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Search Results for: kids care

Marketing Magic: Turning Your Story into Sales

August 8, 2025 by Jacob Lapera

High Velocity Radio
High Velocity Radio
Marketing Magic: Turning Your Story into Sales
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In this episode of High Velocity Radio, Lee Kantor interviews Arias WebsterBerry, CEO of WebsterBerry Marketing, about effective marketing strategies for small to mid-sized businesses. Arias shares his journey from entertainment promotion to digital marketing, emphasizing the power of authentic storytelling, content creation, and leveraging AI. He discusses the importance of having a dedicated marketing budget, offers practical budgeting guidelines, and illustrates success through client case studies. 

Arias WebsterBerry is a seasoned entrepreneur and digital marketing expert with over a decade of experience building revenue-generating brands. As Founder and CEO of  WebsterBerry Marketing, he has led hundreds of clients to measurable success through tailored services in web design, sales funnels, social media, CRM, email marketing, and branding.

He is also the creator of Launch Ignition AI, an innovative business accelerator that automates website, funnel, and campaign creation in minutes, helping clients achieve up to 312% lead growth and 5× revenue increases. He’s launched multiple ventures, including Ignite Funnels, and authored Content Cannon, which guides entrepreneurs in generating a month’s worth of content in a single day.

As a certified Scrum Master and Master Sales Coach, Arias has personally mentored over 400 professionals, driving more than $112 million in cumulative client revenue. His leadership extends beyond marketing, he served as Executive Producer of the acclaimed Hip Hop 101 Music & Art Festival, earning a commendation from the Los Angeles City Council for its cultural impact.

With a global perspective shaped by travel through 25 countries and 35 U.S. states , Arias combines strategic vision, agile frameworks, and creative storytelling to build human-centered, scalable growth systems. His work empowers entrepreneurs to elevate their brand visibility, implement culture-driven marketing, and realize meaningful business results.

Connect with Arias on LinkedIn.

What You’ll Learn in This Episode

  • Scaling through AI powered marketing
  • Authentic content that converts
  • Purpose driven leadership in business
  • Building culture & systems that scale

Transcript-iconThis transcript is machine transcribed by Sonix.

 

TRANSCRIPT

Intro: Broadcasting live from the Business RadioX studios in Atlanta, Georgia. It’s time for High Velocity Radio.

Lee Kantor: Lee Kantor hear another episode of High Velocity Radio and this is going to be a good one. Today on the show, we have Arias WebsterBerry and he is the CEO of WebsterBerry Marketing. Welcome.

Arias WebsterBerry: Hey, Lee. Thank you for having me.

Lee Kantor: Well, I’m excited to learn what you’re up to. Tell us about your firm. How are you serving folks?

Arias WebsterBerry: We are helping people generate leads and turn those leads into dollars to keep it short.

Lee Kantor: So what’s your backstory? How’d you get involved in this line of work?

Arias WebsterBerry: Actually, I hail from the the land of entertainment. I started out as a promoter, starting with, you know, nightclubs and parties and in San Diego and in Los Angeles. And then I actually ended up getting into large scale concerts and executive producing festivals.

Lee Kantor: And then so from those learnings, you were able to kind of develop some marketing strategies for small to mid-sized businesses.

Arias WebsterBerry: Yeah. You know, in doing all of these things, I learned quite a bit about the various components and disciplines and marketing, you know, whether that be, uh, social media, you know, outdoor. So, you know, billboards, print, radio, TV and, you know, content creation and, you know, all the various things that that it takes. And eventually we got into websites and funnels and automation and now I but all those things and kind of all those things that I had to learn in order to throw concerts, I was able to translate into marketing. I went to work for a really large digital marketing agency, and that’s where I kind of got my formal training. And then I struck out on my own and and I created this company.

Lee Kantor: So now in marketing in today’s world, is it do you need to have just boatloads of money in order to effectively kind of rise above the noise, or is it something that you can kind of grind and scale on your own without kind of big mega marketing budgets?

Arias WebsterBerry: Well, I mean, boatloads of cash definitely helps, but it is not a prerequisite to to define success. These days, I think one of the great equalizers in kind of a gray box when it comes to leveling the playing field between the haves and have nots, or those that, you know, may have very large marketing budgets and those that are just getting started and have very small or no marketing budget is the ability to create things that people are interested in, i.e. content. So, you know, in everybody’s pocket is a cell phone, and most of those phones shoot pretty good. You know, quality, as long as you got some decent lighting and a microphone, it really comes down to your your creativity, your ability to tell. You know you or your brand’s story in a way that resonates with your audience and more importantly, explains that you understand their pains, their struggles, and that you have a solution and you’ve got some proof of concept and that you get people results.

Lee Kantor: So how does it differ when you started in a kind of event in entertainment? How does kind of that B2C environment where I want you to listen to my music or if I’m a comedian, you know, listen to my jokes versus I’m a business, you know, I’m a plumber. Uh, you know, how do I how do I kind of get the same attention, if that’s even possible in kind of a B2B world versus a B2C world?

Arias WebsterBerry: Great question actually. Um, you know, I think that that a lot of businesses, um, go wrong in thinking that they’re different, you know, the same way a, um, country artist or a actor. To, um, entertains and draws their audience in is the same. It’s the same thing that you should be doing with your business, you know? Um, you know, an actor plays a character in a movie, and there’s a lot of, you know, things that are set up in, in, um, money and people around in order to cultivate a specific scene that elicits an emotion. Uh, and as a business owner, you need to be doing the same thing. What you notice is that more and more consumers are looking into the personal lives of these these entertainers, right. They want to know what happens once the camera and the lights go off. And that is true for business, right? People want to know who the people are behind the brand. They want to know about the the pains, the struggles. You know, the the, as we say, the behind the scenes. Um, they they want to know how the sausage is made. And, you know, they, they want that so that they feel confident and comfortable doing business with you. But then on the front end, they also want to be entertained, right? They want to root for you. They want to know about your business. And, um. Gary Vee said it best. If you haven’t realized that every single business is a publishing company first that happens to do a thing, well, then you are behind and you’re looking through the prism, uh, at the wrong end.

Lee Kantor: So if you were a business coach, how would you kind of market yourself? Um, you know, to to get the eyeballs, you need to eventually move some of those people from kind of just, uh, lookers to buyers.

Arias WebsterBerry: Yeah. I would start with my my story. Right. Um, you know, every every great story, every hero’s journey has a beginning, right? What’s your beginning? Where did you come from? Right. Even in this this, um, podcast, this episode, right? You started by asking me, where did I start, right? Because nobody wants to know what you know until they know that you care. So I would start by telling people where I come from and how I came up on the skills and the knowledge that I have that can help them. Right. Tell that story as to how I came to this aha moment that that gives me the right and the validity to advise them, to coach them, to to guide them.

Lee Kantor: So in your business, how do you, um, kind of deliver the value? Is it consulting? Is it coaching? Is it. Do you actually kind of do work on behalf of your clients? Like what is the deliverable from your end?

Arias WebsterBerry: All of the above. I have three separate companies that do all of those things. So, um, you know, kind of at the beginning of the the process is what we have, uh, one of my businesses is called Launch Ignition I and it is a system that is designed to help people build businesses, how to structure them, sequence them, and get them ready to scale to six figures and beyond. And then we have Ignite Funnels, which is a all in one business management and marketing system. So you know, your website, your payment processing, email, text marketing, all the different things. And we help people build those, set them up, customize them. And then once you have that machine built, well then my agency Webster Marketing, we help to drive traffic and convert that traffic into leads. So, you know, whether you, um, have a business idea and you need help fleshing it out and turning it into an actual business. If you have a business set up and maybe it’s got a lot of manual processes and not a lot of, uh, customization or automation, then, you know, Ignite Funnels is great for that. And if you’ve got those two pieces in place, but you still are not seeing the results that you want in your business, well, Webster marketing can help you generate traffic and turn that traffic into revenue.

Lee Kantor: So now let’s talk a little bit about AI. You mentioned it earlier. How would you go about kind of leveraging AI right now? Is it primarily on the creating content side, or can you use it in all kind of the pillars that you had described of your organization? Could you. Could you use AI to, um, you know, create eyeballs to your content or is it just for creating the content?

Arias WebsterBerry: Uh, we utilize AI and basically every part of our business. Um, you know, uh, logic has an AI component at its center and it’s core. Uh, with ignite funnels, we utilize it to, um, automate messages and analyze data and respond to people. We also use it to help create, uh, funnels and websites. Uh, and then on the agency side, we build very complex, um, chat bots and um, uh, AI enabled chat bots and in omnichannel, uh, conversations. Um, and then we also use it for engagement. Right? We use AI to analyze data. When we’re running ads. We use AI to, um, elicit responses from people. So, um, the great thing about AI is, you know, it’s about precision, personalization and performance. You know, it allows us to move from guesswork to, uh, data driven decisions, and it ensures that every one of our marketing moves is purposeful and precise.

Lee Kantor: Now, is it possible to kind of grow and scale a business in today’s world without using paid? Can you just rely solely on organic?

Arias WebsterBerry: Uh, absolutely. There are lots of people that do it. Um, you know, it’s just and this is this is the part that that nobody really wants to talk about. Are you actually that That’s interesting. You know, if you’re if you’re not going to pay to play, if you’re not going to pay for a certain number of people to see your message and you want people to find it organically, is your content good enough to to make people want to opt in? You know, do you create things that are valuable enough, entertaining enough, informative enough that it makes people of their own free will decide to watch you instead of, you know, uh, Paris Hilton or Beyoncé, right? Uh, do they see that in Scroll Pass and look at yours? Click engage in want uh, to come back for more? And if it’s not, well then you probably need to go with that.

Lee Kantor: So how would you go about if you were um, say that business coach out there and you were creating this authentic content, which I’m sure you’re a believer, right? The content has to be authentic. It can’t be just some make believe thing that doesn’t connect with you or your business, so it has to be somewhat personal and authentic. How do you like what’s the low hanging fruit for that individual? What like where would you begin a content journey?

Arias WebsterBerry: Uh, like I said, just your origin story, right? Uh, whether it’s, I mean, whatever approach you decide to take, whether it’s comedy or drama or, you know, somewhere in between, I think it’s very important for you to get your story out there. Um, you know, are you telling me that you are, uh, the greatest coach in the world? Um. That’s great. There’s a million of you on YouTube, TikTok, Facebook, Instagram, uh, in your local networking event that are saying the exact same thing. Uh, what separates you from them in that the the the that separator is your story, right? What did you go through that qualifies you to be the person that can tell me anything. Literally anything. Um, you know my story. Uh, I came from nothing. I, I have been homeless. I’ve been bankrupt. I, um, you know, come from a single parent home. Uh, I lost my father when I was, like, 14 to police violence. You know, I had nothing. I had no support system. But somehow I’ve been able to build three, you know, seven figure businesses. Uh, I’ve been able to teach myself coding in websites. And now I have 27 employees on three different continents. Uh, if somebody asks me how or why I feel I’m qualified to teach you about entrepreneurship or why they should listen to me when it comes to scaling a business, well, you can just look at my track record and everything I just said is is valid.

Arias WebsterBerry: You know, you can validate it. There’s proof online, right, that everything that I’m saying is true. You know, we’ve helped generate over $112 $12 million in revenue for our clients. Those are the things that’s that’s my story. That’s where I come from. Those are the things that I’ve done. That’s where rubber meets the road. And I think that a lot of times when people are creating content, uh, they don’t want to get into that. Right? They want the fluff. They just. Oh, hey, look at me. And my kids were out for, um, a walk with our dogs. And, uh, hey, here’s a flier of my business and my products and my services you should buy from me. Nobody cares. Right? They don’t want to know what you know until they know that you care. Uh, and they know that you care. If you can level with them and be honest about where you come from. Good. Better and different.

Lee Kantor: Now. I mean, now that you’ve established yourself and have a track record of success, it’s easier to kind of lean on on that. How would you have done it at the beginning, or how did you do it at the beginning, when you didn’t have that, when you were homeless, when you were bankrupt, when you didn’t have maybe the industry connections you have now. Um, how do you build before you have established yourself as an expert like you obviously have?

Arias WebsterBerry: That’s a great question. And honestly, if I could go back, I would do what I’m about to tell you now. I would document the process. I, I fell prey to thinking this, this antiquated mode of thinking that I need to have it all figured out. And I have to have the fancy car and the big house and, you know, the celebrity friends and, you know, the seven figure, uh, bank account before I can advise people. And the reality is, nothing could be further from the truth. You going through the process and documenting it and publishing it as you go is your track record. It’s the way you bond yourself and bond your audience to you by giving them a peek and a window into the process as its, you know, showing the building of the thing, whether it’s a product or a service. You know, and showing the winds along with the losses, telling people, hey, I’m going for this really big opportunity. We got a big meeting with these guys and we’re about to go in. Hey, wish me luck. Let’s see what happens. And then, you know, maybe you film, uh, maybe not the whole thing, but, you know, kind of the camera outside and you sit and waiting and going in, and then you coming back and telling your audience we didn’t get it.

Arias WebsterBerry: They decided to go in a different direction. Man, that sucks, right? Most people are living in that space of loss and failure, right? The reality is, if you’re a business owner, you’re a salesperson. Most salespeople strike out, you know, 8 or 9 times out of ten, but no one’s documenting that. And when you can show people that they believe you. They see the progress. They see the progression. If they’ve been following you for a couple of years, they remember that first big loss. They remember your first big win. And when it comes around, time for them to actually want and need your services, you don’t have to convince them that you know your stuff. They’ve been watching. They’ve seen you build the thing. They’ve seen your ups, downs, highs, lows, and they know that you are in this to win it right. You actually have a passion. You have a, a a real purpose driven, um, reason to do what you do. And because they’ve been watching it, there’s no doubt that you will give them your all because they’ve seen you do it for others.

Lee Kantor: Now, um, you mentioned the sharing behind the scenes. Now you’ve shared a little bit about building in public. Um, what is the platform you would recommend to a business coach? Is it, um, some video centric thing? Would it like. Is it possible to do this, uh, with text? Is it possible to do with images? Does it have to be, uh, video content? And if it is video. Does it have to be, like on a TikTok or a YouTube? Where would you, um, kind of build if you were this business coach and you were willing to be vulnerable enough and humble enough to build in public, like you’re recommending?

Arias WebsterBerry: Yeah. I mean, I would say, um, I’m going to, uh, not not give you a binary answer. I’m going to give you two things. The first thing I would say is go where you naturally gravitate to. Um, because if you’re not good with the platform, then you’re most likely not going to do it consistent enough to see any results. So, um, go somewhere that you actually plan to spend some time right in somewhere where you feel you can be consistent. So that’s the first thing. The second thing I would say is, you know, try to be, you know, a little intelligent with it. Uh, you know, if you are a, say, a coach and you’re targeting, um, retirees that are, that are going after their second hobby business, right? They’ve already retired once, and now they’re creating a hobby business. And, you know, Snapchat probably isn’t the best place for you. I don’t know any 50, 60, 70 year olds that are spending a whole lot of time on Snapchat, right? So a little bit of common sense helps. But, um, if I had to give you a place, I would say YouTube is a really good place. Um, because, you know, YouTube is the second largest search engine in the world. Uh, and the way the algorithm is set up on YouTube, it is amazing at finding people that are interested in your particular topic. Right. And most people that get on YouTube, um, once they start liking things, the the algorithm pulls, brings people back to you. Right. Youtube is is one of those things that it definitely works as a search engine, very much like, you know, Google Ads or Google in that people go searching for things and then the platform just shows them more of what they’ve searched and liked. Um, so if you publish there and you know, you do a good job with your descriptions and the captions, you can, uh, not only educate people in, you know, show them your process and, uh, your origin story and a little window into your world. But you can actually, you know, actually get people to click out and generate leads out of it.

Lee Kantor: So if I was this business coach and wanted to grow and scale and maybe I’m frustrated where I’m at, where is the entry point in your world? What is the first thing I should be, um, looking to if I want your help.

Arias WebsterBerry: Um, the first thing I would say is, is, you know, put together a budget. I can’t tell you how many conversations I have with businesses and those that are even, you know, well established. I’ve told this story before, but I met with the homebuilder, um, here in Dallas. They’ve been around for close to two decades, and I, they make, uh, I don’t know, 20 million a year. And I remember sitting down with the, with their team and finding out that they don’t have a marketing budget. I was floored. It’s like you guys have been around for how long you’re making how much money, and you guys don’t have a marketing budget. That’s wild. Um, so I would say that the first thing is just sit down and earmark some money. Right. And most people don’t really know, uh, how to do that, but if you’re in business to business, you should be spending about ten. Or earmark 10% of projected revenue towards marketing. So you plan on making $1 million this year? Uh, you need to plan on spending around 100,000 this year on on marketing. So that’d be, you know, somewhere around eight, $9,000 a year.

Arias WebsterBerry: If you’re in business consumer, you should be spending anywhere from 15 to 20% on marketing. So same scenario. You’re trying to make $1 million. You need to put 150 to $200,000 aside, or that’s what you need to plan and budget for, uh, over the course of a year. So if your goals aren’t as ambitious, you’re just trying to do maybe 120 K, uh, this year you’re trying to make 10,000 a year. Well, great. Um, you know, put 10 to $15,000 aside or roughly around $1,000 a month. And that should be your your budget. That’s, you know, graphics, social media, video creation ads, you know, all those different things. See how much you can fit into that budget. And, um, you know, very much watch the return on that and see, you know, how much business you’re able to generate with that money. But I think the biggest thing is most people won’t take the time to sit down and actually put, you know, some money aside, uh, to, to give themselves a decent shot of success.

Lee Kantor: So what is a story you can share, maybe with a client that you were working with, maybe share what the challenge was they had before they started working with you. And then when they work with you and how you were able to help them get to a new level, obviously don’t name the name unless it’s okay, but just the problem and how you were able to help them grow.

Arias WebsterBerry: Yeah, I’ve got a few. Um, uh, we actually just, uh, we had a luxury travel company, uh, that had been around for a few years, but again, they had never really put together a marketing budget. Uh, they were getting a good amount of traffic, uh, as far as, you know, views and stuff on Instagram. But they were having a really hard time translating that into revenue, So they looked great online. Right. Amazing content. You know, lots of people engaging, but it wasn’t really transferring into actual revenue. Um, and what we found is that they did not have any lead magnets, right? They didn’t have anything that they could give away to their audience in order to get them to move from, hey, you’ve got a really cool reel on Instagram to now your name, phone number and email in my system that I can reach out to in and, you know, have a conversation with about coming on a trip. So first thing we did is build out some lead magnets. We built out a whole, um, um, program that allow people to get early access to trips. So they got, um, access to purchasing trips early. They got discounts on on trips, and they also got a couple other perks. And that was the first lead magnet. We built out a funnel for it, a landing page, in order to collect the information, uh, that helped us generate. So they in their five year period. I think they want. I think they had maybe, uh, 500, maybe 600 leads, um, in, in their database over like a five year period. We generated that much in the first two months of working with them. Five, 600 leads. Uh, and then from there we went into ads. So we started running ads, and we generated over 167 leads inside of three weeks for them on the ad side, um, which, you know, had a profound impact on the amount of people that they had a chance to pitch and ultimately the amount of people that that, um, ended up booking.

Lee Kantor: Now, um, when you’re working with a client like that and you’re helping them kind of put together these systems, is it something that you’re explaining to them, you should do this, and here’s how. Or is it like they’re just paying you and then you’re building this all out on their behalf?

Arias WebsterBerry: Um, the latter. So. Well, I mean, we have to explain it to them, right? We’re it’s costing a lot of money. They’ve got to understand exactly what we’re doing and what the inputs and outputs are. Um, but for them, we just built it. All right? We built the. We rebuilt the website, we rebuilt funnels. Uh, we came up with programs, the branding for it, uh, the graphics, the, uh, reels, the, the, um, ad campaign, you know, we we truly built out the entire thing, uh, based off of what we knew they needed.

Lee Kantor: So was it done for you? Service?

Arias WebsterBerry: Absolutely.

Lee Kantor: And is that how all of your services are, or do you have some do it yourself. Do you have some? Do it with you do or is it only do it for you.

Arias WebsterBerry: On the agency side, it’s all done for you. Um, you know, for those that go through our launch ignition system, um, we do have the ability to do some of the things with with you. Uh, which is great, because what we, um, done for you and done with you. Because I think a lot of times, Um, marketing doesn’t work even with agencies, the people that go to agencies because they don’t have enough information. They’re not educated enough. So, you know, assuming you have a good actor right in the in the space and they’re they’re a reputable company. They know what they’re doing. They get results. Um, a lot of times clients won’t give it enough time to work or they’ll insist on certain things because of, you know, some random video they saw on TikTok or Instagram. So they’re constantly switching the strategy or the, um, channel or the budget. You know, they’re moving things around without giving it enough time to actually work. So when you kind of work with someone or do it with them or allow them to do some of the things themselves, it it gives them the benefit of that education so that they have enough information to make good decisions.

Lee Kantor: So who is that ideal client for you? Um, are they enterprise level companies or do you work with smaller startups or is it only the big guys?

Arias WebsterBerry: Yeah. When it comes to launch ignition, we typically work with businesses that are at the beginning of their journey, right. They’re building a business or they’re in their first three years. So, uh, we we typically like them to go through launch ignition first so we can, you know, take them through the full lifecycle to truly building a scalable business and all the back end digital infrastructure that they need. Um, you know, for those that have been in business a few years or maybe have already hit their first, you know, six figures and they’re doing that regularly. Um, Webster marketing works really well. And even if you’re kind of getting started, some of our social media packages, you know, that started a few hundred bucks or are a good fit, you know, even if you’re just getting started. So, um, you know, we we serve we have, um, you know, $100 million clients, right? Large hotel chains, uh, down to individual, um, you know, beauticians, uh, and makeup artists. So, uh, we have packages and, uh, services that that, you know, can basically fit any budget.

Lee Kantor: So, uh, if somebody wants to learn more, have a more substantive conversation with you or somebody on the team, what’s a website?

Arias WebsterBerry: Uh, they can go to Webster Barre marketing. Com so Webster, Barre, Webster like the dictionary, and then b e r r y marketing. Com or you can just Google Webster Barre marketing.

Lee Kantor: All right. Well thank you so much for sharing your story today. You’re doing such important work and we appreciate you.

Arias WebsterBerry: Lee, thank you for having me. And, um, I appreciate it. It was fun.

Lee Kantor: All right. This is Lee Kantor. We’ll see you all next time on High Velocity Radio.

Tagged With: Arias WebsterBerry, WebsterBerry Marketing

How to Build a Sanctuary for Your Soul: Insights from Kate Eckman

August 7, 2025 by angishields

HVR-Kate-Eckman-Feature
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How to Build a Sanctuary for Your Soul: Insights from Kate Eckman
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In this episode of High Velocity Radio, Stone Payton interviews author, coach, and podcast host Kate Eckman. Kate shares her mission to help humanity heal through courageous, authentic conversations, drawing on her background in journalism, personal loss, and coaching. She discusses her podcast Rawish, her journey of self-discovery, and the importance of self-care. Kate also reveals her vision for global wellness centers and an animal sanctuary, and offers practical advice on embracing stillness for personal growth.

Kate-EckmanKate Eckman is the host and creator of Rawish with Kate Eckman, a podcast featuring atypical talks for transformation and wellness through truth and storytelling. She is also the award-winning author of The Full Spirit Workout: A Ten-Step System to Shed Your Self-Doubt, Strengthen Your Spiritual Core, and Create a Fun and Fulfilling Life.

Kate’s TEDx talk, The Surprising Secret To Leading With Confidence, went viral, amassing more than half a million views in the first month alone. She works as a keynote speaker, broadcast journalist and TV personality, bringing her expertise in communications, performance, and mindfulness to her practice as a success coach for business leaders and professional athletes.

She earned a B.A. in communications from Penn State University, where she was an Academic All-American swimmer, and received her master’s degree in broadcast journalism from Northwestern University’s Medill School of Journalism. She graduated at the highest level from Columbia University’s executive and organizational coaching program and is a certified ICF coach (PCC) and a licensed NBI consultant.

Passionate about mindfulness practices for both brain and body health, she is also a meditation teacher and course creator for Insight Timer, the world’s number one–ranked free meditation app. Visit her online at kateeckman.tv and www.thefullspiritworkout.com.

Connect with Kate

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/kateeckman.tv

Twitter: https://twitter.com/kateeckman

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/kateeckman/

Pinterest: https://www.pinterest.com/kateeckman/

YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC0VoBWVoygoQ6HpCM0B69yg

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kateeckman/

Episode Highlights

  • Kate’s mission to help humanity heal and evolve through courageous conversations.
  • Her career journey from journalism to coaching and podcasting.
  • The importance of fostering genuine connections and honest dialogue on difficult topics.
  • The impact of personal experiences, including tragedy, on her professional path.
  • The concept and format of her podcast Rawish, focusing on authentic conversations.
  • The significance of coaching credentials and the need for regulation in the coaching profession.
  • The interplay between her roles as a journalist, coach, and podcaster.
  • The challenges of self-worth and the practice of self-care in her work.
  • Future aspirations, including expanding her podcast and creating wellness centers.
  • Practical tips for listeners, such as the “sit and stare time” practice for self-reflection.

Transcript-iconThis transcript is machine transcribed by Sonix.

 

TRANSCRIPT

Intro: Broadcasting live from the Business RadioX studios in Atlanta, Georgia. It’s time for High Velocity Radio.

Stone Payton: Welcome to the High Velocity Radio show, where we celebrate top performers producing better results in less time. Stone Payton here with you this afternoon. Please join me in welcoming to the broadcast author, speaker, coach and radio host Kate Eckman. How are you?

Kate Eckman: Stone, I’m so great. I’m here with you and your audience. I couldn’t be better. Thanks for having me.

Stone Payton: It is absolutely my pleasure. I’ve really been looking forward to this conversation. I’ve got a ton of questions, Kate, but maybe, uh, maybe a good place to start. How would you articulate mission? Purpose? What are you really out there trying to do for folks these days?

Kate Eckman: I’m really trying to help humanity heal and evolve one courageous conversation at a time. I’ve been a journalist for 20 years by trade, but also have these other careers. But humanity is is my jam and my passion and what makes me tick. And you know, I have felt so disconnected from myself and others at times in my life and felt how debilitating that is. And so I don’t want anybody else to feel alone. And I want us to be able to have uncomfortable conversations as difficult as they can be, but knowing that there’s a positive result. But really, you know, I have not felt good about myself and where I’ve been in my life. And so I know if I have felt that others have and I want to be a source of inspiration and empowerment, and I think we get there by having real, honest conversations.

Stone Payton: So tell us a little bit about the the Journey. It strikes me as incredibly rewarding work if you can get it. I’m sure it wasn’t a straight line, but give us some high spots on the journey if you would.

Kate Eckman: Yeah, I actually graduated from Penn State University. I was a swimmer there. I had an advertising and public relations degree minor in psychology, and I headed straight to Los Angeles. I wanted to work in the entertainment business. I loved movies, and I found myself. I kind of fell into a career as an entertainment reporter as a kid. You know, I’m 22, 23, interviewing the biggest celebrities in the world on red carpets and press junkets. And I again, it just I leaned into my genuine curiosity. I grew up in a house with Tom Brokaw on the news every night, and I would watch him, and then I would go up to my bedroom and and make up the news to my stuffed animals. And so I’ve always just liked to talk. I’ve liked to inform people because I’m just so curious about other people and what makes them tick and why they are the way they are. And, um, you know, of course celebrities get a lot of attention, but I’ve left that career and went to Chicago to get my master’s degree from Northwestern and journalism, and I went from interviewing Tom Cruise and Angelina Jolie to delinquents and the the Cook County jail and court system, and found that to be more rewarding because there was such a need there to talk about deplorable conditions and what was going on. And, you know, I’m a humanitarian at heart.

Kate Eckman: So I had that journey. And then from there was a local news reporter all over the country and, um, after, you know, a decade or so of all the death and destruction, I, I pivoted into being a TV presenter on QVC all over the world. And, um, you know, it’s Covid and there was disruptions there. And so I, um, you know, I had worked as a model in New York City and did other TV work, and, um, I lost two loved ones to suicide in 2014 and 2015. And that kind of changed the whole trajectory of my life and career and went back to school to study neuroscience and positive psychology and whole person coaching techniques to work as a coach and and really help people because I was suffering. So I wanted the knowledge and tools to be able to first help myself, but then help others. And, um, you know that I’ve done a several things in the television world and radio world and now podcast world, having my own show with men and, um, have the most fascinating, remarkable, phenomenal guests on my show who are all overcomers in some way, but doing really big things in the world to to help humanity. And first, just by sharing their story. I think we help humanity by by being honest with ourselves and sharing our stories.

Stone Payton: Well, I’m looking forward to diving into this show because I’m fascinated with the kind of work you do. Of course, because I feel like there are there’s some overlap and some of the things that we get to do in ways that we get to, to, to serve people. When you were making that transition from that more corporate kind of existence with the celebrities and all that, I mean, I got to believe it wasn’t just all a cake walk. Did you have the benefit of some mentors along the way? Did you just get you learn from the school of hard knocks and you also, you made the distinct choice to become a formally credentialed as a coach. Speak to that a little bit if you would.

Kate Eckman: Yeah, sure. So I feel like I so much in my career, I have been thrown to the wolves and I’ve had to luckily I’m like a cat. Nine lives and I always land on my feet. But so much of my career, I just took really big risks and it worked out even when it didn’t, and even when it was tough, whether it was financially or, um, you know, there’s a lot of kind of itchiness and the, the on camera world, so I’ll just leave it at that. But, um, but, you know, and you’re a, you’re a broadcaster, so you know, how there can be some, some a lot of competition and a lot of ego that you have to manage? I think really in any career. But I was just kind of throw into it and really just leaned on my intuition and and leaned on my ability to connect. And I’ve always just genuinely cared about others. So I, you know, it was not so much research about someone I was going to interview, as much as just kind of connecting with them. And that always just worked out for me. And I think the key with any transition is believing in yourself and caring enough about yourself to to leave something that’s no longer resonating or or working out and trying something new, even if it’s, you know, you can feel like a failure or it’s not a typical path.

Kate Eckman: Or again, you know, finances might be tight, but I think if you really, truly believe and yeah, you can lean on some people, a support system is certainly really important. I had some great people too, to look up to. Um, and then transitioning into a coach for me, um, you know, therapists, obviously it’s a regulated business. I think coaching should be a regulated business as well, because I think a lot of people are operating and working out of integrity. You know, just because you went through trauma does not make you a trauma coach. And I think credentials are extremely important when you have someone’s well-being in your hands. And so that was really important to me to have the school, the the school, the skills and the tools to go along with my, you know, street cred, if you will, my personal experience to really be able to help people in a meaningful way.

Stone Payton: Okay, you got to tell me about this show. I want to know everything about it, how and why you got to go in the format, who you’re interviewing, what you’re trying to accomplish. Lay that on us.

Kate Eckman: Yeah. So I came up with raw ish. It’s like raw ish, like raw, you know, um, and RW and then ish raw ish because we’re just getting really raw and real. And I think so much media is performative and surface level and it can be superficial and no one’s saying the quiet part out loud. So I wanted my guests and myself, I have to lead by example and start saying the quiet part out loud, which a lot of quote unquote experts don’t want to do because they want to be perceived in a certain way. But I think when we share openly what we’re struggling with, um, the stuff that we don’t normally talk about, which that was the first line in the trailer for my show, is, what’s something you don’t normally talk about? Because I think our secrets keep us sick. They keep us sick. They keep us stuck. Um, they keep us fighting. So I really wanted us to start being more open. And it was really born from a place of disconnection, feeling disconnected from, you know, even immediate family members, um, friends, the world just so much going on. I recognize it’s a really challenging time for all of us. The world is tougher than it was even a few years ago. And so I think people are just at capacity and checked out.

Kate Eckman: So I wanted to kind of bring us back to our core and to our center and, and tell stories that can uplift and inspire and remind people that they aren’t alone. And we’re all going through things and that’s like, you know, I have guests. I had one gentleman recently, Austin Hatch, who survived not one, but two plane crashes that killed his entire family. He was had a traumatic brain injury. Level seven, the worst doctors had ever seen. Um, and he he survived and went on to play basketball at University of Michigan. And you know, that’s just one example. I have all sorts of people who have just really transformed me by hearing their stories and and connecting with them. And so my audience gets to have that experience as well. So I’m clearly very passionate about this work because I’m passionate about people and I’m passionate about people really living up to their full potential. And, um, even if things are really dark there, there is that glimmer of hope and light, and I certainly want to be a beacon of of hope for people and just remind them of their greatness and that it’s their birthright to have the life that they truly desire.

Stone Payton: I find what you’re doing and maybe more importantly, the way you’re going about it, the way you’re doing it to be incredibly brave. And I’m trying to wrap my mind around the the level of trust that you must certainly have to endear in your guest to have that caliber of honor exchange. I wow, how do you do that?

Kate Eckman: I think what’s been really and thank you for saying that. So and I think what’s been really cool for me is, um, which a lot of people haven’t understood. Um, I have not had a straight linear path. Um, but having all the experience as a journalist and so knowing how to ask the questions and hold space as a journalist who’s been asking questions for 25 years, really, actually, my whole life, you know, starting with my stuffed animals, they didn’t have much dialog back, obviously, but even just being curious about their experience, you know, as the Care Bear. Ah, whatever. Um, Cabbage Patch Kids. But, um, I think then going on to become a coach. I don’t know any, any professional journalists who are also professional coaches and vice versa. So having that double whammy of, um, being able to speak, but more importantly, the the skill of listening, which is a very underrated and undervalued skill in our society. But being able to listen on a really deep level, but also being a vessel and someone who can hold space for depth and for people to feel safe and confident enough to talk about things publicly they don’t normally talk about and show emotion to have grown men, you know, three time World Series champions crying on my show. Um, because they feel that safe and comfortable in my presence and their presence. And so that is a gift, um, to be able to really get to the heart of matter, of the matter and really get to know people so much deeper than where you live and what do you do? But who are you? Without all the titles and labels and limitations that are placed upon us?

Stone Payton: So what are you? Because you’ve been at this a while now. What are you finding the most rewarding these days? Because I know in my experience, sometimes that goalpost changes a little bit. Yeah.

Kate Eckman: I, I think it really is. It is. Even right now, like, I just even love connecting with you. Like, this is my Super Bowl. This is my World Series, this is my $10 million paycheck, is connecting with people and feeling your presence and your energy and your curiosity and and you feeling a certain way during and after the conversation. I think it’s that energy exchange and sharing ideas and sharing perspectives and you sharing something, or me sharing something that we’ve never thought or heard of before, that can change the way we go about our day or our life and and and again, it’s the hope. It’s the feeling. You know, I’m mixed feelings. It’s it’s being able to tap into emotion. And the full spectrum of emotion allow ourselves to feel and to grow and to evolve and to just feel alive after. Maybe we’ve been numbing or suppressing for so long.

Stone Payton: I have to believe the way you’re describing these conversations. I have to believe that coming out of any one of them, and certainly many of them, has to make you also that much better as a practitioner to help you solidify and crystallize your own thinking and your own approach to serving people in a straight coaching relationship. Yeah.

Kate Eckman: Yeah, I think it’s really important to understand people, uh, mostly in the world. And it’s a conversation I just had with an upcoming guest about understanding people instead of judging them. But first we have to understand ourselves. Understand our childhood. Understand our trauma. Understand what we like and what we don’t like, who we are, who we are and what we stand for, what we don’t stand for. And so yeah, I just, I like to be able to, um, really get in there with, with myself and others. But it first starts with, with me being able to, um, understand myself. So then I can, you know, in coaching too, we learn it’s it’s what our client is saying. It’s what they’re not saying. And then it’s kind of the meta, like what’s the what’s the noise and what’s the voice and meaning. Um, on a deeper on the collective. So um, again, listening is a very good, good skill to have. I forget your original question because I’m just so lost and describing it, I’m getting lost in these conversations that I’m having with people and it’s keeping me going. You know, I’ve I’ve gone through some challenges, like we all have. And these conversations, even what you and I are doing here right now, this is this is what keeps me going.

