Business RadioX ®

  • Home
  • Business RadioX ® Communities
    • Southeast
      • Alabama
        • Birmingham
      • Florida
        • Orlando
        • Pensacola
        • South Florida
        • Tampa
        • Tallahassee
      • Georgia
        • Atlanta
        • Cherokee
        • Forsyth
        • Greater Perimeter
        • Gwinnett
        • North Fulton
        • North Georgia
        • Northeast Georgia
        • Rome
        • Savannah
      • Louisiana
        • New Orleans
      • North Carolina
        • Charlotte
        • Raleigh
      • Tennessee
        • Chattanooga
        • Nashville
      • Virginia
        • Richmond
    • South Central
      • Arkansas
        • Northwest Arkansas
    • Midwest
      • Illinois
        • Chicago
      • Michigan
        • Detroit
      • Minnesota
        • Minneapolis St. Paul
      • Missouri
        • St. Louis
      • Ohio
        • Cleveland
        • Columbus
        • Dayton
    • Southwest
      • Arizona
        • Phoenix
        • Tucson
        • Valley
      • Texas
        • Austin
        • Dallas
        • Houston
    • West
      • California
        • Bay Area
        • LA
        • Pasadena
      • Colorado
        • Denver
      • Hawaii
        • Oahu
  • FAQs
  • About Us
    • Our Mission
    • Our Audience
    • Why It Works
    • What People Are Saying
    • BRX in the News
  • Resources
    • BRX Pro Tips
    • B2B Marketing: The 4Rs
    • High Velocity Selling Habits
    • Why Most B2B Media Strategies Fail
    • 9 Reasons To Sponsor A Business RadioX ® Show
  • Partner With Us
  • Veteran Business RadioX ®

Search Results for: kids care

GWBC Radio: Kim Wright with American Heart Association and Susan Gravely with Gravely and Associates

February 21, 2020 by angishields

GWBC-Feature-2-20-20
Atlanta Business Radio
GWBC Radio: Kim Wright with American Heart Association and Susan Gravely with Gravely and Associates
Loading
00:00 /
RSS Feed
Share
Link
Embed

Download file

American-Heart-Association-GWBC

KimWrightHeadshotSizedCropKIMBERLY D. ALLEN WRIGHT is a Vice President of Health Strategies for Metro Atlanta’s American Heart Association. Kim is an experienced leader with a track record of success in developing structural alignment, leading change initiatives and delivering innovative strategic solutions for both profit and non-profit organizations.

As the daughter of an Air Force intelligence specialist, she spent her childhood overseas living in Madagascar, Peru and Honduras. Her proficiency in Spanish later led her to serve as a translator for the Argentinian swim team during the 1996 Paralympic Games. She also performed as a stepper in the Welcome to the World segment during the opening ceremonies for the 1996 Centennial Olympic Games in Atlanta under the direction of Kenny Ortega.

Kimberly graduated with honors from North Carolina A&T State University in 1992 with a degree in Banking & Finance. Upon graduating she accepted a job with McMaster-Carr Supply Co. in Atlanta, GA.

In 1999, Kimberly left McMaster-Carr to launch her own company, Castleberry On-Site Massage Inc., which provided chair massage and mobile spa services to corporations. Kimberly secured major contracts with high-profile clients such as Bell South, Jameson Hospitality and CNN.

Kimberly joined the American Cancer Society in the fight against cancer following her mother’s diagnosis with colorectal cancer in 2001. As the director of mission solutions, she was responsible for the development and delivery of constituent education program materials and mission-based tools. She was also the National Strategic Lead for African American Collaborations/Partnerships and a spokesperson for the American Cancer Society’s Choose You initiative.

In late 2012, Kim joined Pitney Bowes Management Services as a Business Development Executive where she worked with both profit and non-profit organizations improving their data analytics and integration, communication intelligence, messaging via multi-channels and print outsourcing.

Kimberly is an active member of a number of volunteer organizations including Alpha Kappa Alpha Sorority Inc. and serves on the board of the Junior League of Atlanta and the National Black College Alumni Hall of Fame. She also served on the Visitors board at her alma mater and the advisory board for the Allen Etiquette Institute. In 2002 Upscale Magazine named Kimberly one of 10 Power Brokers of the Millennium. Kimberly resides in Atlanta with her two children Storm and JW.

Follow the American Heart Association on LinkedIn, Facebook, Twitter and Instagram.

SusanGravelySusan Duncan Gravely is President of Gravely and Associates, LLC, a women-owned company specializing in providing insurance products and risk management services to women-owned businesses as well as corporate clients who have a need or desire to do business with other women-owned entities. The intent is to develop and maintain professional relationships with those companies that have a diversity-based focus with their vendor partners. With 40+ year’s experience of servicing clients in the commercial property and casualty industry, she has been identified by corporate risk managers and international insurance brokers as very capable of filling this service void.

Gravely and Associates is a certified Women’s Business Enterprise (WBE) through the National Women’s Business Enterprise Council, the largest certification council in the United States. Gravely and Associates has been a member in good standing of the Regional Partner Organization, The Greater Women’s Business Council since 2006.

Susan obtained her CIC (Certified Insurance Counselor) designation in 1989, the CPCU (Chartered Property Casualty Underwriter) designation in 1999 and the CRM (Certified Risk Manager) designation in 2004.

Follow Gravely and Associates on LinkedIn.

TRANSCRIPT

Intro: [00:00:05] Broadcasting live from the Business RadioX Studios in Atlanta, Georgia, it’s time for GWBC Radio: Conversations to Grow Your Business. Now here’s your host, Roz Lewis.

Roz Lewis: [00:00:25] Good morning.

Lee Kantor: [00:00:26] Good morning, Roz. This is Lee Kantor joining you here at GWBC Radio: Conversations to Grow Your Business. And February is Heart Awareness Month. I don’t know if you’re aware of that, Roz.

Roz Lewis: [00:00:38] Yes. And my heart has always been beating.

Lee Kantor: [00:00:42] So, you were gonna have a thematic show, right?

Roz Lewis: [00:00:45] We are. We’re gonna have a great show this morning because of who our guest is. And our guest is Kimberly Wright with the American Heart Association, who is going to give us some insight and tips on how to protect your heart. Our theme this month is talking about how do you protect your heart, as well as, not just your heart, but also the heart of your business. And we also have with us Susan Gravely of Gravely & Associates.

Lee Kantor: [00:01:20] So, she’s in charge of the business part, and Kimberly’s in charge of the heart part?

Roz Lewis: [00:01:24] I think they both have a heart.

Lee Kantor: [00:01:25] They’re both. There’s going to be [crosstalk]-

Roz Lewis: [00:01:27] They both have a heart.

Lee Kantor: [00:01:27] … referencing there.

Roz Lewis: [00:01:29] Yes.

Lee Kantor: [00:01:30] So, who do you want to kick off with?

Roz Lewis: [00:01:31] Let’s get both.

Lee Kantor: [00:01:31] But first … well, you know what? Before we get too far, this is our first show of 2020. Any updates on GWBC that you know about?

Roz Lewis: [00:01:38] Yes. 2020 is our 20th anniversary. We have been certifying women businesses for 20 years, providing them-

Lee Kantor: [00:01:47] Wow!

Roz Lewis: [00:01:47] Yes, The Women’s Business Enterprise National Council certification. And for you women businesses out there, this certification is a national certification. So, whether you’re certified here in our region, Georgia, North or South Carolina, you will be able to utilize this certification with over 350 major corporations who accept this.

Lee Kantor: [00:02:13] And that’s around the country.

Roz Lewis: [00:02:15] That is around the country that accepts it.

Lee Kantor: [00:02:18] And then, there’s no reason not to do this. This is just opening doors for you to grow your business.

Roz Lewis: [00:02:23] This is a great opportunity, number one, for you to network with other successful women businesses. As a matter of fact, today, after we leave the show, we’ll be on our way to Tables of Eight. This is a luncheon where women connect in order to support each other. I have a special saying that’s by Madeleine Albright.

Lee Kantor: [00:02:46] Go ahead.

Roz Lewis: [00:02:46] There’s a special place in hell for women who don’t help other women. That’s right.

Lee Kantor: [00:02:51] So, Tables of Eight will kind of alleviate some of those issues, right?

Roz Lewis: [00:02:55] Yes.

Lee Kantor: [00:02:55] They’re going to get together and help each other.

Roz Lewis: [00:02:57] Exactly. Is going to be at the Agave Restaurant. So, if you have time to stop by, by all means, come. There is opportunity for you to meet some very successful women.

Lee Kantor: [00:03:10] And then, is that something that’s going to be ongoing?

Roz Lewis: [00:03:13] Yes. We do this once a quarter, but we have other events too. So, I always encourage you to visit our website at gwbc.org just to learn more about how you can grow and develop your business.

Lee Kantor: [00:03:28] Good stuff. So, who do you want to kick off the show with?

Roz Lewis: [00:03:30] Let’s kick out the show Kimberley this morning. Let’s get right into the heartbeat.

Kimberly Wright: [00:03:37] Good morning. Good morning.

Lee Kantor: [00:03:37] So, Kimberly, tell us about the American Heart Association. How are you serving folks?

Kimberly Wright: [00:03:41] Oh, well, first of all, it is Heart Month, and we are excited to celebrate your heart this morning and the heart of women. And so, we are a relentless force focused on extending the lives of all people. And so, February is important to us, especially it aligns with Valentine’s Day.

Lee Kantor: [00:04:05] That’s probably a coincidence, right?

Kimberly Wright: [00:04:07] Yes, it is a coincidence. Yeah. It makes sense. A lot of red, right?

Lee Kantor: [00:04:14] So, now, what’s your work at the American Heart Association?

Kimberly Wright: [00:04:17] So, I am the Vice President of Health Strategies for Metro Atlanta. So, what that means is we focus on all things health, in particular, blood pressure control, physical activity, and healthy eating, a lot of policy work focusing on tobacco, especially with his vaping epidemic that we have with the youth in particular. So, I get to wake up every morning focused on how I’m going to save lives. Fancy, huh?

Lee Kantor: [00:04:45] And then, how are you doing that in conjunction with businesses? How are you collaborating with the public?

Kimberly Wright: [00:04:52] Yeah, we partner with businesses, individuals, other nonprofits as well. We partnered with the city’s Councils in Marietta or City of Atlanta focusing on policies as well.

Roz Lewis: [00:05:06] So, how can companies support the American Heart Association and their employees?

Kimberly Wright: [00:05:13] Sure. So, there’s several ways that you can. So, we have actually Workplace Health Solutions, which is a toolkit for companies. A lot of times, companies will decide to have a healthier, which is great, but it’s not sustainable. So, it’s that, “Now what?” So, we really encourage companies to adopt policies of putting their health first. Specifically, tied to women, in particular, we are the chief medical decision makers in our households. So, if women are healthy, the house is healthy, businesses are healthy. So, in particular, we definitely encourage women-owned businesses to focus on putting your health first because there’s a sense of guilt that we tend to have when we focus on ourselves first thinking that it’s selfish when indeed it’s not.

Lee Kantor: [00:06:07] Now, is there some low hanging fruit that a business can do along these lines?

Kimberly Wright: [00:06:12] Sure. So, low hanging fruit is you can do an assessment of your environment and think about what are some of the things that we can take on. Low hanging fruit if you want to encourage and incentivize individuals to park far away, or have healthy meetings, make a decision that you’re going to ensure that you have water instead of sugar-sweetened beverages. We need a little pizzazz, offer infused water perhaps, healthy snacks, again, physical activity, encouraging people to go to the doctor and know their numbers. So, really giving. If you can free up a day to say, “You know what, we’re going to recognize this day as a day that we want everyone in the office to go to their doctor to get their physical and know their numbers.”

Lee Kantor: [00:07:03] Yeah, I know here in this building, they really do a great job. In the third floor here, they have a walking trail that you can walk around. And I’ve seen people have like meetings or instead of having a meeting in a cubicle, you can just walk and have the same meeting, and you’re outside, and you’re walking and moving.

Kimberly Wright: [00:07:18] Yes, absolutely. And a lot of people are working remote these days. So, if you’re working from home, you can walk around or walk on the treadmill. And if you are a leader of a business, encourage that. So, if somebody sounds a little bit winded from walking, celebrate and recognize that versus making them feel like they need to apologize for sounding a little winded.

Roz Lewis: [00:07:40] But we also want to make sure that they’re okay.

Kimberly Wright: [00:07:40] Absolutely, for sure. Yeah, we want to make sure that if you’re just sounding winded because you’re walking, but we definitely want encourage walking.

Lee Kantor: [00:07:51] And then, piggybacking on that okay part, is there a CPR element of this as well?

Kimberly Wright: [00:07:56] There is a CPR element as well. In the American Heart Association, we do offer an extensive CPR training. But we also, on our website at heart.org, you can access information on how to administer hands-only CPR.

Lee Kantor: [00:08:12] And that’s the recommended?

Kimberly Wright: [00:08:14] That is the recommended because it is an easy training and it’s something that you can do to help that individual that is in the middle of a situation to ensure that the emergency, the ambulance can arrive. But it’s not necessarily … it’s enough that you feel empowered to do something without feeling like, “Oh, my gosh, CPR is just too complicated.” And they’re fun videos too.

Roz Lewis: [00:08:42] So, how often do you have to go through training for CPR? I remember when I was a flight attendant, we had to do it every year, doing what was called recurrent training. So, of course, we had to know CPR. But for the day-to-day person, someone working in an office, what would you recommend, so that they hopefully you don’t have an opportunity to use it?

Kimberly Wright: [00:09:09] Sure. So, yes. So, if you’re in a certain field, it is recommended that you get the annual training. But anyone, including your kids at home, can look at this video. Honestly, it takes 10 minutes, and it’s usually to the rhythm of a fun song to help you know the rhythm and the compressions. So, truly, you can go on heart.org, and click on the video, and learn. If you’re in an office setting, I mean, you can make that part of your next meeting to say, “You know what, we’re going to download and start this meeting off by showing this video, so everyone understands how to administer hands-only CPR,” which a big part of it is yelling to someone and telling them to call 911-

Lee Kantor: [00:09:50] Call 911, right.

Kimberly Wright: [00:09:50] … you forget. And so it’s just that reminder of pointing to that person and saying, “Call 911.”

Lee Kantor: [00:09:57] Right. It’s not just yell, “Help!’ You have to say, “Hey, lady in the blue dress, go and call.”

Kimberly Wright: [00:10:03] Yes.

Lee Kantor: [00:10:03] Right. Like that, they know it’s them.

Kimberly Wright: [00:10:06] Exactly. Indeed.

Lee Kantor: [00:10:08] Now, for you, when you’re doing this kind of work, is it a little frustrating in that heart disease doesn’t get kind of the press that some of the other diseases, even though the numbers of people who suffer from heart disease and die from that is much greater?

Kimberly Wright: [00:10:25] Yes. In fact, it is the number one killer of men and women. But the good news is 80% of it is preventable through physical activity, eating healthy, and knowing your numbers. But it can be frustrating because like I tell people, I’m in the business of helping to preserve your health. Everyone is born with a heart. We want to ensure that you have a healthy heart. So, when you have cancer, or something else, or diabetes, which is another chronic disease, that is something that is a disease where we’re trying to preserve a heart to prevent heart disease.

Lee Kantor: [00:11:05] Lifestyle.

Kimberly Wright: [00:11:06] Yeah, it’s lifestyle. So, we take February as an opportunity to celebrate life and your heart. So, that’s where this is an incredibly important month to make people understand, “You know what, there are small things that you can do. And we want you to survive.”

Roz Lewis: [00:11:21] So, how does the American Heart Association … because you mentioned about the healthy lifestyle, and drinking water, infused water. So, how does the American Heart Association work with the food industry to ensure that we are eating more low cholesterol items or have those options available to us?

Kimberly Wright: [00:11:45] Sure. So, well, we want to ensure that the healthy choice is the default choice. So, we want to sneak up on you and just make sure you’re being healthy without you even knowing it. So, with the food industry, in particular, when you go into the grocery store, you’ll see that there is something that says American Heart Association Certified with the check mark.

Lee Kantor: [00:12:06] Check mark, right.

Kimberly Wright: [00:12:08] Right. So, when you’re picking your meats for your sandwich meat for the week, if you know that you can hone in on anything that has that heart check because it lets you know that it has limited sodium, a great source of nutrients, it limits the bad fat. So, industries, we are proud of our brand. And so, for that check mark to to be on a box of healthy cereal or on sandwich meat, this low in sodium, that’s the way we partner with the food industry to encourage them to offer healthier options.

Roz Lewis: [00:12:42] So, what about taste test? Because at the end of the day, it’s all about the taste.

Kimberly Wright: [00:12:47] Yes. Yeah. Oh, absolutely. And also, you can find in our heart.org, we have a tool kit or a resource that’s called Healthy for Life. And it’s all about food discovery experience, while at the same time learning something new. For instance, if we talk to people about you need to lower your sodium, okay, great, that’s wonderful. But now what? What are the different options that I have?

Lee Kantor: [00:13:16] Right. Like, what’s a lot of sodium? How do I-

Kimberly Wright: [00:13:17] What’s a lot of sodium, right?

Lee Kantor: [00:13:17] I don’t even have any context for that.

Kimberly Wright: [00:13:19] Exactly. And more importantly, what else gives me that satisfaction the salt gives me that is not salt? So, through the Healthy for Life, we have a program that’s really a taste test. For instance, there’s cauliflower rice or adding citrus. So, we provide options on what you can do around healthy eating and encourage people to taste. And so, that’s something that a business can do. So, it’s a great tool kit. You may say, “You know what, we’re going to offer a session and have a little competition on everyone preparing this healthy recipe or snack.” You can have popcorn that has no salt and none of the bad fat, but you can add some fun seasoning to it. And somebody may say, “Oh, I didn’t like the parsley.” We’ll try rosemary. It’s a win-win situation. And so, now, people are introduced to healthy options.

Lee Kantor: [00:14:12] Now, are you finding people are more open to trying different seasonings? You see so many ethnic restaurants, food from all over the world where salt isn’t used. They use lots of herbs and seasonings.

Kimberly Wright: [00:14:25] In some communities. Some communities are ready to just expand and taste some of the things. But for instance, there are certain communities that don’t have that same access. If you’re living in the middle of a food desert and the closest place that you can get food is at the corner gas station that has things that are high in salt, it is a preservative. So, that’s where we partner with school systems or community centers to offer these healthy options to get these kids to try-

Lee Kantor: [00:14:58] Right. Because they’re just not aware, right?

Kimberly Wright: [00:14:59] They’ve never been exposed to it. “Oh, what’s that?” You would really be surprised. So, it’s also about the exposure, and then knowing. I have to tell a story that there was one kid that they said, “You know what, I didn’t know that bananas were really yellow. I thought that was just on television,” because he gets his banana from the corner store fresh fruit, not necessarily available at the corner store. By the time they get to it, it’s sitting there for a while.

Lee Kantor: [00:15:30] Turns like Brown.

Kimberly Wright: [00:15:31] Exactly.

Lee Kantor: [00:15:32] Right.

Kimberly Wright: [00:15:33] Right. So, giving them that exposure, but also tying it back to business and the children. It really lets them know what else is out there and exposes them. And they may have a passion for, how can we, a school in a certain neighborhood, partner with a local farmer’s market or a farmer to, now, have fresh fruits and vegetables that the kids can taste?” So, we also focused on empowering communities that don’t necessarily have the same access as others.

Lee Kantor: [00:16:03] Now, are you seeing more or more farmers markets pop up?

Kimberly Wright: [00:16:08] We are. And we are partnering with farmer’s markets. So, for instance, with a lot of the faith-based organizations, a lot of them you’ll see will have pop up farmer’s markets on site after service or donate a lot of their fresh fruits and vegetables to the pantries that are in the churches. So, we are seeing that. But I also want to mention that, sometimes, again, in the interest of time, some folks don’t have time to get that fresh fruit and vegetable. So, we also empower people and let them know frozen is a great option. You can’t get canned with that heart check that says low sodium. But if you can’t even get that, you can rinse things off. So, we really try to meet people where they are, so that everyone feels empowered and knows that there is one small thing that I can do no matter where I live, no matter the zip code. What can I do today to help extend my life and the life of my family members?

Roz Lewis: [00:17:07] Well, think about the things that you’re saying regarding the salt content that’s in a lot of our foods. And I even understand it’s even in milk. So, what are the silent signs that a business owner can look for when it comes to their employees as far as being healthy? And it’s always a fine line, right? We’re between an employer and employee. But more than likely, they’re caring about their teammate. So, are there any signs that any of our owners out there can be aware of or start noticing?

Kimberly Wright: [00:17:56] Right. And you bring up a good point because you want to respect people’s privacy’s, and someone may have the best of intentions and end up making a comment that, now, you have a new whole nother issue on your hands. So, what I would say, I would ask the business owners to not look for the signs but make a decision to be proactive. So, again, it goes back to if you are a business owner, ensuring that in our office, we always have fresh fruit. And so, every day, there’s someone in the office, they go and they get the fresh fruit, and there’s always fresh fruit in the break room. So, I would offer that up or having walking meetings.

Kimberly Wright: [00:18:38] But also, if you see somebody that is looking tired or if something’s going on, not necessarily approaching them because everybody may not want that, but that is an opportunity to reflect to say, “Okay, I noticed that this person’s a little bit tired, and maybe you might want to think, am I overworking them? Am I giving them an opportunity to get up and get moving?'” So, instead of having the conversation, you say, “You know what, let’s have a walking meeting today,” or “Walk with me today,” or something. So, that’s the way that I would. I go back to we want to ensure that the healthy choice is the default choice because there is a sense of guilt, especially for women when we take time out for ourselves. So, we don’t want to add that burden onto them to say, “You know what, you’re just not looking right today.” So, how do we turn it around and empower them?

Lee Kantor: [00:19:28] Now, what about stress? That’s kind of like a silent thing that affects a lot of business people.

Kimberly Wright: [00:19:34] Oh, my goodness.

Lee Kantor: [00:19:34] They feel like they have the weight of the world, responsible for other people. What are some things that people can do to alleviate stress in their business life and life?

Kimberly Wright: [00:19:44] Well, you know what you can do? We recommend you do? Take a deep breath. Stop, pause, inhale through your nose, exhale. Okay. Just stop and take a moment. It sounds simple. And getting enough sleep, we encourage sleep. You have to rest.

Lee Kantor: [00:20:11] Right. Some business owners pride themselves on, “Oh, I only sleep two hours a night. I’ve been working 24/7.” And that’s just not sustainable, right?

Kimberly Wright: [00:20:11] It’s not sustainable. And honestly, are you really being productive? So, that’s the question going back to the business. Are you asking yourself, do we … sometimes, we talk about- especially women – that super woman syndrome.

Lee Kantor: [00:20:32] Right. I got it all under control.

Kimberly Wright: [00:20:33] And I’ve got it all under control. And that’s great, but that can shorten our lives. So, we also need to look out for the super women in our lives and make sure that we’re not taking on too much and saying, “That’s great, but how can I help you?”

Lee Kantor: [00:20:50] Are there any kind of physiological clues that maybe something’s not right? Like is there heart kind of symptoms that someone could see, like, “I’m having trouble. I used to be able to walk up the stairs. And, now, I’m having trouble.” Are there some clues that people can hone in on?

Kimberly Wright: [00:21:06] Yeah, there are some. Those are some. Like, if you’re winded, you’re walking, if you’re feeling tired all the time. I mean, honestly, it’s just those basic clues. But for heart attacks, in particular, or in stroke. So, for stroke, we talk about the acronym of FAST, face drooping, arm drooping, you can’t smile. And if not, then it’s time to call 911. So, those are some of the outward signs, but the challenge is, again, going back to women, “Oh, you know what? I just had this little tingle,” and we ignore it, right?

Lee Kantor: [00:21:42] Right

Kimberly Wright: [00:21:42] So, what I would say is watch. Listen to your body. Listen to the signs. If you’re feeling tired, rest. Don’t ignore the signs.

Lee Kantor: [00:21:53] But they happen like so gradually. Like, you don’t know. It’s a little thing that just kind of builds over time. It’s hard to discern like, “Oh, this is something really big,” or, “This is something manageable.”

Kimberly Wright: [00:22:03] Right, right. And so, yeah, I mean, and everybody’s body is different, and it could be something not necessarily heart health related. So, that’s why we do say it’s important to know your numbers. That’s the best indicator. I mean, truly knowing your numbers.

Lee Kantor: [00:22:19] And your numbers, that’s your blood pressure. What are the other numbers that are important to know?

Kimberly Wright: [00:22:24] They are blood pressure, knowing what your weight should be. So, connecting with your doctor, so that they can even communicate to you what your numbers should be, and establish some goals and metrics.

Lee Kantor: [00:22:37] And that way, you can see trends.

Kimberly Wright: [00:22:39] You can see trends. Yeah, yeah.

Roz Lewis: [00:22:41] But what about the difference between women and men? Because there are some signs that women should pay attention to. Historically, the signs have been more geared towards men. And today, we really have some signs that our women need to be paying attention to. I say the first sign is to lower, to your point, the superwoman cape.

Kimberly Wright: [00:23:04] Right, right, right, yes. And then, if we’re talking about heart attacks, in particular, for both men and women, of course, chest discomfort, shortness of breath, you have discomfort in the upper part of your body. But for women in particular, women experience some different signs of which one in particular is that shortness of breath, if you’re nauseated or vomiting, and back or jaw pain. So, imagine how it could or could not be, right? So, you’re just thinking, “Oh, I was lifting my baby, and it’s just my back,” or “Oh, my jaw. I was clenching my teeth.” So, that kind of goes back to listen to your body.

Roz Lewis: [00:23:52] Right. So, this month is also Go for Red Month, right? So, tell us a little bit about the Go for Red Campaign.

Kimberly Wright: [00:23:59] Right. So, the Go Red for Women. So, it’s important because, like I said, women are the chief medical decision makers in the household, and cardiovascular disease is the leading cause of death among women.

Roz Lewis: [00:24:15] Not breast cancer.

Kimberly Wright: [00:24:16] Not breast. That’s exactly what I was getting ready to say. It claims more lives than any form of cancer combined.

Roz Lewis: [00:24:24] Wow!

Kimberly Wright: [00:24:24] Right. And so, something else to consider is that women continue to be underrepresented in research and experience the inequities that come along with treatment. So, the research dollars, we need to ensure that more dollars go towards research in women, in particular. So, that’s one thing that we focus on. We have something, STEM Goes Red, which is really exciting.

Lee Kantor: [00:24:51] That’s a great idea to combine those two things.

Roz Lewis: [00:24:54] Exactly.

Kimberly Wright: [00:24:54] Absolutely. And that’s focused on young ladies, young girls. So, we partner with local businesses. And it’s a day where each business takes a letter, the S, the T, the E, the M. And the young ladies are exposed to science, technology, and so on, and so forth. And so, it really is about ensuring that women and young girls stay interested in that field. So, ultimately, we can have more women research writers and medical experts.

Roz Lewis: [00:25:25] But is it also about women volunteer for certain test or-

Kimberly Wright: [00:25:25] Right. Yes. So, I would say that women make up less than half of the clinical trials.

Roz Lewis: [00:25:38] And that’s the word I was looking for, clinical trials.

Kimberly Wright: [00:25:41] Yeah. Clinical trials, right.

Lee Kantor: [00:25:42] So, why is that? There’s more women than men, why would they do the trials less?

Kimberly Wright: [00:25:48] Well, I think there’s a number of reasons. One, that ties back to if there’s fewer women, fewer dollars that are going towards women research and women than some women may not qualify for certain clinical trials. But there are a number of factors, but we just need to be more aware of that and know that clinical trials can be an option, but then ensure that more dollars go towards research for women, so that we will have clinical trials that are focused on women.

Lee Kantor: [00:26:22] Right. Because like you said, it’s not the same. Like the disease affects people differently.

Kimberly Wright: [00:26:28] Right. There are biological differences that we can’t ignore.

Lee Kantor: [00:26:31] So, now, what do you need more of? What are some things businesses right now can do to celebrate Heart Awareness Month?

Kimberly Wright: [00:26:38] Well, there’s a couple of things that we’d love for you to do. And this is one, Heart Walk. We have our heart walk every year. And so, we’d love for businesses to participate. That’s a great team-building exercise. It’s a great way to be active together and just celebrate Heart Health. Also, we encourage businesses, if you want to call 1-877-242-4277 or simply go to cpr.heart.org and sign up your business for CPR training, the extensive one. So, that’s where if you want more than download the video quick hands-only CPR training, that’s something else that you can do as well.

Kimberly Wright: [00:27:24] Also, join us in the advocacy space. So, we spend a lot of time in our local markets. And so, you can join You’re the Cure. I’ll pull that information on how to text to join. And so, that keeps you abreast of all the policies that we’re focused on. We are incredibly excited to say that Atlanta is now smoke-free. And that was a result of the policy work that was done. And so, we’d love for businesses and community members alike to come along with us. And we, now, are focusing on … we have participated in Complete Street. So, if there’s new construction going on or renovation, ensuring that there are safe sidewalks for people to be able to to walk, but now taking it a step further, you have those communities that have the Complete Streets but it’s not safe for kids to walk to school. So, we call that Safe Routes to School. So, having business come along with us to really ensure, how can we ensure that kids can get to school safely?

Lee Kantor: [00:28:28] Imagine that, walking to school. Again-

Kimberly Wright: [00:28:30] Walking to school, physical activity. Fancy that.

Lee Kantor: [00:28:32] What a concept. Now, for you, what’s the most rewarding part of the job?

Kimberly Wright: [00:28:37] Every day, I wake up focused on saving someone’s life. And by trade, I’m a finance person. My background is in finance and operations. How did I end up, that’s another story, now that I said, right? How? But just knowing that I have purpose, and it’s a big job, but at the same time, it is incredibly rewarding when I go and I see that heart check at the grocery store.

Lee Kantor: [00:29:06] Or someone put that in their basket.

Kimberly Wright: [00:29:07] Yes, yes. Or people are talking about Zip Code Matter, and the disparity, and the life expectancy from one zip code to another, and the fact that we are participating in bringing awareness to that issue. And so, now, encouraging whether it’s businesses, city council members to come along with us to ensure that there is health equity. So, that excites me.

Lee Kantor: [00:29:32] Now, is there are ways for our listener to volunteer? Are there volunteer opportunities?

Kimberly Wright: [00:29:38] Say no more. There is always volunteer opportunities. So, I would go to heart.org. That’s really the best place to go. And there’s a place there where you can just click to volunteer, and they’ll connect you with your local market-

Lee Kantor: [00:29:54] Right, that’s near you.

Kimberly Wright: [00:29:55] Yeah, yeah, it’s near. Then, we want to plug you in with whatever space resonates most with you. But there are plenty. We don’t exist without our volunteers. We even have committee members that help to inform our where we go and what we should focus on. So, whether you just want to hand out information, or advocate, or serve on a committee, there are plenty of opportunities to volunteer. And definitely want to take a moment to thank all the volunteers that are out there. So, we really appreciate it.

Roz Lewis: [00:30:29] Well, most nonprofits cannot do without volunteers, right? They’re the extended team members. They are also part of the lifeblood of any non-profit organization. And I think you talking about the fact of what you were trained in versus where you are today, you have found your purpose.

Kimberly Wright: [00:30:51] Thank you. I think I have. I think I have. And there’s transferable skills, right? So, I started at a different nonprofit, the Cancer Society before, and I thought to myself, “Who am I, this finance and operations person, to come in alongside the Chief Deputy Medical Officer that I would see on CNN. Who am I?” But there’s the operation. So, I came into this space just really figuring out how to help nonprofits execute on the research. So, for instance, if the research says you need to consume X number of servings of fruits and vegetables a day, how do you translate that to the general public? How do you make it easy for people to understand what they can do? And really just the implementation, the budget side of it. So, at first, I didn’t understand my place. But now, I do understand my place in the nonprofit world. So, that’s another message too that where you start off in your career may not be where you end up, so.

Lee Kantor: [00:31:59] But it’s leveraging your superpowers in order to maximize the impact you’re making and your skills.

Kimberly Wright: [00:32:06] Right, absolutely. So, with donor dollars with the background, I’m always thinking about what’s a strong return on impact and return on investment. And I want to make sure we’re being responsible with our donor dollars. I take pride in the fact that if somebody says, “Where’s money going?”, “Okay, so glad you asked. I can share that with you, so you can see the return on investment and the return on impact.” Great. This is the output or what you paid for, but this also equates to X number of kids now being able to walk to school.

Lee Kantor: [00:32:41] And know a banana is yellow.

Kimberly Wright: [00:32:42] And know that a banana is yellow.

Lee Kantor: [00:32:45] Good stuff. Well, thank you for the work you’re doing. It’s so important.

Kimberly Wright: [00:32:48] Thank you.

Roz Lewis: [00:32:49] Yeah, we really appreciate it. So, Susan.

Susan Gravely: [00:32:53] Yes.

Lee Kantor: [00:32:54] You learned anything there?

Susan Gravely: [00:32:56] I learned a lot.

Roz Lewis: [00:32:58] So, now, here, we’ve talked about how we can help healthy employees and hopefully healthy business owners too. So, remember, it’s more than two hours of sleep. You need at least seven to eight hours. And I’m also talking to myself regarding that.

Susan Gravely: [00:33:15] I can relate.

Roz Lewis: [00:33:15] Yes. But let’s talk about the business and how important it is. And literally, tell us a little bit about Gravely & Associates. And you’re going to hear that I word business owners out there not thinking that that is truly your heartbeat.

Susan Gravely: [00:33:34] That’s exactly right. Well, Gravely & Associates provides insurance products and risk management services to businesses, large and small. Where we plug ourselves in is working with women-owned businesses, minority businesses, smaller businesses that do business with corporate. Those individuals or those businesses have a need for someone who can go in and look at those corporate contracts, determine what coverage they need, and provide that coverage for them in an environment that is service-oriented.

Lee Kantor: [00:34:09] Now, what’s an example of some coverage that when you’re dealing with a corporate that a business may not anticipate needing?

Susan Gravely: [00:34:15] That’s a great question. We see and I see all kinds of contracts. We work with a lot of WBEs, work with a lot of corporate contracts, and those corporate contracts can change from year to year. And you may have had adequate coverage the year before, and then they change their contract requirements, and they’re required to have additional coverage. And it can range from anything from general liability, to umbrella coverage, to crime coverage, and fidelity coverage, professional liability coverage. Cyber coverage is now a big hot topic and a hot ticket for clients that are doing business with corporates.

Lee Kantor: [00:34:58] What does cyber coverage mean?

Susan Gravely: [00:35:00] Cyber liability coverage is basically coverage for those individuals, companies that have computer services, provide computer services, can’t retain any type of personal information for that corporate or for their clients. And if that service is breached, then you have to provide notification to your clients that you have been breached, and you have to meet certain state requirements in that responsibility. You can be held for ransom. They will hold your personal information for ransom. And these are third parties that hack into your computer system.

Susan Gravely: [00:35:46] And so, that’s why cyber liability is such a hot topic now because these corporations, we all do business through the internet. We all do business with computers. We all have smartphones. All of those things can be breached. And if they are breached, then personal information that you have on that website, or on that server, or on that smartphone can be used against you or can be used against the client.

Lee Kantor: [00:36:16] So, then, you have to have the appropriate insurance to protect yourself from that.

Susan Gravely: [00:36:19] Exactly, exactly.

