there’s so many different laws that are changing from not only the federal state, but then also the locals of certain states, um, minimum wage requirements. And you just constantly have to keep up with those day to day. So a lot of times, instead of having to deal with just basic cleanup, once your system is running smoothly, then you can really focus on the legal aspects of things and just making sure the company is staying on top of compliance. And then from there, um, yeah, you can look at a look like a scholar in your job.

Joshua Kornitsky: Well, and all of that to say, uh, as you started with, right, that there’s these disparate systems, there’s these disparate processes. And I think the fact that that you’re willing to unwind that bowl of spaghetti and have the skills and the experience to do so, really speaks to the fact that I know from the other side and the types of clients that I work with often they don’t know a resource like you exists, right? They they think that, well, you know, we created this mess. We’ll we’ll just have to spend a bunch of time and money to, to sort it out. But now knowing that there’s someone that they can reach to, that not only will help keep them current, but also help them untangle and make sense of the mess. Seems like that’s a pretty valuable thing to put out there.

Tiana Neal: Yes. Very good. And I will say unpopular opinion. I like my spaghetti with a little bit of sugar on it. So. So I think from my end, even in my work, um, work function to from consulting, I’m strong and majestic as well. So I think, you know, at this point I’m knowledgeable, but I think just bringing the true authentic and realness and not, you know, not coming across, um, condescending in a way, when you’re coaching people goes a long way. So I like to, you know, follow suit with that as well. And just continuing to get myself out there so people know that I do exist. I think, you know, how Joss and I met was at a networking event, and I’m typically a behind the scenes systems person. But since I’ve started my business, I’ve been doing podcasting. It’s been very helpful that people know that I am there and that I can provide support, and sometimes I just take a call and do some advisory one off without charging. Naturally. Um, you know, and sometimes that leads into business. But I think just even if it doesn’t, just helping people in general, um, what Rob was kind of alluding to earlier is just being an added asset to people so that, you know, they can always remember your name. I think in general, outside of whether or not that turns into business. People still remember you and know you and will continue to follow you and look to you as an inspiration. And that’s what I’m mostly getting out of my experience now, which has been very helpful. And um, yeah, very welcoming for me to kind of just keep going.

Joshua Kornitsky: That’s fantastic. Well, if people want to get their spaghetti untangled or get help with some process or get a better understanding of why HR really is the difference maker and really in in not just the organization, but in the culture of the organization. Sure. What’s the best way for folks to get Ahold of you?

Tiana Neal: Yeah. So, um, so my LinkedIn page is, um, I’d say first off, I’m Tiana. Tiana, and last name is Neal N as in Nancy E. Um, but then my direct email is first name Tiana t I a n a and then it’s at transcend. Com t r a n s e n d e r s.com. Um, yeah. And if you send me an email or send me a LinkedIn connection with message, I’m happy to, um, to reach out and set up, you know, a call or if anyone out there is into HR and payroll or just leadership in general and or starting a business and wanting to get, you know, your name out there, I’m more than happy to schedule a podcast taping also.

Joshua Kornitsky: Fantastic. Well, Tiana Neal, founder of Transcendence Consulting Group, it’s been a pleasure. I really appreciate it. I hope you can stay with me while we talk with my certainly not least, but my last guest, Carol Middleton. Uh, and thank you for sharing the information that you shared with us and to know that there are solutions for problems that most people probably give up on.

Tiana Neal: Yes, absolutely. Thank you, Josh, so much for having me.

Joshua Kornitsky: My pleasure. Well, my my last guest of today is someone that I’ve had the pleasure of knowing now for about three years. Uh, we kind of went into our own perspective lanes about the same time and met around the same time. I guess that’s about right. Yes. I’d like to introduce Farrell Middleton. He’s the founder of The Bell Curve of Life. It’s it’s really a unique teaching program. He’s also written a book, a performer, a environment. It’s a roadmap to enhance your performance and upgrade your environment. After 30, after a successful 36 year career in residential land development and home building, Farrell transitioned into his second career as a teacher, a speaker, and an author in 2022. His mission and focus are to cultivate a level performers and a level environments to drive personal growth and business health. If both can be achieved, success will follow and failure will be rare. Now, Farrell, I know you’re a Georgia Tech graduate with honors, and I know that you have decades of leadership experience, um, in really every session of your life. Tell us how you got here.

Speaker5: All right, well, first of all, thank you very much for having me. And I’ve thoroughly enjoyed my other guests here today. I’ve learned a lot so far. So thank you very much. So, uh, with me, I’m a lifelong Georgian. I grew up in Savannah, moved to Atlanta in 1982, went to Georgia Tech. Uh, as you mentioned, I graduated from honors degree in building construction. Married my high school sweetheart. Her name is Kathy. We married in 1986 and we have two adult daughters. They live here in the Atlanta area and we are a first time grandparents.

Joshua Kornitsky: Congratulations.

Speaker5: Wonderful stage of life. It’s everything everybody said it would be. So, uh, very glad for that. My professional career started in 1986, and I got into land development and homebuilding immediately. Got a degree in building construction from Georgia Tech, so I’m one of those that use my degree. Day one of my career. Wow. And I spent 36 years I was a manager of other people at the age of 22, and I held high level positions for most of my career. And I have touched about 10,000 houses in some form or fashion in my professional career. I was a high volume guy. That’s lots of numbers. Yeah, a lot of numbers.

Joshua Kornitsky: Wow. So? So 36 years? Yes. 30 in the industry? Yes. What on earth made you want? When? When you were done. When? When you said that’s it. That’s house number 10,000, I am done. What on earth made you want to continue on in this capacity? And I want to. I want to give you particular props because I’m a teacher and facilitator of iOS. I didn’t create iOS. I just know it and have lived it. You created your own coaching program that is exponentially harder.

Speaker5: It was a bit of a challenge. Yes, yes. So to answer your question, I’m 61 years old. I’ve got a lot of years left. Professionally, I just decided I wanted to provide a different type of service to society from a way to say it, and I’ve always wanted to be a teacher of sorts in my second career. It’s been a lifelong desire. I assumed it would be at the university level or college level teaching construction management, which I’m highly qualified to do. But I took a different path about ten years ago, and I started working on this program, and it’s called The Bell Curve of Life. And what this relates to is the old 20 over 20 principle that we all remember from middle school. 20% are in the upper category, 60% in the middle, and 20% are in the lower category. And for my program and material that relates to behavior, skills, performance and results, okay. And my program is I’m in the people business is about professional growth and development. That’s what my main focus is. And I want to help people get into and stay in that top 20% in areas of life that matter to them. They have to decide what it is they want to do. I want to help them get in that top 20%, and I can especially move the needle with those folks that are in that middle 60 and that lower 20%. But they have to be willing participants in this. They they have to want to grow and learn. I can help them with all kinds of material, but they have to come to me with a good attitude.

Joshua Kornitsky: We have a saying in my world, if you drag them in, you got to drag them around.

Speaker5: Absolutely.

Joshua Kornitsky: If they don’t want to be there, there’s there’s no helping someone who doesn’t want to learn. That’s right. But let me back up and ask, are you only focused on on the home building industry? Who who are the folks that that bell curve of life helps?

Speaker5: Uh, no. Uh, the majority of my clients are in the homebuilding industry. Uh, and that includes builders, um, trade partners, suppliers, subcontractors, those types of companies. But I’ve also done work with, uh, other companies outside the industry. I’ve done some work with some financial services companies. I did a little work with the Georgia State Golf Association. Uh, I’ve got a new client starting this week. It’s a regional furniture distribution company. Okay, that I’m starting. So my principles in both a performer and a environment get above what I will call hard skills, or specific products or services being delivered to the marketplace. Mine are in that softer, higher level stuff and my principals can relate to, you know, all individuals and all types of businesses. So I guess the the word for it is agnostic. That just sounds like such a negative word, but that’s the word to use for it.

Joshua Kornitsky: But well, it means you’re well here. You’re a vertical independent. I like that.

Speaker5: Yeah. There we go. There we go.

Joshua Kornitsky: So, uh, so can you and I. I freely, freely admit I haven’t received your book, but have not yet finished it.

Speaker5: Fair enough.

Joshua Kornitsky: Um. Share some if you would share 1 or 2 of the the main guiding principles so that people understand what exactly it is you’re trying to help folks move the needle on.

Speaker5: Okay. Excellent. We’ll start with a performer. I’ve got 11 chapters on a performer, and the first chapter in the book is on attitude. And attitude is the aspect or facet in life that has the most influence over your success and happiness. Other people and circumstances can influence it. They can never control it. That’s up to the individual. And positive attitudes are contagious, as are negative attitudes. So which one do you want to be? So attitude is a huge part of my program. In my A environment material, I’ve got seven main components of an A environment. I’ve got 12 chapters overall. I get into some secondary type things, but my number one component of an A environment is vision. And this can be vision, mission, purpose, slogan, that type of thing. And I like to start with this without vision, leadership and direction, you will end up somewhere, but you don’t know where it will be and you won’t know when you get there. And so what I advise my clients to do is when we do talk about this is the number one topic when I engage with them is I like them to develop a 12 to 15 word vision or mission statement that can just roll off their tongue. For example, mine is to cultivate a level performers and a level environments to drive personal growth and organizational health.

Joshua Kornitsky: We’re in clear and concise.

Speaker5: Clear, concise. And what you want that to do is you want that to whoever your audience is, you know, of one person or a few or whatever, maybe a network group or whatever. You want that initial statement to get their curiosity going for them to say, hey, that sounds kind of interesting. How do you do that? And I’ve seen a lot of vision mission statements that are very, very good. But there are multiple sentences, a couple of paragraphs, people lose them. And what you want to do is you want to make sure that you share this very clear, crisp and short vision with your internal associates and your external partners. They will help you attain it. They will. But it’s got to be clear, crisp and concise that rolls off people’s tongues. They’ll help you get it if you share it with them and if you’re committed to it.

Joshua Kornitsky: So clarifying question I work for you at company X, and company X has its own vision. Are you saying that I need my own vision as well.

Speaker5: Oh, inside the company from.

Joshua Kornitsky: No. Just for me. From my own success. To become an A player. The a environment I may not be able to control how they run their company. But if I want to be an A player.

Speaker5: Mhm.

Joshua Kornitsky: How is that one of the steps to understand my own needs.

Speaker5: It is. You know what. I have not looked at it that way before. So you’ve given me something good to think about today. But the answer is yes. Uh basically.

Joshua Kornitsky: But it’s already there.

Speaker5: It’s already there. Yeah. You just rephrased it for me. Uh, but, uh, no, uh, the whole thing is, is that what you want to do? Is frame yourself, set yourself up, uh, you know, back to a little bit of what the other guests have talked about today is how do you fit into your professional role? Right. And that is what I help people do. And actually, a little tangent off of your question a minute ago, what I like to do as well inside a larger company, let’s say a company that’s a home building company, which of course is my background, but you’ve got several internal departments, you’ve got production and you’ve got sales and marketing, finance and accounting and, you know, a land development, that kind of thing. Each of those departments can have their own internal vision with what they want to do, to provide internal customer service to their coworkers, into the organization. They all need to roll up and support the overall mission and vision of the overall company. But departments can have their own vision as well, and that helps them produce what they need to do again, to get that product or service to the marketplace as effectively as possible. That’s what that’s what internal customer service is all about.

Joshua Kornitsky: It makes sense. So let’s talk a little bit about the book a performer, a environment. And it’s really it from its own title. It’s it’s a roadmap to enhance your performance and to upgrade your environment. I’m looking at the title. There you go.

Speaker5: That’s right there.

Joshua Kornitsky: Yeah. So did you. Which came first, the training or the book?

Speaker5: Uh, actually, this was just one of the topics in my program that I started about three years ago, and I’ve got about 25 main topics that I talk about. And this relates to personal circumstances and other types of business things. I’ve got some management and leadership material as well, but over the course of the last two years, this material just kept kind of surfacing to the top right. It just became very important, very valuable. I was getting great feedback on it from my clients, and I just started to really gel around this. And I am a professional speaker as well. Now I’m an author, and in that world there is what is called signature material.

Joshua Kornitsky: Okay?

Speaker5: And this has become my signature material. And basically the whole premise here again is I want to help individuals become a level performers. And again, this all relates to our historical educational grading scale of A, B, C, D, and F and create a level environments. And my main lead in with this is if you put a C performer in an A environment, they can become an A performer. If you put an A performer in a C environment. They will drift towards C performance and they will probably leave the key to success in our economic society because we choose who we do business with. You know, we have guardrails in place, of course, with laws and, you know, finance, you know, constraint, all that stuff that has to happen. We’ve talked a little bit about that with, you know, regulations, but we can do business with whom we choose. And so if a business owner or leader wants to attain a performance from their internal associates and external partners, those companies that support them on a routine basis every day, then they need to create an environment. And I’ve got the blueprint for the A environment, and I’ve identified the main traits of a performers. And if you can get that combination going, then that is a clear direction for success. Without a doubt.

Joshua Kornitsky: It sounds like it’s a pretty clear plan. And as we’ve talked about twice already today, if you’ve got a clear plan, you stand a much better chance of of getting where you’re going. Yeah.

Speaker5: Um, so one thing real quick, uh, basically my concepts. I haven’t created anything new, okay? I’ve just assembled it in a really good format, and the book reads well, I present well, uh, yeah, that type of stuff. It’s easy for people to understand. There’s simple concepts, but I read something years ago. I wish I could take credit for this, but simple rules guide complex behavior.