Stone Payton: Well, I can tell. I can see it in your eyes. I can hear it in your voice. Uh, no, I was just suggesting that with the coaching and the speaking and doing the show, that they. Surely they all serve each other, right? You learn something in one arena and you bring it to the other. And I gotta believe it makes you a stronger practitioner, which probably makes you a stronger writer, which probably makes you a better speaker. Like all of that. Serves everything. Serves everything, doesn’t it?

Kate Eckman: It does. And I one of my favorite quotes I don’t know who said it, but it’s nothing is wasted. And I think sometimes people fear, you know, making a big change in their life, whether it’s career where they live, a family, a divorce, whatever it is, and nothing’s wasted. You know, we get so much from each experience. And I think for me, I remember a time even when I put the journalism and TV broadcasting on hold and I was working as a professional model in New York City because, candidly, it paid a lot more, and I wanted to have that money to invest in my entrepreneur journey. And I had this photographer from my TV news career send me a snarky message and say something to the effect of, good to see you putting your journalism degree to good use. You know, mocking me, working as a model. And all I could do was was laugh all the way to the bank, because that modeling career really, first of all, it brought out all my insecurities. So I grew as a person, but it really gave me some money to to start my my practice as an entrepreneur and pay for grad school and things like that. So, um, I think it’s good. All of our experiences, if we allow them to be catalysts for transformation and make us better. And then you could, you get to combine different tasks and skill sets to make you that much better.

Stone Payton: When you when you become this invested in other people. Do you find sometimes there may be a risk of losing a little bit of yourself or neglecting a little bit of yourself? Is that something you have to work consciously to keep in check? Maybe.

Kate Eckman: Who are you? Intuitive? Um, yes. This has been a practice because I have always been very others focused, and that has gotten me into some relationships with some narcissistic types. And as an empath and, um, just how I was raised, and I think a lot of us, especially as women, we think our value is and how much we’re giving to other people, and then we forget to pour back into ourselves. We don’t feel worthy of it. We want people to like us. We are people pleasers. Um, you know, we don’t we don’t have that, that self-worth. Sadly, even if on the outside it appears that we do, um, to really give back to ourselves and we want to be liked. Right. So this has been a season of pouring back into myself and even recording a solo episode where there was that part of me that’s like, well, what if nobody cares or watches this, or you’re not enough to sign your own, you need a guest. And those have been my most popular episodes, and the one I did in Portugal, you know, with crappy lighting and all this stuff and, you know, frizzy hair from the ocean and all of that. But it’s just like, I don’t even care if anyone’s listening or watching, like, I’m doing this for myself. And that was that was one of my my most popular episodes. So I think it kind of proved the point.

Stone Payton: It made me a little bit of an unfair question, and I certainly don’t expect an accurate answer. I won’t hold it to you the next time we get the chance to visit on air, but I’m going to ask anyway what feels like is next or, you know, 18 months out, two years out. Is there a little bit of a of a beacon out there that you’re kind of moving toward?

Kate Eckman: I’m moving toward signing a really big contract with a partner that can help me really expand my vision and this show so that we can impact more lives. And I just want to keep doing that. And I have a lot of ambition and dream really big. But my coach recently said, you need to dream even bigger. And when I think of dreaming even bigger, I think of, you know, rush healing centers all over the world and, you know, gathering all of my favorite practitioners, many of whom have been on the show and just helping people prioritize their well-being mental, emotional, spiritual, physical. And so, you know, healthier people are happier people, and they’re able to fulfill their unique goal and purpose and mission, um, in an easier, better way. And so I want to be that like, it sounds so big, but instead of everybody being sick at the hospital, we had these big hospital like facilities where people are, you know, really into their health and well-being and going out and kicking butt in the world.

Stone Payton: Well, it does sound big. It sounds audacious, and I have a great deal of faith and confidence in you. I think you’re going to make great strides in that direction. You’re so passionate about this work. This may be a mundane or off topic question, but I often ask I’m going to ask you to, and I don’t even know when or where you’d find the time. But are there other little passions, pursuits, hobbies, interests kind of outside the scope of this that maybe you do pursue in the white space a little bit now and again?

Kate Eckman: You know, I’m absolutely obsessed with animals, and so I can’t believe I don’t have any animals in my own right now. It’s because I’m in transition and I don’t want to be a bad parent. But another dream, speaking of that would be to have a big farm or a piece of land where I could have just rescue a ton of dogs and horses. So I think mainly focus on rescue. I’d get some of my own to, but rescue horses and pigs and goats and sheep and cows and dogs and cats and just had it be a sanctuary for wellness for animals. Because animals need wellness too. I just saw something this morning that 75% of dogs are depressed, and that made me really sad. But instead of dwelling on it, I think, okay, and you know, what I’m thinking of doing too is just going down to the shelter. And if I can’t adopt, I can foster. And even you can take the dog for the day and take it to the beach and, you know, let it sleep in bed with you and give it really good food. And so, um, I’m really passionate about animals. I think they are just pure loving energy.

Stone Payton: I am so glad that I asked.

Kate Eckman: Why don’t you like that vision and me on the farm with all the animals? See, and thanks for letting me say that, because it’s my my lips to God’s ears. That’s my other big, my big dream. And there’s a woman that I know who’s doing something similar. So she’s been a good template and inspiration that, okay, I can do that too.

Stone Payton: At the risk of reducing your work to a cosmopolitan article, which is the furthest thing from my mind. Before we wrap up and we’re going to make sure that people have your contact info and know how to get to your show. Um, but I’d love to leave them with a couple of pro tips and things to be thinking about or reading to kind of have them live a little more into this Rausch mindset, if you would, if anything comes to mind.

Kate Eckman: Yeah, it’s something counterintuitive. A lot of people probably aren’t going to like, but it’s the practice that I call my sit and stare time. And you do just that. You sit and stare straight ahead out the window. No cheating. We’ve got no devices on, no music, no TV, no phone, no you, no social media app, no book. Even you can have a journal. But I really invite people to just sit quietly in a room alone, which sounds awful to a lot of people. It’s one of my favorite practices. And then you just get to tune in to your truth, to your higher self, to God, spirit, universe, whatever you believe in, and you get to listen to your heart. And in those moments, that’s where I got a download to even create this show and to come up with the language for it. And, um, if I have a problem in the past, I would just call up a friend and what do you think? And I’d be all stressed out. And now I just, I sit and stare and I invite in the guidance and I think, oh, that’s interesting. And I think we’re all so overstimulated and overcapacity and exhausted and stressed and anxious that this just gives you your body and your nervous system and your mind and your heart a chance to just take a deep breath and connect with yourself and just listen to what’s going on. And we’re so wise, and I think we’ve forgotten how wise we are. And we’re looking to everything and everyone else for the answers, but they’re all within. And it may sound cliche, and you’ve probably heard it a million times, but have you practiced it a million times? And I think that’s that’s the difference.

Stone Payton: What marvelous council. And I am going to take advantage of it, because as soon as you and I are done, I’m running out to the boat.

Kate Eckman: Oh, my gosh, that sounds fabulous. So you asked about hobbies. Being on a boat? I think with some animals. Maybe not horses, but being on a boat with a dog is is my greatest pleasure in life. So good for you.

Stone Payton: I love it. All right. What’s the best way for our listeners to begin to tap into your work? Uh, get to where they can listen to this show, maybe read your work. Let’s give them some coordinates.

Kate Eckman: Yeah. So if you just go to Kate Ekman k t e s, man, I’m Kate Ekman on all the social medias. My YouTube is Kate Ekman TV, it’s Rausch with Kate Eckman. Everywhere that you listen to podcasts, my book is the full spirit workout. But if you do go to my website, all of this information is there because I just threw a lot at you. But I would love to connect, as you can imagine and Um, and just hear what’s going on with you, and maybe we can address it on some shows or in my next book. And, um, I just I wish everybody well because it’s it’s hard out there these days.

Stone Payton: Well, k, it has been an absolute delight having you on the show. Thank you for your insight, your perspective, your your enthusiasm. And you really are having a meaningful impact on so many. And we sure appreciate you.

Kate Eckman: Thank you so much for having me. This has been such a blast.

Stone Payton: My pleasure. All right, until next time. This is Stone Payton for our guest today, Kate Eckman and everyone here at the Business RadioX family saying we’ll see you in the fast lane.

 

Absolute Heating & Air: A Blueprint for Success Through Appreciation and Integrity

August 7, 2025 by angishields

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High Velocity Radio
Absolute Heating & Air: A Blueprint for Success Through Appreciation and Integrity
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In this episode of High Velocity Radio, Joshua Kornitsky interviews Brian Jackson, founder of Absolute Heating & Air. Brian shares his journey in the HVAC industry, the growth of his company, and the core values—appreciation, education, teamwork, mentorship, and integrity—that shape its culture. He discusses prioritizing employee well-being, fostering career growth, and hiring for attitude over skills. The episode highlights Absolute Heating & Air’s commitment to exceptional service, community support, and empowering employees, offering insights into building a values-driven, people-centered business that stands out in the industry.

Absolute-Heating-and-Air-logo

Brian-JacksonBrian Jackson is a 35-year veteran of the HVAC industry and the Founder and Visionary of Absolute 2020 Inc. and Absolute Heating & Air, serving Morgantown, West Virginia, and Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania.

With a passion for creating a positive impact on people, Jackson attributes Absolute’s award-winning success to a company culture rooted in authenticity, gratitude, and empowerment of the Absolute Team through meaningful opportunities to thrive – both professionally and personally.

Beyond his business ventures, Jackson and his family are avid travelers who seek inspiration through art, music, and cultural experiences. Together with his twin flame, Evelyn, Jackson is now embarking on a new journey – the creation of a nonprofit foundation dedicated to expanding access to wellness resources, educational opportunities for personal growth and behavioral transformation, and programs that foster creative expression and spiritual growth.

Follow Absolute Heating & Air on Facebook, YouTube and LinkedIn.

Episode Highlights

  • Brian’s background and experience in the HVAC industry.
  • The journey of starting and growing Absolute Heating & Air.
  • The importance of core values in shaping company culture and customer service.
  • Employee care as a foundation for customer satisfaction.
  • The significance of hiring based on values and attitude rather than just skills.
  • The company’s core values: appreciation, education, teamwork, and mentorship.
  • The impact of a supportive and growth-oriented environment on employee performance.
  • The role of transparency and accountability in building trust with customers.
  • The integration of community service initiatives, such as the “Hope and Heat” program.
  • The philosophy of prioritizing employee well-being to enhance overall business success.

About Your Host

BRX-HS-JKJoshua Kornitsky is a fourth-generation entrepreneur with deep roots in technology and a track record of solving real business problems. Now, as a Professional EOS Implementer, he helps leadership teams align, create clarity, and build accountability.

He grew up in the world of small business, cut his teeth in technology and leadership, and built a path around solving complex problems with simple, effective tools. Joshua brings a practical approach to leadership, growth, and getting things done.

As a host on Cherokee Business Radio, Joshua brings his curiosity and coaching mindset to the mic, drawing out the stories, struggles, and strategies of local business leaders. It’s not just about interviews—it’s about helping the business community learn from each other, grow stronger together, and keep moving forward.

Connect with Joshua on LinkedIn.

Transcript-iconThis transcript is machine transcribed by Sonix.

 

TRANSCRIPT

Intro: Broadcasting live from the Business RadioX studios in Atlanta, Georgia. It’s time for High Velocity Radio.

Joshua Kornitsky: Welcome back to High Velocity Radio. My name is Joshua Kornitsky. I’m a professional iOS implementer and the host of today’s show. I have with me Brian Jackson, the founder of Absolute Heating and Air. Hey, Brian, how are you?

Brian Jackson: I’m doing phenomenal. Josh, how about yourself?

Joshua Kornitsky: I’m doing pretty good myself. It’s been a good day so far. Uh, nothing but wonderful dynamic conversations. So, Brian, tell us. Ah, Jackson, is what you’ve told me to call you just so that anybody listening doesn’t get confused. He’s told me to call him Jackson. Jackson, tell us a little bit about absolute heating and air.

Brian Jackson: So absolutely, heating and air is a business that I started back in 2013 as a side hustle. I was uh, you say having an early midlife crisis working for a company in Pittsburgh. Going back to school for psychology at 40 plus years old. Because I had recognized in business that that was my my passion was psychologically, you know, how to inspire people, how to engage with clients, things of that nature. And I returned to Morgantown, West Virginia, which was close to where I was born and raised, to finish my degree at West Virginia University and started. Absolutely. It was originally an absolute area, which became absolute heating and air as a means to pay my bills while I went back to college.

Joshua Kornitsky: So did you have previous experience in in air conditioning or HVAC?

Brian Jackson: Yes. So, uh, I was working for electrician first thing out of high school. I had had mechanical experience in high school, uh, working with my dad on some projects, uh, for our church also, um, uh, had a Billy construction class in high school, which I performed a lot of electrical work in. And so I pursued electrical work out of high school rather than going to college. Even though I had a desire to go to college, I wasn’t sure what I wanted to do. Figured enter the workforce first and figure that out, and ended up in the Washington, D.C. area, working for a apartment management company that sent me to school for heating and air conditioning. I returned to West Virginia in 2 or 1994 to start my first heating air conditioning company. I was 21 years old, barely knew shit about what I should have known starting that business, but I had, uh, I think maybe it was a naivete that took away any fear. Does that make sense?

Joshua Kornitsky: Sure, sure. You don’t know what you don’t know, so it’s hard to be afraid of it.

Brian Jackson: Right. And so, because I didn’t have a fear for starting a new business at 21, I didn’t have a fear for, uh, getting into aspects of heating and cooling that I had never done before. I navigated through that with confidence somehow at that early age.

Joshua Kornitsky: And so that was 1994.

Brian Jackson: That was.

Joshua Kornitsky: 1990. Okay. Go on. I’m sorry.

Brian Jackson: So I had that business for 12 years. Uh, obviously starting at a young age without the business background, with only three years of HVAC background. I made a lot of mistakes. Uh, as I grew that company but still reached a level of success that was that I can be proud of in 12 years. That a lot of people my age would not have been able to do.

Joshua Kornitsky: And 100%.

Brian Jackson: Yeah. It’s. And so it was a learning experience where after I sold that, then I made some more, uh, let’s say inappropriate life choices. That took me down a different path.

Joshua Kornitsky: But then we all take those steps, and it’s the only way we learn.

Brian Jackson: Then, uh, return to HVAC by working for a contractor in Pittsburgh that had been friends with. Yeah. So it was, uh, I recognized that the company that I was working for in Pittsburgh was basically limiting my growth, not just professionally, but I think in other aspects of my life, it was causing some friction. I was already going back to school to pursue a degree in psychology, so I decided to return to Morgantown, West Virginia, which was close to where I was born and raised, and finished my degree in psychology at Western University. Uh, my son at the time was going to Fairmont State University in West Virginia for business degree, and so he was working for me part time, uh, basically running apps to air as a side hustle, to provide income, to pay the bills while I was getting this degree in psychology. But, uh, the people in Morgantown knew me and, uh, some of the surrounding area because of the business I had previously. And word got around quickly that I was back in town. And so organically, we were growing the business with almost no marketing. And because of, you know, at the time, I didn’t even really appreciate the full scope of how important infusing the culture and mindset, the core values of what I had into the company as a whole. But it was almost happening naturally without even having that understanding from a larger perspective.

Brian Jackson: And one of the most important things that resonated with me as we started to hire employees was something Richard Branson said. Richard Branson, being the founder of Virgin Records, Virgin Mobile, Virgin Airlines and probably my favorite billionaire in the world. He just seems like a fun guy and I hope to meet him someday. But, um, he said that the customer is not the most important person in your business. The employee is. And if you take care of your employee, you will never have to worry about your customers. That resonated with me on a deep level, because I was always hypersensitive about customer satisfaction in my previous business. And so as we grew and I treated my employees like my customers, and because I did that and took care of them, I appreciate them. I engaged with them on a level beyond just what the work was or what their career was, but actually cared about them. That they in turn cared about the customers. I didn’t the amount of time that would be taken for me to engage with a customer who was upset was insignificant, because I had infused that culture in my team that day to take care of the customers. And so that, I think, is the core of how we were able to grow. Absolute error successfully.

Joshua Kornitsky: So this lesson from Richard Branson of of treating your employees well so that your customers are treated well by your employees, was was the foundation of that in your previous business that you discovered that or was it just sort of inherently who you were? Because that’s a pretty profound realization. And it certainly seems like as as you’ve explained, your your growth has been positive and strong. It seems like it’s made a really big difference.

Brian Jackson: Yeah, I would have to say my own core personal values in relation to customer service comes from obviously my parental upbringing, a spiritual aspect of my upbringing. Um, I would even say there was some genetics involved in that. Um, so it came very naturally to me to want to have my customers be happy. It was very natural for me to want to always do the right thing and do the best possible job, even when I was inexperienced. And I can even think today. You know, looking back 30 plus 35 years ago, I can see jobs that I did at that young age, 21 years old, starting my first HVAC company that look absolutely terrible. Well, and it still bothers me today because I can see that image in my mind. I was like, I wish I knew more then so I could have made that look more beautiful and or maybe work more efficiently, whatever the case might be. But it’s like, that’s just my natural desire to always do the best possible job for somebody. And so it may not come natural to everybody. So that’s a very defining line in our culture today with absolute human error is if somebody doesn’t have that as a core value, that they appreciate a client enough to do that, or they appreciate a team member enough to, uh, help them out and gain that knowledge and ability to perform that way, then that person is not going to fit the culture absolutely well.

Joshua Kornitsky: So that, to me, brings up the concept or the thought that I get that, you know, what the right thing to do is? And I get that you’re hiring people that understand your perspective to the best that you can convey it to them of how important things are. But how hard is it to teach people to understand what the right thing to do is? And are you able to if if you’ve got a technician that’s in the field, if they don’t know, do they know who to call to get guidance?

Brian Jackson: That’s important. Yes. And I think the core values we have at absolute are are the initial point that helps to resolve a lot of that. Uh, we have guys that come to us who have a fear based mentality from places they’ve been before, like, if I do something wrong, I’m going to get yelled at, okay? Or if I get put into a place where I’m challenged, I’m not going to have support. And we see that. And when they come to absolute error, it’s like a a breath of fresh air for them, because now if they do something wrong, they’re coached.

Joshua Kornitsky: If they not just smacked right.

Brian Jackson: It’s like.

Joshua Kornitsky: Metaphorically.

Brian Jackson: Uh, and we proactively try to fill in those gaps ahead of time. But of course you can’t fill them all in. So when a mistake is made, there’s no, uh. Strong. There’s no, there’s no there’s definitely no yelling. There’s no, uh, this demeaning type of discipline. It’s about coaching, mentoring and lifting that person up so they can know what to do in that situation next time. What? They face a challenge where they need support. They’re not wondering, do I have something to rely on? They have a chain of command they can go to that. They’re going to have somebody that can support them through that challenge.

Joshua Kornitsky: And I think it’s critical, because I don’t want to lose sight of the fact that that I’m going to go on a limb here and say, you install heating and air systems, right? That’s the primary focus of the business. If if I’m a customer or a potential customer listening to this, it tells me that if if you’re who I engage, well, obviously we want all of our technicians to do work without error. If there is an error or if a problem manifests. That wasn’t part of the initial understanding. It sounds to me like you’re going to do what’s right for for the customer, as well as for the employee.

Brian Jackson: And the the opportunity that opens up to do the right thing and satisfy customer when they don’t even know is happening is huge. Because if you’ve got a technician who’s made a mistake, he can. Maybe he knows he can put a Band-Aid on it and nobody will ever know he made that mistake. But he knows eventually that could come back on the company.

Joshua Kornitsky: Right?

Brian Jackson: They have worked at places where they’re fear based. Um, and situation is going to allow them to Band-Aid it because they know they’re not going to work there forever. So they don’t care what happens to that company when they leave. So when you instill an environment of a place of safety where that employee knows that when they make a mistake, they can call their supervisors, say, hey, you know, I messed up, uh, I put my foot through somebody’s ceiling. It’s in this area where they don’t know it’s at. I could probably patch it. They’ll never see it. But that’s not how we work. It’s like we’re going to proactively go to that customer and say, hey, I hate to tell you this, but I put my foot through your ceiling. I’ve already called my boss about it. We’re going to get a painting and drywall contractor out here in the next couple of days to take care of this for you. It’s like. That’s once our new team members, our new hires, recognize that that’s how we operate. That changes the entire dynamic.

Joshua Kornitsky: So it certainly sounds like the culture first model makes a gigantic difference in really what impacts how well you satisfy your customers 100%. And in doing that, can you help us understand what is it you look for when you’re looking for, uh, technicians or employees to help them to make sure you’re aligned and that the people who you service your customers will ultimately have their expectations fulfilled. What is it? How do you how do you sift for that?

Brian Jackson: So ultimately, um, and you might be able to help me with this. It’s the, the idea of, Uh, filling a seat with who? And not with a skill set or a idea. It’s about who is the right person as a what are the values? You know, what are what do they think of when it comes to their fitting in within our team? So obviously, as a HVAC company, skills are important and certain aptitudes and abilities are important. But the most important is what is that person’s attitude and their desire to grow and get better. Right? That’s that’s that’s the who of what we look for is who fits that model. So we might be looking at a technician with 20 years experience that knows everything that needs to be done mechanically. But if they aren’t willing to be a mentor, if they aren’t willing to own up to their mistakes, if they aren’t, uh, an honest person of integrity, they are not going to survive it. Absolutely. And so when we look for that. Who? That person who adheres to our core values or at least aspires to. We recognize that not everybody’s perfect, especially when we bring new people on. And they’ve had negative experiences in the past with employers. We’re going to have to make sure they understand what those values are and help them work towards that.

Brian Jackson: And so, I mean, this sounds like a great time to just share the core values, if it’s at least if you please, if we could do that. So, um, as you know, we’ve been working with you, uh, through this process of, uh, really redefining our core values. We had one set of core values that was customer facing and a slight variation of that that was internal that we use for the team, and we found success in using that. But, uh, within the past year, we’ve recognized the need to really enhance that and to combine the two so that we’re really giving the same message to our clients that we are to our own team members. That’s great. And, uh, we were actually getting ready to launch, uh, or present these new core values to the team next week. So this is pretty exciting to be talking about here. Share with us. So the first one is absolute appreciation. And so obviously appreciation is something that we can all appreciate as a core value. But absolute gives it like this higher level in my opinion. Obviously that’s the name of the company. So that plays a part of as well. But um, absolute appreciation to me means you are not just thinking of the appreciation. You’re not maybe even just expressing in words, but you are now showing appreciation by what you are doing with your behavior, right? So if you appreciate your team members and you see they’re struggling on a job, they don’t have to ask you to jump in and help you.

Brian Jackson: Just proactively know you’ve got to get in there and help them. Or at the end of the day, you finished your job and you know there might be some other team members out there still working. And instead of just going home because, you know, you can, you call the office and say, hey, is there anybody out there that needs some help? I’ve got an extra hour here. I can jump in on the job if you need me to. That’s showing true appreciation for your team when you proactively look for those opportunities. Same with the clients or the community that were communities that were involved in. When you start to really appreciate what these customers are doing for us, allowing us to grow as a company and what each individual team member is able to do because we have such a great client base, then we show appreciation for that. We give back to the community because we appreciate that we exist in that community and that we have this opportunity of growth within that community. So obviously we want to show that appreciation.

Joshua Kornitsky: So it sounds like you’re encouraging them to to sort of live that appreciation model and to demonstrate it and show it at all times. Um, it’s a pretty spiritual approach to, to an HVAC company, but I think it’s fair to point out that I. It’s borne of you. Correct?

Brian Jackson: True. And it’s been enhanced through other I mean education. In fact, our previous, uh, internal, uh, core values are really centered around education involved teamwork, education, appreciation and mentorship. Those were the four core values of our internal team up until now. And so appreciation being one of those original four, is now the one of the top of the current and new, um, core values. Um, and so one book that I would like to recommend to the listeners is, um, conscious capitalism. And uh, it’s written by, I think it’s John Mackey, uh, who was the founder of Whole Foods and another economist. I can’t remember his name off the top of my head, but that book really spoke to me in how you need to infuse a spiritual ideal into your culture of your team so that you are, In fact, it also reminds me of the book Good to Great, where you have a level five leader who puts other people first, who doesn’t seek the attention that they’re they’re the ones that created all this and made all this happen, but they’re giving that credit to their team. That’s conscious capitalism. It’s like you’re looking at the spiritual perspective of how does the community, uh, how does the value of the community benefit this business and how we operate the employees, the investors, even the vendors? That’s something I see a lot of contractors, you know, they’ll beat their vendors up for the lowest price. They they, uh, get upset with them, uh, just put a lot of stress on that relationship. Whereas I’ve approached my vendor relationships where I appreciate them, too, and I’m not necessarily looking at the lowest price for my vendor. I’m looking at who is the vendor that’s going to treat my customers and take care of me the way I need to be taken care of, to take care of my customer. Sure.

Joshua Kornitsky: And so, I mean, that translates to A happy customer who has been well served by someone who is conscientious in the work that they’re doing.

Brian Jackson: That’s even how we set ourselves apart when it comes to a sale process, that when we can speak about our vendor in a selling process, that why we chose the equipment we sell. Uh, one example is, uh, client A, their air conditioner goes out on a Friday afternoon when it’s 90 degrees.

Joshua Kornitsky: That never.

Brian Jackson: Happens. You get family coming into town because they’re having the birthday party, the house on Saturday afternoon. We call our vendor and tell them the situation and ask if we can get a piece of equipment delivered to the house Saturday morning so we can get this accomplished for them. I know for a fact previous vendors that I’ve used may have said something like, well, we’re going to have to charge you $200 and you’re going to have to drive here to get it. And, you know, you got to be here right at this time to get it. And or others that may say, well, you’re out of luck. You gotta wait till Monday. But this particular vendor that, um, I’ll mention their name and you can edit out later if it’s.

Joshua Kornitsky: If it’s up to you, as long as you’re good mentioning it, then we’re happy to.

Brian Jackson: Have a Hamburger Corporation as the vendor I’m speaking of. And specifically, uh, uh, their location in Clarksburg, West Virginia. Uh, who? The manager there, Scott Yates. Shout out to Scott and the regional manager. Um, CJ uh oh. Luke CJ’s last name. He’s going to hate me for that. We’ll never tell Cameron, CJ, Cameron love both of those guys. And then our, uh, our territory manager Adam, it’s like those guys genuinely care about taking care of people. So they take care of us, which empowers us, take care of our client better. And so that example of I call hamburger and tell them, hey, this is our situation. This is the client situation. They proactively offered to bring that piece of equipment to our job site on Saturday morning and meet us there at 8:00 so that, uh, we have that client’s AC up and running. I think it was like by 1231 in the afternoon, so that when their birthday party started later that afternoon, now their house was starting to return back to a cool conditioned area. And it was like, that is an example that I relate to people when we’re talking about why we are setting ourselves apart, because the equipment we choose is not just because of the name on the equipment, it’s not because of the features of the equipment. It’s because of the value that that distributor brings to the table. If you, as a client and using a homeowner has a problem, they have our back. They’re going to go above and beyond, not just for us, but for you as the homeowner.

Joshua Kornitsky: You know, Jackson, it sounds like, uh, that the secret you’ve uncovered is, uh, honestly an ancient business concept called dignity and respect, right? Where you treat your vendors and your employees with dignity and respect, and in return you receive it. It’s it’s somewhat golden rule like, but clearly it’s making a difference because it’s. Yeah, because of the level of care you’re demonstrating internally and externally. Your organization continues to grow.

Brian Jackson: And again, it goes back to that same book that I mentioned earlier that I read prior to starting this business. I read it while I was in college for, um, the psychology degree. I was actually in a sociology class. I read this book. And I’d highly recommend that for anybody who appreciates how culture, core values, and a thread of spirituality within a business can help it thrive and be sustainable and even self multiplying. I mean, all those things, in my opinion, require that thread of spirituality and that this conscious aspect of capitalism within that business. And I think it’d be a very valuable read to anybody who is in tune with that thought.

Joshua Kornitsky: And how does it translate to customer satisfaction. Are your customers happy customers? Do you have a couple of good reviews?

Brian Jackson: Oui, oui. 5.0 in the Morgantown area with. I think we’re just now about to hit 1000 reviews, which is only strongly with more than we have. Yeah. And, uh, we have A+ rating with the Better Business Bureau. We’ve been voted by the community as the best in Morgantown five years in a row. Um, it’s constant positive feedback from our clients. And, you know, a lot of times an owner, uh, or even a higher level manager within the HVAC company, a lot of times taken with resolving customer unhappy customer issues. Right.

Joshua Kornitsky: Right. Somebody dedicated full time to solving that.

Brian Jackson: And that’s very rare for us. Um, it obviously happens. We’re not perfect. But even my my management team is so capable of handling that that it never has to come to me as an the owner, I might notice I get all the, uh, the emails every time somebody leaves a review so I can catch a, a low review if one happens to come in, which is rare, but as soon as I see that it’s boom, it goes out to a thread for all our managers to see, and somebody is on point to take care of that situation.

Joshua Kornitsky: And pretty quick mitigation.

Brian Jackson: I would say. I would say it has to be at least two years or more since I’ve ever had to personally talk to a client about a negative situation, because my team is so well equipped to handling those situations and the. So I’m in a privileged position where I now only have to have the positive experiences with my clients when I’m in a community activity or a fundraiser or things of that nature, and I’m engaging with people that use our services and get to hear all that positive feedback of how happy they are with our what we do.

Joshua Kornitsky: So it sounds like, uh, you, you don’t win your business by being the cheapest in town. You simply win it by being the best.

Brian Jackson: Right. Um, I’ve it’s like I almost don’t even think about price, which obviously you have to be conscious of it and and fortunately, I got, uh, uh, my key sales and, uh, finance, uh, director. And he’s also a business partner, and it’s like, uh, he’s very aware of the price structure and keeping that, you know, a great value for our clients. But I’ve always felt like if I’m focused on keeping my employees happy and they keep the customers happy. You know, there’s obviously a cost to that. Of course, if we’re going to maintain a high level of, uh, skilled people that fit our culture, they’re going to expect good benefits, good opportunities, good pay scale. Uh, and so we provide that. And for and using customer in their home, some of them, most of them appreciate that there is they’re not going to get the cheapest price and get the highest quality. In fact, I’ve always said that there’s only three things you can get when you make a purchase, and you have to pick two of the the most important to you because you can almost never have all three.

Joshua Kornitsky: What are those three?

Brian Jackson: You can get a high quality product. You can get high quality service of that product and you can get a low price, but you can never have all three. So you might have a low, uh, good quality product at a low price, but maybe that company is the one that doesn’t call you back when you need service, right? Right. Where they get their for service and they really don’t know what they’re doing. There’s a lot of good companies out there on the install side, but on the service side there’s some things to be desired. And so we like to be around where we can encompass both all aspects of what we do for our clients. But the point being that client has to choose really what is important to them. Do they want a quality product? Do they want a reliable service where they know that their equipment is being taken care of to where it’s running at peak efficiency? So they’re saving energy. Their air is being cleaned so that they have less dust in the house. Their kids are getting sick less. Those are the aspects that a lot of times customers aren’t aware of. And that’s where the education part of our culture is educating the customer what those choices are, so that if they need a lower price, there are options, but they understand you know what they might lose as far as efficiency your air quality is concerned, or if they want to invest in the higher level and have all the bells and whistles, they can do that. But it’s important that we’re educating the client about what those options are, not making the decision for them and educating them so they can make a confident decision, knowing where the right company for them.

Joshua Kornitsky: Well, and it sounds like the motivation behind the education is exactly that. You want to give them the option to make the decision. It’s not just the top price. Every time. It’s it’s you have choices.

Brian Jackson: We can segue that right into our second core value, which is empowering people. It’s like some some, uh, when you hear that empowering people right from the jump within a company situation, you think empowering your employees to to grow in their careers? Possibly. But we define empowering people also with our client base in community as well, because when we educate a client, we are empowering them to make a better decision about their home and their investment.

Joshua Kornitsky: 100%.

Brian Jackson: I educate them when we educate the community about. In fact, one thing that we have at Absolute Error is a program called Hope and heat. So every fall we look for individuals within the community that might be in need of a better heating system, but they don’t have the resource to get it. And so a lot of times we’ll partner with another organization like United Way is one that we partner with on this to identify who those people are and provide quality heating systems for them at no cost. And so we partner with vendors to do that. And so we are now empowering the community to be better for the individuals living there. Because of that aspect of what we do as a company.

Joshua Kornitsky: I mean, that’s making a difference in your community. It doesn’t get much better than that. So and what’s the next one?

Brian Jackson: Integrity in action.

Joshua Kornitsky: Um, Integrity in action. In action. In action.

Brian Jackson: In action.

Joshua Kornitsky: In action.

Brian Jackson: Okay. And I felt it was very important to establish the inaction part of that. Because if you just say we’re a company of integrity, that can be very generic. Anybody out there can say we have integrity. You should use us because you can trust us. We’re we’re an honest company. Those are words, right? Yes. What is integrity in action? That means we are proving that we have integrity when and that’s that’s where it comes down to the accountability, owning our mistakes, being upfront with the customer. Um, one example is, uh, we have, uh, a policy of a lifetime workmanship guarantee. So if if there’s a problem at any point in the future of a system that we’ve installed that we recognize as a result of something we did incorrectly when it was installed, we will cover that, whether that’s 10 or 15 years down the road. But it doesn’t matter.

Joshua Kornitsky: That’s pretty unique in the industry.

Brian Jackson: And that’s I mean, that’s that expresses our confidence that we’re going to do things right to start with. Right. We know that the likelihood of something like that happening is so minimal because of the quality of our service and products and because of the culture that we had, that guys want to do things the right way, and they know they have a space to reach out for support when they’re unsure of something that we have that confidence that what we provide for that client is going to be a lifelong investment that they can rely on. And so in the rare occasion that we have to follow through on a lifetime workmanship guarantee, we’re okay with that because it’s it’s it’s.

Joshua Kornitsky: Very who you are.

Brian Jackson: Very likely that’s going to happen. The only way I can think of that stands out in the moment was one where, um, we had installed new air conditioning system for somebody, and about a year later there was a leak on one of the braised joints that our technician had raised. We covered that repair for free. That’s normal. It was like within the first couple of years. But the technician that braised, it did not do a very good job of braising it. And about year 4 or 5, at least again, now it’s outside of the standard labor warranty, right? They never would have known that this was a problem that was a result of the original deficiency on how that joint was braised, but we just owned it. It’s like we could charge that customer whatever we needed to and said, you know, you have a leak. It needs repaired. Here’s the cost and do the work and get get paid. But we proactively go to that customer and say, hey, look, this is actually the same leak you had three years ago. Our guy must have not did that great of a job repairing it, unfortunately. We’re going to take care of this for free. Normally it would have been, you know, $1,200. Whatever. They present the price and say we’re going to waive that for you because this is a result of our workmanship guarantee. That’s so you can you can see where that can. Clients can be frustrated when their AC doesn’t work, obviously. And when you come to them and say, hey, you don’t have to pay for this repair, even though it’s our fault. They mean at first, the first thought, maybe I’m irritated because you guys should have fixed this right three years ago, but now you’re telling me they don’t have to pay for it? They never would have known otherwise. It was our fault. And we’re. That’s that’s true. Integrity in action.

Joshua Kornitsky: Couldn’t agree more. And and it’s interesting as we’ve gone through your core values, uh, this is a nontraditional way of demonstrating why you excel at what you do and why people should pick up the phone to call you when they have a need for install, repair, maintenance, or any of those things around heating or air, because you’re putting your your integrity on the line, saying these, these are the things that are mattering to us and therefore they will translate into excellent service and good value, ultimately long term for the customer. So integrity in action. Is there another core value.

Brian Jackson: Yes. So we have four. And the fourth one is progress with purpose.

Joshua Kornitsky: Okay.

Brian Jackson: So obviously um anybody that an employer has on their team, they want to see them progressing. I would hope all employers are that way.