Lee Kantor: [00:36:20] Now, what about in health care? I would imagine there is a lot of regulations because aren’t the HIPAA laws such that third parties have to-

Susan Gravely: [00:36:29] Exactly.

Lee Kantor: [00:36:30] … do a lot of stuff-

Susan Gravely: [00:36:30] That is so true. Medical providers are the ones that have the most stringent HIPAA laws. And they have to protect the privacy of that patient, of that client going forward. And it can be thousands and thousands of private information that’s kept on their server or in the cloud that can be breached. And yes, most health care providers, most doctor offices, I mean, it can go down the line.

Susan Gravely: [00:37:03] I’ll give you a great example. During the Christmas holidays, I have a health spending account, and my health spending account was used for my doctor’s visit in November. Well, I just happened to look on my smartphone. I was checking my email on December the 25th, believe it or not. And I had eight emails saying, “Thank you from PayPal. $80 has been taken out of your health savings account.” And I’m like, “I haven’t spent any money. I haven’t gone anywhere.”

Lee Kantor: [00:37:41] That’s weird.

Susan Gravely: [00:37:41] And oh, by the way, it was nail salons and clothing stores.

Roz Lewis: [00:37:44] Wow!

Lee Kantor: [00:37:44] Not exactly heath savings.

Susan Gravely: [00:37:45] Which is not health savings account. So, I immediately go to my bank, I tell them what happened, and the money was put back in my account, but my account was breached, and it was breached from my doctor’s office in November.

Lee Kantor: [00:38:01] And it may not have been the doctor. It could have been a third party that worked with the doctor.

Susan Gravely: [00:38:05] It could have been the third party. It could have been someone who hacked into their system. And so, I notified my doctor. I notified their office. They went and had to notify all of their patients.

Lee Kantor: [00:38:18] Right.

Roz Lewis: [00:38:18] So, when you look at time and effort to recoup all of this, how economical is this to have this insurance?

Susan Gravely: [00:38:27] The insurance cost compared to the exposure is minimal. And I’ll give you a great example. I have a client that we just secured a cyber liability policy for, and it’s three different companies, and it’s a temporary agency. They provide staffing for medical doctors offices and hospitals, general white collar corporate and employees and security. And they just secured a $5 million limit for $7500 a year.

Lee Kantor: [00:39:03] Wow!

Susan Gravely: [00:39:03] That’s unbelievable. And it had alternative coverages that were listed below there that the client hadn’t even really thought about. So, it’s a comprehensive program and the cost, fortunately, for the consumer right now, the cost is not caught up with what is actually going to be the exposure in the long term because everybody needs it. Five years from now, we’re going to see probably … the next three to five years, we’re going to see a big jump in cyber liability premiums because the losses are going to catch up with what people are paying in premium.

Roz Lewis: [00:39:41] Wow!

Susan Gravely: [00:39:41] So, right now, now’s the time to buy it, to get in on the ground floor, so that your costs are not going to be jumped up over a period of time. But if you wait three or five years from now, you may not be able to afford it.

Lee Kantor: [00:39:57] Exactly.

Susan Gravely: [00:39:57] Exactly. So, it’s a process.

Lee Kantor: [00:40:01] Now, any counsel for that new business? Like, what are kind of the basic insurance that they should be looking at?

Susan Gravely: [00:40:09] It really depends on the exposure and what their scope of operations is. And we’ll just take a main street business. A retail business would need coverage for their inventory and their property. They would need general liability coverage, which gives you coverage for bodily injury and property damage to a third party that comes on your premises, or you go to their premises. If they have a commercial auto that they use in the business, you would take commercial auto coverage to cover that exposure. And so, a regular, a main street business that’s just starting out. Those are probably the basics.

Susan Gravely: [00:40:49] Workers compensation, if you have two or more full-time or part-time employees, in the State of Georgia, you are required to carry worker’s compensation insurance. And if you don’t, and you have more of those employees, and someone is injured on the job, you’re responsible for their injury, and you can be fined up to $10,000 for not caring it. And that’s something that’s not really out there or advertised, but it is a state law. I mean, it’s part of what Georgia requires.

Lee Kantor: [00:41:17] What about service companies? Are there any insurance that they should be carrying?

Susan Gravely: [00:41:21] Yes. Service companies are a little bit different in the fact that if you are providing a service, you’re providing something that’s almost intangible. It’s based on your performance. It’s based on the services you provide. In that instance, you would need to carry professional liability coverage. And that professional liability coverage gives you coverage for that entity if that client that you are servicing suffers a financial loss because of something you did as a service.

Roz Lewis: [00:41:54] Is that like errors and omissions?

Susan Gravely: [00:41:54] It’s exactly like errors and omissions. Those two or simultaneous, professional liability and errors and omissions are one and the same.

Roz Lewis: [00:42:03] Okay. But explain a little bit more about why I, as a service business, should have errors and omission.

Susan Gravely: [00:42:12] Okay.

Roz Lewis: [00:42:14] And the difference between the two.

Susan Gravely: [00:42:15] Okay.

Roz Lewis: [00:42:16] If there is a slight difference.

Susan Gravely: [00:42:17] There really isn’t. Errors and omissions and professional liability really go hand in hand. You can call six one half does the other basically. But what you are looking at protecting is the service you provide to that third party. And let’s just take, for instance, a design firm, okay? A design firm provides you with a service. They provide you with a product as well. But say, for instance, that design firm goes out, and they make a drawing of your facility. They say, “This this is where we want the exits to be. This is where we want the restrooms to be. This is where we want. This is how we’re going to decorate. This is the color scheme we’re gonna use,” et cetera, et cetera.

Susan Gravely: [00:43:01] Well, they put all this together, and we find out at a later date or after it’s done that, “Oh, my goodness, we forgot to take into account the ADA Act.” And so, instead of having a handicapped bathroom, we don’t have a handicapped bathroom. And that particular client has suffered a financial loss because they have to bring it up to code. And if that’s not done, then the design firm that designed it in the first place should know that because they are servicing that client. So, it would go back to that design firm and their professional ability to pay that financial loss.

Lee Kantor: [00:43:37] Because they should have known.

Susan Gravely: [00:43:38] They should known, exactly.

Lee Kantor: [00:43:38] Right. And that’s why you were contracting them, because they were supposed to be experts.

Susan Gravely: [00:43:42] Exactly. That’s why you contract. They are experts in their industry and they should know that.

Lee Kantor: [00:43:48] Now, we’re talking about things that are mistakes and things like that. Is there any insurance for like kind of acts of God, like the power goes out, no fault of anybody, and that’s disrupting business? Is there any for that?

Susan Gravely: [00:44:03] Oh, yes, absolutely. And that insurance, some policies do you have a power failure. And so, say, for instance, we have a power outage here during this, and it’s caused by a tree coming down.

Lee Kantor: [00:44:18] Right, like we’re doing work. Right, they’re doing work.

Susan Gravely: [00:44:20] A work down the street, exactly. So, that power interruption comes about. We’re off the air. And then, basically, we’re looking at a tree down over here, and it’s blown over-

Lee Kantor: [00:44:31] And it’s like no fault of anybody.

Susan Gravely: [00:44:31] But it’s blown over and it causes an immediate accident here, then there’s coverage for that under your property policy, under the policy that is provided for your property coverage. And it’s usually a sub limit. I have restaurants that have the power outage coverage because they can’t afford to have a power outage for more than 10 hours or five hours because they have food in the freezer that’s going to go bad. So, that’s a huge exposure. And they will have that, and they may increase that limit. You can buy it in increments of $1000, or $5000, or $10,000, or whatever you think is adequate to cover your inventory or to cover your loss.

Roz Lewis: [00:45:18] But for startups, do you think startups should have this insurance?

Susan Gravely: [00:45:23] Absolutely. And the reason I say that is because you don’t know if you are going to see a client, and you don’t have that coverage in place, you don’t have that general liability coverage in place, and you caused bodily injury or property damage to that client that you’re going to see, they are out of whatever bodily injury and/or property damage, they’re out of pocket. Your insurance should pay for that. And basically, that’s what they’re looking for. And it also lends credibility to the business that you have. You can walk in and say, “I can do this for you. I’m an expert in this field. This, here is my insurance information to tell you that I have already done my due diligence. I’m going to have an adequate insurance program that’s going to cover my exposure, as well as your exposure,” if that situation comes up.

Roz Lewis: [00:46:30] So, we’ve talked about cyber security. Let’s talk about the equipment and how important it is to cover any of the equipment that you have and how, sometimes, especially for startups, they think, “You know what, my budget is already tight, and I’m going to just wing it. I’m just going to take a risk on the fact that this is going to be okay,” where should this not be the number one insurance that they look for coverage on?

Susan Gravely: [00:47:03] It really should. And the reason being … and I spoke with a young lady this week who said, “I did not get the insurance program that you talked to me about a year ago. And guess what happened? I had all of my equipment stolen out of my car.” “I’m so sorry.” That was my first response. “I’m so sorry. but I tried to tell you.” And now, she’s come back to me and said, “I’ve learned the hard way. I know I need to do this. Can you help me?” And I said, ‘Absolutely. I’ll be happy to help you.” But it is very important. You don’t think it’s ever going to happen to you until it does happen to you. And then, it’s too late.

Lee Kantor: [00:47:43] Right. Now, what’s the process? Like you’re a business owner. Like how early in the process should you be talking to your insurance person? Is this an annual call, like you update what’s happening? Like what’s a good insurance company that … what’s the rhythm of kind of communicating with their clients to make sure they’re protected because changes, it’s very fluid?

Susan Gravely: [00:48:05] Absolutely.

Lee Kantor: [00:48:06] Things are always going on.

Susan Gravely: [00:48:07] Absolutely. One of the things that I do in my practice is I touch base with my clients, at least, 90 days prior to their renewal date. And we have that conversation. They get a summary of insurance from me of any changes that we’ve made during the policy term. And I go to them and say, “These are the things that we need to be looking at. What has changed in your scope of operations? What do I need to do for you? What is your payroll look like? What’s your revenue looking like?”

Susan Gravely: [00:48:36] And I’ll be honest with you, the past two years, every single account that I have worked on, every single client I’ve met with is having a huge, huge success in their business. So, their revenues are going up. Their payroll is going up to meet the needs of that product and service that they’re providing. They are expanding their business. And so, my job as their insurance agent and their insurance consultant is to make sure that we are addressing those needs as they come up. And so, that’s my job is to meet with them, at least, 90 days prior to the renewal date. And then, I touch base with them. Usually, most of my clients here for me at least once a month.

Lee Kantor: [00:49:20] And then, part of your job also is kind of being up to date of any changes like in regulation, or laws, or something that they may not be aware of that could be impacting them, right?

Susan Gravely: [00:49:31] Exactly. I mean, I’m constantly reading periodicals. I’m constantly going to … I go to an insurance class every year. We are constantly looking at what is going on out there in the workplace, what is going on out there in the business workplace. And I learn a lot from working with these women-owned businesses that work with these corporates because these corporates are also at the forefront of what is changing in the industry. And so, we have to meet those needs as they come up as well. So, yes, it’s a learning curve. Every single day, I’m reading some periodical, some information, something that has changed in the State of Georgia or whatever state that particular client is doing business in. So, it’s part of my job is to do that.

Lee Kantor: [00:50:17] Now, for the woman that starting out, and their budget is limited, and they’re saying, “Okay, I’m going to not address insurance on day one,” which I am sure it happens, but at some point they’re ready to have this conversation. That initial conversation with you or an insurance professional, is that something that’s very costly, like just a lay of the land to learn how this works because they might be surprised it isn’t as expensive as they made anticipate it be?

Susan Gravely: [00:50:48] Exactly. And a lot of times, I think they hear from … if they’re looking at getting that corporate contract, and they’re looking at doing business with the big guy, so to speak, you don’t always have to provide all of the insurance requirements that that particular contract is requiring because I have gone through contracts before with a client that is providing a product, but they don’t need professional liability insurance because they are selling a product.

Roz Lewis: [00:51:20] Right. That’s on the scope of their work, right?

Susan Gravely: [00:51:22] Right, exactly. So, we look at it or I look at it, look at that contract, and I say, “These are the things that we can go back to that corporate and negotiate.” And you tell them, “This is what…” They give you a contract, and it is a carte blanche. I mean, it’s [crosstalk].

Lee Kantor: [00:51:38] Right, it’s [crosstalk].

Susan Gravely: [00:51:38] That’s right.

Lee Kantor: [00:51:38] Right, exactly.

Susan Gravely: [00:51:38] And what you have to do is tailor it to what you are providing.

Lee Kantor: [00:51:45] Right.

Susan Gravely: [00:51:45] And that’s where I come in as well. And you’d be surprised. You can get a business owner’s package policy, which would include property, and general ability, and typically hard and unknown for $350 a year, depending on where you’re located, and what you’re doing. So-

Roz Lewis: [00:52:04] Can you repeat that. How much?

Susan Gravely: [00:52:06] $350 is the minimum premium.

Roz Lewis: [00:52:10] Wow. Hopefully you all are listening.

Lee Kantor: [00:52:11] Right? Because, I mean, people don’t know. They just imagine this is some huge number. They’re like, “I’m not going to deal with this.” One that’s so minimal-

Susan Gravely: [00:52:18] Exactly.

Lee Kantor: [00:52:20] … it’s like silly not to have it.

Susan Gravely: [00:52:22] And if you start with that minimum premium, as you grow your business, yes, your premium is going to grow because your exposure grows. And so, you have to look-

Roz Lewis: [00:52:31] And so is the revenue and the income.

Susan Gravely: [00:52:31] And so is the revenue and the income. So, it is all relative. It all works the same way.

Lee Kantor: [00:52:37] So, now, how much is that initial consultation just to find out what’s what?

Susan Gravely: [00:52:42] I don’t charge anything.

Roz Lewis: [00:52:44] So, now, you’re saying that you don’t charge anything. I’m hearing $350 to have pretty much general coverage that you need.

Susan Gravely: [00:52:55] Right.

Roz Lewis: [00:52:55] If you break that down, that’s equals to what? Let’s do the math. $30 dollars a month, if that?

Susan Gravely: [00:53:04] Exactly.

Lee Kantor: [00:53:05] Like a movie for two people?

Roz Lewis: [00:53:07] Yes. Actually, a movie costs more.

Susan Gravely: [00:53:08] Oh, no, no, no, no. No, you can’t.

Roz Lewis: [00:53:09] You can’t go to the movies.

Susan Gravely: [00:53:11] No, you cannot-

Roz Lewis: [00:53:11] It’s not $30 anymore.

Susan Gravely: [00:53:11] You might get the popcorn and the cup for 30.

Roz Lewis: [00:53:15] Yes.

Lee Kantor: [00:53:17] Yeah. So, that’s kind of a no brainer there. So, if somebody wanted to learn more and have a more substantive conversation with you, is there a website?

Susan Gravely: [00:53:24] Absolutely. www.gravelyandassociates.com.

Lee Kantor: [00:53:32] Now, before we wrap this segment, Susan, can you talk about your relationship with GWBC? Like how that’s impacting your business?

Susan Gravely: [00:53:39] I love this organization. They have really been just incredible. I have made so many wonderful friends and not only business associates, but just lifelong friends. And if you get involved in this organization, the return on investment is tenfold. It is absolutely incredible. Roz Lewis does a fantastic job. Her support team does a fantastic job. I’m involved in several committees, and I absolutely love it. It’s a highlight of my day.

Susan Gravely: [00:54:16] And you’re talking about getting up in the morning and what your purpose in life is, I have found my purpose in life, and it’s working with women-owned businesses. They truly appreciate what you do for them. And I’m not knocking men. I love men. But working with women, they appreciate what you put into it, and they take your advice, and they look to you. And it’s not just a business associate or business association, it is a friendship too. And I count myself very fortunate, very blessed to be a part of this organization.

Lee Kantor: [00:54:54] And now, any advice for the woman who isn’t yet involved with GWBC?

Susan Gravely: [00:54:58] Please, please, please go to the website, get involved. We’re doing a function every month, some type of networking function every month for women-owned businesses. The certification process, once you’re through it, it’s very easy to renew every year. We are very hands-on organization. We have a working board, and they work, and we have volunteers that work within the organization. And we have a great time. We have a ball. We have a great time.

Roz Lewis: [00:55:37] And then, you can be recognized as volunteer of the year, such as Susan Gravely has been recognized as one of our volunteers of the year.

Susan Gravely: [00:55:44] How nice of you to bring that up.

Lee Kantor: [00:55:45] But the only way you’re going to get that though is, like Susan said, you have to-

Roz Lewis: [00:55:49] You got to show up

Lee Kantor: [00:55:49] You have to get involved. This isn’t something-

Susan Gravely: [00:55:53] Exactly.

Lee Kantor: [00:55:53] … that you just pay a fee, and then-

Susan Gravely: [00:55:54] No, you have to get involved.

Lee Kantor: [00:55:54] … magically business comes your way.

Roz Lewis: [00:55:56] Exactly.

Susan Gravely: [00:55:56] It’s just like a gym membership.

Roz Lewis: [00:55:58] Exactly/

Susan Gravely: [00:55:58] That’s what we like to say.

Lee Kantor: [00:56:00] Right.

Roz Lewis: [00:56:00] Exactly. If you want to grow up, you got to show up.

Susan Gravely: [00:56:04] That’s right.

Lee Kantor: [00:56:05] So, now, Roz, great episode. Is there anything, any events coming up to remind the listener about?

Roz Lewis: [00:56:11] Well, as I mentioned today, we do have an event that’s momentarily starting. It’s our Tables of Eight. We also have additional events, our Top Corporations Luncheon is going to be on April 27th. So, we encourage you to visit our website for other events that not only that GWBC organically creates, but also that we partner with other organizations that you may already be involved with that allows you to, once again, get your name out there. People need to know and understand what you do, how you do it, and more importantly, how you can solve their problems or provide a solution. You want to stay top of mind. There are 9 … no, there are 12 billion women businesses in this country. So, keep that in mind. There’s a lot of competition.

Lee Kantor: [00:57:09] Well, this is your edge. GWBC is your edge.

Roz Lewis: [00:57:12] Exactly. So, we encourage you to get engaged, get involved, volunteer.

Susan Gravely: [00:57:18] Absolutely.

Roz Lewis: [00:57:18] And not only just volunteer within our organization, but volunteer with organizations like the American Heart Association because you never know who your revenue elbows with. It could be the vice president or the chief procurement officer of that corporation-.

Susan Gravely: [00:57:35] That’s right.

Roz Lewis: [00:57:35] … that you are trying to get a contract with. So, those are relationship, relationship, relationship is key.

Lee Kantor: [00:57:43] And what about the corporates, like , why should they get involved with GWBC? What’s in it for them?

Roz Lewis: [00:57:49] Because we have the best repository of competitive women businesses in this country. Keep in mind that we can, now, say out of over a thousand certified women businesses that the majority of them are over $1 million in revenue. So, that’s exciting. And we want to encourage even more. We want to scale those that aren’t at a million yet to get there. So, we would love to say three-fourths of our constituency sits over a million dollars. That’s economic impact.

Lee Kantor: [00:58:27] Right. And that’s important to understand the context of that. That number is way above the norm.

Roz Lewis: [00:58:33] Way above the norm. You’re right. But I always leave you with a parting thought, right?

Lee Kantor: [00:58:38] Go for it.

Roz Lewis: [00:58:39] And so, keep in mind, yes, February is Heart Month, but it’s also Black History Month. And in that, I would like to quote Madam C.J. Walker. She was the first woman millionaire, African-American millionaire. And her quote is, “I had to make my own living and my own opportunity.” And she was very successful in making those opportunities that, today, we still reap the benefits of.

Lee Kantor: [00:59:10] That’s great advice. Choose yourself. Make it happen.

Roz Lewis: [00:59:13] Yes.

Lee Kantor: [00:59:14] Well, Roz, thank you so much for open this episode together. And thank you to both of our guests today.

Roz Lewis: [00:59:19] Yes. We want to thank Susan and Kimberly.

Kimberly Wright: [00:59:22] this was great.

Lee Kantor: [00:59:23] All right. This is Lee Kantor for Roz Lewis. We will see you all next time on GWBC Radio.

 

About Your Host

Roz-Lewis-GWBCRoz Lewis is President & CEO – Greater Women’s Business Council (GWBC®), a regional partner organization of the Women’s Business Enterprise National Council (WBENC) and a member of the WBENC Board of Directors.

Previous career roles at Delta Air Lines included Flight Attendant, In-Flight Supervisor and Program Manager, Corporate Supplier Diversity.

During her career she has received numerous awards and accolades. Most notable: Atlanta Business Chronicle’s 2018 Diversity & Inclusion award; 2017 inducted into the WBE Hall of Fame by the American Institute of Diversity and Commerce and 2010 – Women Out Front Award from Georgia Tech University.

She has written and been featured in articles on GWBC® and supplier diversity for Forbes Magazine SE, Minority Business Enterprise, The Atlanta Tribune, WE- USA, Minorities and Women in Business magazines. Her quotes are published in The Girls Guide to Building a Million Dollar Business book by Susan Wilson Solovic and Guide Coaching by Ellen M. Dotts, Monique A. Honaman and Stacy L. Sollenberger. Recently, she appeared on Atlanta Business Chronicle’s BIZ on 11Alive, WXIA to talk about the importance of mentoring for women.

In 2010, Lewis was invited to the White House for Council on Women and Girls Entrepreneur Conference for the announcement of the Small Business Administration (SBA) new Women Owned Small Business Rule approved by Congress. In 2014, she was invited to the White House to participate in sessions on small business priorities and the Affordable Care Act.

Roz Lewis received her BS degree from Florida International University, Miami, FL and has the following training/certifications: Certified Purchasing Managers (CPM); Certified Professional in Supplier Diversity (CPSD), Institute for Supply Management (ISM)of Supplier Diversity and Procurement: Diversity Leadership Academy of Atlanta (DLAA), Negotiations, Supply Management Strategies and Analytical Purchasing.

Connect with Roz on LinkedIn.

About GWBC

The Greater Women’s Business Council (GWBC®) is at the forefront of redefining women business enterprises (WBEs). An increasing focus on supplier diversity means major corporations are viewing our WBEs as innovative, flexible and competitive solutions. The number of women-owned businesses is rising to reflect an increasingly diverse consumer base of women making a majority of buying decision for herself, her family and her business. GWBC-Logo

GWBC® has partnered with dozens of major companies who are committed to providing a sustainable foundation through our guiding principles to bring education, training and the standardization of national certification to women businesses in Georgia, North Carolina and South Carolina.

Tagged With: Gravely and Associates, Metro Atlanta’s American Heart Association

Decision Vision Episode 51: Should Married Couples Be in Business Together? – An Interview with Carol and Steve Docalavich, yourLTL

February 13, 2020 by John Ray

yourLTL
Decision Vision
Decision Vision Episode 51: Should Married Couples Be in Business Together? - An Interview with Carol and Steve Docalavich, yourLTL
Loading
00:00 /
RSS Feed
Share
Link
Embed

Download file

Carol and Steve Docalavich, yourLTL

Decision Vision Episode 51:  Should Married Couples Be in Business Together? – An Interview with Carol and Steve Docalavich, yourLTL

On this special Valentine’s Day edition of “Decision Vision,” Carol and Steve Docalavich of yourLTL share their journey as a married couple in business together. It’s a great episode with lots of laughs and wisdom. The host of “Decision Vision” is Mike Blake and the show series is presented by Brady Ware & Company.

Carol and Steve Docalavich, yourLTL

yourLTL
Steve and Carol Docalavich

Carol and Steve Docalavich are Co-Founders of yourLTL.

yourLTL is a completely transparent freight intelligence solution, providing direct relationships with carriers supported by our expertise in rate negotiations and proprietary cloud-based transportation management solution (TMS). They provide the most advanced TMS available, to not only find and compare carrier rates for LTL shipments, but they also allow customer specific pricing for the freight needs of their clients, not just transactional rates. There is no contracts or extra fees. They guarantee Fairness & Accountability in Rates (F.A.I.R.). It’s straight forward and transparent!

Their scalable technology helps simplify the life-cycle of the shipping process allowing multiple departments to access the same shipment from the yourLTL platform regardless of the size of your business. Their simple-to-understand user interface make it easy to find, book, and track shipments in only a few clicks.

yourLTL is a certified woman-owned and controlled business.

For more information on yourLTL, you can find their website here.

yourLTL

Michael Blake, Brady Ware & Company

Mike Blake, Host of “Decision Vision”

Michael Blake is Host of the “Decision Vision” podcast series and a Director of Brady Ware & Company. Mike specializes in the valuation of intellectual property-driven firms, such as software firms, aerospace firms and professional services firms, most frequently in the capacity as a transaction advisor, helping clients obtain great outcomes from complex transaction opportunities. He is also a specialist in the appraisal of intellectual properties as stand-alone assets, such as software, trade secrets, and patents.

Mike has been a full-time business appraiser for 13 years with public accounting firms, boutique business appraisal firms, and an owner of his own firm. Prior to that, he spent 8 years in venture capital and investment banking, including transactions in the U.S., Israel, Russia, Ukraine, and Belarus.

Brady Ware & Company

Brady Ware & Company is a regional full-service accounting and advisory firm which helps businesses and entrepreneurs make visions a reality. Brady Ware services clients nationally from its offices in Alpharetta, GA; Columbus and Dayton, OH; and Richmond, IN. The firm is growth minded, committed to the regions in which they operate, and most importantly, they make significant investments in their people and service offerings to meet the changing financial needs of those they are privileged to serve. The firm is dedicated to providing results that make a difference for its clients.

Decision Vision Podcast Series

“Decision Vision” is a podcast covering topics and issues facing small business owners and connecting them with solutions from leading experts. This series is presented by Brady Ware & Company. If you are a decision maker for a small business, we’d love to hear from you. Contact us at decisionvision@bradyware.com and make sure to listen to every Thursday to the “Decision Vision” podcast. Past episodes of “Decision Vision” can be found here. “Decision Vision” is produced and broadcast by the North Fulton studio of Business RadioX®.

Visit Brady Ware & Company on social media:

LinkedIn:  https://www.linkedin.com/company/brady-ware/

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/bradywareCPAs/

Twitter: https://twitter.com/BradyWare

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/bradywarecompany/

Show Transcript

Intro: [00:00:01] Welcome to Decision Vision, a podcast series focusing on critical business decisions brought to you by Brady Ware & Company. Brady Ware is a regional full-service accounting and advisory firm that helps businesses and entrepreneurs make visions a reality.

Mike Blake: [00:00:20] And welcome to Decision Vision, a podcast giving you, the listener, a clear vision to make great decisions. In each episode, we discuss the process of decision making on a different topic from the business owners or executives’ perspective. We aren’t necessarily telling you what to do, but we can put you in a position to make an informed decision on your own and understand when you might need help along the way.

Mike Blake: [00:00:39] My name is Mike Blake and I’m your host for today’s program. I’m a director at Brady Ware & Company, a full-service accounting firm based in Dayton, Ohio, with offices in Dayton, Columbus, Ohio, Richmond, Indiana, and Alpharetta, Georgia, which is where we are recording today. Brady Ware is sponsoring this podcast. If you like this podcast, please subscribe on your favorite podcast aggregator and please consider leaving a review of the podcast, as well.

Mike Blake: [00:01:02] So, the topic that we’re going to do today, and if all goes well, this is going to be released right before or on Valentine’s Day, is couples that going to business together. And I find this an interesting topic. And as it happens, my wife actually came in earlier today to do another interview on selling over Amazon as a retail channel, where, you know, she’s very good at that and I know nothing. But, you know, early in our married life, every time that we tried to have our business lives intersect with one another, it was usually ending up with one of us doing an internet search for divorce attorney.

Mike Blake: [00:01:02] It did not work particularly well. And we both recognized that and we tried to stay away from that. Over time, it’s gotten a little bit better. She’s like, “Yeah, now, you can ask me about how the business is going if you want.” That’s about it. And you probably won’t have to sleep on the couch. And I’ll kind of be on the same way. You can ask me about the business if you want and I may or may not decide to sleep on the couch. So, I have admiration for people who are able to do that.

Mike Blake: [00:02:15] It doesn’t mean that I think our marriage is bad, we’re 20 years together and she hasn’t thrown me out yet. And every day I go home and the key works as a blessing for me. But I do think that I’ve noticed there are couples that have that capacity to work together. And I know that I’m not the only person that’s curious about that, especially in today’s world where, you know, the nature of jobs is different and people going into business for themselves, it’s really never been easier.

Mike Blake: [00:02:44] I think we’re seeing that, you know, more and more and more. But how do you manage the dynamic of a romantic relationship being intertwined with a business relationship? So, as I said, this is not something that I am, at all, an expert on, except that I know that for my personality type, we’re staying away from that. So, we’ve brought in people who can talk about that with us because they appear to have been doing it successfully. And if not, maybe there’ll be some radio drama instead.

Mike Blake: [00:03:13] So, either way, this is going to be a win for the listener. Joining us are Carol and Steve Docalavich, who are co-founders of yourLTL, LTL or less than truckload software platform that provides a visual dashboard of shipping cost allocations, load manifests, shipment tracking, and discrepancy alerts. yourLTL is cloud-based and is continuously enhanced to improve the customer experience dedicated to simplicity and return investment for your less than truckload shipping. They’re also co-founders of Vestra Logistics, a freight brokerage company.

Mike Blake: [00:03:47] And both firms are located just down the road here in Alpharetta. And they also do some real estate management and investing together. Carol, in particular, is a serial entrepreneur, having launched several businesses in coffee, tea import/export, franchise advisory, property management. And Steve comes from a background of having been an air traffic controller for 23 years. So, thank you for making sure I landed safely all those times.

Steve Docalavich: [00:04:12] You’re welcome, Mike.

Mike Blake: [00:04:13] Carol and Steve, thanks for coming on the program.

Carol Docalavich: [00:04:16] Yeah, thanks, Mike.

Mike Blake: [00:04:17] So, how long have you been married and how long you’ve been in business together?

Steve Docalavich: [00:04:23] Eight years on the 14th. Eight years on the 14th.

Mike Blake: [00:04:27] Of this month?

Steve Docalavich: [00:04:29] Yeah.

Carol Docalavich: [00:04:29] Yeah.

Mike Blake: [00:04:29] Well, congratulations. That’s great.

Carol Docalavich: [00:04:32] Yeah.

Mike Blake: [00:04:32] And so, I mean, which came first?

Carol Docalavich: [00:04:37] Match.

Steve Docalavich: [00:04:38] Yeah. So-

Carol Docalavich: [00:04:39] match.com.

Mike Blake: [00:04:40] No kidding?

Steve Docalavich: [00:04:40] Yeah. That’s because Tinder wasn’t around at the time.

Mike Blake: [00:04:45] Well, you know, timing is everything, right?

Steve Docalavich: [00:04:47] Yes, that’s right.

Mike Blake: [00:04:47] So, you found each other on Match. And at that point, did you start to realize that both of you kind of had an entrepreneurial bat that you needed to be, wanted to be in business for yourselves or-

Steve Docalavich: [00:05:00] No.

Mike Blake: [00:05:00] So, how did that evolve?

Steve Docalavich: [00:05:03] Not at all. She was already in business for herself. Actually, we had met. I was an air traffic controller in California and we didn’t meet, meet, but we met only through one of her businesses. I moved from California to Washington Center, which is in Northern Virginia. And when I moved, the FAA moved me and the movers broke or scratched every piece of furniture I had. And so, I called the moving company and I said, “Hey, what I do about this?” Said, “Don’t worry about it, we’re going to send over a van.” This guy, he’s magical. So, they sent over a van and it was called Furniture Medic. I didn’t know what that was. Well, he came in, an hour later, everything was perfect. I was like, “This is amazing.” I never forgot about it, because that was in 1996, I met her in 2012, and she is the founder of Furniture Medic.

Mike Blake: [00:05:55] Oh, no kidding?

Steve Docalavich: [00:05:56] Yeah.

Carol Docalavich: [00:05:57] Yeah.

Mike Blake: [00:05:57] So, how did you get to meet the owner then? I mean, were you such a pain in the ass-

Steve Docalavich: [00:06:02] No, no, no.

Mike Blake: [00:06:02] … that you basically said, “I want to speak to the owner, this is unacceptable.”

Steve Docalavich: [00:06:05] What I’m saying is I surreptitiously, I figuratively met her through her business.

Mike Blake: [00:06:11] Okay.

Steve Docalavich: [00:06:11] And then, in 2012, we actually were out on a date. So-

Carol Docalavich: [00:06:16] Now, we sold that business to—I’m trying to think which company that was with Landmark—but no, Service Master is who actually bought that business. And so, that was much before his time. So-

Steve Docalavich: [00:06:32] Yes, I was controlling airplanes, I was making sure you’re safe, Mike.

Carol Docalavich: [00:06:35] Yeah.

Mike Blake: [00:06:35] Thank you for that.

Steve Docalavich: [00:06:36] You’re welcome.

Carol Docalavich: [00:06:37] And a few businesses more a divorce. And then, we met on Match. You hate when I tell the story, but we actually met in June-

Mike Blake: [00:06:48] This is the internet.

Carol Docalavich: [00:06:49] … before we officially started dating in November. He sent a couple emails and apparently, I didn’t respond. So, I must not have been interested at the time. But now, we met in November just before Thanksgiving and we married six-and-a-half weeks later.

Steve Docalavich: [00:07:08] So, this is an example of how she has to win, Mike. So, she has to say, preemptively, that, “I ignored his e-mails before I acknowledged his e-mails.” So, that’s something.

Mike Blake: [00:07:20] But it certainly turned out all right. And a pretty quick turnaround, six-and-a-half weeks.

Carol Docalavich: [00:07:26] Yeah, six-and-a-half.

Mike Blake: [00:07:27] So, I guess as an entrepreneur, you’re just used to making important decisions fast.

Carol Docalavich: [00:07:30] That’s right. Absolutely.

Steve Docalavich: [00:07:32] And since I’m an air traffic controller, I just make bad decisions?

Mike Blake: [00:07:35] Well, if I’ve learned anything from pushing 10, you definitely to make decisions quickly, too, there, right? So-

Steve Docalavich: [00:07:41] Absolutely. Absolutely. And drink.

Carol Docalavich: [00:07:43] So, I was in the real estate business at the time just after the crash. And, you know, I’d been flipping homes and doing rental homes, about 30 or 40 a month at the time. And so, we got married and I said, “Look, you know, why don’t you join the company after you retire”, and, you know, that sort of thing. So, we kind of, you know, went down that path. And so, he started working with me when he could. You know, he’d not retired yet. So, he soft-stepped into it.

Steve Docalavich: [00:08:18] It just so happened, I lost my medical right around that time, so I had to retire. Either retired or got an office job, so I just said, “I’ll retire.” And then, I got an office job with her. So-

Mike Blake: [00:08:28] You lost your medical, meaning you lost your medical clearance to do that job?

Steve Docalavich: [00:08:31] Right. Right. Exactly.

Mike Blake: [00:08:31] Okay. I didn’t know that.

Steve Docalavich: [00:08:32] Yeah.

Mike Blake: [00:08:32] Okay.

Steve Docalavich: [00:08:32] That’s why I was only in there for 23 years instead of 30.

Mike Blake: [00:08:36] I figured you’re just burned out.

Steve Docalavich: [00:08:38] Yeah, I was burned at 15.

Mike Blake: [00:08:39] There’s got to be some burnout in that job.