Joshua Kornitsky: And that’s great.

Speaker5: I lived a complicated life. Uh, with my career, I’m in the simple world now. My concepts are simple and easy for people to grasp and understand and improve their lives.

Joshua Kornitsky: There are natural, complex fires in the world, and there are natural simplifiers. And some days we sit in one chair, some days we sit in the other. But. But the simplifying chair is a much easier chair to deal with.

Speaker5: It is it just you can communicate well with people, they understand the concepts and yeah, that kind of thing. It’s a it’s a comfortable place to be. Let me be very clear.

Joshua Kornitsky: Absolutely. And like I said earlier, you never want to come across as condescending just because you’re trying to explain a concept that’s that’s complicated. And I think it was Albert Einstein that said, if you can’t explain it simply, you don’t understand it well enough. Right.

Speaker5: I like that.

Joshua Kornitsky: Well, he’s a lot smarter than I am.

Speaker5: Me, too.

Joshua Kornitsky: Um, but I want to ask you. How so? I know you’re a speaker. Obviously you’re you’re an author. We were just talking about the book, and and you offer your services directly. But how else do you get your message out? How else do you help, folks?

Speaker5: Uh, what? I’ve got, uh, again, keynote speaking engagements, which I do. I love doing those. Uh, but I will do small group sessions with private companies, like about ten people in a room. And mainly I like to start with a leadership team to, uh, review a environment. And it takes 90 minutes to go through my seven components. And it’s a discovery session. I’ve moved beyond training and coaching with this particular material. We discover what’s working well and why and what’s not working well and why. And gee whiz, let’s focus on the stuff that’s not working well and why once we discover it. So that would be the next stage of this. And so that’s how I like to engage, uh, to start with and then with my A performer. This material can relate to any level of authority or management or activity, whatever the case may be. These principles relate to everybody. And so a key here is engaging with the clients and customers to expose them to these concepts. Again in a discovery method. And the great the beauty of this is every company and every individual will have different takeaways from the material because they are their own, uh, you know, their own people at that point in time. This is a snapshot of where you are at this point in time. And my goal and desire is to help people discover areas that can move the needle for them. And engaging with me in these sessions is everybody will walk away with something they can do better that day.

Joshua Kornitsky: That’s awesome. That day. And that’s that’s a surprisingly short window, because most of the things that that we teach just in general, take time and application. So just if, if you’d be willing to share without names. Uh, can you share a success, someone or an organization that you’ve worked with that you. You saw the light. Go on.

Speaker5: Oh, absolutely. Uh, there’s one, uh, young man that I work for. He is a, uh, building material supply salesman. Okay. Uh, a good friend of mine, and he just, uh, got into managing other people. So we went through my management material, and he’s in his mid 30s. He’s never managed other people before, and he’s, uh, he’s done that. So we sent him my management material, and then we did a performer a environment with his six person team. And the light bulbs were just going off around the table. That’s awesome. With what we did. So started with him individually, uh, to get him ready and prepared to manage these folks. And then we brought the other folks in as well and had a great group session. And they have made tremendous strides in their, uh, their work as a group. So very, very, very satisfying.

Joshua Kornitsky: That’s and the best part is, is that they get to feel and see that it’s not just you being able to appreciate it, but they get to see it. Absolutely, yes.

Speaker5: So they saw them, saw the results.

Joshua Kornitsky: So a couple of questions. Yes. Number one, if I want to get Ahold of the book, how do I get the book?

Speaker5: Uh, the book is in all the places it should be. Okay.

Joshua Kornitsky: So we’ll have the Amazon link.

Speaker5: Amazon, Barnes and Noble. Uh, it’s on Kindle, of course, and the audio version is on audible. And, yes, I narrated the book. Uh, so it’s out there as well. So it’s in all the right places.

Joshua Kornitsky: You’ve got pleasing dulcet tones.

Speaker5: I’ve been told that.

Joshua Kornitsky: There you go.

Speaker5: And I’ve got a career in radio. Somebody told me that. But I’m 61. I better hurry up.

Joshua Kornitsky: Well, so. So that’s actually my next question is, is, which has been more fun all those years in home building or or sharing the knowledge?

Speaker5: Well, uh, let’s say I had a very good career. Let me let me put it that way. Very 36 years.

Joshua Kornitsky: I didn’t say which was good. I said, which is more fun?

Speaker5: Yeah. Oh, this is a whole lot more fun. Are you kidding? This is a lot more fun. But I did have fun building houses every once in a while. But, uh, it’s, uh, you know, it’s got its challenges. But no, this has been, uh, been a lot of fun for me, but I actually the the really good joy is that I know that I’m helping people live a better life. It’s really that simple.

Joshua Kornitsky: And and again, having known you for a few years, it comes through, right when when people talk to you, when you talk about a performer, a environment, when you talk about bell curve, you just radiate that light of somebody who knows that they’re helping people and it really comes through. So how do people get Ahold of you?

Speaker5: Uh, very simple. Um, my website is The Bell Curve of Life.com. Very easy. I’m on LinkedIn as well under Farrell Middleton and the bell curve of life got a good LinkedIn presence. And, uh, my cell phone number, I gave it to my homeowners. (678) 618-2024 is my cell phone number. And yeah, so that’s how people can get in touch with me. I’m here in the Atlanta area. Uh, but again, my stuff, I can do virtual sessions and things of that nature. So, uh, doesn’t have to be here locally in Atlanta, but I do. I like in-person, but virtual. The world works in different ways these days.

Joshua Kornitsky: It does, it does. And the fact that you’re willing to embrace that in and of itself is is knowledge and acceptance of the fact that that the universe keeps rolling, whether whether we’re in it or not.

Speaker5: That’s right. Like I said, I’m 61 years old and I’ve got a I’ve got to conform to the world as well. So.

Joshua Kornitsky: Okay, I just got an error that popped up on my screen there, but I’m not going to worry about that. I want to say thank you, Carole Middleton, for sharing your journey. Uh, from successful home builder into speaker, author, teacher, coach, I want to say thank you to Tiana Neil, who’s bowl of spaghetti will stay with me forever. But reality being is knowing that there are people that can help, um, organizations untangle the messes that they kind of grew into is a huge, huge thing. And then, uh, first but not last. Robert Lee, I think that you’ve shed a very different perspective on why people don’t need to be necessarily fearful of AI, that it’s a tool to serve. But it starts with getting your yourself organized and understood to what your goals are. So, uh, thank you all for being here today on Cherokee Business Radio. Uh, I just want to quickly remind everybody that today’s episode was brought to you in part by our community partner program, the Business RadioX Main Street Warriors Defending capitalism, promoting small business, and supplying, excuse me and supporting our local community. For more information, go to Main Street Warriors and a special note of thanks to our title sponsor for the Cherokee chapter of Main Street Warriors. Diesel. David. Ink. Please go check them out at diesel. David comm. My name is Joshua Kornitsky. I’m a professional implementer of the entrepreneurial Operating system and your host here on Cherokee Business Radio.

 

Leading with Intention: Embracing a Holistic Approach to Executive Success

September 26, 2025 by Jacob Lapera

High Velocity Radio
High Velocity Radio
Leading with Intention: Embracing a Holistic Approach to Executive Success
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In this episode of High Velocity Radio, Lee interviews Shveta Pillai, executive and leadership coach and founder of Lead Style. Shveta shares her journey from corporate consulting to coaching, emphasizing the importance of integrating professional, personal, and physical well-being for sustainable leadership. She discusses her coaching framework, offers real-life examples of client transformation, and highlights her advocacy for AAPI women executives. The conversation underscores how self-awareness and intentionality can help high-performing leaders avoid burnout and achieve lasting fulfillment in both work and life.

Shveta Pillai, an executive coach with 20+ years of helping leaders navigate the space between performance, perception, and purpose under my belt. Her clients include Fortune 500 executives, founders, and senior leaders managing high-stakes moments— restructuring, transitions, and culture transformation.

Before founding LeadStyle, she spent over a decade consulting within complex industries—energy, healthcare, and other high-pressure sectors where leadership decisions directly impact operations and outcomes. That hands-on experience informs her coaching: practical, strategic, and tailored to the realities of leadership at the top.

At LeadStyle, their mission is guiding a sustainable leadership lifestyle—how you show up professionally, personally, and physically. Her 3P framework helps clients lead at scale without burning out or losing their sense of self. This isn’t soft skills training. It’s about recalibrating how leaders live, work, and influence in ways that drive both presence and performance.

As the co-host of Identity Unveiled, a podcast that features AAPI women redefining leadership, she get to see female pioneers staking their claims. Their voices and others like them are the basis of a forthcoming book.

Connect with Shveta on LinkedIn.

What You’ll Learn In This Episode

  • Why many high-performing leaders feel misaligned or burned out, and how this work addresses that challenge
  • LeadStyle – core concept
  • The 3Ps Framework
  • Identity Unveiled – a personal leadership platform method

Transcript-iconThis transcript is machine transcribed by Sonix.

 

TRANSCRIPT

Intro: Broadcasting live from the Business RadioX studios in Atlanta, Georgia. It’s time for High Velocity Radio.

Lee Kantor: Lee Kantor here, another episode of High Velocity Radio, and this is going to be a good one. Today on the show we have Shveta Pillai, who is an executive and leadership coach and founder of Lead Style. Welcome.

Speaker3: Thanks, Lee. Great to be here.

Lee Kantor: Well, I’m excited to learn what you’re up to. Can you share a little bit about lead style? How you serving folks?

Speaker3: Sure. So Lead Style is an executive coaching organization. This was really founded on the work that helps leaders define what I call a personal leadership lifestyle. That helps them to sustain their level of high performance.

Lee Kantor: Now, what’s your backstory? How’d you get involved in this line of work?

Speaker3: Well, you know, I’m a I’m a high performer. I probably have three chapters to my career. I worked in business development and sales, uh, for a little over seven years, and then went and joined property and casualty insurance and then had a seven year stint in consulting at Deloitte, working in the human capital practice. And there is when I really got that exposure to working with global leaders, and my role was to help leaders and their their teams enjoy change. And as you can imagine, how many people love change. So it was a lot of working pretty deep with executives who were going to have to lead a different way. Their kingdoms that they they ruled over within their organization were changing. And that caused a lot of angst among individuals as well as their own leadership. And so that catapulted me into executive coaching, which is where I’m at now.

Lee Kantor: Now, are you working primarily with individuals who raise their hand and say, hey, I need some help? Or are organizations or maybe boards or private equity firms or groups like that calling you in to kind of triage a situation?

Speaker3: I work with organizations and individuals who reach out to me. Most of my work, however, is with organizations, and they come to me not because there’s something remedial that needs to be addressed with the with their executives. And these, again, are people that are already performing at a very high level. These are individuals with who are consistently already delivering results. They carry a big responsibility. These are people that rely are relied upon to set the pace and solve those really tough problems and to keep those things moving forward. So there’s no remedial issue per se. What we want to make sure is that they can still stay in the game, and they can sustain themselves at that level. So these are organizations that look to me to work with their executive teams or their executive individuals to help them develop the capabilities and the ability to sustain that level of high performance.

Lee Kantor: Now, why are they concerned that they won’t be able to sustain this? Are you seeing some maybe, um, trends that maybe these high performing leaders are kind of getting burned out, or they might be kind of, uh, looking to leap to another opportunity? What? What are you seeing out there?

Speaker3: Yeah. I mean, you look at studies like Gallup just recently put out a report that said that less than half of adults across developed countries like Western Europe, North America, New Zealand, Australia are thriving. And that’s the lowest since 2020. And you then couple that with workplace trends that are showing that the leading one of the leading indicators as to why people are dissatisfied at work is this loss of purpose. And so, yes, I am seeing that with these demands that executives are are under this constant pressure, is that they’re also just feeling out of sync with work and their lives more broadly. Uh, and don’t get me wrong, these are individuals that are performing at a very high level. But you can see that there’s this it’s taking a toll. And that is where I come in.

Lee Kantor: Now, are you seeing is there just kind of a misalignment in priorities as kind of their age. And maybe they are getting more, uh, secure financially? Or are they just saying, hey, there has to be more than this particular thing I’m doing? Um, and then maybe they’ll take the leap to entrepreneurship like you did.

Speaker3: Yes. Uh, all of that, um, you’re hitting it right on, on spot. There is a misalignment. And, You know, sometimes it is jumping in from corporate into entrepreneurship and sometimes it’s just staying in the corporate game. You know, I, I was a corporate junkie for a very long time and a high performer at that. And I wish I had the perspective that I have now and the way that I coach my leaders. Uh, it is not ignoring that, you know, if Covid has taught us anything is that it’s not work in life. It’s not about balance, it’s about integration, and it’s about finding that alignment so that you are leaving, leading a an integrative lifestyle that allows you to, um, not burn out and not leave, you know, whether it’s staying in the corporate track or it’s staying in the nonprofit sector, which is taking a huge hit right now. And I work with a couple of leaders in the nonprofit sector, uh, within healthcare, you’re seeing that, um, where there is this high level of of uncertainty that is driving this, this kind of existential crisis, if you will, around, um, what’s my purpose?

Lee Kantor: So how do you help your clients kind of create this harmony between work and life? Like, is this go to the methodology of lead style.