Joshua Kornitsky: Ideally, but some are not. And I’m sure that you’ve seen that through your time in in industries that electrical and HVAC, not everybody’s appreciated.

Brian Jackson: Right. And I think my biggest reward as the owner of Absolute Heating and Air is seeing young people come into the business at entry level and grow and excel in their career wherever that takes them. In fact, uh, one example is a young man by the name of Paul Barlow, and I’ll send this to Paul so he can see it later. So Paul was one of the original Numbers to absolute error. In fact, I’ll flash back to 2013. Actually, this would have been 2014. So, um, I’d started the business in 2013 when I went back to the college at WVU and Paul was also at WVU. He went to high school with my son. They were good friends. So Paul’s in college, friends and college. Paul’s working at Lowe’s. Uh, and he would help us out on occasion with jobs. We needed extra hand. But then once my son graduated, I asked him, I said, uh, you want to dissolve this business that we’ve been working on here, or do you want to grow it? Because I was fine with either one at the point in time. My my interest was in psychology. Heating and air conditioning was my background. And I wanted to move forward with something in the psychology field. And I was fine with moving to the other side of the country if I needed to. But he said, you know, I got to think we got something good going here. Let’s grow this. And so I’m basically have moved forward, creating a legacy for my son that has now evolved into a legacy for every individual that works for us. So I’m flashing back now to May of 2014, and it was the Tuesday after Memorial Day of that year. I just remember this very distinctly, and we had five of us sitting around my dining room table. There was myself, my son, Paul Barlow, I just spoke about, and then two other guys that had just recently started working for us. And that was the true what I believe, the true onset of what absolute error was going to become. And I just realized I saved the wrong year. That was 2019.

Joshua Kornitsky: No, no one knows. But, you.

Brian Jackson: Know, 2018. But, um, 2013 was when we started in 2018 is when my son was graduating college and we were having this conversation. And then at that dining room table there, Paul Barlow was part of that original foundation of what became who we are today. And I remember at the time, Paul, you know, just out of college, he had some mechanical background. His family was in a construction business, so he was had some skills. But one of the first jobs I had him on, uh, he had, uh, a piece of conduit he was about to cut with a reciprocating saw over top of this, just newly installed, uh, laminate flooring had barely any space between that saw and the flooring.

Joshua Kornitsky: Something bad was going to happen.

Brian Jackson: And of course, he stopped in there. A week later, he somehow cut through the court of a reciprocating saw, a circular saw he was using. So just to show you the, the, uh, the green level Paul was on when he started for us back in 2018. So by 2024, Paul was without a doubt our top technician. Top selling technician. Um, he was on track to make $200,000 in 2024 Because he hit 100 K by the end of June. He was extremely valuable in the growth of our business, not only in what he was producing for the company as a service technician, but as a mentor for others and what he could show other people as they grew. And it kind of got blindsided in July when he told me that he was leaving to start his own business. And in prior years, if that would have happened, I would have been stressed out. Losing a top guy like that. It’s a big producer and a good mentor for our team, but I always knew that Paul had that ability and I don’t want to hold anybody back. And this is why that fourth core value progress, uh, with purpose is very important. I’m not going to hold back anybody from pursuing their career. In fact, back when some companies were having people sign non-compete agreements. Of course, they’re not legal now. But back then, when a lot of companies were doing that, I would not do that. It’s like, what if I can’t provide the space for you to thrive? Why am I going to prevent you from thriving somewhere else?

Joshua Kornitsky: Right.

Brian Jackson: Makes no sense to me.

Joshua Kornitsky: I couldn’t agree more. So you gave him that room to grow?

Brian Jackson: Yeah, I gave him that room to grow. Uh, we had a very amicable separation. He started his own business. Uh, we refer work to him. Sometimes he refers work to us. Sometimes. Uh, and there will always be a door of opportunity for him to return if he ever desires to do so. Um, and so a lot of respect there for Paul as an individual, how he handled the situation and how he’s growing as a family man and a father today. And, uh, I and my son’s the same way. You know, obviously, my son, uh, as, as, uh, this part of the legacy that I’m leaving to him, he’s he’s a solid part of absolute air. And he’s, you know, that top technician I’d say on a lot of aspects. Brandon, my son, um, exceeded Paul on, like, the customer service level, the understanding of our culture and the how we’re infusing that across the board. Paul had his own niche where he was just very focused on customer satisfaction within the home and how he performed in the home, and he excelled at that. So it’s like you got to start appreciating every aspect that every person brings in that business, and how you can help them to progress to their place in their career with purpose.

Brian Jackson: And one way of doing that is identifying unique abilities. Sure. Um, and it’s like we’re not trying to put round pegs and square holes. We’re looking at, you know, if somebody comes to us as a service technician, I’d say the more likely example, somebody comes to us on the installation side of the industry, right? But they have a desire to be a technician. We’re not forcing them to stay as a installer. We’re going to start to phase them into opportunities to taste what it’s like to be a service technician and see, that’s right, that’s right for them, or even within the office environment if somebody in a customer service role, but they feel inclined to pursue something more on the HR level or accounting level. We want to open up those doors of opportunity for them, because ultimately, the way I define a unique ability is something that you have passion for. You love doing it and you’re good at it, right?

Joshua Kornitsky: Absolutely.

Brian Jackson: So and you can have things you’re good at, but you just don’t like doing them. You have things that you really love to do, but you’re not good at it at all. And maybe you just don’t have the.

Joshua Kornitsky: Capacity.

Brian Jackson: The capacity to ever do it in an efficient way. And so once you identify that thing that you have passion for, that you love and you’re actually good at it. That’s what we want to help you to identify so that we can create your career path in line with that. So you’re not just thriving financially with the rewards we can provide. Absolutely. But you are thriving mentally and emotionally that you’re coming home from work in a better mindset to engage with your family. You’re able to spend a more relaxed weekend because you’re not stressed about what occurred during the week. It’s like that’s the kind of environment we want to provide for our team.

Joshua Kornitsky: So all of this leads me to one final question. Are you hiring because it sounds it sounds so. So what are you looking for? And I’m joking, but not right. You’ve laid out why absolute heating and air would be a fantastic place to work. What is it you look for? For the folks that that join your team?

Brian Jackson: So with the release of these new core values, these enhanced core values, next week, they will become part of our hiring process.

Joshua Kornitsky: That’s great.

Brian Jackson: We we will share these core values and how meaningful they are to us as a company in that interview. And we will ask that person, do you feel you have these values or share these values, or at least aspire to have these values? And if they hesitate with that, that doesn’t mean that they wouldn’t. Maybe they’re just. They want to be sure, but that they could even answer that question. Um, with a with a fake. Yes. But they’re not going to come back to us when we when we really present this core values with passion, that this is who we are as a company. This is our culture, and they know they don’t fit that box. I don’t anticipate they’re going.

Joshua Kornitsky: To know I agree with you. They’ll they’ll self-select out.

Brian Jackson: Right.

Joshua Kornitsky: And because it’s a very clear and persuasive argument that this is who we are.

Brian Jackson: Right. And so that’s the first thing we look for is does this person have the ability or the aptitude, the the mindset to fit our culture. Then we’ll look at what skills they have that can be used within the purpose of what we’re hiring them for, or what their aptitude is to an ability to learn that skill set in a short period of time. Um, so it really comes down to, you know, the who. Uh, of who fits the culture, who fits the values. And then we figure out what position within the company makes sense for what might align with their unique abilities.

Joshua Kornitsky: It it sounds like it would be a great opportunity for anybody at any stage, because there’s room to grow and and not just room to grow, encouragement to grow.

Brian Jackson: So and we’re we’re on that path. So every truck we get wrapped now is that we’re hiring on it. All the, uh, ads that we have for recruiting, they’re running consistently throughout the year. Because of that culture we’ve established, we’re now naturally attracting quality people.

Joshua Kornitsky: So if somebody is interested in applying, how do they where do they go? Who do they call?

Brian Jackson: Uh, go absolute Eircom is the website, and there’s a link on the homepage to a careers page. And they can either upload and submit a resume through that link. Or they can just fill out an application, either one. Um, so that would be step one. Um, that’s how to find us.

Joshua Kornitsky: And if we are interested, if someone listening is is interested in, uh, having you come out to install, repair, maintain. Same thing, same website. Go. Absolutely there. Uh, is there a website?

Brian Jackson: There’s. I think every page on the website has a submission form where they can, uh, have a digital request for somebody to call them. There’s also a link on the website where they can actually just go ahead and schedule the appointment without even calling the office. Or they’re always welcome to pick up the phone and give us a call. So, um, in fact, uh, if just to put this out there, we do have a, uh, a toll free number eight, three, three in the number four absolute. So just eight through three four absolute. And they can hopefully remember that and give us a call. But, uh, get the, uh, in respect to the hiring and our growth. Uh, we’re based in Morgantown, West Virginia. We’ve always done work in southeastern Pennsylvania. Uh, but we are growing closer to Pittsburgh. We’re looking for some quality people in the Pittsburgh area as well because we want to. We have intentions of launching a marketing campaign in a select portion of Pittsburgh in October of this year, and we’ll need some people to, uh, start generating that growth there as well.

Joshua Kornitsky: That’s fantastic. Well, Brian Jackson, founder of Absolute Heating and Air, I cannot thank you enough for what, for me was an incredibly inspiring discussion around your core values and why it makes your organization not only a great place to work, but a great place for your customers to seek service because they’re going to get unbelievable attention to detail and an incredible experience working with a company that seems to genuinely care.

Brian Jackson: Can I make one last comment?

Joshua Kornitsky: Absolutely.

Brian Jackson: Core values. This is where this goes back to our original conversation about taking care of the employees, who they take care of the clients and empowering them to do so. When our technicians or our installers or our customer comfort advisors in a home and they encounter a situation that maybe they haven’t encountered before, and they’re looking for how to make a decision for that client that’s in the best interests of the client and the company. These core values are structured so they can reflect on that. They they consider. What is absolute appreciation mean? What does it mean to empower people? What does it mean to have integrity and action and progress over purpose? And when they reflect on what those values mean, that should give them the tools to make that decision without having to reach out to a manager, unless it’s something beyond the scope of what they feel comfortable with. So they always have the resource of the team to reach out to. But we’re our intention with these core values is that gives empowers our team to make better decisions on the spot that are of value to the client and the value of the company, without having to wonder or be concerned about whether or not they’re making the right decision.

Joshua Kornitsky: It seems like it is a fantastic organization to do business with, because you’re giving your folks the autonomy to do what’s right, and it doesn’t get any better than that.

Brian Jackson: Thank you for recognizing that, Josh. That’s definitely what we’ve been trying to build. And as each day we’re not perfect, but as each day progresses, I feel just getting better and better all the time.

Joshua Kornitsky: Again, thank you. Brian Jackson, founder of Absolute Heating and Air. I’m Joshua Kornitsky, one of the hosts here at High Velocity Radio. We look forward to having you join us next time.

 

Tagged With: Absolute Heating & Air

From Street Eats to Strategic Branding: Lessons in Entrepreneurship

August 7, 2025 by angishields

CBRX-8525-Feature
Cherokee Business Radio
From Street Eats to Strategic Branding: Lessons in Entrepreneurship
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Brought to you by Diesel David and Main Street Warriors

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In this episode of Cherokee Business Radio, Joshua Kornitsky interviews Laura and Eric Hart, owners of Gaston Street Eats, about their transition from corporate jobs to running a thriving food truck and catering business focused on corporate events and community impact. They discuss their journey, menu development, leadership programs for young employees, and community outreach. Joshua also talks with Christy Renee Stehle, a brand storyteller and coach, who shares insights on authentic storytelling, personal growth, and building meaningful connections in business. The episode highlights entrepreneurship, community service, and the power of purposeful communication.

Laura-Ann-Hart-headshotLaura Ann Hart is the founder and president of Gaston Street Eats Co., home to two of Georgia’s most beloved food trucks—Gaston Street Eats and The Cheezy Truck. With a strong background in food service, hospitality, and brand development, Laura brings a passion for bold Southern flavors and meaningful community connection to everything she does.

Under her leadership, Laura’s company has earned a reputation not just for its crave-worthy menus, but also for its service-driven mission—feeding corporate teams, schools, nonprofits, and public safety departments across North Georgia. In 2025 alone, Gaston Street Eats Co. fed more than 60,000 people across the state of Georgia.

This impact was recognized with two major honors: the Top 25 Small Business of the Year Award from the Cobb Chamber of Commerce and the “Community Champion” Award from the Tommy Nobis Center.

Operating from a 2,100-square-foot commercial kitchen, Laura leads a talented team that manages catering, private events, and large-scale food service operations. Her attention to detail, commitment to quality, and heart for service have earned lasting partnerships and a growing client base.

What sets Laura apart is her ability to blend creativity with operational excellence. She oversees logistics, menu development, team leadership, and strategic growth—all while staying rooted in her core values of gratitude, integrity, and purpose. Gaston-Street-Eats-logo

Laura is a proud resident of Cobb County and actively supports causes that uplift local families and first responders. Her personal ties to law enforcement and her belief in servant leadership continue to inspire her to give back through food and fellowship.

Whether she’s planning a major event or personally thanking a client, Laura leads with humility, heart, and vision. Her entrepreneurial spirit and community-first mindset continue to drive the success of her company—one meal, one relationship, and one moment of kindness at a time.

Connect with Laura on LinkedIn.

Eric-Hart-headshotEric Hart is the Co-Founder | Operations Director of Gaston Street Eats Co.

Eric brings over 25 years of corporate hospitality experience and has been hands-on in every aspect of our business since day one.

He leads our operations, logistics, and food service— making sure each event runs smoothly and exceeds expectations.

Follow Gaston Street Eats on Facebook.

Christy-Renee-Stehle-headshotChristy Renee Stehle is a dynamic speaker, coach and consultant who specializes in helping organizations stand out and scale through the power of magnetic storytelling and presence.

From chronic illness and spending 5 years traveling across 35 countries to helping organizations find clarity, structure, and consistency of their brand, Christy is a wealth of wisdom and a catalyst for change.

Connect with Christy on LinkedIn and Facebook.

Transcript-iconThis transcript is machine transcribed by Sonix.

 

TRANSCRIPT

Intro: Broadcasting live from the Business RadioX studios in Woodstock, Georgia. It’s time for Cherokee Business Radio. Now, here’s your host.

Joshua Kornitsky: Welcome back. This is your host of Cherokee Business Radio Joshua Kornitsky. Professional EOS implementer. And today’s episode is brought to you in part by our community partner program, the Business RadioX Main Street Warriors defending capitalism, promoting small business, and supporting our local community. For more information, go to Main Street Warriors and a special note of thanks to our title sponsor for the Cherokee chapter of Main Street Warriors Diesel David, Inc.. Please go check them out at diesel.david.com. Well welcome back. We’re happy to have everybody join us today. It’s another exciting episode and I am thrilled to introduce Laura and Eric Hart, the owners of Gaston Street Eats. Good morning Laura, Eric.

Erik Hart: Good morning.

Laura Ann Hart: Good morning.

Joshua Kornitsky: How are you guys doing today?

Laura Ann Hart: We’re doing good. It’s awesome. Yeah, we’re excited to be here.

Joshua Kornitsky: I’m happy to have you guys here, and I think. I hope y’all have fun. So tell me, what is Gaston Street Eats?

Laura Ann Hart: We are a food truck and catering company that literally goes almost all over Georgia.

Joshua Kornitsky: Um, okay.

Laura Ann Hart: We have diverse menus. We are very inclusive for dietary restrictions. Do you want to jump in?

Erik Hart: No. You’re doing a great job.

Laura Ann Hart: We just. We have a lot of fun with our business.

Joshua Kornitsky: Well, that sounds great. What? What brought you to the land of of catering and food trucks.

Laura Ann Hart: Oh, by way of a restaurant.

Joshua Kornitsky: Okay.

Laura Ann Hart: Brought us this way. The short. The really short short version on that was we. My husband came home one day from corporate America and said, I can’t do it anymore.

Erik Hart: I was done.

Laura Ann Hart: And I’m like, you’re kidding, right?

Erik Hart: No, it was dead serious.

Laura Ann Hart: So he said, I’m I’m done. You’re going to end up burying me if I don’t get rid of this level of stress. And of course, we go into restaurants, right? With that stress.

Joshua Kornitsky: Sure. There’s no stress.

Laura Ann Hart: There. Of course not.

Joshua Kornitsky: So low effort, high margin.

Erik Hart: Absolutely. Yeah. Staff always shows up on time remotely.

Joshua Kornitsky: No problems.

Erik Hart: At all.

Laura Ann Hart: Yeah. So we spent he spent the next two years with me. I had a marketing company at the time. Okay. And then one day I said we were sitting across a table going over some marketing, uh, ads, and I said, baby, it’s time.

Erik Hart: It was actually the best two years of my life. I got to sit around, drink coffee, and help. That’s awesome. It was. It was awesome.

Laura Ann Hart: But I. I said, honey, it’s time you got to go do something.

Erik Hart: I was stressing her out.

Laura Ann Hart: Yeah, he was.

Joshua Kornitsky: But you weren’t stressed anymore. No, no. He wasn’t.

Erik Hart: It was unplugged.

Joshua Kornitsky: It’s the great. It’s the great balancing of the scales.

Laura Ann Hart: So, um, he’s. We saw a franchise on Shark Tank getting started, so we jumped in. Submitted our application for Tom and key. And the next thing I know, we’re building a restaurant.

Joshua Kornitsky: Wow.

Laura Ann Hart: And got it built in six months. Opened the doors. We thought this was going to be fabulous.

Erik Hart: Oh, yeah. Ten stores inside of 2 or 3 years.

Laura Ann Hart: That was our.

Erik Hart: Goal. That was.

Joshua Kornitsky: And what was the approximate date on this 2013? Okay.

Laura Ann Hart: So, um, 2014 is when we opened. Yeah. Somewhere in there. Yeah. Signed the papers in 2013. Opened in 2014. And it was great for the first two years. Right. And then, of course, you realize grilled cheese and a restaurant is not really a good concept.

Erik Hart: It was more of a novelty than.

Joshua Kornitsky: Absolutely to tell you that my family enjoyed it. Yes.

Laura Ann Hart: Yeah. I mean, it was great. The food was excellent, but it’s not sustainable. Okay, so.

Erik Hart: We lost the Shark tank bubble, right? Is when things started to go downhill a little bit.

Laura Ann Hart: So the next couple of years we we struggled along literally. Um, and we were. Intuitive enough. I think is the word I’m looking for. When we wrote our franchise agreement, we said we could open a food truck anytime.

Joshua Kornitsky: Okay.

Laura Ann Hart: So that was already in our contract. So literally we found a truck.

Erik Hart: In Kennesaw.

Laura Ann Hart: In Kennesaw in December, wrote the insurance policy in the parking lot of Home Depot and drove that sucker back to the store.

Joshua Kornitsky: Okay.

Laura Ann Hart: And then got it launched, uh, four months later. Of course, it ended up with a ton of stuff. But anyways, jumping forward, we that’s where our first exposure with the food truck came. Right. And it got to a point that the truck was outpacing the restaurant. The truck was supporting the restaurant.

Joshua Kornitsky: Really?

Laura Ann Hart: So we’re like, okay, something’s going on here. Well, of course, Covid hits and we had a tough decision. What are we going to do? Are we going to stay with the restaurant or are we going to go food truck only? And the part I, I kind of jumped over is that in 2020 we decided to launch. We were having such great success with the truck. We decided to launch our own brand, Gaston, the Southern Comfort Truck. Okay, so we had that one running during Covid and then 2021, we closed the restaurant, kept the space, converted it to a commercial kitchen, and launched the cheesy truck.

Joshua Kornitsky: Okay, so now there’s two trucks.

Laura Ann Hart: There’s two trucks, and then we’re in the process of building a third. And honestly, Eric and I are developmentally where I’m thinking we need to go coffee and dessert. He’s thinking we need to go more burgers and what have you.

Erik Hart: But we’re negotiating.

Laura Ann Hart: We’re negotiating.

Joshua Kornitsky: Okay. Well, the good news is, I think that there’s room for both. There is. And who knows?

Laura Ann Hart: Maybe I need to get another.

Joshua Kornitsky: Truck right down the road. There’s your solution. It is. You don’t have to pick one. Pick both. Um, as as an old boss of mine. You say all it takes is money.

Laura Ann Hart: Absolutely.

Joshua Kornitsky: So. So it sounds like it’s been quite a journey. Is this has all come together. And did either of you have food truck experience when you jumped off that cliff?

Laura Ann Hart: No no no no no no no.

Erik Hart: We learned this business the hard way.

Laura Ann Hart: And our first event was with, um. It’s called The Grove now, but at the time it was Piney Grove Church. They changed their name and a very good friend of ours, uh, Pastor Dallas White, he brought us out for that was our very first event. And we totally we did. But who better than with a pastor? Because when it was all over, he goes, we need to pray.

Joshua Kornitsky: So. Well, there you go.

Laura Ann Hart: He got us together and did this little huddle and prayed for our business and for it, and we figured it out. We did a lot of trial and error, but we got it.

Joshua Kornitsky: It’s amazing that people always, always have to learn from messing up. But that’s that’s how we as humans are. If it all came easy, there’d be 30 trucks on every corner. And for a brief period of time, there were. But it turned out it was a pretty hard business to get into.

Erik Hart: Yeah, most trucks don’t make it very long.

Joshua Kornitsky: And I imagine that that the, um, the process of designing and settling on your menus probably was that same trial and error. Or did you already know from the restaurant experience? What was a good mover?

Erik Hart: Well, the cheesy truck was an easy solution because we just, you know, modified the recipes from what we were doing before and we just continued to execute at a very high level with great ingredients. And that set the foundation for the menu on the cheesy truck. Now, Gaston was more of a love of food that Laura and I share. Go ahead.

Laura Ann Hart: No you won’t. Um, the thing with Gaston was we have a little bed in breakfast in Savannah called, uh, the Gastonia.

Joshua Kornitsky: Okay.

Laura Ann Hart: And Eric and I would go there once, twice a year, just, you know, to get away for a couple of days. And, of course, we would eat our way through Savannah. Who doesn’t when you’re down there? I mean, there’s the food is just amazing. So it was a combination of things that we really liked. And then, honestly, it was from a very dear friend of ours, Melissa Bailey, who was with Remax here in, uh, canton. She’s in canton, right. Um, at the time, she worked for.

Erik Hart: Cisco.

Laura Ann Hart: Cisco. And so she got us with a chef with chef Tom, which I think he’s local as well. Yes. And I, we put everything on paper and said, here you go, chef. Tom, this is what we want. Help us build this menu. He goes got it. Came back to us a month later. Down at the Cisco Kitchen and said let’s go through everything. And then gosh, two weeks later he met with Eric and then they built the recipes. So it was, I think, the beautiful thing about this whole thing that we’ve put together. Everywhere you look, there was a piece of community.

Joshua Kornitsky: Well, and I want to.

Laura Ann Hart: Get.

Joshua Kornitsky: To that, and I want to get to that, because you had shared with me that that just in the last year you guys had received a couple of awards. We did. So share those with us because I have some questions.

Laura Ann Hart: Sure. Um, 2023, we got, um, cob chamber, uh, top three business to watch because we were just coming on the scene with the new with the new concept and what have you. And then last this year for 2025, we got the top 25 businesses in Cobb County.

Joshua Kornitsky: That’s fantastic.

Laura Ann Hart: And then Tommy Nobis, uh, honored us with, uh, the Community champion award for this year.

Joshua Kornitsky: So yeah, that speaks.

Laura Ann Hart: Very.

Joshua Kornitsky: Humbling of, of of the way that you’re working and the types of things that you’re doing. And, and I want to talk more about that. But I want to clarify one thing because when you say food truck, I’m not sure that everybody understands there are more than one type of food truck business. Right. And, and are you the show up at the concert and the fair type of food truck or how where does your business come from? And I’ll circle back on community, but I feel like it’s important to clarify that.

Laura Ann Hart: That’s a great question. Here’s the the wonderful thing about the food truck industry. You can run it any way you want, right? But I know me. I’m a control freak, hands down. I do not want to sit on a curb and wait. Wait for someone to arrive. I can’t, I can’t do it.

Joshua Kornitsky: The ice cream man model.

Laura Ann Hart: Absolutely. And the thing is that that’s not such a great model. Especially if you are supporting staff in family and obligations. So what we did was we kind of flipped it a little bit and went commercial in a sense with corporate catering. Um, you hire me for employee appreciation anniversary celebrations, birthdays in 80, 85% of our business. Is that.

Joshua Kornitsky: Wow. So it’s much more predictable. Absolutely. You know.

Laura Ann Hart: Before we go out, how many people were serving what your menu is? Everything’s done. We’re ready. And that has allowed us to grow.

Erik Hart: And on the business side, it also helps us control costs.

Joshua Kornitsky: Yes. Well, sure. Because you you had mentioned in passing that your that your dietary, uh, fulfillment aspect. I’m trying to find the right way to say that, but that you’re very accommodating to different needs of the people that are getting food from you. Isn’t that.

Laura Ann Hart: Yes. That’s really big for us. Whether you’re eating on the Gaston truck or you’re eating on the cheesy truck. We want you. And I think it’s one of our taglines. We feed everyone, okay. We really, really can. Um, gluten free, vegan, vegetarian meat eaters, baby. You know, kids. I mean, we’ve got something for you and whatever. Yeah. We modify menus for no pork, no. No meat, no meat. I mean, we can do this on both Gaston and Cheesy. Everybody should be able to enjoy a food truck experience.

Joshua Kornitsky: So, I mean, I think that that’s incredibly, um, cognizant of of who you’re serving, right. Because a lot of, uh, just thinking in a generic food services, uh, thought process, you know, restaurants are often this is what we have, right? Uh, and to take that consideration on the front end, I think is fantastic and again, kind of speaks to your community service because you’re serving everybody in the community.

Laura Ann Hart: Yeah. What? It would be terrible if you were an employee at one of these companies. And we show up for your employee appreciation and there’s nothing for you.

Joshua Kornitsky: You’re not appreciated.

Laura Ann Hart: Yeah, exactly. You’re not appreciated. There’s nothing for you to eat. So it is one of those questions we do ask our clients. Is there something we need to know? We’ve got one right now where we’ve got to pull all the shellfish off Gaston for their menu, and we’re just replacing it with different items.

Joshua Kornitsky: It’s great that you’ve got that flexibility.

Laura Ann Hart: Yeah.

Joshua Kornitsky: Um, so if you’re comfortable, who are some of the types of businesses you serve? And because you’re 85% leaning in in that direction, I want anybody that’s listening to know, you know what what size organizations can you help? What types of businesses are you typically working with?

Laura Ann Hart: We work with all kinds of businesses. We have, you know.

Erik Hart: Manufacturing sector, retail sector, homebuilders, you name it, we’ve been there. Movie sets. Um, we’ve done a lot of stuff for Netflix. Um, Universal Studios.

Joshua Kornitsky: Oh, so not not mom and pop or not.

Erik Hart: Oh, no no, no.

Laura Ann Hart: Well we do we do what we do, mom and pop too. I think the thing is, um, there’s so much diversity with what we do because of the. And this is where Eric is just really, really excels from his previous experience. He’s the director of operations. He understands that speed of service.

Joshua Kornitsky: Right.

Laura Ann Hart: We don’t want you waiting an hour in line. I want you to fellowship, enjoy your friends, talk with your coworkers, have time to eat your lunch or dinner.

Erik Hart: And yeah, everything we do as far as menu development, truck layout, staffing, training, everything is geared towards executing those menus as quickly as possible so that if we have, you know, 200 people to feed, we can get it done. And that’s, you know, that’s that’s one of our selling points when we’re dealing with these larger clients.

Joshua Kornitsky: Sure. And that makes perfect sense because it’s it’s going to let them know that bringing you in for an hour and a half on site, that you’re going to feed everybody, rather than just having everybody waiting to take their stuff back to their desk.

Laura Ann Hart: Yeah, there’s nothing worse.

Joshua Kornitsky: It’s a waste of effort, time, and that if you’re doing it for goodwill, you lose the goodwill that you’re at. You do. So I think that what you’re the the the very operational approach, the very strategic approach to something that is often a passion project with less of a business sense versus you guys approaching it like a business is, is pretty remarkable, and it’s making a pretty big difference. But this allows me to kind of open the door and come back, because you are looking at this as a business, what does it mean? How do you help your employees kind of look towards the future and be prepared, because obviously you must have pretty rigorous training in order to be able to sustain what you’re doing.

Laura Ann Hart: Yes. Eric. Eric and I, um, the people that come to us are in a very particular stage of their life. They are going there in college, coming out, you know, trying to finish up college. They’re in between. I don’t know if I’m going to go to college. I’m not sure. They’re they’re young. That seems to be what we attract. So very early on, we decided that, you know what? One of the ways that we can give back to this, these kids, I call them kids. They’re just amazing young men and women. The way we can give back is by pouring into them. And so we developed a leadership development program about five years ago.

Erik Hart: While we were still Tom. And we did that program.

Joshua Kornitsky: Pretty remarkable for the type of business you’re in. It’s not can’t be very common.

Erik Hart: It’s all about talent development. Even though we’re only going to get them for 2 or 3 years if we’re lucky. Yep. We’re striving to make sure that they have the tools necessary not only to perform well for us, but to perform in life. And that’s why we we do this quote unquote book club. And we do a book about every, what, 6 to 8 weeks. And, um, we then have a meeting regarding, uh, the discussion points, if you will. And it’s amazing to sit back and watch the eyes, you know, light up as they find that nugget in that discussion to apply it to their own lives. And and in doing so, we get a better team. They work.

Joshua Kornitsky: Absolutely.

Erik Hart: Fantastic with each other, and we’re making a little bit of difference in their lives.

Joshua Kornitsky: Well, and I think that in this kind of circles, this back around, pardon me to the fact that you are so dedicated to the community, you’re actually helping build the community, which is a pretty cool approach for for a business to have. What are some of the other community outreaches that that you’ve done?

Laura Ann Hart: We we were truly, truly and I mean blessed to be able we were we used to have a program where we were doing it once a quarter. It’s what we could afford. Sure. And then we moved into once a month. Um, we’ve been able to do some form of what we call it is a giveback. Okay. And it’s everywhere from we’ll go and feed the police department. We’ll feed fire. We’ll feed, um, Calvary children’s home.

Erik Hart: It wasn’t Calvary our first giveback.

Laura Ann Hart: It was our very first one. So, um, there’s different things that we’re able to do now that we involved our involve our team with where. Here’s the thing if we want. And it was a friend of mine, Michael Everhart, and he’s local as well. Gosh. Everybody’s local. And he had said that if you take care of your backyard and I take care of my backyard. We’ll have a really great community to live in. So this is just taking care of our backyard. Um, by having these things, it’s also teaches our staff about servant leadership, where they can go and take care of their backyard eventually.

Joshua Kornitsky: Resonates very strongly with me. Well, I commend you both because you’re doing something that. Excuse me again. Uh, you’re doing something really remarkable where you’re not just bringing a wonderful product into the marketplace and making it available to people. You’re also really in really working to both improve the community and the people in it. And I, as someone who works with all different sized businesses, that’s a wonderful, wonderful thing to see. And I happen to live in this community. So, so it matters a lot to me. Thank you. That’s fantastic. Well, what let me let me round out by just asking what’s the right size. So if someone’s hearing this and they’re like, yeah, these these folks are great. Their menu, uh, resonates because I’ll be able to feed everybody regardless of their needs. Right. If they want to reach out. What? What makes the most sense? What? What size organization. How many people is is a good fit for you guys to serve?

Laura Ann Hart: Well, I used to think it was anything over 50, but in the last month or so I’ve had people who’s booking me for 20 people. Okay, so I really think it depends on what your goal is. We’ve got a couple events coming up where we’re feeding 400. Well, we fed 150 on Sunday. We fed 225 on Saturday. It just really depends on your occasion.

Erik Hart: And.

Laura Ann Hart: When we have and how you want to celebrate.

Erik Hart: And when we have bigger events, we can just bring both trucks to the same place so we can really accommodate.

Joshua Kornitsky: So that makes sense.

Laura Ann Hart: Yeah, absolutely. And I think the key is, is we stop it accordingly. And that’s all Eric. He’s just I can’t say enough about the operation and I may handle all the other stuff. But if he wasn’t putting together the plan for us to be successful on the ground. This wouldn’t work. So we know with the larger events.

Erik Hart: I have a lot of support. So thank.

Laura Ann Hart: You. You’re welcome. Uh, well, we’ll have 4 or 5 extra. I mean, we’ll bring the extra team again. I don’t want you 400 people. I don’t want you standing in line an hour. So.

Joshua Kornitsky: So it’s. It’s funny. I had a guest on a few months back, uh, a guy named John Basford, who’s a wonderful coach and teacher and speaker, and I just read an email from him this morning. Backstory. My wife is an operation strategist. That’s what she does. Uh, and in this email that he sent today, it said that marketing may be the rock star, but operations make sure the mic works.

Laura Ann Hart: Absolutely.

Joshua Kornitsky: And I really liked how I like that, how that translated. And it seemed really appropriate here. Well, uh, Eric and Laura, what’s the best way for people to reach you?

Laura Ann Hart: Go ahead, call Laura.

Erik Hart: Yeah.

Laura Ann Hart: Actually we just. And I. And I’m so excited about this. Um, we’ve got so many changes happening this year. We’re investing in infrastructure, investing in our SEO, and we just had websites redone. Um, so honestly, website you could go to Gaston Street, Pets.com or the Cheesy Truck. Com or you can just call me and.

Joshua Kornitsky: And what’s the number?

Laura Ann Hart: My number is (678) 986-9234. Or you can Google grilled cheese truck and we’ll pop up now. There you go.

Joshua Kornitsky: So yeah I will. Obviously we’ll have all of this on our site to to make sure that people know how to get Ahold of you. But I’m glad you shared that with us. Well, Laura and Eric Hart, the owners of Gaston Street Eats, thank you so much for sharing your incredible story with us. Uh, I’ve got another guest here in the studio. I hope you have the ability to to stay with us, because I think you’ll find her, uh, incredible and fascinating. So good morning. It’s my incredible pleasure to introduce Christy Renee Stehle, a magnetic brand storyteller, a strategist, a speaker and a coach. Good morning Kristie.

Christy Renee Stehle: Good morning.

Joshua Kornitsky: I’m so happy to have you here. I had the chance to to first meet you at a Kennesaw State family business event where you were on the panel and, and was drawn directly to this, the brand storytelling. Uh, it just blew me away. But tell us a little bit about what you do and how you help folks.

Christy Renee Stehle: Yes, well, I’m a speaker and coach, and I really help brands tell their story to grow their loyal client base, which is incredibly important today in the disrupted market that we’re dealing with humanity, our personal connection, our connection to community is, believe it or not, more valued than it’s ever been in this world of AI. And so I find people having a hard time understanding, well, how do I articulate that humanity from behind a digital screen? Sure. And that’s really where I come in.

Joshua Kornitsky: Well, okay. So that’s pretty incredible. What kind of brought you there?

Christy Renee Stehle: You know, believe it or not, I was reflecting on this last night. I had a speech impediment growing up. Really? And I was taken out of school. I was taken out of class to go under the stairs in this converted janitor’s closet and learn how to just sound normal. And having this training where okay, your mouth shape, your tongue placement, it really developed my ear for language. I started to notice more. I started to be more interested in reading in words and communication. And I think that this is also why I have such a good ear for language I’m able to hear. I’m able to form my mouth, and I think that really helps in the articulating of the invisible essence that comes through when somebody shows up. You know, I always say that our energy tells our story before we open our mouth. And, you know, so I’m able to feel that I’m able to sense that and then I’m able to articulate it for others.

Joshua Kornitsky: So it sounds like overcoming the speech impediment was the key to unlocking your superpower of of enhanced perception.

Christy Renee Stehle: And isn’t it interesting how the pain becomes the power?

Joshua Kornitsky: Well, there’s a wonderful line. I’m a big movie guy, so you’ll hear me quote movies all the time. Uh, the line from the movie was simply that the pain will continue until the learning is complete. Uh, and I’ll tell anybody that wants to know the name of the movie, but I don’t want to pollute the discussion with getting off on a movie conversation. So what is it you do to help those you help?