Steve Docalavich: [00:08:40] I was burned out at 15. So-

Mike Blake: [00:08:43] And at that point, I mean, interestingly then, you didn’t have any hesitation about joining the business and basically being around involved with each other all the time, because not every married couple honestly wants or thrives doing that.

Steve Docalavich: [00:08:59] Well, I mean, it was new.

Mike Blake: [00:09:01] Yeah.

Steve Docalavich: [00:09:01] I didn’t know what that would be like. It seemed to me I want to spend all of the time with her, I could, so hey, why not? Let’s work together. And when we were doing this, there was a property management company in Atlanta that it was managing thousands of homes. They were doing it for one of these—I think it’s Blackstone.

Carol Docalavich: [00:09:26] No, they were doing it for—it was Key.

Steve Docalavich: [00:09:27] It was Key.

Carol Docalavich: [00:09:27] But they were at the time, and there’s still a lot of this around, but, you know, investment companies were selling properties to overseas investors. And so, they were managing these overseas investors and they got bought out, you’re right, by Blackstone.

Steve Docalavich: [00:09:43] Right.

Carol Docalavich: [00:09:44] So, all the ones that weren’t owned going to be owned by Blackstone, they said, you know, “Let’s go find other management.” So, we took over a chunk of about 300 houses at one time for this management.

Steve Docalavich: [00:10:00] And we didn’t even have a business at the time for managing that. We had to build one immediately to do it.

Carol Docalavich: [00:10:05] We did it in about two weeks.

Steve Docalavich: [00:10:07] Oh, my gosh. It was incredible. And I quit. I mean, that’s one of the businesses we did. And I said, “Look, I can’t. You and I can’t do this together”, because it was the most negative business I’ve ever seen.

Mike Blake: [00:10:20] Why? What about it is so negative?

Carol Docalavich: [00:10:23] Nobody’s happy. Owners aren’t happy. Renters aren’t happy.

Steve Docalavich: [00:10:26] Yeah. So, all the owners are international, right? So, everything that goes wrong, they’re mad about.

Mike Blake: [00:10:30] Yeah.

Steve Docalavich: [00:10:30] And the houses, you know, that these people were renting were, you know, they’d have problems and, you know, they were mad. So, it was—I think we built it to 500, 600 houses and sold it. I mean, she was already selling to all these international buyers anyway, so she had that relationship. So, we kind of sold that portion of the business and kept the houses.

Carol Docalavich: [00:10:53] Yeah, our houses.

Steve Docalavich: [00:10:54] Yeah, our houses.

Carol Docalavich: [00:10:54] Yeah, our houses.

Steve Docalavich: [00:10:55] Yeah.

Carol Docalavich: [00:10:55] And then, sold those off separately. Actually, the Blackstone was who bought our portfolio. So-

Steve Docalavich: [00:10:59] Thank you, Blackstone.

Carol Docalavich: [00:11:00] … he came back on board after that.

Steve Docalavich: [00:11:02] Yeah.

Carol Docalavich: [00:11:02] So, he retired for just a second.

Steve Docalavich: [00:11:04] Yeah. That was about it.

Mike Blake: [00:11:05] Like one of the Brett Favre retirements.

Steve Docalavich: [00:11:07] Yeah.

Carol Docalavich: [00:11:07] Yeah.

Steve Docalavich: [00:11:07] It was a month. And then, I went to the Eagles.

Mike Blake: [00:11:11] So, Steve, let me start with you then, because you’re transitioning from air traffic control, a government job, I guess, right? I think it’s all government-

Steve Docalavich: [00:11:21] It’s all government.

Mike Blake: [00:11:22] … jobs, right? And now, you’re going to be an entrepreneur in the real estate business.

Steve Docalavich: [00:11:28] Right.

Mike Blake: [00:11:28] Do you know anything about real estate? Were you any good at Monopoly, at least?

Steve Docalavich: [00:11:30] Define know anything. No.

Mike Blake: [00:11:33] Were you any good at Monopoly? Do you notice once they got the blue properties and-

Steve Docalavich: [00:11:36] Yeah, Park Place and Boardwalk.

Mike Blake: [00:11:37] Yeah.

Steve Docalavich: [00:11:37] Absolutely. It was easy. I mean, all you had to do was lean on her and she, you know, I went and got a cup of coffee for her every once in a while, and made some copies. And I came up, I’m an idea guy, Mike.

Mike Blake: [00:11:50] Okay. Yeah.

Steve Docalavich: [00:11:50] So, I get a lot of good ideas. I think today was an idea of mine. It was probably a mistake. But no, it’s easy when you get somebody who knows what they’re doing. So, she’s taught me a lot over the last eight years.

Mike Blake: [00:12:05] Now, how about you? You’ve got an independent streak to you, right?

Carol Docalavich: [00:12:10] Just a little.

Mike Blake: [00:12:11] Which is why you’ve been in business for yourself as long as I can kind of track your career, right?

Carol Docalavich: [00:12:17] Yeah.

Mike Blake: [00:12:17] And now, here comes this interloper-

Carol Docalavich: [00:12:18] Yeah.

Mike Blake: [00:12:18] … that’s going to come in and sort of share the wheel with you. Was that hard or is it scary maybe? Was there any concern about that or-

Carol Docalavich: [00:12:29] Yeah, I guess probably at first. You know, I figured if you can direct hundreds of airplanes at one time, you probably can handle pretty stressful situations with-

Mike Blake: [00:12:37] That’s fair.

Carol Docalavich: [00:12:39] You know? So, I figured the stress he could endure and the rest of it was just, you know, he’s a pretty intelligent guy. He likes to say, “I don’t know”, because then, that just gets you a lot to do and stuff, right? Like, you know, that’s your—

Mike Blake: [00:12:52] That’s my go-to, yeah.

Carol Docalavich: [00:12:52] … pat answer. Right. Exactly.

Mike Blake: [00:12:55] Yeah.

Carol Docalavich: [00:12:55] But no, he really caught on really quickly. And, you know, I used to say, “This is not a government job, you know, we like work really long hours and get paid for just a few of them.” So, unlike government, where, you know, they work 40 hours and step out. No, he was really game. And he does really good at letting me take the lead. He does really good with that.

Steve Docalavich: [00:13:20] Can I talk now?

Carol Docalavich: [00:13:21] Yeah, go.

Steve Docalavich: [00:13:21] Okay. So—

Mike Blake: [00:13:22] Speaking of which.

Steve Docalavich: [00:13:25] It’s called fake it until you make it, Mike, is what, you just look confident and stand in the corner. And then, she basically tells me what to do. But-

Carol Docalavich: [00:13:33] That’s so not true.

Steve Docalavich: [00:13:35] Well, I mean-

Carol Docalavich: [00:13:36] Not now.

Mike Blake: [00:13:38] Even to a certain extent, though, I mean, there was a learning process for you, right?

Steve Docalavich: [00:13:41] Oh, absolutely.

Mike Blake: [00:13:42] And not everybody can walk into that and be vulnerable and say, you know, “I don’t know. I don’t know what I’m doing.” And men have a harder time with that than women, I think.

Steve Docalavich: [00:13:52] I don’t have a problem with that. Actually, I’ve been doing that my whole career as an air traffic controller. But now, we would go out and we go look at houses and we purchase that, I go, you know, “I didn’t know what was good and what wasn’t good to buy.” So, it was an evolution there and it was fun. It wasn’t-

Carol Docalavich: [00:14:11] That business was really fun.

Steve Docalavich: [00:14:13] It was. It’s not technical, was not difficult, it’s simply, there’s a house, buy it, don’t buy it. Put somebody in it, flip it.

Carol Docalavich: [00:14:24] Yeah.

Steve Docalavich: [00:14:24] Yeah, that kind of thing. So, that was fun. I mean, what we’re doing now has been an absolute learning-

Carol Docalavich: [00:14:32] That’s been a learning curve for both of us, yeah.

Steve Docalavich: [00:14:33] Yeah, but it’s been fun.

Carol Docalavich: [00:14:35] Yeah.

Steve Docalavich: [00:14:36] It’s been fun, because it’s like it goes from one thing to another to another.

Carol Docalavich: [00:14:40] We’re never bored.

Steve Docalavich: [00:14:40] We’re never bored. We’re always together. And I talked about this with you last week, I think I said-

Carol Docalavich: [00:14:46] Before we knew about your questions.

Steve Docalavich: [00:14:49] Yeah. And I don’t even think about spending time other than playing golf.

Carol Docalavich: [00:14:55] Yeah.

Steve Docalavich: [00:14:55] I mean, I want her to play golf with me and she won’t, because she doesn’t want to embarrass herself.

Carol Docalavich: [00:14:58] I would not have time to learn.

Steve Docalavich: [00:14:59] Right. Well, exactly. But I mean, if she could go play golf with me, I’d love to take her playing golf. That’s what I think is, some people can do that, some people can’t. But, you know, she could be with me all the time as far as I’m concerned.

Mike Blake: [00:15:12] As an aside, I remember when my wife and I were in our 20s, she said, you know, “You really got to think about taking up golf, it would really help your career.” And I said, “Let’s watch a game of golf and see if you still think that”, right? And, you know, as you know, a game of golf is not like a game of darts, it’s not over in 20 minutes. It’s like, you know, a game of golf is an all-day event. And to be any good at it where it does help your career, because you’re shooting 298, that’s not going to help your career if every other ball is in the pond-

Carol Docalavich: [00:15:44] Sure.

Mike Blake: [00:15:44] … or hurt somebody. So, you know, “If you really want this, I’m out one day every weekend while it’s warm until I get sort of good.” She’s like, “Never mind, your career is just fine.”

Carol Docalavich: [00:15:59] Yeah, he does try to play just about every weekend. And so, we do have time apart then.

Mike Blake: [00:16:04] Yeah.

Carol Docalavich: [00:16:04] And, you know, I mean, we’re like most couples, we separate. You know, like I go read and he watches a foreign film or some, you know, documentary or-

Steve Docalavich: [00:16:12] We don’t sit in the same office anymore.

Carol Docalavich: [00:16:14] No, we don’t sit in the same. We did for a long time, though.

Steve Docalavich: [00:16:16] We did, yeah.

Carol Docalavich: [00:16:16] We sat in the same office.

Steve Docalavich: [00:16:18] And then, she let me have my own.

Carol Docalavich: [00:16:21] I didn’t have to listen to every conversation there.

Mike Blake: [00:16:26] Well, I’m curious, what was the dynamic that warranted you to have the same office? My wife and I share the same office at home, which means I’m normally out at Starbucks when she’s working. But what made you want to do that? And then, what changed that made you decide you didn’t want to do that anymore?

Steve Docalavich: [00:16:41] She’s on the phone constantly.

Mike Blake: [00:16:43] Yeah.

Carol Docalavich: [00:16:43] Yeah.

Steve Docalavich: [00:16:44] And I’m just getting up and leaving and finding another desk-

Mike Blake: [00:16:48] Right.

Steve Docalavich: [00:16:48] … with a computer and work from there. So, we had that.

Carol Docalavich: [00:16:51] That’s fair.

Steve Docalavich: [00:16:51] You know, she is never not on the phone and I’m never on the phone.

Carol Docalavich: [00:16:56] Yeah. Well, the first thing is when we started this business, you know, we just went into a space. We didn’t know what we needed yet. You know, we didn’t know what size. We didn’t know how many employees. We had no idea. And so, we just kind of rented a small space. And, you know, it was like, “Okay, we know we need accounting in one, you can lock that door”, you know, those sorts of things. “So, look, there’s one office left. Okay, we can put two desks in it, we can share it.”

Mike Blake: [00:17:22] Okay.

Carol Docalavich: [00:17:22] And I think was a good learning curve for you, too, to be able to hear a lot of that. And then, there are times that I have to kick him under the table, so there’s certain, you know-.

Steve Docalavich: [00:17:31] She’s done that twice already.

Carol Docalavich: [00:17:32] So, there’s certain conversations that I still have to say, you know, like there’s certain jokes or we’ll say, “No, he can’t go to that meeting.”

Steve Docalavich: [00:17:40] Okay. So-

Carol Docalavich: [00:17:41] Or, for sure-

Steve Docalavich: [00:17:41] … I don’t know.

Carol Docalavich: [00:17:43] No.

Steve Docalavich: [00:17:43] What?

Carol Docalavich: [00:17:43] You’re not going to tell that joke.

Steve Docalavich: [00:17:44] I’m not going to tell the joke, but I’ll give the—so anyway, no matter what, and this is strategic, so I don’t have to go to meetings, is there’s always a dead hooker joke-

Carol Docalavich: [00:17:55] Somewhere.

Steve Docalavich: [00:17:57] … somewhere in the meeting. And she’s like, “You can’t come.” “That’s okay. Great. That’s fine”, you know. But I’m not in sales. I’m not in sales, I’m more operational, I’m not marketing, I’m not into those things, I work with the people in the office more than I do people outside the office.

Mike Blake: [00:18:09] I don’t know how much mileage I can get by threatening to do a dead hooker joke.

Steve Docalavich: [00:18:12] It works.

Mike Blake: [00:18:13] I’m going to try that.

Carol Docalavich: [00:18:14] He actually almost went to jail over that, so there’s-

Mike Blake: [00:18:16] Really?

Carol Docalavich: [00:18:16] … real story there.

Steve Docalavich: [00:18:18] Yeah. Well, I was on the phone with an attorney a couple of months ago.

Carol Docalavich: [00:18:24] It’s true.

Steve Docalavich: [00:18:24] And he was talking about our terms and conditions and he was—

Carol Docalavich: [00:18:28] Really negotiating it.

Steve Docalavich: [00:18:30] Yeah. And he was talking about—I can’t remember what it was. So, I threw the dead hooker at him.

Mike Blake: [00:18:34] This is your attorney.

Steve Docalavich: [00:18:37] Right. I said, “Look, we don’t because-” No, it’s not my attorney. He was another company.

Carol Docalavich: [00:18:41] He was a client’s attorney.

Mike Blake: [00:18:43] The other side’s, okay.

Steve Docalavich: [00:18:43] That was doing our terms of conditions, they want to do business with us.

Mike Blake: [00:18:45] Okay.

Steve Docalavich: [00:18:45] But they had a problem with something in there saying, you know, the liability part. And I was like, “Look, it’s not like all these truckers have dead hookers in the back and they’re running in a busload of nuns. I said, we got that covered. We have insurance for that. You don’t have to worry about that.” And there was silence and our business partner, Chase, was jumping up and down, screaming silently at me, right?

Carol Docalavich: [00:19:07] So true.

Steve Docalavich: [00:19:07] Because he was mad. And then, the guy on the other end of the phone just started laughing.

Carol Docalavich: [00:19:11] It was one of those delayed like, you don’t know exactly what’s coming.

Mike Blake: [00:19:15] Right. Chirp, chirp, chirp.

Steve Docalavich: [00:19:15] I knew it was coming. I knew it was coming.

Carol Docalavich: [00:19:18] Yeah. So, there are-

Steve Docalavich: [00:19:18] I used to do it all the time.

Carol Docalavich: [00:19:20] … certain times he can’t get go to me.

Mike Blake: [00:19:23] So, I’ve observed two things about you guys, because, you know, we’re doing some things together a little bit. And one is that every time I’ve interacted with you as clients, you’re always together.

Carol Docalavich: [00:19:38] Yeah.

Mike Blake: [00:19:38] Which is interesting. Is that by design? Is that a business strategy or it’s because eight years later, you’re still newlyweds and you can’t get enough of each other? What is that?

Carol Docalavich: [00:19:49] I think it’s somewhat both. I mean, we even run errands together.

Steve Docalavich: [00:19:53] Yeah.

Carol Docalavich: [00:19:53] Yeah. And I think that’s why we married. So, to back up just a minute, when we got married, I mean, you know, when we said we were getting married, my family was like, “What the heck? Like you plan-” Everything’s a plan for me, like, you know, and they were like, “No, no. If you love him in a year, you know, we can, you know, hold off.” And, you know, I was like, “No, I know what I don’t want. And he’s none of those things.

Mike Blake: [00:20:18] Okay.

Carol Docalavich: [00:20:18] So I’m going to go for this.” You know, I was in my 40s, had been married 20-plus years the first time. So, you know, I was like, you know, “No, we’re going to do this.” But I think a lot of that has to do with we just enjoy each other’s company. Sometimes, he’ll go to work like this morning and it’s like, we didn’t do it today, but sometimes, he’ll leave and I won’t see him and we’ll end up in the same color, like we’re going to work and I’ll go, “Oh, my God. We both were blue. This is so stupid. How do we do this?” But yeah. I mean-

Mike Blake: [00:20:49] Oh, it means then there is an old name practice, right?

Carol Docalavich: [00:20:50] Yeah, exactly. I mean, we’re in sync sometimes just like that.

Steve Docalavich: [00:20:54] We look like old people-

Carol Docalavich: [00:20:56] Yeah, we do.

Steve Docalavich: [00:20:57] … with those. I remember seeing my grandparents in a picture one time, they’re both wear the same jacket with those barrel buttons.

Carol Docalavich: [00:21:03] No, we don’t do that.

Steve Docalavich: [00:21:04] No, I know, but I’m like, “How did they do that?” But I can see how it happens.

Carol Docalavich: [00:21:07] Yeah, I really can.

Mike Blake: [00:21:09] Now, the other thing I’ve noticed is you guys laugh a lot.

Carol Docalavich: [00:21:13] Yes. So-

Mike Blake: [00:21:13] And that’s not just an act, is it?

Carol Docalavich: [00:21:14] No. And that was probably, I would say, the first night that we had dinner together.

Steve Docalavich: [00:21:21] Whoa, whoa, whoa, where are you going with this?

Carol Docalavich: [00:21:22] Oh, stop it.

Mike Blake: [00:21:24] She said dinner.

Carol Docalavich: [00:21:25] First night we had dinner together-

Steve Docalavich: [00:21:27] Yeah.

Carol Docalavich: [00:21:28] … we laughed the entire—I mean, it was constant the whole two hours that we had dinner together.

Steve Docalavich: [00:21:35] I’m a funny guy.

Carol Docalavich: [00:21:36] That’s true.

Steve Docalavich: [00:21:37] Next question, Mike.

Carol Docalavich: [00:21:37] You won the lottery.

Mike Blake: [00:21:40] No. And I’m not trying to put anybody on the couch here, but that laughter, I think, is indicative of the kind of humor that you need to overcome the obstacle, right?

Carol Docalavich: [00:21:54] Yeah, absolutely.

Mike Blake: [00:21:54] Because not everything has gone exactly the way that you wanted it to in business, correct?

Carol Docalavich: [00:21:59] For sure, this last six years. But yeah. Yeah.

Mike Blake: [00:22:02] So talk about a crisis in business that you guys faced together.

Carol Docalavich: [00:22:09] Oh, God. Which one?

Mike Blake: [00:22:13] Well, you-

Carol Docalavich: [00:22:13] You want to pick a subject?

Steve Docalavich: [00:22:14] No.

Mike Blake: [00:22:15] I mean, the juicier, the better.

Carol Docalavich: [00:22:17] Yeah, I’m sure.

Mike Blake: [00:22:17] If there is a dead hooker involved, if you guys revisit that, go.

Steve Docalavich: [00:22:20] Well, Mike, I know I’ve told that joke to you in one of our meetings. I know for a fact-

Carol Docalavich: [00:22:24] Do not tell it.

Steve Docalavich: [00:22:25] I know, but I just know I told it to him and he’s acting like he’s so surprised, you never heard this before.

Carol Docalavich: [00:22:29] I’m sure you haven’t brought it up at Brady Ware.

Steve Docalavich: [00:22:30] Oh, my God. How many times have we had meetings?

Carol Docalavich: [00:22:34] Too many.

Mike Blake: [00:22:35] A lot.

Steve Docalavich: [00:22:36] We’ve had the same meeting 15 times, don’t tell me about it. I mean, because we come in there with same issue all the time.

Carol Docalavich: [00:22:42] Oh, God, so many crises. So, this has been the toughest business I’ve ever tried to learn to run.

Steve Docalavich: [00:22:49] Which one?

Carol Docalavich: [00:22:51] Being in transportation, period.

Mike Blake: [00:22:52] Okay.

Carol Docalavich: [00:22:53] You know, a lot of people that do this, they are brokers who worked for another broker who leave with a book of business. And pretty much even with my first husband, everything we did, we pretty much pioneered. They were, you know, new ideas or there wasn’t maybe just a couple of different companies doing it, but they were relatively pioneered industries. And so, this one, we were like, this one over here said, “Well, how hard could this be?” Yeah, famous last words.

Steve Docalavich: [00:23:21] I said that.

Carol Docalavich: [00:23:21] Yeah.

Mike Blake: [00:23:21] Right up there with, hold my beer, right?

Steve Docalavich: [00:23:23] Oh, yeah.

Carol Docalavich: [00:23:23] Yeah, exactly.

Steve Docalavich: [00:23:25] Absolutely.

Carol Docalavich: [00:23:25] So, I think, you know, very first load we moved on the truckload side was a $40,000 claim. You are not prepared for that. I mean, you have no idea. We had no idea what we were doing. And my mentor said, “Good god, girl, can’t you started A, B and C, did you have to jump all the way to S?” You know, I mean, we literally, immediately, our first official day of business. I mean, we kind of been doing it for like a month trying to build up to getting business. So, I mean, that was the first one. And that was a real crisis, because you don’t know if you’re on the hook for that. And we didn’t know, are we on the hook for the 40 grand or, you know-

Steve Docalavich: [00:24:01] I knew.

Carol Docalavich: [00:24:02] God. But you did. You stepped us through all that. You figured out-

Steve Docalavich: [00:24:09] It wasn’t very difficult. I mean, the-

Carol Docalavich: [00:24:10] At first.

Steve Docalavich: [00:24:10] … carriers, you know, they’re the primary behind that. And it turned out fine. But yeah, we’ve had plenty of times in these two businesses that something hits the fan or whatever and you just got to deal with it. It’s a lot easier. I mean, I lean on her a lot. And then, you know, I’m the strong, silent type, because I don’t have much smart to say. And, you know, she appreciates that. You know, “Wow, you just-”

Mike Blake: [00:24:39] That didn’t stop me.

Steve Docalavich: [00:24:41] No. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So, I mean, she’s like, “Wow, you’re just such a rock and I can count on you to be-“, you know. I’m like, “I’m not saying anything because I don’t know what to say.” But she’s great at handling that kind of stuff and she points in the right direction and, you know, we go that way. There are no bones about who is the brains in the family. And I don’t want to say short bus, but I’m on a bus going somewhere. But no, you know, going back to what we’re talking about here, I enjoy being around my wife. We’re best friends and I don’t think that that’s going to change anytime soon.

Carol Docalavich: [00:25:19] Yeah. And I mean, you know, anytime you start a business, I mean, you know, like at any time in whether you buy one, whether you started from scratch or, you know, whatever you do, you know, there’s small crises almost every day, right? So, we deal with a lot of that. But, you know, he plays that part really well. But, you know, he is the person I go to and say, “All right. Hear me out. What do you think?” You know, he calls them at 3:00 o’clock in the morning, like I’ll say, “Are you up?”

Steve Docalavich: [00:25:51] That’s exactly what it is.

Carol Docalavich: [00:25:51] I’ll say-

Steve Docalavich: [00:25:51] That’s exactly what it is.

Carol Docalavich: [00:25:54] “Go make the coffee.”

Mike Blake: [00:25:55] “Are you up?”

Carol Docalavich: [00:25:56] “Are you up? Go make the coffee.” And it’s usually somewhere between 2 and 3 o’clock in the morning. We’ve had lots of those. You know, as you talk yourself through this and what you’re going to do and directions and he’s an excellent sounding board. And I usually come away from those talks with feeling really confident about the decision we’re going make. So-

Mike Blake: [00:26:18] And I got to imagine that air traffic control, everything else just must sort of pale in comparison, right? It’s about working processes.

Steve Docalavich: [00:26:27] Yeah. But, you know, it’s something that—the thing about that is it’s not the same every day, but, you know, it’s proceduralized to a point and then, there’s weather and then, there’s bad rides and then, there’s 9/11, right? There’s something. But otherwise, 99% of the time, it’s pretty proceduralized. You got guys coming in from here, they’re going there. There’s a profile that you need to create in your mind to keep them away from these guys that are going here, landing there, right? So, basically, everybody who’s entering your airspace is separated before they get there, because you have a plan. Not so much in the business world. I mean, it changes every day. You can proceduralize anything you want, but you can’t stop the wind from blowing, right?

Mike Blake: [00:27:11] Yeah.

Steve Docalavich: [00:27:11] It just depends.

Carol Docalavich: [00:27:13] Especially transportation.

Steve Docalavich: [00:27:14] Yeah, especially transportation. It’s a-

Carol Docalavich: [00:27:15] I mean, it’s a combustible engine and a human being, you know. And I mean, we have little to-

Steve Docalavich: [00:27:22] Nothing could go wrong.

Carol Docalavich: [00:27:23] Yeah, nothing can go wrong. But, you know, I don’t know that there’s any one crisis that like jumps out. There’s just been, you know, you go left, you go right, you go left, you go right. You know, there isn’t really a day that I go home and go, “Oh, well, that was so smooth today.” And-

Steve Docalavich: [00:27:42] It’s all about the people you employ.

Carol Docalavich: [00:27:44] Yeah.

Steve Docalavich: [00:27:44] It really is in this business.

Carol Docalavich: [00:27:46] Yeah.

Steve Docalavich: [00:27:46] You know, people you don’t have to keep watching, right?

Mike Blake: [00:27:49] Yeah.

Steve Docalavich: [00:27:49] You can trust them, do your job.

Carol Docalavich: [00:27:51] And we do a pretty good job, I think, of bringing on solid people that support us.

Steve Docalavich: [00:27:56] Yeah.

Mike Blake: [00:27:58] So, let me switch gears here, has there ever been a point at which one of you has offered the other constructive criticism in the business area?

Carol Docalavich: [00:28:09] Oh, when we got here today.

Steve Docalavich: [00:28:11] Mike, that, no.

Mike Blake: [00:28:13] No?

Steve Docalavich: [00:28:13] The answer is no, I don’t, yes, she does.

Mike Blake: [00:28:16] Okay.

Steve Docalavich: [00:28:16] Yes, it’s not constructive, it’s destructive. No, I’m just kidding.

Mike Blake: [00:28:22] No. But that’s going to come up, especially because I imagine it’s gone initially from you, Carol, to Steve, because you were new to business generally and new to her businesses, where she’s a veteran, right? And there’s the kick under the table. But besides the kicking under the table, I imagine there’s a debriefing like, “You understand why I kicked you under the table”, right?

Carol Docalavich: [00:28:41] Oh, absolutely.

Steve Docalavich: [00:28:42] Well, I know before she does it that she’s going to do it. I’d block her. Now, she’ll call me into our office and shut the door. I mean, she’ll call me into her office and shut the door.

Carol Docalavich: [00:28:51] Oh, boy.

Steve Docalavich: [00:28:52] So, I’m just saying, what other couples do that? “Honey, I want you to come in my office. Shut the door.” What would your wife say to you if you did that to her? She goes, “Uh, no.”

Mike Blake: [00:29:03] Even on the end, you know, I should not say that.

Steve Docalavich: [00:29:06] Exactly. Exactly. I know you have a bleep button there. I was almost going to make you use it. But I do that. I understand that I don’t understand. You know, there are some things that I’m pretty good at and there’s some things that she’s really good at. And sometimes, she needs to talk to me about things that she’s good at.

Mike Blake: [00:29:27] And where do you think you complement each other most? What do you guys think the other one brings to the table that maybe you don’t bring to the table as well on your own?

Steve Docalavich: [00:29:39] She brings hard work, integrity, smarts, know-how, experience, and good cooking.

Carol Docalavich: [00:29:49] Not necessarily in that order.

Steve Docalavich: [00:29:50] Not necessarily in that order. Right. Not to mention the other stuff, right?

Carol Docalavich: [00:29:55] I think where he really complements me is first of all, I keep it light all the time. 99% of the time, he’s always in a good mood. I mean, I would say, you know, he’s rarely not laughing. He’s rarely not making a joke.

Steve Docalavich: [00:30:11] A joke, yeah.

Carol Docalavich: [00:30:11] And, you know, he’ll keep it where—you know, a lot of times I’ll spiral, you know. Entrepreneurs, you know.

Mike Blake: [00:30:18] It’s a very lonely place.

Carol Docalavich: [00:30:20] Yes, it is. We’re almost that, you know, that whole like cyclical, up and down.

Mike Blake: [00:30:25] Manic depressive, you know?

Carol Docalavich: [00:30:26] Yeah, I was trying not to say that word, but yeah, we are. And he’ll bring me out of those lows. That’s one of the things he where he really complements me. And he should’ve been a lawyer. He’s really excellent with understanding legal documents and-

Steve Docalavich: [00:30:42] I watch a lot of TV.

Carol Docalavich: [00:30:45] Play one on TV?

Steve Docalavich: [00:30:46] Yeah. And I watch a lot of TV.

Mike Blake: [00:30:46] Yeah. But I don’t remember William Shatner doing a lot of contract work on Boston Legal, so I’m not sure that you’ll love from there.

Steve Docalavich: [00:30:51] I’ve loved him on Boston Legal.

Mike Blake: [00:30:52] I do, too.

Steve Docalavich: [00:30:53] It’s awesome.

Mike Blake: [00:30:54] Full disclosure, I’m in the tank for William Shatner. I tell you, and I like Star Trek 5, but the reason I’m in the tank for William Shatner, he doesn’t run away from who he is, right?

Carol Docalavich: [00:31:05] Yeah.

Mike Blake: [00:31:05] I don’t think he ever expected, certainly, not the last 40 years, never expected to earn an Oscar or an Emmy or whatever it is they give, right? But all he does is just consistently gets work, right?

Steve Docalavich: [00:31:17] He is hilarious. You know, he went from being a tough guy, right? Earlier on because he has like the John, everyone was a tough guy.

Mike Blake: [00:31:23] Yeah.

Steve Docalavich: [00:31:23] And now, he’s just kind of an old soft guy with. you know, opinions.

Mike Blake: [00:31:28] Yeah.

Steve Docalavich: [00:31:28] And that they’re funny. I love it.

Carol Docalavich: [00:31:31] So, there’s really not a contractor he handles all the legal side, most of the attorneys. You know, not you guys. I don’t let him do the finance side.

Steve Docalavich: [00:31:42] No. Wait a minute. Before you screw this whole thing up, we have attorneys, okay? We use a lot.

Carol Docalavich: [00:31:46] We do.

Steve Docalavich: [00:31:46] We use attorneys. She just brings stuff to me for my opinion and then, I work with the attorneys. But-

Carol Docalavich: [00:31:51] I said handle that.

Steve Docalavich: [00:31:51] Yeah. But I mean, there are things that I enjoy about that part of the work that it makes sense to me. It’s fun.

Carol Docalavich: [00:31:58] And that’s a big relief for me.

Mike Blake: [00:32:00] So, let’s talk about that, because sounds like you do divide and conquer a little bit.

Carol Docalavich: [00:32:03] Yeah, we do.

Mike Blake: [00:32:04] What are some areas where you divide and conquer? Saying, you know, Carol, you’re going to take A, B and C on, you’re going to take Q, R, and S on.

Steve Docalavich: [00:32:12] She made me fire people.

Mike Blake: [00:32:14] You’re the hatchet man.

Steve Docalavich: [00:32:16] So, you know, I was an air traffic controller for so long. And I was in management. I was a supervisor and I was like, “God, I just wish that we could fire somebody.” Yeah, I think it’s the worst attitude. But, you know, when I was a controller, I had the worst attitude in the world. So, if I was my supervisor, I would want to fire me. So, I made this remark to her and she goes, “Fine. Well, you’re going to fire someone.” And I fired somebody. I’ve never felt so bad in my life.

Mike Blake: [00:32:38] Okay.

Steve Docalavich: [00:32:38] And now, if anybody needs to be fired, I don’t fire them. We give that to somebody else.

Mike Blake: [00:32:43] Really?

Steve Docalavich: [00:32:44] Yeah, I got what I asked for and it’s no fun.

Carol Docalavich: [00:32:46] No, it’s no fun.

Steve Docalavich: [00:32:47] It’s no fun.

Carol Docalavich: [00:32:49] No. Well, it’s not like that happens a lot, but-

Steve Docalavich: [00:32:52] No, no, no. I’m just saying, you made me fire people-

Carol Docalavich: [00:32:54] Well, you said you wanted to.

Steve Docalavich: [00:32:54] … just to show me what it felt like to fire people.

Carol Docalavich: [00:32:57] Yeah, like it’s-

Steve Docalavich: [00:32:57] It is not any fun.

Carol Docalavich: [00:32:58] No, you’re changing people’s lives.

Steve Docalavich: [00:32:59] Yeah, you are. Yeah.

Carol Docalavich: [00:33:00] So, I mean, you pretty much run anything that has to do with the truckload side.

Steve Docalavich: [00:33:06] Yeah.

Carol Docalavich: [00:33:08] So, he takes over especially all the operational side of that, not the sales side.

Steve Docalavich: [00:33:13] I’m the visionary, you’re LTL. I started all that.

Carol Docalavich: [00:33:15] Actually was your idea.

Steve Docalavich: [00:33:16] That’s right. It’s all my idea.

Carol Docalavich: [00:33:18] It goes back to you saying you don’t-

Steve Docalavich: [00:33:18] I just don’t know how to implement it. Like I said, I’m an idea guy.

Mike Blake: [00:33:21] Ok

Steve Docalavich: [00:33:21] ay. We’re going to the moon next week, building a rocket.

Carol Docalavich: [00:33:27] You know, his transparency, all, you know, the stuff we talked to you about. You know, the whole transparency truly being-.

Steve Docalavich: [00:33:32] If there are any shippers out there, we are the only transparent-

Carol Docalavich: [00:33:34] Broker.

Steve Docalavich: [00:33:36] … 3PL-

Carol Docalavich: [00:33:37] Yeah, 3PL.

Steve Docalavich: [00:33:37] … in the nation. So, there you go.

Carol Docalavich: [00:33:39] But yeah. And I think probably, I run the business, I do all the finance side, salespeople, you know, that sort of thing. And I think we know our roles. You know, we come in, it’s not like every day like he comes to me and says, “What do I do today?” He gets to work three hours before I do. So, yeah, I think now, it’s more or less, we just kind of know what we’re going to do.

Mike Blake: [00:34:07] Yeah.

Carol Docalavich: [00:34:07] I think at first, he really looked for direction, “What do you need me to do? What he needs me to do? What do you want me to take care of?” He doesn’t do that now. I mean, he acts like he, you know, comes to me for direction, he does not. He comes to me after he’s done it and I got to clean it up.

Mike Blake: [00:34:21] After eight years, you know what it’s going to be, right?

Carol Docalavich: [00:34:23] Yeah.

Mike Blake: [00:34:24] It’s unlikely you’re going to walk in and say, “You know what, I need you to kill somebody today. I need you to kill a man”, right? You’re not sort of expecting that kind of pivot, right?

Carol Docalavich: [00:34:34] No.

Mike Blake: [00:34:34] So, did anything surprise you about working together as co-founders, co-entrepreneurs, either on the positive or negative side?

Steve Docalavich: [00:34:43] She has less respect for air traffic controllers now, I think, is-

Carol Docalavich: [00:34:45] I would say that’s probably-

Mike Blake: [00:34:45] Right. She won’t be flying anymore?