Speaker3: It does, it does. And you know, a lot of, you know, lifestyle isn’t just about developing you as a leader. It’s developing the way that you live. And when you live better, you lead better. So a lot of development programs focus only on the professional side. I coach leaders through what I call the £0.03 framework professional, personal and physical. Because you can’t truly sustain success. You know, there’s a statistic out there that says that, you know, we we spend a third of our of our lives working. Well, you can’t sustain success if you ignore the other two thirds of your life. So when I’m working with executives, we’re very intentional about identifying what are their professional aspirations, whether it’s a promotion or it’s leading my team better or inspiring whatever that specific capability is, but also tying into what’s important to them personally. So we define goals in that space and then also in the physical, which has to do with their physical and mental well-being. Um, you know, I can give you an example. I just worked with the chief legal officer, just closed out this engagement, and he worked with a very large, uh, private entity that serves within the government sector. And when I when I met with him, he was just really, really overwhelmed. Um, he was on the brink of quitting, and he was probably one of the best chief legal officers organization had seen, which is why HR approached me to work with him. After about six months. We one of the things he walked away with was realizing that, you know, he needed he needed his jogs every morning. He was an avid runner, and that was getting lost in the fray of the professional commitments and the constant political barrage he was under at work and getting and before he was running. But he was taking phone calls from the CEO, and that was interrupting his ability to really leverage that physical P, if you will. That allowed him to lead at his best when he did get to work.

Lee Kantor: So then you helped him kind of elevate that to kind of a non-negotiable priority.

Speaker3: Exactly. And that was what was surprising for him, right? He was like, you know, I didn’t realize how important running was to me. And and look, I’m not a therapist. What I want, what I am, is someone who holds leaders to realize what’s intentionally drives them. What intentionally is a formula of success for them. You know, if I just come in as a coach and my process is only focused on developing their skills as a professional. Um, you know, delegation, communications, presence. It’s almost like it’s almost a disservice to them because that when we’re not embracing the other parts of who we are, that eventually will lead to that loss of focus, that performance fatigue, uh, that burnout.

Lee Kantor: Now, when you’re sharing kind of that philosophy with your clients, is that like an aha moment? Is that something like they can’t be all in in their work that they like? You’re giving them permission to kind of explore these other areas of their life in order to create this harmony.

Speaker3: You know, that’s a beautiful way to put it. Yes. I am giving them permission to bring those factors into the workspace. It doesn’t it doesn’t have to live outside of the workspace. You know this it’s interesting. I think, you know, when my business partner and I started this organization. My late business partner, she and I were both corporate junkies. And, you know, we had to be kind of when we when we presented this this way, this program, we didn’t want it to be all like soft and woo woo. And I’m here to kind of bring this existential process of living life. You know, we we wanted to be very practical. And I think that’s what when we, you know, talk about the three P’s. Um, at first they’re a little bit oh okay. This feels a little bit like therapy. But as we get into the process, people realize that there’s patterns that they’re seeing and how they’re professionally showing up that is tied to what’s personally important to them. Um, they’ll also notice patterns of like, you know, the fact that I eat, that I’m not eating well and that I’m eating at my desk or I’m skipping lunch, or I’m not getting that break to to pay attention to my health plays a factor in how they are showing up professionally. And, um, it’s, you know, it’s been interesting because I think Covid, of course, has helped the the understanding of why it’s important to, to not live in this like 50 over 50, like life is on one side, work is on the other. That it really is that integrative style that helps people be successful.

Lee Kantor: Now, how do you deliver the coaching? Is it primarily one on one?

Speaker3: Uh, both one on one and in teams. So when I’m working with intact teams, uh, we will start with an experiential process that allows people to dig deep into those three areas. It’s interesting because I think when people start to see in a team within an intact team, you start to see what’s important to people outside. You start to, you know, bring that humanitarian aspect of of the people that you spend a third of your lifetime with, um, that it starts to build those, those deeper bonds. Um, and that connection that I think many people today in the world are, are craving. It starts to build that connection so that teams build deeper relationships, um, and can also better, better manage through the tough times that all teams experience at work.

Lee Kantor: Now, how do you kind of, um, make it a safe space when you’re dealing with a team and not, um, kind of, well, protect the people that maybe aren’t as comfortable sharing with the other people in the group. Uh, in order to get each of them to where they need to be, and especially in a political dynamic, a lot of these organizations have.

Speaker3: Absolutely. Yeah. You know, I invoked the Vegas clause. You know, what stays in this room? What happens in this room, stays in this room. But also, you know, again, I think any good coach will say that you kind of know how far you can push each person that you work with. Um, I’m very candid with them about, you know, sharing what professionally they are aspiring to, to achieve. Um, but the personal and physical goals that they may have, they are can be very vague about and choose not to share that over time, you will see that when you’re working with teams over a course of 6 to 9 months, that they are more open to bringing that side, that vulnerability to the team. And that’s really important because when you don’t have that vulnerability, um, then you start to see things become very siloed. Um, distrust. And so making it comfortable is my job. Right. And and it’s also allowing you always find kind of 1 or 2 people that are willing to share. And I start with them. And when they start sharing, other people feel comfortable sharing as well. Um, I have not come across the breach of trust, um, within an intact group. Uh, but I am aware that can happen. And when that does happen, um, I know that that is going to be a role that I come in and quickly, um, mitigate.

Lee Kantor: Now, in your career, you’ve dealt with so many leaders, uh, over the course of your career, has there been an opportunity to kind of build community around all these leaders?

Speaker3: Um, it’s a great question, and I’m actually starting a leadership lifestyle podcast. Um, I’ve got that’s going to be focused on building that community so that people start to really look at, not don’t look at leadership as just one kind of authoritarian or autocratic, or that there is no one set definitions. And so yes, I am now looking to I already have a podcast that I started five years ago. Um, and so I’m using my learnings from that now to build community around those leaders that have embraced the the bespoke style of having your own personal leadership lifestyle.

Lee Kantor: And then so this will be an opportunity for the leaders to come on and share what they learned. But is there also an opportunity for the other leaders to interact with each other?

Speaker3: That’s the hope. That is the hope. Um, you know, I, I have some clients that I’ve been working with for many years now and you start to see kind of this, this, this leadership lifestyle take form and people actually talking about, well, you know, my, my, my personal P is really big right now. And, you know, I’m really focused on. My kids have left college. Um, and others will be like, well, my my one are still young. So my personal P is taken over right now. And it’s interesting because they’ll start talking in those terms. Um, so you do start to see with some of my long standing clients that culture that, that the lifestyle of way of, of leading, um, taking form across organizations that I’ve been with for some time.

Lee Kantor: Um, now you talk about your work, um, spotlighting AAPI women executives.

Speaker3: Yeah. So, um, about five years ago, um, you know, I was, I, I started a podcast called Identity Unveiled, uh, with another co-founder. And, you know, to be honest with you, this was a passion project that came at a time which was, you know, my, my business partner with Lead Style. She had passed away. Um, and identity unveiled became an outlet for me to express, um, you know, to go deep into a passion and kind of let coaching, let lifestyle breathe while I while I was able to, you know, focus on something that I was also passionate about. I’ve got two young girls, um, and, you know, growing up in Texas, I will say that there weren’t women that looked like me, um, in the executive ranks, or I didn’t really know them. I didn’t know what their story was. There were some. There was Connie Chung, there was. I don’t even know, another Indian woman. I’m South Asian. That was, um, that was at the top. And so I, I started this because I wanted to bring more representation and visibility to AAPI women that had made it to the executive ranks. Uh, there we we share stories about, you know, everything from the personal side of what it took to get to where they are. Um, you know, when leaders feel seen and heard, uh, for their full identity, I think that they can step into leadership more authentically. And that’s. I feel like that’s true for all of us. Um, AAPI women today make up less than 1% of promotions, from senior VP to C-suite. Um, and they’re they’re they’re the racial group that’s least likely to get promoted. And that’s really important for me to address and create a platform that brings visibility to these issues, um, to these women that have made it to the top so that, you know, inspires my girls when they’re ready to, uh, to get into the workforce.

Lee Kantor: Yeah. It’s always when you see somebody who’s done this before you, it kind of clears the path that. Okay, it’s possible this is not just something I’m imagining that could happen. This is something that can happen. I just have to kind of learn more and maybe follow their path a little.

Speaker3: Absolutely. And I kind of take that same approach with my work at Lead Style and the Leadership Lifestyle Podcast and creating that community. I think when you see people living their life and they are, you know, you see them as these successful executives living their life, you hope that it inspires others to not live in these bubbles that will eventually eat away at their success.

Lee Kantor: Now, um, any advice you would give a leader right now that’s hearing this? Is there some takeaway or piece of advice you would share that something they could be doing right now that would, um, maybe create some of that harmony that you talked about amongst the three P’s?

Speaker3: You know, my my advice is that success without sustainability isn’t real success. You can achieve every milestone and still feel empty if you’re misaligned when. So my advice is, is to really think long and hard about, you know, what is it that’s important to you personally and what are you doing to support your physical health? I think we you know, you can you can if you don’t have your health. I think what I’ve seen and have experienced with with losing my business partner, if you don’t have your health, you don’t have anything. And so be really intentional about about setting goals across those areas, but and not just set a goal, but why that’s important to you. I think we lose sight of that. I think we put a check mark behind. Okay. I worked out today. Great. Yeah. But what does that do for you? What’s important to you about that? And that starts to connect back to purpose. You you will start to see that what’s important to you personally, what’s important to you in your in your health is showing up in how you lead and what makes you a great leader today.

Lee Kantor: And is there a story you can share, maybe, of somebody you work with? Uh, don’t name the name or the organization, but maybe the problem they came to you with and how you were able to help them get to a new level.

Speaker3: Um, well, I think I shared a story about my chief legal officer. I’ll share a different one that I worked with the CFO. Um, you know, one of the issues that an issue, but one that she was a high performing, one of the best CFOs this organization had had as well. And she had been with the organization for about four and a half years. The reason that I worked was working with her was that there were a lot of, um, demands that were going to that she need to kind of change a little bit how she was inspiring her team. We also, you know, when we were working together, we I asked her, you know, personally, what did she want to work on? And her what she wanted to work on was buying less shoes. She had a closet of 600 shoes, and it was almost an obsession that she would buy a pair of shoes almost every week. And I said, okay, uh, physically, she was a she, you know, she ate well. She’s very healthy. She did Pilates. Um, so she just needed to sustain that. So as we’re working together, um, you know, we were we were talking about what it is, you know, is lacking the inspiration with her team.

Speaker3: What’s going on there? I, you know, we were talking through some tactics, and then I asked her about her shoes, and she said, I still keep buying the shoes. And I said, okay, What the realization she came to was that the shoes was a way of getting the inspiration and feeling valued, um, because there was something happening personally for her, uh, with her partner that wasn’t that she wasn’t getting the value there. Look, I’m no therapist, but, you know, I did recommend that she see one. And she did end up seeing, you know, working with her. And her husband ended up working with the therapist. But the realization that came out of that was that that she was seeking inspiration from something else, and she wasn’t present with what it is. That was really the root of the issue. And that helped her actually figure out how to deeply more connect with her team so that she could get to the root of what inspired them. And that was a lasting form of transformation, which has she has taken with her and continues to lead with.

Lee Kantor: So getting to the why, it really is the crux of a lot of things.

Speaker3: It is. It really is.

Lee Kantor: So if somebody wants to learn more, have a more substantive conversation with you or somebody on your team, what is the best way to connect?

Speaker3: Um, you can connect with me on LinkedIn. You can also go to my website at wltx.com. Um, and reach out to me there. Um, and, uh, you know, send me an email and we can get started.

Lee Kantor: All right. Well, thank you so much for sharing your story today. You’re doing such important work, and we appreciate you.

Speaker3: Thank you. Lee, appreciate you taking the time to speak with me today.

Lee Kantor: All right. This is Lee Kantor. We’ll see you all next time on High Velocity Radio.

Tagged With: Lead Style, Shveta Pillai

Painting a Brighter Future: The Power of Collaboration in Franchising

September 26, 2025 by angishields

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Franchise Marketing Radio
Painting a Brighter Future: The Power of Collaboration in Franchising
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In this episode of Franchise Marketing Radio, Lee Kantor talks with Dawn Perry and Bill Palliser of CertaPro Painters®. They discuss the company’s evolution from a college summer business to a leading franchise, emphasizing the crucial collaboration between marketing and operations. The conversation highlights the importance of alignment, peer support, and shared values in driving franchisee success. CertaPro’s approach—uniting corporate teams and franchisees through training, peer groups, and open communication—demonstrates how a strong, values-driven culture leads to growth, engagement, and operational excellence across the franchise system.

CertaPro-Painters-logo

Dawn-PerryDawn Perry joined CertaPro Painters®, North America’s Most Referred Painting Company®, in August 2022 as the Chief Brand Officer.

In this role, she is responsible for leading the company’s brand strategy and marketing.

With more than 15 years of franchise marketing expertise and 30+ years of marketing experience, she has a proven track record of driving lead generation and delivering extraordinary brand experiences with a customer-centric approach.

Prior to joining CertaPro Painters, Ms. Perry held two roles over 12 years at Anywhere Real Estate as Senior Vice President Cross Brand Marketing, and as Chief Marketing Officer at ERA Real Estate. Previously, she held marketing management positions with Avis Budget Car Rental Group, Scholastic Book Club, and Time Inc. She also led her own Little Gym franchise for four years.

Ms. Perry has received several accolades for her innovative branding and marketing strategies with bottom-line impact, including being a recipient of the Consumer Marketing Achievement Award from Time Inc., the Alex Perriello Innovation Award, and the Realogy Round of Applause recognition.