Christy Renee Stehle: There’s a lot that goes into it, to be honest with you. At this stage of my business, I do a lot more than I would recommend that anybody does. Um, but I am very dynamic. I, you know, you guys met me at two different Kennesaw State University events, and it just seems that everybody needs this right now. Whether you’re an event organizer wanting to put together really transformational event, whether you’re an organization scaling and saying, you know, maybe we’ve just merged, there’s a lot of that going on right now. Seven brands going under one umbrella brand. How can we be consistent? And so there are certain patterns that run through whether I’m helping large scale organizations or entrepreneurs. It really still is that okay. We’re going to document very strategically your communication guidelines. So every time you show up you’re being consistent. You know what to say.

Joshua Kornitsky: And to that idea.

Christy Renee Stehle: There’s there’s actually a lot of, uh, strategy behind the format of storytelling. And a lot of times people think, you know, I’m just going to show up and tell my brand story, or how do I even do that? Maybe I’m putting it on an about page of a website, or how do you tell a story in a short amount of time. So there really is structure to that. And I help people develop patterns and and communicate that.

Joshua Kornitsky: And that’s what I really wanted to understand. So what are some of the misconceptions that people have when they come to you. And they’re like, okay, well, you know, my dad started the business and I graduated college and I picked up the business, and that’s the story, you know. What are the misconceptions that people have? How do you help them understand and elicit from them at a high level where their story is?

Christy Renee Stehle: Yeah, I think the biggest misconception is that I can’t tell a story because I don’t have enough time. So I just need to be very direct. I need to focus on our product, our benefits, our features. And that’s really the old way of doing things right now. People need that. Like I said, that humanity, that essence and emotion is actually what triggers memory in the brain. So if you’re able to communicate with emotion Motion. While you’re earning their time and attention, you’re earning their trust. And I was just talking with another local business, and, uh, we were laughing about how, you know, today’s market, you have to tell a compelling story online to even get them to have any interest in giving you their time and attention and showing up to a brick and mortar.

Joshua Kornitsky: I have to imagine that there are statistics somewhere about how long that attention span is that you have to capture them.

Christy Renee Stehle: Do you remember, uh, years ago, we heard that we have an attention span shorter than a goldfish.

Joshua Kornitsky: That I have.

Christy Renee Stehle: That that was years ago. For us, it is half that today.

Joshua Kornitsky: And half a goldfish.

Christy Renee Stehle: It’s half a goldfish. Wow. Which is pretty sad. And if that so, it translates into if we if everything else remain the same and we’re just talking about attention span, we would have to work twice as hard to capture and retain that attention. But everything has not remained the same.

Joshua Kornitsky: Sure. No, the content is tripling, is constant.

Christy Renee Stehle: Volume has tripled year over year in the last three years.

Joshua Kornitsky: That’s an AI and the content length has reduced probably by a factor of three, I would guess.

Christy Renee Stehle: Yes, and very interesting. I’m seeing long form content coming back. We’re on the flip side of that. So you see things like Substack where people are having long form content. You’re seeing Instagram Reels went from 90s. They’re now allowing two minutes. Tick tock. That’s good news. Would allow up to ten minutes. So people are giving attention more. But two things that are worthy and that is very important. How do you communicate your value in the first few seconds to get people to buy in, to get people to watch longer form content?

Joshua Kornitsky: So I’m going to ask a question that that is an oversimplification, right? But is it as is it formulaic or does it have to be tailored when you work with your clients. Is there a a b c d e? And we have a successful story. Or do you have to work with them and elicit from them. Sort of the the origin and the development and understand it as an arc.

Christy Renee Stehle: Both both are absolutely true. There is a formulaic structure to it. But in order for me to get that data that goes into the structure, we need to have a conversation. And I laugh a lot. People think, wow, Christie, you did such a great job. You articulated it so well. This is so amazing. Like you, you did it. You know, you gave me all of those data points, and then I just helped put it in that structure.

Joshua Kornitsky: I understand that completely because oftentimes the the genius is in the room and it’s their genius. You’re just helping them. Get it out.

Christy Renee Stehle: We all have blind spots when it comes to our unique gifts. And for brands, it tends to be, I don’t know our value. I don’t know how to articulate our value, what makes us different? And in a very short conversation, we’re able to see, you know, an amazing example as an automotive company in our local community who takes care of their customers as if they were a trusted advisor. They are the chick fil A of automotive and they could not see that. Like, wait a minute. Every automotive place is trying to scam us. You’re taking care of us. That’s your unique distinguishing. And we replace their elevator pitch in 15 minutes flat.

Joshua Kornitsky: Wow. And has it resonated?

Christy Renee Stehle: Oh, yes. Oh, yes. You can see I actually put it on my my Instagram account, I featured them. I was so taken with their story that now I’m featuring them and referring them. And here I am talking about it on a radio show.

Joshua Kornitsky: So because you dropped it, what? How do how do people find you on Instagram?

Christy Renee Stehle: As Christy sees it, it is my it is my legacy account from when I traveled the world, my perspective, and as a brand advisor, I would I would really recommend being the same on every platform. And I’m breaking my own rules, but I cannot. I’m not ready to let it go.

Joshua Kornitsky: Okay, so you wait. You traveled the world?

Christy Renee Stehle: Yes I did.

Joshua Kornitsky: Um, did you learn anything in that little adventure?

Christy Renee Stehle: Oh my gosh. Yes. Well, in 2015, I overcame chronic illness and realized that health is our greatest wealth and time is our most valuable resource. So I heard a parable. You may know the one it says, imagine you have $86,400 deposited into your bank account every day. Okay, you have to use it or you lose it the next day. Nothing transfers over. You can’t get that money back. You have to use it all. Well, it goes on to say, surprise, we have 86,400 seconds in a day, and if you don’t use it, you will lose it. And I can remember standing on my front porch in Florida feeling better than I had felt in years. For the first time, I had full body chills. And I remember thinking, you know what? I’m not. I’m losing it. I’m not using it. Right? So I sold my house and everything I owned, and I traveled for five years across 35 countries. Holy cow. So I’ve learned quite a few things in that time. The most important being do the things that make you feel alive. Don’t get stuck and communicating with others.

Christy Renee Stehle: That’s really where I started to refine this skill of communicating with energy. The amount of times I’ve been in a country where maybe I know, thank you as my only word, and I’ve studied for that and been able to communicate and get my needs met no matter what, is something I’ve started to take for granted. And I was in Montreal a couple of weeks ago, and I was with one of my friends, and now I don’t speak French at all. I have maybe five words. I leverage them very well during my time, but I did not know how to ask. Wait, where’s a wine shop? So I was able to have that conversation with a cashier. She spoke no English, I spoke no French, and my friend was just standing here. And as I turned around after I found out, okay, there’s a wine in the complex of five minutes down the road. She looked at me and she’s like, that’s very impressive of both of you. How did you do that? It’s like, well, just a little bit of this and a little bit of that.

Joshua Kornitsky: That’s, well, you find a way to communicate that. Absolutely. That’s fantastic. And I think you just answered the next thing that I was going to ask you, which is what drives you, what is why are you so passionate about what you do? It sounds to me like the the ticking seconds are a piece of that. What else? What else gets you excited about the work you do?

Christy Renee Stehle: Yes. Well, definitely. Like you said, I’m excited about using my time here on Earth in a very fulfilling way. But that also comes down to connection, you know, and and community, which I know we’ve talked about earlier and, you know, at the end of five years traveling abroad, being in a different city or country every week, it all started to feel as amazing as that experience was. It all started to feel a bit empty, and I really was craving connection and community at a level of these. People have seen me grow through different stages of life. Right there, here. There’s a certain realness to that. And so I came home to Marietta, Georgia, a place that none of us ever thought I would return in a.

Joshua Kornitsky: After a 35 country tour. I, I would think it’d be the last place on my mind.

Christy Renee Stehle: Well, every hero’s journey.

Joshua Kornitsky: Comes.

Christy Renee Stehle: Home. Comes home. And I really felt very called to share everything that I have learned with my community. And just as we were talking about earlier, you know, when you do take care of your backyard, when you do invest in your community, well, our communities determine the quality of our lives. And I’ve seen countries like Cambodia just wrecked by tragedy, that tragedy, and have absolutely nothing. And they’re the happiest people. They’re the most grateful, they’re the happiest, and they have these very rich communities. And so that’s what really started to change in my mind of like, wait a minute. We I kind of grew up with everything and I don’t feel this appreciate it. I don’t feel this grateful, and it really started to shift my mind into what really matters.

Joshua Kornitsky: Well, and it sounds like I mean, obviously we all have to eat, we all have to pay our bills. But it sounds like this is more than about money for you.

Christy Renee Stehle: Absolutely. I have made a lot of money in my life and I’ve been broken my life. And at the end of it, yes, profit does help get your message out there. Obviously, we have to take care of ourselves. It’s a big part of that. But it’s not the driving factor and fulfillment and connection and community. And, you know.

Joshua Kornitsky: There’s there’s a whole lot more to it than money.

Christy Renee Stehle: There is.

Joshua Kornitsky: That’s fantastic. Well, Christi, what’s next? Where are you? Still traveling? Um, are you working around the world? What are you doing?

Christy Renee Stehle: Well, immediately next, on August 22nd, I will be the opening keynote speaker at the Kennesaw Business Association Super Women’s Conference. Wonderful. So I will be talking about how to leverage what I call magnetic presence for impossible growth, to be able to increase your status and your importance and your fulfillment in life. And after that, I am off to Vegas. I did just win a very prestigious award, but I’m sure it is still, um, having me a little like, wow, did that really just happen? But I won the 2025 Smart Meetings Best of Stage award. I am in the Life Changers category, across from four time Olympian athletes and keynote speakers and some global head of events. And I’m heading to Vegas for the VIP party to get to celebrate.

Joshua Kornitsky: And speaking for watching, uh, the folks in the room, it. I can tell you that you definitely seem to inspire, myself included. Uh, it is really a joy to have you here, and you deserve that award. Congratulations.

Christy Renee Stehle: You so much.

Joshua Kornitsky: Thank you. Um, if people want to understand better the value of what you offer, whether as a speaker or as a storyteller or as a coach, how do people reach you?

Christy Renee Stehle: Well, I am on all the social media platforms, but the easiest way to find me since I am breaking my own rules. There is my website christy.com. You can learn about my speaking, my coaching, all of the past case studies that I’ve done and see really yourself in some of the organizations that I’ve worked with, you know, I’ve worked with Claire’s, who went from bankruptcy to 51% growth in a single year while I helped them develop a new voice for a new generation. So I’ve got a lot of stories and companies that I’ve worked with on my website. You can check it out.

Joshua Kornitsky: That’s fantastic. And is that part of when when you have a speaking engagement, obviously they probably ask you to talk about certain things, but I have to believe that must be part of your overall story, those that you’ve helped.

Christy Renee Stehle: Well, of course, of course, of course.

Joshua Kornitsky: It’s just I’m privy because you shared some of them with me that, that, um, it is the stories that you tell that truly empower people to get to know you better. Uh, and, and I would encourage you if you would. Is there one more you could share with us.

Christy Renee Stehle: Well, yes. And before I do, you know, on that, um, I think the true gift of strategic storytelling is selling, telling a story that your audience feels seen and understood in hearing that story. And I think that that really is the goal. And so, yes, I do talk about the successes that I have, but sometimes I can get plugged into an energy of a room and just start talking about great transformation. And, um, sometimes that takes on a different form. But yes, I have worked with LTL freight as well. They were my favorite company to work with, and the rest of my team was always like, Christie, this is a great company. Why are you excited about this? This is so boring. But I love them because they had what I call alignment internal and external alignment. So that just means that they do what they say they they do, they take care of that. But it’s a radical concept today. They take care of their employees, they take care of their customers. And because of that, telling their brand story was very fun. You know, they.

Joshua Kornitsky: Had.

Christy Renee Stehle: It was versus some of the other companies that would come through and not really have that data. They don’t have ways that they’re doing good. And they would just say, well, we we do good in the community. Um, do you can I have some examples, please. And specificity is always the key. Um, so I think that, you know, leave with that little nugget when you’re trying to.

Joshua Kornitsky: Tell.

Christy Renee Stehle: There’s, there’s a nugget. There’s there’s a nugget here. Yes. I think that it’s very easy. One of the biggest mistakes is I see generic messaging all of the time. Well, we make.

Joshua Kornitsky: An appeal to all.

Christy Renee Stehle: People. And when you’re, when you. Yeah, when you speak, when you try to speak to everybody, you’re heard by no one.

Joshua Kornitsky: That that’s a great closure. Thank you Christie. So I mean, just a wonderful, wonderful show today. Thank you again, Christie Renee Steely magnetic storyteller, strategist, speaker and coach. Thank you again. Laura and Eric Hart, the owners of Gaston Street Eats. Um, just a great show. Thank you guys all for being here, for giving your time and sharing your knowledge and experience. My name is Joshua Kornitsky. I am the host of Cherokee Business Radio. I’m also a professional implementer of the EOS system, and I just want to remind everybody that today’s episode was brought to you in part by the Community Partner Program, the Business RadioX Main Street Warriors Defending Capitalism, promoting small business, and supporting our local community. For more information, go to Main Street Warriors and a special note of thanks to our title sponsor for the Cherokee chapter of Main Street Warriors Diesel David, Inc.. Please go check them out at diesel. David. Thank you guys again for joining me here today. Thank you for listening. We’ll see you next time.

 

From Disruption to Innovation: How to Embrace Conflict in Your Organization

August 4, 2025 by Jacob Lapera

High Velocity Radio
High Velocity Radio
From Disruption to Innovation: How to Embrace Conflict in Your Organization
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On this episode of High Velocity Radio, Lee Kantor interviews Kim Faircloth and Dawn Bedlivy, authors and founders of Conflict Sparks Change. They discuss how workplace conflict, if managed well, can drive innovation and positive change. Sharing their expertise in mediation and conflict management, Kim and Dawn introduce practical frameworks like the Four Cs of Trust and the H.E.R.E model, offering leaders actionable strategies to foster open communication, build trust, and transform conflict into collaboration.

Kim Faircloth (PhD, SHRM-SCP, SPHR) is a seasoned professional with over 30 years of experience in conflict resolution coaching and mediation, leadership development, and executive coaching. As the owner of Integrated Conflict Solutions, LLC, she empowers individuals and organizations to effectively manage conflicts and enhance employee engagement.

A certified coach and trained mediator, Dr. Faircloth has guided thousands in addressing workplace conflicts. Her expertise spans roles such as ombudsman, workforce strategies consultant, and director of human resources. Drawing on her doctoral studies in conflict and mediation, she is a senior principal trainer and consultant at the Mediation Training Institute based in St. Petersburg, Florida. She continues to make significant contributions to the field, driven by her commitment to peacemaking and educating future HR professionals.

Dawn Bedlivy (Esq) is a distinguished conflict resolution specialist with over three decades of experience. Her expertise encompasses leadership development, alter- native dispute resolution, and conflict systems design. Ms. Bedlivy has successfully led teams and delivered consultation and training at prestigious venues.

As an accomplished ombudsman, mediator, and organizational systems coach, she has applied her skills to spearhead an innovation ecosystem. Demonstrating her commitment to education, Ms. Bedlivy serves as adjunct faculty at the University of Maryland Francis King Carey School of Law, where she educates future professionals in conflict resolution.

Follow Conflict Sparks Change on LinkedIn.

What You’ll Learn in This Episode

  • How embracing conflict as a driver of innovation reshapes workplace conversations, and what leaders can do to harness conflict to spark change
  • The hidden costs of unresolved conflicts in teams, such as productivity loss, reputation or legal risks, and how leaders can proactively engage to mitigate some of these costs
  • How the 4 C’s (Competence, Confidence, Consistency, Caring) help leaders coach employees and build trust during difficult conversations
  • Why people tend to cling to their stories during particularly entrenched conflicts, and how leaders can use the H.E.R.E model (Honor, Explore, Reflect, Enable/Empower) to forward momentum

Transcript-iconThis transcript is machine transcribed by Sonix.

 

TRANSCRIPT

Intro: Broadcasting live from the Business RadioX studios in Atlanta, Georgia. It’s time for High Velocity Radio.

Lee Kantor: Lee Kantor hear another episode of High Velocity Radio and this is going to be a good one. Today on the show, we have Kim Faircloth and Don Libby. They are the authors of the book and owners of the organization. Conflict sparks change. Welcome.

Kim and Dawn: Thank you and glad to be here. Great to be here.

Lee Kantor: Well, I am so excited to learn what you’re all up to. Tell us about conflict sparks change. How are you serving folks?

Kim Faircloth: Well, we are mediators, conflict resolution coaches, trainers, and mostly focused on workplace conflicts between us. We have a lot of experience. Um, my doctorates in leadership. And, Dawn, why don’t you tell them about your background?

Dawn Bedlivy: Yeah. So I’m an attorney and spent my whole career working personnel issues as an attorney and then building a conflict management system within my former organization. So Kim and I have been together, working together for many years, and decided it was time to put all the wisdom we had gathered over those years into a book, a handbook of sorts, for others to be able to use and benefit from the book. The models we’ve built in other ways, we’ve helped others in the past.

Lee Kantor: So what was kind of the Genesis like first, how did you two get together and meet, and then how did you all decide, hey, this is an area we have to lean into.

Kim Faircloth: Well, we work together through all. We’re not naive. We have been in the trenches. We moved from theory and or law into practitioners. And then now sort of the legacy part, you know, the give part back part. We really had a calling many years ago that we should write some of this down, because a lot of the leaders were saying, you know, you should write a book about this. You know, when we were in training or whatever. And, and so we just decided that we were going to lean into that and write the book and then step into whatever that holds for us in the future. Right now, we’re writing a course and it’s we coach and we just help wherever we can.

Dawn Bedlivy: I think one way we came into it to be, in addition to all that Kim said, is a lot of times in Kim’s position as a human resources director or me as a personnel attorney, we would often be called in at the very last minute when these conflicts had, you know, I call it, become a Chernobyl. But, you know, there was already a meltdown. So we would often say to ourselves or discuss amongst ourselves, you know, there was a point in time where this conflict could have ended up much differently, where we could have nipped in the bud and we really set about a mission to develop a conflict management system or within our organization and techniques to really back up these conflicts and help leaders address them way, way earlier. So we didn’t end up with a pile of ruin in the organization. And I think that’s really what brought us together and committed us to all that we’ve been learning and growing in.

Lee Kantor: Now, can you talk a little bit about just the word conflict in the kind of what conflict means? Because in some cases, conflict I guess is. Humans were a lot of humans are looking to avoid conflict as much as possible. But and I think in in what you’re talking about, you encourage using conflict maybe as a catalyst for innovation or change. So can you talk a little bit about maybe the definition or like defining some terms here of conflict and, and how people are perceiving it and what it could, you know, maybe the positive side of it that people aren’t kind of aware of.

Kim Faircloth: Yeah. Um, so let’s start with. We didn’t even name our book. After reading our book, it was interesting that our publisher was like, you know what you’re talking about here all throughout everything we do is that when harnessed, not managing conflict, but harnessing conflict for change is a really important thing. If you really think about it, it’s when this idea and this idea or this, um, uh, value or this value or whatever it is, this diverse perspective, this, you know, on a team can’t exist well together yet. And from that, something new is trying to emerge in every conflict, something new is trying to emerge. If you would just give it the space and time and open up communication channels around it. I’ve seen amazing results. Um, from just taking the time out of what happens, we get busy. Um, we are conflict avoiders, or we yield and it just gets further apart and further apart if we take the time to kind of reestablish the space and then, uh, work on behaviors like as a team to, to actually debate constructively ideas and come out with outcomes, you know, that we can move forward next steps. Um, so conflict to us is the beginning of the change process. And the opposite is true conflict that is not harnessed well can be a real derail. Or maybe, Don, you want to talk about the cost of conflict?

Dawn Bedlivy: Yeah. What we would find is, um, oftentimes when we were brought in, it’s when there was already a huge cost to the organization. Either people were suing the organization, or they wanted to leave the organization and take their knowledge with them. And in all cases, we found that work was interrupted. You know, there there may be outcomes, but we would often walk in and it might be one person who was suing the organization, but it disrupted the entire team, so nobody was being very productive at that point or producing. Um, and what we realized when we often got in and would speak to people even, who had gotten to the point where they felt like, well, I have no choice but to file a complaint, was that there was some change that needed to happen here. Either they didn’t feel like their voice was being heard sometimes, like Kim just described, their their interests weren’t being met. And what we found out I found a lot of times is people just shut down and view conflict as abnormal. And our goal was really to say, look, it’s not abnormal. It’s it’s we’re going to have different ideas than others.

Dawn Bedlivy: And in fact, that’s why you’re bringing these this team together, right? You want diverse ideas on your team. You want people thinking differently. You want people challenging ideas. It’s oftentimes we’re not taught how to do that in a productive way. And it devolves into me against you as opposed to us against the idea. So that’s really where we came upon our techniques was to say, look, change is constant. And some, you know, we have to look at this conflict as a sign of something different needs to happen here on the team. Either they need a different way of communicating with one another. Um, maybe there’s this person isn’t a good fit, and they need to bring their gifts elsewhere. So that that was really the genesis where we said, you know, the at the seed of every innovation is a big change that’s waiting to happen. And how do we help them, right? How do we prep the people to be accepting of that and view it, um, as an opportunity as opposed to, um, oh my God, you know, here we are again.

Kim Faircloth: We used to back in my day, which is a long time ago, we used to actually give them horrible names, these people that we would bring in to be sort of, um, the, the ones that might, uh, challenge any group. Think we used to call them the devil’s advocates. Sometimes we would even we would even bring them in and tell them to be the devil’s advocate. I mean, that’s how I think, um, different it is. Uh, now, I do think that that now in innovation, we recognize the fact that, you know, if we shut down, um, uh, communication with one another, if there’s a real cost, if we, um, constantly do that. It used to be that I would just, you know, maybe go home and tell my friend or my husband or wife or my kids, you know, I had a bad day. Now it’s all over social media, right? These the the people coming out of college, you know, your your emerging workforce, they’ll say, don’t go work there. So there’s your reputation. It’s bigger than it used to be, the cost of conflict. And I think the big one is the cost of compromise. Mhm. When we yield and we compromise too quick right. So compromise should just be a baby step. When we compromise too quick we go down the path, right? We go down the path. And later on. The cost of that compromise can be massive. When one person will then say, I told you we should have done it my way, right? Because we haven’t learned to harness the power in the beginning of the change process of conflict and deal with unproductive conflict as quickly as we can, teaching leaders to dig in there. And that’s what we do all day long. We really just talk about the fact. Now wait a minute. Isn’t this kind of what we want is a little diverse thought process and but it doesn’t have to. Our thought about the word conflict is always like fisticuffs. You know, this big, heavy thing. And it doesn’t have to be that way.

Lee Kantor: Now, how do you. It sounds like a lot of what you’re working on when you’re working with organizations is really the culture of the organization. So in order to impact the culture, don’t you have to do some kind of pre-work so that everybody understands the rules of engagement and how to communicate. Because just because I have a contrarian opinion about something, it doesn’t mean that I get to have my way right. Like we have to. I hope I get to at least voice my concern and kind of in a in a non-judgmental manner. But it doesn’t guarantee that my point of view is the thing that gets executed, like somebody has to make a call at some point, and we all kind of have to get on board with whatever that call is if we want the organization to thrive. So how do you kind of handle some of the rules of engagement?

Kim Faircloth: Well, first, it’s to establish rules of engagement, to have a, a process for that to have a culture of it. You’re absolutely right. You know, it’s it’s going in and really working with teams training and development and or coaching teams, teams to work through conflicts using structured processes. We really do believe in them? Oui oui, oui. There are many like you can do. Force field analysis. You can. You know, to debate ideas, to actually go back to having a process where voices are heard and people feel heard acknowledging it. What I like about that idea is this. And here’s my addition to that idea, really taking the time to acknowledge the other person, to listen to what ideas are, bring them forward, um. Celebrate them. Okay, so now we have a lot of ideas. I think this is what you’re saying, Li. Now, we we really do need to work with teams to have structured, data driven reviews of those. And of course, there’s going to be some ideas that float up that aren’t going to be able to, um, be implemented yet and always say the word yet, because when we have outcomes, right, the change model that we actually have in the book is very dynamic. It’s very fast. When you have outcomes, you’re already measuring. You know how they’re working and you need to be as agile as you can be. But you do have to have outcomes.

Kim Faircloth: We’re at work, right? I mean, we need to move through them, but we move too fast because we don’t like that middle part where we’re debating. We we just, um, lots of teams, um, need to have individuals working on their own conflict skills and behaviors. Um, and we get called in to help with that, really that we got the ideas and there will be outcomes, right? I mean, there will be outcomes or your business is going to go out of business, right? It’s that middle part. Are those outcomes richly? Um, uh, debated in the middle. Right. Not it doesn’t have to be overly time consuming. It’s just acknowledging these ideas, putting them forward for a team to look at and debating them. What if what if we do that? What if we don’t do that? What? You know, all of the tools that are available are agile. And our Lean Six Sigma people. You know their. That’s where they have learned that we can have some models and structures in the middle of that. But first has to start with being. Being working on our own behaviors. If I’m avoidant right I need to work on that as a team member. The company should should really invest in that. They really should individual behaviors during conflict. Because then those those behaviors come on the team and then the team manifests that way. Don what are you thinking about that.

Dawn Bedlivy: Yeah I, I, I love what you were describing because it’s really our. We’ve done a lot of work on culture within organizations I think both. Big picture thinking about how do you influence the culture. And part of what we really discovered was it has to be, first of all, it has to be intentional. And we would see a lot of times the leaders at the top would be saying something, right? Kind of what you were describing, Kim. Like, this is how we want people to behave. And then no one has. No one’s rewarding that behavior. And no one’s skilling the people to be actually able to perform that way. So just like Kim was saying, we we we said, well, you can’t just tell people up here and expect everybody to to do it. Right. It it has to be in a very intentional effort by the whole organization to look at, well, are we are we actually address teaching people how to address conflict where it actually happens, which is at the individual and team level. Right. You’ll have it. And it also I shouldn’t say that it also happens at the organizational level. So how do you make how do you normalize it through the organizations skill people to utilize it and harness it for as a catalyst? Right. I think that’s what we’re talking about.

Dawn Bedlivy: And then what are you what behaviors. Because culture is how everyone’s behaving every day in the office. That’s what creates the culture. Like I if if I’m up here in the organization as a CEO and I’m behaving one way, but no one’s behaving like I want them to behave, I have to ask myself what’s going on, right? So it’s what what is being rewarded throughout the organization, what behaviors are being rewarded. And that’s really important. So we’ve done a lot of work where we talk about an integrated conflict management system, but it’s really down to how do you diffuse this throughout your whole organization. And ultimately, if no one has the skills to do it, they’re just not going to be able to do it. It goes to also how we select people. Yeah, I know Kim, we’ve done you’ve done a lot of work on selection processes. You know, are we asking questions in our selection processes about how people handle conflict? Um, so culture is really important. And it’s also really important that the leaders who are there understand that if they do address conflict productively if they do encourage communication. These more positive aspects, if they’re normalizing conflict within the organization, that their behaviors are going to be rewarded as well.

Lee Kantor: Yeah. Now can you talk a little bit about, um, maybe the trust issue in all of this? Because, I mean, I’ve interviewed so many people in this subject matter, and when it comes to a lot of leaders are like, yes, we want to be more innovative. We want to lean into change and embrace change. But when reality comes in and then they somebody comes up with ideas or they take chances, obviously they’re not going to bat a thousand. They’re going to have, you know, missed misses. There’s going to be times where they took a shot on something. It didn’t work out. And if those people are demoted or punished or seen as less than, no one’s going to lean into this change or, or even try because they feel like I only they only want winners. And if I’m. How can you kind of play with the edges or test the edges if you’re only going for winners every time? So how do you kind of deal with the trust that’s necessary as foundational in order to, um, you know, have the communication and the and the culture of trust so that they can take risks and not be punished for them.

Kim Faircloth: Yeah. So, well, we have a trust model. There’s so many models in this book. It’s so practical. It really is. It’s not like, um, have emotional intelligence. It’s like, this is what we’re talking about. This is what we mean. And we find that, um, a lot of times our leaders need models. So let’s talk about a trust model. What makes us trust really just about anybody in a professional setting. Right. Um, and maybe in anything. So let me we have the four C’s of trust that that I think are easy to remember. And they really, really, um, go to answering your question. The first is competence, right? If I go to the dentist and they are not competent to do their job right, I’m not going to let them work on my root canal. Another way of saying it is I trust my husband 100%. I do, I’ve been married almost 50 years. I don’t trust him to give me a root canal. He’s not competent to do it. So first thing is, first, your confidence, your ability to, um, ask curious questions and to be a part of your team in that manner really does make me trust you. That’s one. The second, see, is your confidence. If I go to that dentist and get my root canal and they project no confidence at all, I’m going to start to be, um, suspect of whether I’m going to sit in that chair and let you give me a root canal.

Kim Faircloth: Confidence. Really projecting some confidence in what you’re doing, and that comes from knowing what your vision is and holding to it and explaining it and being with your teams. It’s it’s bigger than than we say it all the time, but it really is bigger than that. It’s like you need to do it right so that they can start to see that you’re confident in your leading. So work on that. Really work on that. The third is consistency. And I think this is a big one. This is when Tuchman had it right. Tuchman Tuchman maybe you’ve heard this. It’s like I’m going to say roughly 1969 because there’s some debate about that. But anyway, he said, form storm, norm perform and then atrophy of a team. Right. We that that we teach that all the time. Consistency. So if you say, for example that on this team we’re going to I want us to work as a team. We’re going to value that right. Teamwork. And you say that in your forming stage with the team, you come in as a leader. You say that, you say that, but you don’t hold yourself consistent to that, because the next thing that happens in storm, by the way, storm is what Tuchman said.

Kim Faircloth: Not a little walk in the mud puddle, but storm, which is conflict. Storm. A person comes in and says, hey, boss, let me just tell you about what I’m working on. I’m working on X, y, Z. If that leader doesn’t say, that’s great. Who else is working on that with you? Because I value the teamwork. Why don’t the three of you come in and see me? You see the consistency. Because how will perform is based on our consistency when we form our team up. And that leader really does own a lot of it. And that’s not just supervisory leader project leaders, um, all of those, they really some consistency makes a difference. When I go to get the root canal and I go get the next root canal, and it’s 180 degree different than the first one, I’m going to start not trusting you. So that’s really, really important. And then the final one is so simple. You just care. Like really care. You care about the vision. You care about the company. You care about the people. Those are the four C’s competence, confidence, consistency and caring. If you do, those four people will feel like that. You care about their ideas, you care and they will bring them forward. And you just stay consistent with with what your goals are for debating ideas.

Lee Kantor: Now, what is some symptoms that an organization might have? Um, that maybe they’re not behaving optimally when it comes to conflict. What are some of the things that are happening in the organization that are like, hey, maybe we should contact Kim and Don. What? So what, you know, what is the the clues or the symptoms of, um, maybe conflict dysfunction in an organization?

Dawn Bedlivy: Well, maybe your biggest one. And nobody really wants this, but is, um, are you having lawsuits and complaints against you? That that’s that’s one big clue that perhaps conflict is escalating or information isn’t getting to the right places, I think. Um, another might be you’re not you’re not seeing output or outcomes that you would have expected to see. I think that’s another indicator. And then there are more subtle ones, I think, Kim, that we often see is, you know, are people checked out? You know, can a leader tell that people are just, you know, they’re doing the minimum and then they run out the door? You know, and I don’t mean people who have to get their children to childcare, but, you know, are you really hearing everybody participate? Is everybody engaged?

Kim Faircloth: Um, do you have quiet quitters?

Dawn Bedlivy: Exactly. That’s the question that people quit and forgot to tell you. I think that that’s what you used to advise leaders all the time. Kim. Right. Or do you have people who have already quit and they’re sitting there still. They just haven’t moved on. So I think a lot of what our models teach and what we work with leaders on is how do you notice these signs before they become extreme? Let’s just say. Yeah, right. You know, how do you pay attention to what’s happening on the team? And then back to your point, I think, Lee, how do you create an atmosphere where someone’s willing to come to you and say, hey, look, we’re just not working well together or we’re having a problem with X over here. Because the leaders should be available to help with those types of issues and problems. So if no one’s bringing you an issue, I think that’s another clue.

Kim Faircloth: Yeah. And it shouldn’t be this language of, um, you know, come see me. Not just with the problem, but with the solution. Like, what does that mean? Like, so that’s a first of all, there’s a lot of pressure. I think the other thing is, you know, are people trying to, you know, sort of get your attention and say, hey, boss, before you hear about it on the team, I want you to let you.

Dawn Bedlivy: Know.

Kim Faircloth: That this is going on or, um, you know, are our employees, um, you know, calling in sick. Of course. Some of that. Right. Are you noticing that, like, additional sick leave? Just really the churn ratio? You know, I’m really surprised sometimes in, in companies or organizations that I visit and they’ve had like they’ve watched the churn on the team, the, the, you know, they bring talent up. That’s expensive. They bring talent up. Right. They get it going on the team. And then pretty soon I divorce you because I try to have an idea. Nothing happens. Maybe the first time, that’s okay. Then I try to have another idea. I don’t see anything happening. A third idea. You didn’t even thank me for my idea. You’d never even noticed my idea. Pretty soon I’m going to start divorcing you. And the minute I start looking for a job I have, I have decided that I need to leave the team. Right? So I know that there are people that level up and they have a career progression and I have that. I understand that, but as an HR professional, I know that when I know the out briefs and I think, why don’t we do stay briefings, right, instead of out briefings, right. Why don’t we say what would make you stay here? What? You know, what kind of atmosphere are you looking for? What’s missing here? How can I lead? You better stay interviews. Instead, we do exit interviews. And so in the exit interviews that I’ve been a part of, it really very often gets mentioned that either my ideas don’t get, um, you noticed or, um, conflict on the team is such that I just it’s it’s just a challenge for me to come and sit in that.

Kim Faircloth: And the leader just observes it. They just don’t do anything about it. And I’ll ask, do they know about it? Oh, yeah, they know. Leaders know and they just don’t address it. They think it’ll just go away on its own. Perhaps we have to really just start with with the leaders. It really does. They do need to be engaging. And I think if you’re in at work, often in the in the teams walking about all the old fashioned things that we used to talk about, you know, to talk about. I also think we back to this. Thank you. I’m going to give one more because on every interview we do and in every consultation we do with leadership, we talk about saying thank you. And what we mean by that. Going back to Tuchman, when you notice something coming across your desk and it aligns with what you’re creating, or maybe it’s a spectacular work product, whatever it is, very often as a leader we will go, yeah, that’s great. We need to pick the phone up and we need to make a phone call. Better yet, go there if we can. But in this virtual world, right, do a zoom, whatever you’re going to do. But but try to at least phone call and say, hey, I just want to let you know, I noticed this coming across my desk. This is exactly what I was talking about. Thank you. And don’t say another word. Not. How’s mom? Nothing else. Thank you. And hang up the phone. It’s the only thing they hear is. Thank you. That’s how to make. Thank you stick.

Lee Kantor: Now, what is usually your kind of point of entry in an organization? Are they contacting you to triage something bad that’s happened, or are they ever proactive and want to get ahead of things?

Kim Faircloth: Um, well, it’s, uh, both. It really is. Um, the best way is that’s what we mean by integrated, like, so, you know, integrated, um, means that we do we you’ll find us in the training department, right? In fact, I’ve got a massive training coming up into training. Right. You’ll find us in the Ombudsman Lane, which is the conflict coaching lane. You’ll find us. When? Now we have really separated to the point where a third party external person who has, um, some neutrality to what’s going on can come in and help facilitate dialog. It’s called mediation. Right. We believe in the invitational process where we are inviting voice in the room and we not just a few. After many of these, it’s remarkable how communication did break down. Right. And we can help reestablish it. But it’s all of those. It’s all of those. It’s it’s it’s you have to have this integrated process. I have to be able to touch it. And there’s something called perceived organizational support theory. And what it means is even for organizations, if you’re wondering whether you should invest in this kind of work and having these specialists in your organization who will help you reestablish communication channels, coach all of that through conflict, through that word conflict. Let me just say you perceived organizational support theory would say this, even if I never use it as an employee, just knowing it exists makes me align better with this organization cares about that. And that goes back to Lee. Your question to about trust. Don, do you have anything you want to add to that?