Steve Docalavich: [00:34:48] We take the bus everywhere and rightly so.

Carol Docalavich: [00:34:51] Yeah. So, after I met him and I met a bunch of his friends, which I love, if you knew, you guys are listening, you know I love you.

Steve Docalavich: [00:34:57] They’re not listening to this one though.

Carol Docalavich: [00:34:59] But we left and I was like, “Holy crap, I don’t want to get on an airplane.”

Steve Docalavich: [00:35:07] I was down in Atlanta Center in Hampton and I would let her come to—and that’s the largest aircraft trove solely in the world, busiest, biggest, and all that stuff. I wouldn’t bring her there until after we were married. And she said, “Why?” And I said, “Because they’re all a bunch of jerks and they’re all going to make up stories and tell you, you know, I dated dudes and stuff and, you know, it’s just going to be a terrible experience and I want to be married to you before that happens.”

Mike Blake: [00:35:36] They’re going to talk to you about the time that you landed two 747s naked, basically.

Carol Docalavich: [00:35:40] Yeah, exactly.

Steve Docalavich: [00:35:40] Well, that happened.

Mike Blake: [00:35:42] Okay.

Steve Docalavich: [00:35:42] That’s true. Yeah.

Mike Blake: [00:35:42] How truth is stranger than fiction sometimes.

Steve Docalavich: [00:35:45] Yeah.

Carol Docalavich: [00:35:45] Yeah, true.

Steve Docalavich: [00:35:46] Yeah.

Carol Docalavich: [00:35:47] But yeah. So, I mean, I don’t know, really. You’re better at the storytelling than I am.

Steve Docalavich: [00:35:53] I don’t remember what you’re talking about, what was it?

Mike Blake: [00:35:55] No, it doesn’t matter.

Steve Docalavich: [00:35:55] What was the direction, yeah.

Mike Blake: [00:35:56] Doesn’t matter.

Steve Docalavich: [00:35:57] Yeah.

Carol Docalavich: [00:35:57] You always go off on a story about you.

Steve Docalavich: [00:35:58] Well, I almost went to a dead hooker joke, but-

Mike Blake: [00:36:04] So, everybody, you’re listening to the Dead Hooker podcast and we’re here with Carol and Steve.

Steve Docalavich: [00:36:09] That’s right. If you like, subscribe and thumbs up.

Mike Blake: [00:36:11] Yeah, at deadhooker.com.

Steve Docalavich: [00:36:13] That’s right. I got that, by the way.

Mike Blake: [00:36:15] Do you really?

Carol Docalavich: [00:36:15] Don’t.

Steve Docalavich: [00:36:15] No, it’s deadhooker.co, because somebody else has it.

Mike Blake: [00:36:17] So, you know, somebody is listening and they’re now typing, “I got to see if that domain is available.” I can only get deadhooker.biz.

Steve Docalavich: [00:36:23] That’s right.

Mike Blake: [00:36:24] Oh, man. That’s the lamest one.

Steve Docalavich: [00:36:27] Yeah.

Mike Blake: [00:36:27] Are there any mistakes you made early on that you need to learn from?

Carol Docalavich: [00:36:33] I mean, my list would be really long. You mean as a married couple or just-

Mike Blake: [00:36:36] Yeah, as a married couple in business. I mean, we don’t need to get into the personal stuff, but-

Carol Docalavich: [00:36:39] No, I meant like business-

Steve Docalavich: [00:36:39] Opening up the property management company to bring on those international buyers because we’re just selling to them. You know, that was probably—only because of the way that it happened. It was not a great transition. You know, we got 300 and something houses and we didn’t know who was in them. We didn’t know if they had agreements. We didn’t know where they were. I mean, the-

Carol Docalavich: [00:37:02] We didn’t know if they had mold.

Steve Docalavich: [00:37:03] … turnover, and a lot of them didn’t, some of the houses weren’t even there, was not orderly. It was painful, to say the least.

Carol Docalavich: [00:37:15] Very painful.

Steve Docalavich: [00:37:15] It took us six months to get our feet up under us. I mean, they just said, “Here you go.” And none of it was correct. There’d be different people in houses. We had squatters. I mean, it was horrible. That was one big thing. So, we should have just kept selling them stuff instead of trying to manage their stuff.

Carol Docalavich: [00:37:33] Yeah. I don’t know. As far as where it relates just to a married couple working together, I mean, the first year was tough.

Mike Blake: [00:37:40] Why?

Steve Docalavich: [00:37:41] Because my wife was alive, my ex-wife, I’m sorry. My ex-wife was alive and she had a telephone.

Carol Docalavich: [00:37:47] I’m talking about-

Steve Docalavich: [00:37:48] And she would call-

Carol Docalavich: [00:37:48] I’m not talking about that.

Steve Docalavich: [00:37:49] Okay. Never mind. Disregard that last.

Carol Docalavich: [00:37:52] I was talking about as a married couple working together, not personal stuff.

Steve Docalavich: [00:37:56] Okay. Sorry.

Carol Docalavich: [00:37:57] That’s not what he wants to know about.

Mike Blake: [00:37:57] Yeah, we’re not putting you on the couch.

Steve Docalavich: [00:37:58] Nobody’s listening to this. Go ahead.

Carol Docalavich: [00:38:01] Well, you know, he’s a big personality, as you might have noticed.

Steve Docalavich: [00:38:05] No, I’m not.

Carol Docalavich: [00:38:05] And I have a pretty big personality.

Mike Blake: [00:38:08] Yeah.

Carol Docalavich: [00:38:08] And he did not take direction very well the first year.

Steve Docalavich: [00:38:15] So, you’re saying I’ve learned?

Mike Blake: [00:38:16] So, at some point, did you ever say to him, “Is it that you can’t learn or that you won’t learn?”

Steve Docalavich: [00:38:23] That was that was outside just a few minutes ago, yeah.

Carol Docalavich: [00:38:26] Yeah, there was several of those conversations. It was like, “Look, you know, if you want to do this, you really got to take direction. And I know you don’t-” You know, I mean, his mother told me, “This one doesn’t mind. He doesn’t do well.” I said, “It’s not about minding.” I need him to just understand the process. And he would just, you know, go off on his own and make a decision and-

Mike Blake: [00:38:48] Right.

Carol Docalavich: [00:38:48] Remember the one renter?

Steve Docalavich: [00:38:50] I got a story after this. That’s where you beat me up. Go ahead. Go ahead. No. Have at it.

Carol Docalavich: [00:38:55] So, that was really it. He just really couldn’t take direction very well.

Mike Blake: [00:38:59] Okay.

Steve Docalavich: [00:38:59] Yeah. Yeah.

Carol Docalavich: [00:38:59] That took a while.

Mike Blake: [00:38:59] Okay.

Steve Docalavich: [00:39:00] Okay.

Carol Docalavich: [00:39:00] All right. Go ahead. What’s your story?

Steve Docalavich: [00:39:01] I don’t have one. I was just kidding.

Carol Docalavich: [00:39:02] Yeah, exactly.

Steve Docalavich: [00:39:02] It was a threat. It was a baseless threat.

Mike Blake: [00:39:05] Okay.

Carol Docalavich: [00:39:05] So, there is a quick renter story. So, when we first started, he was like, “Oh, I’m going to handle the renters, I think you’re a little hard, you know, a little harsh on them.” And I said, “Okay.” So, he, you know, calls her and she gives him the story, right? Like I-

Steve Docalavich: [00:39:20] Okay. First, that was a terrible setup for the story. So, the story is-.

Carol Docalavich: [00:39:24] See, that’s what he does, takes it.

Steve Docalavich: [00:39:25] Yeah. Yeah. So, the story is that, you know, we had not that many houses, but we had some renters that were a little bit late with their rent and we took over. So, I said, “Why do we have a management company? We’ll do it ourselves. We’ll manage.” So-

Carol Docalavich: [00:39:35] Yeah, “How hard can this be?”

Steve Docalavich: [00:39:36] Yeah. So, we were managing all her houses and this one lady, “Oh, well, my dog just died and everything, you know, everybody died.” And I said, “Honey, we can’t kick her out. Everything just died. I mean, her plants died, her dog. We can’t do that.” So, come to find out her dog was fine, her plants were fine, she just didn’t want to pay. And so, it just took a little longer to evict her than them, but I was just a soft touch.

Carol Docalavich: [00:40:01] Oh, God.

Steve Docalavich: [00:40:01] Because I didn’t think anybody ever lied.

Carol Docalavich: [00:40:03] Yeah.

Steve Docalavich: [00:40:04] Right?

Carol Docalavich: [00:40:04] Yeah. I’m not quite—and so-

Mike Blake: [00:40:06] Not in real estate.

Carol Docalavich: [00:40:08] No.

Steve Docalavich: [00:40:08] No. No, not renters.

Carol Docalavich: [00:40:10] But what was really funny is we were in the car, on the phone, going down to look at houses.

Steve Docalavich: [00:40:14] Yeah. I remember that, yeah.

Carol Docalavich: [00:40:15] Yeah. And I said-

Steve Docalavich: [00:40:16] I was almost crying at her story, I swear.

Carol Docalavich: [00:40:20] He was literally-

Steve Docalavich: [00:40:20] I said, “Honey, we can’t kick her out. All these things just died.”

Carol Docalavich: [00:40:24] And I said, “Honey, I want to show you something.” I said, “This is the second month her dad has died.” And he said, “Oh, my God.”

Steve Docalavich: [00:40:31] You need the bleep button again.

Carol Docalavich: [00:40:33] Like literally. He goes, “I just fell for that.” And I’m like, “Yeah, but-”

Steve Docalavich: [00:40:37] I’m such a sucker.

Carol Docalavich: [00:40:39] He was a sucker.

Steve Docalavich: [00:40:39] Yeah.

Carol Docalavich: [00:40:39] So, that was some of the stuff that was tough.

Mike Blake: [00:40:41] He’s a softy.

Carol Docalavich: [00:40:42] Yeah, he is.

Steve Docalavich: [00:40:42] Yeah, I am a big softy.

Carol Docalavich: [00:40:45] Yeah.

Steve Docalavich: [00:40:45] But we did evict the hell out of her.

Mike Blake: [00:40:48] Well, at least, there was a happy ending to the whole story.

Steve Docalavich: [00:40:50] Yes, there was a happy ending in this. Right. We kicked her out and her children.

Mike Blake: [00:40:53] Good.

Steve Docalavich: [00:40:54] And I think we killed her dog, I’m not sure. I’m just-

Carol Docalavich: [00:40:56] No, we didn’t. No.

Mike Blake: [00:40:56] One way or the other, something was dying.

Steve Docalavich: [00:40:59] No, I love dogs.

Carol Docalavich: [00:41:00] Yeah.

Steve Docalavich: [00:41:00] But her kids, they were out.

Carol Docalavich: [00:41:03] Yeah.

Steve Docalavich: [00:41:03] I love dogs.

Carol Docalavich: [00:41:03] But he’s good at taking direction now.

Steve Docalavich: [00:41:05] Yes, ma’am.

Mike Blake: [00:41:08] Guys, this has been a great interview. We’re running out of time. We needed to get you onto your weekend, but-

Steve Docalavich: [00:41:13] Mike, if you have to leave, we’ll continue. I don’t know, you know-

Mike Blake: [00:41:16] Oh, well, you know what-

Steve Docalavich: [00:41:17] Yeah.

Mike Blake: [00:41:17] … you ask me questions. Now, we do need to wrap it up and let you guys get back to your businesses and your lives and your weekend, but I can’t thank you enough for agreeing to come on. If somebody is kind of thinking about this, that they’re thinking of going into business as a married couple, I mean, it sounds like you guys are a great example of what to do, can they contact you guys for advice?

Carol Docalavich: [00:41:42] Yeah, absolutely.

Steve Docalavich: [00:41:42] They can call Carol. Her number is—it’s carol@-

Carol Docalavich: [00:41:49] Which one?

Steve Docalavich: [00:41:50] I don’t know. Which one?

Carol Docalavich: [00:41:50] Yeah, seriously, they can, I mean, use my carol@yourltl.com or the office number is 619—what is it? I always give my cell phone, because I’m always on the phone. 619-.

Steve Docalavich: [00:42:05] 678.

Carol Docalavich: [00:42:05] … 678-

Steve Docalavich: [00:42:07] Follow this, 678-619-4316 and then, follow the prompts to Carol.

Carol Docalavich: [00:42:13] There you go.

Mike Blake: [00:42:14] There you go.

Steve Docalavich: [00:42:14] Steve is not on there.

Mike Blake: [00:42:16] And you may have to put on a little prompt in your IVR for marriage counselling.

Steve Docalavich: [00:42:20] Yes.

Carol Docalavich: [00:42:20] Yeah, exactly.

Mike Blake: [00:42:20] Press 7.

Carol Docalavich: [00:42:21] Yeah, exactly.

Steve Docalavich: [00:42:23] Yeah.

Mike Blake: [00:42:23] That’s going to wrap it up for today’s program. I’d like to thank Carol and Steve so much for joining us and sharing their expertise with us. We’ll be exploring a new topic each week, so please tune in so that when you’re faced with your next executive decision, you have clear vision when making it. If you enjoy these podcasts, please consider leaving a review with your favorite podcast aggregator. It helps people find us so that we can help them. Once again, this is Mike Blake. Our sponsor is Brady Ware & Company. And this has been the Decision Vision podcast.

Tagged With: married couples in business, Michael Blake, Mike Blake, Steve Docalavich, transporation management solution

Inspiring Women, Episode 18: Darla King, King Business Interiors

February 12, 2020 by John Ray

Darla King, King Business Interiors
Inspiring Women PodCast with Betty Collins
Inspiring Women, Episode 18: Darla King, King Business Interiors
Loading
00:00 /
RSS Feed
Share
Link
Embed

Download file

Darla King, King Business Interiors
Betty Collins, Brady Ware & Company, and Darla King, King Business Interiors

Inspiring Women, Episode 18:  Darla King, King Business Interiors

Darla King joins “Inspiring Women” to talk about the journey of building her thriving office furniture business, lessons learned along the way, encouraging other women business owners, and giving back. The host of “Inspiring Women” is Betty Collins and this series is presented by Brady Ware & Company.

Darla King, King Business Interiors

Darla King, King Business Interiors
Darla King, King Business Interiors

Darla King is the President and Owner of King Business Interiors. After more than a decade in the furniture business, Darla started the company in 1998 and serves as the company’s Owner and President. Early on, the vision was clear: King Business Interiors will always be more than a furniture vendor.

Today, King serves hundreds of clients in numerous markets and industries. Along with being a Haworth furniture preferred dealer, King represents 300 product lines, operates a full service commercial flooring division, offers inventory and warehousing and provides total move management services. In all that King does, King is dedicated to a single goal: providing customer’s with a “Zero Punch List.”

A commitment to going the extra mile for clients has enabled King to grow from a small five person start up into an established multi-million dollar business with 50+ employees. According to Columbus Business First, King ranks second among area office furniture and supply companies, and ranks ninth in the top 50 women-owned businesses.

King is a proud, family-owned business with a strong focus on their employee’s family lives. Two of the passions at King are “kids come first” and “never miss a ball game.”

King is also a certified woman-owned business, and Darla is active with the National Association of Women Business Owners (NAWBO), Columbus Chapter. Darla takes pride in mentoring fellow women leaders throughout the Ohio community.

Through Darla’s leadership, King is very active in giving back to the community, particularly through an innovative recycling program, Connecting the Dots. This initiative takes reusable furniture and connects the items with nonprofits, startups and charitable organizations throughout Central Ohio.

For more information on King Business Interiors, follow this link.

Betty Collins, CPA, Brady Ware & Company and Host of the “Inspiring Women” Podcast

Betty Collins, CPA

Betty Collins is the Office Lead for Brady Ware’s Columbus office and a Shareholder in the firm. Betty joined Brady Ware & Company in 2012 through a merger with Nipps, Brown, Collins & Associates. She started her career in public accounting in 1988. Betty is co-leader of the Long Term Care service team, which helps providers of services to Individuals with Intellectual and Developmental Disabilities and nursing centers establish effective operational models that also maximize available funding. She consults with other small businesses, helping them prosper with advice on general operations management, cash flow optimization, and tax minimization strategies.

In addition, Betty serves on the Board of Directors for Brady Ware and Company. She leads Brady Ware’s Women’s Initiative, a program designed to empower female employees, allowing them to tap into unique resources and unleash their full potential.  Betty helps her colleagues create a work/life balance while inspiring them to set and reach personal and professional goals. The Women’s Initiative promotes women-to-women business relationships for clients and holds an annual conference that supports women business owners, women leaders, and other women who want to succeed. Betty actively participates in women-oriented conferences through speaking engagements and board activity.

Betty is a member of the National Association of Women Business Owners (NAWBO) and she is the President-elect for the Columbus Chapter. Brady Ware also partners with the Women’s Small Business Accelerator (WSBA), an organization designed to help female business owners develop and implement a strong business strategy through education and mentorship, and Betty participates in their mentor match program. She is passionate about WSBA because she believes in their acceleration program and matching women with the right advisors to help them achieve their business ownership goals. Betty supports the WSBA and NAWBO because these organizations deliver resources that help other women-owned and managed businesses thrive.

Betty is a graduate of Mount Vernon Nazarene College, a member of the American Institute of Certified Public Accountants, and a member of the Ohio Society of Certified Public Accountants. Betty is also the Board Chairwoman for the Gahanna Area Chamber of Commerce, and she serves on the Board of the Community Improvement Corporation of Gahanna as Treasurer.

“Inspiring Women” Podcast Series

“Inspiring Women” is THE podcast that advances women toward economic, social and political achievement. The show is hosted by Betty Collins, CPA, and presented by Brady Ware and Company. Brady Ware is committed to empowering women to go their distance in the workplace and at home. Other episodes of “Inspiring Women” can be found here.

Show Transcript

Betty Collins: [00:00:00] Well, today, I am really fortunate to have a guest with me, Darla King, with King Interiors. Guests are always phenomenal. People love the story. They love to hear how they did things, how they didn’t do things, and some insight from them. Darla King, and King Interiors is kind of a big deal in Columbus, Ohio. She probably … She’s laughing already, but it’s true. Everyone knows them, and Darla is just- they founded this with her and her husband in 1988. The philosophy was, “We will be more than furniture.” So, we’re going to talk a little bit about that today.

Betty Collins: [00:00:39] I know Darla because of NAWBO Columbus. I joined that in 2014 and, of course, the board and the players in Columbus that are part of NAWBO, which is the National Association of Women Business Owners, we’re just a fun group. I liked it from the beginning. She was on the board and became president. Then, I got on the board because, you know, we always need a treasurer, and that’s what CPAs do. So, I got there, and one day, we were all trying to figure out who should be the next role, the next leaderships. She’s looking at me, saying, “You should be president!” I’m shaking my head, “No, I am not doing that ever!” But what it did was it planted a seed in my head that maybe I could do this because NAWBO Columbus is a pretty big honor to be on that board and to be on that track. It’s also about what NAWBO does, and I’m passionate about it.

Betty Collins: [00:01:33] That’s how we kind of got to know each other, and we’re both involved with women’s things all over Columbus. A lot of times, either we’re writing the checks, or we’re sponsoring, or we’re opening up our office, and trying to make this because we believe in all of this. We have that common vote. But we also believe in the business and the marketplace. I know her through NAWBO. She’s a member and she has, of course, been in leadership. She’s also in the Women’s Business Enterprise National Council, and WPO, which is Women’s President Organization.

Betty Collins: [00:02:05] She’s really done some amazing things for women, as well as run a business. Without the marketplace, our country doesn’t do well. So, the marketplace has to have success in it, and we have to give those people that have an idea, a passion, and then, all the sudden, they’re an employer, which means you’ve got households that form communities … The marketplaces, the success, we get to experience every day in our country. I love it, and I love that I get to be a CPA and be part of that venue. Even though it’s depreciation, and GAAP things, and all that, it’s important. We’re going to go on a journey. So, first of all, Darla, can you just kind of tell us a little bit about King Interiors; what you guys do? You are family business.

Darla King: [00:02:50] Yeah.

Betty Collins: [00:02:51] That’s a whole ‘nother dynamic we’ll talk about a little bit today but tell us a little bit about King Interiors. It goes back to 1988.

Darla King: [00:02:57] Actually ’98, but [crosstalk] We’ve been in business 22 years. It’s King Business Interiors, under King Business Centers. Believe me, we struggled with the name, in the beginning, saying, “What should it be?” I worked out of my dining room for the first three months trying to get things rolling. But, I look at … We had a pretty good start, as far as I was already in the industry. I was getting things going for just two or three customers, and I let them tell me how to set it up, like, “What do you need? What do you need?” They really guided me to say, “Nothing’s going to change.” They’re going to have the same national account agreement with the furniture line that we represented.

Darla King: [00:03:43] At that time, we were the third Haworth dealer in Columbus. That happens in places like New York City and maybe San Francisco, but not Columbus, Ohio, because we’re like a secondary market. But slowly, that eliminated … One bought the other and ended up filing bankruptcy. Then, we were the only- King was the only Haworth dealer, which is a major brand; like number two in our industry.

Betty Collins: [00:04:08] Sure. Okay.

Darla King: [00:04:09] Anyways, when we started, we had four partners because I really felt like I needed a whole crowd of people to help me. I look at that today, and I think that’s one of my biggest mistakes was just not believing in myself, but also not understanding what four partners- and even number … Relying on everybody to do what I thought we could do. Slowly, I had to eliminate one partner, and I had to eliminate a second partner. My husband was not one either one of them, so-

Betty Collins: [00:04:38] That was good.

Darla King: [00:04:40] Dave and I- yeah, that’s good. Dave and I’ve been married now 40 years-

Betty Collins: [00:04:43] Very nice.

Darla King: [00:04:44] -but in business 22 years. I think it’s a classic. We’re opposites. He’s very much on the numbers. He’s very black and white. He takes all the details in. That’s not me at all.

Betty Collins: [00:04:56] Yeah. It’s necessary. You gotta do it [crosstalk] right?

Darla King: [00:05:00] Yeah, so I look at that, and I think that was one thing that – back in the early days – was I needed the expertise around me; someone that knows how to start a business. I needed somebody that knew how to build a culture. Those were the two partners early. After a year, year and a half, we made those changes. Then, slowly, it grew. Our kids, at that time, were very young.

Betty Collins: [00:05:22] Sure.

Darla King: [00:05:24] So, there was no intention of them having to get into the business or forced to get in the business. But my daughter did go through O.U., and interior design. Then Chris, our son, he’s 37, and he went to Ohio State for American history, and so-

Betty Collins: [00:05:39] So, he started selling furniture.

Darla King: [00:05:43] Yeah. Actually, he … The best thing is both of them have worked in the business, somewhere along the line. Chris did a lot on weekends, and summers at the warehouse, and with the installers, when he was in school and in college. Then he first came on and was in the accounting department and was in accounts receivable. A couple of years went by, and he said, “Mom, people … I don’t like this job. People lie!” [crosstalk]

Betty Collins: [00:06:05] Really? They don’t want to pay us? Okay.

Darla King: [00:06:05] They got excuses. He’d go, “I got notes here. They were gonna pay; the check was in the mail.” It’s like, “Okay …” He goes, “Can I do something else?” He ended up showing some interest in sales, and he has been in sales since.

Betty Collins: [00:06:17] Good, good.

Darla King: [00:06:17] He’s been with us a quite a while. Chelsea’s been with us seven years, and with her design background, she brought a new look to it. Even when we interviewed at O.U., the counselor asked me to step out of the room, and he asked Chelsea, specifically, “Is your mom forcing you to get in this business because she’s in it?” Chel said, “No, I kinda like it. I wanna do this.” So, everybody’s watching out for is it going to be a family business? Is it a forced issue? Is it [crosstalk] It wasn’t for either one of them. They have worked hard. They’re there every day, and they have great interest in how we’re going to find the next customer, and where we’re spending our advertising money, and all the things that a business owner needs to think about.

Betty Collins: [00:07:02] Right.

Darla King: [00:07:03] So, yeah, now we’re up to 81 employees.

Betty Collins: [00:07:06] Very good. Very good. That’s a lot.

Darla King: [00:07:09] Yeah, and a lot of families, and a lot of kids, and now, a lot of grandkids.

Betty Collins: [00:07:12] Wow. Right.

Darla King: [00:07:13] There’s not a day goes by that I don’t think about the day four people walk walked in; and now we’ve got 81. Everybody’s busy. The Columbus market right now is fantastic.

Betty Collins: [00:07:25] It’s hot.

Darla King: [00:07:26] It is.

Betty Collins: [00:07:27] It’s hot.

Darla King: [00:07:28] Everybody’s got their job to do. They work as a great team; in small teams, too. We’re very fortunate to have some customers that have been with the whole 22 years.

Betty Collins: [00:07:38] Wow. Very nice.

Darla King: [00:07:39] They’re very dedicated to helping us understand better how to get better. Some, I’ve been with for 30 years, but they’ve changed personnel in their businesses, and we’ve kind of been their steady; their facilities partner. Not just selling the next chair, but really understanding their buildings. As we grew, the one thing customers kept saying to us is, “I need warehouse. Can you get a little warehouse?” Well, now we’re at 150,000 square foot of warehouse-

Betty Collins: [00:08:08] That’s a lot.

Darla King: [00:08:08] -because customers don’t build their buildings to have a big basement in the bottom or some storage space. The larger customers, the more product they need, the more churn they have, there are more needs for having inventory readily available. That’s kind of how we’ve grown is through [crosstalk]

Betty Collins: [00:08:26] -it’s a great story. Great path. Not an easy path, for sure. As a CPA, I’ve seen the generations. You have that original generation … I had a grandmother who started a nursing home at the age of 63.

Darla King: [00:08:45] Wow!

Betty Collins: [00:08:46] In her home, which, at that time, you could do that. It was- 12 people could fit- could stay in her home. Today, the third generation is running that. Her secret to success, and I want you to talk about this, was if you want to work at this nursing home, you’re going to do dishes, you’re going to cook food, you’re going to learn to do personal hygiene for people; you’re going to learn how to meet with a family.

Darla King: [00:09:11] Right.

Betty Collins: [00:09:12] I’m sure- and that was what they had to do first.

Darla King: [00:09:15] That’s amazing.

Betty Collins: [00:09:15] It wasn’t because they were, “a King,” they got to be there, right?

Darla King: [00:09:19] Right.

Betty Collins: [00:09:19] Talk a little bit about the dynamics that you’ve experienced with that; because they’ve got to really have an entrepreneurship heart. They’ve got to have a passion for the business. Do you feel like you guys have done that well as a family?

Darla King: [00:09:36] You know, I have learned a lot from them. They’re both millennials. They both have a different perspective on it. For me, being in the business 30 years, I’ve had a lot of my customers retire, and the new face shows up that’s a person that’s going to be running and controlling that company’s facilities, and they needed to talk to somebody at their age.

Betty Collins: [00:09:59] Right. That’s perfect.

Darla King: [00:09:59] They needed to be able to relate to them. It’s like I needed- there were obvious spots where I needed to get out of the way and let them start their conversation. Not that they knew it all by then, but the new person at the facility didn’t either, and it was like, they just want to be heard. They just want to know how to find the solutions. Come back, and let’s talk about it, and let’s pull the team together. We really have four generations in our group, right now.

Betty Collins: [00:10:29] That’s awesome.

Darla King: [00:10:30] So, there’s a lot of people that can help them.

Betty Collins: [00:10:32] What do you feel like the biggest challenges a family-owned business – then we’ll move on to other things – but, for you, because our audience is going to have a lot of family-owned people, and they’re sometimes trying to get through those dynamics. What’s really the biggest challenge that probably will never go away – maybe it has gone away – that you deal with?

Darla King: [00:10:51] Just to avoid competition. We all stay in our own lanes.

Betty Collins: [00:10:56] Yeah. Good.

Darla King: [00:10:56] Dave’s in finance. I’m in sales and marketing. Chelsea is in design and works with architects and designers and goes out after folks that are specifying our products. Chris stays on national accounts and handling the sales side of it. So, we all see different parts of the business, but we all realize we’re in the right seats.

Betty Collins: [00:11:18] Right. Good.

Darla King: [00:11:19] When it starts to compete, like overlap, that’s where you feel the frustration and stress.

Betty Collins: [00:11:26] You’ve done this a long time. I know, for myself, my kids never wanted to be CPAs or in business, and neither of them are. One’s a minister, and one’s a teacher. They’re like, “Nope. No, we’re not … We’d never do that.” My husband and I, I just know how we do loading and unloading the dishwasher. I can’t imagine us being in business all day together. But, you know, talk to us a little bit about being a woman in your industry – is that an issue? Is it not?  – and did you have challenges that you worked through as a woman business owner, just back in 22 years ago?

Darla King: [00:11:59] I think I was insulated by having my brother-in-law, and my husband, and another partner there; that I just went ahead and did what I did, which was [crosstalk] sales and [inaudible] focused on finding business. Their job was the insurance, the banking- all the other things that just were not my expertise-

Betty Collins: [00:12:20] Right, and very male. Those are male-dominated things.

Darla King: [00:12:23] They already had people they knew in those places and areas. Since then, growing into it and realizing the struggles of people with NAWBO; women in NAWBO, and them getting the national certification for being a woman-owned business. It elevates a company – if you’re in the right- in certain categories – to be seen by large corporations that would have never noticed you.

Betty Collins: [00:12:47] Right.

Darla King: [00:12:48] Quite frankly, they’re looking to do business; like the automotive industry. They want to do business with women because women buy cars. So, they’ve made this huge initiative to really look out and find suppliers that are that way. So, right away, we started being noticed and seen and then understanding what they needed. In fact, one day I had a call from a company, Japanese automaker. They said, “Any chance that you own the company?” And I said, “Well, yeah. I do.” They go, “Good, I don’t have to change vendors.”

Betty Collins: [00:13:22] Wow.

Darla King: [00:13:22] Because they were searching to find where they could bring as much as 10 to 15 percent of their vendor suppliers into woman-owned or minority. That’s been an initiative for 20 years, but now, it’s even more today and very focused on it. I’m not sure if I answered your question [crosstalk]

Betty Collins: [00:13:41] No, you did, because it really kind of leads into, you know, you’ve really … You did play a really great role in NAWBO.

Darla King: [00:13:47] Oh, thanks.

Betty Collins: [00:13:47] What was the passion behind that? You kind of already answered that – the passion of being involved in NAWBO and helping women in business today; because you do that a lot.

Darla King: [00:13:58] Well, you know, women need to help women. It’s silly. You see so many times where a woman gets to the top of the company, and she doesn’t help anybody up. “I got here by myself. I’m not gonna …”

Betty Collins: [00:14:09] That’s common.

Darla King: [00:14:09] Wow! How selfish!

Betty Collins: [00:14:13] Right.

Darla King: [00:14:14] You look at the people in NAWBO, and the NAWBO roundtables, and even the WPO roundtables. Sitting with a group of eight women that are all business owners that are different size, different scale, but all the same problems; whether you’re selling $40 million or whether you’re selling $3 million, and you’ve got employees, and you’ve got leases, and you’ve got bank loans, and you’ve got lines of credit-

Betty Collins: [00:14:36] Right.

Darla King: [00:14:36] -you’re trying to figure out when you hire your second employee. They’re all issues that some of us with longer time in the business have experienced. I like to relive it, especially with some of the younger women [crosstalk] It’s a whole different start for them than it was for me. I often am so gratified that I had a team that I could rely on back then that did the kinds of things that I think all of them, individually, are trying to do. All hands on deck; do everything.

Betty Collins: [00:15:06] I had that same … I’m in a very male-dominated business-

Darla King: [00:15:09] You are.

Betty Collins: [00:15:09] -especially in 1988. Well, in this- right now, over 50 percent of women are accountants, but we’re still having some of those same struggles of … The perspective around that roundtable, the perspective of that support, whether it’s WPO, or the WSBA, or the different groups in town … You’ve been a big supporter of so much of that, and it’s very appreciated. I know that Darla King has made mistakes in her journey … Not very many, so we won’t spend long on this, but this is where you get your MBA, your own personal MBA … Could you just talk with the audience about these are challenges that I went through, and this is why they probably were a really good learning experience that I had to probably go through to get to some next levels or even just I made a mistake and I had to rebound, or whatever. So, what do you think of when you think of- just off the top of your head, what comes to your mind?

Darla King: [00:16:07] I made a lot of mistakes. I’ve got to say, I mean, the best thing about being a small business and being able to make decisions fast and to be agile is reverse. Yeah, we tried it. You know, give it three months; give it six months. The biggest mistake was a five-year lease, and I mentioned that earlier. I thought we needed a downtown presence, and I also had a line of furniture that was extremely expensive, but it was one of our brands that we were expected to represent and show, and it was very difficult to separate it, or put it in the same showroom. We needed to separate it and make it look more like a art studio and a feeling like that.

Darla King: [00:16:43] At the same time, there was a big presence of being downtown, potentially, and having- a lot of customers of ours are really close to downtown, so it made sense. We stood on the eighth floor of that building and looked around and said, “There’s a customer, there’s a customer, there’s a customer,” and we were clear up north off 161. Every time we had to leave to go to a customer, we’d leave a half hour early because you don’t know about traffic and parking the whole nine yards.

Darla King: [00:17:09] After about a year and a half, two years into that, we realized nobody really wanted to work isolated downtown at the studio. It wasn’t our culture, and we tried two or three different groups. So, after the time, I said, “Look, we’re just going to turn this into an incubator.” It was fully furnished. I had talked to several- in fact, six of my friends from NAWBO had been working in their dining rooms, or in their living rooms, or in some other kind of space. They took that on. It literally was a win-win, and we turned it into- lemons into lemonade.

Betty Collins: [00:17:39] Right. You helped them; they helped you. We all learned a big lesson. But, you know, you really, probably, at the time just thought, “We’ve got to be downtown,” you know?

Darla King: [00:17:49] Yeah. It was early. It was early on that. Then, our lease was up, up north. We were only two years into it when we realized we found a better space, which is in Grandview. Again [crosstalk]

Betty Collins: [00:17:58] -I’ve been to that show.

Darla King: [00:17:58] Close to downtown; minutes for getting to our customers, but completely different than being clear up north. So, location, location, location is key.

Betty Collins: [00:18:10] Fortunately, you do have- I mean, your husband, I mean, probably dynamically going, “The numbers do not work, but we’re gonna do this because we got a line. It just makes sense.” I bet numbers weren’t showing that, but then you did it anyways. Well, we all have challenges. We all have stuff that happens. That’s just called business.

Darla King: [00:18:28] You live and learn, and you make the best of it or you fix it.

Betty Collins: [00:18:30] Yep. Anything else that comes to your mind that you’d love to share with the audience: “Learn from this. I went to the Darla MBA, got my MBA School,” whatever it is?

Darla King: [00:18:39] Trust your peers and be a good listener because they’ll teach you a lot.

Betty Collins: [00:18:46] Right.

Darla King: [00:18:46] You’ll learn just from the experiences or the way they put things in their company, and their words out there. I learned a lot from that. Whether it was Vistage, or [crosstalk]

Betty Collins: [00:18:55] Women, generally, and the statistics are there. I’m a data person, unless I have to go research and find it, I’m a data when you give me numbers. “Oh, good. Let’s play with this.” The data’s out there that women don’t ask. They think they have to do this, and they carry it. That’s just not … It’s a big challenge that I see in business owners all the time.