She is currently a member of the American Marketing Association (AMA) and has previously contributed to Forbes. She also holds a master chef certificate from The French Culinary Institute.

Connect with Dawn on LinkedIn.

Bill-PallierBill Palliser brings over 22 years of operations, management, and sales experience to his role as Executive Vice President of Operations at CertaPro Painters®, North America’s Most Referred Painting Company®.

With a proven track record of driving organizational success, Bill leads all operations functions with a primary goal of achieving revenue targets and supporting franchise owners in reaching their individual goals. Bill is passionate about the development and execution of business plans and key strategies for franchise owners to drive significant results.

Prior to joining CertaPro, Bill spent 18 years at Sherwin-Williams, where he held numerous roles in store management, commercial and residential sales, and district management. Notably, he spent five years on the national account team, where he managed the partnership between Sherwin-Williams and CertaPro across North America, devising strategies to enhance collaboration.

Bill’s final role at Sherwin-Williams was as National Accounts Sales Director, leading a team that delivered innovative solutions to strategic clients in various market segments, including residential, multifamily, commercial, hospitality, and healthcare.

Connect with Bill on LinkedIn.

Episode Highlights

  • History and evolution of CertaPro Painters® from a college summer business to a full-time franchise.
  • The significance of collaboration between marketing and operations in franchising.
  • Support systems for franchisees, including peer networks and training.
  • The role of shared core values and culture in franchisee selection.
  • The importance of operational excellence in fulfilling marketing promises.
  • Strategies for engaging franchisees in corporate initiatives and decision-making.
  • The impact of peer-to-peer learning and sharing best practices among franchisees.
  • The necessity of corporate alignment for effective communication and strategy execution.
  • The influence of franchisee engagement on overall performance and success.
  • The relationship between a strong corporate culture and franchisee commitment to the brand.

Transcript-iconThis transcript is machine transcribed by Sonix.

 

TRANSCRIPT

Intro: Coming to you live from the Business RadioX studio. It’s Franchise Marketing Radio.

Lee Kantor: Lee Kantor here. Another episode of Franchise Marketing Radio. And this is gonna be a good one. Today we’re going to be talking about why marketing and operations must work together in the world of franchising. And, uh, to talk about that, we have Dawn Perry and we have Bill Palliser, and they are with Certapro. Dawn is the chief brand officer and Bill is the executive VP of operations. So they are very qualified to be discussing this important issue. Welcome.

Dawn Perry: Hi. Thanks, Lee. It’s great to be here.

Bill Palliser: Happy to be here.

Lee Kantor: Well, I’m excited to talk about this topic. But first let’s talk about Certapro painters. Tell us about your mission. Purpose. How you serving folks?

Dawn Perry: Oh, no, I’ll take that. I’m sure Bill can add on. Um, again, thanks for having us today. Look, uh, Certapro painters has been around since 1992, and and we are. Our mission is to lift up the painting painting industry, to aspire to transform homes and properties, um, by creating a workplace of choice. But even more to the core is we are strive to deliver extraordinary experiences. Every paint project at the time we paint for both residential and commercial customers, and we have core values that we live and breathe every single day, that we bring to everything we do. And so we’re happy to be here today. But I can tell you, any organization, including Enfranchising, it is only as successful as the alignment and the collaboration of all the teams that are involved in helping our franchisees succeed. And so Bill and I have been working really hard on being collaborative to deliver on that promise of delivering extraordinary experiences to our franchisees and to our painters and to our sales associates. So what would you add to that?

Bill Palliser: Yeah, I mean, I think well, well said. I often, uh, you know, talk internally and externally about clarity, unity, alignment. And you spoke to that. Dawn, it’s super important that we’re all united in the direction we’re going. We’re clear and we’re aligned. And again today we’re here to talk about, I think, internal and how Dawn and our teams work collaboratively together, but super important that we go external right to the franchise body and all of our stakeholders. Dawn mentioned a few, uh, starting with our franchise owners, of course, all their associates, the painters that put the paint on and really deliver the extraordinary experience to the customers. And then last stakeholder, of course, that that customer. So have to have that clarity in any alignment across, uh, all of those stakeholders to, uh, to be successful and drive the organization forward.

Lee Kantor: Now, can you tell me a little bit about the history of Certapro? Did it start as a mom and pop and then evolved into kind of the franchise that it is today. Is was that kind of the genesis of the idea originally?

Bill Palliser: I can take that one, Dawn, if you’d like. No. So we started many of the listeners may be familiar with college pro painters, which was a concept of, uh, taking college kids, young entrepreneurs and, uh, help them establish a robust, uh, painting business over the summer. And you can imagine how how challenging that would be a working with, uh, with college folks and then those college folks as general managers trying to recruit, uh, you know, their friends, their peers, uh, over the summer instead of, uh, doing what college kids do over the summer, typically, uh, you know, go sling a brush, go sell paint jobs, uh, go deliver extraordinary experiences by, uh, bringing beauty to someone’s home. And so that’s where it started. Uh, and then in 1992, as Dawn alluded, um, Charlie Chase, who is the founder of uh, Servpro, along with another individual, said, hey, maybe we can take this to a full time model, Obviously, working in the summer with college kids has limitations. So let’s let’s see where this could go. And, uh, you know, they had, uh, some aspirations of, of sales and, uh, fast forward 30, you know, almost 35 years. We’ve, uh, we’ve surpassed that significantly. So, yeah, started with a summertime college, uh, gig and, uh, grew into something much, much greater as, uh, what Certapro painters is today.

Dawn Perry: Yeah. And I, I completely concur with what Bill said. I’ll tell a little illustrative story. So one of our biggest franchise owners out in the San Francisco area, um, started out in college pro slinging a brush. And then he also worked for corporate for many years, worked his way up in the organization and went back to being a franchisee. There was a lot of legacy to be proud of at Certapro, including our CEO, who once was a sales associate, is obviously leading the charge for us now. So, um, it is it’s a great operation. It started with exteriors and now moves over to interiors, uh, for both residential and then commercial. Both exteriors and interiors as well.

Lee Kantor: So how do you collaborate when it comes to delivering on the brand promise? Um, you know, in marketing, you know, you’re probably charged with making it enticing and persuading people to try it, but operationally, it has to kind of deliver on whatever it is that marketing is promising. How do you all work together, or do or do you work together and or do you just have to kind of manage whatever the other person’s doing?

Dawn Perry: Well, I think you can operate that way, but you’re not going to be successful that way. So I’ll just start with my role is to, uh, build and amplify brand awareness of certapro painters. Right. To make sure that we are always in the consideration set for anybody who needs to paint. And so how we do that is all the things that we talked about before in terms of delivering the brand promise. But I can say that all I want, but if the the teams are not delivering on that expectation, we’re we’re nowhere. Right? And so where Bill and I try to be aligned and in lockstep is not only what do we stand for and how do we go to market, but how are we delivering on that promise? And we have a phrase, and I’ll let him talk about this, about mastering the basics. Right. We most franchise concepts have a system and it works. And the ability to marry what we do in brand marketing and advertising to what actually happens on the ground, because that’s really where the magic happens, is essential. And we can’t do that without being aligned.

Bill Palliser: Yeah, 100%. And, you know, mastering the basics is kind of our, our, our thematic goal. Right. And and really execution, it’s foundation of operational excellence and executing the fundamentals on what makes our company or anybody’s company great. And we believe the more consistently you execute on the promise, the more raving fans of your brand you create, right? This leads to more referrals. It leads to more repeat customers, and the stronger the brand is. Uh, as a result, in my mind, you know, marketing is really the message, really merely how we kind of tell our story and go to market. Um, but, you know, operationally how you walk the walk and demonstrate and stand behind that message or story is really the lifeblood of of who you are as a, as an organization. So you can’t just have the message, um, and you can’t just have the operations. You need the two lock step, uh, again, with that clarity, entity and alignment, uh, rowing in the same direction together. That, to me, is what true operational excellence looks like.

Lee Kantor: Now, how do you handle, uh, the franchisees as opposed to if this was a kind of a, um, uh, brand that was that owned all of their, uh, all of their stores because the franchisee and the market is an entrepreneur, maybe they didn’t have a background that you all have in on the brand. With the brand doing this kind of work, how do you get a person that’s a kind of a layperson or maybe an executive, or had a different career, and then get them number one to be proficient and efficient and effective when it comes to delivering on the brand promise, and also give them the operational skills to execute at the highest level. Because in the franchisor’s mind, the brand is one thing, but the franchisee in a given market, you would like them to actually think the same thing. But they might think that, hey, maybe that my market’s different, that maybe I am. I’m seeing things that the franchisor really can’t understand.

Bill Palliser: Yeah, I’ll take that one. Leah let let Dawn backfill. Um, she had talked about it earlier. Franchising is all about systems, right? And a good franchisor develops great systems based on, you know, feedback and and trials and pilots and then success. Um, and then once you’ve got those systems, it’s all about driving, uh, execution. Right. Of, of those systems believing that what you have works and having proven success behind it. But franchising is all about inspiration and persuasion. Um, right. We cannot. As you mentioned, they’re independent business owners. We cannot tell them what to do. So we have to inspire and lead them. And really, the best way that that we find to do that in franchising is through their peers, right? Uh, find peers, others that are having success following the systems, doing the things that we believe work and then, uh, telling, uh, telling their story. So, um, you know, whether that’s leveraging technology, adopting marketing tactics, it’s so important that we capture where owners and teams are having success, uh, and share it. And then the more successes we can share, the more feedback we can provide, the more collaboration we have with owners. And then each of us internally, the more effective we’ll be in driving adoption, making changes, and ultimately the more impact we’ll have. Uh, on our results. I always say it’s it’s really about the why, the what, the how. Right. Why is it, uh, valuable or important for a franchise owner to go in a specific direction. Um, what is that thing? Right. Whether it’s technology adoption, how does it work? Uh, and how do they use it? How do they use it to, uh, to drive or drive their results? And again, the more we can use peer to peer engagement and successes of other, uh, other owners and associates, the more likely we have, uh, to drive adoption and execution of those, uh, those systems.

Dawn Perry: And I would just add to that, and I agree wholeheartedly, is and I did not coin this phrase, but I’m sure you’ve heard it right. When you’re in franchising, you’re in business for yourself, but not by yourself. And that that definitely holds true at Certapro, right? I, uh, Bill has a phrase that he coined. I like to say access and insight. When you work with a franchising network, you Dawn’t have to think about the next thing that’s happening with AI or your Google search, or how do I, um, find a new vendor for lifts, you know, from a from an operation standpoint, right. You have the backing of not only the franchise or, um, where Bill and I represent, but also and I, I am completely aligned with him. All of the peer network is really where the strength is. They’re doing it every day, right? The success of a new franchisee comes from. Yes, representing well. And there is obviously, uh, compliance to the brand standards and making sure that you should all like the brand, but it’s what you do in your local market and how you can leverage things that you learn from your peers that will drive your success.

Lee Kantor: So if you were giving advice to other franchisors out there, other business owners out there, how do you what are some of tactically how you’re, um, encouraging, uh, this kind of peer to peer learning and developing this peer network. Like, what are you doing kind of inside that is capturing the stories and sharing the learning.

Dawn Perry: While star and then Billy. I’m sure you’re going to lean into it a little bit, but look, it starts from the moment they come to what we call a meet the team day or Discovery Day, right? Well, they get access to franchisees right then just to, to mingle with and understand. Um, but from that point forward, we make sure say they join, um, a franchise territory that’s in, uh, the New York area. They would be part of a New York co-op. So they immediately get introduced to all of their peers in that co-op. They meet regularly, um, with that peer group, and we facilitate those. Um, there are peer groups that we help facilitate along the way. And again, Bill can give you more about that, but we really just try to make sure that they stay connected to like size businesses. And they have the right support, which really comes from what Bill’s team, uh, represents.

Bill Palliser: Yeah. I think what I’d add to that is, uh, while this may appear to be slow, I often say, you know, go slow to go fast. Um, and I think that holds true to a lot of the innovation, uh, and things that we do at Certapro, and I’m sure others do as well, or I’d recommend others do, and that involve the franchise owners or the key stakeholders early in the process. So you’re rolling out something new with marketing. You’re rolling out something new with technology or something new with with operations. You Dawn’t want to work in a silo, right? Dawn and her team Dawn’t want to work in just the marketing team. I Dawn’t want to work just in the operations team. We a need to be working together and collaborating. But as importantly, we need to be pulling in the franchise owners and the key associates that are doing it every single day. Because we can sit, uh, you know, here at the corporate office and we can put our heads together and come up with what we consider some really great ideas and maybe ideas that, that that might go very far. But at the end of the day, back to that inspiration and persuasion. If we have their buy in from the front end and their input, we may or may not take all their input, and we certainly won’t always take the input 100%.

Bill Palliser: But we take that feedback. We consider that feedback and we we adopt that feedback into the thing that we’re rolling out or developing, uh, so much easier to get buy in when peers can say, yep, I played a role in that, I support that. It was well thought out, and it’s absolutely something that you should adopt or leverage to to grow your business. So again, we do that through a number of different ways. Dawn mentioned the peer groups where we work with like size owners to help them grow their business, but as importantly, get feedback from them about directions that that we’re taking. We have peer groups with associates and things where we’re meeting with these folks monthly to share success stories of where, like peers are having success with various initiatives, uh, and or just business results. And then part of that, again, is bringing that feedback internally so that we can continue to cascade, uh, out best practices, uh, and things that people are having success, success in. So to summarize all that, it’s really working together with all the different stakeholders as we make major moves in the organization to drive the business forward.