Dawn Bedlivy: No, just from our experience, a lot of times I think from what you were saying, Kim, you’ll start with one type of intervention and it may lead to another.

Kim Faircloth: It sure does.

Dawn Bedlivy: Because I think a lot of times when leaders are presented with a situation, they realize, you know what, I can fix this here, but what I really need to do is skill the team as well. So we’re not in this same place again, you know, so that that’s what I think really inspired Kim in my work many years ago was, look, we could do this all day. You know, keep putting out fires. But but how do you stop the fire in the first place? Right. How do we, um. And then beyond stopping the fire, it’s really our whole mantra, which is what? What? Way back when was trying to happen or emerge, or what exciting new possibilities or ideas could have occurred if everybody wasn’t going down the rabbit hole was something that really, at the end of the day, you know, just distracts us from our work. So I think a lot of times one engagement will lead to not necessarily another engagement, but helping leaders figure out, okay, how do you set a new story or a new way for the team to cooperate and work together so that they see conflict as a positive, and now they’re skilled to handle it on their own? That that’s the ultimate goal.

Lee Kantor: Now, is there any advice or tips you can share for leaders right now? Something actionable that they can do today? Um, in order to, you know, help with conflict that might be happening in their organization. Is there something you could share in that regard?

Kim Faircloth: Yeah. Um, what? We have a model here. I’m going to have Don walk through the here model with you. But let me begin by introducing Y. So one is say thank you more, right? A lot more. And make it stick by doing it very purposefully. Two is, um, you know, to be more present, more accessible and more present. Um, we call this the here model. We’ll have Don do it. But the reason that I sometimes cling to my positions, I think really even in mediation, the reason that I cling to my positions or I don’t move off of my position on things, to even share perspective or hear other perspectives is I feel like I’m not heard. And when we use the here model, the first thing for leaders to know is this you don’t have to respond right then. Sometimes the most respectful thing you can do is to hear, and we’ll give you a model for doing that and say these words You have given me so much to think about that I want to pay you the respect to do that. Let’s get back on the calendar tomorrow and then and give yourself space. If it’s an emergency, of course you have to. Or if it’s derailing something big. Of course you have to. But it’s not often that case, right? This thing has been lingering and lingering and lingering. Right? And so you can take a night and you can actually make people feel heard by doing that, by saying, I want to make sure I’m really thinking through what you’ve brought to my attention. And I and I, and I want to respect you with that. So, you know, sometimes be honest with you, I don’t even think what I’m thinking at the moment. I, you know, I have to explore it. And I’m like, you know what? Where am I coming from here? So giving yourself space and time to exercise the here model, Don want to talk about it?

Dawn Bedlivy: Yeah. I think what Kim said is really helpful here, because I think it’s really the first hurdle for anybody is just really noticing that there might be a problem in the first place. So as part of our here model, we have our H, which is we call it honoring the relationship. But what it means is for a leader to really just if they are noticing something, just to maybe call the person aside, set up a meeting and just describe here’s what I’m noticing and here’s why I’m having this meeting about it, because I want to address it. I really want to hear your your thought process. Maybe you’ve received an email from an employee that said, hey, this is going on. And you’re like, you know, you sent me this email. I’m really want to explore with you what’s going on here. So we call that honoring the relationship. And it’s what Kim talked about, just establishing right up front that you, as the leader, heard the individual or noticed something that seems to be happening. And you, you want to get to the bottom of whatever it is. Um, then we do re which is really explore and a lot of what we’re urging leaders to do. There is not do all the talking. So I think oftentimes as leaders, we think that we have to fill the space. And what we teach here is don’t fill the space. If you truly are bringing somebody in and are curious, you have to be curious. You have to suspend your own judgment and you have to let the story unfold. And we have another model sorted, which is also helpful with, you know, how does the leader kind of keep track of what the story is, what what are facts? What are thoughts? What are feelings? But in this stage of explore, what you’re really doing is letting that employee tell you what’s going on.

Dawn Bedlivy: And you’re asking open ended questions. And we always warn people if you really don’t want to hear, the person will know. So, um, and you want to give some time to this individual to really tell what it is they have to tell. So that’s our explore phase. And then we have our, our, our phase where we’re really, um, looking again at and recalling what did this person say? What is it that that, um, you know, where are we now after this story? And oftentimes what you’ll find is that you’ve taken a lot of twists and turns. So our R is really about reflecting on with the person what you heard. And it’s not hey, I think you’re all washed up, you know? Whatever. Um, it’s really about here. I heard you say this, you know? Tell me more about that. It’s reflecting on some of the pieces that you heard, or you might want to understand a little better. And then, um, the last part of ours is really being able to enable and empower. So that’s piece is really about now that this story came out, or now that the person came to you and said whatever it was, um, what are you both going to do? And I think that’s where. Kim, your advice there is really so important for leaders to have heard, because sometimes you’re not going to know what to do.

Dawn Bedlivy: And another thing we often feel as leaders is we have to give an immediate answer. Well, sometimes there isn’t an immediate answer, but what we can say is just what Kim recommended. You know, you’ve given me a lot to think about. I need to talk to X, Y, and Z in the setup of this conversation. It’s really important that the employee understands that whatever they say to you is not necessarily confidential because you work for the organization. And if there’s a problem or there’s again, these are about business issues. And it’s our job as leaders to address business problems. Um, and so what we’re really trying to identify what’s, what’s the problem that’s impacting us here. And then in our last phase always remember to talk about, okay, here’s here’s the steps I’m going to take moving forward, even if it’s just consulting with someone else. I heard you. I’m going to get back to you in a couple of days, but I think it’s also talking to the employee. About what? What do they want to do? You know, what’s what? What what actions are they willing to take? Because it’s really about how do we create the path forward together. So that’s our here model. And I think using that model, we really believe also it helps you illustrate those four CS that Kim mentioned before. Certainly the caring um the competence. Um, it really helps you carry out all of that as a leader. Did you have anything to add there, Kim?

Kim Faircloth: No, we I mean, we probably we don’t have time to explore the sordid model, but having a framework for how you’re sorting this out, because it’s a mess when it comes at you, it’s going to be this and this and this and this. And if you’re being present with them, you don’t want to stop the flow and dig into this quite yet until you get into reflection. So you do want to capture it. I want to really highlight and expand upon something Don said about this confidentiality. I wish even as an ombudsman, but certainly as a leader, I had a nickel for the number of employees who would come to me and say, Kim, can I just tell you something in confidence? And, you know, um, that if I’m honoring the relationship, our first, you know, part of h e e h if I’m really honoring the relationship, do I want to set it up with a lie? No, I like I don’t even know what you’re going to say yet, so I can’t promise you confidentiality, and I don’t even I. So. But we don’t give leaders the words to say, you know, so they have a time to think about it. And I’m often coaching saying, look, it’s it’s like this when you get that and you will. Can I just tell you something in private? You’ll say to them, well, first of all, thank you for trusting me enough to come and bring this to my attention.

Kim Faircloth: I don’t even know what we’re going to talk about. And you’re here for us to work on this. So? So it may be at the end. We have to involve some other people I don’t know yet, so I’m not going to promise you confidentiality. What I will promise you is we’ll only tell the people that need to be told in order for us to move forward with this, and we’ll co-create that at the end. Will, you will know what my next steps are when I’m ready to reach out and do something with this. I’m not going to. I’m going to be transparent with you about that. We’re going to work on this. And I think that’s why you’re here. And I want you to know you’re no longer stuck. You’re here. You actually made the first move. So I’m going to I’m going to partner with you to to work through whatever it is you’re getting ready to tell me. You can do that in your shortened version. But my point is that to give your that honor in the relationship means that you’re setting it up transparently in the beginning. Um, and they and I think it’s an important step.

Lee Kantor: If somebody wants to learn more, have a more substantive conversation with you or somebody on the team or get Ahold of your book. What is the website? What is the best way to connect?

Kim Faircloth: Yeah, it’s it’s WWE exchange.

Dawn Bedlivy: Yeah, we’ve got some great materials out there. Right. Free reading. Free reading.

Kim Faircloth: Free on there. Yeah.

Dawn Bedlivy: Sorted on there. We have some, um, free articles that people can look at and get some instant tips I think, that you were referencing. So we encourage folks to please go to our website.

Kim Faircloth: And you can find us on LinkedIn as well. Of course, conflict sparks change will get you there though, in one place or the other, right?

Lee Kantor: Well, thank you Kim and Don for sharing your story today. You’re both doing such important work and we appreciate you.

Kim Faircloth: We appreciate you.

Dawn Bedlivy: Thank you.

Lee Kantor: All right. This is Lee Kantor. We’ll see you all next time on High Velocity Radio.

Heather Fry with Unify Aesthetics & Wellness

August 4, 2025 by angishields

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Cherokee Business Radio
Heather Fry with Unify Aesthetics & Wellness
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Heather-Fry-headshotHeather Fry is a Board Certified Family Nurse Practitioner through the American Academy of Nurse Practitioners with 15+ years of experience in the medical field.

She is the founder of Unify Aesthetics & Wellness and passionate about bringing unification of wellness and beauty to her patients. She places a high value on being able to share her God given gifts & calling to the medical field she feels Christ placed on her life at a young age.

Her enthusiasm and interest in the aesthetic industry is sparked by her family background in the beauty industry that goes back two generations. Heather specializes in all things injectables and skin care focusing on full facial balance.

Always cutting edge, Heather is devoted to continuing education to refine and dial in her craft. Heather is comprehensive in her approach, addressing the aging process and tailoring a treatment plan that best fits your beauty desires.

Her training includes certification through the American Academy of Facial Esthetics, Academy for Injection Anatomy Cadaver Course, Master Expert Series through Allergan, Galderma and a series of private training throughout her last 5 years of pursuing her passion for Aesthetics.

Transcript-iconThis transcript is machine transcribed by Sonix.

 

TRANSCRIPT

Intro: Broadcasting live from the Business RadioX studios in Woodstock, Georgia. This is fearless formula with Sharon Cline.

Sharon Cline: I love it. Hello. Welcome. Welcome to Fearless Formula. I’m Business RadioX, where we talk about the ups and downs of the business world, and we offer words of wisdom for business success. I’m your host, Sharon Cline, and I have a very lovely person in the studio. I’m so excited to introduce you to her. She is the founder of Unify Esthetics and Wellness and that is in Cumming, Georgia. She is a board certified Family Nurse practitioner with through the American Academy of Nurse Practitioner. She has more than 15 years experience in the medical field. Just a lovely human being. And just in talking with her for a few minutes before we got started today, I just know that we’re going to talk about some very important topics, not only in health and wellness, but what it means for the parts of your life that you get to animate out in the world. And I love that she contributes to it. Welcome to the studio, Heather Fry.

Heather Fry: Thank you so much. I’m excited and nervous and all the things to be here.

Sharon Cline: And all the things. I’m excited because I have known you for a few years now, and every time I get to see you, I always feel like you really take time to look at me and say, what? What is it that you would like to to feel like when you’re out in the world? And then you kind of help me go backwards a little bit to make me feel like, I mean, how I feel on the inside is, is how I look on the outside.

Heather Fry: I love that. Yeah. You took the words right out of my mouth.

Sharon Cline: Oh, nice. Well, we’re done here.

Heather Fry: Right? There it is. It’s the. It’s the energy exchange, right. It’s like you also, I think the one thing patients don’t realize is, yes, we’re here to talk about a medical procedure, but it’s an energy exchange. I’m offering my gift to you. But I look at every patient to is not that I have something to get from them, but to gain their perspective on life or be a part of their. Their journey of their self-worth. And I want to impress upon that in a positive way and leave them feeling whole. That’s what unify means to to make whole. And so it’s like when you leave my practice, whatever that little piece was missing, that you needed that piece of the puzzle for the day, that you feel unified walking out of the door, whether you had a treatment plan or if you, you know, we talk through something, you’re like, I feel a little bit more empowered to just be me. Or I was reminded of, yes, that that person that I, that I am.

Sharon Cline: Mhm. Because it’s interesting to being, um, on social media as much as we are and being able to look at ourselves from the outside. It can be very humbling when you are getting older and still want to feel like you really are who you, who you always were. You know, as you’re looking at yourself and you’re like, hmm, that doesn’t look the same. So what I love, too, is that it’s not something that has to be very dramatic. It doesn’t have to be this huge, major procedure. It can just be like a little tweak here and there that kind of makes you feel like, well, I still have a little bit of control over the things that are happening to me and that that control brings some peace.

Heather Fry: It does. And I think that’s where, as my experience has grown, is when I’m sitting down talking with a patient, I can throw every solution at everyone. But that is not what that’s not what’s going to make you, you know, feel your best walking out the door. It’s my job and my art. My kind of part of my art form is to discover the kind of degree of correction, right? Or the degree of advice or kind of what you’re looking at and deliver that, whether it’s something that’s subtle, you know, to somebody that’s like, I want the whole nine yards. Okay, well, what is that process look like?

Sharon Cline: Right, right.

Heather Fry: Like at the end of the day, if I have a patient that I walk through there, you know, beauty journey, anti-aging journey for years and years to come because I’ve nailed that one thing. They feel safe when they sit with me. They don’t feel pressured, and they feel like what they articulated to me of what they’re looking for. My solution matches that, right. I’m not trying to press upon other solutions and tell you, I’m not going to do this procedure for you unless you do these other things I recommended. And I’ve been taught that way to consult because.

Sharon Cline: Yeah.

Heather Fry: But I don’t feel that doesn’t settle well with me and how I treat as a provider. And not saying that there’s anything wrong with that because I understand different points. But for me, that energy exchange, it’s deeper than just putting filler in somebody’s lips. It’s deeper than just, you know, doing some, you know, neuro modulator treatments.

Sharon Cline: Right. And I was thinking as well that having that balance really does encourage trust with you, because it isn’t sort of my bottom line needs to be this amount today. And so you’re just really trying to to make bank. It’s not about that. It’s really listening. And like you said, it’s like a a dance almost. It is. Here’s what you need. Here’s what I can do. Are you good with this? Right. But do you remember, um, the moment that you sort of knew you wanted to go into medicine?

Heather Fry: I do, I remember always like. So we had animals growing up, and I was always, you know, we had cats. I love my cats. But they would bring little mice and little things. And I just remember always being the rescuer. Right. Or if my brothers fell down and hurt their knee or whatever it was, I was always kind of the rescuer when it came to like the empathetic, like empathy that people needed through, you know, pain or they were sick or they were this and none of that stuff ever grossed me out. I was always pulled to it. I even had to be told, like, hey, we don’t talk about that at the dinner table. I’m like, what? Just untold stories of the air that I just saw was really cool. I just wanted to tell you about this. My mom was just like in the corner, like, that’s inappropriate, you know? Um, but it is something that I, you know, I always play doctor and different stuff and and that’s kind of.

Sharon Cline: Kind of followed you.

Heather Fry: Through. It followed me through.

Sharon Cline: It seems like such a natural fit for you to go into the beauty industry as well, because your family has been associated with it for many years. Can you talk about sort of your history there?

Heather Fry: Yeah. For sure. So, um, growing up, um, my dad’s sister, so my aunt and my grandmother, um, sold cosmetics. So kind of like, um, like a Mary Kay or, you know, like MLM marketing, right? Like, you have your network of people you sell makeup and different things to. My mom was a consultant. You know, everybody kind of was. It was the ladies at the church. Hey, you know, let’s have a little party. And it was called Alloway. And they’re actually local, um, in, you know, in Atlanta. Um, and my uncle also, um, owns, uh, Pure Minerals and then cosmetics. So there’s other brands that most people are familiar with, Pure Minerals makeup I’ve actually been wearing since I was like old enough to wear makeup.

Sharon Cline: Oh my.

Heather Fry: God.

Sharon Cline: Tinted beach. That’s amazing.

Heather Fry: And it’s an incredible company. It’s very clean. It’s entirely correct. Meaning it’s going to, you know, do well with your natural skin. There’s not a lot of irritants, um, like all the boxes you want checked on your clean makeup. They they have it all. But I remember, you know, my dad would talk, talk about he would watch his mom bring, you know, the ladies over and sell makeup. But the biggest thing to me that really was impressed upon me was the ritual of self-care is really what it came down to for me. I remember watching my grandma probably take an hour to do her bedtime routine, because it was her creams and her moisturizers and her things, and that was like a non-negotiable. And then also in the morning, it was that was a process. Um, my mom would take me to the beauty counter, we’d, you know, get different stuff. So that act of self-care through makeup and beauty, that’s kind of where it started. And it’s relevant at a younger age. Right? So it makes sense. That’s what I was exposed to 100%.

Sharon Cline: And I think the the younger you are taking care of your skin, the better off you’re going to be. I lived in Florida and didn’t really wear a lot of sunscreen back in the day. But when my kids were young, I mean, I was I’m a sunscreen holic now, but like when my kids were young, I remember covering them in the zinc. It’s the mineral one. And I’m like, you’re gonna thank me someday. Yeah, exactly. So, yeah, if it’s been on your radar that long, um, it’s just so natural for you to want to help other people have that same sort of appreciation for taking care of themselves.

Heather Fry: Exactly.

Sharon Cline: What do you think is sort of a big misconception about the injectables that you have? Um, at your place? It’s like when I think about people assuming that they’re going to have to have a lot or they’re not going to look natural. I feel like that’s a very common misconception.

Heather Fry: It is. And I, I feel like because it’s becoming more commonplace and talked about, there’s a little bit more awareness that it can look natural. Um, but I think it just goes to the same thing. Of this concept of makeup. Like, you can make your makeup look natural, right? Because you kind of control the paintbrush. And so when it comes to injectables, at the end of the day, we’re practicing medicine. And there’s actually a diagnoses for what a wrinkle is really fat. You know, atrophy is or different different things in the face. And so these tools are medicine to help correct these things. And fortunately it ends up being a cosmetic outcome right on the outer surface of the skin. There’s also medical uses like bladder spasms and migraines and things that you can use these for. But specifically your question, I love it because that’s the question I answer every single day, really, of I don’t want to look ducky. I don’t want to look fake. Is this going to make me look X, Y, and Z? Or there’s even patients that sit in my chair that are like my sister or my mom would, would kill me if I was here, like doing Botox because it’s such a some people frown upon it, right? Because they think you’re not. Aging gracefully or whatever that looks like. But as far as keeping it natural, I think that’s where it takes a lot of education and just understanding that you have to have a trusted relationship with your provider to educate you on what the tools or the medicine is supposed to be used for, and then kind of marry that or match that with the solutions and the corrections that you’re looking for. I also tell patients if we’re comparing fakeness to like maybe somebody and again, not knocking people on TV but certain, you know, appearances that we see. I’m like, you couldn’t give me enough money to make you look like that because there’s also plastic surgery involved in other things. Are there providers saying, hey, that enough is enough? There’s a lot of that’s a whole different like can of worms to talk through.

Sharon Cline: I feel like what you really have always kind of given me the impression of is that it really is an art. It really is almost like sculpting, And I can understand someone not being very careful that way. But what a gift it is to know that there’s someone looking at the structure underneath. What I want someone to see. To know where the right place is. To place something.

Heather Fry: Yeah, exactly. And that’s where, you know, when we’re recommending certain amount of units, everything comes down to two things. The the diagnosis or what we’re trying to correct. Like the complaint or the, you know, appearance that we’re trying to soften. So what that is. And then to the degree in which you want it corrected.

Sharon Cline: What a good point.

Heather Fry: And that part is where do you want a 10% correction 20% correction. Do you want an 80% correction. Then I may say, hey, listen, Botox isn’t the only solution. This port isn’t the only solution to decrease this muscle movement. If we decrease the muscle movement, the line will soften. But if it’s still there, are you going to be okay with that? Or are you going to feel like I didn’t deliver the best results. Well, if that’s the case, you need to understand that maybe we need to resurface the line with a chemical peel because of the degree of that line, that diagnosis of how deep is it a mild, moderate or severe line? Just like if you have a cold, if you have an upper respiratory infection. Right. I’m going to give you some an antibiotic, some steroids. But if you have pneumonia and your oxygen is low, you’re going to be in the hospital. It requires more interventions because the degree of correction has gone further than what that one solution can tackle.

Sharon Cline: Do you ever feel like there are very unrealistic expectations? Yes.

Heather Fry: And again, I when I talk to new injectors or just injectors in general when we’re talking about the consultative process, that’s why that is the most important conversation you’ll ever have with a patient, because you’re not only allowing them to tell you what their expectations are, but your level setting, any misconceptions you’re kind of helping to you’re not going to Redirect or correct. They’re thinking right or they’re unrealistic expectations. But you’re going to. You have to be frank and honest with them. Like, I want to take you on this journey, but you may not get what you’re looking for. If you just go with this solution. And that’s where if somebody doesn’t understand that, or they keep coming back and saying what I didn’t get what I paid for, then that’s what it’s like. I may not be the best provider for you.

Sharon Cline: But it’s so honest to say that.

Heather Fry: It is. You’re doing them a disservice to continue to take their money. If you know that something’s off and they may be better served by somebody else because it comes down to speaking two different languages. Honestly, if you know they’ve had different expectations with another provider.

Sharon Cline: Right, which everybody’s got their own way to be. And I’m, I imagine you’ve corrected things for other providers too, which must be a challenge as well, because not only are you trying to get them to be happy, the patient, but you also are trying to undo what has happened in the past.

Heather Fry: Correct and highlighting on that. I think that there’s been seasons in this industry where it was a trend or a fad to like, knock other injectors or be like this week up, I have somebody that I’m correcting so-and-so, you know, you obviously don’t call it the provider, but correcting two syringes of filler in a lip, it’s like we as providers, we’re still medical providers, and there may be somebody down the road that’s corrected my work. You can never be too, you know, confident. You always have to stay humble in the medical field. Right. Because we’re still practicing medicine. And if there’s something that maybe I chose a certain filler that didn’t settle well in somebody’s lips, I want to be humble enough to say, hey, I will correct that for y’all. Correct my work. I want my patients feel comfortable to come to me and tell me if they don’t like something. But I’m also very careful if somebody does come in my seat and say, I saw so-and-so down the road, I try to be very careful to say, no worries. Let’s look at what is in front of me today, and I’ll let you know how I can help. And, you know, pass the baton. I never want to knock anybody else, because I have a due diligence for a bigger purpose, to not give this industry a bad name, because there are a lot of talented providers that I work with, and we help each other every day.

Sharon Cline: Well, there’s karma too.

Heather Fry: Yes, I totally believe in that. To 200%.

Sharon Cline: Yeah. So and it’s it’s a conscious choice to be kind to everybody’s effort. And you just try to do what you can. Well, I mean, I’m sure not everybody looks at it that way. So I appreciate that about you. Who’s sort of your ideal client coming into see you.

Heather Fry: I like that question. Um, I, I love newbies. The reason being is because I just feel like they’re so delicate. Right. And it’s like your first experience with either a neuro modulator or a lip filler or anything. And I want to do right by them. I want to give them a good impression of this industry. So because I’ve also had people in my chair that are like, I got something done eight years ago and I’ve never been back. I, I love first time patients. I would say my ideal patient, ideal client, um, is somebody that wants to be with me for a lifetime, be with like, it’s a long term kind of play and is open to, you know, those recommendations and kind of having like a treatment plan, somebody that’s like, yes, at the end of the day, I have to make the decision for these treatments. But that once like an annual plan that they stick to and they really put that trust in the provider to recalibrate. Okay. Now that we’re at the maintenance phase now, we’ll pull back a little bit and you’ll just do your neuromodulation treatments and then maybe some quarterly facials or micro needling.

Sharon Cline: I know that we’ve talked about this in the past, that you have some patients that have been with you for quite a while, and looking at some of the photos from the very beginning to where they are now, it’s such a nice, uh, almost proof that you don’t have to be completely, dramatically different. You’re just maintaining what you want. And so would you. Say that’s the most satisfying thing is to be able to sort of see you have a treatment plan, someone actually follows it, and then you get to see in the end.

Heather Fry: Yeah, I call it the aha moment where you take their original before and really just look at that after picture. And I’ve had patients I literally thought this the other day because there’s also new things always coming out. I was like man. Like thinking to myself I’m like, I’ve had this patient for, you know, the last five years. And I was like, oh, look, this picture looks great, it looks great. And then I’m like, look at it again. It looks great. I’m like, how is this even possible? But that’s the amazing thing about the science and kind of progression of what we’re doing with the regenerative side of esthetic medicine, you know, using um, uh, platelet rich, you know, fibrin using growth factor, using natural things.

Sharon Cline: Yeah. I didn’t think about that.

Heather Fry: So that’s a really neat thing. It’s like I’m taking this patient and I’m giving them better skin than they had, like, yeah, that’s a pretty incredible thing, especially into their 40s and 50s. I mean, I have patients that I’m like, wow. Like I think my oldest patient is 89. Um, like just to see those things, it’s like, hey, you’re doing stuff for your skin. It’s a great improvement.

Sharon Cline: We talked a little bit before the show about, uh, the spiritual side of medicine. And I always think about it this way, because not every teenager needs braces in order to speak correctly or to eat correctly or function. But it’s so nice to be able to have a smile that you feel proud of. And there’s like a different feeling that people have when that happens. And so I was thinking similarly, um, you don’t have to have all of these different treatments to feel like you’re fine, but there is something to be said about knowing in your heart, you you look as good as you possibly can. And can you talk a little bit about what you see in the patients that come to you, what it means for them to have some of these treatments that have put them back into an alignment with themselves.

Heather Fry: No, I love that. I think it gets spiritual real quick because behind, you know, and I don’t want to say that it’s always an insecurity. But behind each patient that I’m doing a consultation with, there’s always a deeper story. Um, I’m very passionate about postpartum women in general. And then that perimenopause, postmenopausal, just because hormones in general really intrigued me. But there’s a I just had four kids. I don’t feel like myself again. And I want to feel confident for my husband, even though he says I don’t need X, Y, and Z and he thinks I’m beautiful. I don’t feel it. And so that spiritual kind of connection of I get it, there’s almost like this, you know, gravitational pull that I want to share. Hey, I have four kids. Two. And like I get it. And this is what I did and it helped me. So then it becomes personal. And then as they’re coming back in with their treatments, we stop talking about treatments and we really just talk about life. And I get to see the progression of where they came in. And then six months later, hey, we’re, you know, like we went on a date with, like, fun little stories, um, or big life changes. You know, I’ve had women lose spouses. I’ve had, you know, divorces, we’ve had second marriages, third marriage, things that are like, hey, this is a big deal. Like, I’m so excited. I want to feel like I did in my 20s, but I know I’m not. What what can we do? And so all of that just really goes back to that internal kind of confidence. And first and foremost, I always lead with your already enough with where you’re at. Right? You’re already enough here today. Um, I’m just adding a little, little pizzazz, a little sprinkle on top. You know, it’s just the cherry on top. It’s not the whole thing. They already have what they need. I just need to bring that out in them.

Sharon Cline: If I were looking to do some tweaking. What could I expect to find with you?

Heather Fry: Like, do like what I would recommend. More than likely.

Sharon Cline: Yeah. And anything that you like. Okay, let’s say that a patient or a new patient. A new client of yours would come in. What sort of the gamut of what they could have for themselves? Like, I, I love that you have hormone replacement and hormone. It’s it’s more than that though, is that it’s a bioidentical as it was.

Heather Fry: Yes. Correct. Good job. Oh, thanks. I think we got it today. Hey. No, that’s a good one.

Sharon Cline: Ding ding ding.

Heather Fry: You get five points.

Sharon Cline: We had I had gone to some of your events where we talked about it, and it was just. What’s wonderful, I think, is that you really do give everybody the knowledge, because knowledge is power. It’s like, here’s what we can provide for you. Here’s what it can do. Here’s if you see this, here’s an option. And I know it’s not important to everybody, But if it’s important to you. Here’s where you can go to get something that makes you feel like you look the best you can and feel the best you can, right? It isn’t all about like the looks I know. Um, but what other options, what what other services do you provide for any kind of patient who would come in?

Heather Fry: For sure. Um, the wellness side, even though, you know, we have them, we can kind of chat about them together. They’re both kind of their own deep dive in and of itself. So if somebody is really seeking the wellness side, their hormones are off or they’re explaining symptoms that kind of match that. I really encourage them to follow our curated process for that and meet with Victoria, our nurse practitioner that is incredibly passionate about women’s health. She comes from a background in L.A. and just seeing women through her biggest life change, and I just love her presentation of the wellness side. Um, and so we offer bioidentical hormone replacement therapy through we have pellets, which sometimes for patients, it may take a little bit for them to warm up to that idea. So we also offer in injectables and then creams which are still bioidentical. Um, we have peptide therapy, different supplements based on your nutritional kind of blood panel. And we also do an in-body scan, which kind of takes what muscle mass, you know, fat, water weight, your metabolic rate at rest. Like how what does your metabolism look like at rest? That’s what’s going to kind of set the trajectory of how you’re able to like maintain where you’re at or if you’re gaining weight, losing weight, different things like that.

Heather Fry: Um, so that’s kind of its own little bubble. And then the esthetic side. Um, we just brought on not just I would say Brittany, our esthetician, she’s amazing. She’s been with us for the last year. She kind of did like a six month medical esthetician kind of internship with me, followed me, watching me do all my treatments, and kind of took over the beginning of the year. And she’s just incredible. But that in and of itself is a healing process. But working on the skin is really important can actually render a lot of great natural results. If you focus on that and then if somebody wants to, you know, speak to injectables, then myself or also Victoria nurse practitioner can sit down and talk about injectables. So we have neuro modulators which everybody knows what Botox is. Dysprosium and Dax. Vivo. We have all of them. Um, and then we also have dermal fillers, which most people are familiar with. Um, because there’s been, you know, chatter in the industry about filler fatigue or different things. Um, I really focused on regenerative treatments. So I do a lot of sculpt which is uses basically your it’s like planting seed for collagen.

Heather Fry: So what’s left behind is your own natural collagen. So when somebody is sitting down with me I recommend sculpture to most of my patients 30 and up. To some degree it’s it’s kind of the gift that keeps on giving that people say the 401 K plan for your face. You at last up to 2 to 3 years because you have more collagen in your skin, and it’s going to look the most natural over time. Um, so as my business has grown from just a solo injector to now to injectors and nutritional side, wellness side, um, and an esthetician, I feel like I can really take care of the whole woman. If somebody is, I kind of listen to what they’re screaming for more. If the forefront of their complaint or what they’re telling me is more hormones, we’ll focus on that first. And we won’t even focus on the injectable side because I want them to feel feel physically well, if it’s in disrupting their life to a deep degree, then we’re going to focus on that first and then do injectables. So they both kind of complement each other.

Sharon Cline: They do. It’s interesting to note that even if you felt like you looked really good because you had services done, if you don’t feel really good, it’s not going to even show. I never really thought about that before. Yeah, if you could wave a magic wand and teach every woman one thing about hormones and aging, what do you think that would be?

Heather Fry: Um, that they’re vital for longevity and to not be scared of them. To take the fear. I would wave a wand and remove the fear.

Sharon Cline: What do you think people are afraid of?

Heather Fry: You know, the way that hormones were maybe previously utilized and are still utilized in certain aspects of medicine is the the fear of the C-word of them causing cancer?

Sharon Cline: Oh, I didn’t think about that at all.

Heather Fry: And that’s the question I get with when people say with injectables, am I going to look fake when we talk about hormones? Is this going to cause cancer? That’s a big conversation. And so there’s a lot of studies out there that, you know, can debunk that and actually back up the healthier side, the more the preventative side of that because hormones are vital. Um. And when testosterone decreases in females, we lose muscle mass. We lose. You know, all the things that keep us feeling vibrant. Um, and so just really a lot of education comes with that. But the magic wand would be removing the fear and really sticking home that point that its hormones are vital for longevity, like just the longevity of life.

Sharon Cline: Well, I also think as much as men suffer in their own ways, but women in particular, there’s just so between okay, menstruation and pregnancy and menopause, all of that just keeps constantly changing. Correct. So I can’t imagine how tough it must be on your end to even see, uh, these, these fluctuations. How do you how do you kind of, like, modulate them? How do you keep them within a certain range? It must be very challenging.

Heather Fry: It’s what projected me into wanting to offer hormones in my practice because I knew it was a big undertaking. But when I was early in my practice in internal medicine practice, I saw so many women the same exact story, and I did not have a solution for them because the way I was either interpreting their labs, there wasn’t at the time. It wasn’t very popular to start testosterone creams or injections or things for females. And so that wasn’t a tool in my in my toolbox. And I it didn’t settle well with me. I’m like, I’m not bought into the way I’m practicing anymore because I’m leaving so many women. I can either offer you an antidepressant, an SSRI, optimize your vitamin D or B12. But if that’s not enough, there’s obviously something missing. And it’s the hormone aspect. And that is what made me want to take this deep dive into offering it and educating myself. And it’s still an educational process because as a whole, like as the medical field, we’re still learning a lot. But I think more attention is being given to it because there’s such positive outcomes and success stories with with women.

Sharon Cline: What do you do to take care of yourself? I love that because you have not only your practice, but you have. You just had a baby. You look like you just had a baby. Like you don’t even look like it. It’s amazing. And it’s like, such a testament to, like, the good fight. But what do you do to take care of yourself?

Heather Fry: So I would say it’s been a progression, honestly, and just my educational process in my career as a whole with esthetics. I was the injector when I first started out. I first I just did Botox and really my skincare game wasn’t as strong as it could have been. I didn’t do peels. I wasn’t hooked up with an esthetician at the time. Um, and I’ve really just as a whole, like high level, tried every service that I offer. I’ve tried along the way. I’ve, I’ve as I’ve brought another tool in, I tried it first and as I was a believer in it then it’s something that I offered. Um, I did IVF with my first two babies. So after eight years of infertility and overloading my body with hormones, I felt very just not well. The postpartum depression and all of those things are very hard to overcome. You know, I lean on my faith. I lean on my husband, my friends and family around me. Um, but I wasn’t optimal. And it wasn’t until I started doing testosterone replacement therapy.

Sharon Cline: No kidding.

Heather Fry: After my third baby. So I had my third, which was a surprise.

Sharon Cline: Here we are.

Heather Fry: It was like at first it was a buy to get one free. Now it’s a buy to get to because now I have four kids that we always joke about that. Um, but I actually experienced what it was like to have a testosterone pellet, and I was able to. And again, this is not medical advice. This is my experience. But at the time I my Zoloft wasn’t working for postpartum depression, and I felt like the testosterone pellets helped me with my postpartum depression helped kind of restore my libido, which obviously helps a marriage when you’re going through that, you know, growing and having baby time of life, that’s a really hard time for marriages that I don’t think it’s enough attention. We could do a whole series.

Sharon Cline: On that 100%.

Heather Fry: And so that was incredible. Um, and so I just I wanted to continue to stick with it. So I would say that was great, being really regimented with my supplements, my, my B12 supplements, my, you know, vitamin D, probiotics, gut health is really important. It sounds cliche, but really like your hydration, your basics. Right. And being overly obsessive about those things because there was lack of sleep or other things that I couldn’t control. I tried to be really diligent, diligent about the things I could control. And then coming into having my fourth baby, I knew that, okay, the testosterone pellet is a given. I’m going to do that. And then peptide therapy is something that I’ve recently started doing that I Didn’t you know do previously? Um, I started, um, injecting some Merlin, which is a growth hormone. Stimulating hormone? It’s not semaglutide. It’s not a GLP one. It is a great thing to pair with that when people are coming off of those. But it basically stimulates your growth, your body, to release its own growth hormone, which helps with sleep tightening skin recovery. Um, but also your hormones working better. And so that’s something I did prior to getting pregnant. There’s a there’s studies and, you know, evidence out there about actually helping women get pregnant with some of these medicines.