Darla King: [00:19:19] Yeah.

Betty Collins: [00:19:20] One of the coolest things about your Grandview space, and you said to me, “Yeah, you can use the space,” because you wanted people … It’s your give back.

Darla King: [00:19:29] Yeah.

Betty Collins: [00:19:29] You have very cool coffee there [crosstalk] but it’s your give back is the mentality. Talk a little bit about that.

Darla King: [00:19:36] Yeah. Give them the space. I had some really good bosses, prior to getting my business started. One of them always gave the space. Rodney Wasserstrom always said, “We’re not here after 5:00. Let them come in and have an art show. Let them do this …” It’s like good parking. No one was in that space, so they could get in there. They could have events. I thought, that is amazing. The people that walk through the doors in that community would have never come in there, if they hadn’t been invited through that group.

Betty Collins: [00:20:04] Right.

Darla King: [00:20:04] So, it was obvious, when we moved down here, that we were going to be doing that more, and more, and more. Even in Worthington, we got involved in the Worthington Chamber, but also the libraries called and said, “Is there any chance we could put you on as an option room?” Our space.

Betty Collins: [00:20:18] Oh, wow.

Darla King: [00:20:18] I said, “Absolutely.” When someone would come in and they just wanted an alternative to where they had been meeting or they want to spend a half a day, we had the space; training rooms, or a conference room, or places in the space that you only use 10 percent of the time. What I love about our new space is, at the end of the day, there’s 250 parking spots. If a larger event or a nonprofit wants to come in there, we do not charge. There’s public restrooms … Just all the things are right there ready for it.

Betty Collins: [00:20:48] Right.

Darla King: [00:20:49] But giving back and letting people know that you’re there for it, it just, you know, it feels good [crosstalk]

Betty Collins: [00:20:58] Yeah, because you just had a big fundraiser for Bridgeview.

Darla King: [00:21:00] We did.

Betty Collins: [00:21:01] So, tell us a little bit about- that’s the part of giving back, you know? You’re not selling them furniture, you’re just … You probably will sell some furniture over it, but I mean …

Darla King: [00:21:08] This is our 16th year to have Create for Cause. It’s an event where we give back to the community. We get our vendors involved, and we invite everybody we know. Again, this was a learning curve for me. We started it in our fifth year in business [crosstalk] The reason we started it was every year we were giving a customer a small clock; a Howard Miller small clock. After the fifth year, the salespeople said, “How many more clocks … [crosstalk]?”

Betty Collins: [00:21:35] -don’t want any more clocks, yeah.

Darla King: [00:21:38] We were realizing we had such a repeat business that, yeah, we needed to do something different. So, we kicked it into gear with, hey, let’s have a party. Let’s invite everybody there. Let’s do something about it. Let’s have some fun. So, we created this, which we paint 100 ceramic plates is how it started. Now, we’ve been doing platters; this last year was a tray. We put them in as a silent auction. We invite artists, architects, designers in town to paint the ceramics. If you ever painted ceramics, they come out very chalky when you’re painting them. Then, when they get fired, they’re glazed, and glossy, and pretty, and just glow. So, they can see their finished painting, their finished piece of art, when they come to the party.

Betty Collins: [00:22:24] Very cool.

Darla King: [00:22:25] So, it creates a nice crowd. This year, I think we had over 750 people. Everybody in our company knows that they invite their circle of friends, relatives, neighbors, because it’s not just … It’s you don’t know who knows who. I know you’re a CPA. You know I’m in office furniture. You know somebody that’s in a certain industry, it just connects. So, you never know who knows who knows who that could influence and/or say, “If you’re going to get some new chairs, call King.”

Betty Collins: [00:22:54] Well, you know, that’s really the cool part of giving back. You end up creating something that turns into not what you really thought. Let’s give a clock because, hey, we need to give something to our people. Now we have a party that’s owned, and connection, and you get to do some fun, and you raise money all at the same time. 750 people, that’s awesome.

Darla King: [00:23:13] Well, the exposure for Bridgeway was nice [crosstalk]

Betty Collins: [00:23:15] Sure, sure. Great organization.

Darla King: [00:23:18] -they had the opportunity to explain how they take care of kids with autism [crosstalk] It’s amazing.

Betty Collins: [00:23:22] I’ve been down to their school several times, and it’s just … They’re so passionate. They’re really good. Well, you know, Darla, you’ve not always been a big deal, right? You just haven’t. You started out like every business owner. There’s that commercial out right now; I always love it. “We’ve seen a few things,” No, “We know a few things because we’ve seen a few things …” [crosstalk] According to Darla – we’re going to wrap up a little bit – what would you advise women who are, or want to be in business? Maybe they have the idea; they’ve launched already; they realize, “I’m in this because I got a bunch of liability and I got …” or “I’m going to make this- I want to go full circle. I don’t want- I want this to be more.” What would you say to them?

Darla King: [00:24:05] What [crosstalk].

Betty Collins: [00:24:05] What’s something that you would go, “Do this, or don’t do this, or persevere,” whatever?

Darla King: [00:24:10] I’d say reach out and call folks like yourself; call me; call people that have been through it, because we’ll take the time to go have coffee and brainstorm it and then find the next right spot to be, whether it’s a NAWBO roundtable, or it’s WBENC convention or something. It just depends upon what industry they’re in and how it might help their business. Networking is key, and just picking up the phone and calling somebody, and hope they call back, and hope they can connect with you. That’s big. I think you can’t pass that up. That’s just one big part of it. I know there’s a lot of young gals that get discouraged. They want to start a business. They want to get into it. You don’t have a business unless you have a customer.

Betty Collins: [00:24:58] Right. Very good.

Darla King: [00:24:59] It’s great to dream of something, but you got to think it all the way through, and you’ve got to walk it/talk it with somebody. I think that was the one thing I learned about peer-to-peer learning or understanding was just that really sitting down and sorting it out and thinking through how did that happen to me, and how does it happen to her? How can she get connected to somebody else I know? Because helping them is … It should just be natural.

Betty Collins: [00:25:30] Yeah. Well, no, I’ve called on you several times with … We have a mutual friend, right now, who she just- I loved her from the minute because she was just tenacious. She made sure she got to Betty Collins. She did it through several people because she wanted to meet with me. I thought, you know, I need to meet with her because she’s brave, and she’s bold. Then I said I need to connected as somebody who knows a bunch of big businesses that need commercial real estate … It was just cool to do. It took, what, a half hour my time to think it through and talk with her.

Darla King: [00:26:00] Right.

Betty Collins: [00:26:00] Then, you were like immediate. So … When you’re launching, and your starting, you’re getting out there, and you’re going through those rough times, it’s a constant. You’ve got to be asking for help. I think that’s what you’re really saying.

Darla King: [00:26:12] That’s right.

Betty Collins: [00:26:12] Don’t hesitate to do it because your success … Then, sometimes, someone’s going to ask you, and you’re going to be able to help, and do. Darla, I appreciate you meeting with us today. I love meeting with women business owners.

Darla King: [00:26:23] Thank you.

Betty Collins: [00:26:23] Someone who’s had success. They’ve gone through times. Respected in the community. I appreciate all you do with giving back. Of course, you have something called Connecting the Dots, as well. Tell us about that, and then we’ll close.

Darla King: [00:26:34] Real quick. Gosh, in 2004, we had an outlet store, which is the obvious thing for office furniture dealers. Put your old stuff, or the things you made a mistake on [crosstalk]

Betty Collins: [00:26:45] It’s on sale again, yeah.

Darla King: [00:26:45] That business was like 5:00 to 8:00 at night, and on weekends – Saturday and Sunday. It was like, okay, I’m going to work 8:00 to 8:00, and then 8:00 … So, spreading that out and getting other people involved in it and then, also being located clear up on 161 Huntley Road, it just was not right. I got onto a board of directors through a customer of mine and it was the New Direction Career Center for Women. I noticed they didn’t have two chairs that matched, and I thought, here I sit with this abundance of furniture, and it’s sad; they don’t have the money to spend, and I really don’t want to keep on going with the expense of a warehouse and overhead. So, let me just see if I can’t- if they’ll accept me giving it to them.

Darla King: [00:27:27] Some things we owned, so we could take some kind of write off on it. Other things we were- customers would say, “I don’t want this anymore,” but it still had some life to it. So, we created a program where we are not the nonprofit, but we connect the dots for the used furniture – lightly used and/or brand new – to the nonprofits and charities that need it. Interesting enough, we never advertised.

Darla King: [00:27:51] I probably get five, six phone calls a week, or on our web site, people that are requesting things. No one ever needs the same thing. One time I had a guy call for TVs, and I said, “Boy, we’ve never taken in TVs or appliances, except one-offs because I just don’t know how to maintain them [crosstalk] be good. She said, “Well, I have five men’s group homes, and I have no way to get them to gather in the living room. If I could just get some TVs … ”

Darla King: [00:28:17] Two weeks later, company calls and says, “We just got all new flat screens. We have TVs, if you’d be interested.” I said, “You know what? Send me a picture, if you will.” I called her, and I got the addresses, and we delivered five TVs. I said, “The only bad thing is they’re kind of strapped on to one of these mobile carts,” and she goes, “Good, because I don’t have any furniture to put it on!”

Betty Collins: [00:28:39] So, it all worked out.

Darla King: [00:28:42] It did. It did. So, it’s that kind of thing. I think it’s just that putting it out there in the universe; see how it comes back to us. The groups are really good because they don’t need- nobody needs everything, but they’re looking for something that could make their life easier and better. The last thing they need to spend money on is furniture. They need [inaudible] programs, and people, and computers, and all that, so, yeah …

Betty Collins: [00:29:05] Well, it was a good pleasure talking with you today, just getting to know you a little bit more.

Darla King: [00:29:08] Thanks.

Betty Collins: [00:29:08] A lot of good content for women in business, women business owners to talk about and think about, and I just appreciate your time.

Darla King: [00:29:15] Thank you. I appreciate you-

Betty Collins: [00:29:16] Betty Collins. I appreciate everyone who listens. I am passionate and really fortunate to be a woman business owner and to get to have a podcast, a company that believes in empowering women. Have a great day.

Tagged With: Darla King, King Business Interiors, NAWBO, NAWBO Columbus Chapter, Office Furniture, woman owned business

Decision Vision Episode 49: Should I Sue My Financial Advisor? – An Interview with Robert Port, Gaslowitz Frankel LLC

January 30, 2020 by John Ray

sbould i sue my financial advisor
Decision Vision
Decision Vision Episode 49: Should I Sue My Financial Advisor? - An Interview with Robert Port, Gaslowitz Frankel LLC
Loading
00:00 /
RSS Feed
Share
Link
Embed

Download file

sbould i sue my financial advisor
Mike Blake and Robert Port

Decision Vision Episode 49:  Should I Sue My Financial Advisor? – An Interview with Robert Port, Gaslowitz Frankel LLC

Should I sue my financial advisor? What factors should I assess in making this decision? The answers to these questions and much more come out of this interview with Robert Port, Gaslowitz Frankel LLC. The host of “Decision Vision” is Mike Blake and the series is presented by Brady Ware & Company.

Robert Port, Gaslowitz Frankel LLC

should i sue my financial advisor
Robert Port

Robert Port is a business litigation attorney with Gaslowitz Frankel LLC. He has extensive experience in general commercial litigation and fiduciary disputes involving wills, trusts, estates, guardianships and conservatorships. Robert also has significant experience representing investors harmed by the misconduct of their stockbroker, investment advisor, insurance agent, or other trusted advisor. This includes matters arising from inappropriate investment strategies, unsuitable sales of annuities and life insurance products, failed or unlawfully offered private placements, real estate investment trusts (REITs) and other complex investment products, excessive trading (churning), unauthorized trading, sale of unregistered securities, and losses suffered as a result of Ponzi schemes.

Robert graduated with honors from the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill with Bachelors of Science in Political Science and Psychology. He then went on to receive his J.D. with honors from University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill.

Gaslowitz Frankel LLC specializes in all aspects of fiduciary disputes, representing individuals, executors, trustees, investors, shareholders, and financial institutions in complex fiduciary disputes involving wills, estates, trusts, guardianships, businesses, and securities.

Michael Blake, Brady Ware & Company

Mike Blake, Host of “Decision Vision”

Michael Blake is Host of the “Decision Vision” podcast series and a Director of Brady Ware & Company. Mike specializes in the valuation of intellectual property-driven firms, such as software firms, aerospace firms and professional services firms, most frequently in the capacity as a transaction advisor, helping clients obtain great outcomes from complex transaction opportunities. He is also a specialist in the appraisal of intellectual properties as stand-alone assets, such as software, trade secrets, and patents.

Mike has been a full-time business appraiser for 13 years with public accounting firms, boutique business appraisal firms, and an owner of his own firm. Prior to that, he spent 8 years in venture capital and investment banking, including transactions in the U.S., Israel, Russia, Ukraine, and Belarus.

Brady Ware & Company

Brady Ware & Company is a regional full-service accounting and advisory firm which helps businesses and entrepreneurs make visions a reality. Brady Ware services clients nationally from its offices in Alpharetta, GA; Columbus and Dayton, OH; and Richmond, IN. The firm is growth minded, committed to the regions in which they operate, and most importantly, they make significant investments in their people and service offerings to meet the changing financial needs of those they are privileged to serve. The firm is dedicated to providing results that make a difference for its clients.

Decision Vision Podcast Series

should i sue my financial advisor“Decision Vision” is a podcast covering topics and issues facing small business owners and connecting them with solutions from leading experts. This series is presented by Brady Ware & Company. If you are a decision maker for a small business, we’d love to hear from you. Contact us at decisionvision@bradyware.com and make sure to listen to every Thursday to the “Decision Vision” podcast. Past episodes of “Decision Vision” can be found here. “Decision Vision” is produced and broadcast by the North Fulton studio of Business RadioX®.

Visit Brady Ware & Company on social media:

LinkedIn:  https://www.linkedin.com/company/brady-ware/

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/bradywareCPAs/

Twitter: https://twitter.com/BradyWare

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/bradywarecompany/

Show Transcript

Intro: [00:00:02] Welcome to Decision Vision, a podcast series focusing on critical business decisions brought to you by Brady Ware & Company. Brady Ware is a regional full-service accounting and advisory firm that helps businesses and entrepreneurs make visions a reality.

Mike Blake: [00:00:20] Welcome to Decision Vision, a podcast giving you, the listener, a clear vision to make great decisions. In each episode, we discuss the process of decision making on a different topic from the business owners or executives’ perspective. We aren’t necessarily telling you what to do, but we can put you in a position to make an informed decision on your own and understand when you might need help along the way.

Mike Blake: [00:00:39] My name is Mike Blake and I’m your host for today’s program. I’m a director at Brady Ware & Company, a full-service accounting firm based in Dayton, Ohio, with offices in Dayton, Columbus, Ohio, Richmond, Indiana, and Alpharetta, Georgia, which is where we are recording today. Brady Ware is sponsoring this podcast. If you like this podcast, please subscribe on your favorite podcast aggregator and please consider leaving a review of the podcast, as well.

Mike Blake: [00:01:03] And so, today’s topic is understanding if your financial adviser is truly working for you. And if you think that they’re not, what steps can you take to either correct that scenario or if there have been losses that have resulted from a financial adviser not doing what they’re supposed to be doing for you, how you might go about recovering them or securing some kind of restitution. And I want to be clear about a couple of things about this topic.

Mike Blake: [00:01:35] It’s easy to kind of look at the title of this podcast and say that while this is just going to be a hatchet job on financial advisers. And that’s not really the goal. I know many financial advisers and wealth planners and actually hold the CFA Charter, which is an accreditation that some wealth managers decide to pursue. And I’ll tell you, I have nothing but respect for the financial advisory profession as a whole. And I’ve told people this offline, I tell them all the time, I think it’s actually one of the hardest, if not the hardest profession in finance, because it is highly regulated.

Mike Blake: [00:02:17] It is a business in which the sales cycle typically is measured in years, not days and months. And it requires a different kind of skill set than most financial people have, like, you know, I couldn’t do it. I’m a quant jock that sits behind a spreadsheet all day. And developing the kinds of relationships and that result in somebody entrusting you with their wealth, often, their life’s savings or maybe the savings of several generations of their family in some cases is an extremely hard thing to do.

Mike Blake: [00:02:58] And so, you know, I think the days of, you know, the typical kind of stockbroker dialing for dollars, boiler room kind of thing, Wall Street kind of thing, you know, the movies kind of put those out there, but, you know, they don’t really match reality. I don’t think anymore, although maybe our guests will have something to say about that. But at the same time, I think that this topic is important because a piece of advice I often give clients and anybody else who cares to listen is that, you know, if something’s really important and if you hire an expert to help you with it, it’s not a bad idea to get a second expert to look over the shoulder of the first expert.

Mike Blake: [00:03:40] Because you don’t really know if that expert is doing a great job for you, because they’re the expert, you’re not. You’re entrusting them with your relationship with whatever task or mandate that you’re giving to them, right? And I’ll put myself out there as an example, I’m a business appraiser. And you could argue that a business appraiser doesn’t even understand what we do, but what we do is a very complex thing, a complex task. We sometimes do a good job of communicating what we’ve done and how we’ve done it, sometimes, we don’t.

Mike Blake: [00:04:16] But, you know, the fact of the matter is, is I can tell you from my experience in over half the cases, a client decides I’ve done a good job or not a good job if my number comes out to what they thought the number was coming in. And so, if they thought their business is worth a million dollars and I say, “Yeah, your business is worth a million dollars, I’m a genius. “On the other hand, if they thought it was a million dollars and I come in, I say it’s $3 million, then, you know, I’m an idiot, “I can’t believe that I hired you”, et cetera, right?

Mike Blake: [00:04:48] But the fact of the matter is that the most clients are not in a position really to assess my work. And so, in my field of profession, there actually is now another industry of people that do reviews of what I do. And I hold that accreditation called the Credit and Business Appraisal Review, whose job it is and whose role it is to come in behind the appraise and tell the client, “Yeah, they did what they’re doing. They’re doing a good job”, because as a client, you don’t necessarily have the skill set to make that assessment on your own.

Mike Blake: [00:05:22] It’s really no different than if you’re being told that you need to have a kidney taken out and you decided to get a second or maybe third opinion, right? Because you can’t really tell, you don’t have the medical training. And this applies to the financial advisory space as well. If you entrust your wealth, whether it’s in part or in whole, you know, how do you know whether that person is doing a good job or not? And usually, you only find out if they’re doing a bad job if something happens.

Mike Blake: [00:05:54] You look at your brokerage statement one day and there’s a lot less value there than there should be, for whatever reason, or there may be other triggers that we’ll talk about, right? But the reality is that event may be years or even decades in the making, depending on how comfortable you are with following your brokered statements, how engaged you are with managing your wealth and not all clients are that engaged in management. And that’s the value proposition, right?

Mike Blake: [00:06:24] “Turn over me. You can go out and play golf. You don’t have to pay attention to this necessarily, we’ll touch base every few months”, and off you go. And that’s fine as far as it goes. But what it also does, it puts the client in a tremendously vulnerable position. And again, I can’t emphasize this enough. I know many wealth advisers. And the ones that I know, I would not hesitate to refer clients out to them, I think they play a very important role in society and in the economy, because managing wealth is an important and complex thing to do.

Mike Blake: [00:07:02] But because it’s important and complex, you know, I think you, as a listener, need to understand how do you evaluate the job that the financial advisers are doing. In particular, to make sure that you’re not being taken advantage of in a vulnerable situation. And if it turns out that you are being taken advantage of, what is your recourse? And just as importantly, and we’ll talk about this in the interview, you know, just because you lose money, that doesn’t mean that your financial adviser screwed you.

Mike Blake: [00:07:35] Sometimes, investments just don’t work out, that, you know, there’s just no guarantee of that, right? And so, it’s equally important to understand that just because you lost money, that doesn’t mean the next thing you do is you get on the phone with an attorney and start throwing lawsuits around and complaints at the SEC around, you know, the market take it and the market give it and take it away. So, with that as kind of the background of setting the stage, I’d like to introduce our guest today, my friend Robert Port, who is a partner with the Atlanta law firm of Gaslowitz Frankel LLC.

Mike Blake: [00:08:14] The firm focuses on all aspects of fiduciary disputes representing individuals, executors, trustees, investors, shareholders, and financial institutions in complex fiduciary disputes involving wills, estates, trusts, guardianships, businesses, and securities litigation and arbitration. Robert has significant experience representing investors harmed by the misconduct of their stockbroker, investment adviser, insurance agent, or other trusted adviser. Robert is AV rated by Martindale-Hubbell. Maybe he’ll tell us what AV means and has been repeatedly selected as a Georgia super lawyer.

Mike Blake: [00:08:46] I think he left the cape in the car in the practice areas of securities litigation and fiduciary litigation. Robert is a frequent speaker on fiduciary litigation and securities litigation and arbitration before a variety of audiences, including the Georgia Institute of Continuing Legal Education, the Atlanta Bar Association, and Strafford CLE seminars, the National Association of Personal Financial Advisors, the Georgia Society of CPAs, and the National Business Institute. He has appeared on many media outlets, ones that are far more prominent and important than this one. So, I’m very grateful today that Robert has agreed to come on our little program. Robert, welcome.

Robert Port: [00:09:26] Well, thank you very much for inviting me, Mike. Excellent, excellent introduction. You touched on a lot of things that I think are very important in evaluating what I do and how I approach potential cases in this area.

Mike Blake: [00:09:41] So, let’s jump right into that. So, your role, how do you describe your role in that discussion?

Robert Port: [00:09:52] All right. Let me step back a little bit and talk about what I think about when a potential client calls. So, a call will come in and someone will tell me, you know, I think I have an issue with my adviser or my account to is X. Now, it’s X minus Y or they sold me something I didn’t understand, whatever the case may be. And one of the things that I need to do is approach it as though I were an adviser. I’m not licensed in that area, but I need to know enough to determine whether the investments that the adviser recommended if it was a recommendation situation or if the adviser had discretion.

Robert Port: [00:10:37] Meaning, the adviser had the right to buy and sell things without seeking approval beforehand, whether the investments that the adviser put together are appropriate, suitable is often a word used, for the particular individual. So, that is sort of the benchmark and there is no black and white area here. But generically, you have to look at somebody’s age, experience, income, net worth, their needs, their own personal risk tolerance to try and get a sense of what was suitable and appropriate for them. So, to paint a sort of broad-brush picture, my two boys who are in their 30s have a different risk profile than I do in my 60s. They may not want to, but theoretically, they can tolerate more risk.

Mike Blake: [00:11:36] They can put money into the company that turns peanut butter in a jet fuel.

Robert Port: [00:11:41] Absolutely. And I hope they do. And I hope they make zillions of dollars and this can support dad in his retirement. So, that’s the first thing I need to do. And going back to one of the points you made in the introduction is you are correct that a lot of people hear what I do. And in this area of securities litigation and arbitration and the impression is, “All right. You know, we’re going to sue somebody. My Apple stock went down $2 yesterday”, run down to the courthouse. Clearly, not the case for a whole bunch of reasons.

Robert Port: [00:12:17] One of which is I need to maintain my own credibility in this area. So, going back to my prior point, the first thing I need to think about is, what is the appropriate investment profile for the person who’s calling? And without getting too much into the weeds, looking at various other investments, you can get a sense over the time period that they’re concerned about how an investment would have performed. And what I try and look at is generically, if you can do a profile of what somebody would have been invested and how would that have turned out?

Robert Port: [00:13:00] It may have gone up. It may have gone down. And then, you compare that to where they actually ended up. And the mere fact that you’ve lost money, even substantial money, does not necessarily mean you have a legal case. And the perfect example of that was what people call the Great Recession in ’07, ’08, where generically, a basket of securities comprising a fair mix of the S&P 500 and some bonds, as best I recall, would have been down 35, 40%. Now, that’s a lot to go down. That’s a third of your value.

Robert Port: [00:13:42] But for a vast majority of investors, it was entirely appropriate that they have investments like that. And as a result, it was entirely, I wouldn’t say appropriate, but reasonable that their portfolio would have lost that much. On the other hand, I had cases during that era with, I recall one case with a widow who was in her 70s whose portfolio lost 80% during that period. You know, that alone does not indicate that there’s a case, but it’s certainly a red flag to dig further and see whether what happened was inappropriate for her.

Mike Blake: [00:14:30] So, it’s one thing, you know, in the Great Recession, pretty much everybody lost money, right? The question was how much.

Robert Port: [00:14:36] Right.

Mike Blake: [00:14:37] But the red flag is, well, this one person who probably should have had a lower risk profile, why do they lose twice as much money as most everybody else, right? That’s the red flag?

Robert Port: [00:14:48] Right. And in that particular case, as I recall, and that’s been about 10 years ago now, her adviser had put her in. What we’d call, you know, penny stocks and more risky investments. Now, if she had been in, you know, people talk about blue chip stocks, you know, the names we all know, I’m not going to say any here, because I’m not going to do anything that sounds like a recommendation, but the names who we all know that have been around for a while and pay dividends, those went down as well. And in fact, some well-known names stopped paying dividends, but that would have been appropriate for her. And if she had called and said, “My portfolio’s down 25%”, I would have said, as politely as possible, “You’re lucky, you know. You went down less than everybody else.”

Mike Blake: [00:15:40] Right.

Robert Port: [00:15:40] So, the point is, as an attorney, the first thing I need to do is determine whether or not there are legally recognizable damages and to articulate that in words rather than numbers, from my perspective, as someone who represents investors, that legally cognizable damage number is the difference between where they should have been with a portfolio that was suitable or an appropriate versus where they are. It’s the difference. And let me also add to that. Many lay people and this goes to your comments about getting expertise and having knowledge, I enjoy this stuff. I know everybody else. A lot of folks don’t. It’s just gobbledygook. They don’t open up their statements, because they don’t understand them. That’s not exactly what I like to see, but it’s a fact.

Mike Blake: [00:16:39] Yeah.

Robert Port: [00:16:39] It happens.

Mike Blake: [00:16:39] Yeah, people are people.

Robert Port: [00:16:42] People are people. And so, one of the things is many folks will look at their statements or talking to their friends and they will see that their portfolio is up X, but here, that their neighbor, whose adviser are on their own, was lucky enough to buy, pick a name, Google when it was 2 cents and it’s now whatever it is, they made a fortune.

Mike Blake: [00:17:09] Not a recommendation.

Robert Port: [00:17:09] Not a recommendation. But the point there is in hindsight, it is entirely inappropriate to say, “Well, I would have picked only things”, or, “My advisers should have picked things that only went up.” No one knows what the future holds. Your adviser’s obligation at the time they make the recommendation or exercise their discretion to purchase something for you is, again, to do something that reasonably matches your own personal risk profile, your needs, what you’ve told the adviser or what you want. And the last point on that I’d make is sort of this analogy.

Robert Port: [00:17:55] When we go shopping for clothes, you go to the store and there are different sizes, there are different styles. And that is because the old saying, one size does not fit all. And that’s true in investments. One size does not fit all. What your neighbor has may or may not be right for you. And one of the red flags I’d caution people to think about or keep an eye on is an adviser who seemingly has the same solution for everyone, all right? You see them, they sell you or trying to sell you the same variable annuity that your neighbor has or their other clients have or this portfolio or this fund or whatever it is. Investments need to be tailored to the individual.

Mike Blake: [00:18:48] And that segues actually nicely into the next question, because there’s an important piece of vocabulary in this world that I want to make sure the listener understands, and that is the term fiduciary, right? What is the term fiduciary mean and where does that enter into this discussion that you’re describing?

Robert Port: [00:19:11] Well, the word fiduciary in legal terms means that the person who acts as a fiduciary is supposed to take your interests, your best interests into account in making decisions to avoid conflicts of interest and to do solely what is in your best interest. Think of someone who is a trustee of a trust. They’re not supposed to self-deal, they’re only supposed to do what’s right and appropriate as directed by the trust documents. And the same thing, in my view, with respect to financial advisers, the advice they have to give, in my view, is only what is in your best interest.

Robert Port: [00:19:58] They should not be motivated by the fact that they might earn a lot of commissions by selling you a mutual fund or annuity or if you’re dealing with an insurance person a insurance policy. Now, if I can get into the weeds a little bit, one of the things that lay people generally don’t understand is that there is a distinction in the law, and certainly, the investment community understands this, between what are generally known as stockbrokers versus what are called financial advisers.

Robert Port: [00:20:36] And in the law, financial adviser is actually an important term. A financial adviser who is registered under what’s called the 1940 Investment Advisers Act has an obligation to act as a fiduciary, as a matter of statutory law in the Supreme Court case law. In contrast, a stockbroker, depending upon their licensing, is obligated to only adhere to what’s called a suitability standard, which is a lesser standard than a fiduciary. And in fact, and this is a debate I often have in cases with the attorneys who are on the other side of the case, I believe that even a stockbroker has a fiduciary obligation.

Robert Port: [00:21:25] I believe there’s a case law that supports that, but to be candid, there are arguments that can be made that a stockbroker only has an obligation of suitability, which is generally described as an obligation to only recommend investments that are suitable based on the customer’s age, income, risk tolerance, and things like that. And the distinction, you know, sort of lawyerly, it may sound to some people like we’re arguing over, what’s the phrase, the head of a pin or something like that.

Mike Blake: [00:22:00] Like dancing on the head of a pin.

Robert Port: [00:22:01] Dancing on the head of a pin, the distinction is that the suitability obligation is a lesser obligation than the fiduciary obligation. So, someone can recommend something that is arguably suitable but is not in the client’s best interest. Stockbroker could, for example, recommend an investment that has higher fees to the client, earns them higher commissions, where there would be an argument that if they were acting as a fiduciary, that wouldn’t be the case, that they can’t do that.

Robert Port: [00:22:33] So, to the extent I have a recommendation as a lawyer, I would only use a financial adviser who forthrightly acknowledges that they have a fiduciary obligation and that technically means they need to work for an entity that is a registered investment advisor, RIA. And that means that they, as individuals, are an investment adviser representative, an IAR. Those people, there are no guarantees, even fiduciary is messed up. But to the extent that people willingly and knowingly take on that obligation, whatever the opposite of a red flag is, that’s a-

Mike Blake: [00:23:25] Green light.

Robert Port: [00:23:25] Green light, that there is a probability that they may well, in fact, understand what they’re doing, have the expertise that Mike spoke about in his introduction. And again, a probability, only a probability, nobody can give you any guarantees that they will do what is right for you and in your best interests.

Mike Blake: [00:23:46] Now, in this discussion, there’s also a distinction between a prudent person, you speak of a prudent man, I think, a prudent person is now the term of art, and a prudent expert. Are you familiar with that or am I-

Robert Port: [00:23:59] I’m not.

Mike Blake: [00:23:59] Okay.

Robert Port: [00:24:00] But Let’s explore it.

Mike Blake: [00:24:01] Okay.

Robert Port: [00:24:01] Sounds interesting.

Mike Blake: [00:24:02] So, I’m curious if you’ve run into this. So, it does come up in the CFA curriculum and a prudent person is when they’re in a position of making decisions on behalf of somebody. If, say, they’re an executor of a trust, but they’re not necessarily a trustee, but they have been entrusted with a certain role, but you’re not necessarily an expert. Like, say, you know, somebody who works in retail suddenly is put in a position, maybe they didn’t realize that they’re put in a position of managing their family’s assets, their parents passed away, the will named that person as the executor and now, this person, you know, may have experience handling assets, perhaps, doesn’t, right?

Mike Blake: [00:24:47] As I understand it, maybe not legal standard, but the professional standard to which that person is held is a prudent person, meaning that you’re supposed to be a reasonably intelligent person. You’re supposed to apply common sense in how you manage those assets. But because you weren’t holding yourself out as an expert, that doesn’t mean that you’re necessarily competent, but it does mean that you’re logical and you’re trying to basically do the right thing, as opposed to a prudent expert.

Mike Blake: [00:25:16] And I’ve seen this in cases where I’ve worked with one case I had a few years ago, where a family asset went into conservatorship. And the conservator, as it turned out, was the business owner’s daughter who was a CPA. And she was very unhappy about this. So, she wants to get rid of this like it’s a grenade with the pin pulled out, I can tell you that. But she was put in the position of being a prudent expert because she held a CPA license. And therefore, was assumed to have a greater body of knowledge around finance that another person may not necessarily have.

Mike Blake: [00:25:54] And so, I guess that’s a long preamble to making an observation of which I would like you to comment, that sometimes, financial advisers are, in fact, accidental, right? You don’t realize you’re going to be put in that position. All of a sudden, you are, right? And in that case, does the law provide for additional leeway when you say, “Look, I didn’t sign up for this. I kind of did the best I could, but, you know-

Robert Port: [00:26:23] Right. No, I’ve got it. And that’s fantastic. I’ve never actually heard of the prudent expert concept, and I’d have to think about that a little bit, but—

Mike Blake: [00:26:33] It may not be a legal term—

Robert Port: [00:26:34] Yeah.

Mike Blake: [00:26:34] … may just be in my professional standards.

Robert Port: [00:26:36] Right. But what your comment made me think of is this, Georgia and a lot of states have a trust code and under the trust codes, someone who takes on the position of being a trustee, either voluntarily or because they’re thrust into it, because maybe even unbeknownst to them, a relative or somebody wrote in their will or in the trust that, “When I die or when I become incompetent under my trust, you’re my trustee”, and the law imposes an obligation of prudence, I forgot exactly what the precise terminology is, but it’s essentially what you’ve described.

Robert Port: [00:27:20] So, again, without giving detailed thought to it, I don’t believe you get much of a pass if you take on that role, which under the law means you’re a fiduciary, whether you want it to be or not, I would say you don’t get a pass, because, you know, I don’t know a stock from a kumquat. I don’t know anything about investing. If you take on that role or thrust into it, it seems, to me, entirely reasonable to insist that you either resign and get someone to do it or seek the assistance of someone who knows what they’re doing. And, you know, a lot of answers to questions that people ask me about the law are it depends.

Mike Blake: [00:28:16] Yeah.

Robert Port: [00:28:17] Which is a reference to, you know, what are the background facts? You know, there’s a lot of things in the law that aren’t black and white, they’re shades of gray. And so, this is one where, again, if I were writing on a clean slate and I’m thinking of some of the cases my firm does in the area of trust and estates litigation, where clearly, I have one going on now, someone without the expertise to be a trustee has been handling a trust and has caused hundreds of thousands of dollars’ worth of damage in our view.

Robert Port: [00:28:56] And I am pursuing the case under the assumption, an argument that it really doesn’t matter that he didn’t have the expertise. And if I can, that’s a segue for me to mention this, I am, by nature, very adverse to, adding what Warren Buffett sometimes calls, all the helpers. You know, the CPAs, the attorneys, the financial advisers, everybody is getting a little piece of the action. By my nature, I’m not thrilled with that.

Robert Port: [00:29:38] On the other hand, I have learned in this practice dealing with fiduciary disputes in the wills, trust, and estates area and in the securities area, that it is well worth the cost, presuming the costs are reasonable and appropriate, to get the expertise that Mike has described, to get a professional fiduciary. There are entire companies of substantial worth whose business is to manage assets. And the way I view those fees is the fees you will pay for doing that, which are generally a percentage of assets under management, I view that as an insurance policy to avoid having assets managed by someone who does not know what they are doing and the risk of that.