Lee Kantor: Now that sounds good from a corporate standpoint to have these things, but are you getting the engagement from these peer groups or people looking forward to these peer to peer interactions? Is this something that they, uh, schedule things around, or is this just another thing that corporates making me do?

Bill Palliser: Yeah, I would say in general they’re looking forward to it. Uh, again, our our peer to peer program, uh, which consists of, you know, probably roughly 75% of our, of our franchise owners, uh, has been the lifeblood of our organization and many of our sister brands, uh, organizations in the first service brands. And, um, yeah, they this is a priority for them because they understand they not only have an opportunity to work with corporate, but as importantly, most importantly, they have an opportunity to get feedback from like sized peers. And again, back to how I opened this. It’s all about, uh, driving success through through each other. Uh, and so short answer. Yeah, they’re they’re looking forward to these things. Uh, and again, the more of a value and the more success that you can drive as a result, the more that they want to participate. So we here have great relationships at Certapro. Again, I think that is because we, uh, we listen, uh, we continue to adapt and learn from our franchise owners and associates. And as a result, uh, they want to continue to engage and participate with us at a high level.

Lee Kantor: Well, it speaks highly of the corporate culture. I mean, if you’re able to choose franchisees who, um, have that same kind of mindset and values, then it’s you’re doing a great job in terms of getting them to buy in and wanting and looking forward to kind of these kind of calls and these kind of meetings because they know the value is there 100%.

Bill Palliser: And, um, I will just say Dawn mentioned it earlier and I’ll let her speak to it. She mentioned our core values. And really, when we, you know, when we evaluate a franchise owner coming in, just as they’re evaluating us, we’re evaluating them to make sure that not only do they have the financials and the business acumen to come in here and be successful, certainly we look at that and that’s important. Are they a values fit right. Do they. Do they align with our culture here. Um and the values that we feel are so important. And that’s I think that’s a big differentiator of our organization versus maybe some others where they’re looking to just sell units. We’re not just looking to sell units. We’re looking to bring the right people into the organization, into the family that really want to give back to the brand and help see this thing continue to thrive.

Dawn Perry: Yeah. I’d just add, uh, that, you know, I’ve been in franchising over 15 years, um, the last three with Certapro painters and, um, it’s true in all franchise networks. Right? Engagement within the network and with your peers, whether it’s facilitated by the corporate office or not, is what drives success. We always find that the franchisees that come to events that we host, that participate in peer groups that are offered to them, those that show up and engage on average perform better than those who Dawn’t. Right. So that that, you know, success breeds other success. And we’ve talked around it a bunch and every organization has core values, but ours are deliver what you promised. Have pride in what you do. Respect the individual which is extremely important to us. Practice continuous improvement and embrace the possibilities in that last one is really where we all try to lean in at from the franchisor all the way down to the painter, who in many cases is a subcontractor. Right? We want to make sure that we’re embracing the possibilities of what can be for all of our success, success.

Lee Kantor: Now, is there a story you can share of this type of franchise success where, um, the importance of alignment really shone through?

Bill Palliser: You want to take that one on or do you want me to take that?

Dawn Perry: You start because I’m I’m trying to think of a good story.

Bill Palliser: Yeah. I mean, um, you know, I was thinking it starts with the corporate team. And, you know, when we talk about marketing and or operations alignment, which again is a topic for today, but I think this holds true with with all departments. Uh, we’ve, we’ve led from the top. And I think that’s extremely important that, uh, Dawn and I or our CIO and I, whatever the teams are, are completely lockstep in the priorities. Uh, and the directions, um, you know, uh, that that we’re trying to drive the organization forward. And if we lead with that, that alignment, then then our teams tend to lead with that. And so the success story that I’ve shared is we’ve really Dawne and I have worked really hard at really bringing the marketing team and the operations team together, uh, not only to set goals and have goal alignment, um, you know, whether they’re bonus or reward planner type goals, but also KPI goals, um, for subsequent years so that there’s 100% alignment, uh, around where we’re going and how we’re going to get there. And what we found is that, you know, that has prevented finger pointing, that’s prevented folks working in silos, and it’s increased the level of communication that we’ve been able to effectively go to market with.

Bill Palliser: The second thing we’ve Dawne is really focused on training our teams and not not training them separately, but training them together. So operations folks really understands the roles and responsibilities of the marketing team and the tactics and things that we need to adapt and embrace. And the marketing team is completely aligned around the operations goals. And and if we have to scale them up or teach them something new with the ever changing technology and the things with Google and everything’s changing very rapidly. So we can’t assume that everybody knows everything they need to know to inspire and persuade these owners. And I think that’s created a lot of success because we’ve been able to increase the skill level of our team, create alignment of our team, and ultimately that has transpired to us Impacting specific KPIs and specific results with our franchise owners, which ultimately then leads to their success, uh, in their business. So alignment at the top, down through our teams ultimately then leads to, uh, more alignment in the franchise body and more success as a result.

Dawn Perry: And, um, thanks for the time to fill in my story, Bill. So I appreciate you filling that part in there. So I will add to maybe two different facets of this. So a lot of what Bill was talking about was our corporate alignment, which has really been impactful in we talk about um, in franchising, it’s very difficult. You have to communicate. What do we say times ten. Right, Bill. So it is um, when everybody’s aligned and singing the same song in terms of what is our strategy, our goals and initiatives and how we support our franchisees and our associates. That is another touchpoint, another way to communicate our value back to the franchisee and how they can leverage that value to their success. Um, one of the things I’ll just share, we just came out of our corporate meeting a couple weeks ago. And, you know, when we have these things and we talk about our overall strategy and goals, you’ve got folks on the team that maybe, like maybe they’re doing social media for us, or maybe they’re doing, um, finance, um, or they’re the accountant. How do how can I impact delivering more customers to our franchisees and more opportunities to our franchisees? And when we have these meetings, and we really do these workshops to really help them understand that, yes, what they do drives the end goal. We’ve had phenomenal success in really fostering that alignment. And then from the franchisee side, I mentioned before about engagement, right. Like we all strive to lead, leave a legacy that we can be proud of. And so I’ll tell a quick story. We have an owner, um, a partial owner now out of Arkansas, who he was very well entrenched with advisory boards at the corporate level. He was engaged with corporate, he was engaged franchisee, and he had two sales associates that came up in his organization. And he nurtured and they became owners of the business. Right. So it is really striving to leave that legacy that they can be proud of, and that comes from alignment on where everybody’s going. We’re all paddling in the same direction.

Lee Kantor: Well, if somebody wants to learn more about Certapro, um, if they’re a customer or maybe a potential franchisee, what is the website? What’s the best way to connect with somebody on the team?

Dawn Perry: So the best. Ah, so our website is Certapro Certapro calm. That’s Serta with a C. Um, and they can certainly connect to me, I’m sure Bill as well on LinkedIn. We’d be happy to chat with anyone.

Lee Kantor: Well, thank you both for sharing your story today. You’re doing such important work and we appreciate you.

Bill Palliser: Thanks for having us today. We appreciate you allowing us to tell our story.

Dawn Perry: Yeah. Thanks, Lee. It was a pleasure.

Lee Kantor: All right, this is Lee Kantor. We’ll see you all next time on Franchise Marketing Radio.

 

Tagged With: CertaPro Painters

RFPs + AI: The Game-Changing Combo WBEs Can’t Ignore

September 26, 2025 by angishields

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Women in Motion
RFPs + AI: The Game-Changing Combo WBEs Can’t Ignore
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In this episode of Women in Motion, hosts Lee Kantor and Renita Manley speak with Lisa Rehurek of The RFP Success Company about leveraging AI to improve responses to Requests for Proposals (RFPs). Lisa shares practical strategies for small businesses to build authority, customize AI-generated content, and avoid generic language. She highlights the importance of showcasing credentials and thought leadership to establish trust with evaluators. The episode also previews Lisa’s upcoming workshop at the WBEC-West conference, where attendees will learn to create tailored AI tools and strengthen their RFP proposals.

Lisa-RehurekLisa Rehurek is the powerhouse CEO of The RFP Success Company and the visionary behind RFP Success Express.

With a 78% win rate and over $500M in client contracts secured, she and her team know what it takes to win state and local government contracts through the RFP process.

The RFP Success® Company specializes in connecting the dots from Capture to Proposal to Results. It’s not enough to focus on the RFP that’s on your radar today; the best companies have a well-rounded culture and mindset that permeates the entire company.

Social Media:

    • LinkedIn Personal: Lisa Rehurek | LinkedIn
    • LinkedIn RFP Success: https://www.linkedin.com/company/rfpsuccess
    • IG Personal: Lisa Rehurek (@lisa_rehurek) • Instagram photos and videos
    • IG RFP Success: RFP Success (@rfpsuccess) • Instagram photos and videos

Episode Highlights

  • The role of artificial intelligence (AI) in responding to Requests for Proposals (RFPs).
  • Challenges faced by smaller businesses in navigating RFP processes.
  • Importance of customizing AI-generated content to maintain authenticity.
  • Common mistakes in using AI for proposal writing and how to avoid them.
  • Strategies for training AI with company-specific data to enhance proposal quality.
  • The significance of solution-focused messaging in proposals.
  • The evolving landscape of proposal responses due to AI advancements.
  • Tips for improving readability and engagement in proposals.
  • The value of leveraging past proposals for future success.
  • The importance of building trust and authority in proposals for smaller businesses.

Music Provided by M PATH MUSIC

Transcript-iconThis transcript is machine transcribed by Sonix

 

TRANSCRIPT

Intro: Broadcasting live from the Business RadioX studios. It’s time for Women in Motion. Brought to you by WBEC-West. Join forces. Succeed together. Now, here’s your host.

Lee Kantor: Lee Kantor here with Renita Manley. Another episode of Women in Motion. And this is going to be a good one. But before we get started, it’s important to recognize our sponsor, WBEC-West. Without them, we couldn’t be sharing these important stories. Today’s episode is titled RFPs + AI: The Game-Changing Combo WBEs Can’t Ignore. Our guest today is Lisa Rehurek and she is with the RFP Success Company. Welcome, Renita. Welcome, Lisa.

Lisa Rehurek : Thank you.

Renita Manley: It’s nice to have you with us here today, Lisa. So Lisa’s actually going to be joining us at this year’s conference. Big West Conference out in Scottsdale, Arizona. And she has a workshop that she’s presenting all about this topic. So this podcast is kind of like an introduction to that workshop. And in the workshop you can expect Lisa to dive in with way more details. And we’re talking specifically today about your responses to RFPs and how to use AI to make sure your response stands out from the crowd. So, Lisa, can you start off by telling us what made you choose this actual topic for the conference?

Lisa Rehurek : Yeah. You know, um, AI is obviously all the rage right now, right? Everybody’s talking about it. Everybody’s trying to figure out how to use it. And when you think about RFPs and what people struggle with, particularly smaller businesses that might not have a professional team internally, RFPs are hard. They take a lot of time. And so there’s a lot of people right now searching for how to combine those two. How to use AI to respond to RFPs. And frankly, we’re seeing a lot of bad use of AI. So I love this topic because hopefully we can give some tips and tricks here to hopefully help people along and make sure that they’re using it better than they probably are right now.

Lee Kantor: Can you share some do’s and don’ts, like off the top of your head?

Lisa Rehurek : Yeah, absolutely. A lot of times what people do is they just put the question into AI and say, answer this. And then they take it and they copy and paste it. And that’s the end of that’s the end of that. Way too generic. You’ve got to customize it. You’ve got to really know how to work AI to get it to the right place. The evaluators are getting savvy. They know. They know when you’ve been using AI. So you want to customize it. That’s probably the number one red flag with the don’ts. A do is just start training your AI tool to your business. Start making sure that it understands who you are, what you stand for, what authority you have in your topic, things like that.

Lee Kantor: Now, when you say train, does that require me to do a paid version of the AI tool that I’m using?

Lisa Rehurek : Yes, you should always have a paid version. It’s going to be so much better. You’re going to be able to again, kind of get the bot is going to get used to you. It’s going to learn you. But if you have an unpaid version, it doesn’t store any of that information. So you can create a custom GPT. So for example, you could create a custom GPT that says like, here’s all of the authority that we have in the marketplace. Use this to answer any questions that I ask you around RFPs, and it’ll pull that information. But you got to have the paid version.

Lee Kantor: So it keeps kind of all your content there as a resource for the AI so it can help you, um, communicate a little bit better. It doesn’t have to relearn this every single time.

Lisa Rehurek : Exactly. But if you’re the free version, it’s going to have to relearn it, and you’re going to have to retype it in every single time. That’s no fun.

Lee Kantor: And then when you’re working with it, even if you are using the paid version, how important is it to kind of go go back and forth and not just take its first answer as the answer, but to kind of ask it maybe a different way or ask it to help using different language just so that you’re getting kind of a real next level answer rather than kind of the superficial first answer.

Lisa Rehurek : It’s so important. Lee, I’m so glad you brought that up, because and I think what people are doing right now is they’re just taking the first answer and they’re like, oh, this sounds really good. And then they’re dropping it into their proposal. But it you know, the evaluators can tell it’s not perfect. So, you know, what I like to say is if you’re going to go for the first, first round, which is great. I don’t know about you guys, but I hate looking at a blank piece of paper and having to start from scratch. So it’s really great to go into AI and say, hey, I need to answer this question. Give it a little bit of a prompt and see what it gives you, and then go back again. And maybe you say, you know what, I want to integrate a little bit more fun and spunky personality as I have. So add a little bit more of that, then I’ll do another version, and then I’ll say, you know, I’d like an analogy in here, and I don’t have one off the top of my head. What kind of an analogy can we add in here to make this a little bit more compelling? And so you just want to keep working it and keep massaging it. So it does take work still. But I’ll tell you what, it’s so much better than just that blank page where you got to come up with everything yourself.