Sharon Cline: Who knew? I didn’t know.

Heather Fry: That. Yeah. And, um, I learned it more from my reproductive endocrinologist, like, kind of talking through some of the medications I had to take at the time. But, um, that really helped me. And so when I had Theo, my fourth baby, I knew I wanted to, you know, do another series of those peptides. And then I also use BPC 157 and TB 500, which you can take in an oral capsule because it’s made in the gut. So I encourage people to take that supplement. It’s great. But I did it in an injectable form postpartum. And that I would say that helped my core and my back pain from my epidural and just the bomb that goes off inside your body after a baby. I feel like this has been the best recovery I’ve had from any kid.

Sharon Cline: Wow. Fourth one too.

Heather Fry: Yes.

Sharon Cline: What I love is that you really are taking this approach of I. I will not recommend something unless I’ve actually gone through it myself. Because now you can. You’re the patient and you’re the provider. And it’s very interesting way to look at it. So if you could hear someone say, here are my symptoms, you know already what it feels like and you already know how much better it will be for them.

Heather Fry: Exactly.

Sharon Cline: Um, what has been one of the most spiritually affirming moments in your practice? Like, what have you had? Have you had a moment where you were just like, this is why I do this.

Heather Fry: I mean, when I have those moments with patients where, you know, and it could be something as simple as you make me feel like myself again, but also with the hormone replacement therapy side. You’ve killed my marriage. You’ve restored my relationship with my spouse.

Sharon Cline: Or probably cry every day. Things like that that’s so important is profound.

Heather Fry: It is. It’s really just seeing lives change from from that energy exchange with patients. I would say the other thing that’s reaffirming is just the fact that my doors are still open. I think that being a business owner is extremely.

Sharon Cline: That was my next step is like, let’s talk about what it’s like to be a business owner, especially through the pandemic. To girl, you you hung in. Yes, yes. What is that like for you to be able to have your practice and be a be a business owner? We were just talking about social media. It never ends.

Heather Fry: Never.

Sharon Cline: Yeah. What is it like for you to balance?

Heather Fry: I think the balance comes in and I’ve, I’ve, I’ve leaned on mentors and people that do it better than me. My husband’s amazing at business, but other women in the space. And I heard a nurse practitioner say one time she was like, I don’t believe in work life balance. I believe more so. And wherever you are, you’re 100% present. Or you you do your best to be as present as you can be in that moment, so that if you’re in your business, you’re giving everybody your all in that moment and trying your best not to split that time between other things. For me, when I’m kid facing and when I’m with my children, I it took me about a year, year and a half into my owning my business to learn that. Like, I can’t sit there on a computer in front of them because I’m telling them that work comes before them. And that was a very hard boundary to set, I would say.

Sharon Cline: Well, because it never ends for you.

Heather Fry: It never ends.

Sharon Cline: Is it a challenge still, or are you just very good at being able to put that boundary down? It would be hard for me, I think.

Heather Fry: I think the boundary I’ve, I’ve mastered the boundary. Now what I’m finding is you kind of. You’re walking a tightrope and you’re balancing everything on these two plates that you’re holding. And there are certain things on that plate that hold more weight. And those are the things that you don’t want to fall through the cracks or fall off the plate.

Speaker3: What a great visual, I love this.

Heather Fry: I’m a very visual.

Sharon Cline: I love this one.

Speaker3: I see it and I get the feeling.

Heather Fry: And you’re walking. It’s like there’s certain things falling off, right? And you’re like, you know, you either hired your weakness, which are going to be other people maybe walking below you, or maybe that little safety net of people that maybe catch those things that would fall through the cracks that you can’t handle or hold on to. But there’s there’s also things that like, no, I have to handle that. And those are the things that I tried to focus on. I know what I can let fall through the cracks and what things can’t. Whether it’s, hey, we missed the deadline on sending out the email. You know what? We can push it to next week. I’m not going to. I’m going to spend another hour with my kids, or I’m going to make sure I go to bed on time tonight so I can be rested for my employees and people I’m leading and my patients tomorrow versus like, hey, payroll has to be ran. All right, well, I’m not sleeping on that. You know, there’s there’s it’s just really the management of those tasks. And I’m going to probably butcher this. I’ve my husband, we’ve read like so many books I probably need to reread them. But the seven Habits of Highly Effective People. And then you have your four quadrants. And is it urgent? Not important. Not important, you know, urgent kind of what quadrant are you operating in? And then how do you evaluate that, but also teaching other people on your team how to do that as well?

Sharon Cline: Right. Because that all impacts you.

Heather Fry: It all impacts me.

Sharon Cline: So how has that been leading people?

Heather Fry: I’ve again, because I’m a people person, you kind of think that you’re good at it and you’re like, I got this. And I’m, you know, started with the small team. What I realized is there’s better ways to go about things. And my husband has had his business for 12 plus years, and he does really well at leading people. He was in the military. There’s those leadership skills have to be sharpened and not everybody is going to. There’s a book that says, you said this. I heard that like, not everybody’s going to receive it the way that you say it. Um, and there’s also another Clifton strength finders, right. Like your your greatest strength can become your greatest weakness. And so to be an effective leader, it takes an incredible amount of self-awareness and continuing to always look at yourself as a people person problem. Is it a process problem? Is it a me problem?

Sharon Cline: And is is the person who you’re trying to help even open or has the capacity to understand what you’re trying to do, right? The personalities? The different personalities?

Heather Fry: Yep.

Sharon Cline: I never really thought about that either.

Heather Fry: So that yeah, that’s, you know, just knowing like how to communicate to your team members and how they best receive constructive criticism, feedback, something you’re trying to say nice and kind. They may take as like, I’m out. She said, what to me? You know that misunderstanding? Um, my husband always calls it temperature checks. He’s like, you constantly have to do temperature checks on your employees. And not only just how are we doing in the business, but how are they doing in their personal life? Because at the end of the day, I’m giving them a means to put food on the table, feed their family, you know, be fulfilled in their career. And it’s like, I also want to make sure that they feel empowered to come to me if there’s something going on, because ultimately that will impact, you know, the team and our patients. And so just making sure you have a good kind of thumb on the pulse is kind of what my husband always.

Sharon Cline: Good way to.

Heather Fry: Look.

Sharon Cline: At it. It’s not like you’re having these big meetings. You’re just kind of checking in. Yeah. You know, um, is there anything in your practice that you sort of Wish you had.

Heather Fry: Okay. That’s a very broad question. So it is. I think, um. Like a people or a process or.

Sharon Cline: You know what I was thinking more like.

Heather Fry: Because I do have an answer, but I don’t know if that’s true. Like, I would just say more space right now. That’s that’s the main thing that’s on the forefront of my mind is more space, because I don’t want my patient experience to suffer. That’s 100. At the end of the day, if somebody walks out and they don’t spend a dime, I want them to. I would rather them walk out and say, I had an amazing experience there. Yeah, that’s that’s what it’s about.

Sharon Cline: Um, when you were getting started with your practice, like, was that incredibly daunting for you to find a name, make an LLC all of those steps to make your own business. What was that like for you?

Heather Fry: I was I kind of felt a little Empowered just because of like my husband. I had watched him do it before and I had helped him kind of behind the scenes start his businesses. We have investment properties. We’ve started LLCs, things like that. So it was that part wasn’t daunting to me. What was daunting was, are people going to come? And if I put all this money out there, is it going to be reciprocated? And then is it is it going to continue to infinity and beyond? What does that look like.

Sharon Cline: Go through a pandemic like what we went through.

Heather Fry: Exactly.

Sharon Cline: So how how was what was your strategy to to get yourself known. Yeah. And your reputation out there to be. Oh I have I know a lady who can do this. All your all the people who talk, you know. How did you do it?

Heather Fry: I would say word of mouth has definitely been the most powerful kind of fuel to that flame. Right. Um, when I first started out, I think the biggest thing is just putting your best foot forward and making it convenient for patients. Um, I did. I used to do more, and this just dawned on me the other day. I was talking to Victoria, our nurse practitioner. I was like, we need to start doing more like VIP Botox, you know, pop up clinics or I don’t want to call like, Botox parties, but, you know, like, because it’s still medical, like pop up clinics. I did a lot of that in the beginning. Um, because it kind of takes the fear around. Injectables kind of brings it down. Um, you know, Instagram obviously was a way for me to get my name and my the word out there. Um, but it was it’s really just through community and all of the patients word of mouth. And then there’s some, you know, there’s some marketing strategy, I would say about eight months in which I can’t. Did you come in from a marketing?

Sharon Cline: I did, I came in through Instagram.

Heather Fry: Yes. So I told my husband, I’m like, I don’t want to do that. I don’t want to be cheesy. I don’t, you know, for me, I didn’t want it to cheapen anything. But it’s like you have to put, you know, investments into that. So we have done marketing through Instagram and through Facebook, and that’s brought a lot of new faces. And that’s been incredible as well.

Sharon Cline: But it’s the work that you do because when someone says, oh my goodness, you look so great. And you’re like, yeah, I’ll tell you what I did. Yeah. You know.

Heather Fry: You like I’ll.

Sharon Cline: Go. Yeah. Because you, it’s like, uh, your, your skills and your passion for what you’re doing. They’re walking billboard for that. Yeah, right. What an interesting way to think about it. I never thought about that. It is.

Heather Fry: And that’s that. When people say, I don’t want to look fake, I’m like, you’re also you’re. That’s my work. So I don’t want you to look fake either. I want you to exude confidence because then that can turn into what have you been doing, you know, and then that’s how the conversation gets sparked.

Sharon Cline: Do you have some patients that do want just the most.

Heather Fry: Like, all the things?

Sharon Cline: Yeah. Or even don’t mind not looking real. They like the fake look. Yes I do. What do you do?

Heather Fry: That’s a great. That’s a great question. I, I just say, hey, you know that to the degree that you’re asking me to either put filler in the lip or put filler in the cheeks. My number one reservation is always about safety. So if I can safely put a little bit more volume in a certain area, I will, um, if that’s the look you’re going for. But I don’t have a ton of those patients. But I do have some. And we’ve actually built a really great, trusted relationship because they’ll be like, you know what? You’re right. Like, let’s I think what you did was perfect. Let’s stop there. And you kind of you both kind of come up with your own plan. It’s not just them kind of driving, driving the ship like I want more, but there are I mean, I hear patients, they’re like, I want to be frozen or I’m the one that went to my plastic surgeon and I said, I want to look like I have fake boobs. I want to get credit for this. So I want to I want to look like I paid for my lips to be done, you know, and what they may or may not realize is I’m still going to make it look natural, you know.

Sharon Cline: Well, you know.

Heather Fry: The best of my ability.

Sharon Cline: Because that’s your ethics.

Heather Fry: Yes, exactly.

Sharon Cline: Um, I mean, what advice would you give to someone who is wanting to be in the same kind of service as you were? They’re blending like science, service, spirituality. They want what kind of truth keeps you grounded in that? And what would you recommend someone else finding for themselves?

Heather Fry: I think that it really comes down to knowing your why and kind of your mission statement. My husband always talks about that, like when I kind of get derailed mentally and I’m like, I can’t do this anymore. Okay, let’s come back to why we’re doing this in the first place. And that’s what keeps you grounded. Or if you.

Sharon Cline: Love.

Heather Fry: That, you get a complaint from a patient or something that’s like, man, I can’t believe. Like, now nobody likes me. That’s not true. But you know, these thoughts that we tell ourselves.

Sharon Cline: Feels.

Heather Fry: True. It feels very true. I think that it comes down to just knowing what your conviction is for why you started it in the first place.

Sharon Cline: Which is why you won’t go too far with someone, right? Yeah. That kind of keeps you into your own little personal boundary.

Heather Fry: Exactly.

Sharon Cline: Yeah. I love the asking the why? Because all of the other details can be so distracting. And. But you’re right. If it comes down to I really am trying to help people feel good about who they are, right? That’s very simple.

Heather Fry: You build it or you build it around that.

Sharon Cline: I, I never thought about it. How many times have I said that in this? I never thought about it like that. Yeah, I really thought about that.

Heather Fry: That’s the aha moments. That’s that’s what we’re going for.

Sharon Cline: Yeah. But you know how, how interesting it is that it’s so much of our world is driven by it, you know, the way you look and the way you feel. And I love the idea of it being health too. And so when I think about the little things that I’ve done up until now, it’s it’s it’s meant a lot to me. Not just the way I look at myself, but like, feeling good. So it’s it’s it’s all around like that soul, the mind, body and soul all kind of mixed together. Not every practice focuses on that, too. That’s what I love about yours, I think, is when I go in, it’s like we’re having a relationship. Like we’re having relationship moment.

Heather Fry: I call it the unified moments.

Sharon Cline: Because.

Heather Fry: I want you to leave feeling unified. It’s I that actually came to me recently. It’s like these are sacred, unified moments, you know, that you have with those patients. And when you have that with somebody, they’re like, I’m not going anywhere else. That’s what I’m looking for. That’s what I’m trying to impress upon everybody. And you know, that sits in my chair.

Sharon Cline: What’s like, has there ever been sort of this big moment for you, for you where you could almost like high five yourself for today. Today was. Today was the best day. What is like the best day for you? For patients to come in and feel what?

Heather Fry: Welcomed. Comfortable. And just like safe.

Sharon Cline: Safe. That’s such a good word.

Heather Fry: Safe. Because we do share a lot of intimate. I mean, I have a lot of intimate conversations with my patients, not purposely. It kind of just accidentally happens because they do feel safe. I can tell when somebody is sitting there looking at me like, I don’t know if I believe what you’re saying, lady, you know, and it’s some maybe they come in with a harder shell and like, that is my mission is for them to leave feeling like, okay, I trusted her and I feel safe. But also the best day, like a good day for me, is to also feel like my employees had those exchanges with people as well. Because the women that work with me, I could not do it without them. And when they walk into a room and they have a positive exchange with a patient or hey, girlfriend, you’re back and they’re bantering with a patient, that brings me joy because I know that it fills them. And then when they go home, it’s giving them self-worth. And so having that space to where now I have another nurse practitioner, I want her to have those moments too, with other people and just kind of replicating. But she’s going to have it in a different way because she has a little, you know, a different kind of tweak on her craft.

Sharon Cline: Different little energy. Yeah.

Heather Fry: Exactly.

Sharon Cline: What do you think is the biggest misconception about what you do?

Heather Fry: That. Maybe I’m in it for the money because there’s a lot of people that want to get into this space. And it is maybe to leave bedside nursing to go into it because it looks Fun and it’s very lucrative. It is a lot of hard work, and it takes a lot of keeping up with the most recent research. Always checking your safety protocols, not getting too overly confident about what you’re doing, because a lot of it, you know, requires a lot of skill and knowledge and anatomy because we are injecting things that could cause high risk problems. Um, so yeah, that it’s like fun all the time. It’s a mentally I leave more mentally exhausted than physically exhausted. A lot of the times. The mental exhaustion is is tough sometimes because I want to make sure that I’m I give a lot. And so when I, when I leave sometimes I mean, I, I leave extremely empty going home depleted. Yeah.

Sharon Cline: What do you do to replenish? Because when you go home, you also are mom and wife.

Heather Fry: Yeah, I so this was a big conversation, you know, with little kids all the time because you walk through the door and it’s so many different emotions. When I get home, I will either sit in my car for five ten minutes in the driveway, gather myself, call a person, respond to something that just I needed to get that off my chest, call my best friend, chat. Um, or really just going inside. I’m like, telling my husband, hey, I’m here. Or like, my nanny, hey, I’m here. I’m gonna run upstairs and just change. Just get refreshed and, like, mentally ready for, okay, now I’m in mom mode, just giving me that minute to kind of pivot and switch the hat.

Sharon Cline: What do you think your fearless formula is? Because I’m very sure whoever’s listening who may have had a dream like yours, like I really want to be able to matter to people like this and help improve people’s lives. But it’s it can be scary. Yeah. Um, how did you work around? What is a natural sort of fear of. I don’t know exactly how this is going to work, and I like how did you keep going during the pandemic?

Heather Fry: Yeah. Um, I would definitely say my faith is at the top of the list, right? You know, believing in what kind of God was. If God gave you that calling that it’s kind of impressed upon my heart. Then it’s it’s my job to seek and follow, um, really taking that quiet time to kind of listen to where it is leading me. The pandemic for me, when I got laid off of my primary care job, esthetics was all I kind of had to turn to at the time because there was like the zoom boom. Everybody was looking at a camera at themselves. So there was this zoom effect where people were coming in saying, I see this wrinkle on my face I didn’t see before because I’m staring at my face all day. So there was kind of this little like, boom effect in the esthetic industry that kind of fueled some fire at the time.

Sharon Cline: What? Who knew?

Heather Fry: And that was kind of a cool thing. Um, but for me, it’s staying true to what I was originally Called to do and then allowing those circumstances just kind of always having your, your ear kind of tuned in to those quiet whispers of you’re on the right path and then a door would open that just keep putting it into motion. Right? If you have a calling and you have an interest and you have a desire, then what is it look like? You. You can’t be stagnant. You have to set something into motion. And you’re constantly each motion, each act, each leap of faith kind of fuels you to the next because it’s like, wow, I took that leap of faith that encouraged me because that worked out. And even when things don’t work out, is there a pausing and saying, is this to stop? Or is this to recalibrate and teach me something so that I don’t make a bigger mistake that would bring more hurt and pain along the way?

Sharon Cline: So it’s like not allowing, um, a pivot to mean that you’re wrong. If you are, why it is still in alignment with who you are.

Heather Fry: Exactly.

Sharon Cline: Interesting. I like that because so many things come in that you can’t control. You don’t know what’s going to happen. I hate learning by mistakes. Yeah, I like listening to someone like you who’s gone through something where I can say, oh, my God, it’s so wise, you know, let me take that advice. But when I was younger, you couldn’t tell me any of that. But being an older person. Yeah. Same. Yeah. No. Teach me your ways. Yeah.

Heather Fry: Listening to people that are, you know, wiser than you that have gone before you. Um, and also, as your circle of influence grows, your circle of concern shrinks. Meaning the things that you used to be worried about, you’re not worried about anymore because you, you know, your influence is so vast and so big, you almost get more introspective. And you stop focusing on those little things that used to take you down. So you you exercise that muscle. People are like, well, how do you do it? I didn’t have four kids overnight. I didn’t have a business in 6 or 7 employees overnight. You grow that muscle. You know, you exercise that taught that stress tolerance or whatever that looks like. But over time, you become more introspective because that’s what it takes to continue to be a moldable, you know, effective leader.

Sharon Cline: Is there’s fluidity. Yeah, there. So if you had 15 years ago caught a glimpse of yourself now, it would have been like, oh my gosh, you know, I have all these kids and I’ve got this ball. My eyes. I would have tired freak out if I knew I was going to be on some radio or whatever. Right.

Heather Fry: Exactly.

Sharon Cline: How did that happen? You don’t know what you’re doing. Yeah, but amazing how these little steps that you get. It’s like the road rises to meet you where you are.

Heather Fry: Exactly.

Sharon Cline: Which is really kind of. It’s very encouraging to know that nobody really just gets it right overnight. But as they’re as they’re taking little steps, you get met along the way.

Heather Fry: Correct.

Sharon Cline: I love that. Yeah. What’s coming? This may be one of the last questions. I could talk to you forever. I know it’s like 55 minutes already. Um, what do you see coming on the horizon in your industry that anyone could look forward to? What are you allowed to talk about? I don’t know.

Heather Fry: I would say, um, there’s a lot of, you know, the regenerative part of esthetics, regenerative medicine. Um, you know, we’re talking about peptides and things that make cells behave better. Right. I think it’s just going. It’s going to be hopefully more access to utilize those peptides and utilize the science like exosomes and stem cells and things that can be controversial. But for us to have more definitive either FDA approvals or definitive Of ways that protect us as providers to using those things versus using some of these things off label, which get get done all the time in medicine because we’re a provider, if we have an anecdotal reason or that evidence, then that’s our clinical backup. But you still want to make sure you’re doing right by the patient, because we don’t know what that long term effect looks like. And I think what’s coming on the horizon is just more research and more confirmation that what we’re currently doing is what we should be doing.

Sharon Cline: It’s so interesting to think about it from a cellular level, because essentially that’s where you’re fighting, you know, and so to be able to correct those. Um, I can’t imagine what from the inside out, how different people can look. I feel it’s.

Heather Fry: It’s going to be interesting to see what my adult children, what disease processes they, you know, face in their generation or the lack thereof because of the drastic improvements and medical just hurdles that that we’re making right now that become commonplace. Everybody had like just like everybody had a tanning bed at their house. You’d go to your friend’s garage like, hey, I’m gonna hop in the tanning bed. Yeah. It’s like, is everybody gonna have a hyperbaric chamber in their garage? Is everybody have, like, a red light therapy bed in their garage? Like, you know, hey, this is just what we do all the time.

Sharon Cline: I’ve heard such good things about red light therapy. Yeah. So, yeah, I.

Heather Fry: Think it’s.

Sharon Cline: Great. Wouldn’t it be amazing to know that we could, at home, be able to counteract some of, like, the free radicals we get exposed to all the time? Exactly.

Heather Fry: That’s what it’s about. That’s what we’re combating every single day. And it all comes down to. To what degree do you want to fight that, correct that, reverse. That is going to be what things you need to do, right? Add into your toolbox.

Sharon Cline: It’s a really exciting time.

Heather Fry: It is.

Sharon Cline: I’m really happy that you’re part of it.

Heather Fry: Thank you. It’s very competitive. Oh, that’s why I’m. I want to I’m. There’s a big shift happening right now where it’s becoming very saturated. And I think trust in the provider is it’s not just about the discount or the this or the the money grab. It’s we have to be even more diligent about earning that trust of our patients, our audience. And so that’s just what I’m trying to focus on is focus on, you know, patient trust and experience versus numbers.

Sharon Cline: Is that what you sort of see for your practice like five years, ten years from now, you sort of always having that thought behind it but growing for sure.

Heather Fry: Definitely. And I want to, you know, empower other providers that kind of come under my wing or come into the practice to have that like their why like help to develop their why and fuel their why and give them the resources to have that outlet to do it. You know, under the umbrella of unify and whatever that looks like for them.

Sharon Cline: I love, too, that you’re talking about it being saturated because I get ads all the time. You know, you click on one ad and then you’re on all the ads, but it is almost like, um, there’s no way to know. It’s a, you know, there’s no way to know, especially if it’s not word of mouth. Right. So that becomes even more important, I imagine.

Heather Fry: Yeah. For sure.

Sharon Cline: Well, my word of mouth. Yeah. Amazing. Is that. No. Is that. I’ve had a great experience having you here in the studio. And also, if someone wanted to reach out to you or find out more about your your practice, where can they go?

Heather Fry: So you can go to my website, unify esthetics plural.com or my Instagram is at unify esthetics. Um and learn more there.

Sharon Cline: Well I have just had the best time. Heather Frye I have to thank you so much for coming in and letting me understand, even because we never get chances to talk. But having an understanding of what your why is and how important it is to know your own truth and stick by it when I’m sure you get pulled on. Lots of different ways to not do that, but there’s something peaceful about putting your head down at night, knowing you stayed true to yourself, and then your practice continues to grow because of that. Because you never compromise, you know? Exactly.

Heather Fry: Thank you for helping me articulate that.

Sharon Cline: Oh, sure. Well, I love that.

Heather Fry: That’s kind of what you do. That’s kind of why we’re here.

Sharon Cline: Well, this has been a happy Thursday for me, so.

Heather Fry: I enjoyed.

Sharon Cline: It. Thank you. And thank you all for listening to Business RadioX Fearless Formula. I’m Business RadioX and again, this is Sharon Cline and Heather Frye saying with knowledge and understanding, we can all have our own fearless formula. Have a great day.

 

Tagged With: Unify Aesthetics & Wellness

From Corporate Hubs to Community Events: The Multifaceted Role of Perimeter CIDs

August 4, 2025 by angishields

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Greater Perimeter Business Radio
From Corporate Hubs to Community Events: The Multifaceted Role of Perimeter CIDs
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In this episode of Greater Perimeter Business Radio, Lee Kantor interviews Ann Hanlon, Executive Director of the Perimeter Community Improvement Districts (CIDs). Ann discusses how the CIDs, funded by commercial property owners, invest in infrastructure, beautification, and community events to enhance the Perimeter area—a major Atlanta business hub. Key topics include the area’s economic significance, collaborative regional efforts, new trail and transit initiatives, and the Playfully Perimeter event series. Ann emphasizes the importance of public-private partnerships and community engagement in making Perimeter a vibrant, accessible, and attractive place to live and work.

Ann-HanlonAs Executive Director for the Perimeter Community Improvement Districts (PCIDs), Ann Hanlon is in charge of the organization’s daily operations, as well as its investments in transportation infrastructure.

The CIDs have an annual operating budget of over $8 million. Previously, Ann was the Executive Director of the the North Fulton CID for 13 years, beginning when it was a start-up. Prior to entering the CID space, Ann served as a Senior Program Specialist at the Atlanta Regional Commission.

A native of South Georgia, Ann received a Bachelor of Arts degree with a double major in Government and Computer Science from the University of Notre Dame, and a Masters of Public Administration degree in Management and Finance from Georgia State University.

Ann was honored as the “Woman of the Year” by the Women’s Transportation Seminar Atlanta Chapter in November 2016. In April 2015 and again in 2017, Governor Nathan Deal appointed Ann to the Board of Directors for the Georgia Regional Transportation Authority where she serves on the Projects and Planning committees. Ann was named a “Notable Georgian” by Georgia Trend Magazine in 2017, one of the Atlanta Business Chronicle’s “Women Who Mean Business” in 2015 and as one of Georgia Trend Magazine’s “40 under 40” in 2012 and 2018.

In 2019, she served as Chairman of the Board of Directors for the Council for Quality Growth as the Council’s first female Chairman. Additionally, Ann serves on the Board of Directors for the Women’s’ Transportation Seminar, Atlanta Chapter, the Greater North Fulton Chamber of Commerce, the Sandy Springs and Dunwoody Perimeter Chambers of Commerce, and the DeKalb Chamber of Commerce.

In 2020, Ann was appointed by CEO Michael Thurmond to the DeKalb County COVID19 task force, and continues to serve in that capacity as a representative of large business interests in Perimeter during the pandemic.

Ann is a graduate of the Regional Leadership Institute of the Atlanta Regional Commission (2010) and Leadership North Fulton (2006). Personally, Ann is a volunteer with the Girl Scouts of Metro Atlanta, a member of All Saints Catholic Church and a sustainer with the Junior League of Atlanta.

She lives in Dunwoody with her husband, Michael, and their two daughters.

Follow PCIDs on LinkedIn.

Episode Highlights

  • Overview of the Perimeter Community Improvement Districts (CID) and its role in the Perimeter area.
  • Funding mechanisms of the CID through a special purpose tax on commercial property owners.
  • Infrastructure projects supported by the CID, including sidewalks, trails, and road improvements.
  • The significance of the Perimeter area as a corporate hub with numerous Fortune 500 companies.
  • The Playfully Perimeter initiative aimed at community engagement through free events.
  • Regional cooperation among the cities of Sandy Springs, Dunwoody, and Brookhaven.
  • The CID’s role in enhancing transportation options, including the Rapid Ride vanpool service.
  • Emphasis on pedestrian and bicycle infrastructure development post-COVID-19.
  • The importance of community awareness and support for CID initiatives.
  • Encouragement for public engagement in local events and understanding the CID’s contributions to the community.

Transcript-iconThis transcript is machine transcribed by Sonix

 

TRANSCRIPT

Intro: Broadcasting live from the Greater Perimeter. It’s time for Greater Perimeter Business Radio. Now, here’s your host.

Lee Kantor: Lee Kantor here. Another episode of Greater Perimeter Business Radio in. This is going to be a good one. Today on the show, we have Ann Hanlon who is the executive director for the Perimeter Community Improvement Districts. Welcome, Ann.

Ann Hanlon: Hi. Good morning. Well, thank you so much for having me. I really appreciate it.

Lee Kantor: Well, I am so excited to learn what you’re up to for folks who aren’t familiar. Can you explain the Perimeter CIDs? How are you serving folks?

Ann Hanlon: Yeah, absolutely. So the the perimeter community improvement districts, we are a special purpose tax district. We generate property tax dollars from a private millage rate here from commercial property owners in the perimeter area. And then we are able to privately invest those dollars into projects that benefit the business market, the business community. We can do sort of hard core construction projects, like we help the city governments build sidewalks and trails and intersections and exit ramps off the highway. And we can also participate in like programing and doing sort of like fun events around the area. The whole idea is to keep the perimeter market healthy and thriving and exciting, continuing to be the big economic engine that it is. The Sid, a little bit of history, the the SIDs is we are uh, we’re actually two community improvement districts under one roof. Perimeter SED was founded in 1999, believe it or not. So we’ve we’ve been around for a while. We are one of about 30 special community improvement districts in metro Atlanta. There are big kids, you know, people may or may not have heard of them, but they’re kids in Buckhead and Midtown downtown Atlanta, over the battery where the Braves Stadium is, and out in Gwinnett County and in North Fulton. And all these organizations are functioning to do projects in their areas and make it beautiful. You know, some we do landscaping. We do sort of a whole litany of things to sort of keep our community healthy and vibrant.

Lee Kantor: Now, can you kind of educate the listener a little bit about what makes the perimeter area so special? Like how many companies around are in the in the district? Just to give people an idea of, um, how thriving this, this community and region is.

Ann Hanlon: Yeah. So perimeter perimeter is, is one of the largest concentrations of class A office space in the southeastern United States. So we are the home to many fortune 500 companies that, you know, that you have heard of Mercedes Benz. State farm UPS WestRock. Intercontinental hotels Group. Hapag-lloyd. So this you know, we’re big. We’re a big time corporate headquarters in metro Atlanta. We also have a reputation for being a big time corporate headquarters throughout the whole Southeastern United States. So there’s a lot of investment from corporate America has invested a lot here in this community. Um, and they’ve they’ve banked a lot. They have done that because of the strength of this market. Um, this this area geography. We we’re one of the best geographies in metro Atlanta. We of course, you know, right at the corner of 285 and Georgia 400, we’re served by major highways. We have four Marta stations, four heavy rail Marta train stations that service the district, uh, at Dunwoody, Sandy Springs Medical Center and North Springs. Uh, we’ve got a fantastic network of local roads. You know, so we’ve there are three city governments here with the city of Sandy Springs, the city of Dunwoody and the City of Brookhaven. All of them are sort of interconnected. Working on good roads, good signal timings. And now the most recent thing you know, within the last probably five years is the build out of a first class trail system so that people can, you know, the beauty of perimeter, which has always been the beauty of the market and will continue to be, you know, employees can get here on the train, by car, uh, by bicycle, by trail, if they want to walk here. Um, the market is safe. It is clean. So we’ve the market has for years enjoyed sort of a reputation of being this big corporate headquarters for metro Atlanta.

Lee Kantor: Yeah. When I, I live in the area. So this is very personal to me. And it’s important to me to share these kind of stories and educate, uh, kind of the world about what makes this area so special. But I’ll tell people that you can just almost throw a stone and hit billion dollar company headquarters in just it’s just unusual that people don’t kind of really appreciate the density of these super large enterprises just in their neighborhood. That’s kind of hidden away, that you may not even know that they’re there. A lot of the times, and especially for a visitor standpoint, they may not even be aware that, like you mentioned, some of these, the largest of these companies are located in their neighborhood.

Ann Hanlon: That’s right. And you know, the beauty the beauty of perimeter is you put it perfectly. These corporations are here. They’re invested here. You know, again, Mercedes Benz, UPS, Cox Enterprises, State Farm, WestRock. You know, I could go. Um, I could go on and on and on. But not only are they physically located here, but they have invested here. So. So our job at the CID is we work for all those companies, you know, we work for all the companies and the, the, the private real estate investors who own the property. And they are like putting their money where their mouth is. They are actually investing in the community there. They are helping to pay for road projects. They’re helping to pay for the trail projects. Um, they they put their money into the CID, which if you sort of think of it, maybe like a homeowner’s association, if if you live in a subdivision, you’re all paying into the HOA, and then the HOA is able to use that money to do things that benefit the entire community. A CID is pretty similar, actually, except it’s these big corporations that are paying in, um, they pay into the CID and then as staff at the CID, we execute all those projects we work, you know, some of them were able to do on our own, uh, like we maintain all the landscaping Escaping in parameter. We spent over $1 million a year just on landscaping. We do new plantings every spring and fall. We pick up all the trash. Um, you know, we like to make sure that it looks nice because a sense of arrival to to these big corporations, it’s important, a sense of arrival.

Ann Hanlon: When you enter the market, it’s important to look like you’ve arrived at a place where people are paying attention to the way that it looks. Uh, they’re also these big corporations through the SED are helping fund projects. So, uh, and a great example is the 285 at Georgia 400 Interchange project, which if you live in the area, you’re really familiar with that, uh, that is an enormous project. It is one of the biggest projects that the Georgia State Department of Transportation has ever built, like in the history of the state. It’s one of the biggest. And the see, I’m happy to say that the SED has helped finance that. We’ve helped. We made a $10 million investment in that project prior to its starting. We lobbied for years to make it happen, and although it has been a very big, complicated, long project, you know, ultimately the corporations and perimeter and these big commercial property owners, they really do a good job of having a long view. You know, they know that a big investment in a project that probably has caused some discomfort for people on some days, because the traffic will snag up every once in a while. But but long term, that is going to make this market healthy, and it’s going to make it accessible so that we can continue to recruit more companies to come here.

Lee Kantor: Now, can you talk a little bit about the Playfully Perimeter initiative?

Ann Hanlon: Yeah. That’s fun. It’s so the CFD, you know, for for years, like I mentioned, we were founded in 1999. Uh, for years the CED really has invested in, you know, hard core in the ground construction projects, and I could look all over the market and give you examples of that. The SED I mentioned 2400 interchange project. The SED helped build the ramps from Hammond Drive onto Georgia 400. The SED helped build the Perimeter Center Parkway flyover bridge. The SED has worked with the city governments to build countless crosswalks and sidewalks and intersections. Um, but you know, like everyone else after Covid, we have tried to evolve our investments to to really sort of invest in the market and do what people want, you know? And now nowadays, the we really are focused on the experience of being in perimeter, not just that hard core construction projects to get people in and get people out more easily with traffic, but also to make it a pleasant experience. You know, once we understand, it’s important for for residents and for employees, once you get here, it needs to be a pleasant experience. It needs to be safe. It needs to be we clean and there needs to be programing. There needs to be things to do. So one of the initiatives that we’ve launched this year, we launched this spring is called Playfully Perimeter.

Ann Hanlon: Uh, it’s really fun. It’s a series of events that are where we, we put on totally free to the community. Um, we invite the community, we advertise on social media, and we’re just doing these pop ups to sort of show people how fun it is. Our next one is going to be, um, next month on August 27th. It’ll be from 3:00 to 7:00 pm over at Perimeter Summit, which is where Villa Christina is. Um, and the Hyatt just across 25, uh, in Brookhaven. And it’s going to be super fun. We’re going to have popsicles. We’re going to have food. We’re going to have music. People can register for free online. They can register through our website, or you can find us through social media. Um, so that’ll be fun. It’s just going to give people something to do. And you can stay tuned because we’re also going to be doing we’re going to try to aim to have these. Once a quarter We’ll be having one that sort of fall festival related in the fall, and a holiday one. We’re going to be working with the city of Dunwoody on their holiday headquarters event in December.

Lee Kantor: Yeah, there are so many things that happen around here, and and it’s wonderful to see the communities while, like you mentioned, like Sandy Springs, Dunwoody and Brookhaven are all kind of their unique neighborhoods. But there’s so much kind of cross-pollination where people are like, you know, I know personally, I live in Sandy Springs, but I shop at the Dunwoody Publix or I’ll go over to Brookhaven for a meal like it’s very connected and they’re not kind of isolating themselves. It seems like they’re trying to play nice together. And our studio is located physically in the Sandy Springs chamber, but we would love to be more of a resource to the entire area to really be that place where these stories can be told. Are you doing like how how have you found these kind of communities working together, you know, for kind of the common good for the region.