Robert Port: [00:30:29] That is like an insurance premium. And most of the cases we see in the trust and estates area, almost all of them are lay people who’ve been thrust in these roles. You know, the oldest son who’s the attorney, the daughter who’s a CPA, the son who’s the doctor, and mom and dad think, “Yeah, sure. They’re smart, they can handle this.” And either intentionally or unintentionally, they don’t have a clue of what they’re doing. And that can range from mere negligence to essentially outright embezzlement.

Mike Blake: [00:31:12] And, you know, the funny thing about embezzlement and white collar—

Robert Port: [00:31:17] Not to the person that’s being embezzled.

Mike Blake: [00:31:19] Yeah, that’s true. But not funny, humorous, but funny, strange, is-

Robert Port: [00:31:24] Yeah.

Mike Blake: [00:31:24] Especially if you’re a lay person and you’re not used to this, I think many of those crimes are committed quasi-accidentally and that they don’t understand kind of where the line necessarily is. Now, what you bring up in that scenario is interesting because it actually applies to me. So, you know, my parents wanted me initially to be the trustee of their estate, which with my financial background, I am fully qualified to do. But perfectly candid, I do not get along very well with my sister. And so, what I told them was that if you do that, the returns on the estate will be great and there’ll be a lot of very happy lawyers, right?

Mike Blake: [00:32:05] Because I just know the way that relationship’s going to go. So, you know, even in that particular case, because one thing you have to look at is family dynamics, too. Just because I’m technically qualified, that doesn’t necessarily mean that I’m the best person for that job and somebody independent, I think, and that thankfully, my parents ultimately saw the wisdom of that, providing for an independent trustee is going to go a long way to making sure that the wealth does what it’s supposed to do.

Robert Port: [00:32:35] Yeah, you’re a very wise son. And you raise one other issue, which we see in our practice. And sometimes, folks will ask, “Well, what’s a bit of advice you give to people?” And this is true I think generically with dealing with family money is, to the extent possible, transparency, disclosure, and explaining to your heirs or whomever needs to know why it is you’re making the decisions you’re making.

Robert Port: [00:33:09] What’s been interesting to me is to realize that even people of nominal means over a lifetime can accidentally accumulate a meaningful amount of money, you know, seven figures is not unusual if you’re middle class, you don’t burn through your money, and it just sits there and accumulates. And what is interesting is for some reason in our society, talking about money is taboo. And mom and dad don’t want the kids to know that, “When I die, you guys are going to split one million, two million, five million.”.

Robert Port: [00:33:51] And surprise, we’re both gone and now, you’ve got to wrestle with it. So, we advocate within the extent possible to have some disclosure, to have some transparency if there are, for example, a reason you want to give one child more than the other, explain that. If you want to leave the marital home or the vacation home to one child or the other or give it all to the ASPCA. Whatever it i, explain that.

Robert Port: [00:34:20] It may not eliminate the disputes, but to the extent your heirs can understand your rationale, it’s very helpful. And when you couple that with, as you have wisely done for the circumstances you’ve described, have a third party in there, it has the probability of tamping down disputes. Now, you know, your family members may get into a dispute with the third party, but, you know, you’ve done what’s appropriate and hopefully, they have executed their duties appropriately.

Mike Blake: [00:34:57] So, I want to come back to the primary topic, because there’s one question I want to make sure that we get kind of out there, which is, you know, if I’m not happy with my portfolio, what are kind of the signs that, as somebody who’s an investor, I might see my portfolio that might lead me to conclude that there is something amiss, some sort of malfeasance, as opposed to, “It’s just my tough luck, a loss”, right?

Mike Blake: [00:35:32] How can I triage initially to make sure I’m not just sort of running to you every time I lose 2% where, right? As opposed to, you know, “This is really bad. I shouldn’t have taken 10% of my portfolio and invested in his brother’s alpaca farm”, right? It’s typically not that egregious. So, in your experience, what are kind of the breadcrumbs that say, you know, you really ought to think about talking to somebody to see if there was something amiss?

Robert Port: [00:36:02] Sure. I think the first thing to think about is reflect back on your initial discussions with your adviser. Did he or she take as much of a deep dive as they could into learning about you? You know, what are your needs? Do you have kids that need to go to college? Are you worried about your retirement? Do you have aging parents who might have to support? Are you going to lie awake at night if you see in the paper that the stock market’s gone down, you know, X percent today or tomorrow?

Robert Port: [00:36:37] Reflect back on whether you feel that the adviser got a good picture of who you are. And that goes back to what I said before, which is one size does not fit all. You know, if you’re dealing with an adviser whom is uninterested in any of that or doesn’t appear to be and doesn’t really find out about you, I think that’s a red flag. If you can, not to get started, but if you’re there, reflect back on that.

Robert Port: [00:37:10] The other thing, there’s a number of other things that come to mind, I would get an understanding as to whether or not the investments seem to be, I’ll say, ordinary and boring or that stocks and bonds and mutual funds or are they calling you about hedge funds and real estate investments and annuity abuse, particularly, variable annuities and what’s called equity-indexed annuities are a problem. You know, do the investments sound overly complicated?

Robert Port: [00:37:52] And one way to think about this is this is your money, you’ve worked a lifetime or your working career to accumulate it, if you can’t explain to, you know, a child who is 10 years old what your money is doing and where it is, you ought to ask yourself whether that ought to be the case. If you don’t understand what’s happening with your money, that’s potentially a red flag. Now, you know, Mike talked about expertise and I often make analogies, too, to going to the doctor.

Robert Port: [00:38:29] You know, you go to the doctor and here, she says, “Well, you have this issue and you need this operation or take this medicine.” And hopefully, they explain it enough, so you understand what the problem is. And think about that with your own adviser and with your investments as well, you know. You may not be able to talk about PE ratios and, you know, Delta and all the other ways that someone like Mike knows how to measure investment performance, but you should have an understanding, generically, how much of my portfolio is exposed to stocks, how much is exposed to bonds. What else is going on? Do I need investment income, dividends, and things like that?

Robert Port: [00:39:17] I would also be concerned about something that Mike alluded to, which is, you know, is the adviser suggesting you invest in things that are, if you will, offline. You know, this adviser call, I’ve had cases where the adviser says, “Well, you know, I’m getting into rental housing and, you know, I need some investors”, or, you know, “My brother-in-law’s alpaca farm” or, you know, “My buddy is starting a hedge fund and, you know, needs some money and, you know, I think it’s a great investment.” And another one is there are no guarantees against loss, I guess, except maybe if you buy government bonds.

Mike Blake: [00:40:09] Right.

Robert Port: [00:40:09] There’s a debate about loss there. But if you hold them to the end, you know, unless the world blows up, you’ll get your principal back.

Mike Blake: [00:40:15] Nominally, you’ll get your principal back.

Robert Port: [00:40:16] Right. So, be concerned if an adviser says, “Oh, it’s guaranteed.” That doesn’t necessarily apply to annuities. They’re backed by insurance companies and you get your money back. But on annuities, and again, I’m talking about particular types of annuities, immediate annuities are generally not an issue, but when you’re sold an annuity, for example, there is a prospectus, that may not be the exact right word for annuities, but generally, a thick document written by a whole room full of lawyers explaining how this thing works.

Mike Blake: [00:40:56] Explaining in quotations.

Robert Port: [00:40:59] Yeah, in air quotes. That’s exactly right. And I have had cases where these are incomprehensible. I had one case where I hired an expert who has something like a PhD from MIT in mathematics. And he said it took him and his three colleagues, who also have similar credentials like a week to figure out how this thing worked.

Mike Blake: [00:41:21] Jesus.

Robert Port: [00:41:23] And it goes back to what I said before, if you can’t read and understand what’s happening with your money, even though, you know, you may find out later, you could have tripled your money in two weeks, don’t do it. And that sort of leads me to something else. And I can obviously go on and on here. But one of the principal things, I think, folks need to understand is, what is a reasonable rate of return?

Robert Port: [00:41:52] One of the things that Ponzi schemes and you can think about Bernie Madoff, if you will, as an example, is that they promise folks unreasonable rates of return. And I’m speaking from memory here, but one of the things to think about, is what is a fair rate of return, unreasonable investments right now? So, if I’m recalling correctly, if you were to buy government bonds right now, you might get, what? One-and-a-half, 2% a year?

Mike Blake: [00:42:24] Yeah. Give or take the term, yes.

Robert Port: [00:42:26] Right. If you buy generically all of the stocks in the S&P 500, you know, historically, depending upon what numbers you use, including dividends or not, you know, maybe 7, 8% and so on and so forth. So, if someone comes to you and says, and I’ve seen this, 15% per month guaranteed, it might happen, but there’s no free lunch, return is not without risk. And to me, you know, that sort of screams some sort of fraud. So, I’ve talked about bench marking before in terms of figuring out your damages.

Robert Port: [00:43:09] One other thing in terms of figuring out whether you are in a place that you ought to be is if your adviser is guaranteeing returns, guaranteeing against loss of income, what return is he or she guaranteeing? You know, Bernie Madoff’s brilliance, if I can use that word, is that he structured his Ponzi scheme, so he returned 10% essentially per year, year-after-year, which interestingly enough, comes very close to a little bit more risky investment portfolio, which is not outrageous. So, he sort of slipped under the radar there. But what a lot of lay people didn’t realize was that it is almost impossible to have annual returns like that year-after-year.

Robert Port: [00:44:02] You know, I said a moment ago, the S&P returns, maybe, you know, 7, 8%. That’s not year-after-year-after-year. That’s over 20, 30 years. You know, it might go up 15% one year, down 20% the next. And that is an average. So, you know, be careful out there. Understand what you’re getting into. Be able to explain it. Don’t believe that you’re special and you’re getting these fabulous returns. Because candidly, one of the things that I often think about is if, in fact, there was an investment that had, you know, 15% per month returns, I don’t know why anyone would sell that to anyone else, I’d keep that all to myself.

Mike Blake: [00:44:53] Absolutely.

Robert Port: [00:44:54] And I’d benefit from that. And I wouldn’t be selling it to people for a small commission on getting them into it.

Mike Blake: [00:45:02] You know, what you’re talking about, these Ponzi schemes remind me, and you would have gotten a kick out of this, you know, I started my career in Russia and I started at a point where they were going through privatization. You may recall they had vouchers where you basically got a certificate from the government that basically said you had equity in the state’s assets. That was the way they tried to privatize. But the problem is, 150 million Russians have these vouchers.

Mike Blake: [00:45:34] On an individual basis, they really weren’t worth a whole lot, right? And that was not a society that accumulated a lot of wealth. It was designed to prevent that, right? Communism. And so, I still remember there are commercials for this company, at the time, it was called MMM Invest. And this was before they had our kind of securities laws in terms of disclosures, what you can say and what you can’t say. And they would brazenly come on and say, “If you invest your voucher with us and we’re guaranteeing, you know, a 30% rate of return every quarter.”.

Mike Blake: [00:46:08] And they’d have these people come on and saying, “I invested my voucher with MMM Invest and now, I’m driving a Rolls Royce”, that kind of thing, right? And it just shows, you know, their securities laws have since evolved somewhat, I’m not sure at our level, but it was it was interesting to see when you kind of take the safeties off of the regulations, right? You don’t see that on TV here. But without regulations, you’d see that all the time.

Robert Port: [00:46:36] Well, that’s a fascinating story. I’ve always wondered about the transition from communism to whatever it’s become. But I will say this, if you hearken back to right before the Great Depression, your listeners may recall the commercials on TV, where someone’s invested with ABC company and now, they’re on a yacht and now, they’re sitting on a beach with their broker in front of their presumably fancy second, third, or fourth home.

Robert Port: [00:47:09] So, you know, they may not come on TV and say 30% per year, but they’re saying, “Well, trust us and we’ll turn your money into this.” And that actually made me think of one other thing that is important to me and in fact, how I think about investing for me personally, and again, I’m not an adviser, but this this is the way I think about it, there is nothing wrong with batting for average, all right? Going back to what I said before, you know, a basket of securities broadly invested across stocks and bonds over the last, you know, 30, 40, 50 years, yes, there have been terrible ups and downs.

Robert Port: [00:48:00] And if you go back even further to the Great Depression, you know, it was horrific. But over long periods of time, if you can stomach the ups and downs and that goes to what’s reasonable and appropriate for you, you will get a fair average return or I won’t say you will, because that’s predicting, but you have. Nobody knows what the future holds. And what’s interesting is there are study-after-study that demonstrate that, but also, at the same time, have looked at actual investors’ returns.

Robert Port: [00:48:39] You know, taking into account the people who watch TV and buy this, sell this, and they trade and they incur commissions and tax costs and just sort of, I don’t recall the exact numbers, but let’s say over the last 20 years, the S&P diversified portfolio, let’s say, has return, I’ll pick a number, 7%. What they find is people who think they can predict the market and buy and sell or do different things, they generally, on average, I think that the differential is, you know, something like 5 or 4%.

Robert Port: [00:49:17] You know, they’re losing conceptually 3% a year because they’re trading and because they think they know the future. So, A, bat for average. B, understand that no matter how brilliant your adviser is or you think they are, they don’t know what the future holds. And one way to think about this, in my mind, is lots of folks will point to, “Well, Warren Buffett has earned these fabulous returns.” I forget what they are, but it’s approaching, what, 15, 20% year over year over year since the ’50s?

Mike Blake: [00:49:56] Yeah, although the last two years have not been kind to Berkshire Hathaway. But until then, yes.

Robert Port: [00:50:00] Okay. But the point I’d leave your listeners with is that’s fine. Mike, as a numbers guy, will understand what I say, that there is a probability that people like Warren Buffet exist, what they would call outliers, they get more than average returns. The question for any investor, I think, is what is the probability of the hundreds of thousands of advisers out there? What’s the probability that today, you’re going to pick the adviser who will 20 or 25 years from now be the next Warren Buffett? And I’d respectfully suggest that probability is approaching zero.

Mike Blake: [00:50:45] It is. I often characterize Warren Buffett, and I call Warren, he calls me, who the hell are you? But I characterize him as Mozart.

Robert Port: [00:50:54] Yeah.

Mike Blake: [00:50:55] Right. And there’s only one Mozart in several generations. Even Warren Buffett has said, “If you wake up in the morning and you look in the mirror and somebody besides me is staring back at you, you ought to be in index funds.”

Robert Port: [00:51:07] That’s exactly right.

Mike Blake: [00:51:10] Robert, we’re running out of time. There’s one other question I want to ask before we let you go, because we talked about some kind of the smoking gun elements where maybe, there’s something that somebody might come to you and ask a question about and I want to ask specifically about a lot of account activity, right? And you talked about the people that do their own churning, they’re day traders, and, you know, maybe you beat the market by 2%, but you’ve paid 4%, so you’re really not even on that.

Robert Port: [00:51:37] Well, plus taxes.

Mike Blake: [00:51:37] Plus taxes, right? So, my question is, if they have an actively managed account, they open their broker’s statement and see there’s a lot of activity, is that often a smoking gun?

Robert Port: [00:51:52] Well, thank you for raising that. Yes, it can be. And what’s important to understand in this day and age is the manner in which funds are invested now by investors is a little different than it used to be. So, Mike used the word churning and the concept in the law is a lot of buying and selling in your account to generate commissions for the broker that may or may not be good for you. So, yes, lots of activity in the account can be an indication that there’s a problem.

Robert Port: [00:52:33] But the caveat is that many brokerage firms, in particular, and indeed other advisers are going to what are called the managed accounts now, where your funds are actually placed with another investment management fund and they do, in fact, trade, as best I can tell, every day. And the way some of those are structured is you will get a statement, I’ve seen these, where, you know, it’ll be pages and pages and pages because the transaction’s done in what’s called the managed account flow through to you.

Robert Port: [00:53:12] That might not be a problem if, in fact, the setup is a managed account run by an independent adviser, where the fee is simply computed on assets on their management and they’re not taken a commission on every trade. But the bottom line is, yes, lots of activity can indicate a problem, it could indicate your broker is churning your account because his kid needs to go to college or he wants a new boat or he wants to compete with the broker down the hall who just got a new Maserati, whatever the case may be.

Robert Port: [00:53:47] So, you know, look at that. Is it a black and white issue? Sometimes, it is. And just a short story years ago, I represented an elderly widow whose account had what we call turnover rate of 21 annually. And what that meant was, and Michael could explain how that’s done, because I had someone other than me do it, but when you do the math, functionally, what was happening is her entire account was bought and sold every other week.

Robert Port: [00:54:29] Right. And she started with, I think the numbers were $160,000. And over the course of a year, when she came to me, she had $1,500 dollars left and the broker had earned $40,000 in commission. Now, that’s probably one of the most egregious cases I will see, but that goes to churning. So, bottom line is, yes, lots of activity, particularly, if you have not given your adviser what we call discretion or authorization to trade without calling you, that can be very much of a problem.

Mike Blake: [00:55:14] Robert, we’re out of time, but there are lots more questions that we could ask and somebody may have, how can somebody reach you if they want to learn more about this?

Robert Port: [00:55:22] Sure. The name of our law firm is Gaslowitz, that’s G-A-S-L-O-W-I-T-Z, Frankel, F-R-A-N-K-E-L. You can find us on the web at gaslowitzfrankel.com. My phone number is 404-892-9797. And if you want to shoot me an email, it’s rport@ga, for Georgia, gadisputes.com.

Mike Blake: [00:55:50] And that’s going to wrap it up for today’s program. I’d like to thank Robert Port so much for joining us and sharing his expertise with us today. We’ll be exploring a new topic each week, so please tune in so that when you’re facing your next executive decision, you have clear vision when making it. If you enjoy this podcast, please consider leaving a review with your favorite podcast aggregator. It helps people find us so that we can help them. Once again, this is Mike Blake. Our sponsor is Brady Ware & Company. And this has been the Decision Vision podcast.

Tagged With: fiduciary abuse, fiduciary litigation, Gaslowitz Frankel, gaslowitz frankel llc, Mike Blake, Robert Port

Shatha Barbour with Hera Hub and Sonny Patel with Insurmi

January 23, 2020 by Karen

Shatha-Barbour-with-Hera-Hub-and-Sonny-Patel-with-Insurmi
Phoenix Business Radio
Shatha Barbour with Hera Hub and Sonny Patel with Insurmi
Loading
00:00 /
RSS Feed
Share
Link
Embed

Download file

Shatha-Barbour-with-Hera-Hub-and-Sonny-Patel-with-Insurmi-4

Shatha Barbour with Hera Hub and Sonny Patel with Insurmi

Hera Hub is a spa-inspired, shared workspace and business accelerator for business owners, entrepreneurs and professionals. This flexible work and meeting space provides a productive work environment with a mission to support women business owners, helping them to thrive! HHFullLogoMed

Hera Hub members have access to professional space to meet with clients, connect and collaborate with like-minded business owners, thus giving them the support they need to be prosperous. It is also a place to find additional resources, such as training, workshops, and one-on-one support essential for their business growth.. Hera Hub also offers an accelerator program with AHA to Exit to help all industries and stages of business grow and succeed, creating growth in our local economy!

shatha-barbour-on-Phoenix-Business-RadioXShatha Barbour is a passionate leader with a global vision! She has a diverse background with broad experience working in the healthcare and pharmaceutical industry to co-founding a nonprofit organization to being CEO of Hera Hub Phoenix. After receiving her degree in Healthcare Management & Policy from Univ of Michigan in 2002, Shatha worked with the senior executive team of a hospital undergoing a 5 yr turnaround plan. From there, she moved on to work for Eli Lilly, a fortune 500 pharmaceutical company, where she covered roles from sales operations to global access strategy, improving the reach of medicine throughout the world among Lilly affiliates worldwide.

In 2010, Shatha Barbour moved to Phoenix and took a hiatus from her corporate background. She co-founded a non-profit educational organization called Good Tree Institute, that she actively participates in still. By 2014, Shatha realized she wanted to bridge these broad experiences, from her corporate background to her non-profit startup to pursue her passion: cultivating and empowering women to fulfill their goals and business ideas in a collaborative environment!

Shatha started her journey of opening Hera Hub Phoenix in the fall of 2016. After almost 2 years in the making, Hera Hub Phoenix opened its doors in April of 2018. Hera Hub Phoenix is designed as a beautiful landing space and launching pad for the women of Phoenix in all industries and backgrounds, yet not exclusive to just women. It has already become that space with many business owners, professionals, organizations, and companies using the space as a workspace and training center.

Her ultimate vision is to build bridges between communities, especially women business owners locally, nationally, and internationally! In her free time, you’ll find Shatha hiking, working and facilitation workshops with nonprofits, and spending quality time with her husband and three kids.

Connect with Shatha on LinkedIn and follow Hera Hub on Facebook and Instagram.

InsurmiColorTransparent

Insurmi is a conversational-AI powered customer engagement platform for insurance carriers. The digital engagement platform is used by top-tier global insurance carriers to give them a competitive edge on generating new business online, streamlining customer claims, and delivering an overall better customer experience through next-generation technology.

SonnyPatelHeadshotCropped2019Sonny Patel is the founder and CEO of Insurmi, an AI-based engagement platform for insurance carriers.

He started the company just three years ago at the age of 21 while working as a sales director and financial advisor at a top life insurance company where he realized the process of buying and selling insurance was unnecessarily cumbersome and outdated. He was determined to change this, and went to work to develop a solution that would simplify and take the guesswork out of the insurance buying process. That solution would eventually become Insurmi.

Now, Insurmi is being used by a number of top-tier global insurance carriers to easily generate new business online, streamline customer claims, and deliver excellent customer service through conversational AI.

Follow Insurmi on LinkedIn, Facebook and Twitter.

About Our Host

Kindra-MaplesAlong with being a Spartan racer, past animal trainer and magician’s assistant, Kindra Maples has experience working with diverse crowds of all sizes, ages, and backgrounds to support them with engagement opportunities.

Kindra is a dynamic and engaging community engagement specialist with 10+ years of proven excellence across senior leadership roles leading partnership development and community outreach and engagement.

As an ambassador of Phoenix Business RadioX she is able to continue supporting community engagement through connecting business professionals to others in the community.

Tagged With: Entrepreneurs, Insurmi, Insurtech, Leadership, Phoenix, smallbusiness, Sonny Patel

Decision Vision Episode 47: How Can I Get My Employees to Think Independently? – An Interview with Joanna Bloor, The Amplify Lab

January 16, 2020 by John Ray

how can i get my employees to think independently
Decision Vision
Decision Vision Episode 47: How Can I Get My Employees to Think Independently? - An Interview with Joanna Bloor, The Amplify Lab
Loading
00:00 /
RSS Feed
Share
Link
Embed

Download file

how do i get my employees to think independently
Mike Blake and Joanna Bloor

Decision Vision Episode 47: How Can I Get My Employees to Think Independently? – An Interview with Joanna Bloor

This episode took a right turn into a question many business owners struggle with:  “how can I get my employees to think independently?” Joanna Bloor and “Decision Vision” host Mike Blake veered into this important topic in a fascinating and insightful discussion. “Decision Vision” is presented by Brady Ware & Company.

Joanna Bloor, The Amplify Lab

how do I get my employees to think independently
Joanna Bloor

Introduction expert and Founder of The Amplify Lab, Joanna Bloor is on a mission to help us prepare for the big leap into the future. To uncover and articulate our value and our place in the next chapter of humankind. No big deal. Why? Because we all need to rethink how we prepare for the future of work. The what, where, when and how of work is changing – and so is the who.

And it all starts with understanding why and how you need to have a better answer to the question “What do you do?

An “eternal student of what is around the next technology corner” Joanna started her career by scaling the revenue strategies of brands such as Ticketmaster, Cars.com, OpenTable, and Pandora. Then a conversation in line at TED 2016 led to a realization that what we are known for has far-reaching impact as an individual and a leader.

In front of audiences that range from thinkers at TED, to technologists at Dreamforce, to entrepreneurs at Gathering of Titans – like a Fairy Godmother – Joanna’s known for “live amplification” of audience members while zinging the audience with moments of surprise and laughter. All wrapped up with the practical guidance of what you too, can do next.

“Joanna shines a light on long-forgotten ingredients that make up our secret sauce, reminding us that we’re not awesome by accident.” — Cristina Jones, EVP Trailblazer Marketing Salesforce.com.

You can learn more about Joanna at her website, or connect with her through social media on LinkedIn and on Twitter.

Michael Blake, Brady Ware & Company

Mike Blake, Host of “Decision Vision”

Michael Blake is Host of the “Decision Vision” podcast series and a Director of Brady Ware & Company. Mike specializes in the valuation of intellectual property-driven firms, such as software firms, aerospace firms and professional services firms, most frequently in the capacity as a transaction advisor, helping clients obtain great outcomes from complex transaction opportunities. He is also a specialist in the appraisal of intellectual properties as stand-alone assets, such as software, trade secrets, and patents.

Mike has been a full-time business appraiser for 13 years with public accounting firms, boutique business appraisal firms, and an owner of his own firm. Prior to that, he spent 8 years in venture capital and investment banking, including transactions in the U.S., Israel, Russia, Ukraine, and Belarus.

Brady Ware & Company

Brady Ware & Company is a regional full-service accounting and advisory firm which helps businesses and entrepreneurs make visions a reality. Brady Ware services clients nationally from its offices in Alpharetta, GA; Columbus and Dayton, OH; and Richmond, IN. The firm is growth minded, committed to the regions in which they operate, and most importantly, they make significant investments in their people and service offerings to meet the changing financial needs of those they are privileged to serve. The firm is dedicated to providing results that make a difference for its clients.

Decision Vision Podcast Series

“Decision Vision” is a podcast covering topics and issues facing small business owners and connecting them with solutions from leading experts. This series is presented by Brady Ware & Company. If you are a decision maker for a small business, we’d love to hear from you. Contact us at decisionvision@bradyware.com and make sure to listen to every Thursday to the “Decision Vision” podcast. Past episodes of “Decision Vision” can be found here. “Decision Vision” is produced and broadcast by the North Fulton studio of Business RadioX®.

Visit Brady Ware & Company on social media:

LinkedIn:  https://www.linkedin.com/company/brady-ware/

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/bradywareCPAs/

Twitter: https://twitter.com/BradyWare

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/bradywarecompany/

Show Transcript

Mike Blake: [00:00:01] Hi and welcome to the Decision Vision podcast. We’re going to do a little of a prologue before you listen to this podcast, because I don’t want to be accused of false advertising. The discussion is about the nature of work and the changing nature of work. And we had a terrific discussion with Joanna Bloor. And I do hope that you’ll listen to this, even though the topic is a little bit different than the way it’s presented in the introduction.

Mike Blake: [00:00:29] We had originally thought that the discussion was going to be around labor models and to a lesser extent, employee engagement, but really adapting to new realities, generally, in the labor force. And the way that the conversation turned, and I decided that it was a good turn, so we just sort of ran with it, is really talking about, at a high-level, employee engagement and how do you unlock the full potential of your employees as thinking organic human beings.

Mike Blake: [00:01:02] And, you know, if you don’t think that’s a good thing, then you probably don’t want to listen to this podcast because we’re going to talk about things that you’re just not going to really jive with. But if you think that is something that’s worthwhile, I know a lot of people that come to me and say, you know, “Boy, I love to get my employees to think on their feet better. I love to get them more engaged. How do I do that?” Then, I think you’re going to find this conversation to be very interesting. It’s kind of like a TED talk but a little bit longer and with no slides, but I think a very high-level intellectual conversation.

Mike Blake: [00:01:35] So, we’ll go back and take another look with a different episode at actual models of work when we can do something a little bit more specifically. But, you know, I don’t want to have you go in 20 minutes and wonder kind of when is the topic that was advertised coming up and waste your time. And I want to be respectful of your time. So, if you’re going to listen to another podcast, thank you for doing that. Otherwise, you’re gonna stick around, sit back and relax and enjoy the infotainment.

Intro: [00:02:04] Welcome to Decision Vision, a podcast series focusing on critical business decisions brought to you by Brady Ware & Company. Brady Ware is a regional full-service accounting and advisory firm that helps businesses and entrepreneurs make visions a reality.

Mike Blake: [00:02:22] Welcome to Decision Vision, a podcast giving you, the listener, clear vision to make great decisions. In each episode, we discuss the process of decision making on a different topic from the business owners or executives’ perspective. We aren’t necessarily telling you what to do, but we can put you in a position to make an informed decision on your own and understand when you might need help along the way.

Mike Blake: [00:02:41] My name is Mike Blake and I’m your host for today’s program. I’m a director at Brady Ware & Company, a full-service accounting firm based in Dayton, Ohio, with offices in Dayton, Columbus, Ohio, Richmond, Indiana, and Alpharetta, Georgia, which is where we are recording today. Brady Ware is sponsoring this podcast. If you like this podcast, please subscribe on your favorite podcast aggregator and please consider leaving a review of the podcast as well.

Mike Blake: [00:03:05] Today, we’re going to talk about the nature of work. A seemingly esoteric topic, but one that is getting increasing attention and it’s receiving increased attention from a number of angles. One, there’s a macrosocial angle that is forcing us to revisit how we consider work, because we are finding increasingly that more and more of us are becoming, if not expendable, then certainly ancillary to technology that is now capable of performing more complex tasks than were even imaginable 10 to 15 years ago.

Mike Blake: [00:03:50] And to that end now, we are experimenting with different economic systems to help us cope with that, frankly, without necessarily having to sabotage technological progress, because there are very real reasons we want to do that. And, you know, the so-called Star Trek economy is great, but they don’t show you kind of the painful transition that gets you from this economy into that Star Trek economy. And that painful transition is, you know, what do people do when robots do everything that people want?

Mike Blake: [00:04:28] And, you know, some countries are now experimenting with something called a universal basic income. There’s at least one Democratic presidential candidate who is embracing that as a way to cushion the blow. But we’re forced to reexamine the role of labor, if you will, in our economy and our society because, you know, automation is not only expanding, but its rate of acceleration is increasing as well.

Mike Blake: [00:04:57] And then, on a micro-level, we’re being compelled to reexamine what work looks like because, you know, particularly in the American economy in an unprecedented level of competition in many areas, not every area, to be sure, but certainly, in professional services and other areas, you know, we have competition from places we never would have dreamed we’d have competition before, whether it’s China, whether it’s India, whether it’s startups, whether it’s, again, AI.

Mike Blake: [00:05:33] We are being forced to rethink what role labor is really meant to play in the workplace. And then, you know, at some point, because there’s really a limit to how much you can improve your labor force by simply raising pay and increase in the value that you extract from your labor force by doing that, it’s compelling us to rethink models of work, whether that’s working from home, whether it’s the four-day workweek or the four-hour workweek, as we sometimes hear about, job sharing, and flex time and the gig economy and so forth.

Mike Blake: [00:06:16] And they’ve all been around to some extent, but they have not been sort of up close, in person, and in our faces the way that they have become in the last five to 10 years or so. And if you’re a business owner or an executive and you’re not thinking about this, you need to start because this is a hard puzzle to solve. And if you do solve it, then you’re going to create a significant competitive advantage for yourself. And if your competitors solve it before you do, watch out.

Mike Blake: [00:06:46] So, as usual, with all of our topics, I’m not the subject matter expert, I’m just the person who brings on the person who is the subject matter expert. And to help us work through this today is Joanna Bloor, who is expert and founder of The Amplify Lab. Joanna Bloor is on a mission to help us prepare for the big leap into the future, to uncover and articulate our value and our place in the next chapter of humankind.

Mike Blake: [00:07:08] Why? Because we all need to rethink how we prepare for the future of work. The what, where, when, and however work is changing and so is the who and I would argue the why as well. And we’ll talk about that today. It all starts with the understanding of why and how you need to have a better answer to the question, what do you do? An eternal student of what is around the next technology corner, Joanna started her career by scaling the revenue strategies of brands such as Ticketmaster, cars.com, OpenTable and Pandora.

Mike Blake: [00:07:37] Then, a conversation online at a TED 2016 led to a realization of what we are known for as far reaching impact as an individual and as a leader. In front of audiences that range from thinkers at TED to technologists at Dreamforce to entrepreneurs, a gathering of titans like a fairy godmother, Joanna is known for live amplification of audience members while zinging the audience with moments of surprise and laughter.

Mike Blake: [00:08:00] And I can attest to that. We had a preliminary conversation to come on here. It seemed like it was two minutes, before we knew it, an-hour-and-a-half had gone by. I’ll wrap up with a practical guidance of what you, too, can do next. And as a testimonial, Joanna shines a light on long-forgotten ingredients that make up our secret sauce, reminding us that we’re not awesome by accident. And that was by an executive from salesforce.com. Joanna, welcome to the program.

Joanna Bloor: [00:08:28] Thank you so much for having me. I’m excited to continue our conversation.

Mike Blake: [00:08:32] Yeah. So, let’s get people caught up because otherwise, they’re gonna be jumping on a treadmill, going 30-miles-an-hour. Why are we having this conversation? I mean, you know, do what I say make sense in terms that we’re being confronted with just this need to reconsider the very nature of work?

Joanna Bloor: [00:08:49] Yes. Yes. Well, I was thinking about this as preparing and how do I kind of macro this up, because you talked about the Star Trek being future and how do we get there. And in looking at work, and I actually think there are lots of people talking about the future of work and how do we get there, the reality is, I think, we’re actually here today. And part of the challenge that we see our whole marketplace in, and I will start by saying what is really interesting about work is it’s a double-sided marketplace.

Joanna Bloor: [00:09:29] They are buyers. The employer chooses the employee, the employee chooses the employer, which adds a whole level of complexity and questions and everything to the entire thing. It’s not like you’re buying a pair of shoes that you get to walk out the store with. But what I was thinking about, this whole question about, well, what does work look like in the 21st century? I really actually took a step backwards and said, well, what has happened to work over time?

Joanna Bloor: [00:09:59] And then, separate it because how humans travel through work, how business is run, and how technology is run potentially have different patterns. And what I ultimately noticed was that, well, if you look at technology, most technology companies are running around and saying, you know, “We’re in the fourth industrial revolution.” And I go, okay. So, we’ve gotten from the original industrial revolution when we saw the shift from farming to factories and all those sorts of things.

Joanna Bloor: [00:10:34] And, you know, technology has had enormous play in that. But I would argue that the human revolution hasn’t happened yet. So, while technology has gone through major shifts and transformation and then, I would actually say that business has started to make major shifts and transformations, humans haven’t. So, let’s just say, okay, we’re just going to use the base model of the industrial revolution and how business and technology has run.

Joanna Bloor: [00:11:08] The past was very one dimensional and at best, binary. So, you think about how companies grew, it was all about supply chain optimization. It was all about operational efficiency. It’s all about growth and what does your P&L look like. And are you returning investment to whoever is investing to you, whether you’re public, private or whatever the financial structure is. And yet, if you look at technology, it’s gone from very ones and zeros to we’re now in the world of quantum and AI and gosh, robotics and all sorts of really multidimensional things and business has to.

Joanna Bloor: [00:11:56] And, you know, you talk to any company today and they’re starting to think about up to triple bottom-line economics. And so, both technology and business have become much more multidimensional. And when you look at the human element, all of the tools, the elements of humans, and these job descriptions, performance reviews, measurements of productivity, measurement of almost everything is still very binary. It’s still, do you have that skill set? Do you not have have that skill set?

Joanna Bloor: [00:12:35] And what I think everybody, and I know everybody who is listening is going, “Wait a second. I’m way more interesting than just a skill set.” And I go, “Yeah. Absolutely.” You look in a business and I think any business owner, any leader would say the most multidimensional interesting thing in my company are the humans and yet, all of the tools in the supply chain about, how do we navigate that marketplace? A very one and two-dimensional work in this multidimensional world.