Lee Kantor: And it’s and it’s using the tool, not like a thesaurus, but more like an executive assistant where you’re, you’re kind of wanting it to, you know, think a little bit and be better and not just give you kind of the surface. You, you want it to kind of get in there and make connections that maybe a human would have trouble with.

Lisa Rehurek : Absolutely. And, you know, again, you know, kind of back to my analogy of analogies, I am horrible at just thinking up an analogy. Like, it just my brain just doesn’t go there. And so it’ll give me and I’ll say like, give me three ideas for an analogy, and then I’ll pull one and and have it keep working it. And it’s unbelievably smart. I mean, it is pretty crazy how good it is already, but it’s not all the way there yet. Right. And so to your point, like it’s gonna it’s gonna pump out stuff better than my brain could, but it’s not quite. It’s just not quite there to be like, hey, this is great. Now I’m just going to copy and paste this. Now I gotta work it a little bit and massage it a little bit, but that shouldn’t take you that much time.

Renita Manley: So how exactly can a we be make sure she’s personalizing her? Um, her response just so she’s not sounding like, um, the next VB or the next small business owner. Pretty much. How can you use words or use AI or use a prompt to help generate responses that are very much so individualized.

Lisa Rehurek : Yeah. So, um, one of the thing well, so you know how I talked about that kind of custom GPT, you want to have something that is in your GPT that is, or whatever one you’re using that is that knows you, right? So the the way that I started was I just went in and I said, I’m going to tell you a whole bunch of stuff about me, and I want you to ask me some questions to clarify anything that you don’t understand. And then I just went in and started kind of brain dumping, like, you know, we’ve been in business for eight years. I have 30 years of RFP experience where, uh, we specialize in the sled space, which stands for State Local Education. I like to be a little bit fun and spunky. Um, we here’s what our brand stands for. So a whole bunch of that stuff. Here’s the authority that we have. Here’s some evidence I just started dropping a whole bunch of stuff in there. Then ChatGPT came back and ask me some clarifying questions and it was great. I remember asking me, do you have any quantifiable statistics that we can include here? And I’m like, oh yes, I have forgot about that. So I added that in. So what’s so great about that is all of those things make us different than anybody else that does what we do. Not just the quantifiable stuff and not just the, um, you know, here’s about our brand, but also kind of the personality of who we are.

Lisa Rehurek : And when you get all of that in there, your answers are going to just be a little bit more. They’re going to be your personality. They’re going to be your brand. And that’s going to stand out above everybody else. There are other things too. So, um, one of the biggest mistakes that we see people make in RFP responses is they are all about them. We help you this, we help you that. But the evaluators don’t really care. And it’s not going to it’s not going to make them lean in and really listen. What they what you need to do is start talking about how your solution is going to help them. It’s that whole classic what’s in it for me? Right. They want to know what’s in it for them. And so when you start crafting things that way and you can say, hey, here’s the answer that I crafted. Can you help me make this more about them, more about how our solution is going to help them flip the switch and think about the Wifm, and it’ll start to help you with that. You’re going to have to massage it, but it’s going to start helping you flip that around. So things like that will make a very, very huge difference.

Renita Manley: How how do you think um, the proposal responses looked before everyone started using ChatGPT and AI and afterwards, like like you’re an evaluator, you’re getting your responses for years, and now you’re like, okay, all right, everybody’s giving me A+ responses now. So how how are how are they how are they differing now.

Lisa Rehurek : So a couple of things, um, I would say that they were much more generic and bland before. So most people just blend it in. And what happens then is the evaluators give you like maybe the meets expectations scores, but you’re kind of average. Now one of two things is happening. We are seeing some better responses. And so you got to up your game because everybody else is upping their game. But we’re also seeing AI responses, which is not making people happy. So there’s some some certain signs em dashes. Ai loves em dashes, they love quotation marks. They love certain words like robust. Take that crap. Pardon my French out of there. Take it out. Because the evaluators know that that came from AI. Um, and it’s, you know, you got to pay attention to that kind of stuff. So in the new world, there’s kind of two things happening. We’re seeing either they’re getting really smart and savvy and everybody’s elevating up. And we’re also seeing kind of a little too much use and reliance on AI.

Renita Manley: Okay. Is that fatigue. Like how does that lead to like evaluation fatigue. Like here we go again with these AI responses. And it’s kind of making. So for using that AI response for a for proposals you want to make sure you one stay solution focused not all about yourself. Try to stay away from some of those AI tall tale signs like the Em dashes, or maybe even just spontaneous, um, bolded words. Every other sentence has a bolded word that seems to be like an AI response. Okay. Uh, what? What’s the best AI program to use for a proposal response?

Lisa Rehurek : You know, honestly, I just use ChatGPT. It’s the one that I started with. I love it because it knows me now, and it. And it’s getting to know me well. We’re actually building an AI tool specifically for proposals. And the back end of that is ChatGPT as well? So I’m a ChatGPT fan, but there are a ton of them out there. And you know, if you have time and inclination, it’s always fun to go out and test different ones for, you know, some of them are free, free trials, things like that, to just play around for with them. But there’s a lot we use ChatGPT again. And then I also have starry AI that I use for some images, and we use Jasper for some other very specific things, but ChatGPT for the main responses.

Lee Kantor: Now I’d like to get back to putting in the data to start with. You mentioned, you know, having it ask you questions and getting kind of a deep dive into, um, you know, the history of the company and all it can do and all that stuff. Is it a good idea to actually input proposals that you’ve done before, like even like, hey, I won this one or I lost this one and actually input that data into the is that useful or is that, you know, is it outdated? Is there value in doing something like that?

Lisa Rehurek : So I have a whole bunch of answers. Um, so I’m going to try to keep track of my. My mind is pinging all over the place to answer this. First of all, um, if it’s a good proposal. Now, if you’ve won the proposal, it doesn’t necessarily mean it was good. It just means that it was better than everybody else’s. So you always want to make sure you get feedback. And if you get feedback that your qualifications scored you really high, then you know that that section is probably something you want to keep and you want to you want to probably put that in and say, hey, this was a winning qualifications. Um, one of the things, again, kind of back to our platform that we’re building is we’re it will have a storage for library content for those kinds of things, um, organize that way. And ChatGPT you’re just going to have to put it in your, uh, your custom GPT to have it in there, um, to use to pull from for future things. So the answer to that is yes. Um, if you’ve lost, you probably don’t want to use that because, you know, and again, if you can get the scoring tools, you might have lost. But maybe again, your executive summary was great and it scored really high. Then you want to pull that in, but you don’t want to pull in the sections that got low scores. Now what you could do is if you’re somebody that really wants to learn is put in, hey, here’s the question and answer that we got scored really low on. Help me understand what I could have done better. And there’s more things you could maybe add to that prompt, but that would get you some learning. And then maybe a revised version of that that you could store.

Lee Kantor: Now what about, um, other proposals in other areas just so that it can learn things that win? Like, is that have any value that it may not be your specific niche, but it’s a winning proposal.

Lisa Rehurek : You know, it’s interesting. I’ve never tried that, Lee, to be honest with you. I’ve never even thought about that. It would be interesting to see how you could do that. The first thing that came to mind is, well, you know, maybe you could take the winning proposal from, from what you bid on and put it in against your proposal and say, hey, you know, give us some some things that we can improve on for the next time. But I don’t know if it would I don’t know how good it would be. I guess you could. Sorry. I’m thinking out loud as I’m thinking through this. I think you could probably put in a winning proposal and say this was a winning proposal. Extract out the top ten things that they did well. Something like that. And just see what it comes back with. For things that maybe you could then take and use in your next proposal. Kind of like a little checklist.

Lee Kantor: Now are there certain, you know, kind of scoring tips that you can share when it comes to this? Are there some things that, oh, you have to do this or don’t do this. Or are there some kind of low hanging fruit in that area?

Lisa Rehurek : Yeah, I mean for sure some of it we’ve already talked about, like if you’re too focused and not solution focused enough, um, there’s there’s some readability things. So, um, you know, there’s a, a standard kind of thought out there that you should be writing to a sixth grade reading level. Most people are writing to 11 or 12th grade and that just the evaluators gloss over it. It’s not dumbing down. It’s making it more simple for them to understand and score you on. So one of the things that I always tell people is you have to think about the fact that these are human beings on the other end of this proposal, right? They are they are scoring you and minimum maybe 2 or 3 others. And up to I mean, we had one the other day with 32 people responded to it. So these evaluators are having to go through this. The more that you can do to make it easy on them. Shorter sentences, less techy talk, right to a sixth grade reading level. Um, tell them what they need to know. And also, for the love of Pete, answer the question. I will tell you that 99% of the RFP responses that we look at somewhere in there.

Lisa Rehurek : They have answered questions that have not really answered the question. And sorry, I’m going off on a tangent here, but that’s another thing that you can use AI for is to do a checks and balances. Here’s the question. Here’s my answer. You know, do a checks and balances to make sure that we’ve answered the question appropriately. And it’ll give you some feedback. So a lot of times in the RFPs they’ll give you multiple questions in one question. And it’s really easy to miss pieces of it. Um, if they ask you for a process, give them a process. Tell them. Step one, step two, step three. Don’t just drop in a massive paragraph. These evaluators are probably tired. This isn’t their full time job. Maybe they’re planning their kid’s birthday party in their heads. I mean, if you lose their attention, that’s what they’re going to be doing. Grocery lists, kids birthday parties. What do we have to do tomorrow to get the kids to school on time? All of those things that swimming around in our heads. So you’ve got to make it compelling for them to lean in and pay attention. Otherwise you’re going to get at best average scores.

Renita Manley: So it sounds like when you say they had to make it compelling, it’s almost like they need to try to connect with that human that’s actually going to be reading their response. So that’s the tricky part when you’re trying to balance how to use AI to leverage your response. But at the same time, you got to figure out how to connect with this human being who may have to cook dinner later on, go to a kid’s soccer game, go grocery shopping, go catch the game at the bar afterwards. They they want that moment of reading the responses to be compelling, to not seem boring like the past five AI responses that I’ve just I just read. So I guess the question. Another. My final question would be is, um, what would be some savvy ways then to use AI without losing that human connection? And then I want you to follow up with, um, explaining to VBS how you plan on building off this podcast episode at your session? At our upcoming conference.

Lisa Rehurek : Yeah, absolutely. So, you know, one of the things that I think when I was an evaluator I appreciated was personality. So kind of back to what I was talking about before. Get your personality in there. And everybody’s so scared to do it. They’re so buttoned up because the RFP itself is so buttoned up. It’s like let loose and put some personality in there and maybe, you know, whatever your personality and your culture of your business is, inject it in there because that will the the they will appreciate it. Also storytelling and analogies and metaphors, those are things that they remember more. And remembering is going to help them absorb. One more thing I want to tell you is that 78%, 78% of people are skimmers of readers or skimmers, which means that if you’ve got a massive paragraph, they’re probably not going to read it. 78% of the evaluators are not going to read it. So what can you do to, like, hit on those those important points right out of the gate on the front end. That’s about them and how they’re going to be able to trust you and be excited to work with you. We’ve all seen it in marketing, right? It draws us in and we’re like, oh my God, I have to have that.

Lisa Rehurek : I have to have it now. That’s what that’s kind of the same feel that we want them to have. So, um, did that answer that question, Renita? Okay, great. Um, so then for the event, you know, we’re going to dive deeper into this and we’re going to have some activities so that you are building we’re going to have you build a custom GPT. We’re going to talk a little bit about, um, authority and evidence and building those things. One of the hardest things for smaller businesses is that and a lot of us, we are smaller businesses, not all, but um, and this stays true for everybody, but particularly smaller businesses is that you’ve got to build trust. They’ve got to believe that, that you’re not going to go out of business or that you’re not going to ghost them. There’s more trust with a bigger company. So it’s a little bit of a hurdle that those smaller companies have to to come over. So we want to make sure that you’ve got the authority, you’re showing your thought leadership, you’re showing them that you are the one. And we’re going to dive into that at the conference.

Lee Kantor: Now, is there any pre-work or homework you would like them to do in order to prepare in order to get the most out of the session?

Lisa Rehurek : You know, I think it would be great if they just came with kind of understanding what, you know, making sure that they come with their list of authority. And when I say authority, it’s things like, you know, have you won awards? Have you been quoted in media? Have you? What’s your customer service scores? Things like that. Obviously we’re not going to get everybody to do that because I don’t know how many people are listening to this that are going to actually be there, but it will help you go faster if you bring some of that stuff with you.

Lee Kantor: And then what would be kind of a a reasonable expectation of what they’re going to walk away with at the end of the session?

Lisa Rehurek : I would say that they’ll walk away with a custom GPT. And whether what I don’t know right now is if we’re going to all have Wi-Fi access. Um, so they might have to to do it manually and then go put it into ChatGPT or their system afterwards. Um, and then they’ll also walk out with, you know, some good thought leadership statements that they can use, that they can plug and play into proposals as well as their evidence and authority to build that trust.

Lee Kantor: And if somebody wants to learn more about the RFP success Company, is there a website? Is there a best way to connect with you or somebody on your team?