Ann Hanlon: Yeah. I, you know, you you nailed it. I mean, I think that in terms of we have to act together as a region because when we are the to keep the perimeter market strong and to keep all these communities strong, like we there’s there’s more horsepower when we all work together. Um, and we for these big economic development prospects as we’re, you know, recruiting companies. Um, StubHub I shout out to Sandy Springs, uh, StubHub just before the big announcement that they’re they’re locating in perimeter within the city of Sandy Springs. I mean, that’s big. You know, they have these big companies with big cachet continuing to choose Sandy Springs and Dunwoody and Brookhaven. We all it’s I think that’s a testament to the fact that we’re all working together. And so corporate America sort of knows that this is a place where there’s a lot of great synergy, and that’s super important. Um, I’m, I was really, really supportive and excited to see the Perimeter Chamber of Commerce. Of course, has has has gone through a merger over the last year. There was a Dunwoody, a Dunwoody Chamber of Commerce and a Sandy Springs Chamber of Commerce.

Ann Hanlon: Those have now merged to serve even a bigger footprint to sort of represent this Dunwoody and Sandy Springs perimeter region, which is fantastic. You’ve got programs like Leadership Perimeter that it serves that really is building this super strong pipeline of leaders and recruiting young people to serve in leadership roles in Dunwoody and Sandy Springs and Brookhaven. So you’ve got the sort of the civic framework and the social fabric there is already so interconnected. And then when you’ve got the city governments who who have to each function and provide services in their own cities, you know, there’s there’s so much coordination that happens constantly with with road projects and trail projects and signal timing and law enforcement. Um, so I think that citizens really, although citizens may not always get a glimpse at all of that interconnectivity, um, and all the coordination and all the work that goes on behind the scenes. Um, I think that residents really are enjoying a vibrant community because there are so many people behind the scenes working together to make that happen.

Lee Kantor: So what is an a day in the life for and look like? It sounds like there’s so much stuff going on. How do you kind of wrangle all the cats here?

Ann Hanlon: Well, you know, I can honestly say I’m really fortunate at the Syd we’ve got, you know, we have we’re governed by, uh, two boards of directors, um, 18 members, uh, our boards of directors are elected and appointed, and they represent the commercial property owners in this market. And, um, you know, I will say I’m really fortunate to work for all these individuals because they’ve got a long term view of what, what where they think this market needs to go. And then on a daily basis, you know, what does it what does a day look like? I think for the CID staff, our job is to really try to implement their vision so they see a future perimeter market that’s not you know, it’s not your grandfather’s perimeter, right? This is not we’re trying to constantly evolve the market. We don’t this is not the perimeter of the 1980s is not perimeter of the 1990s. We’re really trying to lobby and push everybody forward into what perimeter is going to look like for the next 10 to 15 years. Um, so that involves, gosh, on a daily basis. You know, we are always working with the city government partners, um, Mayor Paul and Sandy Springs, Mayor Deutch and Dunwoody, uh, Mayor Park over the city of Brookhaven.

Ann Hanlon: Um, they have excellent city councils. Excellent. Really? Professionally, I would put their city staff for those three cities. Professional city staff up against any cities in the state. You know, these are three professionally run cities that are able to execute projects. Um, and then, you know, we also, of course, lobby on a state level. We are we’re talking to the state Department of Transportation, communicating with the governor’s office. Really always trying to keep perimeter top of mind because there’s a lot of competition, right? Especially in the state of Georgia. There’s a lot of focus everywhere. Um, at the port down in Savannah, certainly in downtown Atlanta, over the battery out in Gwinnett. So our we wake up every day trying to push projects forward and work with our local partners to see how we can be a resource to them, um, to push forward the vision of keeping perimeter, like I said, the safest, cleanest, most highly performing market in metro Atlanta.

Lee Kantor: Yeah. And as somebody who’s a resident here and works here, you can just feel kind of the center of gravity of the city of Atlanta kind of edging northward and the. And what your work is doing is helping that I think happen.

Ann Hanlon: Yeah. Well I’m glad. Thank you for saying that. And I’m glad you you can see that. I mean, I you know, we’ve got I really just can’t say it enough. There’s so many people who are, who wake up every day trying to make it easy to do business here in perimeter. You know, we’ve we sort of act like a concierge of sorts to all of our businesses. And so relationships are really important. You know, we we may get a call from a property owner who’s trying to get a permit with the county, or they’re trying to get a zoning with the city government, or they’re just trying to connect with someone. And it’s relationships are so important. So we’ve we really try to to convene people. We we, we try to make sure that all the companies are talking to each other. You know, we we do networking events with we have events among the companies so that we’re, you know, we’re actively trying to make sure that State Farm and UPS and Mercedes-Benz and Cox Enterprises, that they have a forum to all get together, um, to talk about the problems that they’re facing. You know, I’ll give you a recent example, uh, where we’re actually launching a van pull service. There have been some cuts. The state of Georgia recently has made some cuts to commuter bus lines that come in and out of perimeter on a daily basis. So we’ve worked with all the big companies to launch, um, like a big van pool program. That’s called Rapid Ride. If you have any listeners who are interested, they can find it on our website. Um, but this is a service that the SED is working with the state agencies to pay for so that if people need, uh, resources to get into perimeter to come to work, and they, for whatever reason or not able to to have their own car, you’ll be able to do that. So it’s super exciting.

Lee Kantor: And I’m noticing a lot more kind of wider sidewalks, encouraging, more walking around and and exploring that way via bike or or walking. Uh, is that a priority as well.

Ann Hanlon: As a huge priority? You know, and especially since Covid, I think Covid, uh, really illustrated that people want to be outside and trail projects are really important. They’re important, you know. And from where I sit, sort of representing the private, uh, business community and the big private corporations, it’s really, really important to them that their employees are able to access these trails, to get, to get out, to walk, to maybe walk, to work on the trails or to have it as amenity that they’re able to offer, um, to help land new business here in perimeter. The big goal, the big goal that is shared by all of the cities and by the CED, is to connect the perimeter market to path 400, um, which of course is a project that was initiated by our our colleagues down in Buckhead through the Buckhead CID and Livable Buckhead, uh, led by Denise Starling. That connecting our trail system to path 400 is so important, because the path 400 ultimately will connect to the Beltline at its south end. So we are all working on it. We every every segment of trail is is wildly expensive and wildly complicated. And their utilities and their topographical issues. Um, but we’re we’re all determined to make it happen. So hopefully one day in the future, you know, a person would be able to walk or to ride their bikes from Perimeter Mall all the way down to the Beltline on an uninterrupted trail system, which I think would just be amazing.

Lee Kantor: Yeah. And I think that that affects like traffic and, uh, getting cars off the road. Like it just changes kind of the look and feel of the experience of living in the metro Atlanta area. I mean it that could be a game changer.

Ann Hanlon: It could. It could be a huge game changer. And there’s so many commercial property owners that own, uh, own property all over metro Atlanta. Um, so there’s a lot of synergy between, you know, commercial property owners, for example, uh, a lot of the same owners who have invested in property in Buckhead have also invested in property and perimeter. So they really understand this, like long term vision of of how that could be a game changer, you know, to be able to be able to just easily and safely ride a bicycle from Buckhead to Perimeter Mall would would totally be a game changer. I think it’s going to is really going to help metro Atlanta, like level up, help us compete with other other metro areas who are already doing this, you know, Austin, Texas, Charlotte, North Carolina, um, some cities in the Midwest. This is already happening in other places. And so there’s a lot of us who are determined to make it happen here.

Lee Kantor: So what do you need more of? How can we help you?

Ann Hanlon: Uh, that’s a great question. Money. Do you have do you have millions of dollars floating around? That always helps. Um, no, I think you know. Thank you so much for for having me on the podcast today. I think, you know, having everybody educated on on what we do as a kid is so important because, you know, we we need community support for all of these things. You know, for the trail projects need that the kid is is wonderful. But there’s really nothing that we can do in a vacuum. We have to have, like our amazing partners at the city of Dunwoody, the city of Sandy Springs, uh, the city of Brookhaven. You know, we do projects and partnership with those cities. They, they, they run point on the projects, and we’re able to be a funding partner, and we’re able to bring the power and the support and the dollars from the business community to support the work that they’re doing. Um, so I think, you know, in terms of your listeners, as long as you can understand what what the challenges are, um, and what the private sector is doing to help that that alone, uh, is helpful and then come out, you know, if you want to really sort of participate in some of the fun programing that we do come out on the 27th of August from 3 to 7. Have some, have some ice cream. Uh, meet some of your neighbors. You know, it’s just great to take part in the community and to understand the community that you’re living in and working in.

Lee Kantor: Yeah. I think that you’re among the unsung heroes of the area. And I think it’s important for folks to understand what you’re trying to accomplish and all the things that you have accomplished thus far that, you know, we as residents might be taking for granted because we don’t know, to give you the credit. But I think it’s important to, uh, for to educate people about the work that you’re doing and how important it is to help better our community as a whole. So I want to thank you for doing what you’re doing and sharing your story today. You’re doing such important work and we do appreciate you.

Ann Hanlon: Oh, thank you, I appreciate that. As I say, it’s it’s amazing what you can accomplish when you don’t care who gets the credit.

Lee Kantor: Exactly. But it’s also important to understand that there are people behind the scenes that are doing this. So they should get the credit, at least be aware that they exist. So if somebody wants to learn more, is there a website? Is there a place to connect?

Ann Hanlon: Absolutely. So please check out our website. Is perimeter atl.com. Uh, we also have a huge social media presence uh, perimeter ATO and we, you know, it’s a good resource because we don’t only just share our own stuff, we also work really closely with all of our partners. And we always broadcast out what they’re doing, whether it’s the perimeter, um, Chamber of Commerce, the Greater Perimeter chamber or Leadership Perimeter or other organizations like discover, Dunwoody or visit Sandy Springs. You know, we’re working with this. There’s a huge civic fabric in this community, and we’re all working together. There’s a lot of great people making it happen, but generally speaking, you can find all of it on our website or on our social media outlets.

Lee Kantor: Well, and thank you again. Uh, we really do appreciate all the work you’re doing, kind of behind the scenes. And it’s important, I think, for, you know, our listeners to understand that this is important work and people are actively doing things to improve their property values, their, you know, kind of day to day experience here. And, and we just really do appreciate what’s happening over there. Uh, thank you again.

Ann Hanlon: Yeah. Thank you for having me. I really appreciate it.

Lee Kantor: All right. This is Lee Kantor. We’ll see you all next time on Greater Perimeter Business Radio.

 

Tagged With: Perimeter Community Improvement Districts (PCIDs)

The Best Strategies for Successful Business Exits and IT Alignment and Workplace Culture

July 30, 2025 by angishields

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Cherokee Business Radio
The Best Strategies for Successful Business Exits and IT Alignment and Workplace Culture
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Brought to you by Diesel David and Main Street Warriors

CherokeeSponsorImageDieselDavidMSW

In this episode of Cherokee Business Radio, Joshua Kornitsky welcomes Brian Lemmings of EightyTenTen, who shares strategies for aligning IT teams with business goals through process and people-focused improvements; Carl Nicpon of Marsh Creek Advisors, who discusses simplifying business sales and the importance of early exit planning; and Sean Dineen of Iron Age Office, who details building a successful handcrafted furniture company and fostering a strong workplace culture. The episode blends practical business advice with inspiring entrepreneurial stories, offering listeners valuable insights on leadership, transition planning, and craftsmanship.

Brian-Lemmings-bwBrian Lemmings is the founder of EightyTenTen, a consultancy focused on helping IT and service teams move from reactive support functions to strategic business enablers, by shifting their service and delivery models.

With over 20 years of experience in operations, service delivery, and IT leadership, Brian brings a practical, people-first approach to solving complex internal challenges.

His journey began as a teacher, teaching middle and high school before transitioning into different leadership roles in IT. That foundation in communication and clarity now fuels his work with CIOs, IT support teams, and service leaders looking to improve performance, reduce friction, and earn trust across the business.

Brian is the creator of the Business Clarity Framework — a proven model that helps internal teams align their strategy, structure, and influence to better serve the organization. EightyTenTen

He’s known for cutting through complexity, simplifying processes, and helping teams shift from task-focused to impact-driven. Whether he’s coaching service desk leads, advising PMO leaders, or partnering with university IT teams, Brian brings an encouraging and grounded presence.

He’s passionate about helping leaders build confident, capable teams that drive growth, clarity, and trust. At the heart of his work is a simple belief: we’re better together — and that mindset shapes how he shows up as a coach, consultant, and collaborator.

Connect with Brian on LinkedIn.

Marsh-Creek-logo

Carl-Nicpon-bwCarl Nicpon was the third-generation owner of a wedding services provider with 14 Atlanta locations and 200 employees.

Carl led the effort to sell the 50 year-old business in a private equity roll-up of the industry, and he now uses that first-hand experience in his role as Managing Director at Marsh Creek Advisors, where he helps business owners bring their company to market and negotiate a successful exit.

Carl is also an Adjunct Professor in the Executive MBA program at the University of Georgia. He also holds the gold standard designation of Certified Exit Planning Advisor.

Carl lives in Dunwoody with his wife Lyn, and they have two boys who attend Georgia Tech. Iron-Age-Office-logo

Connect with Carl on LinkedIn.

Sean-Dineen-bwSean Dineen is the President & CEO at Iron Age Office.

With an extensive background in design, Sean set out to make his mark within the US design industry.

His work portrays success, creativity, and power that attracts the successful professionals of America.

Connect with Sean on LinkedIn and follow Iron Age Office on Instagram.

Episode Highlights

  • Enhancing IT service delivery and internal processes for businesses.
  • Aligning IT teams with broader business objectives through process improvement.
  • The importance of effective communication and collaboration between IT and business teams.
  • Tailored solutions for mid-sized companies with dedicated IT support.
  • Mergers and acquisitions (M&A) and exit planning strategies for business owners.
  • The emotional aspects of selling a business and the need for clear communication.
  • The significance of building a strong advisory team for successful business transitions.
  • Challenges faced by business owners during the exit process, including owner dependency.
  • Craftsmanship and custom office furniture manufacturing in the U.S.
  • The importance of hiring for character and cultural fit in business growth.

Transcript-iconThis transcript is machine transcribed by Sonix.

 

TRANSCRIPT

Intro: Broadcasting live from the Business RadioX studios in Woodstock, Georgia. It’s time for Cherokee Business Radio. Now, here’s your host.

Joshua Kornitsky: Welcome back. This is Joshua Kornitsky professional EOS implementer and the host of Cherokee Business Radio. I’ve got some great guests here in the studio today. But first, I want to let you know that this episode is brought to you in part by one of our community partners, the Business RadioX Main Street Warriors defending capitalism, promoting small business, and supporting our local community. For more information, please go to Main Street Warriors. And we’d also like to give a special note of thanks to our title sponsor for the Cherokee Chapter of the Main Street Warriors, Diesel David, Inc.. Please go check them out at diesel. David. Well, here we go. And as I said, we’ve got quite a group of folks here with us today. And I’m really excited to get started. So let me begin by introducing, uh, Brian Lemmings. Brian is the founder of EightyTenTen, a company that’s focused on helping IT teams and businesses improve their service delivery and internal processes. And the reason I wanted to read that is 8010 seems a little vague. And he’s going to tell us a little more about that. Good morning Brian, how are you?

Brian Lemmings: Hey. Good morning. Good to be here. Thanks.

Joshua Kornitsky: I’m so happy to have you. Um, tell me a little bit about who you are, and then we’ll lead into what 8010 is about.

Brian Lemmings: Sure. I’ve. I’m Brian Lemmings. I’m founder of 80 1010. Um, so, uh, I started about six months ago. Officially launched a business in 2023. But I spent corporate world for 20 years. And then, um, with the business launching in 23. I did both for a while and, uh, 8010. Ten’s real focus is helping. Uh, within the IT world, uh, support and delivery teams, uh, to be better and more aligned with the businesses. And so, uh, the business or the technology model has not really changed in the last 50 years. And so, uh, the way we used to do things is just not as beneficial to the businesses and to technology teams as we can do today.

Joshua Kornitsky: Okay. And I apologize, I missed the ten on the end of that. It’s it’s it’s 80 1010. And I should have known that because we discussed it beforehand. And I know the reason behind why it’s 80 1010. But tell us why did you name the organization 80 1010.

Brian Lemmings: Yeah. So it’s 80 1010 is a play off of the Pareto principle. So 8020 rule. Right? So, uh, as I, uh, as I venture through technology, fully focusing on projects, I’ve been in it for 20 plus years, but not a technician by any means. I’m just a guy that understands when I can’t do something and get the right people in the right place. So a leading technology teams, technology projects. It always came back when working with business teams that instead of just putting people and throwing people or throwing technology on a problem, they needed to go backwards a little bit more and look at process. So process is the key to all the different parts and pieces of a business, of a technology team. And so the eight, ten, ten to me just made sense that 80% of the from a business problem perspective, 80% can be solved by getting the process right, by getting the right people aligned, by getting the right people involved and making it clear, making it simple. And then you can add people on top of it, and then you can add technology on top of it. So 80, ten, ten became a mental more of a mental picture for myself. And with the different teams I’m working with to really focus in on processes and whatever that may include from process perspective, and then put people and then put technology on top of that.

Joshua Kornitsky: Okay. And just to clarify, you’re not providing technical services, correct?

Brian Lemmings: You do not want me to do any technology service at all. But I’ve worked through enough technology implementations, work through enough technology teams that I understand what the technology teams are going after. And I play a good middle role between the businesses and technology teams, and that the businesses have a, uh, a, a an end goal, a value driver they want to get to. And technology plays a role in that in some instances. And so it’s getting those teams working together to help them move forward when implementing technology or when looking at we want to do I want to move to the cloud, but what does that mean from a technology perspective is much different than what it means from a business perspective. So working those two worlds together?

Joshua Kornitsky: Sure. So so you’re helping align other people’s teams to.

Brian Lemmings: Yeah, exactly. So helping align other people’s teams, whether it’s from a full business perspective or whether that is from IT support perspective, how does the IT support team really support the business, and what does that look like or from a project management perspective? How is that delivery of that support or delivery of that project impacting the overall business itself?

Joshua Kornitsky: So it sounds to me like you refined very carefully what it is you’re teaching your clients or your client staff. How did you arrive here? Are you a trainer by experience.

Brian Lemmings: So I before getting to the business world, I was a teacher, so I was in middle school and high school teacher. So I’ve moved from this, um, guerrilla warfare of teaching, of sneaking up on them and helping them, you know, learn something they didn’t know they were learning and moving. That same mentality, that same mindset, taking that something that may be complex, breaking it down, meeting in that situation, kids where they are and and then helping them guide them through those pieces. So I take that same mindset and move that into the business world, into the technology world. So what’s the complexity we’re trying to get through? I help them get there to make those connections that they need from a mental connection or from, oh, that’s what you meant. Let’s go this way. Oh, we’re looking from a business perspective. You know, it measures in performance. They measure in heavy metrics where the business may not. Business is, you know, going to be more focused within the value brought. And so how do we measure and bring those two worlds together.

Joshua Kornitsky: So this sounds like a sarcastic question but I really do mean it. Do you find that the skills that you learned teaching kids help you better bridge and explain complex concepts to the adults, because you’re not explaining the technical aspect of it? So does it make a difference to me?

Brian Lemmings: Makes a huge difference. So I started in teaching again middle school, high school, science and working with things. I was a coach from a from a sports perspective and then moved into the business world, began at the very bottom of it from a production control support as a support role, and then began to recognize and be recognized for project delivery, project management. So I had a great manager who said, hey, go be a your project manager. We’re going to help you do that. And then everything I learned in teaching, I could apply through project management because it’s the same thing you’re getting people to do. So if they don’t really want to do it, it’s not their primary job. Oftentimes their project is something different. So I definitely use that capability to, uh, to bring people better. We’re all better together. So helping them from a collaborative perspective, taking thoughtful approach, how do we really want to do this? Does it make sense for us to do this? And then the biggest part for me is winning over the hearts and minds. So understanding what is the end goal? We’re trying to get to working backwards to get that and to show and to communicate. As we’re walking through these different areas, we’re going to hit this goal at the very end. And, uh, getting that collaborative approach to things is really important.

Joshua Kornitsky: Makes perfect sense to me. And I think that your, your pedigree coming out of teaching kids and again, not being denigrating is, is enormous in helping adults sort of bridge that gap. Um, I think that’s incredible. Now, what are the types of, uh, organizations or companies that that you typically help.

Brian Lemmings: Sure. So I’ve I’ve been asked that question a lot in the last couple of weeks, whether to myself or from actual, um, you know, actual potential clients. And, and what I’m finding is I initially started trying to solve every problem that was out there, because that’s what I can do. Right. We all have superpowers. We can solve everything without thinking. Sure. Um, but, uh, within the last six months really narrowed that down to looking at, um, midsize, midsize companies up through corporations. I’ve worked with 25 people up through 10,000 people. So working and and either those levels, which is a really big swag of, you know, count of people. But working with those mid-sized companies that have it, teams that are dedicated to either support, whether that is customer support, that is actual help desk, or on the project delivery side, project management. So working with those sized companies, a thousand people, up to 10,000 people. Right. So there’s that group there, um, and helping them. A business that has technology or a technology team. And someone who’s putting AI in someone who’s software development, uh, working with those teams to get their business goals set. So helping to change the mindset from a technology we are here to we’re reactive in technology to being more proactive in helping the business to be enabled to be stronger.

Joshua Kornitsky: Sure, that makes sense. And let me ask you, if I’m somebody in an organization or in a company like that, what are some what are some tools or some warning signs that would that would tell me that that my staff could benefit from this?

Brian Lemmings: Sure. Uh, the primary piece is when you’re looking from a business perspective, it really is. It feels like my IT team is not ever doing anything from the business perspective.

Joshua Kornitsky: Understood.

Brian Lemmings: Right. And but on the IT side, it’s. We’re doing everything. Holy cow. Light my hair on fire. I have 6000 tickets I have to get through or it’s. The business doesn’t understand what we do. That’s where the telltale from the IT side of the business, says we need to do these 15 other things. We’re already doing 2000 things. We need to prioritize what we’re doing. Are we really aligned to what? From a technology perspective to what the business wants to do? Or are we just picking up things because the business thinks it’s the next shiny object? So from the technology perspective, it is we’re overloaded or we’re overloaded, right? We’re being very, very reactive. Business says we’re hard to do business with. Right. That could be projects don’t ever get done the projects. We have 1500 projects that are the number one process or the number one priority. Nothing’s a priority on the business side. It’s I’m not really sure what it does. They sit this black box I put in a ticket, and I may have to wait in line for a long time. And I don’t get updates. It’s not really helping. Maybe we should get somebody else to do that for us. Right. So it’s having those different conversations from the value or assuming from the viewpoint of either the business owner or from the technology owners.

Joshua Kornitsky: So you kind of blow the fog out of the way and help the top. See the IT team and the IT team. See the top.

Brian Lemmings: Right. It’s really working. Its better together. Right? So my 8010, 80, ten, ten was built on the same things I learned from I was teaching to when I became within the corporate world or through the business world, which was we’re better together taking a thoughtful approach and hearts and minds whenever that change, organizational change management to get to that next piece, whatever that next piece is.

Joshua Kornitsky: And broadly speaking, because obviously every case is going to be different. How long do you typically end up working with the teams?

Brian Lemmings: Uh, for some teams, it has been a of course, for some conversation has just been a conversation. It has been more, uh, on demand advisory. Uh, I had a client I met with last month that we met for two hours, and we were able to help get, uh, move from a decision of what tool they wanted to go after, which would be the right set for them. And we just looked at everything, and at the end had an end result after a couple hours. I have a I have a potential client that is a six month project where we’re completely transforming their PMO, And so that would be a six months. It could be a year depending on how far they would take that next step. But the first step is just getting that baseline foundational piece, a setup and move there. So it could be anywhere from an hour to two hours to six months. From a fractional perspective, it could be a year long depending on really what what is the pain point. And that’s really important to understand. What’s the pain point they’re actually going after. Instead of what is the pain point that you’re feeling at the initial pace of asking those questions, get down to that root cause analysis.

Joshua Kornitsky: So it sounds like it’s not a one size fits all.

Brian Lemmings: It’s not. It’s a thoughtful approach.

Joshua Kornitsky: There you go. We always used to call that a tailored solution.

Brian Lemmings: Absolutely.

Joshua Kornitsky: That’s fantastic. Well, Brian, I think that what you’re bringing to the world is more clarity and more clarity helps everybody. Right? Um, how do people reach you if they’re interested in exploring more and understanding what it takes to work with you?

Brian Lemmings: Yeah. That’s great. So I’m in really two main places. I’m I’m on LinkedIn a lot, and I’m probably the only Brian Lemmings in all of LinkedIn. There may be three lemmings Maybe looking for maybe five lemmings total. Okay, I’m the only.

Joshua Kornitsky: Are they all right?

Brian Lemmings: Um, of the ones that I’m aware of. Yes. Fair enough. And then, uh, I have a web page called Gain Business Clarity. Com.

Joshua Kornitsky: Okay, fantastic. Well, we’ll have all of those links on, uh, when, when the story goes live and we push out to the podcasts. But you’ll also be able to reach out to Brian directly with that information. Brian, I thank you for sharing your insight and letting us understand how you can truly bring clarity to folks. I think that what you’re doing aligns very well with what the needs in the world are, so I salute you for finding a great niche. Awesome. Thank you so much. Thank you. Well, my next guest is a gentleman I’ve known for a couple of years now, and I’ve had the opportunity to see him in action. And he’s he’s actually, um, well, he’s a little bit of a superhero in what he does. And I actually just heard him helping a family member with homework, so I know he knows what he’s doing. Uh, I’m very pleased to introduce Carl Nicpon who is an M&A advisor and Certified Exit planning advisor with Marsh Creek Advisors. Morning.

Carl Nicpon: It’s great to be here.

Joshua Kornitsky: Sorry, I didn’t mean to embarrass you with the homework thing, but I’m probably going to have my daughters call you from here on out.

Carl Nicpon: Oh, now we’re in trouble. Well, we’ll see how they do. I remember my, uh, my my boys when they were growing up. You know, my wife handled all of the reading and writing and social studies, and I had the math and science, and, you know, I did pretty well in math. I thought I might even be a math major. Uh, and I realized how, like, extraordinary my kids are because I tapped out helping them with math when they got in ninth grade. And it was it was over. So I was like, yeah, yeah, you’re gonna have to go with your teacher on that one.

Joshua Kornitsky: You made it further than I did. So this was I think sixth grade was as far as I got.

Carl Nicpon: Well, this was a sixth grade nephew, so, uh, that’s who you saw.

Joshua Kornitsky: Perfect. Um. Well, so tell us, girl. What does an advisor do?

Carl Nicpon: Yeah. So, uh, you know, this is all about helping business owners retire in style and when they’re ready to sell their company. We do that by showcasing what really sets their company apart, so that the exit feels like the true reward that they really deserve.

Joshua Kornitsky: Well, so I know from our, uh, discussion prior to this that, that, uh, the firm won the, the top firm of the year from M&A source, uh, and that you yourself had been a business owner and I believe, um, had you went through the process of selling your own business, didn’t you?

Carl Nicpon: That’s true. So, uh, I guess to me, it I work in the space of businesses that are, you know, very much similar in size to the business that we had. And I really appreciate the ability to connect with business owners and the emotional things that they’re going through. Um, it is a roller coaster ride as you prepare for an exit and then going through the process of selecting a buyer and negotiating a sale.

Joshua Kornitsky: Okay, so let me ask, following up on something you just said, roughly what size organizations do you. Do you typically work with?

Carl Nicpon: Yeah, we play in the space that is, um, a little bit smaller than what an investment investment banker might handle, but larger than what a a main Street business broker. So revenue wise, think 5 to 50 million.

Joshua Kornitsky: Okay. So that that helps people understand. But you mentioned the word a couple of times and you have the accreditation. Why is being a certified exit planning advisor important to what you do?

Carl Nicpon: So you’re never going to do this on your own as a business owner. And it’s not just one advisor that you need. You’re going to need a whole team around you. You need your wealth manager needs to be on the same page of what’s happening here, your tax advisor, your CPA. Um, you need probably some work around trust in estate planning, and, um, you may need some support from internal folks to produce the due diligence that’s going to be needed. And all that takes a lot of coordination, and it takes people having a similar framework. When those folks all have done the CPA, uh, framework, then we kind of intuitively get where this is going together. Okay. And it you know, we know how to work together without stepping on each other’s toes. And, you know, quite frankly, that’s important to the business owner because they can focus on running their business while we focus on preparing and selling the business.

Joshua Kornitsky: It makes sense, as you explain it to me out of curiosity when it comes to that framework. Obviously, coming in with with a broad outline of how you’re going to attack the every step of the way, knowing that there’s variables you can’t plan for. Um, are you the usually the, the group that’s in charge of that process.

Carl Nicpon: Some people think of us as the quarterback. Okay. And, you know, uh, kind of coordinating all the pieces, making sure that they’re all in place. Um, and that there aren’t any gaps. Uh, coordination. We’re there. Another way to say what we do is. Interestingly, I don’t say that we sell the business. I say that we set the stage. We bring the lights. We bring the microphone. We bring the right audience. We set the teleprompter. We whisper in the business owners ears. When we’re going to cover. What? Because there’s a cadence to the conversation. But in the end, who sells the business is, in fact, a business owner.

Joshua Kornitsky: Well, it sounds like there’s a million moving parts.

Carl Nicpon: Exactly.

Joshua Kornitsky: And and I’m going to ask you a question, knowing full well that there’s no perfect answer. But if a business owner is even thinking about this, when should they reach out?

Carl Nicpon: The moment they start thinking about it.

Joshua Kornitsky: Okay. And when do they typically reach out?

Carl Nicpon: The moment they get an offer that’s unsolicited and they talk to a lawyer and the lawyer says, uh, maybe we need to take a couple steps backwards. And that’s often when we, we get a phone call. Uh, but I, I think I like to describe what I hear as the seven year syndrome, and, and here’s what that kind of how’s that plays out a business? If you ask a business owner, when are you planning on retiring? Uh, they’ll say, uh, 7 to 10 years if you ask them that same question a year later. The answer doesn’t change. It stays 7 to 10 years, and it stays that way until all of a sudden they say, I’m just done. I’m exhausted. I’m ready to go, you know, spend time with my grandkids or travel or whatever the case may be. And they’re like, ready for it to happen. Now, the the issue with that is that most business owners don’t realize that from the day. Let let’s just say that you sold the business today, right? Well, most buyers are going to expect you to stick around in a transition period. The most common transition period is 12 months. So there’s a year right there. The process of selling, marketing, negotiating, doing diligence and closing the sale. That process right there is a year long.

Joshua Kornitsky: Okay.

Carl Nicpon: And most people don’t have great financials going into this process. So there’s a cleanup period. And you want to show the last 12 months of operation being highly profitable and and growth. So that sometimes takes say at least 12 months. That’s three years right there.

Joshua Kornitsky: So it’s only got four left in there. 7 to.

Carl Nicpon: 10. Yeah exactly.

Joshua Kornitsky: That. But you explained it very well because those are things that often people don’t think about what are other, what are some of the other things that they consistently kind of, uh, either miss or, or don’t do in anticipation of, of eventual sale?

Carl Nicpon: Yeah. I think, you know, the number one thing that will make it difficult for a business to transition and depends on where you get your stats, but anywhere from 20 to 30% of the businesses that go onto the market will actually sell. Really? Yeah, pretty low odds.

Joshua Kornitsky: Why?

Carl Nicpon: Well, the biggest reason for a business not to transition is owner dependency.

Joshua Kornitsky: Okay. We’re the owners of the bottleneck or the the the keeper of the tribal knowledge.

Carl Nicpon: All of that. They might also be doing a lot of the work. They might be responsible for a lot of the sales. If they haven’t unloaded these important tasks to other team members than what does a buyer buying? People think, oh, they’re buying my customer list. Well, you know, if you’re the linchpin to all of it, then when you leave, what’s to say that that client is going to stick around? They have a personal relationship with you, they have a connection with you. And all of a sudden you say, I’ve selected, you know, this new person to come in behind me and they’re going to do great for you. And that’s the perfect opportunity for the client to say, you know, I haven’t shopped for a while. I’m going to check out what else is out there. And that’s exactly what they do.

Joshua Kornitsky: And that I can’t say it makes sense, but I understand the thought process behind it. Right. So in order to become sticky, you’ve got to delegate as as that business owner and get other players involved early so that you’re not the bottleneck.

Carl Nicpon: Yeah, we say that every day. You should work on finding yourself just a little bit more.

Joshua Kornitsky: There you go. And I think that’s great guidance because in the work that I do with my clients, oftentimes I’m the first person that’s ever said to them, you’ve got to delegate. Because the only way to get elevation in the business, as the owner is to to get things off of your plate.

Carl Nicpon: And that is absolutely the beauty of systems like iOS.

Joshua Kornitsky: Right. Well, thank you, I appreciate that. Well, um, it works. Karl. So everything you’ve explained makes sense to me because it lays out a clear and concise path. How did you gain this perspective? Did you have any teachers or mentors that helped you sort of see the the universe through these eyes?

Carl Nicpon: Well, okay. Yes. And before I get there, I’m going to now tag team on what Brian started. Uh, I started my, my career also in the school system as a counselor and and as an administrator. And, uh, you know that really? I used that work all day long now. Uh, one just coordinating everything. But to and more importantly, understanding the emotions that business owners are going through and being able to help them manage stress. Um, and when we operate under stress, we make suboptimal decisions. So part of what we want to do is just help bring that down a notch so that the business owner is able to see things with clarity. Uh, and then, uh, you know, commit to an action and then take that action, not get stuck in, you know. Uh, and that what is it? Paralysis by analysis. Not get stuck there, but be able to move forward. So now to your question about mentor. Uh, so the business that we were in was, uh, if if you’ve been around the Atlanta area for a while, then you might, uh, remember names like dingus firmware or savvy firmware. That was our. That was our family.

Joshua Kornitsky: Okay.

Carl Nicpon: And my mom, my dad passed away, uh, when I was a teenager. My mom took the reins and, uh, continued to to run the business with her brother. And my mom never went to college, and I remember very vividly one day that we were in a meeting with a whole bunch of external advisors, and conversation was going great. And, uh, my mom was very engaged, and she was nodding and like, you know, it was all making sense. And the end of that wrapped up and the advisors all left shut the door. And my mother said to me, okay, can you explain to me what what that was all about? And my heart broke, because here is the woman who taught me so much about business, how to how to work and lead people.

Joshua Kornitsky: Right?

Carl Nicpon: And then she was in a meeting where it was for her, and it didn’t make sense to her. And so so two things happened from that conversation. Number one, I learned how to say complex business things in simple English that don’t take an MBA to understand. And then the second thing I learned was how to ask questions in a meeting that got the participants in the meeting to break it down into simple terms. And I look like the one that maybe I didn’t know exactly what I was talking about, but it gave her the confidence and the clarity she needed to be able to just put her finger on it and say, this is the direction we’re going to go and move on. Right then and there.

Joshua Kornitsky: Those are both incredible skills that I can see how that would be a game changer. If you’re helping a business owner or owners understand some complex things that just aren’t part of their daily vocabulary, no matter what their business is.

Carl Nicpon: And truth be told, M&A is not that difficult. But it scares a lot of business owners because there are these weird, strange, you know, terms like networking capital.

Joshua Kornitsky: And that they don’t understand because it’s not a it’s not a game that they play ever.

Carl Nicpon: However, if if we talk about it, you know, bare bones and what it really breaks down to. It’s actually pretty common sense, right? And, uh, I actually kind of get upset at some of my folks in my industry because they perpetuate this shroud of, of, of knowledge that, you know, they keep the conversation at a level that just, you know, most human beings don’t engage in. And and that just drives me nuts because it’s not supposed to be that way. It shouldn’t be that way for a business owner.

Joshua Kornitsky: I just read this in a book. Why say something in ten words that you can say in a hundred?

Carl Nicpon: Exactly.