Joanna Bloor: [00:13:07] So, I sit here and I say, so as human beings, we aren’t in the fourth industrial revolution. We’re still trying to get out of the first industrial revolution. And I think what we are starting to see with the gig economy and people really pushing back on companies around where are they investing with them and career path and all of the elements that come into play when you’re talking about humans are really beginning to change.

Joanna Bloor: [00:13:35] And the question then becomes as because it’s a double-sided marketplace as both a leader, a business owner, whatever your role is in this or as a team member, how do you start thinking about how to change the narrative about you and say, “Look, a resume isn’t the thing that tells me who I am, a job description isn’t the job.” And how do we start thinking about talent in much more of a multidimensional structure? Then, you start talking about like how all that happens.

Mike Blake: [00:14:10] So, although this is, I think, subsiding a little bit, I think we’re past the point of peak blame, but you still sort of hear it plenty, is that we’re only having this conversation because Millennials and Gen Zs are basically modern-day hippies without the tie-dye shirts and they don’t want to work hard. You know, how do you react to that? Is that a legitimate analysis or is that just a cop-out?

Joanna Bloor: [00:14:35] No. I think that is the same argument every older generation has about the generation before. Plus, let’s be real, because I wanted to say this, that like Millennials, Gen Z, Gen X, Boomer, it’s just a marketing category. This is just a sticker and a label that we have put on people. And yes, as human beings, we do need to categorize things, otherwise, our heads explode, unless the sticker is really, really good, like winner of X or the best at Ys, we don’t actually like to be labeled.

Joanna Bloor: [00:15:17] And so, first of all, I always talk to teams and say like, “Let’s step away from the stickers and let’s also recognize-“, you know, I was, for lack of a better term, it’s what a punk, 20-something-year old myself once upon a time. And I was running around saying, “Well, hang on, why are the rules the way they are? And what’s happening?” This happens, I think, with every single generation. But where I do come back is, and say like, “Where are the labels actually helpful?”

Joanna Bloor: [00:15:48] So, I’m now going to disagree with myself, is I do think as you were looking at the talent in your organization, we do need to actually give a bit of a nod to what has been, in essence, the career path. And I say this kind of airports around it of the talent that comes into your organization. And the reality is, for all of us, our career path actually starts when we’re little teeny tiny kids and start going to school.

Joanna Bloor: [00:16:19] So, I’ll give myself the sticker of Gen X. So, I was brought up in a generation in, you know, my formative years when I started to actually realize that it was more than just play out there, were in the ’80s. And if you think about what life is like for a Gen X’er in the ’80s, there wasn’t a lot of after-school programming. We were the first generation of parents of divorce. And so, there’s a concept of a latchkey kid, which is kids used to go home after school and let themselves into their own homes.

Joanna Bloor: [00:16:55] And while we all did just fine, we kind of had little to no parental supervision. And at the same time, for the boom and bust of the ’80s, you then roll those same people into the ’90s where the internet started to become a thing and technology became such a major part of young people’s lives. We were the first adapters of technology and were the first people to be described as digital first. What was true about that period, and especially for those of us, including myself, who got to really be in those early stage companies who were building the internet.

Joanna Bloor: [00:17:34] My first, I want to say, dot-com job was in 1995, but I had been playing with technology for fun for, gosh, almost a decade before that. And what was true about that era is there were no rules, you know, from, I’d say, 1995 until the present day. Every single job title I have had has been made up and every single job description I have had is made up. And I say this for myself, but that’s the same for my entire peer group of people who ran through that period of time.

Joanna Bloor: [00:18:13] And I say all of that because what I think it means is that anybody who that resonated with, can sit here and go, “Well, hang on a second. I’m really used to there not being rules and rules are made to be broken. And a job description is just a suggestion.” And really, I am going to sit here and say, “How can I play with technology as opposed to asking about career paths?” And then, I flip it around and say, “Well, what is that same narrative for people?”.

Joanna Bloor: [00:18:44] And instead of giving them a sticker, let’s say, you know, anywhere from 30 to 35 and younger, the reality is, it’s both their education and their entertainment, because it was the age of fairness. It was never about here’s the trophy for participation, it was a, here’s a trophy for playing as a team, in an age of what I call a fairness in their education and attainment. You have an entire generation of people who’ve been brought up both in school, where at the beginning of school, they’re told, “This is what you need to do to get an A. Here are the rules.”.

Joanna Bloor: [00:19:21] And you think about even sports and other games, it’s very rule-based. And this is what you do to succeed and level up in all of those sorts of things. And then, you look at entertainment, too, and even the most simple and basic video game—and I will absolutely own that I do play Candy Crush on airplanes while I’m passing out on the runway and it’s something to do to distract my mind. Very simple, basic video games.

Mike Blake: [00:19:46] I’m right there with you.

Joanna Bloor: [00:19:46] You’d think we’d find a little time to meditate or something during that period. I’m not worried about that. But you look at that and in video games, if you break the rules, you die. Oh, but FYI, you also get four more lives. And so, when I look at those pattern and then, also look at the boomer generation, and I sit here and I go, why are we surprised that the talent that is coming into our organization is sitting here saying, “Tell me what the rules are and I will do it. But then, I will expect to level up.”.

Joanna Bloor: [00:20:28] And then, you have an entire leadership team who says, “Hang on a second. Rules are made to be broken”, et cetera. And I sit here and I go, this is why I think there’s a bit of angst between some of the generations because we’ve had different experiences and different patterns. But I also sit here and say, on a much bigger level, I actually think the generations coming into the workplace have it right.

Joanna Bloor: [00:20:55] I do think that questions around what is the right measure of success are the right questions to have. What does success look like? I do think they’re right to come in, like I know that they’ve given that really terrible moniker of snowflake. But what’s true about that is every snowflake is scientifically different. But the reality is, as human beings, we are all incredibly different. And that’s actually what is amazing about human beings.

Joanna Bloor: [00:21:26] And so, I don’t sit here and say, well, hang on, we’re all right in this scenario. You should learn how to break the rules. And everybody is different. And so, I sit here and go, well, the supply chain of the industrial world, which is scalable, repeatable, mechanistic, is about productivity. It shouldn’t be applied to humans because with this, much more organic, evolving, changing things. And so, I say, kill the resume, kill the job description, kill all of it.

Joanna Bloor: [00:22:01] And I know the next question is like, what do you do then? And I actually start to look at, how do you look at your talent, which is, again, for any company, probably the most important thing that you have and say, well, how do we actually shift to the supply chain of human talent? And instead of coming in and saying it’s about stickers and badges and tenure and skills and all of those sorts of things and actually look back again in time to the world before the industrial revolution and say, wow, hang on a second.

Joanna Bloor: [00:22:35] When you or somebody in the workplace prior to, what is that, like late 1800s, they had the equivalent of an internship. We were all artisans and we all learned to craft and apprenticeships. And there was a lot more of almost currency transactions beyond currency when you went to go work for somebody. So, if you were an apprentice working with a master and I will say it was with more than four, there was an expectation that it was more than just a paycheck. And so, I suggest that, you know, the workplace actually becomes much more like school and say, okay.

Joanna Bloor: [00:23:28] As talent is coming in and as you’re having the conversation around the multidimensional changing human and the value of the human, how do you then start to think about, okay, so if the job description is actually trying to solve this problem, what is the combination of skills that we are looking for? But then, starting to ask the question of, what is the potential that we are looking for? Because you’re looking for somebody with ideas, you’re looking for somebody’s brain to come into the conversation. And that has much more of apprenticeship model than I think the employee model of today.

Mike Blake: [00:24:05] So, let me jump in on that, because-

Joanna Bloor: [00:24:09] Okay.

Mike Blake: [00:24:09] … I think there’s a lot to unpack there. And we may just spend the rest of our time kind of unpacking that, which is fine. But a thought that occurs based on what you just said that I think is a critical takeaway is that the nature of work and the way we structure it really is about making it easy to get rid of people, when you really boil right down to it, right? The job descriptions, the leveling up, so to speak. And I love that term, by the way. It’s really all about protecting the firm from being basically attacked by the employee, instead of, what if our approach was we’re just never going to be sued by an employee because we’re just going to focus our efforts on making them good. And therefore, they’d be nuts to sue us and we’d be nuts to fire them.

Joanna Bloor: [00:25:08] Yes. Yes, I’ve had this conversation with a couple of—like the conversation around—my first conversation was let’s get rid of the resume, because I think it’s such a single dimensional document and people spend far too much energy, and the HR executives I’ve talked to across the board have said, “Oh, but we need it so that we don’t get sued.” And while fairness in employment practice and appropriate employment practice, I think, is critically important and really understanding who a person is, is critically important, but any business owner would tell you that if you are putting into practice so that you don’t get sued, you’re actually limiting yourself rather than expanding the opportunity.

Mike Blake: [00:26:00] So, you know, let me ask this, is that tug of war? And one thing we’re hearing a lot more about now is mental health in the workplace. I’m a big advocate for mental health. I think it cannot be talked about too much. You know, is that tug of war between the desire of employees to grow and to develop versus the firm that is trying to protect itself from its own employees? Is that literally driving employees crazy?

Joanna Bloor: [00:26:41] That’s a really interesting question. Not a psychologist, not-

Mike Blake: [00:26:46] Me neither.

Joanna Bloor: [00:26:46] … a doctor.

Mike Blake: [00:26:47] Just you and me talking here.

Joanna Bloor: [00:26:49] It’s just you and me. Okay. My only inclination is to say, of course, it is. You know, there’s been endless studies around the whole carrot and stick science of reward for employees. And you come back to what I said earlier about how both, you know, the, what is it you need to do to get an A, how do you level up within your application, that feedback loop that we’ve all gotten a little bit addicted to. But well done. You got a gold star. You’re the champion on the leader board.

Joanna Bloor: [00:27:25] Like whatever it is, that feedback would just become so easy, that when we’re not getting that feedback looped within our workplace, we start to get anxiety around it. You know, am I doing okay? Is everything working? And then, you add on the fact that the challenge of business is there isn’t always a right answer, which speaks to that multidimensionality and the fact that unless I would argue, I think about like what is the product of the human being in the workplace.

Joanna Bloor: [00:28:12] And it’s their brain time. And even if you have an employee who is working in a retail store, you want them there to think critically as opposed to just being a robot and a machine. And yes, all of the things we have surrounding human’s process, the feedback loop, the, what are you doing, how are you doing it really talks to us more like we’re machines rather than as really interesting human beings.

Mike Blake: [00:28:44] And, you know, think about from a consumer’s perspective, if you have a question or a challenge, what’s the most infuriating thing you can hear? So, well, that’s the rule and I can’t break it, right?

Joanna Bloor: [00:28:56] Exactly.

Mike Blake: [00:28:57] Or if I do that for you, I get fired. And that, more than anything, it makes me want to take my phone and smash it, except it’s worth as much as my wife’s engagement ring, so I’m not going to do that. But, you know-

Joanna Bloor: [00:29:12] But you think about—yeah.

Mike Blake: [00:29:12] But that thinking-

Joanna Bloor: [00:29:14] So, I was think really thoughtfully.

Mike Blake: [00:29:14] … that brainpower is what leads to satisfaction.

Joanna Bloor: [00:29:16] Yeah. So, I just want to give a real example about this because I don’t want to sit completely esoteric on this whole scenario. So, I’m actually going to talk about a situation that I just encountered. So, I want to just lay the land of what’s out there. So, you have just a group of people who have been taught over and over and over again through time, follow the rules, follow the rules, follow the rules.

Joanna Bloor: [00:29:45] They come work for a company and I mean, use—I’m not actually going to say the name of the company since I just had a conversation with the CEO about this because I was curious, but it was a food service company that I was interacting with. And clearly, they had done a really innovative process with food that was part of the experience of the food eating process. That’s about as far as I can go on this. It was a really fun store and I was excited to be in there.

Joanna Bloor: [00:30:15] And I went in to buy the product and the person behind the counter said, “Well, what is your name?” And I said, “Well, I’m literally buying the product. You’re not making anything custom for me. It’s in this package. I just want to walk out the store. Why do you need my name?” And he goes, “But that’s what I’m supposed to do.” And I was like, well, I go and ask like, “Can we just do this?” I was in a rush, just do the credit card and run out.

Joanna Bloor: [00:30:39] Oh, that’s a very simple, easy transaction. What stuck with me afterwards is just like, gosh, if I was GM of this company, I was the CEO of this company, I’m not, what I would want my employee to know that they had the wiggle room to do is actually take the critical thinking and say, hey, look, this woman rolls in. It’s clearly moving at 100 miles an hour, kind of the pace that I operate at. Because she’s not getting something custom made for her, she’s actually just buying a thing off the shelf and literally wants to swipe and go.

Joanna Bloor: [00:31:13] Well, I’m just going to put Bob in the machine and who cares? Because it wasn’t going to take a point where it was, oh, they want my email address so they can send me marketing materials. It was literally to make that process work better. Do they have the bandwidth to break the rules to say, hey, I’m just going to skip the process and actually see that my customer across from me wants to move quickly and service that need as opposed to serving the need of company.

Joanna Bloor: [00:31:44] And I know that seems really myopic and individual and I sometimes wonder if when I describe it, I sound a bit like a whiny customer, which maybe I am. But I sit here and I say, as somebody who understands the retail experience as an example, I would much prefer the employee who understood that the rules could be broken there and that they wouldn’t actually get dinged, punished, whatever for not just being a cog in the machine, while it is a very complex machine that they are running because they’re doing all sorts of customizations and all lots of stuff.

Joanna Bloor: [00:32:19] And I sit here and I go, that this structure of, here is the job description, here are the rules, here is the process, here are the expectations, here’s what’s correct, here’s what’s incorrect is really making our employees into machines more than the amazing thing that they really are. And so, how do you actually help people understand that rules can be broken while also recognizing that we have brainwashed people into saying that you have to follow the rules. Like I think we’ve just roboticized the workforce because you might get sued, because you want to move faster, because of all of these sorts of things. And I come back to, okay, we have got to shift into this more multidimensional space. And again, I could go on, on all of these sorts of things.

Mike Blake: [00:33:10] Well, let’s drill into that actually. So, I’m just gonna tear up the script. And to be perfectly candid, we’re not talking about what I thought I would talk about today, but I think this is really cool and we’re just going to roll with it, okay?

Joanna Bloor: [00:33:20] Okay.

Mike Blake: [00:33:21] And that is because the question I’m really driving at, because you’ve uncovered something I think is important and I think that business people and executives and owners want to know is, how do you deroboticize your workforce? Right? Everybody is subject to this roboticism. And even the places where we don’t want people to be robots, look at customer service representatives, right? We all know they’re looking at a screen.

Mike Blake: [00:33:49] And based on what we tell the CSR on the other end of the phone, assuming they’re human, is that there’s an algorithm in front of them then telling them what the choices are they can give back to me in order to try to resolve whatever it is we’re trying to resolve, right? So, even there, they’re robots, it’s just that there’s a human interface to a robot, basically. So, maybe let’s go with number three, what are three things that an executive should be thinking about if they’re concerned that their workforce is too robotic, too going through the motions, too rigid, and encourage them to, you know, be the thoughtful, organic beings that is there in our nature.

Joanna Bloor: [00:34:34] Okay. Big question, but I will try and get it to three. So, the first one, I would say, is really looking at—so, if you know that you are currently getting roboticized humans, let’s just call them that for right now, the result that you were getting from your current processes of roboticized humans, then I sit here and I say like any products that you are looking at within your company, look at your purchase process.

Joanna Bloor: [00:35:03] You know, if you were buying software as an example, which is, in essence, it is the same thing you’re doing, you would have an RFP process and you would say like, were they nice to have, were they enough to have, like what is that entire purchase process that you are going through? And my guess is for any companies that if you really sat and broke it down and said like, what is—and let’s think about the sales process as a whole and the sale’s funnel starts with how you get into consideration sets.

Joanna Bloor: [00:35:38] What is that first step of consideration set for you? And is it what it is today for most people, which is resumes and keywords and all of those sorts of things. And maybe that is the right set of criteria to get somebody into consideration set. But then, I sit here and say, okay, then there’s the evaluation process of protecting somebody, which currently sits, sometimes, with recruiter, sometimes, with just the hiring manager and say like, are we actually interviewing, for lack of a better term, a robot or are we interviewing for critical thinking?

Joanna Bloor: [00:36:17] And then, the customer service world, like what is it you’re actually asking for and taking them through that? And so, really looking at your purchase process of somebody’s brain time and saying like, what are the different things that we should be looking for as opposed to what does the machine look like, which, I think, on the machine side, tends to lean more to, what are your experiences in the past? What is your skill set?

Joanna Bloor: [00:36:48] You know, I’ll actually use myself as an example of where I threw a purchase process completely out of the windows for a company when I was early in my career. You know, I was a manager of a high-end swimsuit store, where I think it was like $100 to $200 for a swimsuit sort of situation and had, through people that I knew, gotten an opportunity to interview for a dot-com, where I was going to shift from selling swimsuits to selling websites.

Joanna Bloor: [00:37:25] And in today’s world, I absolutely would have not made it through the consideration set because while sales was a consistent skill set, absolutely nothing else on my resume said anything about media, said anything about understanding how to sell to small to medium-sized business, like literally would have not made it through. But because I knew the right people, et cetera, I managed to get a meeting.

Joanna Bloor: [00:37:51] And in the process, and now, I look back on it, I could hear the VP himself really having a hard time trying to bridge my experience in the past with what he needed for me to be a critical thinker for in the future. And we were getting really stuck on a conversation about objection handling and did I know how to handle objections in the media space? And I remember saying to him quite sassily and I held my hands up and I said, “I’ve been selling a piece of fabric this big-“, put my hands fairly close together, “…to more than this big”, and I move my hands apart, then I said, “I’m making them feel great about themselves, at the end today, I don’t think objections are my problem.”.

Joanna Bloor: [00:38:34] And that started the whole hilarious conversation where we really talked about how we transferred, how I think about selling swimwear, and what was the decision-making process for a customer in a swimsuit store, and how did I bridge that to how that would also manifest in this whole internet world because the internet didn’t really exist and somehow, lots of stuff until I was given the opportunity to make that bridge and that required them to rethink their buying process.

Joanna Bloor: [00:39:02] And it worked out for all sorts of reasons. So, I sit here and I say, how do you think about how you were buying people and not necessarily saying, “Look, in my RFP process, they need to be this exact thing, go to this exact school, have this exact skill set.” Because unless you’re having that conversation, you can’t bridge. So, that’s the first one. The second one is really understanding as an employer, that your employers do their job, they don’t marry it.

Joanna Bloor: [00:39:35] It is a transaction. You are renting their brain. And right now, in the robot world, what if it’s just a cash transaction? Well, the only thing is like let’s look at how are you measuring success in the robot-based world. The only things that you can sit here and say like, this is where I can show success for the employee is compensation and title. And I sit here and I say, well, gosh, if you have a real conversation with an employee that, is compensation or title important? Absolutely. But is everything else important, too, because they’re multidimensional? Absolutely, as well.

Joanna Bloor: [00:40:20] And so, I look at it and I say like if you were working for somebody that you are an apprentice with us. And as an apprentice and you’re an apprentice for a, I don’t know how much time I’m going to get with you because it is a double-sided marketplace and my employee might choose to leave. And so, how do I sit here and say, where can I add value that actually helps them much more intrinsically to themselves.

Joanna Bloor: [00:40:48] As opposed to just saying, well, I’m going to add value by adding a ping pong table or bringing in lunch or whatever the pool sparkly thing is today or I’m in a different compensation and/or title and actually come back and say like, who is this human being and how can I actually help them? And I heard people say develop and grow, but it’s not just on their skills to make them more of a human, but actually development in their thinking approach. This brings back to my-

Mike Blake: [00:41:18] Yeah. How do you help them evolve?

Joanna Bloor: [00:41:20] Yeah. And now, I’m going to jump the shark for a second because I sit here and I say like I have been—I mean, I’ve been obsessed about this whole idea for decades and, you know, a lot of this whole narrative on how do you think about talent, which really forced upon me as an executive at Pandora, because I had a team that went from 30 to 400 over three years with revenue numbers that were around $100 million annually to $1 billion annually over that same period of time. And so, everything was moving at a ridiculous speed. And then, the majority of those 400 people were maybe second job out of college, 27, I think, was the average age. And what I realized really quickly was I couldn’t promote every single one of them every six months. Not physically possible.

Mike Blake: [00:42:16] Right.

Joanna Bloor: [00:42:17] I couldn’t give them a raise every single six months. So, coming back to this whole how do you have a conversation was about who they really are and what is their value to the organization completely shifted the narrative around who they were and what they were all about. And as the executive in charge, I would literally go around and be like, “This is why you are important and this is why you are important.” And we’d have a conversation around their value.

Joanna Bloor: [00:42:41] And it had a dramatic difference on their engagements, their tenure, their ability to collaborate with each other, all of those sorts of things. When I sit here and I say like, think about more as apprentices and that you get to borrow their brain. And how do you do that? But what I saw in not only getting our hand forced at Pandora but then, also, as I started to really study this phenomena out in the real world and started to build The Amplify Lab was that, I’d say, 99.9% of the people that I engage with, and it doesn’t matter if they are 18 or 60, have no idea who they want to be when they grow up.

Joanna Bloor: [00:43:27] There’s a tiny percent of people who go, “Oh, no, I have complete and utter clarity about who I want to be and how I can get there.” Well, actually, not necessarily how they can get there, but actually what that thing is or if they have an idea of who it is they want to be. And again, I’m going to come back to the, what are the experiences of the younger, and I say younger, I’m an old lady, younger generations is there’s so much feedback today. Like I just got tagged two times on Instagram today and I was like, “Well, look at that. I got an instant feedback.” There’s so much feedback on am I successful, et cetera. People are then also terrified of breaking the rules, which is also a part of the problem because we are these multidimensional people. So-

Mike Blake: [00:44:17] So-

Joanna Bloor: [00:44:17] I just sit here and I say, let’s-yeah, sorry, go ahead.

Mike Blake: [00:44:19] Well-

Joanna Bloor: [00:44:20] I really jumped the shark just on a bit there, but getting back in.

Mike Blake: [00:44:22] No. Well, actually, you segued because I think then the way to summarize that is, is that third principle is really get to know your employees.

Joanna Bloor: [00:44:29] Yeah.

Mike Blake: [00:44:30] And get to know them for who they are, not what their resumé says they are.

Joanna Bloor: [00:44:35] Right. And it’s not get to know them and say like, “How are your kids”, and all of that sort of stuff, it’s—and thank you for helping me bridge it back—just get to know them, but also help them see themselves and see what their potential could be. And I have absolutely no doubt that every single one of your listeners has a person, whether they have worked for them or not, but they have engaged with where they’ve gone, “Wow, this person has enormous potential and I’m going to put my relationship capital on the line for them and open doors for them and make connections and guide them.” Some people might call this mentors. I think that’s the wrong thing. I think that they are sponsors.

Mike Blake: [00:45:25] Yeah.

Joanna Bloor: [00:45:26] Because when you are putting your own capital on the line, it’s a little bit different. But we sit here and we look at this contract of potential and that is what we’re looking for. Reverse that transaction and say, okay, who are the people who saw that in your personal career path up? And I’ll tell you today, if any one of the people who opened doors for me, who taught me things that made me better, that said, “Gosh, Joanna. Here is your potential”, if they picked up the phone today and said, “Hey, Joanna, I need something from you” or “Hey, Joanna, will you come work with me on-“, whatever it is they’re doing, I would drop everything and go do stuff for them.

Joanna Bloor: [00:46:13] And you sit here and as a manager and you say, okay, how do I get my entire organization to be that excited to work with you? It’s because you have seen the potential in them. And, again, it’s coming back to that double-sided marketplace. And if anybody is listening who is an employee, I sit here and say like, consider that in who you’re working with and that, “Yes, we absolutely want you to do a good job and there’s stuff that needs to get done.”.

Joanna Bloor: [00:46:51] But we are hired, we are promoted, we are given opportunities based on our potential, and it is justified by our past. And so, having that whole conversation about potential and not only for the individual, but what is at their life that they want to go down? And how do you get to know them and know that it’s not just—although, again, because we live in this binary business construct, how do you take just title and compensation off the table and have a conversation about what will actually stretch you, help you grow, help you learn, you know, what is your potential, where am I seeing patterns of something that you’re uniquely good at that maybe you haven’t even considered them?

Joanna Bloor: [00:47:41] Instead of, you know, being almost myopic and saying, “I’m going to follow this career path to be X”. And of course, you want to be a physician and then, I think we will observe a bit different there. But how do you get off that path and actually start to pattern what has happened with business and technology, which again, I’ll say they have shifted and used some of the business constructs of agile developments and beta testing ideas and redeploying one part of the organization, another part of the organization. You would take all of these constructs and do them with human things as well, which allow for a much more multidimensional workplace.

Joanna Bloor: [00:48:26] Like some of my favorite team members in all of my jobs who worked with me were ones that I gave to other departments and said, “I think they’d be really great for you.” While, yes, they don’t have any experience in fill in the blank here, legal, finance, creative, employee development, didn’t matter, but they showed the potential in this space and helping them move into that space. I’ve now got an ally in another part of the company who we’ve got this great relationship with and it always ends up paying off and allows the person to actually start to make more of a portfolio of who they are.

Mike Blake: [00:49:07] So, Joanna, as I predicted, I blinked and about an hour has gone by, so we will have to continue this at some point. But I want to thank you so much for coming on and having this conversation. If somebody wants to pick this up with you, how can they best reach you?

Joanna Bloor: [00:49:24] Well, I am across all of the social medias at Joanna Bloor. I have them all, so come find me anywhere there or they can go to joannabloor.com and find out how to contact us there. Very easy to get through. Clearly, I can talk about all of this ad nauseam and like the nicest notes like say, we are all different, so we will have different questions. So, it’s important to think about how that looks for you.

Mike Blake: [00:49:54] So, before we go, I’m going to test your social media street cred. Do you have a TikTok account?

Joanna Bloor: [00:50:01] No.

Mike Blake: [00:50:03] That’s a shame.

Joanna Bloor: [00:50:04] I know. You know, I am too wary of data and data privacy issues. In my former life, I was an ad technology executive.

Mike Blake: [00:50:17] Okay.

Joanna Bloor: [00:50:19] I have yet to be convinced that that is an environment where the data of me is actually where I want it to be. And so, yeah, I’m going to hold off on TikTok. Yeah.

Mike Blake: [00:50:34] Well, when you do, hopefully, you’ll do something—

Joanna Bloor: [00:50:36] It is off at the moment.

Mike Blake: [00:50:36] When you do, since you’re a child of the ’80s, as am I, I’m hoping you’ll do a Pat Benatar cover and then, make that available.

Joanna Bloor: [00:50:45] Perfect. Done.

Mike Blake: [00:50:46] So, that’s going to wrap it up for today’s program. I’d like to thank Johanna Bloor so much for joining us and sharing her expertise with us. We’ll be exploring a new topic each week, so please tune in so that when you’re faced with your next executive decision, you have clear vision when making it. If you enjoy these podcasts, please consider leaving a review with your favorite podcast aggregator. It helps people find us so that we can help them. Once again, this is Mike Blake. Our sponsor is Brady Ware & Company. And this has been the Decision Vision podcast.

Tagged With: CPa, CPA firm, Dayton accounting, Dayton business advisory, Dayton CPA, Dayton CPA firm, Decision Vision, Employee Engagement, employee relations, Michael Blake, Mike Blake

Inspiring Women, Episode 17: Charting A Financial Course For Women

January 15, 2020 by John Ray

charting a financial course
Inspiring Women PodCast with Betty Collins
Inspiring Women, Episode 17: Charting A Financial Course For Women
Loading
00:00 /
RSS Feed
Share
Link
Embed

Download file

charting a financial course

Inspiring Women, Episode 17: Charting A Financial Course For Women

Host Betty Collins addresses the importance of women actively planning for their future, charting a financial course, and finding good advisors to help. She also interviews Helen Colon of Capstone Wealth Advisors. The Inspiring Women podcast is presented by Brady Ware & Company.

Helen Colon, Capstone Wealth Advisors

Helen Colon

Helen Colon is a Financial Advisor with Capstone Wealth Advisors. With 38 years of industry experience, her areas of focus include women’s financial strategies, retirement income strategies, cash flow management strategies, business retirement plans, divorce financial planning, and investments.

Helen is also a Certified Divorce Financial Analyst® (CDFA). As a CDFA, she helps clients with pre-divorce financial planning such as providing strategies for providing financial information and assistance, including evaluating the tax implications of dividing property and the settlement options for dividing pensions, marital property and awarding of child and/or spousal support.

Helen is active in her community, including serving on the board of the Women’s Small Business Accelerator (WSBA). She has also volunteered with the Girl Scouts of Ohio’s Heartland teaching financial literacy workshops for the Women at Ohio Reformatory as well as for the young girls.

Betty Collins, CPA, Brady Ware & Company and Host of the “Inspiring Women” Podcast

Betty Collins, Brady WareBetty Collins is the Office Lead for Brady Ware’s Columbus office and a Shareholder in the firm. Betty joined Brady Ware & Company in 2012 through a merger with Nipps, Brown, Collins & Associates. She started her career in public accounting in 1988. Betty is co-leader of the Long Term Care service team, which helps providers of services to Individuals with Intellectual and Developmental Disabilities and nursing centers establish effective operational models that also maximize available funding. She consults with other small businesses, helping them prosper with advice on general operations management, cash flow optimization, and tax minimization strategies.

In addition, Betty serves on the Board of Directors for Brady Ware and Company. She leads Brady Ware’s Women’s Initiative, a program designed to empower female employees, allowing them to tap into unique resources and unleash their full potential.  Betty helps her colleagues create a work/life balance while inspiring them to set and reach personal and professional goals. The Women’s Initiative promotes women-to-women business relationships for clients and holds an annual conference that supports women business owners, women leaders, and other women who want to succeed. Betty actively participates in women-oriented conferences through speaking engagements and board activity.

Betty is a member of the National Association of Women Business Owners (NAWBO) and she is the President-elect for the Columbus Chapter. Brady Ware also partners with the Women’s Small Business Accelerator (WSBA), an organization designed to help female business owners develop and implement a strong business strategy through education and mentorship, and Betty participates in their mentor match program. She is passionate about WSBA because she believes in their acceleration program and matching women with the right advisors to help them achieve their business ownership goals. Betty supports the WSBA and NAWBO because these organizations deliver resources that help other women-owned and managed businesses thrive.

Betty is a graduate of Mount Vernon Nazarene College, a member of the American Institute of Certified Public Accountants, and a member of the Ohio Society of Certified Public Accountants. Betty is also the Board Chairwoman for the Gahanna Area Chamber of Commerce, and she serves on the Board of the Community Improvement Corporation of Gahanna as Treasurer.

“Inspiring Women” Podcast Series

“Inspiring Women” is THE podcast that advances women toward economic, social and political achievement. The show is hosted by Betty Collins, CPA, and presented by Brady Ware and Company. Brady Ware is committed to empowering women to go their distance in the workplace and at home. Other episodes of “Inspiring Women” can be found here.

Show Transcript

Betty Collins: [00:00:00] Today, we’re going to have a topic that I’m probably most familiar with and could probably talk about for more than one podcast. It’s charting a course for women that … A financial guide is so important, and it’s something that doesn’t always get done. I really want to talk about it because I think you’ll find some statistics that are very bothersome about it.

Betty Collins: [00:00:23] Back in the day, when my mom and dad were married and raising kids, my mom did very, very little with money til later in life. But she made up for time, that’s for sure. My dad just carried the day with all of that. Then, he retired earlier than she did, and he went back to handling money. Then, she really wasn’t too sure of things. When it came time to for her – she’s a widow now – to deal with money, she really had been out of the loop a long time. Fortunately, they had planned well, but they never worked on it together. They never charted the course and had a plan; they just kept doing what they do, which is work hard, save; work hard, save. Not a bad way to go, and they did pretty well.

Betty Collins: [00:01:06] It’s mind boggling that this is 2019. We’re almost at the end of a decade, and that women today take financial planning and put it in a drawer; maybe a closet; under the rug. You would be amazed. It’s not something that they really are at the helm of. Why is that? We’re dominating in so many ways. We’re educating ourselves further than men. We are definitely dominating marketplace, where we’re starting more businesses. We’re providing for our families – sometimes, THE provider. We’re becoming a lot more influential in top leadership positions, such as CEOs, you hear a lot more; executive management. Politics, we are on the rise there. I don’t know why anybody would want to do that, but they do. And we’re really just now making a lot of room in the boardroom. It’s becoming more of our place. We actually have a seat at the table.

Betty Collins: [00:02:04] As we’re dominating, moving certainly forward, really scary statistics by UBS, who is a financial planning firm. 85 percent of women today manage the expenses of their household, whether they’re married or single. It’s just the woman takes that on. Only 23 percent take the lead, when it comes to long-term financial planning. Really, it’s kind of important because, first of all, women live longer than men, so you’re going to have to have some dollars that last longer. Women tend to be a little more risk averse. We miss those growth opportunities because we don’t necessarily want to take the risk. A savings account and security sometimes comes a little bit before that. What they did find was that women who do invest are much more strategic. They’re more goal-driven. Those two things don’t make sense. What it tells me, though, is that we need to have more women thinking about how they’re going to invest.

Betty Collins: [00:03:03] Women put others first. That’s really nice, but I want you to envision yourself as a greeter one day at Walmart because you made sure everybody was taken care of before yourself. You need to pay yourself first, even above your children. I look at my kids today and go, “You’ve got 40 years to work and deal with your life. You can do it.” I’ve had to really be one of those parents who drew a line in the sand. Earlier, as they were kids, I was really obsessed with leaving them money, and making sure they were set for life, and different things like that. Now I look at it and go, “You’re healthy, and you’re educated. Go figure out what you want to do.” So, I put some other things before them that are more important when it comes to financial things.

Betty Collins: [00:03:48] Early and often is the only way to live, when you’re talking about financial planning. Sometimes, we just look at it as, “Well, it’s too late.” I don’t think it’s ever too late to start somewhere. I didn’t start til in 1998. I was going through some personal things that changed; that was my late 30s. I really had to sit down and prioritize what was important. As much as I am a CPA, I am not a financial planner. Those are two different things, so I had to listen to professionals, and I’m still listening to them in my fifth decade of life.

Betty Collins: [00:04:23] The biggest thing I had to do was face my fear with it, and I had to make up for lost time. That took me owning it. I look at financial planning as very complex. I hate reading the statements of how my investments are doing. I don’t like seeing what I should buy and sell. I don’t want to make those decisions. I’m like most women – I’m conservative; I like my security. Yet, I had to make up for some time because I didn’t start til late 30s. I can really say I’m probably not going to be a Walmart greeter because I did those things.

Betty Collins: [00:04:54] I want to talk to you a little bit today about … That’s just my personal experience, and I’m being honest with you. I didn’t start out, from the beginning, putting money in the bank. My husband did. My husband works for the post office and he, from day one, not making a whole lot of money, believe it or not, at the post office 30-some years ago, put something in a 401(k). He started much earlier in life and was able to retire probably much earlier in life because he did those things.