Lisa Rehurek : Yeah, absolutely. I mean, you can always go to our website, the RFP success Company.com. Um, I’d love for people to connect with me on LinkedIn. I’m just Lisa r e h u r e k I’m the only one. Um, and yeah, I’d love to connect with anybody, uh, that that wants to connect. And we, we do a lot of, um, we do a lot of blogs and we do a lot of free information and webinars and things like that to help teach people. So the website’s a great place to start for that.

Lee Kantor: And Renita, one more time, the coordinates of the event.

Renita Manley: Yes, it is December 16th through the 18th in Scottsdale, Arizona. So if you have not purchased your tickets to attend, make sure you do so immediately because it is going to be fantastic. I’m actually going to be there this year and I’m excited about that. So I get to meet some weebs. But yeah, um, come on out. Get ready. Um, make sure you have your pen and pad and everything together. So if you go to Lisa’s workshop, you are ready the next time it comes around for you.

Lisa Rehurek : Yeah. And I’ll also do a quick little plug. I’ve been going to this conference for years. It’s so phenomenal, you guys. I mean, obviously the content itself, but also just connecting with other women, business, enterprise, women, it’s a community that supports it’s just been such a phenomenal community and we need that in our lives. So I hope to see you there.

Renita Manley: Thank you, thank you. Yeah. In an RFP game is growing and changing rapidly. So I really do suggest you all, um, come on to the conference and come to these RFP workshops, because from what I’m seeing, it is the change is lightning fast. And evaluators are very savvy and so are corporations and companies needs. They’re very savvy. Things are changing. Local, local, local. You gotta come out and get all those other tips.

Lisa Rehurek : Yes.

Lee Kantor: Well.

Renita Manley: For me, Lee.

Lee Kantor: All right. Well, Lisa, thank you so much for sharing your story today. You’re doing such important work, and we appreciate you.

Lisa Rehurek : Thank you.

Lee Kantor: All right. This is Lee Kantor for Renita Manley. We’ll see you all next time on Women in Motion.

Tagged With: The RFP Success Company

Yara Banks with BNX Business Advisors

September 26, 2025 by angishields

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Houston Business Radio
Yara Banks with BNX Business Advisors
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Yara-BanksYara Banks is a resilient and visionary leader with over 25 years of experience in human resources, leadership development, and business operations.

As the CEO of BNX Business Advisors, a certified small business consultancy, Yara partners with small and mid-sized companies to build strong HR infrastructures, develop high-performing teams, and prepare for contract readiness in competitive markets.

She is also the creator of Lead Like a Black Belt™, a transformative leadership development program that brings martial arts principles—discipline, focus, and resilience—into the boardroom. A national karate champion, Yara uses her journey and training to help business leaders overcome challenges with clarity and strength.

Beyond consulting, Yara is a dynamic speaker, author, and philanthropist who delivers impactful workshops and keynotes on leadership, equity, and employee engagement. Her mission is to empower business leaders to grow their companies with purpose and create inclusive workplace cultures that thrive.

Upcoming Event: The Pivot Principle – Navigating Change in Uncertain Times

Yara will also be featured in The Pivot Principle, an engaging online event focused on helping professionals navigate change during uncertain times. Join her and other expert speakers for real-life insights, strategic tools, and inspiration to help you embrace transformation and thrive.

🗓️ Date: Register Now on Eventbrite
Don’t miss this opportunity to connect, learn, and lead with renewed confidence.

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/yarabanksmba/
Website: http://www.bnxba.com

Transcript-iconThis transcript is machine transcribed by Sonix

 

TRANSCRIPT

Intro: Broadcasting live from the Business RadioX studios in Houston, Texas. It’s time for Houston Business Radio. Now, here’s your host.

Trisha Stetzel: Hello, Houston. Trisha Stetzel here bringing you another episode of Houston Business Radio. Today’s guest is Yara Banks, entrepreneur, HR strategist, and CEO of BNX Business Advisors. With more than 25 years of experience in human resources, leadership development and business operations, Yara helps small and midsize businesses build strong HR foundations, prepare for contracts, and scale with confidence. She’s also the creator of Lead Like a Black Belt. We’re going to talk a little bit more about that. It’s a leadership program inspired by her own journey as a national karate champion, where she applies discipline, focus and resilience to the business world. Yara’s work is all about helping entrepreneurs avoid costly mistakes, lead high performing teams, and seize opportunities for long term growth. Yara, welcome to the show.

Yara Banks: Thank you so much, Trisha. It’s a pleasure to be here. I am honored and I’m super excited about it. I come with a lot of energy. Listen, I I’m pumped. I’m pumped. Good.

Speaker4: I’m glad it’s coming through the screen. I can feel it because I’ve got some here, too, so I’m not stealing yours. I’m bringing some energy to you. All right.

Trisha Stetzel: All right, so, Yara, tell us a little bit more about who you are and how you found yourself in the business that you’re in.

Yara Banks: Sure. So I am Yara Banks. I’m the CEO of Bnc’s Business Advisors. Um, all the things that she said that you already said about my business. It’s true. But the easiest way to say it is we sell profit protection. We sell profit protection. So we stop organizations from leaving money on the table or watching it walk out the door by reinforcing their HR infrastructures, right. Working on their leadership and their people strategies. So that’s any size business, right? So I just want you to know that, like, we want to work with people who want change and to want to, um, to, uh, what’s the word I’m looking for? You know what? When you get older, this is what happens, right? So we want people who want to work with us. Let’s just leave it at that. So I live in Jacksonville, Florida, but my client base is from sea to shining sea all over the country. Um, we, um, are prided. We pride ourselves in having partners where we and we have about 10 to 12 different associates throughout the country. So we have partners that can go and be kind of like released into different areas of the country in order to do what we do. Um, I am a wife and I am a mom of six.

Yara Banks: Ranging from age 34 to 11 year old twins. I am a homeschool mom. Um, like you said, I do have multiple businesses. Um, so I stay. Oh, I stay busy. And for hobby, I happen to do karate. So at age 48, I walked into a karate studio. Um, thinking to myself, so this is how we we trick ourselves. Thinking to myself, I want to do some exercise. I want some me time. I’m looking for that work life harmony, but I don’t, I don’t I’m not going to tell anybody. I’m not going to tell anybody because this is my thing. It belongs to me. No one else’s business. That’s the lie I was telling myself. At the end of the day, I was lying to myself. I didn’t tell anybody because if I told someone, that meant I couldn’t quit. If I wanted to, I would have no accountability, right? So I didn’t tell anybody, but I didn’t want to quit. It was so fabulous. So at 48, I started less than a year later, at 49, I was a world bronze medalist champion of karate. And then in July of this year, right after my 50th birthday, a two time national bronze medal champion in karate, and I have learned so much from the martial arts that I started lead like a black belt.

Yara Banks: There are principles within and disciplines within martial arts that transcend over into leadership characteristics, characteristics of good leaders. And so I wanted to bring those out things like trust, focus, discipline, humility, those things that are needed to be a good leader are also principles that stand out in martial arts. Plus, aren’t we all tired of the regular leadership development training? The same in one ear, out the other? Be good to people you know. Mind your manners that that plane stuff. So. And lead like a black belt. We we have different levels of belts. There’s six belts altogether. Each belt is a standalone so they’re not necessarily built upon one another. So for instance our white belt is emotional intelligence okay. We have a yellow belt. That’s communication. Our green belts accountability. Brown is strategic planning. So you can take different belts by themselves. Or you can take the entire all the way to a black belt. A black belt will get you all of those. Right. And so what’s cool about it is it’s transformational. People really are engaged. I wear my whole karate uniform. Trisha. We break actual wood in there. Okay.

Speaker4: Yes.

Yara Banks: Those are breakthroughs that we need. We actually sometimes need to feel the breakthrough that we. So we can manifest it for real. Right? Sometimes we just think, oh, be great if we can get past this. But when you can break that board, you you get that manifestation right then and there. And the energy is just amazing behind that and people really feel empowered by doing that. Now, of course, you gotta sign your disclaimers because we’re all business people, right? So I’m just saying.

Trisha Stetzel: Be careful breaking that board. I’m just saying.

Yara Banks: And in all in all seriousness, I tell I tell them whoever volunteers to do it, I say this every time. Do you believe you can do this? Yes. Because if you do not believe you can do this, you will hurt yourself.

Trisha Stetzel: Mhm.

Yara Banks: More importantly, or as importantly, if you make me believe you can’t do this, I will get hurt.

Trisha Stetzel: That’s right. And then you can’t do it like right. No time out. Someone else get in line.

Yara Banks: Right. Exactly. So you have to be very confident that if you’re going to do this, that you believe that you can do it. And even if you believe you can do it and you don’t do it the first time, guess what? Do it again. Because guess what? A lot of times don’t happen. Things don’t happen the first time we try it. So every time though, they’ve done it, the first time, every single time. I haven’t had one where someone hasn’t broken it. So that’s really that’s really encouraging. It’s empowering. And you should see just the I don’t know how to put it the energy, the the the feel. Everybody in the room explodes and cheers. And I’m like, it’s really something we want to see people do anyway. I think it’s important because like I said, it’s transformational. We give them tips. They can leave today and go back to their office and implement today. Um, and then we do follow ups with them, not just a one and done. I want to see how you’re doing 30 days from now or 90 days from now. What’s changed for you? What do your people say have changed for you? Right. That’s what’s going to be important. My, um, one of the things that I am certified in is, uh, EQ, which is emotional intelligence.

Yara Banks: And so I give assessments, uh, but not just for the individual leader, but also for teams, but also as a 360, which means your spouse if you want your family, if you want your direct reports, your peers and your bosses. What do people what does everyone think about you and how you’re doing? And that really gives you some perspective into things that you have an opportunity to improve, or areas where you’re doing really well. So all of that plays a role in like being a great leader. Like it really does. So there’s that. Um, besides leadership development, which is something that’s near and dear to my heart, um, we do all other HR stuff too, like the whole infrastructure piece. Um, we were just talking about the leadership development because I think that’s the biggest piece of it. I believe that’s the biggest piece because you could get all the infrastructure together. But if folks have no leadership, they don’t know what they’re doing. They’re not skilled. It’s all going to fall down anyways. So those leaderships help build that strong foundation that the infrastructure is built on.

Trisha Stetzel: Yeah, that’s absolutely true. So one, you guys, if you want to see Yara and her karate uniform, she you can go to her LinkedIn page. You just look up Yara Banks m b and you will find on her picture she’s wearing her karate uniform. She’s not wearing it today. She looks beautiful today, but she wasn’t ready to come be, uh, do lead like a black belt.

Yara Banks: I might have it behind me. I could always go.

Trisha Stetzel: I, I love this, so, um. Yara, I would love to take a little bit of a dive into the HR space, because I know you help small to medium sized businesses. And many of us who are small business owners, small to medium sized business owners may bury our head in the sand when it comes to HR because it’s scary to most of us, and you’ve been in that business for a very long time, and now you use your skills with small to medium sized business owners. So what would you say to the business owner who is terrified of HR? Just when you say it.

Yara Banks: Get help.

Trisha Stetzel: Mhm.

Yara Banks: I’m going to tell you to get help. Um, it is an area that a lot of people are afraid to touch, and it has to do with their level of confidence. Right. If you’re a barber, you cut hair really well, but you don’t do the other things necessarily. Well get help. If you are sick, you go to the doctor. If you have tax problems, you get an accountant, right? So go get help. Now people say, oh, it’s unaffordable or whatever. I promise you that. A couple of hours with a consultant like me is a heck of a lot cheaper than a lawsuit. I promise. Right. So, you know, get help to at least get the fundamentals. Like, at least get your your your handbook down. Get some forms. I work with the company who came to me. They had 50 employees in 12 states. Trisha. Wow. 12 states. Every state has its own employment laws. Okay. Right. 50 employees. They all work remotely, and they’ve been working for two years. No HR infrastructure. When I tell you she didn’t even have a job application. At all. Wow. So I had to reverse engineer an entire HR department for them to be compliant. I’d rather not do it that way, but I can if I have to.

Trisha Stetzel: And it’s okay. We have to start somewhere, right? Right. And some of us are starting from ground zero, and it’s absolutely okay to be at ground Zero.

Yara Banks: To work with Trisha, to be honest with you, because you can get that foundation and from the start and people don’t realize your HR foundation is where your culture comes from. Built off your core values, your mission and vision and why you got started. All of that’s part of your culture. So if you can start that as early as possible, you really need to have policies and handbooks and all of that established before you bring on even one person. You really do. So it’s okay. I like working with the smaller companies because it’s easier to make change. If I went into Amazon talking about, hey, we need to change your culture. You know how long that would take? You see what I’m saying? So really, it’s important to get it in early. And if you have started and you haven’t started perfectly or you have challenges or there’s some compliance issues, get an audit. There’s easy compliance audits that you can get. Get an audit to see where you stand, what you need to work on. But turning your back to it, not addressing it is going to cost you money, and it’s going to cost you more time in the long run. At the end of the day, as as founders and the C-suite, the owners. Right? Our job is to be working on the business, not in the business. You hear it all the time, right? So we need to be working on revenue generating activities, not necessarily managing people. And so if you have a handbook, your handbook should manage your people. It should tell you what to do in case. So if this happens or that happens you’re not losing sleep trying to figure out what should I do.