Joshua Kornitsky: Some people just feel the need to demonstrate that they know all of the ten letter words, and in doing so, they actually remove the conversation from an understandable level. So I think the emotional intelligence that it lays between the lines of what you’ve shared probably makes a big difference to the the folks you work with.

Carl Nicpon: Yeah. And here’s the thing. The the biggest issue is that it prevents people from engaging an advisor in the first place. They think to themselves, you know. Oh, man. I found a buyer. That’s all I need. Or the smarter ones, you know. Think I found I found a good buyer. I mean, I’m happy with that. But what makes the difference when you’re selling company is I found lots of good buyers because now we’re creating competition. And, you know, it’s it is. It is just like, sort of think about early on when you were dating. Right. If there were a whole bunch of folks interested in the person that was the apple of your eye, you know, you stood a little taller, you dressed up a little bit better, you took. You took them out to nicer dinners, and you made sure that you were the one that kind of shined. Sure. Well, the same thing happens with buyers. They, you know, put better, put forth a better offer. They sharpen their pencils, they’re more willing to work with you around the things and the priorities that are important to you when they know that there are others who are qualified and interested.

Joshua Kornitsky: Sure, it drives the price up and makes everybody more interested. Exactly. That’s great. Well, Carl, how do people get Ahold of you?

Carl Nicpon: Yeah. So I’m on LinkedIn, Carl Nippon and our websites. Com.

Joshua Kornitsky: That’s fantastic. And again, we’ll share all of that information so that people know how to find you if they didn’t write down fast enough. But, Carl, uh, thank you for sharing the insight and the surprising emotional awareness. And, Brian, I don’t take that away from you, but he highlighted it. So but I think.

Carl Nicpon: He tweeted up. Well, this is teamwork over here.

Joshua Kornitsky: There you go.

Brian Lemmings: Listen better.

Joshua Kornitsky: Together. That’s right. That’s that’s the the root of it all, isn’t it. Um. Well thank you. Appreciate it. Carl. So our last guest today is someone that I’m so pleased I had the opportunity to get introduced to. Uh, I’d like to introduce everyone to Sean Dineen. He’s the CEO and co-founder of Iron Age Office headquartered in Kennesaw, Georgia. Welcome, Sean.

Sean Dineen: Thank you for having me.

Joshua Kornitsky: Thank you for being here. So tell us what.

Sean Dineen: Is not all down a downhill from here?

Joshua Kornitsky: No no no, no. I noticed you taking a lot of notes, though, while Karl was talking about what it takes.

Sean Dineen: Maybe mentally.

Carl Nicpon: I think he saved the best for last.

Sean Dineen: You’re in. Good.

Joshua Kornitsky: Well, you’ve got the better voice from anybody in the room, so we’ll start from there. What is Iron Age office?

Sean Dineen: So Iron Age office. So we, um, we manufacture office furniture for commercial workspaces and also residential. But if you think of the likes of, you know, uh, Knoll, Steelcase, Herman Miller, we have positioned ourselves as the powerful alternative. Um, you know, they’ve they’ve kind of set the standard. And I believe that to be great. You don’t necessarily necessarily have to reinvent the wheel. You just take take the existing wheel and make it look better. And that’s what we’ve done. And we’ve we’ve changed. What what you initially think is the commercial world is laminar. And all of this press board and that kind of material and we’ve, we incorporate raw material. We’re talking like solid maple tops, carbon steel frames. Oh wow. It’s all handcrafted right?

Joshua Kornitsky: Yeah. No one’s ever said what a sexy Steelcase assembly you have in your eye.

Sean Dineen: Yeah, exactly. Yeah.

Joshua Kornitsky: Yeah, yeah. But but I saw the pictures of some of the stuff you build, and it’s it’s really quite incredible. And, uh, how did you get into this? How did how did you find yourself making furniture?

Sean Dineen: Yeah, very random actually. So, um, you know, I finished college in, I think, you know, 2013, and I was like, I don’t want to go do a 9 to 5 job. And this was in England. Um, so I heard of this, the program called Challenge of Sports. And it’s basically where you’re coaching, coaching, uh, soccer camps all over the US. And I was like, you know, sign me up, let me go to America and, um, enjoy three months in the sun before I get get back into the real world. So I came over and I was coaching, um, different camps and living with different families every single week. One of the families I lived with, he owned a machine shop called so The Machine Fabrication. And he, you know, he saw that I was leading these camps with multiple kids and all that kind of thing. And I guess he saw something in me. So he took me to his, uh, workshop. I saw what he did, and I saw that he’d actually made a desk for himself out of wood and steel. And with my design background, I actually tweaked the design, um, and made it, you know, slightly more appealing. And and we actually, um, then put that, took photos, put it on Etsy, and, you know, from there you never knew what was going to happen. And, um, sold one. I think one of the first projects was like a State Farm office as well. Uh, and it just kind of exploded from there. So it’s all been natural organic growth and, um, turned into a process that I’m incredibly proud of. And, um, I may be from the US, but I was, um, certainly made in America so.

Joshua Kornitsky: Well, and only because it was mentioned earlier, you are now one of us.

Sean Dineen: That’s it, that’s it. I’m officially a US citizen. Um, honestly, it was an incredible process. The it was very emotional being there as well because I, I got married. So for me, it was, you know, it was quite a simple process. But for a lot of people in that room during the ceremony, they’ve, they may have been in this process for many, many years and come through many trials and tribulations. And so it was it was emotional to see quite how much it meant to people. And, um, and, you know, likewise, it means the same to me. But it was just nice being able to hear and see other people’s stories, too.

Joshua Kornitsky: Well, we appreciate you making all those efforts and becoming a citizen. But let me return back to the Iron Age office, because I realized the way that I made it sound. People may think you are the only person making furniture.

Sean Dineen: I know, right?

Joshua Kornitsky: Yeah. And I think we should clarify that because otherwise. Yeah, I mean, it may be beautiful, but it takes a very long time if it’s just one guy, right?

Sean Dineen: Right. I actually am when I meet people for the first time and I tell them what I do and they yes, they presume that I’m the one making the furniture. I’m like, no, my hands are way too soft for this. So, um, but my, uh, no, I have a wonderful team and, you know, started from a few hundred square feet to a few thousand square feet to, um, 20,000. And then in 2021, we actually bought a new building which is 80,000ft². And now we have up to 60 employees, and it’s all made in under one roof, made in America, US materials. And, um, our product is. There’s nothing like it. We our Instagram account, you know, we have 120,000 followers now and and they’re not not just people that are going to purchase the product, but we we’re creating a fan base.

Joshua Kornitsky: And so share your Instagram handle so that people know how to reach them.

Sean Dineen: Yeah. Yeah. Of course.

Joshua Kornitsky: Use it as.

Sean Dineen: Well.

Joshua Kornitsky: Um, where would people find you on Instagram?

Sean Dineen: It is at Iron Age office. Okay.

Joshua Kornitsky: Um, I didn’t want I just didn’t want it. You can’t just drop it just in case. I know you say it.

Sean Dineen: Yeah, yeah, yeah, of course, but, yeah, like I said, we, um. One of the things I’ve realized is that, yes, we make a beautiful product and there’s no one that does what we do. But I also realize that the brand, the Iron Age office brand, is equally as powerful. Um, so a lot of the people that do follow our Instagram are they’re not just there for the product, but they’re they’re there for the process. Therefore, the fact that it is made in America And it’s, you know, it’s it’s raw. You see the the sparks flying, the, the woodworking. And we’re really trying to trigger emotion through our content.

Joshua Kornitsky: Well, and and not just you becoming a citizen, but you being, you know, I live in Kennesaw. Employing 60 people is no small feat in a town, much less a town like Kennesaw. Um, so thank you for for that. You’re welcome. You’re welcome. Because that makes a difference in the community. Yeah. Um, but as you’ve grown. Right. And and this has been over what time period that that you’re up to those 60 employees.

Sean Dineen: Yeah. Ten years now. So.

Joshua Kornitsky: So that’s pretty that’s pretty rapid growth. What what are some of the challenges that you’ve had going through that process?

Sean Dineen: Yeah. The um, you know, the our product, we do not need to sell our product, which is quite, you know, a unique thing to say, right? Our product truly sells itself. And the way we do that is through our content and, and social media. But the, um, the biggest challenge becomes the the skilled craftsmen and women that build the product. Um, welding. No problem. You still have, you know, um, different schools that teach welding. And you can you can go and learn that trade. Woodworking, on the other hand, is really is, um, a dying craft, like one of our missions is to revive craftsmanship in the US. And that’s mainly because of the woodworking. Um, we found that the the talent in our team. Now, they didn’t come to us with experience. They came to us with, you know, the eager and and willingness to learn. So we brought them in green and let them develop and learn skills, learn how to use tools and become a master craftsman. And now, you know, when you and when you think about welding and In woodworking, you’re not necessarily thinking about healthcare for one and a true career, but we’ve been able to turn what what may have been a hobby into a full fledged career and something we’re proud of.

Joshua Kornitsky: Well, and and again, you’re not just being an employer. You’re you’re training and that that’s training that sticks with them forever. Yeah. So you’re you’re creating craftsmen. And I can tell you I’ve, I’ve talked to probably thousands of businesses. You don’t encounter that as something very often because most people just want to hire the talent that exists. Yeah, exactly. So you’re putting the time in to create the talent you need.

Sean Dineen: Yes, exactly. And the fact that, you know, we have everything is under one roof. So you’ve got multiple departments working together. So this skill. Yes, it’s important, but first and foremost you have to be a good person because you’re you know, it sounds very cliche, but you’re coming into our Family, which it really does feel like that because you know, you’re under one roof for so many hours working together. Um, and we try to input that, you know, like, no silo rule, but you have to be a good person. So if if the interview goes well and we enjoy talking to you, you know, then then that’s really all we need. We will teach you everything else you need to know from there.

Joshua Kornitsky: You’re you’re speaking my language. We call that the getting the right people into the right seats. They aligned your core values. So. So you’re already in a better place. Exactly. That’s fantastic. So I happen to have a couple of friends, and my late father in law also were, were skilled, uh, in really what I would call artistic woodworking. And they all three had one major thing in common. They were perfectionists. And as perfectionists, working in a craft, how do you how do you produce at scale when you’re working with what most people would consider art versus the science of manufacturing.

Sean Dineen: Yeah. No. Great question. I mean, yeah, when you when you think of like a, a wooden table, you automatically kind of think of like a mom and pop type shop where they might be producing a small amount of tables a year and they’re happy and on they go. But we’ve, we’ve turned that mom and pop type process into a full production facility. So, um, yeah, we it’s again something that we, we really take pride in, in, um, the process is because of the good people as well. We really have to, um, make sure we’re amplifying that process and make sure that, you know, the right things are moving as they should. And, uh, and it’s going out the door.

Joshua Kornitsky: There’s a book by a man named Daniel Pink called drive. And it’s about what motivates people. And it’s a little dated because it was pre-COVID. And he predicted how everyone would be working from home. So some of it didn’t quite hold true. But the one thing all of his scientific study revealed Yield. Was that carrots and sticks are great for motivation short term, but the only way people will work really, really hard is when they take intrinsic value and pride in the work they do. And it sounds like you’ve tapped into that.

Sean Dineen: Yeah, totally.

Joshua Kornitsky: And that makes a difference. So. So how do people buy your stuff?

Sean Dineen: Yeah. So, um, that’s a that’s another good question, sir. So we yes, we have a website, but believe it or not, we do not have pricing on our website, which is often frustrating because, you know, we’ve got a large social media following that often funnels them to the website. And then there’s a bunch of cool products with no pricing. Um, the reason for that is, you know, like like Herman Miller Knoll, we, we distribute our product through furniture dealerships. Okay. But when, you know, there’s also there’s also occasions where not everyone wants to work for a furniture dealership. So we work directly to. Oh, um, but we, we encourage people to reach out so we can learn about their project, what’s going on and how we can best help them. We have an incredible design team in-house as well that can help with floor plans. Um, and honestly, one of the most exciting things that we’re doing right now is we like to implement the the client’s branding into the workspace, and that’s through the furniture. Um, and that can be as loud and as bold as, um, a logo in a conference table. Or it can be as discreet as a, maybe a laser cut in a sheet metal or something like that. So, um, and especially the logos in the conference tables has really become that.

Joshua Kornitsky: That’s a huge differentiator in a space that you mentioned earlier. Steelcase and Herman Miller, and you weren’t speaking ill of them. You were just acknowledging that you were in the space. But that really does set you apart, because that’s that’s the kind of personalization. And I’ve been in many, many, many conference rooms. You don’t see that. Yeah, exactly. You know, you might see a real nice sign on the wall. Uh, but to have it built to that level, uh, it sounds like it’s more than just furniture. It truly is designed.

Sean Dineen: Yeah, exactly. And along with the brand, like, my tone of voice on LinkedIn and other platforms, is is incredibly confident because I truly believe that we are the cool kids in the industry. And because there’s no one that does what we do, so why not own it and just be true to who we are and and, uh, keep rocking and rolling.

Joshua Kornitsky: It does not get any better than that. And it sounds like the confidence is well placed because you’ve got 120,000 people on Instagram telling you that, that you’re doing something that’s cool. And and believe me, as a father of two daughters, I’m never told I’m cool. So I understand what what what the value of that is. Um, any advice you give to somebody that was just starting out?

Sean Dineen: The, um. I think that, you know, there’s a lot of, you know, you can listen to podcasts and all sorts of things nowadays that there’s these, um, entrepreneurs and, and whoever that, uh, are given all this advice and things. But I think the bottom line is you don’t have to take a big risk to get started. Like if you have an idea, you know, stick to your normal job, do it on the side and then until it becomes something big, then take that step and then take that risk. But you know, you’re not going to get anything done without getting it. Something started. So my advice is just to, you know, be be humble as you kind of initially at least. And um, and wait till, till you get your, the, the ball rolling.

Joshua Kornitsky: So don’t be afraid to take that first step.

Sean Dineen: Yeah exactly. But also stay grounded. Like stay keep that job keep keep that income. Come in and then take the risk.

Joshua Kornitsky: I think it’s a healthy perspective. I’m all for working hard, but you can’t just throw it out the window because you think you have a great idea.

Sean Dineen: Exactly. Yeah. You’ve got to be real. Yeah, you’ve got to be real.

Joshua Kornitsky: Well, Sean Dineen, thank you so much for for sharing your perspective. Oh, let me ask, uh, how do people get Ahold of you and Iron Age office?

Sean Dineen: Yeah, for me, my personal brand, just on LinkedIn. Um, and obviously my website and, um, Instagram is definitely the platform to to be and learn more about what we do. Iron age office.

Joshua Kornitsky: There you go. Well, we’ll have all of that, uh, available when we get the things posted live here in just a couple of days. Well, I want to thank my guests again for coming in today. Uh, first was Brian Lemmings, who is the founder of 80 1010, focused on helping IT teams and businesses improve their service delivery and their internal processes. Carl Nickerson, who is an M&A advisor and a certified exit planning advisor with Marsh Creek Advisors and I forgot to mention, is also a teacher in the MBA program at the University of Georgia. So thank you for that. My daughter just graduated. And last but certainly not least Sean Dineen, who is the CEO and the co-founder of Iron Age Office. Thank you all for being here today and sharing really your incredible stories, and it’s a pleasure to have you on, and we invite you back anytime that you have the opportunity. Uh, today’s episode was brought to you in part by the Community Partner Program, the Business RadioX Main Street Warriors defending capitalism, promoting small business, and supporting our local community. For more information, go to Main Street warriors.org. And a special note of thanks to our title sponsor for the Cherokee chapter of Main Street Warriors Diesel David, Inc.. Please go check them out@diesel.com. My name is Joshua Kornitsky. I’m a professional iOS implementer and the host of Cherokee Business Radio. Thank you for joining us. We’ll see you next time.

 

Justin Abrams with Aryo Consulting Group

July 30, 2025 by angishields

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Houston Business Radio
Justin Abrams with Aryo Consulting Group
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Justin-AbramsJustin Abrams is the founder and CEO of Aryo Consulting Group, a strategic consulting firm that serves as the unbiased growth engine for small and mid-sized businesses.

Specializing in increasing total enterprise value, Justin helps clients cut unnecessary marketing spend while implementing smart, scalable acquisition models—all without sacrificing EBITDA margins.

In his conversation with Trisha Stetzel, Justin shared his philosophy on building sustainable, long-term growth rooted in strategy, automation, and efficiency. Influenced by his father’s military background, Justin brings a structured, mission-driven approach to business problem-solving.

He discussed how AI and automation can be used to eliminate routine tasks, improve profitability, and empower small business owners to focus on what matters most. His commitment to organic growth and operational excellence makes him a trusted advisor to companies aiming to scale with purpose.

Connect with Justin on LinkedIn.

Transcript-iconThis transcript is machine transcribed by Sonix

 

TRANSCRIPT

Intro: Broadcasting live from the Business RadioX studios in Houston, Texas. It’s time for Houston Business Radio. Now, here’s your host.

Trisha Stetzel: Hello, Houston. Trisha Stetzel here bringing you another episode of Houston Business Radio. My guest today is a game changer in the world of small business consulting. Justin Abrams is the founder and CEO of Aryo Consulting Group, known as the McKinsey for Small Business based in Boston. ACG delivers strategy, growth and optimization without the corporate price tag. Justin’s firm helps has helped over 300 businesses, including Pfizer, Sony and Bayer. Grow smarter, often without spending a dime on ads. Instead, they leverage organic strategies like Reddit, local SEO, and community driven content to generate leads that stick. Also, Justin I know don’t get read yet because I’m not finished. Recognized as a top consulting firm by clutch and among other works, top 1% expert vetted teams Justin and ACG bring clarity, innovation and results to founders who are ready to scale with purpose. He’s here today to talk business leadership and why small businesses deserve world class strategy, and he’s got the playbook to back it up. Justin, welcome to the show.

Justin Abrams: Trisha, that was amazing. That was the nicest intro I’ve ever heard about myself. I really appreciate it.

Trisha Stetzel: Yeah, absolutely. I’m so excited to have you on the show. We were just, uh, riffing before we started recording, and it’s been a few months since we’ve gotten together, so I’m really excited that we have this opportunity today together. So first, I’d like to start with tell us more a little bit about Justin and how you got into the consulting business in the first place.

Justin Abrams: Yeah, so Aria was really started out of necessity during the pandemic. A lot of my friends and family, uh, needed advice. They had small businesses and things had changed so drastically, um, that it really just became more of a how do I help my friends and family rather than how do I build a business? As this started to grow and I realized, like, these solutions, uh, were practical takes just about everyone in this space. Uh, it was really it started to kind of fester my mind. Like, maybe I should start a business out of this, like, I. I thought it was at the right time. There was a lot of need for for kind of an updating in your systems and kind of going, as we’ve always done, started to change. So, uh, tried to get a few clients, got really lucky and started getting some of the larger clients as well. Sony was one of our first clients and it just kind of grew from there. Uh, really again, organically. Like, I was not expecting to start a business. Uh, and then, you know, five years later, I’m extremely thrilled to be here with this business.

Trisha Stetzel: Wow. That’s amazing. You know, I think that happens often. We get we start doing something that we love for others who need the skill or the service that we can provide, and then we decide to open a business. So let’s talk about that. Let’s talk about these small businesses and um, how you’re able to take this, these big business ideas and apply it to smaller businesses through, um, different strategies and things that people may not have top of mind.

Justin Abrams: Yeah. Well, I think the biggest thing with the small businesses is that they start to get really content based on their revenue as that business owner sees for their lifestyle. So if they’re making around $1 million a year, they look at their their annual salary and their take home pay and they start to say, this is great. I don’t need to really work any harder. I don’t I don’t want to work 80 hours a week anymore. And they take their foot off the gas a bit. Um, which is totally understandable. There’s nothing wrong with that. Um, but the thing that I start to get worried about is like a there’s a exit plan that’s going to happen. So if you’re a 40 to 50 year old business owner and you’re, you know, you have the lifestyle that you want, your kids are starting to grow up. So you want to spend more time with them. That’s excellent. But someone’s going to have to take this over. And so you need to think kind of a longer term approach of what is this look like in 15 years when I want to go sell it is it’s still going to be a 1 to $1.2 million business. Like that’s great. But that’s not maybe a nest egg that people are comfortable with. I mean, $1 million today is not the same as it was ten years ago.

Justin Abrams: Uh, so so it’s really a question of like looking almost to the future, like a financial advisor and saying, where do we really need to get to? And what does that take? Um, that’s the first thing. Uh, and then the other thing is just so, so many businesses, all they know is their business. So they’re experts that they’re one thing. But because we’ve had 300 plus clients, I can tell you I have this case study experience over so many various examples and saying like, because so many people come to me, they’re like, all right, let’s start doing TikTok ads. I see those are going off. I’m like, all right, we run the test. Like, I can tell you exactly how much you should spend. Or I think it’s a bad idea to run TikTok ads for, you know, x, y, z business. So it’s a really good way for them to bounce ideas off of me. And I can tell them, real world, this is working or not working. Um, and just really, I try to think of us as like a primary care physician. They come to us consistently, they ask us their other, they tell us their problems, and I help diagnose it and then get them on their way to to growth.

Trisha Stetzel: Yeah, I love that. So I want to go back to the first thing that you talked about, which is exit strategy. And, you know, beginning with the end in mind is so important. But yet, as you do, I see a lot of businesses out there that aren’t thinking about the end. They’re only thinking about where they’re at right now, and it feels they get to a position where they feel good and they’re like, well, I’m just going to stay here for a little while, not thinking about someday. You don’t want to just let your business go. You want you either want to leave a legacy and pass it down. If you have a family business, right, or you want it to be bankable and something that you can actually sell for a profit, I think that’s so important. And then to your second point around, we’re all experts in one space as we should be, right? As small business owners, we should focus on the thing that we’re really good at and then ask Justin for advice on the things that we’re not very good at, so that you can help us with that direction. Can you talk about. I’d love to talk a little bit about marketing because you you brought up TikTok, and I think this is really important. And we see a lot of business owners buying ads on LinkedIn or Facebook or TikTok or wherever they’re spending their money. Um, how much should a small business be spending on marketing, generally speaking? And why should they be spending money on marketing?

Justin Abrams: Great question. And okay, the first answer is that they should be spending as much as they can. That will actually work, because if I am making $1 million a year in my business and I’m spending $50,000 on ads, if they’re if that’s what’s getting me to that million dollars. Then by all means, do that. What I find most small businesses is they’re spending 50,000. There may be only making 100,000 off of that. And then if they’re actually thinking about what’s their actual margin, they’re oftentimes net negative. I come into at least half of my companies that I come into. I realize they’re really not making a profit on their marketing. So I really try to dial it down to start maybe a few percentage. And then once we see where we’re actually getting the profit from, and maybe we funnel some of that money into a different strategy, um, then we can really grow if it’s working. If you’re getting A5X return on your investments, let’s keep spending more. That’s great. But most people are not even getting a 1 to 1. Or maybe they’re getting a 2 to 1 and that isn’t really reproducible.

Trisha Stetzel: Mhm. Okay. So they need to come talk to Justin. Uh. All right. Um, when we’re talking about growth in these businesses and, you know, whether it’s through marketing or other things that we’re doing, um, you know, we we talk about double digits in growth every year or annually. You’re saying we should grow by 20% annually. Let’s talk more about that.

Justin Abrams: Yeah. So this is a really hard thing for people to wrap their mind around. Um, I would say it’s really a question of inflation. Number one, so if you’re not growing at least by maybe 5 or 6% a year, you’re actually losing money due to inflation, especially some industries. It’s even worse. Um, a lot of the, the employer based where you have high costs on employees benefits are going up five, 6% a year. Salaries are maybe going up 7 or 8% depending on this face. Or maybe you can’t hire. And so now you have to really struggle and pay more. So it’s easily a 6 or 7% growth that you need to have. But then you need to look at your business and realize there’s a lot of consolidation on all of these businesses. I think 100,000 baby boomers a day retire. Those people that are retiring are selling their business, and those people that are buying them are young, hungry, scrappy. They’re trying to combine all of these businesses, cut costs, maybe consolidate the CRM, consolidate the back end. And so they’re looking when I speak to them, they’re always looking at 20%. So if you’re not going at at least 15 to 20%, it’s going to be very difficult for you to compete with them because they’re coming in hard and fast and and consolidating where you can actually see that growth. So definitely want that 15 to 20%.

Trisha Stetzel: Yeah. That’s awesome Justin. So, uh, I know that there are some folks out there who are already interested in having a conversation with you. So what is the best way to get in contact with you, Justin?

Justin Abrams: Yeah. So our websites are wired for consulting group. Com. You can find us online. You can follow us on LinkedIn. My name is Justin Abrams on LinkedIn. I’m based in Boston. Uh, they can definitely reach out. And I love to talk to every small business owner I can. Even if we’re not going to work with them. I love to bounce ideas off of them and vice versa.

Trisha Stetzel: Fantastic. Thanks, Justin. Let’s talk about you. Talk about financial engineering to grow your business. Tell me more about that.

Justin Abrams: Yeah. So I think it’s a misunderstood part of business, uh, that you can actually put very little amount of money down, similar to buying a home but actually buying a similar business. So if you’re an HVAC company in Houston and, you know, and I’ll just take a step back and say a lot of the private equity guys, they’re already doing this. But if you’re a HVAC guy in Houston, you might already know the best guy near you and have a good relationship and a good rapport. And he’d much rather sell his business to you than to sell to some New York private equity. Guy’s just not even going to care. So you have this relationship, you have this knowledge, you know, his business inside and out. And, yeah, maybe 65. He wants to retire. So what you can do is if they’re if they’re growing and you want to look at their books, you can then buy their business. Put about 5 to 10% down. You’ve now potentially doubled your revenue. And you just have a small monthly fee that you have to pay off every year. But not only do you now have a great situation where you just have like basically a loan because you’re a larger business. The larger the business, the higher value you you have. So if it’s a $1 million business, you might have a lower multiple than a two or a $3 million business. So you’ve basically it’s like a two, a one plus one equals three. In a lot of ways it’s a great way to grow your business.

Trisha Stetzel: Wow. That’s a fantastic idea. And I know in the Houston area, there are a lot of small business owners that are ready to retire. I heard you say that there’s a very large number of baby boomers that are retiring on a daily basis, and I know a lot of those must be part of the millions of people who are here in the Houston area. So, Justin, as a as a consultant and in that space, it you’re open to work to not working with anybody but having a conversation with anybody. And I think that’s fantastic that you’re open to just let’s have a conversation and see where it goes. Why? What is the biggest reason why people engage with you to help them with their business.

Justin Abrams: I would say the largest one is really people are stuck. They’ve hit a plateau on their sales and they are realizing that they need to do something. Something needs to change.

Trisha Stetzel: So how do they what’s the first step with the folks that who. So you’re going to have a conversation with them. And I think that’s fantastic. What’s usually the first step that you take with your brand new clients?

Justin Abrams: Yeah, I like to just look under the hood, see what’s going on. Where’s the marketing? Where’s the spending? Tell me a little bit about the organization, the employees. Why have you felt it’s slowing down? It’s slowing down because a new competitor is in town. Is it slowing down because, uh, maybe maybe just sales have not been so great in that area. Maybe there’s, uh, people leaving that area. Is it macro related? Is it something that you did? Um. You know what? What is the. I want to hear what you think, and then I can do my own research, but which will not cloud it. But I just want to understand what is your reason for for coming to me. And what are your thoughts? Um.

Trisha Stetzel: I love that. And no judgment. Right. It’s just kind of where you are. And why are you stuck? And then you’re going to go do your homework so that you can bring back some really great information for them. Um, I happen to know that your dad was a veteran. So can we talk about can we talk about that just a little bit?

Justin Abrams: Sure. Yeah. My dad was a major in the Army. He was in there for 15 years. He just missed out on Vietnam. But, um, you know, definitely kind of the just. He was obsessed with the Army. He was stationed all over the world, Germany for a number of years. Um, and he had that kind of Cold War, Uh, Easter, eastern Germany. Kind of stationing. Um, he never literally thought he was going to be in the military his whole life. Um, like, was ready to be a general, like in his mind. Um, he hit 39 or 40, maybe. And he ended up getting set up with, uh, at the time, a woman turned out to be my mom. Uh, you know, so he he ended up leaving. But 15 amazing years and, uh, you know, he’s he’s the kind of person that I look, just I just look at him like he’s lived a life far better than anything I’m doing. I wish I could give back as much as him, but, uh, this is maybe a small percentage of what I can do.

Trisha Stetzel: Yeah, I, I love that. And, you know, we all have a little bit of space to give back, and we’re going to do it in our own way. And I can see that kindness through even our conversation today. So the I want to ask how his story has really impacted you. And I hear part of it where you want to be able to give back. But what is the impact that your father’s story has on you as a grown person today?

Justin Abrams: You know, I think part of it is really strategically thinking, you know, he when he was working and, and leading hundreds of of people or thousands of people, it’s really a question of like, how do I strategically make everyone in this battalion better? And what’s the what’s the long term plan? He’s still to this day, as you know, strategy games and stuff that he’s always I mean, he beats me in chess every time I play and it’s very frustrating. So I think it’s it’s just a way to think through the, the way that I think through businesses. A lot of the way that he thinks through through military strategy, um, and using that kind of knowledge has been really helpful. Um, so yeah, that’s certainly one way. And I think just his idea of giving back. Like, I could go to the large conglomerates and try to sell our services. But to me, it’s not something I enjoy. And personally, I don’t think, uh, you get to reward as much.

Trisha Stetzel: Yeah. Well, and, you know, being able to take this big business idea and bring it to smaller businesses, I think is so important. And that’s a huge give back to the community to be able to provide that type of knowledge, innovation and strategy to provide back to these smaller businesses. So as we get to the back end of our conversation, I’d love to hear more about some of these tools that you’re utilizing with your smaller businesses so that you can help with cost savings, um, and how you’re able to help utilize those with your clients.

Justin Abrams: Yeah. I mean, we use a ton of different tools, um, that really are. It really depends on the type of clients, but a lot of them are utilizing just modern AI workflows. So things like inbound, um, text and messages, we can automate a lot of that stuff. You know, I have a client right now. They’re getting about 30 or 40 inbound requests a day. It’s just too much for one human to manage. Um, and a lot of them are very basic questions. Can you give me an idea? Can you tell me the pricing? What are, you know, what are your thoughts on x, Y, and Z? So it’s it’s something that a human could do, but it’s almost a waste of that humanness because they’re behind their desk now answering questions. It’s not it’s not right. So I try to really push what can be basically like not human work, like robotic type of monotonous work that we’ve had to use humans. But now we can put your humans onto the things that make you money, which is sales, customer relationships, outreach, uh, conferences. Like, I talked to a sales guy the other day. I said, take the number of conferences that you’re going to and triple it. We can automate all the nonsense and the proposals and all that stuff. Let’s get you in front of the right people. That’s what matters.

Trisha Stetzel: I saw you light up when you started talking about AI and automation, so I’d like to dig around in there for just a minute, because I know there are a lot of people listening today that may still be a little afraid of A.I. and when we’re talking about AI, we’re not just talking about chat bots, we’re talking about other ways of automation, like what Justin was talking about being able to answer questions to your audience, having an automated FAQ. Basically, if we want to bring it down to a lower level. So talk to me about AI and why our small business owners should be embracing it instead of running away from it.

Justin Abrams: So the beautiful thing about small businesses in comparison to the large businesses is large businesses cannot afford to make a mistake at all. They do not. Pfizer cannot have a chatbot on their site that accidentally gives you the wrong dosage. Something, God forbid, happens. And there’s a, you know, something horrible happens, right? That is something that by nature, AI is going to make that mistake at scale with millions of patients. It’s going to do that. So they can’t really embrace it in the same way that small business that maybe gets 20 or 30 messages a month, you know, that’s not a big deal. If you if you say, uh, yeah, that was our chatbot. I’m sorry we gave you the wrong quote for plumbing. You know, plumbing contract. It’s no big deal. So that’s the beautiful thing that I see AI being able to bridge that gap and also really cutting some of the costs. So now you don’t have a person responding to every message. You can have them doing other more valuable things. I don’t see it as cutting employment at all. I see it as being able to move like humans into the right part of the business to grow it. And that’s again, that’s just something that if you’re at JP Morgan, you can’t have a chat bot doing it all or it’s just too much, too many mistakes. So it’s a huge benefit and I think you can be shy of it. You can be afraid. Um, but why not embrace it and start slow?

Trisha Stetzel: Yeah. And go learn a little bit, even if it’s helping you with your calendar or maybe an FAQ forward facing or something that answers your phones. It’s such a time saver. And then you can put the right people in the right places doing the right things that they’re good at, right? Uh, instead of the things that they’re not so good at. All right. So here’s my last question for you. Well, it’s not really a question, but a statement. Tell me your favorite story. It can be a client story or your favorite Justin story.

Justin Abrams: Oh, this is a great question. So I think, uh, I think my favorite story is really on. Um, I have a local landscaper. He is in a similar position to a lot of your, uh, your listeners, um, they’re doing a little under $1 million a year. Um, in similar fashion to what we were talking about before. His father had a their rival, but they were really rival landscaping company as well. And he passed away. And that is a big catalyst of these of the the best small businesses is just an untimely death. So he had to take over. Now he has two companies and he has to take it over, Figure out all the systems, how to grow it. For a year he did that, and he then looked at his annual profit and loss. That. All right, I’m spending way too much. So what? All we did, we came in, spent about a month looking at everything, testing a few things, and we realized he was spending about $40,000 a year on marketing and making -$10,000. It was actually losing him. Customers. I don’t know how, but he was losing him money. So the first thing we did, I just said, let’s let’s just cut it all.

Justin Abrams: You’re not making any money from it. Let’s just cut it all. His profit has doubled this year. Just by just just cutting those things off. We’re running some SEO. We’re running some local community groups. Yes, but there’s no cost to that other than some some minor ongoing maintenance. And it’s totally changed now. I say this is like some great thing I did. The trust that he has to do to just turn off the faucet. That’s something that’s very hard to do. I say most most of my clients wouldn’t have the faith in me. So I think it’s when I say, like, what’s the most impressive? I always say having that faith, believing that I know what’s best. That’s I mean, I don’t trust anyone. I understand. It’s like it’s a hard it’s a dog eat dog world, and I understand, but that’s one of the things where I found a customer really believes in me. Even though, you know, I don’t know anything about landscaping, but I can look at the books and kind of tell him how to do it.

Trisha Stetzel: Because you have the experience and expertise in business, and that’s what’s most important. Thank you for sharing that. I, uh, what a great story about a family owned business by accident. Yeah. And, you know, unfortunate situation, but we find ourselves in those kinds of positions quite often, where we have aging parents or grandparents that own businesses, and the person who’s receiving that business just doesn’t know anything about them. So thank you for being there right along and helping this gentleman grow his profit by twice. Uh, just from cutting off something that he’s spending too much money on. Right. And not getting a return. Fantastic. This has been a wonderful, absolute amazing, uh, discussion today. Justin, I really appreciate you joining me.

Justin Abrams: Oh, thank you for having me. Trish, this is great.

Trisha Stetzel: All right. One more time. Justin, how can people connect with you?

Justin Abrams: Uh, yeah. So the website is ro r y o.com. Mario, by the way, stands for Safe Travels in Japanese. So if you have any issues, you need some safe traveling expertise. I’m your guy and we’re on LinkedIn. You can find me on Twitter, Instagram, all the socials.

Trisha Stetzel: Awesome. And I think I found Justin on LinkedIn. I think we’re connected. So if you can’t find him, come, come find me and I’ll connect you with Justin. Thank you again for being with me today. This has been amazing and, uh, can’t wait to have our next conversation together.

Justin Abrams: Excited to do it. Thanks, Trisha.

Trisha Stetzel: That’s all the time we have for today. If you found value in this conversation and I had with Justin, share it with a fellow entrepreneur, veteran or a Houston leader ready to grow. Be sure to follow, rate, and review the show. It helps us reach more bold business minds just like yours and your business. Your leadership and your legacy are built one intentional step at a time. So stay inspired, stay focused, and keep building the business and the life you deserve.

 

Tagged With: Aryo Consulting Group

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