Betty Collins: [00:05:21] What should you do? First, you’ve got to manage your own money. It’s just too hard to make. It’s too hard to earn, and you never know when your earning ability is going to not be there. You have to manage it, and that’s really on you. It’s not on anyone else. As I tell my kids with student loans, who, they don’t want to pay them back, I said, “When you signed those loans, you didn’t say, ‘I’m going to really try to make every effort to pay this loan.’ You said, ‘I need to do this, and I’m going to do that. I’m going to take responsibility.'”

Betty Collins: [00:05:51] If you have a confidence issue with money, and you hate money, and you don’t want to face it, and you don’t want to deal with it; you’re not an accountant, and it’s too much, then picture your life over the next five, 10, and 15 years without money and a plan. What is it going to look like? What are you going to look like when you don’t have the ability to work, if you’re in labor, and now you’re older? What does it look like if your industry’s changing, and you’re not changing with it? What does it look like, when you just want to maybe hide behind the desk? Then, one day, you’re like, “I don’t have this taken care of …”? I still am somewhat intimidated by financial planners because I don’t feel like I know everything. I just found people that I trust.

Betty Collins: [00:06:32] Then, there’s the whole caretaking, and enabling the people in your life. You know what? That takes your resources. My adult children are educated and healthy. They do not need me to hover over them. They do not need me to rescue them. Right now, I have to, as the parent, and as the aging parent, take care of myself. I will tell you, with my parents, who didn’t always put together a plan together, we never had to take care of them because they did have their ducks in a row. But they also made sure they didn’t hover over us for life either. You have to be careful with those relationships that do that. Then, you’ve got to focus on earning while you have the potential to do it. You make hay when you can. You seize your opportunities. Life can change on a dime, so you have to really focus on that.

Betty Collins: [00:07:18] You have to track your expenses somehow, and I don’t mean you need to be sophisticated. I will tell you, and this is almost embarrassing, but I have QuickBooks in my personal life, and I track how we spend money. There are times I look at it … My husband wants never to look at it. He hates it. But I look at that sometimes and look at what I spend it at Kroger in a month, and it’s mind-boggling; or Starbucks coffee. Before you know it, you’re going, “Wow, it took me all that time to earn, and yet I’m throwing it out the door.” Not that Kroger is a bad place, but I probably over-shop, and I have too much. Tracking how you spend is part of the financial planning. It’s just not earning and saving; it’s when you get that, what do you do with it? There is that middle-class millionaire all around you; you have no idea, because they do really watch how they spend. I don’t like being around tight, cheap people. I hate that. I hate people that constantly think a coupon is the answer to everything, but there is a lot of respect I have, when somebody really is intentional about not wasting their money, when they spend.

Betty Collins: [00:08:23] This is a big problem for women, and I think you need to … I need to say it out loud, and then you need to really look in the mirror and see this as a problem in your life – you cannot let relationships sabotage your finances, whether that’s significant others, kids, aging parents, friends, or family. You have to figure out when someone is constantly in your checkbook, and you constantly are working and they’re not, or whatever the case is. They basically are sabotaging … I’ve seen enough women be completely taken advantage of and didn’t even have a clue; or they were so wrapped up in the relationship, when they finally were able to break off – if they did, they saw it – a lot of hard money went out the door in a relationship that also went out the door.  I would encourage you, with relationships like that, you have to let go of those, if you don’t want to be a Walmart greeter; if you want to make your dollars that you work hard for worth their time.

Betty Collins: [00:09:25] It’s a long journey – 40 years. I can’t believe I’m in my last 10, probably, of working. It’s best if you take the whole 40 years to plan and not the last 10, because there is no quick fix. There isn’t any, “I’m going to now just become a huge saver.” It always discourages me, even when I see people who have saved tremendously, and all the sudden, they’re diving into what should not be touched until they’re 65. I see it all the time.  It’s a long journey. It’s a journey that takes you all the way til the time you can retire. People even don’t know how much they have, in those 40 years, or how much they would need to go beyond 20 years. Don’t do that in your life, because, when you finally get some free time, you finally have a little bit of choice, you want to have some financial freedom there, if you can.

Betty Collins: [00:10:17] What should you do when someone says, “I can do this for you,” and Shazam! It’s called quick fix. It’s called luck. It’s really sad that 28 percent of our country thinks that the lottery is a great way to plan for retirement. The other sad part of those statistics are most people … not most, but a good amount of people that win the lottery end up in bankruptcy because they don’t really know how to handle something, first of all, that big, and they didn’t earn it. Then, they have everyone at their doorstep – those typical sabotage relationships. Quick fixes and lucks are not there, but neither is hope. Hope is just not a strategy. “I hope it all works out …” “I hope I don’t have to work at Walmart as a greeter …”

Betty Collins: [00:11:03] I’m not making fun of people who work at Walmart as a greeter. My dad worked til he was 73 because he wanted to. He just wanted to. When he got to a point, where he knew he was going to have to pay taxes on the money, he worked for free; because, for him, getting out and having that purpose was there. But it’s not a strategy, if that’s when you still have to pay your mortgage, and your rent, and all those things. So, don’t look at hope as a strategy. If you catch yourself going, “Well, I just hope my business works out because then I can retire …” – not a strategy.

Betty Collins: [00:11:32] You have to know the difference, when you’re financial planning … Women, you want to really have it all and do it all, as we do, sometimes. You have to know the difference between bad and good debt. There is good debt. I think your house, having debt on it, is not a bad debt. It’s an investment, and it’s a place that you can one day call your own. However, when you have to make a $2,000 payment on a house, you probably have to earn $3,000 or $4,000 to do that. By the time you tax it, and give the government their share, and then you’re paying interest on that, as well, you have to still go, “I know that’s good debt because I have an investment, but I still have to really earn a lot to do that.” When you’re thinking about decisions, like mortgages on a house, which might be good debt, you have to look at the course you’re charting, and say, “Is it worth having to make this kind of money to pay this kind of good debt?” Those are questions, when you hit certain ages in life, you really do have to confront.

Betty Collins: [00:12:40] The other thing about debt is everyone’s very consumed in- because this is just now how we are, and I’m kind of this way. If you asked me to donate money to your organization, if you gave me a card that says, “We want to deduct $30 a month out of your account, and you can give us $360 over a course of a year,” or if you say, “Can you write a $360 check tonight?” I’m probably going to tell you I like the monthly payment, because we are so geared to that. What you really have to ask yourself – and it’s okay that you have monthly payments … Can you afford it? – But do you really know what you paid for the car? Do you really know what you paid for the house? Do you really know what you gave to the charity? The mindset of monthly payment is sure, it’s good for budgeting, but you still have to know, was this worth the buy?

Betty Collins: [00:13:30] I’m a big person of, as soon as Kohl’s starts sending me 30-percent off, I’m thinking, what do I need? What I need? There’s good and bad debt. If you save 30 percent, but then put it on one of their cards, and you just took your time paying it, you didn’t pay 30-percent less, right? We laugh, and we say those things are common sense, but it’s how people live. Then, they get to a point in life- they’re like, “What happened? I can’t go back and make some things change.

Betty Collins: [00:13:57] Here’s a great way to think, when you are charting your course – overestimate the money needs, and then, you get to enjoy maybe the surprise of some excess cash. Now, I’m the person in life, if I lose 10 pounds, I know I can eat what I want for the weekend, instead of going, “I could get to 12 pounds …” That’s just how I think, sometimes.

Betty Collins: [00:14:19] So, sometimes, overestimating, putting yourself to go, “I really need a thousand bucks, but, man, if I had 1,400 … Let’s try to go there and then, we’ll see what happens,” right? When you needed the thousand dollars, and now you need nine, you really did well, but if you need the thousand and you needed 12, you still can cover it. It’s like when people estimate their tax payments. First of all, either people never will pay an estimated tax to the government, which I get, or they love to overestimate because they hate a tax bill, and then, they love getting a big refund. Both ways, to me, are crazy. Try and nail it in and having a little bit of access that the government has to give you back isn’t the worst thing in the world, or whatever the case may be.

Betty Collins: [00:15:03] Women are dominating in starting up businesses. We are one who are, “I gotta do this. I’ve got an idea. I’ve got a passion.” Then we get our, “Okay, my idea has turned into a business, but it’s killing me because I still … It’s this huge investment, and I’m not making probably the money I wanted to.” I think [inaudible] on the Big Bang Theory … Love to watch that show. It’s useless, mindless television.

Betty Collins: [00:15:32] Penny, of course, is an aspiring actress, and she works at The Cheesecake Factory. That’s her day job. She’s always broke, so she decides that she is going to sell some type of jewelry. She’s all excited because she’s making this jewelry, and she can sell it for five bucks; until Sheldon comes in the room and logically puts it through and says, “You would have to sell this many pieces of jewelry to even pay your rent.” At that point, she can’t have this mass production to make thousands of things to pay her rent.

Betty Collins: [00:16:02] When we are charting our course and saying, “If I started my own business, I have so much more freedom, and I can really make some money, and I love what I’m doing,” but it has to be part of the financial plan that it can really work. I’m very fortunate in what I do. I don’t have to sit and talk about a lot of, “I gotta make this many pieces of jewelry …” But in my business, even as a shareholder, I have to sit and say, “If I keep doing hundreds of 1040s without a business tax return, I’m probably not going to make the money that I normally do. Do I want to work that hard and have that much chaos in my life?” Some of it is that’s just what I do but is it part of the long-term plan that you can say, “Hey, I can do this, and I can live, and I can have a good course that I like?”

Betty Collins: [00:16:45] The other thing in business, and in your personal life, are budgets. Very few people live on budgets today. Very few people even know how to create one. When my kids … My daughter was starting to get an apartment, she realized, “I don’t know if I can afford to live.” I said, “Well, you’ve gotta figure it out.” Of course, she finds some app. The app tells you all these things. It creates the budget. She was a little blown away with what it took to live, and she was a little more logical in moving out and not moving out as quickly.

Betty Collins: [00:17:14] Then, she thought through, “We probably can only afford this.” She thought through a lot more. Still got to be independent; not live with her mom, and still got to have her own deal. The next apartment, though, she moved into, she just said, “It’s time to move.” They lost a roommate, and they paid more for rent, and she had to get a different car. All the sudden, she’s like, “Oh, my …” because she really didn’t think through in a budget format.

Betty Collins: [00:17:39] Sometimes, when you’re starting your business, you need to take out as little money as possible versus just, “It’s kinda like my business. It’s my LLC. It’s the same thing as Joe Smith …” But you have to still go, “I only can take this much out of my business because if I’m going to use this business as a resource to get to retirement, guess what? I gotta plan just like I do in my household.”

Betty Collins: [00:18:01] Those are things that you have to do. It’s all exciting. I know you’re just thrilled … Depends on the Walmart greeter question, I guess. Be informed. It’s the biggest struggle I have with our society right now, because we have- it’s almost like we have way too much information, so we’re not getting the right information. That’s a problem for anyone trying to handle their finances. I have people who, “I’m not going to pay those brokers any fees. I can sell my own house. I don’t want to pay a realtor,” or, “I can invest my own money on E-Trade.” Well, you better know how to be informed when you do those things and get to the right information, or I would tell you to hire it.

Betty Collins: [00:18:49] I would tell you that you have that advisor … I have more than one adviser because I need to be informed with the right information. Clicking on Twitter’s article written by someone I don’t know, representing some agenda or opinion, is not information. You have to be very, very careful. Then, I think you have to read, and then you read. It’s all part of owning it. It’s all part of charting your course. There’s a tremendous amount of books which we will have that you can read that get you in the game, especially if you’d rather read a Dummies for Financial Planning than you would some economics book, right? Which, by the way, I don’t even read economics books.

Betty Collins: [00:19:27] There’s all kinds of things. Prince Charming isn’t Coming: How Women can get Smart About Their Money, by Barbara Stanny. All You’re Worth: The Ultimate Lifetime Money Plan, by Elizabeth Warren; not the Elizabeth Warren you probably think of. Your Money or Your Life: Nine Steps to Transforming Your Relationship with Money. Again, you could go online and Google ‘guide to women financials,’ and you’ll find book, upon book, upon book. You also can get people that can recommend books to you, but I would tell you to do that.

[00:20:01] Life is too short, and it’s meant to be enjoyed. Chances are, you will have to work, so make it worth all the time and effort that you do. You can either live in control of your financial path, or you can be controlled by it. I would suggest to you, today, choose wisely and determine how you are going to chart your course to some financial freedom where you can enjoy life on your terms.

Betty Collins: [00:00:00] Today, we’ve been talking about a financial guide for women; hopefully you enjoyed the podcast. I’d like to really wrap it up today with someone who’s been in financial planning a long time. She’s definitely someone that I really do business with and like. Her name is Helen Colon, and she is with Capstone Wealth Advisors. I met Helen through NAWBO Columbus, which is the National Association of Women Business Owners.

Betty Collins: [00:00:27] She’s had an amazing passion for women, for sure, and financial planning. Really, she takes it a step further by making sure that they plan, and they are protected. She has an amazing career and background, and her passion, along with her New York sass, are what sets her apart, for sure. So, Helen, welcome today, and thank you for taking the time that you’re going to spend with us. Just tell the audience just a little bit about you and your journey in the financial world.

Helen Colon: [00:00:56] First of all, Betty, thank you for having me. I started out my career back in 1982 as a key punch operator on Wall Street. Then I grew myself, where I became an institutional trader for many, many years. I did that until 2009, where my life’s trajectory turned, and I became a caregiver for five years, which landed me in Columbus and private practice.

Betty Collins: [00:01:28] Well, I can’t imagine being on Wall Street for 28 years. You were definitely the Lone Ranger. Of course, I know you learned to play golf during that time because that’s what you had to do, right? Talk to me, just a few … I know you have some certain certifications that are geared to women.

Helen Colon: [00:01:46] I have a certification as a certified divorce financial analyst. I received my certification after I met several women who came to me after their divorce was final. They did not come out of that marriage with an equitable portion of the marital assets. It distressed me so much that I made it a priority to help in any way that I can so that other women don’t end up in that position.

Betty Collins: [00:02:17] Sure, sure. I think it’s one of things that I definitely have been attracted to you, because I represent a lot of women business owners, and you’re right, that happens. What do you see when you’re helping women? What are they doing well, and what are they struggling with in the financial world, or in their lives?

Helen Colon: [00:02:36] Well, Betty, women face unique challenges in their lives. The income gap, where we’re only paid 80 percent to the dollar, as opposed to a male counterparts. We have longer lifespans. Typically, we will live at least five to 10 years longer, minimum, than our male … We have multiple roles and responsibilities, such as becoming a caregiver, or going through a transition, such as a divorce. Most times women are not … They put everyone first and they, themselves, on the back burner. That’s a huge mistake, just because, as I said, they live longer; the challenges … So, they need to plan properly and save for themselves for that time.

Betty Collins: [00:03:23] Right. What’s really distressful is I was reading, and I was surprised in the statistic that 85 percent of women handle the financial expenses in their home. Yet only 23 percent, I believe, handle financial planning. I will tell you, it’s an intimidating thing. Sometimes, you feel like, “Oh, no, it’s confession unto God. I’ve got to go tell them that I have money, or I’m doing this, and I don’t know what to do with it.” It’s a hard thing to confront sometimes.

Betty Collins: [00:03:57] But it all comes down, like I said in my podcast, do you want to be a greeter at Walmart or not? Do you want to really handle that? So, tell me what a successful woman looks like when she is in that 23%, and she’s doing what she’s supposed to because they tend to manage money better … They’re better investors, sometimes. They’re a little more aggressive and strategic. What does that successful woman look like that takes it and says, “I’m gonna own this …”?

Helen Colon: [00:04:25] Well, they have to take the fear out of the equation. They have to realize that they need some financial guidance; a professional that will help them take that first step. You need to walk before you run. So, a woman that realizes that she needs some type of financial planning is willing to talk to someone, regardless of whether they have knowledge of investments or not. That’s our responsibility to educate our clients in investments.

Helen Colon: [00:04:57] Financial planning is a relationship with the client. I take great pride in developing a team effect around my clients, as you know. I bring in the CPA for the tax strategies. I bring in the estate attorney for legacy planning, multi-generational planning. Those women that come to me realize that they find value in being- they feel safe. They feel they have their team around them so they can go on and do what they need to do.

Helen Colon: [00:05:32] Financial planning doesn’t just involve investments. We look at risk protection, long-term care. I work with a CPA, with tax strategies, things of that nature. I had a client come to me, as you know, several years ago that wanted help with financial planning. Her fear was that she was going to live in her daughter’s basement if she didn’t plan properly. Well, I can tell you, as of today, that will never happen.

Betty Collins: [00:06:04] Yeah, she’s a great success story, for sure. It’s because she just faced it. She owned it and said, “What do I gotta do?” Because women are that way … When we decide we have to do something, or that this is a priority, it generally gets done. We’re just sort of like that.

Helen Colon: [00:06:15] Face the fear.

Betty Collins: [00:06:19] Yep, face the fear. What are common mistakes you see? This is, “I’m going to just go online and trade all myself because I want to pay a fee,” or [crosstalk]

Helen Colon: [00:06:27] Stop! No!

Betty Collins: [00:06:28] Don’t do that. What are the common mistakes that women make?

Helen Colon: [00:06:36] Well, not taking that first step; not realizing that just because they don’t know what they don’t know, they’re frozen. They need to get out and find someone that they feel comfortable with; develop that relationship with that advisor; and start to educate herself. They need to save now, not tomorrow. Now. It’s imperative because, as you said earlier, wouldn’t it be sad if you got to that full retirement age and realized that you can’t retire because you didn’t plan properly. It would be wonderful if you could get to that point, and say, “You know what? The decision is mine. I’d rather choose to continue to work than not.”

Betty Collins: [00:07:23] Right. I know for myself, I did not start anything til age 38. I tell my kids all the time, I started with 50 bucks a month into something. They just look at you like, “50 bucks a month will never get you there.” Of course, now I’m a young 56 years old. I’m so glad I started somewhere, started something that … I had good advisers around me. When I realized they weren’t good advisors, I got rid of them. I just have a passion about it because you just don’t know, and life can change on a dime. You know [crosstalk]

Helen Colon: [00:07:55] One phone call changed my whole life.

Betty Collins: [00:07:57] Sure. Sure. You were the big dogs on Wall Street, and as you said … Wow, life changed, and you had to be a caretaker of parents, and you were ready to do that.

Helen Colon: [00:08:06] I was fortunate to be able to take that experience from my Wall Street days and translate that into my private practice. I find, most often than not, women want to be spoken to, not at. I like to coach my clients into educating them about what it is that they’re doing; why I recommended something – an investment, or whatever have you; that way, they don’t turn around and say, “Well. Helen told me to do it, so I did it.” No, this is why I did it.

Betty Collins: [00:08:41] Well, it was great having you here today. I appreciate you taking the time. This is Helen Colon, and she is with Capstone Wealth Advisors in the Polaris area, in Columbus. I would encourage you to reach out to her, or find her, or get with me, because she’s just done a fantastic job with other women in business. Again, we have a passion together with NAWBO Columbus. Women, do not let this part of your life go. Make sure that you have a financial guide that you … It’s your course that you are charting.

TMB E30; Forty-Niner Golf & CC, & Square One Intern

January 10, 2020 by angishields

Tucson Business Radio
Tucson Business Radio
TMB E30; Forty-Niner Golf & CC, & Square One Intern
Loading
00:00 /
RSS Feed
Share
Link
Embed

Download file

GUESTS:
Casey Polivehak, Director of Golf
Forty-Niner Country Club
12000 E. Tanque Verde Rd
Tucson, AZ 85749
520-749-4925 ext 1
Email:   caseyp@fortyninercc.com
Website: http://fortyninercc.com/index.htm
SOCIAL MEDIA: Facebook | Instagram | LinkedIn |

Casey is the Director of Golf and Sales at Forty Niner Country Club in Northeast Tucson, AZ.   Casey was hired after new ownership purchased the course in 2012 to help in a major rebuilding/rebranding project.  Using his 20 years of industry experience and local contact network, Forty Niner is on its way back to being one of Tucson’s favorite courses. 

Born and raised in Tucson, AZ, Casey and his wife of 13.5 years, Amber, have settled in the area he grew up.  Amber is a hardworking, homeschooling mother and part-time teacher for the Vail School District.  Daughters Lucy- 9 and Hawley-1 and  son Bodey- 6, are the highlight of their lives 

Casey’s main jobs at Forty Niner are membership and tournament growth, revenue management, marketing, and overall customer service satisfaction.  Having experience at some of Arizona’s top-rated resorts and private clubs, has groomed Casey to handle the good, and bad that comes along with the golf industry. 

Casey enjoys playing golf, but raising a family is most important right now!  Casey and Amber help with youth groups at their church, and enjoy home projects including gardening, raising dogs + chickens, and of course swimming and playing with the kids. 

About Forty Niner Country Club

Forty Niner Country Club is an upscale, semi-private facility designed by William Francis Bell.  The course opened in 1961 and though not as demanding as the many desert-style courses in the area, the tree-lined fairways, and tightly guarded doglegs pose the same challenges it did almost 50 years ago when the club hosted the PGA Tour’s Tucson Open in 1963-1964. 

Spread over 110 acres, the course is known for its lush, mature landscaping and excellent course conditioning.  It is lined with mature stands of mesquite, giant cottonwood, eucalyptus, and weeping willow trees.  The fairways are Bermuda grass, over-seeding in the fall with perennial ryegrass.  The elevated Tif-dwarf Bermuda greens are known locally for their swift putting surfaces in the winter months.  The course has two lakes that come into play and is bordered on the south by the Tanque Verde Wash.  Members enjoy a 6,669-yard, 18-hole, par 72 golf course. Four tee positions on every hole ensure playability, satisfaction, and challenge for every level of golfer.  The winding fairways and majestic mountain views surprise golfers at every turn.  

A full-service restaurant, The Rincon Mountain Grill, has been expanded and upgraded serving breakfast, lunch, and dinner 7- days a week with various specialty offers.  An upgraded kitchen boasts a double-decker pizza over, where the Roadrunner Pizzeria is using house-made hand-tossed dough, and the freshest ingredients available!  Ranging from sandwiches to steak or seafood, and even gluten-free options, enjoy your favorite type of food expertly prepared and served with a smile!! 

Facilities 

The Club’s facilities include an 18-hole golf course, full-service restaurant, driving range, putting green, short game area, fully stocked Golf Shop, State of the Art Fitness center, swimming pool, men’s and women’s locker rooms, indoor and outdoor dining, large outdoor banquet/wedding venue, and private meeting/conference space

Jamain T. Miller, CEO/ Co-founder 
Square One Intern 
Tucson   State: AZ
Email: jamain@squareoneintern.com 
Website: https://www.facebook.com/squareoneintern
SOCIAL MEDIA: Facebook | Instagram | Twitter |

Jamain, CEO and Co-founder of Square One Intern, is a transplant from New Jersey. He’s been in Tucson for 6 years and came here via the US Air Force. As a former intelligence analyst for Combat Search and Rescue, Jamain learned that there were three essentials necessary for any mission to be successful. 1) A clear vision for the results desired, 2) a detailed plan to achieve those results, 3) and a well-run organization where everyone understands their roles and responsibilities for achieving those results via the plan. After interviewing over 200 organization heads and managers, Jamain condensed the most affective solutions into a system that organizations can use to clarify their vision, create their plan, and organize their team around that plan and vision. That’s the Revenue Focused Development System. 

Because he has a passion for training youth, Jamain also runs a non-profit that trains at-risk youth in entrepreneurship to help them lift themselves out of the cycle of poverty they were born into. The same business organization system is employed with the youth and their ability to understand the system equals that of any business owner he’s worked with. The non-profit is called Circle One Tucson, signifying the 360 degrees of support each Tucson youth is given. 

About Square One Intern

Through networking with other entrepreneurs, Jamain met his Co-founder, Mariana Eubanks, three years ago and they stayed in contact. Both have a passion for business and youth and in February of 2019, Mariana approached Jamain with the idea of connecting students in the early stages of their education to businesses they’re interested in working with. This would provide them early real-world work experience in the field they’re studying so they can decide early on whether or not that particular career is for them. They also wanted the student to provide value to the organizations they’re working with. So, after a few months of testing various concepts, Square One Intern became a workforce development agency focused on connecting non-profits with Young Professional Implementers who can help them apply the Revenue Focused Development System to their organization and help them use it with maximum effectiveness.  

Forty-Niner Golf & CC – Tucson’s Hidden Jewel

 

Tagged With: Tucson Means Business

IMPACT Ep3: Three Non-Profits Collaborating Together

January 9, 2020 by angishields

Tucson Business Radio
Tucson Business Radio
IMPACT Ep3: Three Non-Profits Collaborating Together
Loading
00:00 /
RSS Feed
Share
Link
Embed

Download file

 

Michele Santorelli, Program Director 
IMPACT of Southern Arizona 
3535 E Hawser Street
Tucson, AZ 85739  
520-825-0009 
michele@impactsoaz.org 
impactsoaz.org 
SOCIAL MEDIA: Facebook | Twitter |

I am originally from the “Big Apple”, but I am elated to now live in the “Baked Apple”.  Soon after I was married, my husband and I left the city and snow in search of a warmer climate.  Before settling in Tucson, we explored several cities across the country.  My wonderful husband of 25 years, my two sons, and my furry four years old, continue to enjoy hiking and exploring the beautiful state we settled in.  My background is in business and banking with a deep connection to community service.  This passion was the foundation of how I was raised and how I raised my two sons.  I believe when children can connect what they learn to real-world challenges, they add abundance in ways that make the world a better place.  Working at Impact has allowed me to share my passion and connect with individuals, partners, and communities while building and enhancing essential programs that meet the needs of the communities we serve.   

What is the IMPACT you have? IMPACT works to stabilize families, support seniors, and move people out of poverty. This is done through a variety of programs designed to feed people of all ages, stretch household budgets, teach people new skills to help them better manage finances and make important decisions, and to provide guidance and support along personalized pathways to self-sufficiency. IMPACT also provides resources SANP, Southern Arizona Non-Profits and referrals to the community – serving low to moderate-income families and individuals in greater Tucson, Marana, Oro Valley, and Pinal County.  

It is our partnerships with other agencies, businesses, governments, social clubs, volunteers and donors to which we attribute our success of 20 years. Since we opened in 2000, we have invested more than 25,000,000 in the community: serving more than 190,000 meals to seniors, providing more than $12,000,000 of perishable and canned food, distributing more than 650,000 items of clothing, and delivering many other valuable services. Thanks to wide community support, all our services have been provided free of charge, and we have improved the lives and inspired the futures of more than 9250 individuals! We look forward to another 20 years of changing peoples’ lives. 


Stephanie Urdiales, General Manager 
Golden Goose Thrift Shop 
15970 N Oracle Road
Catalina AZ 85739  
520-825-9101 
manager@goldengooseaz.com 
goldengooseaz.com 
Air Force brat – philosophy major – former dancer and ballet instructor – mother of four – grandmother of nine – Golden Goose general manager for fifteen years – began working at age fourteen – have a strong background in corporate retail, resale, and thrift. 

What is the IMPACT you have?  

The Golden Goose is a nonprofit retail thrift shop. Our purpose is to generate revenue for IMPACT of Southern Arizona and SaddleBrooke Community Outreach to fund their respective charitable community programs. Past sales have resulted in more than $13,000,000 which has helped purchase food for two food banks, clothing for children and adults, educational scholarships, meals for seniors, and many other critical programs. Shop at the Goose and you will put a big smile on your face, as well as that of someone less fortunate. Volunteer here, and you will make lifelong friends and know you make a difference in the lives of thousands of people. 


Stephen Groth, President 
SaddleBrooke Community Outreach 
63675 SaddleBrooke Blvd. Suite L 
Tucson, AZ 85739 
949-533-9355 
steve.groth42@gmail.com 

I grew up in Chicago and Connecticut and graduated from the Univ. of Connecticut, and earned my MBA from Wharton School at Univ. of Penn. I spent most of my career financing, buying, and selling commercial jet aircraft around the world. Retired to Arizona in 2010 and began with SBCO shortly thereafter on an education committee specializing in scholarships. Elected President 3 years ago. I also compete in and run Trivia games and co-run the Great courses program. I’ve been married for 52 years to Sharon who started and runs a “Famous Painting “program in a local school. 

What is the IMPACT you have? Our mission is “to provide opportunities for kids to succeed”. As such we are an all-volunteer organization that is “all about the kids” in our “copper corridor” providing new clothes and backpacks to 1700 kids twice a year, now providing 4-year college scholarships to 81 kids, supporting academic enrichment programs and recreational activities in our communities, and sponsoring a large food drive for the local Foodbank. 

SHOW HOST:
Barbara McClure, Executive Director  
IMPACT of Southern Arizona 
3535 E Hawser Street 
Tucson, AZ  85739                                                    
520-825-0009 / Mobile Phone: 206-915-0919 
barbara@impactsoaz.org 
www.impactsoaz.org 
 SOCIAL MEDIA: Facebook | Instagram | LinkedIn | Twitter |

Barbara McClure wakes up each morning passionate about going to work at a place that improves lives and inspires futures every day! She has been the Executive Director of a Tucson social service nonprofit called IMPACT of Southern Arizona, for ten years. What is it that keeps you passionate about your role Barbara? 

Barbara has been a visionary and planner with decades of experience as a small business owner and in nonprofit leadership; her innovative ideas and strategic thinking, along with a talent for bringing the community together, has helped grow IMPACT five-fold in a very short time. Her talents and interests are diverse but all center around helping people, improving the community, bolstering education, building capacity and sustainability, being vocal about the rights and conditions of others, experiencing art, nurturing all inhabitants of your garden, and enjoying life to the fullest. 

And now Barbara is about to experience another exciting chapter in her life with hosting a brand-new Radio Show Podcast here on the Tucson Business RadioX Network starting in November. 

IMPACT of Southern Arizona is a 20 – year old social service nonprofit stabilizing families and seniors, and moving people out of poverty. IMPACT’s programs are designed to stretch household budgets so earned income can be spent on necessities such as improved housing conditions, fuel to get to work, utilizes, and needed medical attention and prescriptions.  Its clients are your neighbors! People come to IMPACT because it is a welcoming place where they are always treated with dignity and respect, and where they find resources, referrals, coaching, and help to attain the skills that can move them forward into self-sufficiency. 

Barbara grew up in Pasadena CA, moved to Long Beach for college, got married and started our family then moved to Seattle area ten years later. Took our youngest son on an 11-month motorhome trip to get to Tucson – Homeschooled for 10th grade. 

We vacationed at a rustic cabin when I was growing up, where we had no phone or television; and spent all our time outside fishing, hiking, horseback riding, listening to old radio shows, playing pool, reading comic books from the local small grocer, and using our imaginations all day long. I always admired the superheroes who defended people and cities like Gotham and Metropolis, so when our three boys were born, we named them after familiar character: Colin (Bryce for an overlay of Bruce Wayne, Kent, and Parker. Our first grandchild was born last year, and as in the family tradition, named Logan, after the Wolverine. I used to always tell them they were my superheroes – and they still are today! 

Barbara loves working with numbers and has always loved math and the organization of things, so accounting seemed perfect, but I soon realized that I if I became a CPA I would have to spend many months inside doing tax returns, and that did not appeal to me as a long–term career! I have a great imagination and enjoy creating things, so thought I should find a better path that might nurture that side of my personality. I was working in the shipping industry in SoCal at the time and fell in love with import and export, so shifted my majors to Marketing and International Business. Those were wonderful fits, and I imagined graduating and moving to the largest port on the planet, in Germany; then, I met my future husband and things took a different turn. 

A little bit about how Barbara got into Nonprofit work: 

All along with my husband and I were always involved in nonprofits and community volunteer opportunities, and often said it was too bad we could not make a living doing those things we loved so much. Leadership roles in PTO, Boy Scouts, Historical Societies, Junior League, Elks, Rotary and more. Then when we moved to Tucson I looked for a local opportunity to impact my community. A Board position was about to open at IMPACT, and my local bank branch manager, Peggy Smoot, suggested I would be very passionate about getting involved in the mission work there. I worked in the Food Bank. 

There are thousands of nonprofits in Tucson. What makes IMPACT Unique is that they bring the community together to stabilize families and move people out of poverty. Our true success lies in partnering with a large number of businesses, agencies, social clubs and other nonprofits. We invest $2.5 million in the community each year, and we do it all with a lean staff of amazing professionals supported by more than 170 volunteer shifts each week! We have put great systems in place to run efficiently, effectively and with a commitment to sustainability and integrity, protecting the community’s investment in our work, striving for perfect audits, being innovative, building capacity and most importantly – treating everyone with dignity and respect. We are an award-winning nonprofit with numerous nods to incredible customer service. Our clients are your neighbors… We improve lives and inspire futures of people living in Southern AZ.  

So, IMPACT is celebrating its 20th anniversary this year, and you have been at the helm half that time. Share with me the things IMPACT has accomplished over the years, and the things you have planned for this celebratory year. 

 

Tagged With: SANP, Southern Arizona Non-Profits

  • « Previous Page
  • 1
  • …
  • 128
  • 129
  • 130
  • 131
  • 132
  • …
  • 162
  • Next Page »

Business RadioX ® Network


 

Our Most Recent Episode

CONNECT WITH US

  • Email
  • Facebook
  • LinkedIn
  • Twitter
  • YouTube

Our Mission

We help local business leaders get the word out about the important work they’re doing to serve their market, their community, and their profession.

We support and celebrate business by sharing positive business stories that traditional media ignores. Some media leans left. Some media leans right. We lean business.

Sponsor a Show

Build Relationships and Grow Your Business. Click here for more details.

Partner With Us

Discover More Here

Terms and Conditions
Privacy Policy

Connect with us

Want to keep up with the latest in pro-business news across the network? Follow us on social media for the latest stories!
  • Email
  • Facebook
  • Google+
  • LinkedIn
  • Twitter
  • YouTube

Business RadioX® Headquarters
1000 Abernathy Rd. NE
Building 400, Suite L-10
Sandy Springs, GA 30328

© 2026 Business RadioX ® · Rainmaker Platform

BRXStudioCoversLA

Wait! Don’t Miss an Episode of LA Business Radio

BRXStudioCoversDENVER

Wait! Don’t Miss an Episode of Denver Business Radio

BRXStudioCoversPENSACOLA

Wait! Don’t Miss an Episode of Pensacola Business Radio

BRXStudioCoversBIRMINGHAM

Wait! Don’t Miss an Episode of Birmingham Business Radio

BRXStudioCoversTALLAHASSEE

Wait! Don’t Miss an Episode of Tallahassee Business Radio

BRXStudioCoversRALEIGH

Wait! Don’t Miss an Episode of Raleigh Business Radio

BRXStudioCoversRICHMONDNoWhite

Wait! Don’t Miss an Episode of Richmond Business Radio

BRXStudioCoversNASHVILLENoWhite

Wait! Don’t Miss an Episode of Nashville Business Radio

BRXStudioCoversDETROIT

Wait! Don’t Miss an Episode of Detroit Business Radio

BRXStudioCoversSTLOUIS

Wait! Don’t Miss an Episode of St. Louis Business Radio

BRXStudioCoversCOLUMBUS-small

Wait! Don’t Miss an Episode of Columbus Business Radio

Coachthecoach-08-08

Wait! Don’t Miss an Episode of Coach the Coach

BRXStudioCoversBAYAREA

Wait! Don’t Miss an Episode of Bay Area Business Radio

BRXStudioCoversCHICAGO

Wait! Don’t Miss an Episode of Chicago Business Radio

Wait! Don’t Miss an Episode of Atlanta Business Radio