Yara Banks: You’re being consistent. Your policies and your and your cultures being consistently applied to everyone across the board. Because all I’m doing is what does the handbook say about that? What does my policy say about that? Okay, so you’re not running the risk of treating one person different than the other. You know what compliance is supposed to be. You know how you’re supposed to flow through different processes. So yes, get help if you don’t know. I mean, uh, I hate to say this, but even if you have to go to YouTube University, I hate to say it, but even if you have to do something to show that you’re trying to get it together, meet with consultants because most of I can’t speak for anybody else. For me, my initial conversations are free. I don’t charge for those. Okay. Just to kind of give you an idea of where you are and what you need to work on, because why I want to make it accessible to all people. At the end of the day, it’s not just you as an owner and a founder. You have a fiduciary responsibility to all stakeholders, and that includes your employees. That includes the people who help build your organization. Whoever you have loans out to, like you have to be successful, right? And even your family who helps support you through this? Those are stakeholders too. So you want to do it right. And then and then with that, think about the worst boss you ever had, the worst place you ever worked. And when you think about that, the next thing you want to do is not be that.

Speaker5: Mhm.

Yara Banks: Right. So get stuff in order. Get your house in order so that you can prepare, Prepare to bring more people on because you need those more people for growth, but you want them to stay. You want them to be loyal long. They want to feel valued. You want them to help you create this, this dream that you, that you’ve made. You want it to be a reality. And you need people to do that. So you they are your biggest assets and so they should be treated as such.

Speaker5: Um.

Trisha Stetzel: It I love that you say just ask for help. And so many of us are reluctant to do that because we feel, I think the mindset around that is that we are weak because we need help. It’s actually shows strength when we reach out for help, and it also shows knowledge that we are not know it alls. We’re good at what we do in our businesses, so we need people like you, Yara, to come in and help us with the things that we aren’t so good at. And by the way, you guys know judgment. Yah’s going to come in and have a conversation with, you know, judgment and where you’re at. And she’s going to help you get where you need to go. So Yara, if people are already interested in having a conversation with you, what is the best way to connect?

Yara Banks: They can connect on all social media channels. Um, our website is Binks ba bas business advisor. So Binks com so W-w-w binks.com or our phone number is (904) 345-0070. So any way you want to reach out, I’m happy to have a conversation with you. But I need you to know, like she said, no judgment. You have to start somewhere. Every little bit helps. And guess what? You as a leader are being watched. Humility, right? To say, hey, I need help. Honesty and transparency are key drivers of leadership success, and the people around you are watching that. That’s huge. It is. So, you know, go ahead.

Trisha Stetzel: No, please keep going.

Yara Banks: I’ll say I was going to say their their professional development. It is our responsibility to continue to learn. As long as we have breath in our bodies, we need to continue to learn. Everybody, I have a coach. Okay. I have a mentor. Everybody should have a mentor. Should have a coach, should have somebody who’s helping them. Because you cannot be the smartest person in the room. And if you are, you’re in the wrong doggone room.

Trisha Stetzel: This is why I love you, Yara. I know all, all of the listeners who know me well know that I say that all the time. You can. All of the people that you allow in your room need to be bigger, better, faster, stronger, and smarter than you.

Yara Banks: Absolutely.

Trisha Stetzel: Or you need to go find new friends.

Yara Banks: Exactly how can you grow and hold you accountable and hold you.

Trisha Stetzel: And hold you accountable?

Yara Banks: Yeah, I started a group of of girlfriends who were all on their own businesses. It’s called feet to the fire. I hold your feet to the fire. So we get together on a quarterly basis and. Okay. What are your goals? What’s your Q1 goal? Q2, Q3, Q4 what’s happening? How’s it going? What are your wins? What are your opportunities? So be able to hold each other accountable.

Trisha Stetzel: Absolutely. All right you guys you you know that I will put your contact information in the show notes. So all you have to do is point and click. Yara I also know that you have some events coming up. So tell us about those.

Yara Banks: Okay. So virtually we have an event coming up on October 15th called the Pivot principle. Right. What small businesses need to know in these uncertain times. So what is pivoting? When are you ready to pivot? What does that look like? How can we pivot? Maybe we don’t have additional resources. How do we pull it from inside and pivot. Knowing your customer, knowing what the market’s doing. All of that. So that’s one. And that’s free. That’s free to attend. And then the second one is called Workplace Peace in a World on Fire. Now that one is about conflict resolution. Think about the world we live in and everything outside the four walls of our office building, everything going on and it is being dragged into the workplace. Okay, so how do we manage that? How do we how do we, um, allow for some sentiment of you being yourself, but then allow for productivity and lack of conflict within the workplace? Now that one is, um, a fee of just $59 or we have a buy two get one free special that you can get for that. But that one’s October 22nd. And I think it’s huge, especially the world we’re living in. I did one similar to that about a year ago, and that’s when we just were dealing with Israel and Palestine. It was, it was it was that much into the workplace. Now add that on to Russia, Ukraine. A lot of the political stuff going on, everything else. And it’s in the workplace. And so how do we maintain peace when the whole world around us is in fire on fire?

Trisha Stetzel: I love this, thank you for bringing these amazing opportunities out. Yara, you guys, again, Yara is going to send me these links. I’m going to put them in the show notes. And you can also connect with her through DM or conversations as these are posted out on social. I know Yara will respond to you guys so that you can get signed up for those classes. If it’s okay, I’d like to circle back to where we began. Which is your lead? Like a black belt program. I heard you talk about the two two parts of your program that I’m really interested in, which is, uh, emotional intelligence and communication. I think this plays a role in everything that we’ve talked about today. Can we talk about the importance of understanding where we are with emotional intelligence, and what do we do with the data that we gather from that?

Yara Banks: Okay. So with emotional intelligence, first of all, it starts with being introspective, looking at yourself. What are my triggers? What? What things you know are my buttons that get pushed? And how do my emotions play a role in my decisions? Then look outward and try to identify the same thing for other people around you. You get to know you build rapport. You know people around you. Let’s talk about a team. Like in a work environment, okay. You get to know those people around you, and you know that Susie tends to be a little more sensitive. So if you need to give her feedback on her work, you’re going to you’re going to maybe shoot the breeze a little bit. How was the weekend? And then kind of ease onto it, right. But then there’s Stephanie, and she’s thick as thieves and she doesn’t care. Just spit it out. What do you want? Stopping me in my day. What do you want? And you just let her know what it is. So you have to have an idea about your people. And then you. You can identify how I can deliver. Talk about communication. Deliver information that will be received the way it’s intended to be received. Like I tell people all the time, you have to like, we talk about buy in. For instance, you talk about getting buy in. If I decide in my company that I’m going in, I’m going to pivot. I’m going to go in a different direction. And some of my team members don’t agree that that’s the right way to go. It’s okay as long as you understand this is the way we’re going. You understand why we’re doing it, how we’re doing it, and how it impacts you. You don’t have to agree agreements, not part of the requirement to understand. So there are some leaders that get in trouble because they’re trying to be everyone’s friends. Oh, we’re just like a family. That’s one of the ones that I know. Red flags all over the place. Right.

Speaker5: Mhm.

Yara Banks: Because we will let our family treat us some ways that we wouldn’t let strangers treat us. So if you say just like a family I guarantee you we’ve got problems I guarantee. Right. So, so with that being said, we’re too, you know, we know too much. I want you to have a rapport. But your employees are not your friends. They should not be your friends. There’s there’s a boundary that goes there. So when it’s when, like, I worked at a, at a client one time, they had a lady who’d been there for 22 years, but she only came to work on Fridays for three hours because that’s all she wanted to work. And they didn’t want to go ahead and cut, cut her and let somebody else work full time in that slot, because she only has two more years till retirement. We’re just going to let her ride it out, okay? You know, she’s she’s a widow now. She’s just like family. We’re just going to let her work three hours a week, pay her full time until her retirement.

Speaker5: Oof! Okay.

Yara Banks: That kind of stuff. Right? So we can’t do that. Oh, well, Susie doesn’t come to work on time. She’s late like an hour, almost three times a week. But she’s got kids. So many people have kids who come to work on time. Like, we have to be able to have those tough conversations, and it takes us and we’re not having them because of our lack of confidence.

Speaker5: Mhm.

Yara Banks: That’s why that’s why we avoid conflict is because of our own insecurities. And by the way telling someone about themselves. No I don’t want to say it like that because I’m just kidding. But giving someone feedback right. Constructive feedback. Yeah. It’s not a conflict.

Speaker5: Mhm.

Yara Banks: Conflict. The word conflict is has a negative connotation around it. Right. But to tell you as your leader that I need something different from you is helping you grow. That’s not conflict. So people say, oh, that’s conflict. I’m trying to avoid conflict. That’s not conflict. That’s your job. That’s your responsibility to help me lead and grow. So, Introspectively, what is it about me that’s blocking me? Where’s the barrier that’s stopping me from having these true, sincere, authentic conversations with my people? They’re going to help me grow, help my organization grow. What is what’s within me that’s stopping me? Is it fear of rejection? Oh, they’re not going to like me anymore. They’re going to think I’m picking on them. Is it fear of of of them? Of their response? They might get angry at me. You know what? What is it? Do you not have the skills to have communication in a conversation that might be sensitive? Then you need some training and it’s okay. You need training. It’s okay. The ability to make the the decisions that. Yes, Susie, who works on Friday three days a week, she’s gotta go. We appreciate her 22 years. But in order for this, for this organization to move forward, we need that full time salary to put somebody in there to get that production. It’s not personal. It’s business.

Speaker5: That’s right. All people.

Trisha Stetzel: Yeah. And all of those things damage the culture as you were talking about earlier. Right. Um, because the people. Yeah. That’s right. People on the outside looking in are going, well, they’re getting special treatment or you’re doing something different with that person. Well, why can’t I have some of that? And, um, I. Yeah. Okay. So are you going to have to come back? We have to have a whole nother conversation about hard conversations. Yes. I think this is a big deal. Uh, and I know we’re already out of time, but I’ve got one last question for you. You are a superwoman.

Speaker5: You have kids, you’re homeschooling.

Trisha Stetzel: You run a business. You have you have this beautiful multiple programs. But this beautiful program lead like a black belt. You’re doing events. You also are a champion in this fun thing that you decided to do just a couple of years ago. Karate. How do you do it all? How do you balance everything? And what advice would you give to the women out there who are listening, saying, I could never do all of the things that Yara is doing?

Yara Banks: First of all, never compare yourself to someone else, okay? That’s number one. Number two, it is not a balance. It’s in harmony. It’s a harmony. Okay? So some days I’m in my office till 9 p.m. and I get to spend the time with the kids and my husband the way I want to. Or I miss out on the movie night because I’m in here working. It’s. It’s in harmony. You have to have the support of your family so they understand the main goal. Your why of what you’re doing has to be so big. My, why is if my six kids can watch me build something out of nothing, then they know they can too. And that’s big enough to keep me going, right? I do my karate as a way to do my. For me, that’s my self-care. Um, I try to incorporate the family members into the different things that I do like, if especially we do also a lot of community service at banks. So like hurricane comes, we will load up a U-Haul truck and take it to wherever it needs to be. And we do back to school drives and all that. I incorporate the kids and my family into those things so that they are still spending time with me. Um, but don’t let it be a barrier that because you’re a mom, you still can’t go be great. You can still go be great. Um, as a mom, even as a single mom, you could still go be great. Um, and so I want to encourage people to not let that be a barrier. And if you have that barrier and get a piece of wood and smash it, I was looking for a piece of wood and smash that barrier, because it is not something that’s going to hold you back unless you let it. Your only limit is your mind. Your limit is your mind.

Trisha Stetzel: And who’s in your room?

Speaker5: Yes. Yeah.

Trisha Stetzel: Because you need that support. Oh my gosh. Yeah. This has been so much fun. Thank you so much for joining me. I can’t wait to have you back. And I want to talk about having hard conversations.

Speaker5: When you come back. Absolutely.

Yara Banks: Absolutely.

Trisha Stetzel: Tell everyone how they can reach out to you in the best ways to connect.

Yara Banks: Sure. All outlets on social media, Facebook, LinkedIn, um, Instagram. I think we have a TikTok now. I’m excited about that. We do have YouTube, so there’s videos where you can see me breaking stuff if you like. Um. Um. Phone number is (904) 345-0070. And, um, our website is ww.com. And for those of you who like to read, I do have a book, my second book out called The Executive Blind Spot How misalignment with HR can, um, impact your Bottom line. So all of that’s available, um, for you guys as resources and tools. And I look forward to speaking with you again, Trisha. I look forward to speaking with members of your audience. I really am truly humbled to be a part of the show today.

Trisha Stetzel: Thank you. It’s been my pleasure. Can they find your book on your website, or do they need.

Speaker5: To go to another.

Trisha Stetzel: Outlet?

Speaker5: Okay, fantastic.

Trisha Stetzel: So you guys go right over to Yara’s website to find all of the resources that she’s talked about today. And of course, I will include the event resources as well in the show notes. And you can go to Bnc’s NBA.com. Or you can find Yara on social y a b a n k s m b a. That’s specifically on LinkedIn. Yara, thank you again for your time today.

Yara Banks: Thank you Trisha I appreciate it.

Trisha Stetzel: That’s all the time we have for today. If you found value in this conversation that I had with Yara, please share it with a fellow entrepreneur, veteran or Houston leader ready to grow. And be sure to follow, rate, and review the show. It helps us reach more bold business minds just like yours. Your business, your leadership and your legacy are built one intentional step at a time. So stay inspired, stay focused, and keep building the business and the life you deserve.

 

Tagged With: BNX Business Advisors

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